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Old 01-17-2010, 06:31 PM   #161
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That was basically already in my post.
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Old 01-17-2010, 06:32 PM   #162
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Eh
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Old 01-18-2010, 12:45 AM   #163
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Yeah, doesn't surprise me that Conan is going to bat for his staff. If I were NBC, I'd scrap Leno, because right now he is damaged goods, and let Conan go on for at least a little while. See how his ratings go for another season. This whole incident has caused so much good-will towards O'Brien, that I think he may have made some permanent fans.
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Old 01-18-2010, 07:57 AM   #164
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I like how his peers call him very intelligent and educated and even though he seems silly most of the time I think he did go to Harvard.
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Old 01-18-2010, 08:39 AM   #165
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The moment Conan starts talking about something seriously, you can tell what an intelligent, humble and kind man he really is. He's the offspring of a lawyer and a doctor; graduated high school valedictorian, and left Harvard as magna cum laudi in literature and history. Double-checking this on Wikipedia, I find that when he was serving the Harvard Lampoon as its president, the rival magazine, The Harvard Crimson, was being headed by current NBC President, and one of the main forces behind Conan's departure from NBC, Jeff Zucker.

Old grudge?
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Old 01-18-2010, 09:11 AM   #166
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Read somewhere else that Zucker also had Conan arrested right in front of him because him and the guys at the Harvard Lampoon went around picking up copies of the Harvard Crimson. Also the Crimson posted up Zucker's number for some sort of sexual ad or something, don't remember exactly and too lazy to find it again.

So yeah, I'd say there's a pretty hardcore grudge there
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Old 01-18-2010, 09:52 AM   #167
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Hahahaha, that is an amazing "coincidence."
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Old 01-18-2010, 03:14 PM   #168
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I think the reason why Letterman is pissed is because he is still bitter over losing The Tonight Show. He also knows when Jay comes back, he'll be bringing in the ratings again.

I think in due time, this will all just be a bad memory, but things will go back to the way they use to be. Jay will be making jokes about all this again one day when he finally retires, and another host takes over, but before then, people will forget all this hopefully. NBC wants $$$$, and ratings, and they want it now. They had no other choices back in the 90's when they gave Jay time to make the show a hit, but they had options this time, and waiting two years or more for Conan to get his act together is not doing smart business in my view.
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Old 01-18-2010, 05:33 PM   #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zeeboe View Post
I think the reason why Letterman is pissed is because he is still bitter over losing The Tonight Show. He also knows when Jay comes back, he'll be bringing in the ratings again.

I think in due time, this will all just be a bad memory, but things will go back to the way they use to be. Jay will be making jokes about all this again one day when he finally retires, and another host takes over, but before then, people will forget all this hopefully. NBC wants $$$$, and ratings, and they want it now. They had no other choices back in the 90's when they gave Jay time to make the show a hit, but they had options this time, and waiting two years or more for Conan to get his act together is not doing smart business in my view.
Actually, they did have an option back in the 90's. They were reportedly considering replacing Leno with Letterman just a few months into Leno's stint. Letterman had received a $16 million offer from CBS, and NBC had to decide which horse they wanted to back. NBC eventually chose Leno, but Letterman kicked his ass for a good while. This only changed when Leno did something huge and had the interview with Hugh Grant.

Leno is no longer the brilliant strategist that he was. He got destroyed by Jimmy Kimmel on his own show. He has delusions about himself, as you can infer from his speech about "being no Carson" but then doing the opposite of what he said he would, anyway. Also, Leno has been able to build no momentum in this thing. His ratings are down which are not a good sign right now with all the attention floating around his name.

I'm sure Letterman is still bitter, but why shouldn't he be? He was Johnny Carson's picked replacement. He had served NBC for years before. He gave Leno the platform Leno needed to get himself out there a lot more than what he was. It's easy to perceive how Leno swooping in out of nowhere to take the show would infuriate Letterman.
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Old 01-18-2010, 05:42 PM   #170
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Leno isn't going to be some magical fix for NBC. I don't think he's going to be pulling in the same numbers he was last year, as he more competition and other issues when he goes back to 11:30.

George Lopez is pulling in decent numbers at 11, Jimmy Kimmel's ratings are increasing, and Jay isn't going to have a good prime time lead in for a while... not to mention he's come out looking like a bit of a douche.
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Old 01-18-2010, 06:08 PM   #171
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I think a lot of people never gave Leno a real chance, but once they saw him when Hugh Grant was on there, they realized Leno was funny.

In regards of Carson/Letterman - It was NBC's show, not Carson's, and NBC was, and still is trying to target the younger audience, and Jay brought in younger viewers at that time. I'm not sure if he is now, but back then, Jay was the guy younger people wanted to watch.

This is just an opinion, but Letterman has always had an old people vibe to his CBS show. I watch his show sometimes, and for years, I seriously feel like I'm back at my grandparent's house.

And with nothing but the highest respect to Johnny Carson, towards the end, his show was a Grandma and Grandpa show, which is why NBC kept hinting for him to retire.

I don't wanna come across as bias, but since I was a kid, I felt Jay's show had that young vibe to it. Maybe because the lighting on his show is darker, and it gives it a nightclub vibe to it, and even the colors are nightclubish colors. Whereas Letterman's lighting is all big and bright, like a bingo hall....

....Plus, Jay has Kevin and his mostly all black band, and black people (no matter how old they are) are rad.
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Old 01-18-2010, 10:15 PM   #172
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Watching Leno as I type this. He is addressing this issue right now, and telling his entire side of the story. I hope it shows up on AOL news, You Tube, and everywhere else on the web so others can see.
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Old 01-18-2010, 10:18 PM   #173
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I believe the person that might end up learning and benefiting the most from this whole debacle from NBC might be Fallon or whoever NBC sets as the #2 guy.

Once Leno decides to retire again, whoever is the #2 person probably wants to ironclad the Tonight Show contract to prevent Leno or NBC from going back on their promise/deal. Although if Leno was able to go back a 3rd time, it might end up killing the Tonight Show in the long term since nobody will want to work NBC if they are not guaranteed to develop their time on the Tonight Show.
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Old 01-18-2010, 10:18 PM   #174
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You can definitely trust Jay Leno's side.
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Old 01-18-2010, 10:24 PM   #175
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You can definitely trust Jay Leno's side.
He pretty much told the truth. In my view, when stuff like this happen, you need a scapegoat, and Leno was the perfect one since he is pretty much getting the gold. It's like people just wanna cheer, and feel bad for the ones who lose.
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Old 01-18-2010, 10:27 PM   #176
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None of this would have happened if Leno would have retired like he said he was going to.
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Old 01-18-2010, 10:40 PM   #177
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None of this would have happened if Leno would have retired like he said he was going to.
NBC wouldn't let him. He was under contract, and they would not let him go elsewhere. Plus, they felt he still brought in ratings, and thought he could help.
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Old 01-18-2010, 10:42 PM   #178
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Wasn't there talk of him going over to FOX or ABC? I don't think he was under contract
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Old 01-18-2010, 10:46 PM   #179
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Wasn't there talk of him going over to FOX or ABC? I don't think he was under contract
He said on his show a while ago that he was under contract with NBC for like another year, and he was asked to stay. He agreed to help NBC, Conan, as well as all the people on his staff so they could stay employed.

He's also said he and Conan have spoken, and have no issues with one another.
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Old 01-19-2010, 01:58 AM   #180
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Leno's take:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Leno
“I thought maybe I should address this — at least give you my view of what has been going on here at NBC. Oh, let’s start in 2004 — 2004, I’m sitting in my office, an NBC executive comes in and says to me, ‘Listen, Conan O’Brien has gotten offers from other networks. We don’t want him to go, so we’re going to give him The Tonight Show.’ I said, ‘Well, I’ve been No. 1 for 12 years.’ They said, ‘We know that, but we don’t think you can sustain that.’ I said, ‘Okay. How about until I fall to No. 2, then you fire me?’ ‘No, we made this decision.’ I said, ‘That’s fine.’ Don’t blame Conan O’Brien. Nice guy, good family guy, great guy. He and I have talked, and not a problem since then. That’s what managers and people do; they try to get something for their clients. I said, ‘I’ll retire, just to avoid what happened the last time.’ Okay.

“So time goes by, and we stay No. 1 up until the day we leave. We hand… [applause here] No, no. Okay, but I’m leaving before my contract is out. About six to eight months early. So before I could go anywhere else — I would be at least a year or 18 months before I could go and do a show somewhere else. I said to NBC, ‘Would you release me from my contract.’ They said, ‘We want to keep you here.’ Okay. What are your ideas? They said, ‘How about prime time?’ I said, ‘That will never work.’ ‘No, no, we want to put you on at 10:00. We have done focus groups. People will love you at 10:00. Look at these studies showing Jay’s chin at 10:00. People will go crazy.’ Didn’t seem like a good idea at the time. I said, ‘All right, can I keep my staff?’ There are 175 people that work here. I said, ‘Can I keep my staff?’ ‘Yes, you can. Let’s try it. We guarantee you two years on the air, guaranteed. Now for the first four or five months against original shows like CSI, you’ll get killed, but in the spring and summer when the reruns come, that’s when you’ll pick up.’ Okay, great. I agree to that.

“Four months go by; we don’t make it. Meanwhile, Conan’s show during the summer — we’re not on — was not doing well. The great hope was that we would help him. Well, we didn’t help him any, okay. They come and go, ‘This show isn’t working. We want to let you go.’ ‘Can you let me out of my contract?’ ‘No, you’re still a valuable asset to this company.’ ‘How valuable can I be? You fired me twice. How valuable can I be?’ Okay. So then, the affiliates are not happy. The affiliates are the ones that own the TV stations. They’re the ones that sort of make the decisions; they’re not happy with your performance and Conan is not doing well at 11:30. I said, ‘What’s your idea?’ They said, ‘Well, look, how about you do a half-hour show at 11:30?’ Now, where I come from, when your boss gives you a job and you don’t do it well… I think we did a good job here, but we didn’t’ get the ratings, so you get humbled. I said, ‘Okay, I’m not crazy about doing a half hour, but okay. What do you want to do with Conan?’ ‘We’ll put him on at midnight, or 12:05, keeps The Tonight Show, does all that, he gets the whole hour.’ I said, ‘Okay. You think Conan will go for that?’ ‘Yes, yes. [laughter from the audience] Almost guarantee you.’ I said okay. Shake hands, that’s it. I don’t have a manager, I don’t have an agent, that’s my handshake deal.

“Next thing I see, Conan has a story in the paper saying he doesn’t want to do that. They come back to me and they say, ‘If he decides to walk and doesn’t want to do it, do you want the show back?’ I go, ‘Yeah, I’ll take the show back. If that’s what he wants to do. This way, we keep our people working, fine.’ So that’s pretty much where we are. It looks like we might be back at 11:30; I’m not sure. I don’t know. [applause] I don’t know. But through all of this — through all of this, Conan O’Brien has been a gentleman. He’s a good guy. I have no animosity towards him. This is all business. If you don’t get the ratings, they take you off the air. I think you know this town, you can do almost anything. You get ratings, they keep you. I don’t get ratings; he wants. That was NBC’s solution. It didn’t work, so we might have an answer for you tomorrow. So, we’ll see. That’s basically where it is.”
Much as I think Leno is horrendously unfunny, I'm much more inclined to blame NBC for this fiasco than him, even before that statement.
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Old 01-19-2010, 02:59 AM   #181
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NBC is completely lacking any long term thinking in this mess. They went with the cheap short-term route with Leno's new show and then panicked once their plan backfired with Letterman regaining #1 spot and Leno costing them money.

Instead of doing the logical thinking of fixing the show that is causing the problem and hope it acts like a trickle effect to the following shows, they decide to get rid of Conan's 11:30 time and hope things go back to the old way.
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Old 01-19-2010, 09:07 AM   #182
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Tried to post the full clip from AOL, but nada, so here is the link that will take you to the clip.

http://www.popeater.com/2010/01/18/j...onan-obrien%2F

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Old 01-19-2010, 07:19 PM   #183
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Leno should just tell NBC he's not going to do a 30 minute show or the Tonight Show.
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Old 01-19-2010, 07:47 PM   #184
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Leno should just tell NBC he's not going to do a 30 minute show or the Tonight Show.
He's under contract. He pretty much has to do what they say, or he could get sued.
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Old 01-19-2010, 10:25 PM   #185
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Yeah, but before they were violating HIS contract with the move. If it bothered him so much he could've just said no, but instead he went and reworked his contract. Regardless, can't blame Leno for this, but he did have a choice
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Old 01-20-2010, 12:14 AM   #186
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rofl @ NORM MACDONALD showing up on Conan tonight
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Old 01-20-2010, 12:46 AM   #187
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whatm what happened
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Old 01-20-2010, 01:51 AM   #188
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Dunno at the end of the monologue Conan was like "And I have just been told we have an old friend who will be dropping by in the next segment so stay tuned..." and I was like hmmm HOPE it is Norm MAcdonald

And then in the next segment NORM came out with a fruit basket. And he was like "oh well I uh got you this in June but forgot to bring it with me, so I figured I would drop it off now.."

And then he read the "card" attached to the gift basket and it was all hilarious stuff congratulating Conan on the show and how NBC was so smart for giving it to him and how we looked forward to seeing the show on forever and stuff. Dunno when Norm reads it all it is hilarious.
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Old 01-20-2010, 04:47 AM   #189
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27CDB6E-AE6D-11cf-96B8-444553540000" width="480" height="418" id="VideoPlayerLg43773">
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Old 01-20-2010, 07:08 AM   #190
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awesome
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Old 01-20-2010, 10:58 AM   #191
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NORM is hilarious. Conan has also been on fire since this whole thing started. When he's pissed off, he just goes all-out, and it's reminiscent of Late Night Conan (who was much more lively).

I'm still not inclined to completely take my suspicions off Jay Leno. While NBC are no doubt the biggest idiots in this mess, Leno's story is not really consistent. Everything I have seen has led me to believe that Leno did not really want to give up The Tonight Show when he did, and when 2009 did come along, he wasn't as passive about things as he makes out. Leno sort of gave NBC (whether he "threatened" them or not) an ultimatum -- I'm going to be working for you or I am going to be working elsewhere. NBC (perhaps foolishly) said "for us."

I mean, if Leno was still under contract, he would have still been getting paid, right? He wanted to be on the air. That's not a bad thing, per se, but it did put NBC in a bit of a panic. They knew he would be going elsewhere as soon as he could, and they didn't want the competition. Leno didn't want to sit-out of late night. That led to them trying him in prime time, and it didn't work. As a result, Conan is the one who got the shaft. Granted he didn't get the ratings, but it's easy to see why he didn't get the chance Leno did when he was getting killed by Letterman, and didn't have Carson still floating around.

Leno should have opened his mouth back in 2004. He should have said "no," and then NBC would have chosen right there and then between Leno and Conan. Leno jumped through certain hoops, and it made a huge mess. I guess he's only human. If one that knows how to play politics.

What's sad, is that Conan O'Brien has been quite dominant against both Leno and Letterman recently. Granted, it is because most people know that his show is ending. But they also know the same thing about Leno in prime time. Right now, Conan is the "hot" act in late night, and in seven months he's turned things around (for a time) on Letterman -- which is something Leno took years to do. Reports indicate a drastic growth for Conan's audience each night, too. It's not just one spike. If NBC plays this out a little longer, they could see how big they could get Conan and re-evaluate themselves. Releasing Conan while he is hot could also be a big mistake. Let the attention fade away, let his ratings drop again, and then Conan would be a "two-time failure." But right now, Conan would technically have to be considered the "King of Late Night."

They could give Jay Leno a show on Sunday in the meantime, or something. Not sure what NBC usually airs over there at that time, but over here, Rove McManus did quite well with a show that aired live on Sunday. People would actually really look forward to it as a way to relax before the coming week.
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Old 01-20-2010, 11:02 AM   #192
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This is from MTV. I'm not sure how reliable they are with their show-biz news:

Conan O'Brien and NBC were said to be close to a deal late last week to secure the host's exit from "The Tonight Show" after just seven months on the job, clearing the way for Jay Leno to return to the desk he occupied for 17 years.

Now it appears that those negotiations are bogged down over the issue of severance compensation for O'Brien's staff of nearly 200, many of whom moved from the East Coast to California when their boss took the "Tonight Show" gig.

Conan is "dug in on that," a source familiar with the talks told The Associated Press.

Earlier reports have offered conflicting versions of what was going on backstage at "Tonight." The New York Post reported that staff was disgruntled over possibility losing their jobs while O'Brien walked away with millions in compensation. Conan's manager hit back against such accusations, telling TheWrap.com that the host was intent on securing adequate payment for his staff.

In response the latest leaks regarding negotiations, NBC shot off a statement to the AP. "[I]t was Conan's decision to leave NBC that resulted in nearly 200 of his staffers being out of work," the statement read. "We have already agreed to pay millions of dollars to compensate every one of them. This latest posturing is nothing more than a PR ploy."

It seems like relations are going to get even nastier between the network and their soon-to-be-jettisoned top dog. Speaking of which, negotiations are also focused on whether or not O'Brien will be able to maintain the intellectual property rights to comedy bits like Triumph the Insult Comic Dog that he created during his NBC tenure, according to the AP.

Thus far, the proposed deal between the two sides would reportedly pay O'Brien more than $30 million dollars and allow him to start work on another network at early as this fall. The deal, however, is said to prevent Conan from attacking NBC in his jokes if and when he pops up on another network, perhaps Fox, as has been rumored.

On Tuesday's show, though, Conan was still addressing the late-night debacle head on and even referencing the possibility of skipping over to the rival network when he ticked off a list of ways to keep himself occupied once he leaves his show. "Make a big move to Fox," he said. "Megan Fox."
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Old 01-20-2010, 04:57 PM   #193
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Hopefully this will clear some things up

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Old 01-20-2010, 04:59 PM   #194
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Apparently all that is now dividing the split between Conan and NBC is an additional $600,000 for his 200 staff. NBC is just going to lose that money elsewhere, I don't see why they don't just humour CoCo.
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Old 01-20-2010, 11:17 PM   #195
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I hate Jay Leno so I've decided that this is all his fault.
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Old 01-21-2010, 12:08 AM   #196
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I think a lot of people never gave Leno a real chance, but once they saw him when Hugh Grant was on there, they realized Leno was funny.

In regards of Carson/Letterman - It was NBC's show, not Carson's, and NBC was, and still is trying to target the younger audience, and Jay brought in younger viewers at that time. I'm not sure if he is now, but back then, Jay was the guy younger people wanted to watch.

This is just an opinion, but Letterman has always had an old people vibe to his CBS show. I watch his show sometimes, and for years, I seriously feel like I'm back at my grandparent's house.

And with nothing but the highest respect to Johnny Carson, towards the end, his show was a Grandma and Grandpa show, which is why NBC kept hinting for him to retire.

I don't wanna come across as bias, but since I was a kid, I felt Jay's show had that young vibe to it. Maybe because the lighting on his show is darker, and it gives it a nightclub vibe to it, and even the colors are nightclubish colors. Whereas Letterman's lighting is all big and bright, like a bingo hall....

....Plus, Jay has Kevin and his mostly all black band, and black people (no matter how old they are) are rad.
I do not believe that Jay Leno is a funny person. His show may be funny, and he may write decently "funny" one liners for the monologue, but he's not funny. You can see it in his interviews, he never adds anything to the conversation. He has no persona to work with. Conan and Letterman are funny at all times, even outside the monologue.

Like I don't think he is funny just hanging out, probably a normal guy

I get the feeling that both Conan and Letterman would be very funny irl
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Old 01-21-2010, 12:21 AM   #197
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Old 01-21-2010, 12:34 AM   #198
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That was great, but the 1.5 million dollar sketch was amazing.
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Old 01-21-2010, 12:44 AM   #199
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So fucking glad I don't watch late night. What a shitstorm.
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Old 01-21-2010, 03:57 AM   #200
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That was great, but the 1.5 million dollar sketch was amazing.
That was fuckign amazing and halarious.
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