Is Jeff Hardy's push related to...

[Stickman]

Steroids? Do you think the WWE's wisdom says, "Everybody is talking steroids so let's push the only guy in the company that probably can't lift a barbell?" Look at every other wrestler and they're a big ripped guy, you look at Jeff and he's a scrawny looking punk.

Am I wrong in thinking this is possible?

[SammyG]

Never really thought of that. Ya never know, could be. But then again, Hardy has always been mad over.

[Funky Fly]

You know, Jeff really isn't scrawny. You ever seen a 6 foot 220 pound dude in person? Not scawny. Just not roided.

Also, I think it has more to do with basically everyone going ":roll: HHH is going over :roll:"

[Stickman]

You know, Jeff really isn't scrawny. You ever seen a 6 foot 220 pound dude in person? Not scawny. Just not roided.

Also, I think it has more to do with basically everyone going ":roll: HHH is going over :roll:"


I get what you're saying but he doesn't look like a roider. 98% of guys do.

[Kane Knight]

Steroids? Do you think the WWE's wisdom says, "Everybody is talking steroids so let's push the only guy in the company that probably can't lift a barbell?" Look at every other wrestler and they're a big ripped guy, you look at Jeff and he's a scrawny looking punk.

Am I wrong in thinking this is possible?

This has been suggested before, and it definitely strikes me as WWE logic. Push the stoner because he doesn't look like he's juicing.

However, I'm betting it comes down to the fact that he's about the only guy anyone gives a shit about legitimately.

[Kane Knight]

You know, Jeff really isn't scrawny. You ever seen a 6 foot 220 pound dude in person? Not scawny. Just not roided.

Yeah, but compare him to the normal wrestling physique, rather than normal physique. Big difference.

[Theo Dious]

This has been suggested before, and it definitely strikes me as WWE logic. Push the stoner because he doesn't look like he's juicing.

Weed > Roids?

[St. Jimmy]

It's related to sucking.

[Kane Knight]

Weed > Roids?

Well, I think that's their logic, anyway.

[Theo Dious]

Yeah I've never heard of anyone being killed by someone on Weed Rage.

"Duuude, I am sooo going to fuck your ass up go- WHOA, SHINY!"

[Mister Sinister]

Yeah, suprised Jeff is able to keep the figure he has with his documented weed problems, technically as bad as people make it sound, he would be the fattest and most out of shape person in the company due to the munchies

[Kane Knight]

Yeah I've never heard of anyone being killed by someone on Weed Rage.

"Duuude, I am sooo going to fuck your ass up go- WHOA, SHINY!"LOL!

[BigDaddyCool]

Which explains why Batista has been in the title picture for the past year as champion or challenging for the title.

[Kane Knight]

Which explains why Batista has been in the title picture for the past year as champion or challenging for the title.

Because we all know Bats didn't do no drugs.

[Theo Dious]

Because we all know Bats didn't do no drugs.

No, but Vince is on crack, so...

[Kane Knight]

But anyway, Bats gets some pretty huge reactions, which does tie to my theory that Hardy's getting a push because he's one of the only guys who gets reactions in an otherwise stoic crowd base.

[Theo Dious]

So, KK, I know you're no huge fan of Batista's or Edge's, who who do think is a better champion selection?

[RVDmark]

Weed > Roids?

6 Million people in this country (UK) smoke weed regularly (according to a report I read), I highly doubt that 6 million over here take steroids. And I would imagine that the US and Canada have similar ratio's. Therefore weed is more accepted publicly as its something you are likely to know someone who does it. Compared to steroids, with it recently possibly causing someone to murder their family, weed is in a better light. Weed has caused I believe 1 or 2 recorded fatalities ever, and even then I wouldn't class them as direct causes. Steroids, well, more than that. Alcohol has killed far more than those two put together and I bet you'll still be out drinking this weekend, so its not a matter of how dangerous the drug is, just how accepted it is publicly. No go be a good sheep and have a beer whilst telling everyone marijuana is bad.

[RVDmark]

Yeah I've never heard of anyone being killed by someone on Weed Rage.

"Duuude, I am sooo going to fuck your ass up go- WHOA, SHINY!"

They really should do an angle with that for Jeff. He's a second away from beating Orton at the Rumble when he suddenly realises that the WWE belt spins.:love:

[Kane Knight]

So, KK, I know you're no huge fan of Batista's or Edge's, who who do think is a better champion selection?

To be clear, I like Edge. I hate his "ANGRY FACE" persona, because he sounds less like a heel and more like a retard. And he couldn't draw heat for shit early on, and now that people are forgetting that he and Lita did the nasty, he's not exactly getting a shitload, either.

I also like Batista, but he got lazy when he came back from injury. the guy had some of the sickest looking power moves in the business, and he was very over with the crowd.

Edge'll probably get heat for doing Vickie, but otherwise, I think his range is fairly limited. Bats should probably never speak, and he's a lazy fucker, but he's over with the crowds legit, and so my money's on him.

6 Million people in this country (UK) smoke weed regularly (according to a report I read), I highly doubt that 6 million over here take steroids. And I would imagine that the US and Canada have similar ratio's. Therefore weed is more accepted publicly as its something you are likely to know someone who does it. Compared to steroids, with it recently possibly causing someone to murder their family, weed is in a better light. Weed has caused I believe 1 or 2 recorded fatalities ever, and even then I wouldn't class them as direct causes. Steroids, well, more than that. Alcohol has killed far more than those two put together and I bet you'll still be out drinking this weekend, so its not a matter of how dangerous the drug is, just how accepted it is publicly. No go be a good sheep and have a beer whilst telling everyone marijuana is bad.

Come on, people, stop with the half ass logic.

[The Optimist]

Besides the obvious hyperbole, I think it might. At least it's something to show, since the current champion is Orton, who was on the steroid list I think. And other main eventers involve Triple H, and Batista.

[Kane Knight]

The problem is, even the little guys are juicing, too. It's like the Mitchell report, where a lot of the guys weren't starting pitchers and home run sluggers, they were just guys looking to cling to their third tier status and not get fired.

WWE is in a similar sitch. Even the little guys are juicing (Which is their own damn fault), and so their options are limited.

[The Optimist]

But I see it about public perception as much in that way. Looking at Jeff Hardy you think alot of things, roided up is not one of them. If Hardy is in the title scene they have one man who clearly is that, not roided up. Who else does that include . . . HBK? I can't remember if Edge was involved or not.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I had the thought the other day, but then why isn't CM Punk getting a more serious push? I suppose when Punk says he's straight-edge, he means recreational drugs, and the guy could be roiding, but then you look at the other guys the WWE is pushing. They are all still big, and some of them were even suspended for drugs recently.

I also don't think it is what KK said, exclusively. Yeah, Jeff is over, but he's not so enormously over that the WWE would have to push him. They've shown a stubborness to that in the past. I mean, Balls Mahoney is currently really fucking over (it surprises me), but he doesn't get much by way of a push. That might be because he didn't get his start in the WWE, but still, I don't think it is exclusively that reason.

I personally cannot slap a label on this. I mean, did the Jeff Hardy loving even start before the guy got his push? He was the same old Jeff Hardy, and then Matt Hardy got taken out of the Survivor Series match in a kayfabe sense, and Jeff got to survive with Triple H. Then he starts getting the pins in all the main event tag team matches he's in.

To be honest, I'm going to throw two more slightly obscure conspiracy theories. One is that Jeff is getting a push just to spite Matt Hardy. The WWE knows Matt is good, and they know he's the more reliable worker, but it always seems that for every push Matt gets based on his work, Jeff Hardy gets one based on jumping off ladders, and Jeff's is on the main brand and he actually gets to win their secondary title.

I mean, look at their resumes. Jeff Hardy has four IC Title reigns to his name. Matt Hardy has been Cruiserweight Champion and a WWE Tag Team Champion away from The Hardy Boyz.

Another crazy theory I'm throwing out there, is that Jeff Hardy is getting a push because of Triple H. I don't know if Hunter legitimately likes the kid, but I'm thinking that Trple H is just trying to prove he can do it. All of Jeff's big wins have come in matches with or against Triple H. You have to believe that The Game has had some word, one way or another, in Jeff Hardy coming out looking the way he does.

Apparently Triple H is going to be in charge of developmental one day. This might be his way of proving to Vince that he can take a guy and make him a star. I'd be cool to see if Shawn Michaels does something like that late 2008. HBK has been working with Mr. Kennedy, and has worked with young talent before, but I'm talking about a really intense feud with a guy no one sees coming, that makes the kid look good around every corner.

[Mr. Nerfect]

But I see it about public perception as much in that way. Looking at Jeff Hardy you think alot of things, roided up is not one of them. If Hardy is in the title scene they have one man who clearly is that, not roided up. Who else does that include . . . HBK? I can't remember if Edge was involved or not.

Edge has stated that he has taken steroids, and he was suspended because he was named in the recent scandal.

Chris Jericho is another smaller guy the WWE could push, and while MVP might be on roids, it would not surprise me if his physique was natural. The guy strikes me as a naturally built guy.

[Kane Knight]

But I see it about public perception as much in that way. Looking at Jeff Hardy you think alot of things, roided up is not one of them. If Hardy is in the title scene they have one man who clearly is that, not roided up. Who else does that include . . . HBK? I can't remember if Edge was involved or not.

Edge was not only a part of it, but he lied about it.

The problem with your reasoning is that they could have done it with any number of people who are "clearly not roided up." And some of those guys were indicted in the signature scandal. "Clearly not roided up" only works outside of piss tests and reality. I mean, when you think about juicers, do you think Funaki or the Hurricane? Maybe you do, but most people sure as fuck don't.


But they're also pushing juicers, with Edge in the ME scene, Trips in the ME scene, Batista in the ME scene...So the token clean guy argument really just weakens with the environment. Granted, Vince isn't strong on logic, but...

[Zen v.W.o.]

The new policy:

Stop pushing steroid users, and start pushing guys with heroin problems.

:y:

[Shadow]

In regards to Noid's HBK taking an unknown or little known younger guy and making him a star.

Paul London perhaps?

[The Optimist]

Edge was not only a part of it, but he lied about it.

The problem with your reasoning is that they could have done it with any number of people who are "clearly not roided up." And some of those guys were indicted in the signature scandal. "Clearly not roided up" only works outside of piss tests and reality. I mean, when you think about juicers, do you think Funaki or the Hurricane? Maybe you do, but most people sure as fuck don't.


But they're also pushing juicers, with Edge in the ME scene, Trips in the ME scene, Batista in the ME scene...So the token clean guy argument really just weakens with the environment. Granted, Vince isn't strong on logic, but...Yeah, basically. I didn't say it was smart, I said it was what it looks like. Or more clearly, it looks like it's a contributing factor. Hardy's name is clean and he doesn't look like he's juicing. It very well could be unrelated and just coincidental timing to be honest.

[Kane Knight]

I had the thought the other day, but then why isn't CM Punk getting a more serious push? I suppose when Punk says he's straight-edge, he means recreational drugs, and the guy could be roiding, but then you look at the other guys the WWE is pushing. They are all still big, and some of them were even suspended for drugs recently.

The guy's supposedly refused drugs for actual medicinal purposes. I mean, the straight edge lifestyle is really supposed to be all about not poisoning your body at all.

Of course, Punk apparently drinks, and that's not even pointing out the irony that even if he drinks caffeine free diet Pepsi, he's still putting toxins into his system. Pepsi has two of the worst legal substances on the planet in it--Caffeine and sugar, and the acid in it's horrible, even sans caffeine. and Asparatame...But I digress.

I kind of think he's not getting pushed too hard because they don't want to look like fools if he fails a piss test.

[Mr. Nerfect]

In regards to Noid's HBK taking an unknown or little known younger guy and making him a star.

Paul London perhaps?

I would fucking cum.

[Mr. Nerfect]

The guy's supposedly refused drugs for actual medicinal purposes. I mean, the straight edge lifestyle is really supposed to be all about not poisoning your body at all.

Of course, Punk apparently drinks, and that's not even pointing out the irony that even if he drinks caffeine free diet Pepsi, he's still putting toxins into his system. Pepsi has two of the worst legal substances on the planet in it--Caffeine and sugar, and the acid in it's horrible, even sans caffeine. and Asparatame...But I digress.

I kind of think he's not getting pushed too hard because they don't want to look like fools if he fails a piss test.

Since when has Punk been a consumer of alcohol? Just out of curiosity.

I've had some friends who have gone "edge," and while there are acids in Pepsi, I don't think Punk would get impaled for drinking it. It's mainly alcohol, smoking and drugs the beliefs are again, isn't it? Some deeper forms do practice ruling out medicinal use of drugs and caffeine, as you mentioned.

I think you just have the straight-edge lifestyle on a technicality. It is almost impossible to not poison your body without breathing these days.

[Kane Knight]

Since when has Punk been a consumer of alcohol? Just out of curiosity.

I've had some friends who have gone "edge," and while there are acids in Pepsi, I don't think Punk would get impaled for drinking it. It's mainly alcohol, smoking and drugs the beliefs are again, isn't it? Some deeper forms do practice ruling out medicinal use of drugs and caffeine, as you mentioned.

I think you just have the straight-edge lifestyle on a technicality. It is almost impossible to not poison your body without breathing these days.

Punk's spoken specifically about the poisoning your body bit. He's also refused medical attention before on these grounds, I've seen it listed in some of the results and it was hyped by a lot of his fans during his RoH days and right up until he showed up in ECW. Caffeine is worse for you than most of the drugs they bitch about. Even if you couldn't catch a lot of sXers smoking and drinking when they're not fronting and preaching, that's pretty bad hypocrisy, and it doesn't need to go into the technicalities of "everything's poison."

People have reported seeing Punk drinking beer, but again, not really the major point.

By the way, the acid in Pepsi is no minor deal. Cola can do as much damage as cigarette smoke to your body. It just does it in a silent fashion, destroying yourr bones and organs. And hey, that's fine, I'm in favor of people doing what they want, as long as they don't wreck things for everyone else. But honestly, you're probably better off with the beer.

[Kane Knight]

And again, I really do think if they had faith in Punk's cleanliness, they'd have thrown him up on Raw and put him in the main event scene. However, if he's juicing, or doing ANYTHING that might show up on a screening, it would be apretty nice slap in the face.

[Chavo Classic]

6 Million people in this country (UK) smoke weed regularly (according to a report I read), I highly doubt that 6 million over here take steroids. And I would imagine that the US and Canada have similar ratio's. Therefore weed is more accepted publicly as its something you are likely to know someone who does it. Compared to steroids, with it recently possibly causing someone to murder their family, weed is in a better light. Weed has caused I believe 1 or 2 recorded fatalities ever, and even then I wouldn't class them as direct causes. Steroids, well, more than that. Alcohol has killed far more than those two put together and I bet you'll still be out drinking this weekend, so its not a matter of how dangerous the drug is, just how accepted it is publicly. No go be a good sheep and have a beer whilst telling everyone marijuana is bad.

Wow... wow! I'm hoping you're 12 years old, otherwise you're a fucking idiot.

[Dave Youell]

Recently for any PR stuff, they are sending Punk to do the interviews, Vince has said he see’s him as one of his top stars of the future, ECW needs him, he’s basically the only star on that show, there’s meant to be a draft lottery in March, I can see Punk moving then, most probably dropping the title before then.

There would be no point in moving Punk to Raw now, as he’d get lost in the shuffle for the build up to Mania, I’m sure they have a rough idea on what the main matches for Mania will be, so the storylines should already be loosely set, moving Punk onto Raw now would hurt his impact as he’d be in the mid card and by the time he gets a push, it wouldn’t mean as much if he jumped straight away and started to feud with upper card talent

As for Punk’s straight edge thing, I think it’s legit, I don’t think he’s done roids, his body hasn’t really changed in the 6 years I’ve been watching his matches, supplements and stuff? Possibly, but I can’t see him doing roids, I’ve seen a few shoot interviews when he speaks about his opinions on them and he doesn’t give the impression that it’s something that he would do.l But then, it could all be a gimmick.

Personally I think it would be great if he kicks it up a gear with the straight edge thing, really shoves it down people’s faces, until he turns heel with it (like in ROH) and then comes out smoking and drinking a beer, perfect hypocrisy heel heat. Or course that won’t happen, but I think it would be good, plus Punk wouldn’t want to do it given his lifestyle choices

[Mr. Nerfect]

Punk's spoken specifically about the poisoning your body bit. He's also refused medical attention before on these grounds, I've seen it listed in some of the results and it was hyped by a lot of his fans during his RoH days and right up until he showed up in ECW. Caffeine is worse for you than most of the drugs they bitch about. Even if you couldn't catch a lot of sXers smoking and drinking when they're not fronting and preaching, that's pretty bad hypocrisy, and it doesn't need to go into the technicalities of "everything's poison."

People have reported seeing Punk drinking beer, but again, not really the major point.

By the way, the acid in Pepsi is no minor deal. Cola can do as much damage as cigarette smoke to your body. It just does it in a silent fashion, destroying yourr bones and organs. And hey, that's fine, I'm in favor of people doing what they want, as long as they don't wreck things for everyone else. But honestly, you're probably better off with the beer.

Oh, I'm not arguing with you. I'm certainly not straight-edge myself, I'm just saying that they probably don't care about the science behind it. I mean, if they did, all the points you bring up are extremely valid.

Was that beer drinking at the RAW XV show? Because that was Pepsi. I mean, I don't want to imply I think the guy walks on water, but I doubt he'd claim he is straight-edge when he's clearly not.

[Dave Youell]

Was that beer drinking at the RAW XV show? Because that was Pepsi. I mean, I don't want to imply I think the guy walks on water, but I doubt he'd claim he is straight-edge when he's clearly not.

That was def pepsi he was drinking then, they even replayed him saluting the crowd the following week for the recap

He’d be an absolute moron to preach the straight edge lifestyle then drink beer on live tv

[Chavo Classic]

The IWC should really stop speculating on Punk's lifestyle, it's kinda sad.

[Dave Youell]

The IWC should really stop speculating on Punk's lifestyle, it's kinda sad.

There's lots of things we should be doing

[Chavo Classic]

Would it bother you if you went round to Stone Cold's house, and he didn't have any beer in the fridge and offered you some tea instead? Would you cry hypocrisy because hey, I though you were a tough SOB who drank beer everyday and kicked ass? Why did you lie to me? What about your gimmick?

Not that I'm defending Punk. If he does turn out to shoot up or crack open a can, then he deserves a beating. But I don't think he is that person, judging by the massive ink across his middle and the various shoot-interviews where he maintains his lifestyle. But we can't prove a dam thing, so it's pointless.

[Mr. Nerfect]

That was def pepsi he was drinking then, they even replayed him saluting the crowd the following week for the recap

He’d be an absolute moron to preach the straight edge lifestyle then drink beer on live tv

Exactly. I mean, I don't pretend to know the guy, but I think a lot of claim that he's a violator of his own beliefs is unwarranted, stupid and often unlikely.

[Corkscrewed]

skipped the replies, but I say no, because otherwise, CM Punk would actually be getting pushed (he's gotten the most lackluster "push" of any "top champ" I've seen in a while, because it's not going in either direction).

[Kane Knight]

Exactly. I mean, I don't pretend to know the guy, but I think a lot of claim that he's a violator of his own beliefs is unwarranted, stupid and often unlikely.

I dunno. If I saw no one else say it, I think I'd still believe Rob Harvey. Since he's said it, I just don't find it unlikely. I'm not saying it's impossible, but when I look for some reason Rob might be making it up, I really can't think of one, and he hasn't really given us a lot of reason to think he's a liar. Any, really.

[Kane Knight]

And as a side note, since the "Beer Bash" bit from Raw was brought up, I paid attention to that primarily because of the "report" which included "and even if he was drinking a Miller Lite, does that really count?"

Because I thought that and some of the other notions brought up in said thread were kinda funny.

No, we've seen screenshots. It was soda, which doesn't change the stupidity of asking if it counts if you drink a beer that's only 4% ABV instead of 8 or 9 % ABV. Oh, and the "But what could Punk do? He had no choice" argument is a kinda funny one, too. The guy could refuse medical care based on his beliefs, but not a beer if Austin tossed him one....:wtf:

Anyway, those remain funny, reality notwithstanding, because they were more or less hypotheticals when the controversy hit.

[Stickman]

Would it bother you if you went round to Stone Cold's house, and he didn't have any beer in the fridge and offered you some tea instead? Would you cry hypocrisy because hey, I though you were a tough SOB who drank beer everyday and kicked ass? Why did you lie to me? What about your gimmick?

Not that I'm defending Punk. If he does turn out to shoot up or crack open a can, then he deserves a beating. But I don't think he is that person, judging by the massive ink across his middle and the various shoot-interviews where he maintains his lifestyle. But we can't prove a dam thing, so it's pointless.



Could you imagine going to Stone Cold's house and drinking a brew with him without him pouring it all down his face and shirt?

[Chavo Classic]

Could you imagine going to Stone Cold's house and drinking a brew with him without him pouring it all down his face and shirt?

He'd be a pretty lousy host, is what he'd be!

[Chavo Classic]

Oh, and the "But what could Punk do? He had no choice" argument is a kinda funny one, too. The guy could refuse medical care based on his beliefs, but not a beer if Austin tossed him one....:wtf:

I think some of the fanboys meant something along the lines of Punk loves this business so much, would he risk making Stone Cold look stupid by turning down a Beer. As another face, it's his obligation to go along with the celebrations. Would he sacrafice his own personal beliefs to avoid soiling a great wrestling moment...

Which got me thinking... how do you think Punk felt towards the angle when Raven tied him up and poured Beer on him? He must have at least got a mouthful of the stuff, and his skin might have absorbed some.

Do you think he was reluctant? Was it his idea?

[Kane Knight]

Right now, I'm mostly wondering how much beer your skin absorbed...:wtf:

[Chavo Classic]

Right now, I'm mostly wondering how much beer your skin absorbed...:wtf:

I wonder if you sat in a bath of beer, how long it'd take to get drunk?

[Kane Knight]

You'd die first.

Assuming your intent was to sit there until you got drunk.

[The Lone Wolf]

i think that it is more related to him being the most over person in the WWE but thats just me.

[Kane Knight]

i think that it is more related to him being the most over person in the WWE but thats just me.

Which explains why Cena was pushed and Christian was depushed, and so on.