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Old 10-27-2014, 04:09 AM   #1
hb2k
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The Trial Of Eric Bischoff (Podcast Question)

So, for this week's Squared Circle Gazette Radio, we're returning to our "Court Case" format that we did in the past for one of our most popular shows (The Trial of Triple H), and this time putting Eric Bischoff under the gun.

We have a prosecution, a defence and judge in place - the charge against Bischoff is that he's the person most responsible for the death of WCW (via malpractice and negligence). So in terms of feedback it's simple - where do you stand on that specific question, and on what grounds?

As always, the best feedback will be read on the show and become part of the debate. So whaddya think - is Bischoff most responsible?




Now on iTunes!
https://itunes.apple.com/gb/podcast/...io/id892060223

Latest episode October 25th - Was The Invasion Doomed To Fail?
http://squaredcirclegazette.podbean....omedToFail.mp3
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Old 10-27-2014, 05:44 AM   #2
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Considering that the only reason WCW died is because Bischoff couldnt get a time slot and at the time of its collapse its ratings were still strong compared to other cable programming the only answer is no...

The only blame is at the AoL merger...short debate...go team!
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Old 10-27-2014, 06:33 AM   #3
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The logo change. That's when WCW (wCw) died.
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Old 10-27-2014, 07:01 AM   #4
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I'm on the prosecution for this one, so it's a challenge, but putting the blame on the merger is so bogus.
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Old 10-27-2014, 08:01 AM   #5
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Kevin Sullivan's role in the whole thing went unnoticed IMO, 14 of their top guys asked for their release because of him, and of course The Radicalz got theirs.
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Old 10-27-2014, 08:18 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hb2k View Post
I'm on the prosecution for this one, so it's a challenge, but putting the blame on the merger is so bogus.
No its a legitimate fact. Had they been willing to keep it on air WCW would have stayed around. I dont think you realize what the average TV draws in a week. The show was doing very well, they just didnt want thew stigma of a "rasslin" show.
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Old 10-27-2014, 08:27 AM   #7
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Kevin Sullivan's role in the whole thing went unnoticed IMO, 14 of their top guys asked for their release because of him, and of course The Radicalz got theirs.
I'm missing something here. Care to elaborate?
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Old 10-27-2014, 10:12 AM   #8
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Kevin Sullivan was heading a committee that took the book over from Russo in January of 2000. Benoit didn't want any part of that, with the whole Woman thing. He and others saw the writing on the wall and asked for their releases, which they got.
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Old 10-27-2014, 01:50 PM   #9
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Right. the TNT director that cancelled nitro did it not at all based on profit/loss of WCW it did it because it didnt want Wrestling in its network.
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Old 10-27-2014, 02:23 PM   #10
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Right. the TNT director that cancelled nitro did it not at all based on profit/loss of WCW it did it because it didnt want Wrestling in its network.
Exactly. Its too easy, and if they still were drawing $250 million of revenue like they did in 98, with ratings that high, I find it hard to believe they'd want them off the network.
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Old 10-27-2014, 03:38 PM   #11
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Disagree. Would argue Hogan or the AOL-Time Warner merger were bigger reasons in the end. Hogan mostly because of the vast amount of politicking he did while the merger eventually lead to a new boss at the time who wanted nothing to do with wrestling.

Bischoff's main problems were relying way too much on the nWo storyline and wanting to spend his way out of any situation (good or bad) than develop things for the long term. He did help kill off WCW but wasn't the main guy responsible.
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Old 10-27-2014, 03:45 PM   #12
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Exactly. Its too easy, and if they still were drawing $250 million of revenue like they did in 98, with ratings that high, I find it hard to believe they'd want them off the network.
Wasn't that same money burning up as fast as they made it?
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Old 10-27-2014, 04:43 PM   #13
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Firstly, I just listened to your "Was the Invasion doomed to Fail" podcast, and thoroughly enjoyed it. Never caught you guys before, but will now download each episode. Great work.

On topic now, with Bischoff, I'm not sure what else he was supposed to do. He was tasked with making WCW compete with a juggernaut. The only way he could do that is to sign top guys with what he believed was a blank cheque book. In order to make them come, he had to promise guaranteed, mega-bucks contracts and also give creative control. He had to do that to sign them, and with those guys came egos and baggage. To compete, he needed them, and he needed them happy and had to pander to their needs, to the detriment to the rest of his business.

Had Eric's brief been to create a stable, financially well run company, creating stars and becoming sustainable, I am sure that he would have done so, but that was not his brief. Ted wanted to compete, nothing more. We see it in other sports teams who sink cash into trying to compete and then self imploding later.

Had Eric been given time (I believe WCW had been burning through bookers and executives, so he must have felt pressured) he would have been able to take it much slower.
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Old 10-27-2014, 05:38 PM   #14
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1997 Marlins. They won it all and then fell off the face of the planet.
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Old 10-27-2014, 07:06 PM   #15
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Completely off-topic, but I just wanted to say that upon reading the thread title, I thought this was about the RAW "trial" in December 2005 which eventually culminated in his termination from WWE.
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Old 10-27-2014, 07:13 PM   #16
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You are not alone. I thought so too and thought it was such a random thread.
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Old 10-27-2014, 07:14 PM   #17
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Also seems like each of your so called topics are just gutter trash thoughts from a smarks head on the wrestlecrap forums. Is next weeks episode about cm punk having nuclear heat?
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Old 10-27-2014, 07:16 PM   #18
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I will say no, definitely not.
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Old 10-27-2014, 07:22 PM   #19
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Is it about Sid shitting his pants?
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Old 10-27-2014, 10:44 PM   #20
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Was it Eric Bischoff's idea to put the WCW Title on David Arquette? If no, I say 'Not Guilty.'

He's guilty of being an accessory, but the gun wasn't in his hand. His mistakes were, in no particular order:
  • He created a killer storyline that he didn't know how to end.
  • He was about the only guy who didn't see potential in Steve Austin
  • Kept people in a predetermined 'spot' with no regard to what they were doing or capable of.
  • Pushing Ernest Miller over much more deserving talent
  • Blood Runs Cold
  • Allowing himself to be run over by the likes of Hogan, Nash, etc.
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Old 10-28-2014, 12:22 AM   #21
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No he is prob one of the least responsible
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Old 10-28-2014, 04:06 AM   #22
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I still say not guilty. He made Raw up their game by making WCW more than a southern-regional company. WCWs other managment ruined it by not having a great business structure. Bischoff made a great story but nobody knew how to capitalize on it.

AOL Time Warner killed WCW not Bischoff. The money from the PPVs going to Turner Home Entertainment and not WCW killed WCW. The merchandising department not knowing that the nWo doesn't work for them killed WCW. Ted Turner wanting another prime time show killed WCW. So many things killed WCW but none were really Bischoff's fault when you actually take an objective look at it.

If the WWE had the idea of the nWo they would all be billionaires right now. They had the structure to make something great but WCW didn't. Don't think it was Bischoffs job to handle everything like that. He just produced the TV.
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Old 10-28-2014, 08:25 AM   #23
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Lol come on. Blood runs cold cost not money, wasn't that big of a story, didn't last long, was over during their run at the top, and actually drew some fans in.

Dafuq?
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Old 10-28-2014, 09:42 AM   #24
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I wonder how much the 6 months of Glacier introductory promos cost.
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Old 10-28-2014, 06:08 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vastardikai View Post
I wonder how much the 6 months of Glacier introductory promos cost.
Not sure about debut hype stuff but it did cost WCW around $500,000 for his debut month and a big reason why almost everything for his entrance got axed very quickly.

Think the Death of WCW book revealed what the final cost for his push ended up being.
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Old 10-28-2014, 08:03 PM   #26
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lol Glacier what a waste
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Old 10-28-2014, 09:00 PM   #27
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WCW was dead in the water regardless of what Bischoff did. They created basically a shooting star. It was going to be beautiful and burn bright for a short period of time, but eventually it was going to die out. It was a television network that had a wrestling show vs a company whose sole focus was wrestling. WCW was basically Seinfeld and the WWE was ESPN.

Last edited by Bad News Gertner; Yesterday at 09:07 PM.
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Old 10-28-2014, 09:01 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by MatthewAllenHanso View Post
Also seems like each of your so called topics are just gutter trash thoughts from a smarks head on the wrestlecrap forums. Is next weeks episode about cm punk having nuclear heat?
I listen to their show frequently and everyone knows how much I hate snobby smarks. It's actually a good listen.
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Old 10-28-2014, 09:26 PM   #29
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If WCW had been making money in 2001 like they were a few years prior AOL/TW wouldn't have cancelled it. WCW had run for years under people who didn't care for wrestling at all but kept it running because of the money it made. AOL/TW made the final decision but other people made it the right one at that time.

As far as whether Bischoff killed it, really the answer is no. He injected life into a languishing product and wasn't able to sustain that new life long-term. His only ideas involved bringing in recognized talent, and when he ran out of said talent he had nothing left. The only lasting stars that were truly made after Bischoff took the reins were Goldberg, who's success and popularity were largely a fluke, and DDP, who dragged himself up into that spot with the help of a few friends despite management's objections. Booker T and Scott Steiner simply got popularity boosts after years of being successful tag team guys and gained main event status due to a vacuum above them, and Jarrett during his World Title reigns was no more a star than he was as WWF Intercontinental Champion. Whoever decided to give Bischoff as much free run as they did, and whoever decided that the likes of Russo and Ferrara could put on an A+ show are really the ones to blame. You don't blame a bunch of monkeys for throwing their shit around the Lourve if you set them free in it.

Also Goldberg fucking killed off the nWo return angle following the Fingerpoke of Doom by trying to put his hand through a fucking windshield. What a complete ass. WCW might have had a chance if that hadn't happened.
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Old 10-28-2014, 09:26 PM   #30
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Quote:
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I wonder how much the 6 months of Glacier introductory promos cost.
Roughly the gross national product of Nicaragua, El Salvador, and Panama combined.
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Old 10-28-2014, 09:27 PM   #31
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Oh yeah and thanks for the mention on the last show.
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Old 10-29-2014, 10:00 PM   #32
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Bischoff was obviously a really smart and ambitious guy who capitalized on a few lucky bounces and helped make something special. He's also an ass and made some bad decisions. I think he's done very well for himself if you look at his body of work, but he definitely at the very least contributed greatly to the downfall of the company. McMahon has done smart things to help build the business and has also almost killed the business with some god awful decisions, he just won at the end of the day.
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Old Yesterday, 02:57 PM   #33
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I had never listened to this 'cast before today. I'm now up to episode 5. This is tremendous. Nicely done!
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Old Yesterday, 03:09 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gorgeous Dale Newstead View Post
Bischoff was obviously a really smart and ambitious guy who capitalized on a few lucky bounces and helped make something special. He's also an ass and made some bad decisions. I think he's done very well for himself if you look at his body of work, but he definitely at the very least contributed greatly to the downfall of the company. McMahon has done smart things to help build the business and has also almost killed the business with some god awful decisions, he just won at the end of the day.
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Old Yesterday, 03:17 PM   #35
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of course he's not. Without getting into who was responsible for the majority of the downfall (something I also don't think Bischoff can be blamed for), never mind the ultimate demise, the simple fact is there was an agreed deal by all parties and papers signed for Bischoff and his investors to buy WCW. Bischoff goes off on a family holiday knowing his life is about to become hectic running a full time wrestling company again and Time Warner pull the rug out by taking all wrestling programming off the air rendering the deal worthless. These events alone show Bischoff obviously isn't the most responsible. "WCW" killed WCW, "WCW" being the guys upstairs with all of the real power. Fuck, Bischoff was the only one trying to save WCW.
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