Vince McMahon on TNA: "I don’t think that’s what the culture wants these days"

[Xero]

http://www.acorn-online.com/joomla15/arts/features/53533-after-26-years-wrestlemania-is-still-special-to-wwe-owner.html

One of the biggest days on the sports entertainment calendar arrives Sunday, March 28, when Wrestlemania XXVI takes place before a packed University of Phoenix Stadium. It will be watched by millions more on pay-per-view.

And when the World Wrestling Entertainment (WWE) invades Glendale, Ariz., the biggest feuds of the year will culminate on the grandest stage of them all. Not only is John Cena challenging Batista for the WWE Championship and Chris Jericho is putting his World Championship on the line against Edge, but the Undertaker is betting his legendary Wrestlemania undefeated streak against Shawn Michaels’ career in a rematch of last year’s classic match, and those are just some of the highlights of a star-studded card.

The excitement around this special event doesn’t end with the fan, it extends all the way up to the company’s owner, Greenwich resident Vince McMahon.

“There’s an extra amount of excitement,” Mr. McMahon said. “It’s the culmination to a year of buildup for us. ...Wrestlemania was the first pay-per-view we did on a national basis and to be able to do it, we literally risked everything we owned. So every Wrestlemania is special. To us it’s like the Oscars or the Grammys or the World Series or the Super Bowl.”

The story surrounding the first Wrestlemania, March 31, 1985 at Madison Square Garden, is nearly as legendary as the event itself. At a time when wrestling companies still held fast to the idea of regional territories, the McMahons were pushing their company toward a national presence. It was a risky venture and Mr. McMahon and his wife Linda literally staked ownership of the company on its success.

Ultimately, the marriage of pop culture to professional wrestling changed the industry’s landscape, allowing Wrestlemania to become a globally recognized event. Today you don’t even have to be a sports entertainment fan to know what Wrestlemania is.

“It has grown into everything I ever wanted it to be, but we’re still not there yet,” Mr. McMahon said. “There’s more that can be done, but it’s grown every year into something that people can’t miss.”

WWE has changed in the last few years and embraced a more family-friendly style for its weekly television shows. According to Mr. McMahon, the shift has allowed the company to grow and appeal to a more diverse audience, including women, who he says now make up 40% of the company’s audience, as well as the children who will make up the next generation of fans.

“At heart I think we’ve always been a bit of a family affair,” Mr. McMahon said. “If you look at the audience for our live events you will see fathers and sons and mothers and sons and brothers and sisters. This is something an entire family can go out and enjoy together. It’s a lot like baseball in that respect.”

The wrestling landscape itself has also changed in the last six months. For years WWE battled rival World Championship Wrestling (WCW) in what fans remember as the “Monday Night Wars” because both companies had programs going head to head Monday night. WWE decisively won the war in 2001 with the end of WCW, but this month Total Nonstop Action (TNA) moved its wrestling program to Monday nights directly against WWE’s flagship program RAW.

WWE isn’t sweating it though and the ratings have so far backed that confidence up, with millions more preferring WWE programming. Mr. McMahon even goes as far at to say TNA is “not competition.”

“We’re in different businesses,” Mr. McMahon said. “We’re in the entertainment business and they’re in the ‘pro wrasslin’ business. It’s different markets. When they moved to Monday nights they threw the kitchen sink at us and only did a fraction of our audience. It doesn’t speak well for the type of product they’re trying to present with the tawdry, blood-soaked action. I don’t think that’s what the culture wants these days.”

With the company producing movies, books, DVDs, monthly pay-per-views and hours of weekly television without any reruns, Mr. McMahon said WWE is more comparable to a company like Disney than to TNA.

“We’re woven into the fabric of Americana,” Mr. McMahon said.

But Mr. McMahon’s focus isn’t just on his company’s performance, since at this year’s Wrestlemania, he will be facing off against the legendary Bret “The Hitman” Hart in a match that has been building for nearly 13 years around real personal animosity Hart felt for his former boss. It’s not the first time Mr. McMahon has competed at Wrestlemania, but he is hoping it will be the last.

“It makes things more difficult,” Mr. McMahon admitted. “I really much more prefer working behind the scenes as a director and a producer than being part of the action. I do hope this will be my last time in the ring, but I say that after every match I’m in. I’m 64 years old and while I’m in great physical condition and I never want to say never, I really don’t want to do this again.”

However, he knows how long fans have been waiting to see The Hitman get his hands on the diabolical Mr. McMahon and he said his goal is to give the audience what it wants. Plus as one of his company’s biggest villains, Mr. McMahon loves the reaction he gets from the crowd.

“It’s an exciting feeling,” Mr. McMahon said. “When you get an audience to react to you the way the audience always does to the Mr. McMahon character, it’s one of the greatest feelings you can get as a performer and it’s a real shot of adrenaline. Whether it’s good or bad, you want that reaction. The only thing you don’t want is for the audience to just sit there and do nothing. That’s the death knell.”

Next year’s Wrestlemania is already set for Atlanta and Mr. McMahon admits that as soon as this year’s is over, people will begin looking ahead on the calendar.

“After a Wrestlemania someone always says, ‘Gee, that was great. How can you top it?’” Mr. McMahon said. “And the answer always is, ‘I don’t know how we can. But I do know that we will.’”

[The Jayman]

lol @ ‘pro wrasslin’ business

[kareru]

“We’re in the entertainment business and they’re in the ‘pro wrasslin’ business.

that just says it all right there

[Jordan]

Vince is cool. I'd like to hang out with him.

[BigDaddyCool]

Vince is right you know. TNA is compitition to WWE the way a baby bunny is compition to me in fight.

[Swiss Ultimate]

I once watched BDC slaughter a hundred baby bunnies just for a laugh.

I'm still crying inside.

[Xero]

At least they were delicious.

[Spaff]

Vince is right you know. TNA is compitition to WWE the way a baby bunny is compition to me in fight.

if its a spelling bee,my moneys on the bunny:kiss:

[AngryMidjit]

if its a spelling bee,my moneys on the bunny:kiss:

ahAhAHAHAHAHA

i also lol'd at WWE being compared to Disney

[Ermaximus]

So how long before Vinnie Mac buys out TNA and fires Hogan and Bischoff? Again!

[The Jayman]

i'd say never

[Xero]

Once TNA goes under Vince will buy the library for like $30 and make millions off it.

Still can't wait for "The Rise and Fall and Fall and Fall and Fall of TNA".

Then they'll hold TNA One Night Stand, featuring Hogan and Flair in the main event.

[The Jayman]

Still can't wait for "The Rise and Fall and Fall and Fall and Fall of TNA".

i will watch to see where this "rise" comes into play

[kareru]

i will watch to see where this "rise" comes into play

id class being the number 1 wrestling company in north america as 'rise'

[The Jayman]

id class being the number 1 wrestling company in north america as 'rise'

I know. I was kidding. calm down bro :D

[Xero]

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[Xero]

id class being the number 1 wrestling company in north america as 'rise'

lol not this shit again.

And CZW's #2...

[Volare]

Vinny Mac even knows that TNA is just WCW 2.0....hence TNWCW.

[kareru]

lol not this shit again.

And CZW's #2...

“We’re in the entertainment business and they’re in the ‘pro wrasslin’ business

[Xero]

To be fair, TNA's Sports Entertainment too.

Vince is just wrong on that statement.

[TheAdamEvansFan]

38,815 posts by XERO. Worthy resume material right there. This guy knows his wrestling. Everyone bow down.

[erickman]

i rember vince saying the same thing about ted turner

[Steveviscious89]

Forget about arguing over who's wrestling and who's not. What about Vince claiming that the culture doesn't want what TNA is doing? I mean, deep down all of us here just want a good show, and we seem to have times where we think neither one of them is any good. I mean usually when you watch a TV show and no longer like it, you quit watching it. With wrestling, we just kind of sit and wait for it to get better, and we've been waiting for nearly ten years IMO. Is Vince right in his claim? Something has to give at some point.

[Juan]

id class being the number 1 wrestling company in north america as 'rise'

lol get the fuck out of here

[St. Jimmy]

To be fair, TNA's Sports Entertainment too.

Vince is just wrong on that statement.


I see the Sport, where's the entertainment?

[TheAdamEvansFan]

Maybe it's watching old ass Ric Flair n Hogan try to wrestle, but completely botching the moves. Their guts are almost as large as their egos. I don't know whether to call the local Nursing home security and to inform of an outbreak/fight or to invade the ring and kick their ass for good.

[tjmidnight420]

.... I... um.... ok I got nothing....

OK trying again...
TNA doesn't fare well against the E, but to say that it's different businesses is just retarded... Wrestling and boxing are different businesses. Wrestling and MMA are different. Wrestling and sports entertainment? That's just Vince's way of avoiding being regulated...

[BigDaddyCool]

I once watched BDC slaughter a hundred baby bunnies just for a laugh.

I'm still crying inside.

I used a lawn mower.

Seriously though, my brother used to work as a lawn mower and slaughtered rabbits when mowing at a power plant with lots of unmowed grounds.

[HBPunk]

the E

THIS. SUCKS. Is TNA the A? Utter bollocks

[tjmidnight420]

THIS. SUCKS. Is TNA the A? Utter bollocks

There you go thinking again bro...
By Vince's own admission, and quoted in this very thread, WWE isn't in the "pro wrasslin" business. Note the second "W" in "WWE". Also worth noting that the "E" here stands for entertainment, the business he says he is in. See where I'm coming from? It's funny you've been registered here longer than me, and not only are you knocking the terms used here, you're trying to change them. GTFO if you can't be peaceable with the other posters here.

[HBPunk]

There you go thinking again bro...
By Vince's own admission, and quoted in this very thread, WWE isn't in the "pro wrasslin" business. Note the second "W" in "WWE". Also worth noting that the "E" here stands for entertainment, the business he says he is in. See where I'm coming from? It's funny you've been registered here longer than me, and not only are you knocking the terms used here, you're trying to change them. GTFO if you can't be peaceable with the other posters here.

You gave a nickname to something that is THREE letters long, you are a douche for this. Iv been registered here longer than you yes but i dont have to follow the crowd and accept any terms, most guys on here are utter nerds and computer geeks, as are you id imagine. hush now junior

[tjmidnight420]

You gave a nickname to something that is THREE letters long, you are a douche for this. Iv been registered here longer than you yes but i dont have to follow the crowd and accept any terms, most guys on here are utter nerds and computer geeks, as are you id imagine. hush now junior


bitch please....:foc:

I'm a nerd, and a computer geek. This is a wrestling forum. If you don't like what's said around here, feel free to delete your account and go join up with the WWE universe, you fucking mark.

[Juan]

You both should shut the fuck up.

[Xero]

38,815 posts by XERO. Worthy resume material right there. This guy knows his wrestling. Everyone bow down.

One of Adam Evan's only fans is his mother.

This is not an insult, just fact.

[HBPunk]

bitch please....:foc:

I'm a nerd, and a computer geek. This is a wrestling forum. If you don't like what's said around here, feel free to delete your account and go join up with the WWE universe, you fucking mark.

oh oh, doorbell tjmidnight420, its Aunt Flow. 420 my balls, that is all:kiss:

[Kane Knight]

that just says it all right there

Except it's really an artificial distinction.

And TNA's reslly still trying for "sports entertainment," even if they do have high fliers and blood.

[Xero]

Fliers and blood ARE Sports Entertainment.

[Wishbone]

this is why WWE fails IMO I mean they are a wrestling business even if they don't want to admit it yet they have almost no wrestling! That would be like Disney not making mindnumbing child sitcoms about crappy singers it goes against what your trying to sell. Sure TNA's not much better but atleast they admit to being a wrestling business even if they don't always deliver! Truthfully I don't think any current 'wrestling company' or 'sports entertainment company' is worth a damn atleast not compared to the WWF and WCW I grew up on.

[Swiss Ultimate]

I don't think the culture wants what TNA is dishing out. However, I think a lot of people would enjoy a more adult-oriented version of what the WWE is producing. TNA's product, however, doesn't deliver anything remotely as deep as ECW or as compelling as WWE.

:(

[SOCCER LEGS]

most of you are missing the point that mcmahon is driving at.

our culture is obsessed with pop culture. the WWE has been slowly and surely gaining more of a foothold into the mainstream. a couple examples of this are the celebrity guest hosts they've been having on RAW, and the WWE's expansion of the diva's division to make the show more appealing to women. the closer the WWE is to the vein of the mainstream, the more appealing the show is to the average person.

basically, Vince's vision of the WWE is a show that can keep the entire family entertained, rather than a show that is meant for pro wrestling fans.

[tjmidnight420]

most of you are missing the point that mcmahon is driving at.

our culture is obsessed with pop culture. the WWE has been slowly and surely gaining more of a foothold into the mainstream. a couple examples of this are the celebrity guest hosts they've been having on RAW, and the WWE's expansion of the diva's division to make the show more appealing to women. the closer the WWE is to the vein of the mainstream, the more appealing the show is to the average person.

basically, Vince's vision of the WWE is a show that can keep the entire family entertained, rather than a show that is meant for pro wrestling fans.

Decent post dude, props.

[KayfabeMan]

Vince comparing WWE to Disney?

Give me a fucking break.

Like WWE's programming is totally appropriate for children and families.

That and Walt Disney's worst day was still way better than Vince's best one.

[Xero]

I don't know, Mickey was kind of shoved down our throats for decades.

[KayfabeMan]

But his image works as a brand in itself.

That is identifiable by everyone in the world, and always will be.

John Cena - not so much.

[kareru]

and the way the donald had to put mickey over just plain sucked

[KayfabeMan]

Donald also hates Cena.

[dronepool]

To be fair, TNA's Sports Entertainment too.

Vince is just wrong on that statement.

Yeah, I don't get what's so different besides WWE's new friendlier tone. What makes TNA pro wrestling and WWE "sports entertainment"? WWE was doing the same shit as TNA in 1999 and they still called it sports entertainment.

[KayfabeMan]

Vince just wants everyone to believe there is actually 'entertainment' or 'sports' on his show; when, clearly, there is neither.

[kareru]

technically all pro wrestling is sports entertainment

[KayfabeMan]

And I love how Vince always uses 'wrasslin' as a derogatory term, when that's what his father promoted, and that's what all the companies in the 1970's / 80's who were making more than him promoted, and that's what WCW - the company who beat him for over a year straight in the ratings - promoted (for the most part, work with me here).

The guy has been a cancer to the actual wrestling business since he got into it.

Curse his father for having him.

[SOCCER LEGS]

Vince comparing WWE to Disney?

Give me a fucking break.

Like WWE's programming is totally appropriate for children and families.

That and Walt Disney's worst day was still way better than Vince's best one.

again, you're missing the point.


like Disney, the WWE provides entertainment through a number of different mediums: television shows, pay per views, monthly magazines, movie productions, record albums, on demand cable channel, clothing apparel, etc.

[dronepool]

Vince would bottle people's tears and sell it as bottled water if he could.

[KayfabeMan]

again, you're missing the point.


like Disney, the WWE provides entertainment through a number of different mediums: television shows, pay per views, monthly magazines, movie productions, record albums, on demand cable channel, clothing apparel, etc.

I got the point, I just didn't like the comparison to Disney itself.

Had he said Oprah, for example, I'd be fine with it.

[McLegend]

Kayfabeman you are the biggest WWE hater of all time.

You kinda sound like the bitter old man who thinks WWE ruined wrestling forever.

[KayfabeMan]

Thank You :)

[Johnny McNasty]

Vince with all due respect is losing his touch these days. He is out of the loop to what fans really want to see. He also doesn't have a son with a real passion for the business who has some fresh innovative ideas, and a finger on the pulse of WWE's audience ready to take over. Guess Triple H and Stephanie will have to do.

[Ermaximus]

This whole thread makes me laugh. Seriously.

[bostonbill41]

I don't think the culture wants what TNA is dishing out. However, I think a lot of people would enjoy a more adult-oriented version of what the WWE is producing. TNA's product, however, doesn't deliver anything remotely as deep as ECW or as compelling as WWE.

:(

It's interesting. I watch Raw and it seems more than half of it's "drama" than actual competition. I know alot of people can't stand Vince but give the devil his due, he's a great businessman.

And I'm sure the "kids" love those skimpy outfits the Divas wear, LOL

[RVDmark]

It's interesting. I watch Raw and it seems more than half of it's "drama" than actual competition. I know alot of people can't stand Vince but give the devil his due, he's a great businessman.

And I'm sure the "kids" love those skimpy outfits the Divas wear, LOL

He isnt a great businessman, he was, he isnt any more. He's been losing audience figures pretty steadily and has to do all he can to keep his audience, i.e. make it PG to entice the kiddies in because he alientated his existing audience. Thats not a good businessman, its clutching at straws.

He wants to be an entertainment show, thats fine, but this forum is full of wrestling fans, and the top Wrestling company these days is TNA. WWE does some good wrestling matches, but what you see on Monday and Friday nights is not wrestling. Or at most a watered down version of wrestling.

Admittedly TNA has a tendancy to go the other direction and end up with spotfests but thats not the arguement here.

TNA has better wrestling than WWE (not neccessarilly better wrestlers, but the quality of the wrestling itself). The main appeal for me is the "flippy Stuff" (apologies to any actual wrestlers who read that, Ive watched WWE for so long I cant remember half the proper names for moves :( ), that is a great display of balance and athletic ability.

Its not fun to watch a brawl that you feel you could reenact with a friend in your living room. It is fun to watch a wrestling match with skilled wrestlers doing what they do best. It doesnt have to have blood, or weapons even, (weapons and blood are fun on occasion though), but the reversal into reversal stuff is just great to watch, it also means the wins can come out of nowhere and get you wrapped up in the match.

I dont think TNA will ever beat WWE as they arent on the same battleground anymore. I do think that TNA will become more popular, and will get audience figures comparable to WWE eventually.

But by that point it will be like comparing Saturday Night Live to a football match. Just different TV shows.

[RVDmark]

Vince with all due respect is losing his touch these days. He is out of the loop to what fans really want to see. He also doesn't have a son with a real passion for the business who has some fresh innovative ideas, and a finger on the pulse of WWE's audience ready to take over. Guess Triple H and Stephanie will have to do.

I always got the impression that the business was destined for Steph and he would be playing second fiddle to her.

[Jeritron]

Friday Night Smackdown has more wrestling than Impact, by far. This is a fact, not an opinion.
Also, NXT has more wrestling in an hour than Impact ever does in 2.

As for Raw, they feature about an equal amount of in ring action. Usually Raw has a bit more.

Those are the facts. As for my opinion of the product, the non-wrestling aspect that both companies feature is much more coherent and tolerable in WWE. Storylines, fueds, booking, and the overall meaning behind everything is more clear-cut and logical in the WWE. Production value hasn't even entered the conversation yet, but I won't go there. That's just my view though, and you don't have to agree.

But claiming that TNA is heavier on wrestling than WWE would be false. So your point that it's like comparing saturday night live to a football match only holds relevance if Saturday Night Live contains more football than the football match.

[kareru]

wwe's highest ratings ever
8.4 September 27, 1999 during attitude era

average ratings for attitude era 6.0

raw average rating since pg 3.6


just sayin'

[kareru]

TNA president Dixie Carter responded to Vince McMahon’s criticism of TNA in an interview published yesterday with a post on Twitter.

“To be called tawdry from the King of Tawdry, that is some compliment!” Carter said.

Regarding TNA, McMahon told Acorn Online: “When they moved to Monday nights, they threw the kitchen sink at us and only did a fraction of our audience. It doesn’t speak well for the type of product they’re trying to present with the tawdry, blood-soaked action. I don’t think that’s what the culture wants these days.”

Furthermore, Taz also noted the following in regards to McMahon’s comments: “Mae Young stuff is all high road, or when JR was sick Dr Hynee bit (classy)! Pot, meet Kettle. Nice to see VKM is a TNA viewer!”

that Dr Hynee bit turned me off wrestling for years

[RVDmark]

Friday Night Smackdown has more wrestling than Impact, by far. This is a fact, not an opinion.
Also, NXT has more wrestling in an hour than Impact ever does in 2.

As for Raw, they feature about an equal amount of in ring action. Usually Raw has a bit more.

Those are the facts. As for my opinion of the product, the non-wrestling aspect that both companies feature is much more coherent and tolerable in WWE. Storylines, fueds, booking, and the overall meaning behind everything is more clear-cut and logical in the WWE. Production value hasn't even entered the conversation yet, but I won't go there. That's just my view though, and you don't have to agree.

But claiming that TNA is heavier on wrestling than WWE would be false. So your point that it's like comparing saturday night live to a football match only holds relevance if Saturday Night Live contains more football than the football match.

I didnt mention the amount of wrestling, Im talking about the actual wrestling matches themselves, and the content of them.

TNA's production value is worse than WWE, but it is improving. Noone expects TNA to become massive overnight, so we have to judge by the direction the companies are headed.

Apart from maybe 2 fueds I couldnt care less about WWE at the moment and its coming up to 'Mania. Theres just more stuff I want to watch on TNA right now, Hogan is on TV less and less, Bischoff is still awesome on the mic, plus RVD without the restrictions on moveset and character might go somewhere. I'm enjoying the nostalga of TNA right now, theres some promise to it as well. WWE, well all they have promised is that PG is here to stay.

Its all subjective, I'm fed up w/ PG TV.

[Jeritron]

wwe's highest ratings ever
8.4 September 27, 1999 during attitude era

average ratings for attitude era 6.0

raw average rating since pg 3.6


just sayin'


Look in the yellow circle.


http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/2779/wm14c.jpg











Just sayin'

[screech]

Got him good

[RVDmark]

that Dr Hynee bit turned me off wrestling for years

I should probably be glad for not knowing, but what is this Dr Hynee stuff of which you speak?

[kareru]

Look in the yellow circle.


http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/2779/wm14c.jpg




Just sayin'




yeah that was the beginning of the attitude era

[Jeritron]

I didnt mention the amount of wrestling, Im talking about the actual wrestling matches themselves, and the content of them.

TNA's production value is worse than WWE, but it is improving. Noone expects TNA to become massive overnight, so we have to judge by the direction the companies are headed.

Apart from maybe 2 fueds I couldnt care less about WWE at the moment and its coming up to 'Mania. Theres just more stuff I want to watch on TNA right now, Hogan is on TV less and less, Bischoff is still awesome on the mic, plus RVD without the restrictions on moveset and character might go somewhere. I'm enjoying the nostalga of TNA right now, theres some promise to it as well. WWE, well all they have promised is that PG is here to stay.

Its all subjective, I'm fed up w/ PG TV.


Hogan is not on TV less and less, but whatever. I'm glad you can enjoy that but I can't. I don't think anything about their wrestling is any better.
I'd much rather see Jericho, Punk, Morrison and the rest of the Smackdown roster in matches that go somewhere and often times feature finishes.

I can't remember the last time a WWE ppv ended with a slapstick Benny Hill segment, and a title challenger being happy that he got screwed out of the belt. As long as he gets to pose with Hogan, that's the real victory right?
And he doesn't even get a rematch or a fued continuation. He just moves on.

The ring action often doesn't do anything for me there, because the fueds don't mean anything, and there isn't really any storyelling going on in there. AJ and Abyss can work, but there's just not much to it other than that. It's just TNA talent pool matchup #50480283403.

Aside from the stuff Angle does, I'm usually not interested. And Angle's fueds and angles don't do any favors. He's just so damn good in the ring that he is able to elevate guys for the time they're in the ring with him. After that, TNA doesn't seem to do anything with them.

[Jeritron]

yeah that was the beginning of the attitude era

They had been putting out the attitude era product for over 6 months at that point.
What I'm saying is, the product is what it is. The whole TV PG crusade the IWC is on is a huge scapegoat. The problem should be with the booking, and the level of creativity and motivation driving the product.

That's like saying a movie that is rated PG can't be great, or even win best picture, gain critical acclaim, or hit at the box office.


Blood, unprotected chairshots, and sexual content do not make the wrestling program any better or worse unless you are watching for those things specifically. For the people that do, I think Backyard Wrestling tapes are the place to go.

Storytelling, innovation, creativity, and things of that nature are what made that programming such quality. It can be done today whether it's TV PG or TV MA.

[kareru]

They had been putting out the attitude era product for over 6 months at that point.
What I'm saying is, the product is what it is. The whole TV PG crusade the IWC is on is a huge scapegoat. The problem should be with the booking, and the level of creativity and motivation driving the product.

That's like saying a movie that is rated PG can't be great, or even win best picture, gain critical acclaim, or hit at the box office.


Blood, unprotected chairshots, and sexual content do not make the wrestling program any better or worse unless you are watching for those things specifically. For the people that do, I think Backyard Wrestling tapes are the place to go.

Storytelling, innovation, creativity, and things of that nature are what made that programming such quality. It can be done today whether it's TV PG or TV MA.


i agree, i9m just saying that VKM has no idea what ' the culture' wants anymore, and maybe he should step down

[Jeritron]

Yea but you state that ratings are going in the tank and Raw's average rating since TV PG is 3.6

That's a misleading number. Raw's average rating since 2003 is 3.6. In fact, looking at the sheet right now it has consistently been between 3-4 since early 2003, and in some stretches the ratings were even lower than they are now.

So when a TV 14 rated product from 2003, featuring attitude era stars is drawing a lower rating, what are you going to blame?

Seems like now the argument is going to shift from TV PG being the problem to just plain Vince...

[kareru]

Yea but you state that ratings are going in the tank and Raw's average rating since TV PG is 3.6

That's a misleading number. Raw's average rating since 2003 is 3.6. In fact, looking at the sheet right now it has consistently been between 3-4 since early 2003, and in some stretches the ratings were even lower than they are now.

So when a TV 14 rated product from 2003, featuring attitude era stars is drawing a lower rating, what are you going to blame?

Seems like now the argument is going to shift from TV PG being the problem to just plain Vince...

its both, he seems to think that PG entertainment is the way to go and it clearly isn't he barely even knows what todays adults want so he has no hope with the kids

[Jeritron]

well then what is the way to go? If it's doing the same ratings as the post-attitude era with all it's leftover stars and a TV 14 rating, it can't be that off base.

[kareru]

well then what is the way to go? If it's doing the same ratings as the post-attitude era with all it's leftover stars and a TV 14 rating, it can't be that off base.

well i would equate to what they are doing at the moment to killing a mouse with a shotgun, if it was up to me and the goal was wide demographic i would do this

WWE monday night raw - PG14 aimed at teens
ECW wednesday night hardcore tv - MA aimed at adults and wrestling fans, im not talking about 2 girls fucking in the ring type of stuff but a bit more adult based.

WCW friday nitro - PG tv aimed more at families and kids

hell even by doing this they could probably slam out 2 ppvs per month, this way every body is happy, they could probably storyline some takeover and treat the 'companies' as separate entities

[Jeritron]

So what you're suggesting is that the WWE, on it's own, tries to orchestrate a re-enactment of the boom period on their own. By replicating what was popular in 1999, they are tapping into what the culture wants today?

[kareru]

So what you're suggesting is that the WWE, on it's own, tries to orchestrate a re-enactment of the boom period on their own. By replicating what was popular in 1999, they are tapping into what the culture wants today?

obviously the storylines would be different but since the wwe own both wcw and ecw they should do more with it, maybe even capture back some of the fans that were 'lost in the shuffle'

[Juan]

Attitude Era is dead, ECW is dead, WCW is dead. They're never coming back.

[Jeritron]

Maybe they should reform the AWA and NWA while they're at it. They can set up territories and that way the roster won't have to tour as much. Surely some of those 80s fan that were 'lost in the shuffle' will be recaptured...

The WWE is not going to move backwards, and trying to reel in fans from the past is a crapshoot. They need to move forward, and aim to create new ones. The past is the past, and this "culture" you speak of needs to be found in the present. The money is in new fans, and future fans. Cradle to the grave.

WCW and ECW are dead entities. The WWE has already used them up on air, and they're now 10 years old and dead. It's time for wrestling to move on, and so should it's fans.

[kareru]

Attitude Era is dead, ECW is dead, WCW is dead. They're never coming back.

anything can happen in the world of 'rasslin'

[Jeritron]

What Juan said.

[kareru]

Maybe they should reform the AWA and NWA while they're at it. They can set up territories and that way the roster won't have to tour as much. Surely some of those 80s fan that were 'lost in the shuffle' will be recaptured...

The WWE is not going to move backwards, and trying to reel in fans from the past is a crapshoot. They need to move forward, and aim to create new ones. The past is the past, and this "culture" you speak of needs to be found in the present. The money is in new fans, and future fans. Cradle to the grave.

WCW and ECW are dead entities. The WWE has already used them up on air, and they're now 10 years old and dead. It's time for wrestling to move on, and so should it's fans.

the NWA is still going and do have territories

[kareru]

FINE


well i would equate to what they are doing at the moment to killing a mouse with a shotgun, if it was up to me and the goal was wide demographic i would do this

WWE monday night raw - PG14 aimed at teens
CCWF wednesday night Chillum - MA aimed at adults and wrestling fans, im not talking about 2 girls fucking in the ring type of stuff but a bit more adult based.

WXF friday bubble - PG tv aimed more at families and kids

hell even by doing this they could probably slam out 2 ppvs per month, this way every body is happy, they could probably storyline some takeover and treat the 'companies' as separate entities

[Jeritron]

They still have the championship committee and all that jazz, last time I checked. They're not near their former prominence though. I meant WWE promoting it as a "brand".

[RVDmark]

Ah yes, wrestling needs to move on. But moving on doesnt mean alienating a hefty percentage of their current audience. Moving on and adapting is essential. WWE's current form of moving on appears to be getting out of wrestling, which as a wrestling company is a bad move you could say.

[RVDmark]

Also, just because its PG doesnt mean it has to be the crap they churn out either. Dont believe me?

"JBL is poopy."

Case closed.

[Jeritron]

That's the whole point I was trying to make. Thanks for coming around and saying the same thing. Case closed.

[KayfabeMan]

WWE will eventually collapse on itself (again) and wind up in the same basket that they were in in the early 1990's.

[Juan]

WWE will eventually collapse on itself (again) and wind up in the same basket that they were in in the early 1990's.

You're on ok enough guy, but I just hate arguing with people like you. Makes me feel like a WWE fanboy instead of feeling like I should, like I'm using common sense.

[KayfabeMan]

So am I.

WWE's business is a cycle. At somepoint, WWE will drop off again.

They already have, but their rebound has kept it not noticible that they had fallen to begin with.

Will they come back after the next major drop off?

Maybe, depending on if Vince is still alive and who is in charge, etc.

[dronepool]

Quick question-

When was the last true TV-14 WWE show?