*SPOILERS* Raw 12/02/07 Play-By-Play

[NeanderCarl]

Hey, peeps.

I'm gonna be adventurous and stay up until 6am watching tonight's edition of Raw, two hours later than usual but I suppose I can't complain compared to the deal you Yanks are getting. :p

I shall add my play-by-play commentary as we go along for anybody who wishes to have Thursday's show spoiled for them (or for those not planning on watching) in NeanderCarl's inimitable, opinionated style!

There you go, that means you can ask me any questions as we go along, rather than reading some bland spoilers on some newsboard.

Do us a favour, though. Don't post the spoilers in here when they end up online until the show has finished on my end!

Great stuff. Only 45mins to go. Wonder if I'll make it...

[Blitz]

Trumps wrestler vs McMahon's wrestler at Mania, with the loser (Trump or McMahon) getting their heads shaved.

Crowd did not dig it that much.

[NeanderCarl]

Do us a favour, though. Don't post the spoilers in here when they end up online until the show has finished on my end!

Trumps wrestler vs McMahon's wrestler at Mania, with the loser (Trump or McMahon) getting their heads shaved.

Crowd did not dig it that much.

:(

[NeanderCarl]

Actually, I already read that, but :(

[Blitz]

I'm watching it now. I thought you were too?

[Blitz]

Mickie James looks eminently fuckable tonight. Is that a spoiler?

[The Genius]

thank you carl, i always appreciated your live play by play coverage of WWE ppvs including your commentary.

[SammyG]

She always does.

[NeanderCarl]

Nah, it's not on until 4am in the UK (starts in half an hour).

[Blitz]

So...should I do play by play now or what.

[NeanderCarl]

thank you carl, i always appreciated your live play by play coverage of WWE ppvs including your commentary.

:D There's never a lot of point doing them for Raw usually, as everybody watches it, but I thought I'd do it this week as it's not on until Thursday for the majority of posters.

Same with the Big Four PPVs, but I shall be do a PBP for No Way Out this Sunday.

[NeanderCarl]

So...should I do play by play now or what.

It must be nearly finished on your end, surely?

You can't do that because then I won't be able to post in my own thread for fear of being *SPOILED!* ;)

[Blitz]

Nah, I'm only a half hour in. Raw doesn't start in Canada until 10PM.

[lort]

I may stay up and watch RAW. Not got anything to do tomorrow.

Carl, is No Way Out free in the UK this Sunday?

[Blitz]

There is a very shitty match going on right now.

In today's WWE, I don't think that qualifies as a spoiler.

[Blitz]

Special appearance tonight by (spoiler) Roddy Piper

Main event tonight: Undertaker, John Cena, Batista, Shawn Michaels vs Randy Orton, Edge, MVP, Mr. Kennedy

[SammyG]

OMG BRET HART

[Blitz]

Spoiler Flair cuts another promo on Carlito. Carlito challenges flair to a match, Flair accepts. end spoiler

[NeanderCarl]

Starting in a minute. Hope this is actually worth staying up all night for. I have to go to uni tomorrow with no sleep.

[NeanderCarl]

Okay, the audio is way out of synch...

[NeanderCarl]

Anyone else think Mickie James is nice to look at for five minutes a week, but she'd really fucking annoy you if you had to spend every day around her? She's FHAFH material.

[Blitz]

First person announced for this year's hall of fame: Dusty Rhodes

[NeanderCarl]

The brand extention doesn't matter one bit any more to WWE, does it?

Piper appearance tonight, good stuff.

[NeanderCarl]

McMahon and Trump to kick things off.

[NeanderCarl]

Trump has aged a lot in the last few years, hasn't he?

I watched WrestleMania IV a few weeks back, and he looked almost like a totally different person.

[NeanderCarl]

Vince seems to having trouble pronouncing "WWE" tonight. Keeps saying "WW...a".

[NeanderCarl]

The brand extention doesn't matter one bit any more to WWE, does it?

Just to prove it, as well as the main event, Ashley just escorted Trump to the ring.

[NeanderCarl]

Crowd hasn't turned on this segment yet, anyway.

[NeanderCarl]

:lol: @ Vince's claim that he will never wrestle again. Reckon they did that to protect Trump, make him look like a tough guy who was actually prepared to fac Vince?

[NeanderCarl]

Hmmm... I forgot I was supposed to be doing play by play.

Basically, Trump came out and said he was going to repeat the money drop from a few weeks back. Vince said that he was wise to the plan and stopped the stage hands. Trump challenged Vince to a match at WrestleMania. Vince refused on the grounds that his doctor told him he will never wrestle again following the Hell In A Cell match.

Vince's counter-offer is a match where Vince and Trump choose a wrestler each to second at Mania. Trump proclaims that he agrees on "Hair vs Hair" terms, just to prove that Trump doesn't wear a hairpiece. Vince refuses on the account that Trump probably has something up his sleeve.

Trump calls Vince gutless and that is enough to make Vince phlegm that the match is on.

[NeanderCarl]

Trump really has no business getting involved in WWE, but he is a mainstream name and a pretty good television performer, in that he can carry a segment well, as he just proved. It's a good rub for WWE and adds a bit of unusual interest to a match at Mania, plus the "Hair vs Hair" gimmick is one of the few gimmicks left that is not overexposed on TV.

It's not going to "save the wrestling business" but it does add to the WrestleMania MEGA hype machine. I give it a :y:

[NeanderCarl]

I just hope they choose the right guy to align with Trump. Some faces won't be hurt by being seconded by Trump, but some of their guys stand to lose a lot of cool points having Trump in their corner.

[NeanderCarl]

Despite what Hulk "The Truth" Hogan says, I reckon the Vince/Trump feud will culminate in a Shane McMahon vs Hogan match at Mania. It makes storyline sense, as why wouldn't Vince pick "my son Shane" as his representative, while Hogan had a storyline alliance with Trump (if only in Hogan's interviews) back in the WrestleMania at Trump Plaza days.

Johnny "Don't Call Me Over" Nitro vs Super "Stop Forcing This Catchphrase On Us, It Ain't Sticking" Crazy now.

[NeanderCarl]

My bad, it's actually a mixed tag. Nitro and Melina vs Crazy and Mickie James.

[NeanderCarl]

I think Crazy would make a good, Hennig/Rude-style heel.

[NeanderCarl]

If he changed his ring gear, that is.

[NeanderCarl]

Melina pinned Mickie out of nowhere, with no momentum whatsoever, with a tight-grab but this was a decent little match. Nitro and Melina take the win.

[NeanderCarl]

Eugene dicking about in the ring, and he is taking on The Great Khali. Eugene has a Ric Flair doll, and has grown quite the long goatee now.

I thought Eugene was meant to be a heel?

[NeanderCarl]

Is Khali better or worse than Giant Gonzalez? On a relative scale of how the athleticism in wrestling has increased since 1993, I'd say they are equally bad.

Jim Ross says that Khali is from the jungles of India. Does India even have any jungles.

Total squash, as Khali shoves Eugene to the floor in what Jim Ross described as a "chokeslam" and gets the duke.

Worthless but mercifully short.

[NeanderCarl]

Shawn Michaels interview next, and Michaels really needs to stop wearing the DX gear, especially if he is going to main event WrestleMania. It makes him look and seem like one half of a tag team.

When one half of a tag team goes solo, without making any changes, they tend to look weak and not get over. Michaels of all people should know that. Of course, Michaels has the bonus of having been a bonafide main eventer before the DX reunion. But with the DX music/T-shirts/etc I just get the impression that:

i) I am watching "Shawn Michaels, one half of DX"
ii) he is just doing it so Triple H can continue to get a merchandise payday during his layoff.

Would you back Jerry Saggs going into a singles title match? Or Phineas Godwinn? I know Michaels is a much bigger star, but still....


We get a replay of Flair's a-bit-too-close-to-the-bone promo against Carlito last week. Flair about to speak, but Carlito arrives looking for an apology. Flair tells Carlito he says no guts and no heart. Carlito is tamping! He challenges Flair to a match and promises to show him passion. Nice mental picture.

Flair agrees. Woooo.

Flair is a major hypocrite. A guy with "guts and passion" wouldn't have wrestled the same match blueprint for 30 years. Okay, it was a GOOD blueprint back in the day, but please! If he'd had the guts or passion to try mixing things up a bit, rather than getting wasted in a different bar each night, maybe then he'd be able to lecture guys like Carlito. I know, I know... he's a legend and he's had a lot of classic matches, and that much is true. But his reputation was always a bit of a sham and he has exposed that much many times in the last few years.

Jim Ross is having an aneurysm over the Skittles advert again.

We have Jeff Hardy vs Chris Masters non-title match, now. For the second week in a row, Hardy's opponent gets a future title match if they win. Isn't that wrestling law ANYWAY?

[NeanderCarl]

I wonder if anyone is actually reading/going to read this, or am I just really wasting my time?

[NeanderCarl]

Jeff Hardy gets the roll-up and the win, making the whole "future title shot" stip obsolete for the second week in a row. I suppose it adds a little to the match, and makes it unpredictable when Hardy goes on to win, as long as it doesn't happen TOO often.

Jim Ross calls the main event of Cena/Undertaker/Batista/HBK vs Edge/Orton/MVP/Kennedy an "acclaimed main event" before it has even happened. How is that possible? Also, is MVP really in the "elite", as JR claims?

[NeanderCarl]

Jerry Lawler brings out 'Rowdy' Roddy Piper, and claims he has "kicked cancer's ass".

Piper comes out in a black kilt. I think Piper is fantastic, but is he the first guy ever to GAIN weight during cancer treatment??

[Caged Heat18]

I wonder if anyone is actually reading/going to read this, or am I just really wasting my time?

I'm reading it. Thanks for doing it. :y:

[Tombstone275]

Im reading.... thanks

[NeanderCarl]

Piper announces fat wigger Dusty Rhodes as the first entry into the Hall Of Fame 2007.

[NeanderCarl]

A lot of great shots of Dusty in the classic polka dots gimmick from the old WWF 1989-1990.

Piper introduces Rhodes who comes out to a, shall we say, polite ovation.

[NeanderCarl]

You know, I think Rhodes has dropped a bit of weight since he was last seen on TV around Cyber Sunday.

The crowd have warmed to him now, they're chanting "Dusty".

[NeanderCarl]

Looks like Dusty is about to give his induction speech in the middle of the ring. Be patient, Dream.

Umaga comes out and interrupts, along with Armando "Don't Call Me Alejandro" Estrada. Umaga is staring down Piper but Rhodes gets funky like a monkey with some of his trademark punches, but Umaga fires back and nails Dusty with his ass-to-the-face turnbuckle charge. Piper nails Umaga with a chair, but Umaga isn't fazed.

Umaga nails Piper with the Samoan Spike, then Rhodes gets the Spike too and all these Portland fans who were hoping for a feelgood moment with Piper's big return in his hometown are left disappointed.

Hope this doesn't lead to Umaga vs Rhodes at WrestleMania.

[NeanderCarl]

:lol: Jim Ross is "disgusted" by Umaga's actions, and sounds it too!

I actually think this was a pointless angle that simply ruined the big moment for Piper and just exploited his illness by pushing Umaga as a bastard for hurting a cancer victim.

Carlito vs Flair is next.

[NeanderCarl]

Ric Flair comes out, with an on-screen graphic that reads "Ric Flair", with the name "Ric Flair" plastered all over the TitanTron, and Lilian Garcia announces him as "Ric Flair".

Jim Ross' response?? "You are looking at Ric Flair".

Thanks for clarifying that, JR.

[NeanderCarl]

Carlito isn't wrestling any differently than usual, considering that the whole point of this angle is to "light a fire under him". The commentators keep talking about how much intensity Carlito is showing. Their definition of intensity is going for constant pinfalls after Flair has already kicked out. That's not "intensity", that's stupidity.

Flair pins Carlito with a roll-up.

[NeanderCarl]

Carlito is pissed off, but offers Flair a handshake.

I sense a Carlito heel turn. It can't come soon enough. His smart ass character has been destroyed since he became a lapdog, first for Trish Stratus, then Torrie Wilson.

[NeanderCarl]

Back to Rhodes, I'm thinking he must be the "centrepiece" star of this years Hall Of Fame, unless by some miracle Randy Savage is inducted. There really are no big stars left who are i) inactive ii) on good terms with WWE.

I suppose Steve Austin is a possibility, as is Steamboat.

[NeanderCarl]

Nitro and Melina are furious backstage in the interview area, because Grisham is nowhere to be found.

He is with Ashley instead, talking about her Playboy cover. Ron Simmons shows up, looks Ashley up and down, and gives her an approving "Damn!". Is there such a thing as an "approving Damn!"? There is now.

MVP, Kennedy, Orton and Edge are formulating a gameplan in the locker room.

[NeanderCarl]

Apparently the main event is next. There's at least 40 minutes to go. I'm not in the mood for a long, drawn out match, so I hope we get some other stuff. Most likely scenario, though, is a big brawl between the members of the same teams. MVP vs Kennedy at WrestleMania?

[NeanderCarl]

I was actually thinking last week while I was watching Raw that, barring the Survivor Series, it has been a while since we have seen a traditional one-fall 8-Man Tag Team match. Well, one week later I get my "wish".

DX has a slightly modified TitanTron video. They should be dropping it altogether, not making new ones.

[NeanderCarl]

Words can't describe how much better Raw has been for not having a 15 minute John Cena wankfest interview.

[NeanderCarl]

I'm in a dilemma. I don't want The Undertaker to win the World championship, but I also don't want Batista to end the streak. And I don't want a cheap finish like a DQ either.

There's money to be made from an Undertaker vs Edge "Streak vs Streak" match at a future WrestleMania, in which Taker should pass the "unbeaten at Mania" torch to Edge.

The more I see of Kennedy the more I think he is better suited to his heel role. I did at one time think he was a future top babyface, but he plays the asshole character so well, he really does comes across as a dick. That level of believability is hard to come by these days.

[NeanderCarl]

You know it's been around 20 minutes since I mentioned that the main event was due to fill 40 minutes. In that time, they have shown the entrances and two commercial breaks. Crafty, WWE!

I wonder if you removed the entrances, replays, adverts, old material like SmackDown catch-ups and This Week In History, and shots of the commentators giving links how long Raw would actually last?

[NeanderCarl]

Satellite signal is starting to fuck up, I may not be able to see this one through.

No, I think it's back...

[NeanderCarl]

JR: Michaels and The Undertaker will probably never have Christmas dinner together.

Umm... a bit random, but I get your point.

[NeanderCarl]

What's is the deal with MVP, anyway? What's with the ridiculous gear, and why is he being pushed so hard when he is so mediocre? He's not a bad on-camera performer, he plays the MVP gimmick well, but he doesn't wrestle like a main eventer. Is he REALLY SmackDown's Number Two Heel?

[NeanderCarl]

:lol: the third commercial break since we were told the match was next. There are more commercial breaks in a two-hour edition of Raw than in five hours of terrestrial commercial television here in the UK. Is it an American thing, a cable thing, or a WWE thing?

[NeanderCarl]

I'm already assuming that Taker/Batista and HBK/Cena are going to get into it, as they need to hype No Way Out on Sunday (which is one of the more appealing B-show PPV main events in a while).

I suppose the Orton/Edge blow-up may happen here too, as an Orton vs Edge match at Mania is nearly a given.

I wonder if MVP/Kennedy will get into it too, just to add to it all.

HBK misses a Sweet Chin Music on MVP and nearly nails Taker instead. Taker goes to chokeslam Michaels but is interrupted and chokeslams MVP. Michaels with the superkick on Orton instead and pins him.

[NeanderCarl]

Now the faces are all in-fighting.

Taker chokeslams Michaels. Batista Bomb on Cena. I thought Cena and Batista were supposed to be best buddies? HBK and Cena left laying as Taker and Batista stand tall as the show goes off the air about 10 minutes earlier than usual. Maybe they cut it short so they can add an extra ad break on Thursday, because Lord knows there wasn't enough of them tonight. :roll:

[St. Jimmy]

No one watches Smackdown, obviously. Sounds like a pretty "MEH" Raw, and since it's competing with Grey's Anatomy and ER it's gonna get dominated and I'll give fuck all.

[NeanderCarl]

Well, there you have it, folks. NeanderCarl's play-by-play of the night Raw went to the dogs, but the show was pretty entertaining. WWE usually tries a lot harder in the run-up to WrestleMania, I don't know why they don't put as much effort in all-year round... probably because we'd still all find something to moan about.

Barring the unpleasant Umaga angle, this show was pretty solid, well above average. The main event scene is looking good for the first time in I don't know how long (seriously, barring Edge's early "Rated R Superstar" days with the WWE title, I often skipped the main event or paid little attention to it.)

If you're wondering whether to watch on Thursday or not, I'd say give it a look. And give the Trump angle a chance too, I think it may pay off.

[NeanderCarl]

No one watches Smackdown, obviously. Sounds like a pretty "MEH" Raw, and since it's competing with Grey's Anatomy and ER it's gonna get dominated and I'll give fuck all.

It wasn't a "knock the ball out of the park" Raw, but it was a good watch, and the main event was something a bit different if nothing else.

[NeanderCarl]

No sign of Kenny Dykstra, Vladimir Koslov, Cryme Tyme, WGTT, Viscera, Val Venis or the ECW crew tonight. Had to make room for the Trump/Vince and Umaga/Rhodes angles, I guess.

[NeanderCarl]

No Coach or Maria either.

[The Genius]

thanks again carl. i will probably watch thursday night anyways.

[ddpBANG]

No sign of Kenny Dykstra, Vladimir Koslov, Cryme Tyme, WGTT, Viscera, Val Venis or the ECW crew tonight. Had to make room for the Trump/Vince and Umaga/Rhodes angles, I guess.

Kenny Dykstra - Heat - vs. Val
Vladimir Koslov - No clue
Cryme Tyme - Heat - vs. Cade/Murdoch
WGTT - Heat - Shelton vs. Scotty 2 Hotty
Viscera - No clue
Val Venis - Heat - vs. Dykstra
ECW crew - It's ECW