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Sickboy
12-23-2003, 12:53 PM
http://shopzone.wwe.com/shopzone/en_US/images/00728pi.jpg

I was looking at this pic (which is a bit too small) and I was wondering who are the wrestlers on the bottom row? I only recognize Iron Sheik, Flair, Kane and if I'm not wrong the second person on the right is Mr. Wonderful Paul Orndoff.

The Chosen 1
12-23-2003, 01:47 PM
On the bottom is JYD and Orndoff.

I believe the wrestler next to flair MIGHT be, or looks like Bruno Samurtino.

I <3 Negros
12-23-2003, 02:29 PM
The guy next to Flair would be Gorrila Moonson.

Savio
12-23-2003, 02:50 PM
bret hart is #1 what were they thinking

loopydate
12-23-2003, 03:22 PM
Does anybody actually have this magazine who would be willing to post the entire list? I don't want to buy it myself, but I'm curious who's in it.

blake639raw
12-23-2003, 04:24 PM
I think that's Bam Bam Bigelow in the bottom corner, and Pedro Morales is on the bottom row too.

FakeLaser
12-23-2003, 04:47 PM
bret hart is #1 what were they thinking
They were thinking correctly.

Head
12-23-2003, 05:23 PM
It may be just because I have bad eyesight, but is that Kane on the bottom row, forth from right?

sadio8
12-23-2003, 05:30 PM
interesting to say the least. Lord knows why Brock Lesner is on that list.

Kenny
12-23-2003, 05:31 PM
It may be just because I have bad eyesight, but is that Kane on the bottom row, forth from right?

Looks like it to me.

Head
12-23-2003, 05:32 PM
Thats some bullshit.

sadio8
12-23-2003, 05:32 PM
Yeah that looks like kane. And if he is on this list then thats really screwed up.

Loose Cannon
12-23-2003, 05:37 PM
bret hart is #1 what were they thinking

I think they were actually thinking this time :y: :y:

Kenny
12-23-2003, 05:37 PM
Here's what I got...

ROW 1: Bret Hart, Hulk Hogan, Andre The Giant, Honky Tonk Man, Ultimate Warrior, ??????, Bob Backlund, Sgt. Slaughter, Roddy Piper, ??????

ROW 2: Kurt Angle, ???????, Chris Jericho, ???????, ??????, Mick Foley, ??????, Jimmy Snuka, Scott Hall, ???????

ROW 3: Jake Roberts, ??????, ??????, ??????, Triple H, Stone Cold, Ted Dibiase, ????????, Yokozuna, ???????

ROW 4: ???????, The Undertaker, Jesse Ventura, Shawn Michaels, The Rock, Moolah, Macho Man, Brock Lesnar, Rick Rude

ROW 5: Shiek, Haku, ???????, ???????, ???????, Ric Flair, Kane, JYD, Paul Orndorf, ??????

WHERE THE F*CK IS CHRIS BENOIT?!?!?!

Head
12-23-2003, 05:38 PM
WHY THE **** WOULD HAKU BE ON THERE?

Head
12-23-2003, 05:39 PM
Good list besides that though.

Loose Cannon
12-23-2003, 05:40 PM
That can't be Haku. JYD WTF. Why is he on there

Loose Cannon
12-23-2003, 05:42 PM
I think next to Jericho is Bobo Brazil

Head
12-23-2003, 05:43 PM
Nah, it really looks like Haku. Can't think of anybody else it would be.

The CyNick
12-23-2003, 06:11 PM
I got this list from another site:

1. Bret Hart
2. Hulk Hogan
3. Andre the Giant
4. the Honky Tonk Man
5. Ultimate Warrior
6. Killer Kowolski
7. Bob Backlund
8. Sgt Slaughter
9. Roddy Piper
10. Don Muraco
11. Kurt Angle
12. Jay Strongbow
13. Chris Jericho
14. Bobo Brazil
15. Bruno Sammartino
16. Mick Foley
17. Ivan Putski
18. Jimmy Snuka
19. Scott Hall
20. Antonio Rocca
21. Jake Roberts
22. Pat Patterson
23. George Steele
24. Billy Graham
25. HHH
26. Steve Austin
27. Ted DiBiasse
28. Wendi Richter
29. Yokozuna
30. King Kong Bundy
31. Buddy Rogers
32. Undertaker
33. Jesse Ventura
34. HBK
35. Ricky Steamboat
36. The Rock
37. Fabulous Moolah
38. Randy Savage
39. Brock Lesnar
40. Rick Rude
41. Iron Shiek
42. Ernie Ladd
43. Pedro Morales
44. Ken Patera
45. Gorilla Monsoon
46. Ric Flair
47. Kane
48. Junkyard Dog
49. Paul Orndorf
50. Haystacks Calhoun

Couple of things:

I dont think the intention was to make Bret Hart #1, I think its just a list of the top 50, but in particular order. I mean how the heck would the Warrior or Honkytonk Man crack the top 5????

As for people on the list, I think the only really wierd ones are JYD and Kane, in my opinion neither of those guys belong on the lsit, but whatever. Brock I would have put on the list because he was the youngest WWE champion, and he's caught on to the business faster than very few people in the history of the business.

Mr Perfect should have made the list and probably the British Bulldog, but there will always be omissions in a list like this. I'm suprised Nash didn't get on, not from a skill standpoint but from a "I kiss Hunter's ass" standpoint.

Loose Cannon
12-23-2003, 06:19 PM
I got this list from another site:

1. Bret Hart
2. Hulk Hogan
3. Andre the Giant
4. the Honky Tonk Man
5. Ultimate Warrior
6. Killer Kowolski
7. Bob Backlund
8. Sgt Slaughter
9. Roddy Piper
10. Don Muraco
11. Kurt Angle
12. Jay Strongbow
13. Chris Jericho
14. Bobo Brazil
15. Bruno Sammartino
16. Mick Foley
17. Ivan Putski
18. Jimmy Snuka
19. Scott Hall
20. Antonio Rocca
21. Jake Roberts
22. Pat Patterson
23. George Steele
24. Billy Graham
25. HHH
26. Steve Austin
27. Ted DiBiasse
28. Wendi Richter
29. Yokozuna
30. King Kong Bundy
31. Buddy Rogers
32. Undertaker
33. Jesse Ventura
34. HBK
35. Ricky Steamboat
36. The Rock
37. Fabulous Moolah
38. Randy Savage
39. Brock Lesnar
40. Rick Rude
41. Iron Shiek
42. Ernie Ladd
43. Pedro Morales
44. Ken Patera
45. Gorilla Monsoon
46. Ric Flair
47. Kane
48. Junkyard Dog
49. Paul Orndorf
50. Haystacks Calhoun

Couple of things:

I dont think the intention was to make Bret Hart #1, I think its just a list of the top 50, but in particular order. I mean how the heck would the Warrior or Honkytonk Man crack the top 5????

As for people on the list, I think the only really wierd ones are JYD and Kane, in my opinion neither of those guys belong on the lsit, but whatever. Brock I would have put on the list because he was the youngest WWE champion, and he's caught on to the business faster than very few people in the history of the business.

Mr Perfect should have made the list and probably the British Bulldog, but there will always be omissions in a list like this. I'm suprised Nash didn't get on, not from a skill standpoint but from a "I kiss Hunter's ass" standpoint.

Thanks for the list CyNick. It was killing me for the last half hour to see who everyone was. I knew that was not Haku. But yeah that's bullsh** that Perfect or Bulldog didn't make it. Perfect would be in the top 15 for me.

Sickboy
12-23-2003, 07:11 PM
Btw, that's a horrible pic of Warrior, he looks like an ugly 60 year old with paint on his face :lol:

FakeLaser
12-23-2003, 07:14 PM
I got this list from another site:

1. Bret Hart
2. Hulk Hogan
3. Andre the Giant
4. the Honky Tonk Man
5. Ultimate Warrior
6. Killer Kowolski
7. Bob Backlund
8. Sgt Slaughter
9. Roddy Piper
10. Don Muraco
11. Kurt Angle
12. Jay Strongbow
13. Chris Jericho
14. Bobo Brazil
15. Bruno Sammartino
16. Mick Foley
17. Ivan Putski
18. Jimmy Snuka
19. Scott Hall
20. Antonio Rocca
21. Jake Roberts
22. Pat Patterson
23. George Steele
24. Billy Graham
25. HHH
26. Steve Austin
27. Ted DiBiasse
28. Wendi Richter
29. Yokozuna
30. King Kong Bundy
31. Buddy Rogers
32. Undertaker
33. Jesse Ventura
34. HBK
35. Ricky Steamboat
36. The Rock
37. Fabulous Moolah
38. Randy Savage
39. Brock Lesnar
40. Rick Rude
41. Iron Shiek
42. Ernie Ladd
43. Pedro Morales
44. Ken Patera
45. Gorilla Monsoon
46. Ric Flair
47. Kane
48. Junkyard Dog
49. Paul Orndorf
50. Haystacks Calhoun

What the hell is King Kong Bundy doing on this list?

TJ4LIFE
12-23-2003, 07:48 PM
wheres bastion booger when you need him?

JeremyTB29
12-23-2003, 11:01 PM
Why is Shawn Michaels so far down??.He should of made the top 10 easy but they have him at #34

MVP
12-23-2003, 11:56 PM
OMG WHERE'S NASH?!!

MVP
12-23-2003, 11:57 PM
jk, but Owen Hart should be on there.

thebitch
12-24-2003, 12:16 AM
Whomever wrote this was an idiot. There are so many people on there that shouldn't be, and so many that should be on there that aren't. British Bulldog, Dynamite Kid, Owen Hart, Chris Benoit are just a few.

Corkscrewed
12-24-2003, 12:40 AM
Why is Shawn Michaels so far down??.He should of made the top 10 easy but they have him at #34

Cynic pointed out that the list really isn't in any order. I mean, look at #4.

KayfabeMan
12-24-2003, 01:32 AM
1. Bret Hart - No question about it....
2. Hulk Hogan - Duh,he was the WWF....
3. Andre the Giant - Obviously....
4. Honky Tonk Man - This guy has NO business on here....
5. Ultimate Warrior - Made the WWF a good amount of $$....
6. Killer Kowolski - Definitely was a team player for WWF....
7. Bob Backlund - Nutjob,but he helped WWF alot....
8. Sgt Slaughter - I think they did it because he's got the in....
9. Roddy Piper - One of the greatest heels ever....
10. Don Muraco :y:
11. Kurt Angle :y:
12. Jay Strongbow - Great worker....
13. Chris Jericho - Most underrated in recent history
14. Bobo Brazil - Was a good worker,but there were better....
15. Bruno Sammartino - He (along with Hulk) built it....
16. Mick Foley :y: Did more than what anyone thought he could...
17. Ivan Putski :y:
18. Jimmy Snuka :y:
19. Scott Hall - OK,a great IC champ,but there were alot better
20. Antonio Rocca - Changed the style of wrestling....
21. Jake Roberts - Very underrated; too bad he can't change
22. Pat Patterson :wtf:
23. George Steele - Awesome guy,great worker
24. Billy Graham - Great personality...
25. HHH :|
26. Steve Austin - Carried WWE for the time he was needed...
27. Ted DiBiase - Should have been Champ; **** HTM
28. Wendi Richter - It asks: "why did you screw me over?" :mad:
29. Yokozuna - Definitely deserves his spot....
30. King Kong Bundy - Not the best wrestler,but a legendary heel
31. Buddy Rogers - This guy is WAY overrated...
32. Undertaker - Worked like a dog for WWE; deserves it...
33. Jesse Ventura - In the top 5 greatest heels of all-time....
34. HBK
35. Ricky Steamboat
36. The Rock
37. Fabulous Moolah :y: :y:
38. Randy Savage - Ooooh Yeaaah!! (he stole it,but it works)
39. Brock Lesnar - One of these things does not belong....
40. Rick Rude - Awesome worker
41. Iron Shiek - Team player all the way through....
42. Ernie Ladd - Paved the way for AA's in wrestling....
43. Pedro Morales - Great great wrestler
44. Ken Patera :|
45. Gorilla Monsoon - Awesome guy; did so so much...
46. Ric Flair - Not any better...
47. Kane :wtf:
48. Junkyard Dog - Could have been the top face; politics...
49. Paul Orndorff :y: Awesome heel; great worker....
50. Haystacks Calhoun :y:

Others that I think should have been on there: Curt Hennig;
Owen Hart; British Bulldog; Kerry Von Erich & Greg Valentine
(it's also sad looking at my choices for additions that 4 of 5
of them have passed on,and at young ages)....

It's also great that Vince has messed over 1/2 the people on
that list.He mentions them as people who are the 50 greatest
in WWF ever,yet he has ****ed em' over :lol: Most notably,a
TRUE legend in Bruno Sammartino,Women's Champion Wendi
Richter,and George Steele.

The CyNick
12-24-2003, 01:38 AM
Keep in mind a guy like Kerry Von Erich didn't really do all that much in the WWE. He had a pretty short run, and never really had any memorable matches (save maybe one against Perfect that comes to mind). So guys like him or even LOD who didn't make the list really didn't have a big impact on the WWE, which is what the list is about; the WWE.

JeremyTB29
12-24-2003, 03:44 AM
the reason benoit is not on that list is because I believe it's the wwf/wwe's 50 greatest wrestler's and Benoit hasn't been in the wwe all that long.But again Lesner and angle haven't been in the wwe that long either.Angle still deserves to be there but I don't think Lesner does.

Darwin Henderson
12-24-2003, 06:40 AM
It's also great that Vince has messed over 1/2 the people on
that list.He mentions them as people who are the 50 greatest
in WWF ever,yet he has ****ed em' over :lol: Most notably,a
TRUE legend in Bruno Sammartino,Women's Champion Wendi
Richter,and George Steele.

What did he do to Sammartino? I've heard they fell out over something but I dont know what.
And what happened to Richter and Steele?

KayfabeMan
12-24-2003, 07:06 AM
What did he do to Sammartino? I've heard they fell out over something but I dont know what.
And what happened to Richter and Steele?

Richter - She was supposed to work a masked jobber named
"Spider Lady" back in the mid-80's at MSG..At that point,she
was Women's Champion,but was working without a contract.
Vince wanted her to sign a contract to assure that his title-
holder would remain with him,and she refused to do so before
this show (due to her being promised a certain amount of $$
and then according to the contract getting less).

Vince got pissed and had Moolah wear the Spider-Lady mask
and outfit,and she rolled up Wendi with an extremely fast 3
by the referee,becoming the new Women's Champion; and in
the process,ending Richter's active wrestling career with all
major promotions.Some say that this was an angle,but it has
been said by various people "in the know" that it is definitely
not.

***
Sammartino - Sammartino worked hard for Vince for many
years.He decided he wanted out of the business around the
time that his son David decided that he wanted to get in.

Vince told Bruno to come back and work with them,as he
(Vince) "wanted to maintain the old-school ways",yet af-
ter Bruno signed on,they went off in the completely new
direction,and left Bruno working in a situation he did not
want to be in.

They then had Bruno come back and wrestle on several
occasions to "get David over",but obviously it was just
for the $$ that Bruno working got in,because after Bruno
tagging with David on several occasions,etc.. David was
put right back into dark matches,and was never pushed
as was promised.

He also messed Bruno out of some money,and when it
came time for A&E to do their history of wrestling spe-
cial,they needed WWF footage.Vince told them (A&E)
that they could not show footage of Bruno,or even do
an interview with him to air on the show (esentially th-
ey couldn't mention him at all - which was the case),or
he wouldn't give them the rights to use the footage &
interview his wrestlers.

He also tried to block Bruno from being inducted into
the MSG Hall of Fame.Very spiteful and disrespectful
to a guy who carried your company for many years...

Darwin Henderson
12-24-2003, 08:06 AM
Richter - She was supposed to work a masked jobber named
"Spider Lady" back in the mid-80's at MSG..At that point,she
was Women's Champion,but was working without a contract.
Vince wanted her to sign a contract to assure that his title-
holder would remain with him,and she refused to do so before
this show (due to her being promised a certain amount of $$
and then according to the contract getting less).

Vince got pissed and had Moolah wear the Spider-Lady mask
and outfit,and she rolled up Wendi with an extremely fast 3
by the referee,becoming the new Women's Champion; and in
the process,ending Richter's active wrestling career with all
major promotions.Some say that this was an angle,but it has
been said by various people "in the know" that it is definitely
not.

***
Sammartino - Sammartino worked hard for Vince for many
years.He decided he wanted out of the business around the
time that his son David decided that he wanted to get in.

Vince told Bruno to come back and work with them,as he
(Vince) "wanted to maintain the old-school ways",yet af-
ter Bruno signed on,they went off in the completely new
direction,and left Bruno working in a situation he did not
want to be in.

They then had Bruno come back and wrestle on several
occasions to "get David over",but obviously it was just
for the $$ that Bruno working got in,because after Bruno
tagging with David on several occasions,etc.. David was
put right back into dark matches,and was never pushed
as was promised.

He also messed Bruno out of some money,and when it
came time for A&E to do their history of wrestling spe-
cial,they needed WWF footage.Vince told them (A&E)
that they could not show footage of Bruno,or even do
an interview with him to air on the show (esentially th-
ey couldn't mention him at all - which was the case),or
he wouldn't give them the rights to use the footage &
interview his wrestlers.

He also tried to block Bruno from being inducted into
the MSG Hall of Fame.Very spiteful and disrespectful
to a guy who carried your company for many years...

Vince will shit on anyone wont he. Wasnt Bruno champ for about 6 or 7 years.

KayfabeMan
12-24-2003, 08:31 AM
Indeed.

Bruno had 2 title reigns with WWWF/WWF; the first one for nearly 8
years,and then the second one (done again,as a favor for Vince) for
4 years (where it was only supposed to be a one year deal).

Loose Cannon
12-24-2003, 11:38 AM
1. Bret Hart - No question about it....
2. Hulk Hogan - Duh,he was the WWF....
3. Andre the Giant - Obviously....
4. Honky Tonk Man - This guy has NO business on here....
5. Ultimate Warrior - Made the WWF a good amount of $$....
6. Killer Kowolski - Definitely was a team player for WWF....
7. Bob Backlund - Nutjob,but he helped WWF alot....
8. Sgt Slaughter - I think they did it because he's got the in....
9. Roddy Piper - One of the greatest heels ever....
10. Don Muraco :y:
11. Kurt Angle :y:
12. Jay Strongbow - Great worker....
13. Chris Jericho - Most underrated in recent history
14. Bobo Brazil - Was a good worker,but there were better....
15. Bruno Sammartino - He (along with Hulk) built it....
16. Mick Foley :y: Did more than what anyone thought he could...
17. Ivan Putski :y:
18. Jimmy Snuka :y:
19. Scott Hall - OK,a great IC champ,but there were alot better
20. Antonio Rocca - Changed the style of wrestling....
21. Jake Roberts - Very underrated; too bad he can't change
22. Pat Patterson :wtf:
23. George Steele - Awesome guy,great worker
24. Billy Graham - Great personality...
25. HHH :|
26. Steve Austin - Carried WWE for the time he was needed...
27. Ted DiBiase - Should have been Champ; **** HTM
28. Wendi Richter - It asks: "why did you screw me over?" :mad:
29. Yokozuna - Definitely deserves his spot....
30. King Kong Bundy - Not the best wrestler,but a legendary heel
31. Buddy Rogers - This guy is WAY overrated...
32. Undertaker - Worked like a dog for WWE; deserves it...
33. Jesse Ventura - In the top 5 greatest heels of all-time....
34. HBK
35. Ricky Steamboat
36. The Rock
37. Fabulous Moolah :y: :y:
38. Randy Savage - Ooooh Yeaaah!! (he stole it,but it works)
39. Brock Lesnar - One of these things does not belong....
40. Rick Rude - Awesome worker
41. Iron Shiek - Team player all the way through....
42. Ernie Ladd - Paved the way for AA's in wrestling....
43. Pedro Morales - Great great wrestler
44. Ken Patera :|
45. Gorilla Monsoon - Awesome guy; did so so much...
46. Ric Flair - Not any better...
47. Kane :wtf:
48. Junkyard Dog - Could have been the top face; politics...
49. Paul Orndorff :y: Awesome heel; great worker....
50. Haystacks Calhoun :y:

Others that I think should have been on there: Curt Hennig;
Owen Hart; British Bulldog; Kerry Von Erich & Greg Valentine
(it's also sad looking at my choices for additions that 4 of 5
of them have passed on,and at young ages)....

It's also great that Vince has messed over 1/2 the people on
that list.He mentions them as people who are the 50 greatest
in WWF ever,yet he has ****ed em' over :lol: Most notably,a
TRUE legend in Bruno Sammartino,Women's Champion Wendi
Richter,and George Steele.

I think HTM should be on that list as he was one of the greatest heels ever and generated a tun of heat when he was the I.C. CHAMP. People were calling for his head during the last few months of his reign. Of course he wasn't a real good worker but he got way over with his character and worked the mic pretty good to get the audience going.

Yeah and Von Erich wasn't with the WWF for that long and he only had a couple of decent matches. Although his I.C. feud with Perfect was my favorite I.C. feud of all-time.

But I really don't understand why they didn't include OWEN or Perfect when guys like Ken Patera, JYD, and Kane are on there. Those two were some of the best workers the WWE has ever had. I consider Perfect to be the greatest I.C. champ of all-time. And Owen I consider to be very underated and could of easily been Heavyweight Champ.

loopydate
12-24-2003, 03:46 PM
I'm just curious, guys, but who would you put on your Top 50 list? I'll have to do a little research first, but I think I'll post mine today.

Sephiroth
12-24-2003, 04:04 PM
They were thinking correctly.

Your right Bret Hart deserves to be #1, I think he is one of the Greatest there is if it would not be for that little thing, that happend (if i am not mistaking) with Goldberg, he would still be around to prove he is one of the greatest. Ask any wrestling fan and he will tell you the same.

Lara Emily
12-24-2003, 05:28 PM
Scott Hall and Kane make the list Chris Benoit doesn't weird.

KayfabeMan
12-24-2003, 06:05 PM
I think HTM should be on that list as he was one of the greatest heels ever and generated a tun of heat when he was the I.C. CHAMP. People were calling for his head during the last few months of his reign. Of course he wasn't a real good worker but he got way over with his character and worked the mic pretty good to get the audience going.


I just think he shouldn't be included because,in the long run,he
hurt the business WAY more than he ever could have helped it.

It is due to him that Ted DiBiase never won the World Title,and
never got a chance at the top again (something that could ha-
ve made WWF quite a bit of $$ and also something DiBiase was
certainly deserving of).

His ego was bigger than him,or anything he accomplished.

The CyNick
12-24-2003, 07:19 PM
Hall I can sorta see with his participation in the Ladder Matches with HBK, which had a huge impact on the business. However, on a personaly level I would put a guy like Hennig or Bulldog ahead of him.

Kane kinda baffles me, I mean I guess he's there because he won the title, but I mean I dont think that should be enough to get him on the list. I guess he's just there because he's been with the company for a long time.

BasicThuganomics
12-24-2003, 11:02 PM
I just think he shouldn't be included because,in the long run,he
hurt the business WAY more than he ever could have helped it.

It is due to him that Ted DiBiase never won the World Title,and
never got a chance at the top again (something that could ha-
ve made WWF quite a bit of $$ and also something DiBiase was
certainly deserving of).

His ego was bigger than him,or anything he accomplished.


How did HonkeyTonk Man keep Ted DiBiase from getting the world title? :mad: The Million Dollar Man is one of the best gimmicks ever in wrestling and Ted DiBiase will always be one of the greatest heels ever IMO.

Loose Cannon
12-24-2003, 11:17 PM
How did HonkeyTonk Man keep Ted DiBiase from getting the world title? :mad: The Million Dollar Man is one of the best gimmicks ever in wrestling and Ted DiBiase will always be one of the greatest heels ever IMO.

Well I think at one of the shows before WM4, (I think Sat Night Main Event) Macho Man was suppossed to win the I.C. Title from HTM. But HTM got pissed and didn't want to job to Savage and complained to Vince and Vince allowed HTM to keep the title.

So Savage was going to shoot on HTM on a live Sat Main Event cause he got pissed and to prevent him from doing this, Vince promised him the World Title at WM4. That World Title was suppossed to be won by Dibiase at the PPV.

Well that's what I heard.

loopydate
12-24-2003, 11:32 PM
Well I think at one of the shows before WM4, (I think Sat Night Main Event) Macho Man was suppossed to win the I.C. Title from HTM. But HTM got pissed and didn't want to job to Savage and complained to Vince and Vince allowed HTM to keep the title.

So Savage was going to shoot on HTM on a live Sat Main Event cause he got pissed and to prevent him from doing this, Vince promised him the World Title at WM4. That World Title was suppossed to be won by Dibiase at the PPV.

Well that's what I heard.

I'm sure most of that's true, but what I can't wrap my head around is the fact that a heel was supposed to win the main event at a late-'80s Wrestlemania...

Loose Cannon
12-24-2003, 11:41 PM
I'm sure most of that's true, but what I can't wrap my head around is the fact that a heel was supposed to win the main event at a late-'80s Wrestlemania...

You know that never really crossed my mind until you just mentioned it. That would of been a little strange. I wonder if Savage would have turned heel had he not won the belt. You think WM 5 would have been Dibiase vs Hulk rather then Savage vs Hulk? Makes you wonder a bit.

KayfabeMan
12-25-2003, 12:53 AM
Well I think at one of the shows before
WM4, (I think Sat Night Main Event) Macho Man was suppossed
to win the I.C. Title from HTM. But HTM got pissed and didn't
want to job to Savage & complained to Vince and Vince allowed
HTM to keep the title.

So Savage was going to shoot on HTM on a live Sat Main Event
cause he got pissed and to prevent him from doing this, Vince
promised him the World Title at WM4. That World Title was
suppossed to be won by Dibiase at the PPV.Well that's what I
heard.

Yep.HTM didn't want to lose to Savage because he felt it would
hurt his cred,and that he was too big of a star to "lay down" for
Macho.Honky threatened to TAKE THE IC TITLE AND LEAVE THE
WWE,so like LC said,Vince told him he could keep it,which...

pissed off Savage (rightfully so) and Savage,like LC said,made a
promise (I call it that because he would have) to shoot on HTM
and take the title off of him.Vince,realizing that HTM wasn't Bret
Hart,didn't want to do a screwjob on him,and promised Macho a
title run.

So Savage won the match,and the yearlong reign with the belt,
that DiBiase never go to have.All because of one egotistical ass-
hole named The HTM.

Now,if only Ted DiBiase and IRS would have taken the Tag Titles
to WCW in the early 90's :y: :y:

BasicThuganomics
12-25-2003, 02:45 AM
Well, to be fair, what HTM did definately wasn't right. But i kinda think that it shouldn't be entirely blamed on him. I mean, if Vince had wanted to make him champ just to please Savage, why did he do it for the entire year? Vince still should have found a way to give DiBiase the belt that he deserved. Ted DiBiase was the man in his day.

Bad Guy
12-25-2003, 03:27 AM
brock lesnar? wtf

Nowhere Man
12-25-2003, 05:53 AM
I'm guessing they're just going by their stints in WWF/E, because there's no way Flair deserves to be that freaking low on the list.

Good list altogether, although I do think Owen and Hennig deserve to be on there WAY more than guys like the late JYD and Kane. I'm guessing my top 50 would look a lot like that, except with the numbers severely re-arranged.

KayfabeMan
12-25-2003, 05:58 AM
Well, to be fair, what HTM did
definately wasn't right. But i kinda think that it shouldn't be
entirely blamed on him.I mean, if Vince had wanted to make
him champ just to please Savage,why did he do it for the
entire year? Vince still should have found a way to give
DiBiase the belt that he deserved. Ted DiBiase was the man
in his day.

Vince made Savage Champion because he promised him he would
hold the IC Title,and with that not happening,he needed to get a
belt on him quick,or risk losing him. Keep in mind,he kept the title
on him for a year because: A) It worked & B) This was the 1980's,
the title had not begun to change hands often - there were only
about a dozen title reigns before Savage,and about 10 Champions.

Ponder this as well: Honky wouldn't put over Savage,but he had
to squash match the title away to The Ultimate Warrior (as seen
on TV the other night) in a HORRIBLE HORRIBLE excuse of a mat-
ch.Also,if you saw that match,you'll notice HTM was doing SHIT
in the heat department,as his gimmick was dying off (and his uh,
"skill" was less than stellar).

KayfabeMan
12-25-2003, 06:08 AM
Good list altogether, although I do
think Owen and Hennig deserve to be on there WAY more
than guys like the late JYD and Kane. I'm guessing my top
50 would look a lot like that, except with the numbers severely
re-arranged.

JYD was another guy who got misused thanks to politics.

He could have been an even bigger star,but alot of the top
guys saw his potential to be a new top guy (or should I say
his already big base carried over from NWA and new fans) &
had him crushed before he could steal their spots (The HHH
Syndrome's grandfather).

His merchandise was always the top seller; if not it was a
very close second. He did TV shows,commercials,and was
really one of the few wrestlers at the time to gain mainst-
ream celebrity status; known by the general public,actors,
etc... His feuds with Race,Adonis,and Roberts were classic
as well - although I feel NWA used him better.

May He Rest In Peace :wavesad:

Nowhere Man
12-25-2003, 06:42 AM
Don't get me wrong; I wasn't saying that Junk Yard Dog was a bad worker. Neither is Kane. I happen to agree with you in that he was awesome. I simply think that Perfect and Owen deserve their props more so.

Loose Cannon
12-25-2003, 09:58 AM
Vince made Savage Champion because he promised him he would
hold the IC Title,and with that not happening,he needed to get a
belt on him quick,or risk losing him. Keep in mind,he kept the title
on him for a year because: A) It worked & B) This was the 1980's,
the title had not begun to change hands often - there were only
about a dozen title reigns before Savage,and about 10 Champions.

Ponder this as well: Honky wouldn't put over Savage,but he had
to squash match the title away to The Ultimate Warrior (as seen
on TV the other night) in a HORRIBLE HORRIBLE excuse of a mat-
ch.Also,if you saw that match,you'll notice HTM was doing SHIT
in the heat department,as his gimmick was dying off (and his uh,
"skill" was less than stellar).

YEAH I watched the Warrior-HTM squash match the other day and the pop from the audience when Warrior got the 3 was huge. They went nuts.

DaveWadding
12-25-2003, 10:24 AM
Now,if only Ted DiBiase and IRS would have taken the Tag Titles
to WCW in the early 90's :y: :y:
??

Was that the reason for them and the Steiners flipflopping belts for like a month?

Savio
12-25-2003, 01:46 PM
where's spanky!?!?!?!?!?!? j/k

I don't see Sting up there though???

Loose Cannon
12-25-2003, 02:07 PM
where's spanky!?!?!?!?!?!? j/k

I don't see Sting up there though???

Sting never wrestled for the WWF

KayfabeMan
12-25-2003, 03:45 PM
Don't get me wrong; I wasn't saying that Junk Yard Dog was a bad worker. Neither is Kane. I happen to agree with you in that he was awesome. I simply think that Perfect and Owen deserve their props more so.

I know,I didn't mean any offense,because I do agree with you :y:

I just wanted to point out that JYD was another misused guy like
DiBiase and others were...it's a shame what happens :(

JeremyTB29
12-25-2003, 04:38 PM
Wasn't Macho Man a bigger star then HTM at the time HTM held the IC title?.Why would HTM feel above jobbing to a bigger star then him?.

KayfabeMan
12-25-2003, 04:55 PM
Wasn't Macho Man a bigger star then HTM at the time HTM held the IC title?.Why would HTM feel above jobbing to a bigger star then him?

Because he had a HUGE ego,and didn't want to put anyone over,
let alone what he thought to be a "talentless kid".Plus,he thought
that his "spot" would be taken,and he'd not be needed (which is
what happened anyway).