Random baseball shit

[The Miz]

Please, if you have a heart, go to MLB.com and vote Francisco Liriano for AL Final Vote to be named to the AL All-Star Team. He's currently in second place.

When voting, consider that Liriano has been the best pitcher in baseball the last 2 months. Consider that he is doing it in his rookie year. Consider that he is the only starter in baseball with a sub-2.00 ERA. But most importantly, consider who will take his spot if you choose not to vote:

http://www.geocities.com/ajpierzynski/images/AJ.jpg

THIS FUCKING ASSHOLE!

Look into your heart. Don't let A.J. fucking Pierzynski grace the roster of the AL's best. Don't let his stupid fucking manager get his wish and have AJ on the team.

Go and vote. Now. Multiple times.

http://www.mlb.com/

[The Miz]

You only have till 6 eastern BTW :mad:

[Joey Slugs]

awwww.

Is it going to suck that much to have one of the best catchers in the league in the All Star Game? Better luck for Liriano next year.

AJ - 5/28 .326/.371/.446

[ct2k]

Yeah i voted for him not long after the last man vote started, went for Nomah in the NL:y:

[Joey Slugs]

It's going to be AJ and Nomar. And all will be right with the world.

Then someone will drop out of the ASG and then Crede will get the call (should be starting anyway... fucking popularity contest).

[RP]

i voted for pronk

[DaveWadding]

i voted for pronk

So did I...but I'll probably throw in a vote for Liriano just cause.

And LOL @ Pusszynski being "one of the best Catchers in the league." The guy is terrible and a piece of shit to boot.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>I didn't vote Liriano. The kid's awesome, but I want the NL to actually have a fighting chance. Definately didn't vote AJ either. Too many White Sox already as is. I voted Ramon Hernandez, who probably won't even play if he's put on the team.

Besides which, Ozzie should be punished for not taking Liriano to begin with. What the fuck is wrong with him. :| The only way I could question him further is if he lets Mark Redman play in the game.</font>

[Joey Slugs]

And LOL @ Pusszynski being "one of the best Catchers in the league." The guy is terrible and a piece of shit to boot.

3-run game winning home run anyone?

[DaveWadding]

lol...okay?

[Joey Slugs]

lol...okay?

Make all the "Pusszynski" and "he got pwned by Barrett" comments you want... last time I checked... he punked your entire fanbase last weekend.

And cry all you want about him winning the 30th man, he'll be there next Tuesday and he'll play. Simple as that.

We got Pods voted in last year (over Jeter I may add) and we'll get AJ in this year.

[DaveWadding]

And cry all you want about him winning the 30th man, he'll be there next Tuesday and he'll play. Simple as that.



Only because Guillen has a HUGE hard on for him...which you obviously do too.

[Joey Slugs]

Only because Guillen has a HUGE hard on for him...which you obviously do too.

Ozzie didn't pick him to be in the 30th man thing, that was the MLB.

[RP]

Yah we know Joey Slugs, tragedy happens and Spodwinklesk getting voted in over Jeter was one of them.

[Joey Slugs]

Yah we know Joey Slugs, tragedy happens and Spodwinklesk getting voted in over Jeter was one of them.

Then New Yorkers should of voted more.

[RP]

Then New Yorkers should of voted more.

Yah congrats on your future White Sox All star game trivia question there.

[DaveWadding]

Then New Yorkers should of voted more.

I think its pretty funny how you were pissed off about it being a "popularity contest" and now you're endorsing it because it went your way.

[Joey Slugs]

I think its pretty funny how you were pissed off about it being a "popularoty contest" and now you're endorsing it because it went your way.

The popularity contest is for the starters.

[ct2k]

What i wanna know is why the hell is home-field advantage still decided by the all-star result?

It's just...insane!

[DaveWadding]

However you wanna justify it to yourself is cool with me.

[Joey Slugs]

However you wanna justify it to yourself is cool with me.

Pissed that "your" team only has one guy going?

[RoXer]

So Slugs, back to the question at hand here....


Why should A.J. be voted in and not Liriano?

[BCWWF]

AJ Pierzynski being one of the top catchers in the game? Outside of his batting average he is merely average.

AJ has 28 RBIs. 16 MLB catchers are above him, three are tied with him. Seven AL catchers are above him.

AJ has five home runs. 22 MLB catchers have more than him, three are tied with him. 13 of those above him are from the AL.

AJ has an OPS of 816. Five MLB catchers have more than him, and ALL FIVE are from the AL.

The pecking order for AL catchers should go as follows:
1. Joe Mauer (MIN) .391 6 43
2. Victor Martinez (CLE) .307 11 56
3. Ramon Hernandez (BAL) .274 15 59
4. Jorge Posada (NYY) .307 11 45
5. Kenji Johjima (SEA) .294 10 41
6. Ivan Rodriguez (DET) .306 7 39
7. Jason Varitek (BOS) .244 9 40
8. AJ Pierzynski (CWS) .326 5 28

AJ doesn't hold water when it comes to being a deserving All Star this year. He is the same as he was on the Twins for so many years, he is a very solid player who hits well late in the lineup, but has relatively nothing to show for it but average. He is not deserving of an All Star bid this year.

[Joey Slugs]

I'm glad your "pecking order" is opinion based.

[RoXer]

So Slugs, back to the question at hand here....


Why should A.J. be voted in and not Liriano?

[Joey Slugs]

AJ's in the lead right now, that alone answers the question.

[BCWWF]

How can you justify that AJ is more deserving of the All Star game than Victor Martinez or Ramon Hernandez? A few more hits and about half as many RBIs? The All Star game is already flawed by the voting system, which prevented a lot of deserving guys from making the rosters to begin with. Even if the rosters were set right from the start, Pierzynski still wouldn't be on the team.

Justify why AJ is more deserving than all-but two of the guys I listed and maybe you can change my mind.

[RoXer]

AJ's in the lead right now, that alone answers the question.

So your answer is "because"

[Joey Slugs]

A no nonsense get-it-done (and one of the reasons the pitching staff was so dominant last season) top 5 catcher on the best team in baseball.

That is all I have to say.

[BCWWF]

Ivan Rodriguez isn't even in the vote silly

[Joey Slugs]

Tigers may have the best record, but they are 1-5 against the White Sox this year.

As I said, the best team in baseball.

[BCWWF]

AL Team ERA
1. Detroit Tigers 3.52
2. Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim 4.15
3. Oakland Athletics 4.18
4. Minnesota Twins 4.34
5. New York Yankees 4.39
5. Chicago White Sox 4.39

[RoXer]

OK. I'm done here.

[The Miz]

A no nonsense get-it-done (guy)

Slugs, don't you claim to be heavy into sabermetrics? The whole point of sabermetrics was to look at baseball in a different way, different from the traditional attitudes and beliefs held by baseball people. The reason James started writing was because of attitudes like yours. "He's a no nonsense get-it-done guy." What the fuck does that mean? Is there a measure or statistic you use to quantify his lack of nonsense? What does he get done? If "it" refers to getting on base, hitting for extra bases, and creating runs (things you should use to measure a player's value), then there are at least three catchers in the American League who get "it" done better.

Joe Mauer .459 OBP, .544 SLG, 29 XBH
Ramón Hernández .334 OBP, .497 SLG, 35 XBH
Jorge Posada .402 OBP, .489 SLG, 23 XBH
A.J. Pierzynski .371 OBP, .446 SLG, 22 XBH

and one of the reasons the pitching staff was so dominant last season

So now we're awarding people all-star berths for what they did last season? I'm pretty sure the 2006 All-Star Team is to award those who have been the best players in 2006, not 2005. If A.J. is so great at handling the staff, why does Jon Garland suck so much this year? Even if Pierzynski is so great at handling the staff, that makes him all-star worthy?

top 5 catcher on the best team in baseball.

Who cares what team he plays on? This is the AL vs. NL, not the White Sox vs. NL (although that's how Ozzie would like it). What team he plays on should not be a factor in deciding if he's all-star worthy because the all-star game is about individuals. Are Scott Kazmir's numbers any less impressive because the Devil Rays are shit? Please.

The ONLY reason you voted for Pierzynski is because he's a White Sox, and you know it.

[Joey Slugs]

Who cares what team he plays on? This is the AL vs. NL, not the White Sox vs. NL (although that's how Ozzie would like it). What team he plays on should not be a factor in deciding if he's all-star worthy because the all-star game is about individuals. Are Scott Kazmir's numbers any less impressive because the Devil Rays are shit? Please.



Don't even give me that "that's how Ozzie would like it" shit. No one bitched and moaned when Torre would do that every year.

But you are right, I am big into Sabermetrics and the only reason I voted for AJ is because he is on the Sox. He's a major pain in the ass, but atleast he's our pain in the ass.

[The Miz]

Don't even give me that "that's how Ozzie would like it" shit. No one bitched and moaned when Torre would do that every year.



I did

[Joey Slugs]

I did

That makes one. :lol:

[Adder]

I gave Liriano and Young @ 20 votes each.

[The Miz]

Ozzie called all his gay friends that he met at Madonna concerts and told them to stuff the ballot box for AJ :(

[mrslackalack]

Santana and Lirano might bring a title to the Twins one day if they stay together and healthy.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Voted for Liriano and Mr. Nomar Garciapara

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

AJ and Nomar ended up getting it. Liriano could get on if a pitcher drops out, but last I heard if any player at ANY position drops out, Ozzie is bringing Joe Crede

Smart move :y:

[BCWWF]

So does that mean that Magglio is already replacing Manny?

I thought Crede should have made the team ahead of Glaus anyway, but what can you do I guess.

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

So your answer is "because"
ROFL

[OssMan]

7 White Sox going this year. The year that they took away the vote from the fans was the year that the NL All Star team was the entire Cincinnatti Reds lineup. I hope they take away the fan's vote again, but that will never happen.

[MVP]

Don't even give me that "that's how Ozzie would like it" shit. No one bitched and moaned when Torre would do that every year.

Hi, Red Sox fan here :wave:

[The Outlaw]

Wow, Liriano didn't make it?

I change my vote for biggest robbery.

[The Outlaw]

National League fans knows whats up.

NOMAAAAAAAAAAAA :cool:

[ct2k]

I can't believe AJ Pierfuckingzysnki got it ahead of Liriano...Above average catcher over rookie phenom pitcher

[Joey Slugs]

HAHAHAHAHHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA!

suckers.

[The Miz]

What's funnier is that Liriano is so much better than all of Chicago's "5 potential 20-game winners" it's ridiculous

[Joey Slugs]

What's funnier is that Liriano is so much better than all of Chicago's "5 potential 20-game winners" it's ridiculous

Say what you want.... The White Sox are defending champs and Liriano's Twins are fading. I could care less who he's better than right now. Arguement is over... AJ's in, Liriano's out.

[The Miz]

The White Sox winning the 2005 World Series has exactly what to do with Liriano vs. Pierzynski in 2006? And I guess it's Liriano's fault the Twins are fading when he starts every 5th game.

You know Liriano is better than AJ and all 5 of your starters so what is your point? "The Whie Sox won the World Series last year" is not an acceptable answer

[Joey Slugs]

You know Liriano is better than AJ and all 5 of your starters so what is your point? "The Whie Sox won the World Series last year" is not an acceptable answer

Better than all 5 of our starters? Based on what? At the moment stats?

Please. When the game is on the line I'd take one of our guys over some flash in the pan rookie anyday.

I've have this arguement when he has about 5 years of wear and tear under his belt.

[Ruby]

Punch AJ

[The Outlaw]

Yeah, most of the time we do base stuff on current stats.

[The Miz]

Better than all 5 of our starters? Based on what? At the moment stats?

Please. When the game is on the line I'd take one of our guys over some flash in the pan rookie anyday.

I've have this arguement when he has about 5 years of wear and tear under his belt.

The Minnesota Twins won the World Series in 1987

[ct2k]

Ugh at the end of the day, who would rather see AJ (i wish i could punch him) possibly catch for an inning and take one at-bat, or Liriano show his stuff?

[Ruby]

Hard to argue with that logic.

[Joey Slugs]

Ugh at the end of the day, who would rather see AJ (i wish i could punch him) possibly catch for an inning and take one at-bat, or Liriano show his stuff?

Liriano would pitch for what? MAYBE an inning? AJ could have the chance of being a late inning defensive replacement and maybe go on to get a game winning hit. Might even make him MVP. Who knows.

Really doesn't matter anymore does it?

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Liriano is the best pitcher in the majors right now, thats why it does matter that he is not in the All Star game. How it even came down to a "last man" vote is ridiculous, so what if he hasn't made 15 starts? He has 9 (pretty sure its 9) wins with an ERA under 2.

Good thing Mark Buehrle and his 4.02 ERA made it though, cuz I know I can't name five pitchers in the American League right now that deserved the spot more than him...

[Joey Slugs]

You'll never hear me say that Buehrle should be on the All Star roster this year.

[The Miz]

lol I like the argument of what his role will be in the game. He'll probably only pitch an inning so he doesn't deserve it. We should probably invite Sandy Alomar Jr. to the all-star game, he's been the best pinch hitter in the game. Also Scott Sauerbeck is just deadly against lefties

[ct2k]

Liriano would pitch for what? MAYBE an inning? AJ could have the chance of being a late inning defensive replacement and maybe go on to get a game winning hit. Might even make him MVP. Who knows.

Really doesn't matter anymore does it?

Maybe maybe maybe maybe maybe. Why's a maybe for AJ so different to a maybe for Liriano?

AJ could be a late inning defensive replacement sure, but then Liriano could come in with no outs, bases loaded and Albert Pujols at the plate, pitch a perfect inning with 3K's and then bring Ted Williams back from the dead, its all maybes at the end of the day

[The Miz]

Irrelevant

Liriano > Pierzynski, thats all that matters. The All-Star team is selected based on which players have had the strongest first-halves, not on who you think will have a bigger impact on the game

[ct2k]

That argument fell flat on Slugs the first time what makes you think it'll work a second time:p

To be fair the all star is always going to be a popularity contest, being able to vote up to 25 times doesn't help, i personally only vote once but i can imagine a lot of fanatical supporters do it all 25 times.

The only reason Liriano isn't there is because he's a Twin imo, not enough exposure, if he was on sunday night baseball every few weeks and people were seeing what he does for real, he'd be there, as it is AJ was on an historic world series winning team and plays in Southern California, nuf said

[The Miz]

Chicago isn't quite Southern California but yeah. Playing in SoCal would actually hurt him because according to ESPN no teams west of the Mississippi exist

[ct2k]

I was thinking about Vlad Guerrero at the same time for some reason and i managed to put AJ in an Angels uniform in my head :|

[BCWWF]

Chicago is the third biggest media market in the US though, so if they get some people behind AJ then he's got a good shot at getting in. What is kind of surprising though, it was obviously going to come down to a race between Liriano and AJ, but I swear nobody liked AJ outside of South Side Chicago and Minnesota. Obviously the people in Minnesota are voting for their current player rather than the former, so who else is voting for AJ?

[The Miz]

Casual fans, they don't know who Liriano is and they remember A.J. for the Josh Paul incident/Michael Barrett incident

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

MLB needs to make up its mind and admit that the All Star game doesn't matter. I think they overreacted when the game ended in a tie a few years ago. "This one counts!" Shut the fuck up, no it doesnt. You let fans vote for the starters, most fans are going to vote for their favorite players, not some player they've probably heard little about playing thousands miles away even if that player is better. I think the entire roster should be selected by allowing every major league player to vote, I feel that'd be pretty fair and I cannot see players voting for dudes from their own team since I doubt most players are really that "tight" anyways (due to the constant roster turnover) And even if guys where voting with a biased view, I think they'd be in the minority so the right guy would still make it the majority of the time.

Listening to nationl radio, and they where dogging on Manny Ramirez. Understandable from the stand point that he was the top vote getter and should play, seeing how they don't feel he is really injuried (Neither do I) but then they were stressing the point about how he needs to be there to help his team win because the "this game counts." If this game counts then why is Ivan Rodriquez the starting catcher for the American League? Why isn't Liriano on the pitching staff? MLB needs to drop this "This Game Counts!!!" bullshit and just let it be known to pitchers that just because you made the team doesn't automatically mean you'll get a chance to pitch, or maybe carry an extra pitcher or something to avoid what happened a few years ago. The "This game counts" thing isn't even a fix to the problem from before, they could still very easily run out of pitchers if the game is tied so it is completely useless.

[OssMan]

Chicago isn't quite Southern California but yeah. Playing in SoCal would actually hurt him because according to ESPN no teams west of the Mississippi existBarry Bonds

[The Miz]

I think the players voting would be better, but still not that great. I do think guys would vote for their teammates though, they don't exactly have the free time to look at stats that we do and they know their guys a lot better than the guys they play once every few weeks.

There isn't really a good way to pick the teams, unless they put The Miz in charge, then they'd be flawless

[The Miz]

Barry Bonds

Like I said, no teams west of the Mississippi. They care about Bonds, not the team he's on. What team is he on anyway?

[BCWWF]

There was something that I was reading at one point, don't know where, but it was talking about the results of the players vote. The example they showed was that in the AL third base category, Troy Glaus and Eric Chavez were voted top and A-Rod third. Not implying anything because I don't really know, but just an example if you want to make a case for players voting.

[ct2k]

I think the All Star is cool, but really the only sport where its garaunteed to produce fireworks is in the NBA...generally

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Like I said, no teams west of the Mississippi. They care about Bonds, not the team he's on. What team is he on anyway?
I dunno, I hear this a lot from people on who live on the West Coast but I hear a n awful lot about the Oakland A's and how they were projected to win 100 games this seasons.

[The Miz]

lol an awful lot. They were a trendy pick pre-season and Harold Reynolds picked Bobby Crosby for MVP, but that's it, and you know it. They're still the last team to get their games shown on SportsCenter regardless of how good or bad they're playing. Also, I'm sure you're aware that they're by far the most injured team in baseball. No? That's because ESPN never talks about them, the Rangers, the Dbacks, the Dodgers, or anyone else. They should the game highlight and thats it.

So far they have missed significant time from:

Huston Street
Justin Duchscherer
Rich Harden
Eric Chavez
Frank Thomas
Mark Ellis
Joe Kennedy
Milton Bradley
Esteban Loaiza
Jay Witasick

But I'm sure most teams in baseball would still be over .500 having played with less than 75% of their team the first half of the year

[BCWWF]

Well according to Michael Smith, the Yankees have been the most impressive team up to this point because of how they overcame the injury and Randy Johnson sucking problems. So there goes your argument The Miz.

[The Miz]

I don't believe it until I hear it from Skip Bayless

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I dunno, its not like the A's are all over ESPN but I don't think the bias is as bad as people make it out to be. I've heard plenty about the A's being injuried but I think I've actaully seen more about how their offense isn't where it should be yet they are still in first.

What I haven't heard about in relation to the A's tho is how Bradley is acting. Still a shithead or did he "turn it around?"

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

I dunno how the Yankees are the most impressive team because even with the injuries look at the top of the line up: Damon, Jeter, A-Rod and Giambi

[ct2k]

To be fair considering we've only had 2 consistent starters in Mussina and Wang, our bullpen has not been entirely solid (besides the obvious) and Sheff, Matsui and Cano are all injured...And A-Rod had that massive slump...I'd settle for 3 games back, especially considerin how good and well rounded a team Boston are:y:

[The Miz]

I dunno, its not like the A's are all over ESPN but I don't think the bias is as bad as people make it out to be. I've heard plenty about the A's being injuried but I think I've actaully seen more about how their offense isn't where it should be yet they are still in first.

What I haven't heard about in relation to the A's tho is how Bradley is acting. Still a shithead or did he "turn it around?"

But if it were an east coast team, the coverage would be immense. Remember when they won like 80% of their games for that 2 month stretch last year? Went from 15 below .500 to 15 above .500? Yeah it was a story, but it was still always behind "Fact or Fiction: Manny asking for a trade is just 'Manny being Manny'" and all that bullshit. Imagine if an east coast team did that. Their games would be the first highlight and would be followed by 10 minutes of analysis of every minute detail of the team. The fact is that with the exception of Barry Bonds, NO West Coast baseball story gets Yankees/Red Sox coverage, but if the stories happened on the east coast they would be huge.

For example:
Mauer leading the league in BA almost at .400 (2006)
Oakland going from 15 under to 15 over (2005)
Gagne's ridiculous saves record (2004)
Ichiro's hit record (2004)
Texas threatening all types of offensive team records (2005)
AL West coming down to the last series of the year betwween Oakland/LAAA (2004/2005)

Imagine if any of these things happened to Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Atlanta, Baltimore, etc. Yeah these things got coverage, but was never "the big story" even when it should've been because it took place out west.

[ct2k]

Is it all just a remnant from the fact that baseball was first popularised in and spread from the north-east primarily?

I dunno, i might be wrong on that but yknow. plus the north-east whilst having a huge population and a lot of teams is not exactly a vast geographical area, especially when you're comparing it to the 'West' or the West coast.

[The Miz]

What I haven't heard about in relation to the A's tho is how Bradley is acting. Still a shithead or did he "turn it around?"

lol Bradley never did anything. He is just a regular L.A. black kid but guys like that never play in MLB so the fans couldn't except him being himself. What did he do, throw some baseballs on the field and call Jeff Kent a racist? Wow what a shithead. The media wants him and every other player to play the Sammy Sosa "Baseball been very good to me" bullshit but Bradley KEEPS IT REAL. When keepin' it real goes wrong :(

Bradley is fine now because Oakland is probably the easiest place for a player to play, the media doesn't care about the team and the clubhouse has always been considered the most "laid-back" in baseball. A's have taken in several guys who were supposedly "team cancers" (Bradley, Jose Guillen) and there's never been any kind of problem.

Also Bradley won the award for most time and money donated to the community of any Dodger player in 2005, and has a program called "Bradley's Youth" where he meets kids before games. LA Times left out a few details

He's still more well-behaved than 80% of the NBA

[ct2k]

Haha, i just typed out a huge reply and hit that faggy little button on the mouse that goes back:rant:

But yeah, i was making a point about the NE and its teams in general being steeped in far more baseball history than the West. Plus bear in mind the Giants and Dodgers spending the first halves of their existence firmly planted in New York, the NY Jews probably still hold a grudge for them moving away all those years ago:p

[Joey Slugs]

I'll add to Miz's arguement of an east coast bias -

After Boston won the world series they seemed to have a game on ESPN atleast once a week. The White Sox have had 3 so far this year (including Opening Night when they were the only team playing).

You would think that no matter who the world champs are, they deserve a much bigger spotlight.

[ct2k]

Agreed, but the Red Sox are the Red Sox, the only team with (debateably) more general buzz around them are the Yankees, both are coincidently East Coast. Remember a few years back when it was nothing but St Louis? Every goddamnit week! Atlanta before that, they got loads of airtime! Neither are remotely east coast

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

For example:
Mauer leading the league in BA almost at .400 (2006)
Oakland going from 15 under to 15 over (2005)
Gagne's ridiculous saves record (2004)
Ichiro's hit record (2004)
Texas threatening all types of offensive team records (2005)
AL West coming down to the last series of the year betwween Oakland/LAAA (2004/2005)True, a lot of those probably would recieve a lot more coverage (some listed did receieve a lot tho, especially Ichiro's hit record) if those teams/players played on the East Coast but I think it also has something to do with the number of fans team have and shit like that as well. I haven't heard much about the Florida Marlins rookie pitcher Johnson or 2nd basemen Ugga and they are located on the east coast as well.

[The Miz]

They're nice rookies but aren't doing anything out of this world.

[BCWWF]

That's the same thing people said when I ranted about this a while back...but when you say "East Coast Bias" it generally refers to the New England/New York/Pennsylvania area in my opinion. Four of the top ten markets are in that area (New York, Boston, D.C., Philly).

I would say that Atlanta and Miami, the other major (technically) east coast teams are just as left out at the teams in Texas and the other secondary places. Basketball is kind of skewed because New York has an awful basketball team and nobody likes the Nets, but if the Heat didn't have Wade and Shaq and won the NBA title, you wouldn't hear about them either. But news about the Knicks is about 100 hours to 1 compared to news about the Atlanta Hawks, who are all but the same team.

[ct2k]

NE you have Boston, Yanks, Mets, O's, Phillies, Pirates and Nats all in a (relatively) small geographic location in the far NorthEast corner of the US, it just so happens that NY is the most culturally and financially important city in the world and its media is incredibly influential etc etc etc, there's loadsa factors, its not MLB dictating things. Out West you have the Pads, Dodgers, A's, Angels, Giants and Seattle all strewn our over a thousand odd miles of coastline, i guess there's just not the same concentration of people, teams etc there as there is in the NE.

[Joey Slugs]

...NY is the most culturally and financially important city in the world...

Most financially important city in the world? Hardly.

[ct2k]

Well...Yes it is quite frankly

[Joey Slugs]

Well...Yes it is quite frankly

Another East Coast bias. Chicago is a far more important financial center.

[ct2k]

Lol, you really do think the world orbits around Chi-town don't you?

The New York financial district and stock exchange is the busiest and most important in the Western economy and thus the world, END OF

Chicago is probably 3rd behind LA as far as the US goes and definitely not as important as Tokyo or London

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Can't really say I've ever heard that the East Coast biased has some effect on Chicago - like Chicago is located in Oregon or something. It is only one time zone away and I hear plenty about the Cubs. Probably because the Cubs where recently named the 4th most popular major league team. They talk about teams that casual fans enjoy hearing about, since the majority of fans aren't diehards.

I think its pretty funny how heavily the bias is talked about on here, its obviously there but you kind have to expect a little bit when ESPN is located in Connecticut/all the big markets in the Northeast/time differences. I really don't think it is as bad as people make it out to be tho, then when you point out a situation where the bias has no effect that, for some reason doesn't count. Like Barry Bonds, the LA Lakers, the NFL constantly trying to get another team in LA even though 2 teams already failed there, College football (Uproar over Utah, USC football, Texas - I am sure the excuse for that is because college football isn't big in the Northeast, BC has only won their last 5 bowl games and finished in the top 25 the last few seasons)

I guess you guys don't remember the 49ers vs the Cowboys rivilary either, but that probably doesn't count either because the Cowboys are Americans team or something.

[Joey Slugs]

Lol, you really do think the world orbits around Chi-town don't you?

The New York financial district and stock exchange is the busiest and most important in the Western economy and thus the world, END OF

Chicago is probably 3rd behind LA as far as the US goes and definitely not as important as Tokyo or London

I do not think the world orbits around Chicago, but I do want people to get there facts straight.

The NYSE might be the "most known" exchange but it is not the end-all-be-all.

Chicago hosts the world's largest and busiest trading floor, the biggest NASDAQ pit, the world's only currency exchange, the world's largest and busiest options exchange, and host to the headquarters of 8 of the top 10 biggest trading firms in the world.

Yes... there is even an East Coast bias in the financial world.

[Joey Slugs]

Can't really say I've ever heard that the East Coast biased has some effect on Chicago - like Chicago is located in Oregon or something. It is only one time zone away and I hear plenty about the Cubs. Probably because the Cubs where recently named the 4th most popular major league team. They talk about teams that casual fans enjoy hearing about, since the majority of fans aren't diehards.

I think its pretty funny how heavily the bias is talked about on here, its obviously there but you kind have to expect a little bit when ESPN is located in Connecticut/all the big markets in the Northeast/time differences. I really don't think it is as bad as people make it out to be tho, then when you point out a situation where the bias has no effect that, for some reason doesn't count. Like Barry Bonds, the LA Lakers, the NFL constantly trying to get another team in LA even though 2 teams already failed there, College football (Uproar over Utah, USC football, Texas - I am sure the excuse for that is because college football isn't big in the Northeast, BC has only won their last 5 bowl games and finished in the top 25 the last few seasons)

I guess you guys don't remember the 49ers vs the Cowboys rivilary either, but that probably doesn't count either because the Cowboys are Americans team or something.

The reason you hear alot about the Cubs (or why the Cubs are so popular) is because their games are shown on a national network.

The only team in sports that can claim that.

[The Miz]

TBS?

[Joey Slugs]

TBS?

No, the Cubs are on WGN. The Braves have somewhat of the same deal but they are on cable.

[The Miz]

I get TBS but not WGN

[Joey Slugs]

I get TBS but not WGN

I'm sure you get WGN (might not be called that)... it's a network "superstation".

[BCWWF]

OMG how pissed was I on opening day of 2005 when the Cubs game was broadcasted live on both ESPN and WGN and the Twins/Mariners, which was on in most of the nation, was not shown :rant:

But yeah, Chicago and Atlanta have that aspect to them, but I don't think that really affects their coverage on ESPN.

One thing that you have to look at is the people that ESPN uses. Pardon the Interuption is two columnists from the Washington Post. Around the Horn is better, but Boston is always represented (which they should be) through Michael Smith, Bob Ryan or that lady (who is pretty good IMO) and now Woody Paige is located in New York, making two of the four columnists from the said region. In terms of the sports world, having New York, Boston, Texas, Chicago and Los Angeles, sometimes Denver covered it pretty good, but it wouldn't hurt to get more people.

Also, I don't think anybody made any reference to it being a MLB conspiracy. It's mainly due to the fact that there are a lot of teams in a small area and that ESPN headquarters is an hour away from New York, ESPN magazine is in New York as is Sports Illustrated. What is weird is that a lot of shit is based out of Atlanta too.

I've always wondered why somebody can't come out and try to rival ESPN. I mean look at the options. Midwest Sports Channel: Chicago, Milwaukee, Twin Cities, St. Louis, Indianapolis, Detroit, Ohio, Tennessee, Kansas City. Pick up the NHL rights to start and go from there.

Texas seems like the most underrepresented sports area in the nation if you ask me. They have so many major league and major college teams that are basically taken forgranted. Some of the best fans in the nation are from the south, it seems like a network could take advantage of that. And then the West Coast. This is where a primary network would benefit the most because of the time zones. Think about it: San Diego, Los Angeles, San Francisco, Sacramento, Portland, San Jose, Seattle and Phoenix all have major league teams. So many big colleges in there too, and the Denver and Utah markets aren't too far away.


Dunno.

[BCWWF]

WGN is basically really, annoyingly biased White Sox and Cubs games, reruns of Family Matters and a horrible newscast. Not a bad channel though, especially if you're a Cubs fan.

[The Miz]

I'm sure you get WGN (might not be called that)... it's a network "superstation".

Nope

[The Miz]

One thing that you have to look at is the people that ESPN uses. Pardon the Interuption is two columnists from the Washington Post. Around the Horn is better, but Boston is always represented (which they should be) through Michael Smith, Bob Ryan or that lady (who is pretty good IMO) and now Woody Paige is located in New York, making two of the four columnists from the said region. In terms of the sports world, having New York, Boston, Texas, Chicago and Los Angeles, sometimes Denver covered it pretty good, but it wouldn't hurt to get more people.

lol I HATE Jackie MacMullen

[Joey Slugs]

WGN is basically really, annoyingly biased White Sox and Cubs games, reruns of Family Matters and a horrible newscast. Not a bad channel though, especially if you're a Cubs fan.

I wouldn't say that WGN is biased towards Sox games. Our "home" channel is Comcast Sports Chicago.

WGN is definitely a Cubs station. Tribune Co. owns the Cubs, Chicago Tribune Newspaper, WGN, and Wrigley Field. Meaning that the Cubs have Yankee and Red Sox money but spend like the Royals.

[The Miz]

Are you saying Harrelson and Johnson aren't cheerleaders?

[Joey Slugs]

I wouldn't really say that Chicago is fairly represented in ATH.

Mariotti is a fag.

:lol:

[Joey Slugs]

Are you saying Harrelson and Jackson aren't cheerleaders?
fixed.

They are, but what announce team isn't? Plus - they aren't just the WGN team for the Sox... they are the announce team no matter what station their on.

[The Miz]

Listen to Vin Scully sometime. There's a reason he's been the best for 50 years: he's not a Dodger homer.

Hawk and DJ are the worst, period. Nobody openly cheerleads like those 2

[Joey Slugs]

Listen to Vin Scully sometime. There's a reason he's been the best for 50 years: he's not a Dodger homer.

Hawk and DJ are the worst, period. Nobody openly cheerleads like those 2

oh come on. you are trying to tell me that not one other team in baseabll has a radio or tv team that "cheerleads"?

impossible.

plus, there is nothing wrong with them rooting for the team... i wouldn't want to listen to an announce team that really didnt care about the club that they worked for... no matter how good they were.

[The Miz]

I said none "like them", meaning, not nearly as bad. No other announce team calls the opposing team "the bad guys". No other announce team fails to compliment any opposing player on anything no matter how god he or or how good a play he just made. No other announce team goes completely silent when their team starts losing.

Not only are they homers, they're just morons.

[Joey Slugs]

I said none "like them", meaning, not nearly as bad. No other announce team calls the opposing team "the bad guys". No other announce team fails to compliment any opposing player on anything no matter how god he or or how good a play he just made. No other announce team goes completely silent when their team starts losing.

Not only are they homers, they're just morons.
Never have anything good to say about opposing teams?
Wrong. They do praise a great catch or a top player.

Something wrong with them calling the opposing team the "bad guys"?
Last time I checked... good guys always tried to beat the bad guys.

Fall silent when the Sox start to lose?
How many Sox games do you watch a year? Since I haven't heard that yet... in about 16 years (since Harrelson started in the booth).

Eh. My favorite annoucner is Bob Uecker.

[The Miz]

It's even mentioned on his wiki page (which I didn't edit)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ken_Harrelson

Harrelson's distinctive announcing style is a subject of much contention amongst Chicago sports fans. Most have criticized him for the monotony of his voice, his repetitive and predictable and over the top calls, and his frequent long stretches of silence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dead_air) while calling a game, especially if the White Sox play on the field is subpar.

[The Miz]

I like how you bolded your answers though, in case I couldnt find them

[The Miz]

Just did a quick google search and the first page alone had sites talking about Hawk's silence when the Sox start to suck including deadspin, baseballthinkfactory, and a Braves blog. But yeah I probably just made it up and am the only one who thinks it

[The Miz]

http://letsgosox.blogspot.com/

He's annoying enough as it is, but to complain about the umpires calls, claiming that there are two different strike zones, one small one for the White Sox pitchers, and one bigger one for the Red Sox, and then to just say nothing when an obvious bad call goes Chicago's way makes him sound like an ass. At one point, as we saw a replay of what looked to me like a perfect pitch, he said, "Schilling was given that pitch." And it's not like he was merely pointing it out, he was groaning about it. Literally. Saying things like "oh, come on." Speaking of saying nothing, that's one of his favorite calls. Play happens, he stays quiet. It's refreshing when announcers shut the hell up for a second, but when something's going on, feel free to chime in!

http://www.athleticsnation.com/user/RudiFan

The best time to catch his act is when the White Sox are getting their butts whipped. He is as quiet as a church mouse. Otherwise his constant homer chirping is extremely annoying.

http://www.netshrine.com/vbulletin2/showthread.php?t=5859

Harrelson is definitely the star of the Hawk and DJ show - his rampant homerism drives most out of towners crazy and nearly led to fist fights with Phil Garner and Kent Hrbek. No doubt the duo is kept on a short leash by the owner. Team criticism is strictly verboten, but if you listen carefully you can tell when Hawk is disgusted by the current bunch of losers. Often he'll just remain silent after a boneheaded play. The increasingly incompetent Sox have sucked the life out of Harrelson recently - even his trademark "You can put it on the board!" has become a halfhearted ritual at times.

http://www.bravesbeat.com/bravesjournal/bristol/archives/2005/09/hawk_harrelson.html

If the Sox are losing late in the game, Hawk will go minutes without saying anything, just pouting. Someone gets a hit: Hawk spits out a terse "There's a basehit into left." Then back to more pouting silence. Phenomenal broadcasting. I vote for Hawk.

http://www.deadspin.com/sports/baseball/some-broadcasters-are-wound-more-tightly-than-others-167619.php

Hawk says some, ahem, intereting things from time to time. He has been known to say "Jose Valentin is the best baserunner I have ever seen" or "Paul Konerko turns a 3-6-3 better than anyone I've ever seen", but these things obscure how critical Hawk actually is. His complete silence for minutes at a time after a White Sox blunder sometimes says more than beating Jerry Manuel to death with a wrench. I guess you have to spend 400+ hours listening to him per year to understand the Hawk.

[The Miz]

I changed the topic title to correctly match the direction of this thread. What haven't we talked about in here?

[DaveWadding]

I'm sure you get WGN (might not be called that)... it's a network "superstation".

So is TBS, and they are both cable stations (Here they are, at least).

[DaveWadding]

OMG how pissed was I on opening day of 2005 when the Cubs game was broadcasted live on both ESPN and WGN and the Twins/Mariners, which was on in most of the nation, was not shown :rant:



BTW, the reason for that is that traditionally, the Reds games are the first games to start on Opening Day (Supreme could prolly it explain it better than I could though...)

[DaveWadding]

and just to keep on going: Both Hawk and DJ and the Braves announce team is terrible, so is Len Kaspar.

[BCWWF]

I wouldn't say that WGN is biased towards Sox games. Our "home" channel is Comcast Sports Chicago.

WGN is definitely a Cubs station. Tribune Co. owns the Cubs, Chicago Tribune Newspaper, WGN, and Wrigley Field. Meaning that the Cubs have Yankee and Red Sox money but spend like the Royals.

OH MY GOD! I never really noticed it until I watched a White Sox game against the Twins on WGN. The announcers whine about everything. Without a doubt the most bias and annoying announcers I've ever heard.

[BCWWF]

BTW, the reason for that is that traditionally, the Reds games are the first games to start on Opening Day (Supreme could prolly it explain it better than I could though...)

No, I don't think that's it. I don't know if it was the opening day of baseball or not, but just about every team was having their opening day. ESPN had the Twins and Mariners game on in most of the nation, but in the region I was in they played the Cubs game because it is a closer market. The reason it really pissed me off is because the Cubs were on WGN too! Fuck you Miz and everybody else who doesn't get WGN.

[BCWWF]

Post 3: I kind of like Jackie McMullen (or whatever). Most of the time when you hear a woman trying to break down sports it is just awful (see Julie Foudy). But this chick can hold her own against the idiots on that show.

[MVP]

I have cable, but do not get WGN. I've watched it on my friend's DISH network and it's pretty biased toward the Cubs.

BTW I can't believe anybody hasn't mentioned Joe Buck yet.

[OssMan]

wow Vin Scully is still doing play by play? I got the Mets 1986 world series DVD and he is the play by play guy on there

White Sox announcers though, I think I saw one game where they were having a conversation about something and then a guy on the other team hit a homerun and they continued to have their conversation as the ball flew through the air. They didn't even acknowledge it

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Yeah I don't have WGN but I have TBS (aka Superstation) and they show Braves games.

Having every game played nationally doesn't really make you that much more money I don't think. Since you are showing games in another teams territory, you must pay a % to the MLB which goes out equally to all 32 major league teams.

I think the Red Sox have pretty decent announcers, they are a bit more for the Red Sox obviously but I don't think they are ridiculously biased or anything. The post game show is really good though, espcially if Dennis Eckersley is co hosting it.

I fucking hate Joe Buck though, so anti-Red Sox when he is announcing. Last Saturday the Red Sox where on FOX and there was a pop up between SS/LF area and when Gonzo backtracked to run out and get the easy fill ball Joe Buck was like "I bet there is nobody more happy than Ramirez to see Gonzo making that catch" then he said the worst part about Manny's injury is remember which leg to limp with. (I just heard reports that Manny's knee is actually bothering him too, they are thinking of DHing him and having Youk play LF and have Ortiz play 1B if anyone outside of Bud Selig actually cares)

http://images2.sportsline.com/u/photos/baseball/mlb/img9550373.jpg
WHA?

[The Miz]

Yeah I stopped watching FOX like 3 years ago because I couldn't take it anymore so I forgot about those guys. McCarver and Buck are 2nd behind Harrelson/Jackson. The worst part is the constant Derek Jeter dicksucking, even when the Yankees aren't playing. Any time a guy makes a smart baserunning play McCarver will say "That's a play out of the Jeter playbook"

[The Miz]

Speaking of shit announcers, during the home run derby David Ortiz told the BBTN guys that it was his son's birthday and Harold Reynolds responded with "Feliz Navidad" LOL

[Skippord]

Ozzie called all his gay friends that he met at Madonna concerts and told them to stuff the ballot box for AJ :(
:rofl:

[Jesus Shuttlesworth]

Speaking of shit announcers, during the home run derby David Ortiz told the BBTN guys that it was his son's birthday and Harold Reynolds responded with "Feliz Navidad" LOL
ROFL I missed that

[Ruby]

When Milton Bradley was having his meltdown in LA, Vin Scully was carrying on with his same monotone voice as he described Bradley's tirade. It made the whole thing so much funnier to watch.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

BTW, the reason for that is that traditionally, the Reds games are the first games to start on Opening Day (Supreme could prolly it explain it better than I could though...)
Actually they stopped making that a tradition a few years ago but I can't remember why. Still though I'd imagine ESPN has a few more reasons to cater to Chicago rather than Minneapolis.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

Joe Nuxhall is back calling Reds games this week and it was nice to hear his voice last night but he was not even close on some of his calls. I don't think he ever once called Clint Barmes by his name. He was just "the Rockies' shortstop" the whole night when Joe was talking. Plus he had a field day trying to pronounce Yorvit Torrealba.

[The Miz]

Supreme, what do you think of the López/Kearns trade?

In Seattle we always called Yorvit "JoeJessica" (Torre-Alba). Some guys from http://www.ussmariner.com/ started it and they eventually started calling him that in the papers

[Supreme Olajuwon]

I'm actually a pretty big fan of it. This was the highest that Kearns' trade value was ever going to get and I think Majewski is a solid addition. They definately need Majewski more than they need Kearns and Lopez.

[BCWWF]

Back to the random thing about opening day a few years ago...I think ESPN was doing one of the things where they have a couple games but they are regional. In the area that I was in, there are a lot of Cubs fans, and that is why it happened.