The Cobra: Legit Finisher? [Archive]

Xero

01-31-2011, 02:31 PM

Figured I should get this out of the Rumble thread.

I'm of the opinion that the Cobra is not a legit finish. It has no impact, it doesn't look good at all, and no one of worth should be selling the move, let alone losing to it.

Something like the People's Elbow was USUALLY used in conjuncture to the Rock Bottom or Spinebuster. Also, Rock was a legit competitor. A better example is the Samoan Spike, which had a shit ton of visual impact.

With Santino, his entire arsenal of moves consists of joke spots, and the Cobra has no impact. He doesn't seem like he can hang with anyone outside of a joke match. I know he CAN, if he were allowed to go, but I'm going on the character.

Someone like Yoshi Tatsu selling and losing to it would be fine. But someone like Del Rio, or anyone from Nexus, selling it makes them look weak as hell to me and puts them down in my eyes.

For the record, I think if Santino was allowed to go in the ring and had some legit matches, I could absolutely buy him, even if his out of the ring character was exactly the same. I've hoped for him to be able to go for the longest time now.

Discuss the Cobra and Santino in general in here.

Rammsteinmad

01-31-2011, 02:33 PM

Hold still a second while I strike you in the throat. We'll see if you sell it or not. ;)

Jordan

01-31-2011, 02:36 PM

You gotta just accept the comedy aspect of WWE. Santino didn't win the Rumble, but it's a move that in incredibly over and gets people excited. It is a huge sign of respect for anyone to sell it, sure, and Santino is widely regarded as one of the best pound for pound workers WWE has. He has a unique grappling style from the 30's and his own brand of comedy. I am all for it, sorry Xero.

Jordan

01-31-2011, 02:36 PM

Let take something back...

Santino will be regarded as one of the best pound for pound workers in WWE, by the end of 2011.

CSL

01-31-2011, 02:37 PM

Of course it's not, it's never gonna drop anybody for a World title. But it also doesn't matter, it's over and it works for him.

Emperor Smeat

01-31-2011, 02:55 PM

It could count as a legit finisher since the move itself attacks the throat while the comedic part is him setting up the move. If he was to be a heel, all he needs to do is get rid of the setup and just have it as a throat strike and it still would be believable as a finisher.

Its sort of like HBK "tuning up the band" with his set up for the sweet chin music. He takes a while to prepare and during the whole time, the other wrestler can hear him kicking the mat. All that part is meant for is to get the crowd ready for his finisher.

Lock Jaw

01-31-2011, 02:55 PM

Santino's been having legit matches for a few months now. They've been pushing the "being trained by Kozlov" thing, and it has allowed him to actually get in offense in matches now.

Sure, he still does his comedy spots, the splits, and stuff like that.... but tons of legit wrestlers have had spots like that that they do mid-match.

Santino is a whole lot more legit now than he was six months back.

#BROKEN Hasney

01-31-2011, 03:00 PM

I'd be more likely to break it out in a fight than a rolling arm-bar.

Swiss Ultimate

01-31-2011, 03:03 PM

The Cobra is over though. So is Santino.

#BROKEN Hasney

01-31-2011, 03:06 PM

Still trying to find a vid on the underground from while Nash was getting ready for the Rumble applying his new submission so I can use it in real life. Can't find one where it goes all the way before the otter guy taps though.

Rammsteinmad

01-31-2011, 03:11 PM

Wow, those Nash jokes continue to be not funny.

Fignuts

01-31-2011, 03:17 PM

If he didn't make it look so ridiculous, it could be. I mean it's a similar move to the samoan spike. He just executes it in a comedic way. Which is fine, because as everyone said here, that's what is over right now.

chrisat928

01-31-2011, 03:28 PM

Legdrop was a legit finisher for years for Hogan, who otherwise did no high impact moves. Yet guys bigger than Hogan did legdrops as standard moves.

The actual strike of the Cobra is a pointed strike to the throat, which has the potential hurt like hell.

erickman

01-31-2011, 03:29 PM

did'nt ming have the same move in wcw, the finger of death or something like that.

The Show Off

01-31-2011, 03:31 PM

did'nt ming have the same move in wcw, the finger of death or something like that.

His finished was the Tongan Death Grip which was a submission type move.

chrisat928

01-31-2011, 03:31 PM

Tongan Death Grip was a nerve hold, up under the chin.

Lara Emily

01-31-2011, 03:31 PM

It could be, and I kinda hope they do one day, all they need to do is drop the comedy set up turn it into something he can pull out of nowhere and have the announcer's put it over as a debilitating shot to the throat, sell it that it causes temporary never damage or something who cares, if the announcer's get doom and gloomy enough over it's effects people will buy it. Some of the coolest finishers come from that area, Tongan Death Grip (aka BEST FINISHER EVER, loved the nerve hold pinfall), Samoan Spike and kinda even Sweet Chin Music is in that area.

Lara Emily

01-31-2011, 03:32 PM

His finished was the Tongan Death Grip which was a submission type move.

It was a Pinning move! Meng pinned guys with his fingers, sickest finisher

bigslimjj

01-31-2011, 03:58 PM

Socko,ballin elbow,peoples elbow,U can't C me,worm,boom drop,Piper eye poke...etc. Yes it can,and has. Because this is "Sports-entertainment" and those type of moves work,because the guys sell being hurt. Anything,and I mean anything can be sold. Aluminum trash cans and lids,cardboard cutouts of Goldberg,Vince Mcmahons muscle and fitness magazine cover and plenty more. The cobra is legit,and Santino should have won the rumble.

Lock Jaw

01-31-2011, 04:04 PM

Lara Emily

01-31-2011, 04:07 PM

Honestly, in a real fight it would be a more legit finisher than the Attitude Adjustment.

Jabbing a guy in the throat vs. picking him up on your shoulders, and then throwing him onto his back

Gonna bust out The Cobra next time I am in a bar fight.

Make sure ya do the whole taunt set up and then have fun getting cold clocked right in the kisser.

CSL

01-31-2011, 04:13 PM

Honestly, in a real fight it would be a more legit finisher than the Attitude Adjustment.

Jabbing a guy in the throat vs. picking him up on your shoulders, and then throwing him onto his back

Gonna bust out The Cobra next time I am in a bar fight.

Hey, try picking a guy up for the FU but switch to an Aeroplane Spin and watch the sheer confusion/mild terror on the other guys face. Nobody fucks with the Aeroplane Spin.

Volare

01-31-2011, 04:28 PM

Especially close to ceiling fans.

jaycool2k

01-31-2011, 04:31 PM

Cool King

01-31-2011, 04:35 PM

I wasn't going to say the whole "But it hurts in reality" thing, but the people do have a point.

Getting stabbed in the throat with five fingers hurts. It hurts more than getting a falling chop to your chest, yet The Worm was extremely over back in the day. I still remember the crowd loving it when Scotty 2 Hotty got Austin in position for The Worm on SmackDown, he didn't manage to get it all done though but the reaction to the possibility of it was great.

The Cobra is just the new Worm. Theatrics and a weak looking move that entertains the crowds greatly.

I see no problem with The Cobra.

Cool King

01-31-2011, 04:36 PM

Robodiv

01-31-2011, 04:37 PM

That santino OVW vignette is well good!

whiteyford

01-31-2011, 04:43 PM

If someone like HHH took it and sold it then i think everyone would buy it as legit. Getting hit in the throat hurts, even by a jobber, but i think its more the way its presented and how commentators react that makes it seem like a comedy finisher. Santino was the last guy eliminated from the rumble so he's not the problem.

The Show Off

01-31-2011, 04:46 PM

It was a Pinning move! Meng pinned guys with his fingers, sickest finisher

You're right. Completely forgot that it was a pinning move. My bad.

Rammsteinmad

01-31-2011, 04:46 PM

Wow. Santino looked fucking dangerous there. And that arm bar move he had looks lethal.

jaycool2k

01-31-2011, 04:49 PM

That santino OVW vignette is well good!

Yeah, i would like to see him go back to that sort of character.

whiteyford

01-31-2011, 04:50 PM

Doesnt Santino have a legit Judo background?

jaycool2k

01-31-2011, 04:57 PM

Doesnt Santino have a legit Judo background?

I think so, also thought he did some UFC stuff?

#BROKEN Hasney

01-31-2011, 05:19 PM

Wow, those Nash jokes continue to be not funny.

Unlike YOUR FACE :cool:

Lara Emily

01-31-2011, 05:22 PM

You're right. Completely forgot that it was a pinning move. My bad.

No worries I think it actually was used sometimes as a submission. Such an awesome move totally loved that WCW/NWO Revenge actually had a version of it that ended in a pinfall. (The animation was techicnally a choke hold)

Xero

01-31-2011, 05:23 PM

It's a "realistic" move, and I CAN understand from that point. And I don't even have a problem with the setup. It's the move itself.

Yes, realistically, it's going to hurt. But this is pro wrestling, where theatrics matter a lot more than "what hurts". It's all about, to me, the fact that it just doesn't look like it hurts. He pokes the guy. It's to the throat, but it needs impact. I don't know if it's the way he does it or they sell it, because I'm sure if it was done at a specific angle or in a specific way it COULD look good. But to me it just doesn't come off as painful at all.

It's actually similar to MMA, at least to me. I've seen enough fights to have seen that the moves DO NOT look impressive, mostly the strikes. Knee lifts are something that's a good example to me. I KNOW they hurt, and I can get behind them BECAUSE I know they hurt, but I also know that MMA is real. Nothing has to look "impressive". It just has to look like it hurts.

It's completely different with wrestling. Yes, there needs to be a degree of realism, but at the same time, when you have something that looks weak compared to 90% of moves, there's a problem. It's like it's out of place.

In the end, my whole problem is that it looks weak, whether it's "realistic" or not.

#BROKEN Hasney

01-31-2011, 05:23 PM

I didn't think it ended in a pin? The game, I mean. Wasn't it one of those chokes where the other guy wiggled his legs around?

#BROKEN Hasney

01-31-2011, 05:25 PM

I still don't even think it looks weak, like at all.

Kane Knight

01-31-2011, 05:25 PM

Hold still a second while I strike you in the throat. We'll see if you sell it or not. ;)

In a company where eye gouging isn't all that serious?

Nicky Fives

01-31-2011, 05:28 PM

I find The Cobra dumb, but it's over.... that's really the only thing that matters......

Lara Emily

01-31-2011, 05:29 PM

I didn't think it ended in a pin? The game, I mean. Wasn't it one of those chokes where the other guy wiggled his legs around?

Nope Meng's version had a pinfall, Jim Neidhart's finisher was the exact same animation without a pinfall. When the move was ported over to WM2000 it was Neidhart's version.

<iframe title="YouTube video player" class="youtube-player" type="text/html" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/EP2rTR5pPQs" frameborder="0" allowFullScreen></iframe>

@4:08

#BROKEN Hasney

01-31-2011, 05:30 PM

Yeah, I mean The Worm was pathetic in some peoples eyes, but that ended up getting pop of the night some shows.

I, for one, loved Too Cool. Worm and all.

CSL

01-31-2011, 05:31 PM

Wow, those Nash jokes continue to be not funny.

lol you really have gone out of your way to be a whiny tart recently haven't you. Quick, save everybody and post some more crying over Hulk Hogan. Because that's always relevant and fun to read :y:

#BROKEN Hasney

01-31-2011, 05:32 PM

lol you really have gone out of your way to be a whiny tart recently haven't you. Quick, save everybody and post some more crying over Hulk Hogan. Because that's always relevant and fun to read :y:

[/thread]

Rammsteinmad

01-31-2011, 05:35 PM

thedamndest

01-31-2011, 06:49 PM

It all depends how the move is sold. The Worm could finish matches against mid-card level guys but bigger names could kick out or even prevent the move from happening. But then they were never going to make Scotty 2 Hotty a big threat to Austin or anyone. The move was exactly where it should have been for what Scotty was.

The Cobra compliments Santino's character in the same way. If they build up Santino, the move itself is fine because it is a strike to the throat. It isn't as explosive as a Pedigree or a Stunner so I would change it for those reasons. The Cobra just isn't a move you would pop for as a finish to a main event match. But there isn't really anything wrong with it.

Heisenberg

01-31-2011, 07:53 PM

The Cobra seems to channel it's power from the damn Unibrow he rocks.

CSL

01-31-2011, 08:01 PM

I thought that's what us internet wrestling fans do?

If the goal is 'typical super serial clueless internet dipshit', sure.

Jeritron

01-31-2011, 11:41 PM

And here I was thinking I could win matches with a Worm-Stinkface combo

dingdongyo

02-01-2011, 12:24 AM

Yeah, i would like to see him go back to that sort of character.
i don't. santino is unique and funny. the angry violent guy is the persona you give to the guy who can't do anything else.
i honestly wanted santino to win the rumble. it would have been the biggest upset rumble win since duggan.

Theo Dious

02-01-2011, 12:39 AM

The Cobra is far more believable than the 619.

SlickyTrickyDamon

02-01-2011, 01:06 AM

Worm, Balling Elbow whatever. The crowd loves the fuck out of it. Quit being such a stick in the mud.

Nightwing

02-01-2011, 05:36 PM

Ill take the Cobra over The Worm, and Stinkface any day.

Troelar

02-01-2011, 06:31 PM

I would agree that if Santino is supposed to become a legit threat at any point, then they can slightly modify the finisher (ditch the intro, perhaps a different way of doing the actual strike, using two hands one from either side - whatever).

BTW it's not a pinfall here :) : <iframe title="YouTube video player" class="youtube-player" type="text/html" width="480" height="390" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/NQ1wOR22NbA" frameborder="0" allowFullScreen></iframe>

Lara Emily

02-02-2011, 07:47 AM

Yeah it was a submission movie if need be and was used as such early but then it was mostly a pinning move Fuck I love that move, my absolute favorite finisher of all time (seriously you're pinning a guy with your fingers how badass is that). Like I said loved that WCW/NWO Revenge got it right (It was actually one of the first things I checked for when I got that game)