Ultimo Dragon

[Mr. Nerfect]

I've seen so little of this guy's actual work, but I'm a huge mark for him. Is that insane? I'm checking out some of his shit now.

Ultimo Dragon is fucking awesome. No evidence needed. :y:

[FourFifty]

Are we talking about the same Ultmio Dragon who tripped on his cape twice on his way to the ring for wrestlemania?

[Blitz]

FourFifty is right, 2 minor slips definitely negates 20 years of fantastic matches.

[FourFifty]

People tend to recall the "aw shits" more than the "good moves".

Ultimo Dragon is a great wrestler who came back from a horrible arm injury (Thank you WCW dipshits) who could go toe to toe with ANY luchador and much like Chris Benoit this guy could make a bowl of pudding look good in the ring.

But when anyone mentions him I don't think of him with 525,600 titles on him, seeing that sick DDT he did, or the great matches he had in WCW. I think of him tripping on his way to the ring, twice, on the biggest show of the year.

[Mr. Nerfect]

People tend to recall the "aw shits" more than the "good moves".

Ultimo Dragon is a great wrestler who came back from a horrible arm injury (Thank you WCW dipshits) who could go toe to toe with ANY luchador and much like Chris Benoit this guy could make a bowl of pudding look good in the ring.

But when anyone mentions him I don't think of him with 525,600 titles on him, seeing that sick DDT he did, or the great matches he had in WCW. I think of him tripping on his way to the ring, twice, on the biggest show of the year.

You bring up a fair point, but does anyone else remember the cruiserweights at WrestleMania?

[FourFifty]

I'm going to assume Rey Mysterio doesn't count?

[Mr. Nerfect]

I'm going to assume Rey Mysterio doesn't count?

Ah, touche.

Haha, let's not count Rey, Chavo or Eddie. :p

[FourFifty]

Or Chris Jericho......

[SammyG]

Are we talking about the same Ultmio Dragon who tripped on his cape twice on his way to the ring for wrestlemania?
Uh oh. Beware of Funky.

[FourFifty]

Oh, so my mod trashing a few days ago is no big deal, but I mention a fact and now The Fly is going to go after me?
I have two words for ya!
You're welcome.

[Nowhere Man]

Found a bunch of his old matches from Japan, and naturally they rock. Sasuke, Lyger, etc. all great stuff. But I found something that caught my attention: there's a match where Ultimo faces someone named "Ultimate Dragon," who wore a black version of Ultimo's costume and used a Shooting Star for his finisher. I've never seen this guy before, and can't find anything else of him. Anyone know who the hell this guy was?

[Funky Fly]

I know the match you're talking about. It's got a SSSSSSSSSICK Shooting Star Press to the cement from the top rope. And I'm not talking that pussy shit Kidman does where there are 2 or 3 guys standing up who catch him. I mean 1 guy lying down taking an SSP from the turnbuckle.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I've seen that match, too. It kicks ass.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Or Chris Jericho......

I think you mean Chris Benoit. I don't count Benoit as a cruiserweight because he never went for the belt in WCW, and he did compete for the Light Heavyweight Championship as Wild Pegasus, which he actually won at one stage, but the WWE tends to ignore that part of their Championship's history.

"No, I meant Chris Jericho. The other guy in the match with Chris Benoit and Kurt Angle at WrestleMania 16. The guy who headlined WrestleMania X-8."

Who?

I kid, I kid. I love Chris Jericho. I was just covering up me inadvertent disclusion of him from my previous post. :shifty:

[Mr. Nerfect]

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/Ultimo%2BDragon/video/x1gn8t_ultimo-dragon-wins-the-tv-title-2nd

Just started watching this match. Seems like it kicks a lot of ass. William Regal defends the WCW Television Championship against Ultimo Dragon. Regal looks HUGE here. I guess it's because I'm not used to seeing him in the ring with cruiserweights. Honestly, the guy comes off as a bear.

[Fignuts]

Ultimo is easily one of my favorite wrestlers. One of WWE's biggest fuck ups imo.

[Funky Fly]

http://www.dailymotion.com/relevance/search/Ultimo%2BDragon/video/x1gn8t_ultimo-dragon-wins-the-tv-title-2nd

Just started watching this match. Seems like it kicks a lot of ass. William Regal defends the WCW Television Championship against Ultimo Dragon. Regal looks HUGE here. I guess it's because I'm not used to seeing him in the ring with cruiserweights. Honestly, the guy comes off as a bear.
Probably also because he was heavier too.

[Fignuts]

For real tho, you'd have to be legally retarded to be able to fuck up with Ultimo, but they did it.

[Funky Fly]

I know. He jobbed to Rey (no problem there) in a three minute match (:'( )... while Rey was dressed like the fucking Incredible Hulk (:'( x 10).

[Mr. Nerfect]

Probably also because he was heavier too.

I guess that could have something to do with it. :p

Yeah, I watched the rest of the match, and they bill him as being 280lbs. Much larger than his current 240lbs self.

[Mr. Nerfect]

And yeah, the WWE fucked up really badly with Ultimo Dragon. How hard is it to just use him as the badass perfection he is?

[The One]

Ultimo Dragon is good, but I've never had a single mark out moment for him ever.

[Funky Fly]

Ultimo Dragon is good, but I've never had a single mark out moment for him ever.
Well, I suppose not, since he's not as hilarious as Nash on the stick and he doesn't wear see-thru trunks like a certain ass man.

[Xerzes]

I always enjoyed the period in WCW when Ultimo would walk around wearing a title belt, holding one or two more, and had some little Japanese guy who followed him around carrying several others because he's that awesome. I have no doubt that he was actually engaged in nine or so simultaneous title reigns all over the world because he was awesome.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Ultimo's good but he's nowhere near as good as some people seem to think

[Thriller]

Ive had the honor of watching Ultimo Dragon at an indy show down here in Mississauga
Ive seen him fight Chris Sabin,Black Tiger and in May he is coming back to fight Lyger.

www.uwahardcorewrestling.com is the site for all the skeptics

[Kane Knight]

Dragon is awesome.

Shall I presume you will put both lips to his dick and come up with numerous plots to ME him?

[The One]

I always enjoyed the period in WCW when Ultimo would walk around wearing a title belt, holding one or two more, and had some little Japanese guy who followed him around carrying several others because he's that awesome. I have no doubt that he was actually engaged in nine or so simultaneous title reigns all over the world because he was awesome.

Actually, all of the title belts were one in the same. It was the J Crown Championship put together by New Japan. They took eight of the world's top non-heavyweight titles; British Commonwealth Junior Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Jushin Liger), IWGP Junior Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Great Sasuke), NWA World Junior Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Masayoshi Motegi), NWA World Welterweight Championship (originally held by Negro Casas), UWA World Light Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Shinjiro Ohtani), WAR International Junior Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Ultimo Dragon), WWA World Junior Light Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Gran Hamada) and the original WWE Light Heavyweight Championship (originally held by El Samurai). All eight men entered into a four night tournament were the winner would win all eight titles to be named the J Crown Champion. Grand Sasuke defeated Ultimo in the finals, however Ultimo beat Sasuke about two months later and won the J Crown/all eight titles. Ultimo lost it to Liger, Liger lost it to El Samurai, and he in turn lost it to Otani.

The J Crown was eventually disbanded when WWE wanted to reintroduce the Light Heavyweight Title and suddenly realise it was in the hands of Otani, and demanded he give the belt back. See New Japan had been using the physical title belt as one of their own for a long time, but I guess WWE kind of forgot to keep tabs on it (so in a way, the WWE Light Heavyweight Title was on WCW programming when Ultimo carried all the belts around). Anyway, Otani gave back the WWE Light Heavyweight belt, vacted all the rest except the IWGP Junior Heavyweight Belt, and the rest is history.

[FourFifty]

I think you mean Chris Benoit.

Nope. Jericho was a cruiser weight champion in WCW. Now he may have bulked up a bit since then, but I just like to point that out whenever I talk about the cruiser weight title.

[FourFifty]

Actually, all of the title belts were one in the same. It was the J Crown Championship put together by New Japan. They took eight of the world's top non-heavyweight titles; British Commonwealth Junior Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Jushin Liger), IWGP Junior Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Great Sasuke), NWA World Junior Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Masayoshi Motegi), NWA World Welterweight Championship (originally held by Negro Casas), UWA World Light Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Shinjiro Ohtani), WAR International Junior Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Ultimo Dragon), WWA World Junior Light Heavyweight Championship (originally held by Gran Hamada) and the original WWE Light Heavyweight Championship (originally held by El Samurai). All eight men entered into a four night tournament were the winner would win all eight titles to be named the J Crown Champion. Grand Sasuke defeated Ultimo in the finals, however Ultimo beat Sasuke about two months later and won the J Crown/all eight titles. Ultimo lost it to Liger, Liger lost it to El Samurai, and he in turn lost it to Otani.

The J Crown was eventually disbanded when WWE wanted to reintroduce the Light Heavyweight Title and suddenly realise it was in the hands of Otani, and demanded he give the belt back. See New Japan had been using the physical title belt as one of their own for a long time, but I guess WWE kind of forgot to keep tabs on it (so in a way, the WWE Light Heavyweight Title was on WCW programming when Ultimo carried all the belts around). Anyway, Otani gave back the WWE Light Heavyweight belt, vacted all the rest except the IWGP Junior Heavyweight Belt, and the rest is history.

Did Ultmio Dragon hold the WCW cruiser weight title while he had the J Crown?

[The One]

Yes, Dean was Cruiser champ through most of his reign with the J Crown, but he did win the Cruiser title from Dean, however he dropped the J Crown like 5 days later.

[FourFifty]

So if the J Crown had a WWF title in it, and The Ultmio Dragon won the WCW cruiser weight title while he had the J Crown, I'm pretty sure that means that Sean Waltman wasn't the first wrestelr to hold a WWF and WCW title at the same time.

[The One]

Hard to say. I mean, by all rights, the WWE Light Heavyweight Title was no longer true property of WWE. It was a belt that they created, and then allowed New Japan to take it over. It wasn't even refered to as a WWE Title, it was more just that they kept the physical belt and used the term "World Light Heavyweight Champion." So I guess, technically, maybe not, but as far as the first man to hold a WCW and a WWE title, which the owner and promoter of the company put on them (granted it's the same man, but work with me) it's still Sean.

[FourFifty]

If the WWF's title in the J Crown didn't mean anything why would the WWF want to get that title back? It WAS a WWF title, while under the contorl of another promoter. Now I'm sure during this time period the WWF said nothing about that title, and claimed that TAKA was the first Light Heavyweight champion, but it still sounds like, for the record Ultmio Dragon was the first person to hold a WCW and WWF title at the same time.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Nope. Jericho was a cruiser weight champion in WCW. Now he may have bulked up a bit since then, but I just like to point that out whenever I talk about the cruiser weight title.

Yeah, I know. I was just being an ass to cover accidentally leaving him out.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Dragon is awesome.

Shall I presume you will put both lips to his dick and come up with numerous plots to ME him?

I shall put both lips to his dick, but I don't get why you think I'd try to suggest how to main event him. I only suggest how to main event the guys in threads where it's asked how to push someone, which is kind of the point. :p

I do think Dragon should have made a pretty obvious pick for Cruiserweight Champion, though. How the WWE fucked that up is beyond me.

[Funky Fly]

Ultimo Dragon could shit in a sandwich and I would pay to eat it.

[FourFifty]

Yeah, I know. I was just being an ass to cover accidentally leaving him out.

Ah, I didn't know, seriously.
Most wrestling fans I know have no idea that Jericho used to be a cw champ, and since one's tone of voice can't be heard over the internet... Need I say more?

[FourFifty]

Ultimo Dragon could shit in a sandwich and I would pay to eat it.

That just might be the most disgusting thing I've heard all week.

[Funky Fly]

That just might be the most disgusting thing I've heard all week.
I would let him do me ass to mouth.

[The Show Off]

I would let him do me ass to mouth.
"You never go ass to mouth!"

"Becks did you ever go ass to mouth?"

"You never go ass to mouth."

"Not even once?"

"Not even ever."

"You two are both so repressed..."

[The One]

If the WWF's title in the J Crown didn't mean anything why would the WWF want to get that title back? It WAS a WWF title, while under the contorl of another promoter. Now I'm sure during this time period the WWF said nothing about that title, and claimed that TAKA was the first Light Heavyweight champion, but it still sounds like, for the record Ultmio Dragon was the first person to hold a WCW and WWF title at the same time.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/93/WWFLightHWtitleorig.jpg

That was the original WWE Light Heavyweight Title. And while it had the WWE Title attached to it's name, it really wasn't a WWE Title. They never booked the belt. From my understanding, they lent their name so that the Universal Wrestling Association could have a legit belt. This was back in the era when terratories was still the international scene, and it wasn't uncommon for someone to "create" a title, despite truly having nothing to do with it. I mean it went through 1981 (the year it was created) to 1997 without ever appearing on a single WWE event. Also, for what it's worth, Chris Benoit would have then also been the first and only man to ever win both the WWE World Lightheavyweight Title and the WWE World Heavyweight Title. But truly, unless you are a stickler for details (which I am) 99% of the wrestling world considereds TAKA as the first LHW Champ due to him being the first one that WWE actually crowned. :|

[Funky Fly]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/9/93/WWFLightHWtitleorig.jpg

That was the original WWE Light Heavyweight Title. And while it had the WWE Title attached to it's name, it really wasn't a WWE Title. They never booked the belt. From my understanding, they lent their name so that the Universal Wrestling Association could have a legit belt. This was back in the era when terratories was still the international scene, and it wasn't uncommon for someone to "create" a title, despite truly having nothing to do with it. I mean it went through 1981 (the year it was created) to 1997 without ever appearing on a single WWE event. Also, for what it's worth, Chris Benoit would have then also been the first and only man to ever win both the WWE World Lightheavyweight Title and the WWE World Heavyweight Title. But truly, unless you are a stickler for details (which I am) 99% of the wrestling world considereds TAKA as the first LHW Champ due to him being the first one that WWE actually crowned. :|
Not gonna lie, you're kinda making me wanna let you do me ass to mouth too right now.

[The One]

Don't let anyone tell you otherwise, knowledge of Pro Wrestling Title history gets you ass. :y: :D

[ddpBANG]

there's a match where Ultimo faces someone named "Ultimate Dragon," who wore a black version of Ultimo's costume and used a Shooting Star for his finisher. I've never seen this guy before, and can't find anything else of him. Anyone know who the hell this guy was? "Black Dragon" Bret Como. (http://www.moondogmanson.com/blackdragon/)

He's also wrestled in the Pacific NW and Canada.

He's also friends with Chris Jericho and Lance Storm.

Can't seem to find anything new on him...

[Nowhere Man]

Thank you, that was driving me crazy.