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Old 08-27-2015, 10:42 AM   #1
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John Cena is the greatest WWE superstar of all time.
He really is. You can't flex on the kid. He's the man.

Refute it. You can't.

FREAKY! OUTTIE!

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do you know what I have seen a lot of people dumber than me and canadian crippla His name is Mr. Robert Goulet
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All would of been well if I'd have fucked her in the toilet.


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Old 08-27-2015, 11:05 AM   #2
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Greatest superstar of his time, no doubt. All time is a harder case to make. He'd definitely be in the top 3-5 though.
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Old 08-27-2015, 11:05 AM   #3
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Debatable but he is in the top 5 easily.
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Old 08-27-2015, 11:16 AM   #4
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CONTROVERSIAL!
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Old 08-27-2015, 11:19 AM   #5
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Hulk Hogan is the greatest WWE Superstar of all-time.

While I like Austin and Rock more than Cena, Cena's had more longetivity than both, so he's probably ahead of them.
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Old 08-27-2015, 12:08 PM   #6
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certainly of his time.

Hulk Hogan & Bruno Sammartino for me are two greatest of all time.
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Old 08-27-2015, 12:31 PM   #7
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These always feel like bating posts, much like a kobe v lebron v jordan argument. But this many posts in it's stayed fresh so,


The reason cena wont go down as goat is because too many detractors. Too many fans are anti the cena character,not the man, the character. He is the greatest of the last 10 years because thats been forced on us. Thats all weve been given. He was forced on us like hogan was. Not many fans appointed cena as the greatest.

Wrestling fans will always put a flair or hbk over cena from wrestling standpoint even though those two never had crossover success outside the ring.

And hogan,rock, austin had more crossover success that made them bigger than cena, so either side of the coin it's not gonna be john
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Old 08-27-2015, 12:46 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by NormanSmiley View Post
These always feel like bating posts, much like a kobe v lebron v jordan argument. But this many posts in it's stayed fresh so,


The reason cena wont go down as goat is because too many detractors. Too many fans are anti the cena character,not the man, the character. He is the greatest of the last 10 years because thats been forced on us. Thats all weve been given. He was forced on us like hogan was. Not many fans appointed cena as the greatest.

Wrestling fans will always put a flair or hbk over cena from wrestling standpoint even though those two never had crossover success outside the ring.

And hogan,rock, austin had more crossover success that made them bigger than cena, so either side of the coin it's not gonna be john
10 niggawatts
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Old 08-27-2015, 12:53 PM   #9
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I love him, think he is great in the ring and amazingly hard working, but he has been stale for years and years.

People can paint it however they want and talk about his time on top being so long, but numbers are down and that is not because of being on a down cycle, its because interesting things don't happen, and when they threaten to, WWE are quick to go back to the same old pattern.

Network expansion and a new age aside, he is the main man in an era where people aren't watching, many of which switched off long ago when it became obvious that there wouldn't be any new faces anytime soon.

IMO, he can't go down as the greatest of all time, because he is the only candidate in a poor era.

That is not Cena hating, cause I think he is great, but they have never evolved him and he has played his part (eg Nexus) on making bad decisions that have just continued te status quo.
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Old 08-27-2015, 01:13 PM   #10
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In what aspect? Because during his reign on top the ratings are falling.
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Old 08-27-2015, 01:21 PM   #11
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The one aspect he may be the greatest is company man. He may be the guy with the smallest ego.
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Old 08-27-2015, 01:49 PM   #12
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The smallest ego far and away was the Rock. The Rock constantly did the job. Cena, not so much. The decision Cena made on having the Nexus lose to him at Summer Slam was a prime example.
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Old 08-27-2015, 01:54 PM   #13
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Quote:
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The smallest ego far and away was the Rock. The Rock constantly did the job. Cena, not so much. The decision Cena made on having the Nexus lose to him at Summer Slam was a prime example.
That was his call?

Suuucks.
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Old 08-27-2015, 02:43 PM   #14
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Elaborate on that demonrick, cena refused to lay dpwn to the nexus? I heard someone saying that cena was making a beef to keep the title on his bitch but that seemed minor, but he didnt want to job to the barrett nexus?


Only time I heard about rock putting ego first was refusing to work with shawn
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Old 08-27-2015, 02:44 PM   #15
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Of all time....Ric Flair and Hulk Hogan are the greatest.

Of his time....Hate to say it, but it's true.....it's damn true. Cena is right up there with Austin & The Rock.
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Old 08-27-2015, 02:44 PM   #16
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Believe Jericho has confirmed it before.
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Old 08-27-2015, 02:55 PM   #17
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I had such high hopes for the nexus.
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Old 08-27-2015, 02:56 PM   #18
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Jericho and Edge talked about it during one of the very first eps of Talk is Jericho as both of them were in the match. They tried to talk Cena out of the "take a DDT on the floor and STILL come back to beat Gabriel and Barrett" as they felt it would make the Nexus look so weak to have the odds overcome in such a fashion in their first match.

Cena admitted after the match that he should have listened and gone for a more conventional ending. All 3 guys seemed to agree that Nexus should have gone over but it was likely Vince's call to have Cena win. The ending still sucked though.
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Old 08-27-2015, 03:18 PM   #19
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It's hard to have this conversation because it's about persistent marketing, not like in legitimate sports wherein a performer actually proves and shows greatness. Essentially, Brock was supposed to be Cena in 2002 when they came in together but his personality didn't jibe with the business, so Cena got hot and was pushed. Vince picks who is the greatest at a given time, until recently when fans and social media combined the throw wrenches in his well oiled machine.
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Old 08-27-2015, 03:24 PM   #20
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Old 08-27-2015, 03:48 PM   #21
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Agreed condor,vince presented us cena just like he did hogan
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Old 08-27-2015, 04:38 PM   #22
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I think Kane has the smallest ego, just does what he's told.
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Old 08-27-2015, 04:42 PM   #23
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Wasn't Hogan already shit fucking hot before WWF? Swear it's been discussed countless times that Verne Gagne missed the boat on him over merch issues and all Vince did was snatch him up and let the money flow.
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Old 08-27-2015, 04:59 PM   #24
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Wasn't Hogan already shit fucking hot before WWF? Swear it's been discussed countless times that Verne Gagne missed the boat on him over merch issues and all Vince did was snatch him up and let the money flow.
Yah, Norman just insists Hogan was forced on us and whatnot, because Hogan leg dropped his mom. [citation needed]
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Old 08-27-2015, 05:01 PM   #25
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Let me clarify, vince presented cena the same way as hogan where he is the protected top guy and nobody will get strong over hogan/cena as long as they sell tshirts to kids
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Old 08-27-2015, 05:41 PM   #26
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Quote:
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These always feel like bating posts, much like a kobe v lebron v jordan argument. But this many posts in it's stayed fresh so,


The reason cena wont go down as goat is because too many detractors. Too many fans are anti the cena character,not the man, the character. He is the greatest of the last 10 years because thats been forced on us. Thats all weve been given. He was forced on us like hogan was. Not many fans appointed cena as the greatest.

Wrestling fans will always put a flair or hbk over cena from wrestling standpoint even though those two never had crossover success outside the ring.

And hogan,rock, austin had more crossover success that made them bigger than cena, so either side of the coin it's not gonna be john
Ha you really think his divisiveness is gonna keep him from being considered one of the greats? LOL
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Old 08-27-2015, 05:47 PM   #27
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Im saying I would put john cena as greatest of the pg era, and I wouldnt put him in the top 10 of all time. And that my opinion means more than your chick name
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Old 08-27-2015, 05:57 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Condor View Post
It's hard to have this conversation because it's about persistent marketing, not like in legitimate sports wherein a performer actually proves and shows greatness. Essentially, Brock was supposed to be Cena in 2002 when they came in together but his personality didn't jibe with the business, so Cena got hot and was pushed. Vince picks who is the greatest at a given time, until recently when fans and social media combined the throw wrenches in his well oiled machine.
I still think if Brock had been more open to the travel schedule, WWE would be an entirely different place. Brock has always had "it," but he hated the tour. Cena had slightly less of "it," but was willing to go the extra mile (and then some). If Brock had played the game, I honestly think his combination of size, skill, and presence could have made him the "legitimate" star WWE has wanted forever. Brock as THE guy would have changed everything.
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:00 PM   #29
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I agree with this loopy, but would brocks mic skills ever gotten to a point where he could sustain it? Ive never thought they were awful but never been great either. Could it have been worked around?
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:05 PM   #30
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I think what he's doing now with Heyman suggests he could have. Paul is great, but for me the highlight of Monday's beatdown was the look on Brock's face when he decided "Yeah, you know what? Maybe I WILL go back and murder that guy." He shows little flashes of personality just from the way he carries himself that I think would make up for any shortcomings on the mic.
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:05 PM   #31
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Cena is the fucking man though. More so than Austin, or anybody after Hogan, really. Nobody in the modern sports entertainment platform has lasted this long, and compiled the run he has, other than Hogan. And even then, Hogan didn't last as long as Cena has. By the time Hogan was nearing the end of his run, he was already running out of steam.

Cena still has plenty of fireleft in the tank and is far better matches than Hogan ever did. Maybe he doesn't carry the same spectacle, but for a guy who works live tv 52 times a year and ever ppv, and is still as good if not better than he was ten years ago, he'd have to be one of the greatest.
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:09 PM   #32
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Yeah Cena is a WWE Mt. Rushmore guy, for sure. His character is bland as hell, but aside from Hogan and Austin, nobody has had a run like Cena. Now, the business itself is not in as good a place as it was for those two, so he suffers a bit from the "big fish in a small pond" issue, and the writers have done him no favors in terms of growths, but the things he's done cannot be refuted. Character bores me to tears, but I respect the hell out of the man.
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:12 PM   #33
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I think the main argument is that it isn't just Cena being great, but the entire business model that places him on a pedastal because of his track record. He has only been the guy for the past five years because they are afraid to try anybody else. Hence, past guys like Brock, Batista and Orton being pushed near the top lately.
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:12 PM   #34
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Loopydate for the win.summed up perfectly. Close thread
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:14 PM   #35
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Disagree about him being the greatest of all time nor as being in the Mt Rushmore of wrestling but easily a 2nd tier candidate of greatness. Having a Hogan-like dominance run helps a lot while this year alone has shown how great he can be when he's motivated to prove something or put on amazing matches.
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:15 PM   #36
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Indeed. As far Brock is concerned, I think the guy that benefited most from Brock's departure was Batista. In an era of separate brands, where Cena was a great talker and great brawler in the ring, he was bound to get over and headline.

Batista, on the other hand, did not have the same look or presence as Brock, he wasn't anywhere near the athlete in the ring Brock was, and while heel Batista is great, his mic work was just ok.

Honestly feel has Lesnar not left, Batista may have still gotten a run but nothing like the one he did where there wa literally nobody to push.
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Old 08-27-2015, 06:59 PM   #37
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Hogan > Cena. Austin also has a valid case.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anybody Thrilla View Post
He really is. You can't flex on the kid. He's the man.

Refute it. You can't.


John Cena is definitely up there (easily Top 5 in my opinion, with Hogan, Austin, Rocky, and Bruno in there as well), but I think Hogan easily deserves the, "Greatest of all-time" moniker. Hogan meant just as much to kids back then as Cena does now, but Hogan took wrestling to an entirely new level. Hogan made put wrestling on the map. While Cena has done an admirable job of being the top guy over the past 10 years and keeping the WWE afloat, he didn't take the company to new heights like Hogan.


And for the record, my favorite guy is Stone Cold Steve Austin, and I think Austin has a legit claim for being the greatest of all-time as well. Austin took the wrestling industry to new heights just as Hogan once did.


Austin was the #1 guy during the #1 Attitude era. When you look back on Austin's career during 1997-2003, almost all of his feuds were 5 star calibre and ridiculously high profile. You can't say that about almost anyone else. Austin/Bret, Austin/Owen, Austin/HBK, Austin/Vince, Austin/Taker, Austin/Rock, Austin/HHH, Austin/Angle, Austin/Jericho-Benoit, etc.


In terms of high profile match-ups and feuds (and according to former TPWW poster Rob Harvey, ratings/revenue), Austin was the clear cut greatest of all-time.
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Old 08-27-2015, 08:11 PM   #38
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Indeed. As far Brock is concerned, I think the guy that benefited most from Brock's departure was Batista. In an era of separate brands, where Cena was a great talker and great brawler in the ring, he was bound to get over and headline.

Batista, on the other hand, did not have the same look or presence as Brock, he wasn't anywhere near the athlete in the ring Brock was, and while heel Batista is great, his mic work was just ok.

Honestly feel has Lesnar not left, Batista may have still gotten a run but nothing like the one he did where there wa literally nobody to push.
Looking back I actually wish we had gotten more time with Kayne Batista seemed like he was finally hitting his stride and for me, honestly the first time he didn't feel so ridiculously bland.

As for Cena its hard as hell not to respect the guy especially lately (part of me thinks he really enjoyed those open challenges) and it was pretty cool seeing the crowd go from Cena sucks to being unable to with hold props after his matches.
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Old 08-27-2015, 09:16 PM   #39
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I'll never buy Cena as the absolute greatest of all-time, but as much as I loathe and detest the character he portrays, I think his "Doctor of Thuganomics" years through the first 1 - 1 1/2 years as WWE Champion make him a solid top 10 in my book, even as much as I hate giving the devil his due.
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Old 08-27-2015, 09:24 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heyman View Post
John Cena is definitely up there (easily Top 5 in my opinion, with Hogan, Austin, Rocky, and Bruno in there as well), but I think Hogan easily deserves the, "Greatest of all-time" moniker. Hogan meant just as much to kids back then as Cena does now, but Hogan took wrestling to an entirely new level. Hogan made put wrestling on the map. While Cena has done an admirable job of being the top guy over the past 10 years and keeping the WWE afloat, he didn't take the company to new heights like Hogan.


And for the record, my favorite guy is Stone Cold Steve Austin, and I think Austin has a legit claim for being the greatest of all-time as well. Austin took the wrestling industry to new heights just as Hogan once did.


Austin was the #1 guy during the #1 Attitude era. When you look back on Austin's career during 1997-2003, almost all of his feuds were 5 star calibre and ridiculously high profile. You can't say that about almost anyone else. Austin/Bret, Austin/Owen, Austin/HBK, Austin/Vince, Austin/Taker, Austin/Rock, Austin/HHH, Austin/Angle, Austin/Jericho-Benoit, etc.


In terms of high profile match-ups and feuds (and according to former TPWW poster Rob Harvey, ratings/revenue), Austin was the clear cut greatest of all-time.
You don't think Rock has a legitimate argument? For all intents and purposes, he really didn't leave at all, even part-time for Hollywood until pretty much the end of the Attitude Era, and in that time he went from being the first-ever third generation superstar, but at first besides that fact, a nobody called Flex Kavana during his develiomental days with the company in the summer of 1996, to being "The Blue Chipper" Rocky Maivia, with goofy hair and attire in his Survivor Series '96 WWF debut. Still, he persevered and won his debut match as sole survivor for his team. He went on to many IC and WWF/WWE Championships and was molded into one of, if not the best talkers of all-time in the company's history. Rock definitely has a dog in the fight, too.
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