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Old 05-26-2016, 10:00 AM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ruien View Post
No no no no. We are finally getting back into a position where everyone is not a forner WWE or World champ. Keep it to 1 title where it actually means something if you won it at some point.
Completely agree. Guys like Swagger and Ziggler are former champs, these guys are not main eventers and never were yet somehow they have world championships. There should be one title and the champ goes to both shows. Use the US and IC titles as the brand championships, that not only elevates those titles but keeps people away from the real championship. If they really feel the need for a lower card title bring back the Euro and Tv or Cruiserweigt titles. Two world championships not only sounds stupid, but it dilutes the top stars.
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Old 05-26-2016, 10:03 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by slik View Post
What does that mean!?
Possibly no more live specials or ppvs in general. Being rumored they are dropping NXT house shows after mid-June.

Also rumored to be going back as a pure developmental thing like it was before it got huge. TV/Network wise, still will be shown till at least the current tv contracts end.
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Old 05-26-2016, 10:13 AM   #83
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What does that mean!?
Probably going to raid the NXT roster so NXT is truly a developmental promotion. I'm fine with it as I think most the top guys in NXT don't belong there.
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Old 05-26-2016, 10:21 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smelly Meatball View Post
Possibly no more live specials or ppvs in general. Being rumored they are dropping NXT house shows after mid-June.

Also rumored to be going back as a pure developmental thing like it was before it got huge. TV/Network wise, still will be shown till at least the current tv contracts end.
Noooooooooooooo

NXT was the best wrestling experience on my life as a fan in Dallas for WM weekend. It's so much better than RAW/Smackdown often. Nooooooooooooo
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Old 05-26-2016, 10:26 AM   #85
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Brand split is an awesome idea. Just keep one champion though, for fuck's sake.

World champ goes between brands, IC Title signifies Raw supremacy, US Title signifies Smackdown supremacy. All is well. No need for this two world title BS.
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Old 05-26-2016, 10:27 AM   #86
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No more live specials or PPVs? I assume that doesn't include the big 4.
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Old 05-26-2016, 10:29 AM   #87
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Think that's only NXT. HHH had cryptic tweet saying the next Takeover might be it's last.
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Old 05-26-2016, 10:32 AM   #88
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Oh. Didn't read the post that was in response to.

Well in that case, I hope they don't do two specials a month to cover both brands now. Having to stretch feuds for 2 months instead of running through everything as quickly as possible would serve them well.
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Old 05-26-2016, 11:31 AM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCrippyZ View Post
This is also true. The idea that the brand split will improve or make the writing and under performing talent better is an illogical fallacy.
I heard they have 12 writers now, six for each brand is enough. This will help the story because instead of having to produce 5 hours of a story each week you only have to produce 2 or 3.

Imagine having to write a Game of thrones episode that was 5 hours each week.
Last edited by Big Vic; 05-26-2016 at 11:56 AM.
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Old 05-26-2016, 11:41 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Vic View Post
I heard they have 12 writers now, six for each brand is enough. This will help the story because instead of having to produce 5 hours of a story each week you only have to produce 2 or 3.

Imagine having to write a Game of thrones episode that was 5 hours.
That's great in theory sure. It doesn't guarantee an improvement in quality though for either or both shows, just that one show MIGHT be better than the other.

Not to mention the fact that one show (cough, Raw, cough, cough) will always be seen as the "premier" show by most people, including fans, talent, Vince, office, backstage, etc. Even if Smackdown actually ends up being better than Raw in quality content, Raw's been around longer, has the more established brand, is more iconic, etc. A brand split isn't going to change that, let alone all the other flaws in WWE's writing, creative, booking, production, content, etc. This is just a way for Vince and everyone to feel better about the product and distract the fans from the fact that nothings really going to change or improve. Same company, same folks in charge, more of the same.
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Old 05-26-2016, 11:56 AM   #91
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They might book SD! Stronger during Football season.
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Old 05-26-2016, 12:22 PM   #92
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Quote:
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They might book SD! Stronger during Football season.
Not a bad idea.
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Old 05-26-2016, 01:06 PM   #93
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RAW could have Sting as GM, hell bent on sabotaging Seth Rollins(for ending his career) and his quest for getting the Championship he never lost. It would allow Roman to be a full fledged heel and earn his keep with the fans.
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Old 05-26-2016, 01:41 PM   #94
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GM Sting ONLY!
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Old 05-26-2016, 01:47 PM   #95
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The problem with keeping the one title is that the champion (Roman Reigns) will be a focus on both shows..... likely a segment and a match on Raw, then likely the same on Smackdown.... Better to have that second title to keep Reigns confined to Raw, and it can make being drafted to Smackdown more important as lesser talent can say "I want to get drafted to Smackdown, so I can enter the battle royal/tournament/clusterfuck match to become the new champion"
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Old 05-26-2016, 01:51 PM   #96
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And NXT should be left as is, minus the likes of Roode/Aries/Joe/Balor/etc. to be drafted up to the main roster.....
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Old 05-26-2016, 02:46 PM   #97
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Might just be acknowledging that after they take all the top talent from NXT it isn't going to be the same product. So it will probably take a step back for awhile until they start building up a bunch of new guys again. Will probably resemble early days of the brand.
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Old 05-26-2016, 02:49 PM   #98
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Im sure its been mentioned or complained about by someone within the pages of this thread but I don't have time to read all of your garbage (prounced Gar-bodge)

I"m excited for it but I really hate that it is Tuesdays because of the 3 hour Raw the night before I don't know if I could do 2 more hours the next day and then 1 hour the following day for NXT...it's a lot for the aging fan to digest.

It'll be fun for a while though.
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Old 05-26-2016, 02:51 PM   #99
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I think i might just skip Raw honestly, especially if roman is on it.
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Old 05-26-2016, 03:00 PM   #100
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I'll wait and see which roster gets which guys and check out both for a little while before deciding which to skip...but it's bound to be one of them.....

Hoping to god we get another "smackdown 6" type situation.....
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Old 05-26-2016, 06:31 PM   #101
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I haven't gone through the whole thread, but I am cautiously optimistic about this. A brand split has been ideal for a long time, but the problem is in how the WWE would handle it. If both shows feel identical, what is going to be the point? I hope they allow Triple H and a team led by Ryan Ward head SmackDown. I also hope RAW drops back down to two hours.

SmackDown going live is a big change in and of itself. This will increase the cost of the show, and while it probably increases what the show makes from USA Network, it's probably going to have a lot more worth in Vince's eyes. Enough worth to warrant him keeping his hands of it? Who knows?

This will help the ratings for SmackDown. I love Mauro Ranallo's commentary, but I've only listened to it twice since the start of the year, and once was because I wanted to hear it specifically. SmackDown has not felt important for a long time. Going live and being the exclusive home of some WWE talent you really want to see is going to drive up that percentage of the hardcore audience. Cesaro would be a good choice to send to SmackDown. And if they send Becky Lynch there, I must be done with RAW altogether.

This will also help talent. There are a lot of guys in similar situations. They're building Rusev up as a monster on a tear. Fans want to see Samoa Joe called up. What's he going to do with "monster on a tear" gone? Now he can be the monster on a tear on the other show. It's inevitable Bayley gets called up at some point. Where does that leave Becky Lynch -- the "other" plucky babyface in the Women's Division? She can be the plucky babyface on the other show.

Guys are overexposed these days -- you see them talk too much, work too much and lose too much. Now you can reduce that exposure by about 50%. You can also keep worn-out programs away from each other to rejuvenate. I don't ever need to see Orton vs. Sheamus again, but now you can make sure it doesn't happen by having them on separate shows.

There are a lot of talent "on the cusp." Kevin Owens is apparently ready for the main event, Sami Zayn is apparently ready for the main event, AJ Styles is apparently ready for the main event, Dean Ambrose is apparently ready for the main event, Bray Wyatt is apparently ready for the main event. "All the WWE needs to do is push them." Well, now, you can ideally push twice as many guys, as there will be parallel spots for guys on the roster.

That being said, they need to put effort into this, or else they will just feel like two watered down WWE shows.
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Old 05-26-2016, 06:37 PM   #102
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If they do away with NXT, they are really dumb. Smackdown! initially will feel a bit TNA-ish with all the former TNA talent most likely to be featured on that show along with current top-tier NXT talent.

That is fine by me, but NXT needs to remain as it is and continue to establish new stars. NXT is also far and away the superior product this entire calendar year. Takeover Dallas was exponentially better than WM.

Love to see this succeed, hopefully it works as most of us hope it will.
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Old 05-26-2016, 07:20 PM   #103
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Killing NXT would be incredibly dumb.

It has been the most interesting thing to happen in wrestling since the end of the Monday night wars. It's created stars and helped people get over before appearing on the main roster.

What I hope they do is create a Smackdown product which is more like NXT in feel.

The problem with the brand split when it existed was there were two products which catered for the exact same audience in the exact same ways. If they want to build Smackdown then they should look at making it a product that appeals to different fans rather than just being a slightly less interesting version of RAW.

But I can't help think that what we are seeing is the return of two mediocre shows rather than any move forward.
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Old 05-26-2016, 08:34 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicky Fives View Post
The problem with keeping the one title is that the champion (Roman Reigns) will be a focus on both shows..... likely a segment and a match on Raw, then likely the same on Smackdown.... Better to have that second title to keep Reigns confined to Raw, and it can make being drafted to Smackdown more important as lesser talent can say "I want to get drafted to Smackdown, so I can enter the battle royal/tournament/clusterfuck match to become the new champion"


He's been in 1-1.5 segments and 1 match per Raw. I don't mind his taking up a segment and/or match on SD too. Champ should be on both shows. Plenty of time for the rest of SD to develop the other talent.


That's, of course, if they did things right.


I like the idea that WWE/WWE Womens Champion rotate. IC and US are each brand's champions.


I wouldn't even mind two tag titles, given how deep the tag division is currently.
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Old 05-26-2016, 08:43 PM   #105
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NXT is about developing talent. Triple H's recent strategy has been to sign talent that have already gotten world and television experience and put them in great showings against each other to get the brand over. Sure, it helps Wesley Blake to wrestle Shinsuke Nakamura at an NXT house show, but ultimately there are a lot of guys in NXT that are ready to make money now. Calling them up to a unified roster is just going to get them lost in the shuffle. There's a lot more room for the likes of Joe, Balor, Nakamura, Roode and even Aries with a brand split in place. You can still do what NXT used to do and have main roster talent head down and work special spots on NXT television to keep it hot. Sheamus, Rob Van Dam, Dolph Ziggler and I think even Chris Jericho all made NXT appearances at different points. The talent only need to make one set of tapings and can possibly film a backstage segment, an in-ring promo and then work a match and you're done. Meanwhile guys like Tye Dillinger, Elias Samson, No Way Jose and whoever else you want to debut/use more strongly can get that exposure in front of crowds and hopefully develop into TV-ready talents.
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Old 05-26-2016, 08:48 PM   #106
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This also helps the women and tag teams. I've already touched on the women, but with one division, you basically have a champion, a challenger and maybe one other side feud and a few girls appearing in corners. Natalya's been the current challenger, so girls like Sasha and Paige (except for that win over Charlotte) had little to do. Now you can have Charlotte working with Nattie on one show, a program between Becky and Emma going on the other, and two more sub-programs going.

The tag team division is weird. I've heard people calling it "strong." The only real teams worth a damn, as far as credibility goes, are The New Day, Gallows & Anderson and maybe The Usos. There's a wide gap between those teams and the guys beneath. Enzo & Cass are over, but they feel too much like they're still trying to find that footing. Having two shows mean you can build a team on SmackDown, build a team on RAW, have your title feud on one of the shows, and ultimately everyone gets more shine.
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Old 05-26-2016, 08:48 PM   #107
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This is all in theory, mind you.
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Old 05-26-2016, 09:17 PM   #108
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Some more stuff from the Observer recently includes Vince McMahon currently rumored to be getting more hands-on with Smackdown once it goes live which hasn't happened in years. Cena confirmed as the top star for Smackdown and Reigns for RAW. Also already confirmed the WWE has plans in set for the debut of a new World belt and several storylines/feuds already in waiting for the belt.

Similar to the first Draft Lottery, current plan is for the majority (if not all) of the wrestlers to not be told where they will be heading until their actual draft pick announcement during the upcoming RAW draft show.
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Old 05-26-2016, 09:32 PM   #109
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I'm optimistic. They even talked about this on a local radio station, so WWE is getting more buzz. The original brand split worked wonderfully for the first 5-6 years. From 2002 through about 2007/2008, it was awesome and still meaningful. The random face-offs at the Rumble or SummerSlam and the "dream matches" you can now incubate for WrestleMania every year. Once they started bleeding over and they did that "RAW SuperShow" shit, it was pointless.

I'd have the 3 "World Titles" (WWE World Heavyweight Champ, Women's World Champ, and World Tag Champs) rotate among the brands. Build it up to where those 3 champions are a big fucking deal. Make the IC title RAW only and the US Title SD! only. The IC/US Champion is the de facto "top dog" on their brand when the WHC isn't there. Then, I'd bring back the Hardcore Championship and European Championship to give the lower card guys something meaningful to fight for and build feuds around. Dean Ambrose going on a long run as the "Hardcore Champion" or Cesaro as the European Champion and building it up to be meaningful. Those undercard titles were pretty good in the Attitude Era for giving those lower card guys something to do. Build up the prestige with an Ambrose or Cesaro and then have them drop them to an up-and-comer who will put on good matches and build storylines where every level of the card matters and has something to fight for.

Shane can say he wants to bring back the title he fought for at WrestleMania years ago. The same title held by the likes of Triple H, Shawn Michaels, Owen Hart, Chris Jericho, British Bulldog, William Regal, Kurt Angle, and Eddie Guerrero! With all the European wrestlers in WWE now, they could easily make it a huge point of pride like the U.S. Title and make a big deal out of it and have it main event a SD! in London.

The Hardcore Championship would be awesome for your more intense guys like Ambrose, Owens, and these other guys who could really go all-out with their acrobatics and innovative moves on the outside. Keep it serious and avoid the gimmicky stuff and overly choreographed brawls in the backstage area. It doesn't have to be a bloodbath every week, but a title that builds up guys who are badasses and get that aura around them.


You can't tell me you wouldn't have the biggest boner since HHH's entrance at WrestleMania this year to this card:

WWE SummerSlam 2016 (4 Hour Main Show, 1 Hour Pre-Show)
World Heavyweight Championship: Roman Reigns (c) vs Brock Lesnar
World Women's Championship: Charlotte (c) vs Sasha Banks
World Tag Team Championship: The New Day (c) vs Enzo & Big Cass
World Heavyweight Title #1 Contender's Match: Chris Jericho vs Sami Zayn
(RAW) Intercontinental Championship: The Miz (c) vs John Cena
(SD!) United States Championship: AJ Styles (c) vs Seth Rollins
Tag Title #1 Contender's Elimination Tornado Tables Match: The Dudley Boys vs The Club
(RAW) Hardcore Championship Tournament Finals: Dean Ambrose vs Kevin Owens
(SD!) European Championship Tournament Finals: Finn Balor vs Cesaro
Women's Title #1 Contender's Match: Bayley vs Paige vs Asuka
Pre-Show Hardcore Championship #1 Contender's Match: Sheamus vs Samoa Joe
Pre-Show European Championship #1 Contender's Match: Rusev vs Dolph Ziggler

That'd be better than WrestleMania and each match would matter.

EDIT: William Regal would make a good GM for SD! if they are going to overhaul NXT.
Last edited by James Steele; 05-27-2016 at 12:04 AM.
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Old 05-26-2016, 11:59 PM   #110
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Dudley Boys vs. The Club just gave me wood.
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:01 AM   #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smelly Meatball View Post
Some more stuff from the Observer recently includes Vince McMahon currently rumored to be getting more hands-on with Smackdown once it goes live which hasn't happened in years. Cena confirmed as the top star for Smackdown and Reigns for RAW. Also already confirmed the WWE has plans in set for the debut of a new World belt and several storylines/feuds already in waiting for the belt.

Similar to the first Draft Lottery, current plan is for the majority (if not all) of the wrestlers to not be told where they will be heading until their actual draft pick announcement during the upcoming RAW draft show.
Has a date been set for the draft show? (sry if this has already been mentioned)
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:07 AM   #112
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Current plan is on July 11th according to Bryan Alvarez from F4W.
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:09 AM   #113
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Dudley Boys vs. The Club just gave me wood.
Gallows turns on Anderson and pulls out a cut.
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Old 05-27-2016, 02:09 AM   #114
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Cena to SmackDown is a good move, actually. I'd put Cesaro there too, given that he has tremendous chemistry with Cena, and it gives smarks a reason to tune in to the show. If they call up Samoa Joe, and they should, then putting him on the same brand as Cena is desirable. This works, because I want Rusev and Joe on different shows, and I want Cena and Rusev on different shows. Given that you have Rusev as US Champion, this would mean the IC Champion to SmackDown -- so they get The Miz and Maryse. Orton and Cena should remain separate, as should Orton andd Sheamus, and Sheamus and Cena has not been done to death. Sheamus and Cesaro do great work together too.

I'd consider moving AJ Styles and Sasha Banks there too. Just to give them that added nudge of star power and to give people a reason to watch.

If you call up Joe to SmackDown and have Sheamus there too, it's probably best to call up Finn Balor to RAW. You can probably have him run wild with The Club over there. Becky and Finn are close, so why not let them keep hanging out, and it keeps the Irish presence strong on RAW? Sasha is also on SmackDown, so Becky would get a better chance on RAW. Call up Bayley for SmackDown, since her face character is so much different to Sasha's. Paige is then logical for RAW.

If you need another heel lady for SmackDown, why not call up Asuka? To give RAW a big Japanese name, bring up Shinsuke Nakamura to that brand. Kevin Owens and Sami Zayn would be a good fit to continue their feud on RAW, I feel. You don't want to have those four guys from the Fatal 4-Way on the same show anyway.

I'd like those shows. Obviously not complete, but you've got something looking like:

RAW:
Roman Reigns (WWE Champion)
Charlotte (Women's Champion)
The New Day (Tag Team Champions)
Rusev (US Champion)
Randy Orton
Kevin Owens
Sami Zayn
Shinsuke Nakamura
Finn Balor
Luke Gallows
Karl Anderson
Becky Lynch
Paige
Lana

SmackDown:
Roman Reigns (WWE Champion)
Charlotte (Women's Champion)
The New Day (Tag Team Champions
The Miz (IC Champion)
John Cena
AJ Styles
Cesaro
Sheamus
Samoa Joe
Sasha Banks
Bayley
Asuka

That's obviously with a lot of talent left to assign.
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Old 05-27-2016, 11:19 AM   #115
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Kill SD and make NXT the second show~~~
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:03 PM   #116
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So can we assume that Brock Lesnar will be a part of the actual draft?
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:03 PM   #117
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but not The Rock
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:06 PM   #118
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So can we assume that Brock Lesnar will be a part of the actual draft?
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but not The Rock
Could be a free agent like Austin was during the first brand split.
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Old 05-27-2016, 12:24 PM   #119
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oh thats a possibru
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Old 05-27-2016, 07:51 PM   #120
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Observer had a pretty good article about the new Brand Split and the likelihood this could end up failing like every other time the WWE has tried to boost Smackdown's image.

Third time within the past year and a half the WWE has tried to quickly boost Smackdown with the other two failing because the WWE eventually lost interest. Also the WWE running the risk of driving more viewers away if the top two stars (Cena and Reigns) are booked in a similar way.

Quote:
But this is the crucial point that much of the more excitable commentary has missed – the brand extension/split is a move made out of weakness. Unlike when they first divided the roster in 2002 due to the belief that such differentiation may help attract different audiences, the WWE already has NXT to appease the hardcore audience. Instead, this is simply about better organising the current product to maximise the amount of programming current WWE fans will watch.
Quote:
The best proof of that is the news in this week’s Wrestling Observer Newsletter that John Cena will be the face of whichever brand does not have Roman Reigns, likely to stay on Raw. If we were to assume that the WWE’s objective is to create a ‘sports entertainment’ and a ‘wrestling’ brand, this is the worst possible thing they could do as both men anger and annoy the same young male/hardcore fan demographic they want to increase. It would be next to impossible to claim that a Smackdown led by Cena has a different philosophy to pro wrestling than a RAW show led by Reigns.
Implied Cena likely is only going to bring a temporary boost in Smackdown's ratings if bigger changes are not done with the brand.

Also implied this is WWE's final chance to improve things before the next tv contract talks happen in a couple of years.

http://www.f4wonline.com/wwe-news/ho...d-split-213516
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