How would've you booked the InVasion?

[The Naitch]

Based on real life circumstances (signed available wrestlers ie DDP. No Goldberg yet. He comes in later around 2003.)

What did you like about the InVasion?

What would've you done differently?

[VSG]

Get in nWo, Flair and Bischoff earlier and have them lead WCW. The ECW part was fine.

[Rammsteinmad]

Which totally ignores the bit about using wrestlers signed at the time... Except maybe Flair who came in the night after the Invasion finished.

[The Pope]

Have Dean Malenko destroy the alliance.

[Rammsteinmad]

In response to the thread, there wasn't really much else that could be done, other than not making the Alliance guys always look like bitches. In particular DDP, who was one of WCW's top guys, instantly turned into a jobber.

It was a messy situation, I feel inclined to say 'I would have waited to sign other people such as Goldberg, the NWO, Rey Mysterio etc', but looking at how long it took all these people to appear, fans would have probably lost loads of interest in a WCW vs. WWF angle anymore.

[VSG]

When WWE bought WCW, did they not automatically get all the existing contracts of WCW wrestlers? That means nWo was available, but not Bischoff who was working for Matrats.

[The Pope]

No, the big stars had contracts with I think it was Warner Bros. (Goldberg, nwo, etc.)

[Evil Vito]

When WWE bought WCW, did they not automatically get all the existing contracts of WCW wrestlers? That means nWo was available, but not Bischoff who was working for Matrats.

<font color=goldenrod>Nope. Pretty sure WWF got to choose what contracts to pick up, and the wrestlers had the option of backing out of it. There was someone (think it was Scott Steiner or Goldberg) who I believe said if WWF picked up their contracts they would simply sit out. Of course, both guys ended up coming in anyway.</font>

[Innovator]

The WCW main eventers could have taken buy outs from their contracts, but they would've been taken almost pennies on the dollar

[The Naitch]

did anybody like how DDP made his debut? I'm not talking about how he ended up jobbing to Sara, I'm talking about the unmasking in itself

[The Pope]

<font color=goldenrod>Nope. Pretty sure WWF got to choose what contracts to pick up, and the wrestlers had the option of backing out of it. There was someone (think it was Scott Steiner or Goldberg) who I believe said if WWF picked up their contracts they would simply sit out. Of course, both guys ended up coming in anyway.</font>

Not true, they didn't have contracts with WcW, they did with Warner Bros... So they could purchase the contracts but they were too expensive so WWF/E decided to wait for the contracts to expire.

[VSG]

<font color=goldenrod>Nope. Pretty sure WWF got to choose what contracts to pick up, and the wrestlers had the option of backing out of it. There was someone (think it was Scott Steiner or Goldberg) who I believe said if WWF picked up their contracts they would simply sit out. Of course, both guys ended up coming in anyway.</font>

Ya, you are kinda right. WWF/E got to choose but I think it was Warner Bros. Inc. who had the contracts. I also just read this: http://www.amazon.com/Hulk-Hogan-Lost-Episodes-Discs/dp/B000N4I302

Hogan was not signed on by any company due to his knee surgery and came back for a 1 match deal to face Curt Hennig at Jimmy Hart's XWF. The match impressed WWE who gave contracts to both men in 2002.

[Fox]

The key was definitely to make WCW/ECW guys not look like bitches. RVD, DDP, Rhino and other Alliance members should've been made to look even stronger than the WWE's top guys, at least in the beginning. It was important to make the invading party look like a threat, otherwise what's the point? I think bringing over Austin and Angle was a bad idea, as the InVasion angle quickly turned into heel Stone Cold angle, with the WCW/ECW factor as almost a background factor.

RVD should have won the WWE Title in the first few months and been made as the true leader of the InVasion. He was hot as hell at the time and feuds with Austin, Rock, Angle, Undertaker and Jericho could've been big money. The Alliance should've gained more powerful members, maybe Kane or Big Show for muscle, and as time went on, Vince should've done everything in his power to bring in Flair, Bischoff, Hogan or Sting as a big reveal surprise to make the Alliance that much stronger.

The angle should have lasted all the way through WrestleMania X-8, where Hogan would've still faced Rock, but with the InVasion storyline in place of the nWo angle. The WWE/WCW titles would've been unified at Mania in a big blow off match, in addition to a multi-man match to decide the future of the Alliance and the WWE, much like they did at Survivor Series.

[Rammsteinmad]

That Survivor Series match was amazing btw.

Even though the Alliance team only had two actual Alliance wrestlers. Still a great match.

[Rammsteinmad]

did anybody like how DDP made his debut? I'm not talking about how he ended up jobbing to Sara, I'm talking about the unmasking in itself

I did. I remember marking out huge at the time. Especially because around that time, you had Booker T at KOTR, and Lance Storm and Hugh Morris (who was over at the time) made run-in attacks. It was really exciting.

We just didn't realise at the time that those were the biggest WCW stars the Alliance would have.

[Evil Vito]

<font color=goldenrod>But yeah, based on the talent roster available at the time the least they could have done was not make the Alliance look like bitches.

But - let's just say they could have signed anybody. I would have had WCW somehow get SmackDown and bring most of the roster over. WWF and WCW run as two separate shows for awhile but tensions start running high when it is also somehow revealed that the KOTR tourney will feature 16 WWF guys and 16 WCW guys. WWF gets pissed, saying it's their tourney. They took a show away, now they are taking the tourney, etc.

Eventually you start seeing invasions on both shows. We end up at the Invasion PPV which features a 9-match series between WWF and WCW. Rhyno wins a hardcore match against some random WCW guy in the opener of the show, and he cuts really short promo more or less hinting that something big is going down later on.

The show is tied at 4-4 going into the main event (shock of shocks!) and you have Austin going up against a big WCW name (Booker makes sense since it'll be champ vs. champ, I'd like to see Austin/Goldberg but that match not ending clean would piss off a LOT of people). Rhyno randomly comes out. Everybody is confused. Then RVD, Sabu, Sandman, Dreamer, and maybe a few other debuting ECW guys rush the ring and just start wrecking everything in a manner not unlike the Nexus. Figure the ECW guys aren't as well known so they need to do something really memorable. The next night Heyman reveals he was behind it, sick of being glanced over in the WWF/WCW war, etc.

So yeah. It winds up being a 3-way war with a lot of twists, turns, defections, teased defections, etc. WWF eventually has to win and then the draft concept begins not too long after Survivor Series. It'd be far more interesting than what actually happened IMO.</font>

[Fox]

The Alliance Leaders should've been: Rob Van Dam, DDP, Booker T, Rhino, Raven, and Lance Storm. These guys should all have been built up as major threats to the WWE guys, using old WCW and ECW footage to craft awesome promo videos about each man that would be played throughout RAW and Smackdown. They should've gotten clean wins over top WWE stars.

Mike Awesome, the Dudleys and Stasiak/O'Haire should've been used as muscle, and Paul Heyman should have been the major mouth piece for the organization, doing what Eric Bischoff did for the nWo and being the first guy on the microphone during their in-ring promos, selling the Alliance and his men the way only Paul E. can sell.

I also think that at WrestleMania X-8, the Alliance should have actually WON the multi-man Survivor Series match for the ownership of Monday night RAW, but in the main event, a WWE guy wins the Undisputed Championship. Overhaul RAW for a month or two with WCW and ECW sets and stages and logos, and then at Backlash or Judgment Day have the final main event: Rob Van Dam vs. Stone Cold - Undisputed Title vs. Ownership of Monday Night RAW to Alliance or WWE. They could've had Vince McMahon actually begging Stone Cold to win him his company back.

[The Naitch]

The key was definitely to make WCW/ECW guys not look like bitches. RVD, DDP, Rhino and other Alliance members should've been made to look even stronger than the WWE's top guys, at least in the beginning. It was important to make the invading party look like a threat, otherwise what's the point? I think bringing over Austin and Angle was a bad idea, as the InVasion angle quickly turned into heel Stone Cold angle, with the WCW/ECW factor as almost a background factor.

RVD should have won the WWE Title in the first few months and been made as the true leader of the InVasion. He was hot as hell at the time and feuds with Austin, Rock, Angle, Undertaker and Jericho could've been big money. The Alliance should've gained more powerful members, maybe Kane or Big Show for muscle, and as time went on, Vince should've done everything in his power to bring in Flair, Bischoff, Hogan or Sting as a big reveal surprise to make the Alliance that much stronger.

The angle should have lasted all the way through WrestleMania X-8, where Hogan would've still faced Rock, but with the InVasion storyline in place of the nWo angle. The WWE/WCW titles would've been unified at Mania in a big blow off match, in addition to a multi-man match to decide the future of the Alliance and the WWE, much like they did at Survivor Series.

best idea so far

[Wolfpack423]

did anybody like how DDP made his debut? I'm not talking about how he ended up jobbing to Sara, I'm talking about the unmasking in itself

Yes, I liked DDP's debut. He is a favorite of mine and I think he deserves more credit than he gets, but that's another story. He did well in that segment and the crowd reacted positively towards him. That was probably the highlight of his WWE career the debut and retaining the European title at WM18.

[erickman]

In response to the thread, there wasn't really much else that could be done, other than not making the Alliance guys always look like bitches. In particular DDP, who was one of WCW's top guys, instantly turned into a jobber.

It was a messy situation, I feel inclined to say 'I would have waited to sign other people such as Goldberg, the NWO, Rey Mysterio etc', but looking at how long it took all these people to appear, fans would have probably lost loads of interest in a WCW vs. WWF angle anymore.

what they did to ddp was the worst jobing to takers then wife, i am kind of glad they ended wcw, what they could have done was rename smackdown wcw, an it would be the same crap wwecw was.

[glanville6]

would have much rather seen Jericho in the Alliance fueding with the Rock instead of being in the WWF feuding with his own teammate.

Also agree that Austin and Angle didnt belong in the Alliance.

Do like the idea that WCW had Smackdown and WWF had RAW though. But what would ECW have had? Jakked/Metal? That probably could have worked, at the time... but cant figure out how they would have fit in the Invasion angle.

As it was though, the angle was ok...dissappointing to some, but not as bad as some people say. Just like the Nexus angle, I just dont think they could have stretched it until Mania...unless they had Bischoff.

[Rammsteinmad]

To be perfectly honest, at the time I enjoyed the angle. I was only 14 and wasn't looking so much into the backstage shit and 'who's over' and 'who's being buried' etc.

[Wolfpack423]

To be perfectly honest, at the time I enjoyed the angle. I was only 14 and wasn't looking so much into the backstage shit and 'who's over' and 'who's being buried' etc.

In my opinion 2001 is one of the best years in WWE history and I actually enjoyed the Invasion very much. I didn't like DDP getting buried myself, but it was cool seeing him on TV. I did want to see Sting and Goldberg. I thought that the Austin-Angle feud was one of the best feuds I have ever seen and their matches were five stars, I really liked their Summerslam match more than any of them. I know it ended in DQ. I just thought the match was better than Unforgiven.

[Aguakate]

Hindsight is always 20/20.

Let's let Paul Heyman talk about this:

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[BollywoodSingh]

My biggest problem was that it turned from a WWF vs. WCW feud to a McMahon family feud. I also didn't like how WWF guys (Austin, Angle, Christian, Test, etc.) joined the alliance. It kind of made the Alliance seem like any other stable.

[The Naitch]

LOL you Bollywood Singh, you the guy from smashwrestling who was in my e-fed?

[bigslimjj]

They got a lot of mileage out of those other guys once they started filtering them in later on. I think they purposefully brought in just enough names to make The Alliance legit and do the angle that way with SCSA. Then later on waited until the real big WCW guys contracts ended and then offered them less money when they needed jobs again. Rey, Goldberg,Steiner,n.W.o. and more had major story lines throughout the early part of the last decade.They did as much as they could with what they bought I think. They could have booked the story better for the Invasion,but money was made none the less.

[Aguakate]

They should've definitely brought the BIG NAMES over to WWF as leaders of the Invasion, instead of bringing "lesser name guys". If they would've brought Goldberg, Steiner, Nash, Hall, etc, it would've been explosive, and who knows how the wrestling industry would've changed.

But to make the Invasion a McMahon family feud was one of the worst decisions ever. Made the fact that WCW was "invading" WWF totally secondary.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

No Shane or Stephanie.

[Jimmy Cones]

ECW would have never teamed with WCW.

[Next Big Thing]

They should've definitely brought the BIG NAMES over to WWF as leaders of the Invasion, instead of bringing "lesser name guys". If they would've brought Goldberg, Steiner, Nash, Hall, etc, it would've been explosive, and who knows how the wrestling industry would've changed.

But to make the Invasion a McMahon family feud was one of the worst decisions ever. Made the fact that WCW was "invading" WWF totally secondary.

1) It wasn't possible because of the contract situations.

2) Vince never ever intended on any WCW guys attaining any major form of success over his guys.

The NWO, easily top 3 stables of all time in it's earliest form, was made to look like clowns from day 1. DDP, who would have been a great babyface, was made to look like a creepy stalker and fed to Taker. Steiner and Goldberg came and went and the only reason Hogan thrived is because he's Hogan.

In my opinion, the Invasion angle turned out just as McMahon wanted it to. WCW talent looking like jobbers to the WWE guys.

[CSL]

I wouldn't have had the Vince/Shane WCW angle. I'd have started the whole thing the Smackdown before the Judgement Day PPV (people will buy the PPV to see if WCW show), keep the random run ins from guys like Storm, Morrus, Awesome (no Booker, no DDP/no stalker angle aka keep the biggest names out) in the weeks leading to King of the Ring (still main evented by Austin/Jericho/Benoit and still speculating that if Benoit or Jericho win, they could take the belt to WCW) Get to the point where lower card WWE guys are setting up guard posts in the parking lot, getting calls there are WCW guys in the building, generally waiting for/looking for WCW guys.

Come to King of the Ring: lots of cutting to the WWE guys waiting for WCW in garage etc through the whole show, have nothing happen until towards the end of the main event (but still with about 20 minutes of the show to go). Have JR start talking about a commotion in the parking garage, cut there to find the Dudleys, Raven, Tazz etc (the WWE ECW guys minus Rhino) helping WCW guys beat on just about every WWE guy in the building, JR starts screaming about what's going on, it's an ambush, they're supposed to be on our side etc, the cameras follow the attackers wandering around backstage, beating down everybody in sight including Vince etc, cut back into the arena with Austin watching on the titantron. Then something similar to this:

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Have Booker walk out like Barrett does, slowly walking down to the ring, DDP, RVD, Rhino, Dreamer, Palumbo and O'Haire jump the barriers and surround the ring, each one getting a few seconds on camera. Austin, Jericho and Benoit stand back to back in the ring facing the invading guys until Jericho and Benoit turn and face Austin. Austin does the slow, 'realizing what's happening' turn around to face Benoit and Jericho and gets jumped. Booker and the guys around the ring jump in and pound on Austin. They all then start destroying the ring and ringside area, the commentators go silent. JR, Fink, Hebner, security etc gets attacked and Heyman gets the mic. By this time all of the invading guys will have made their way to the ring. Everybody gets into what's left of the ring, Austin is out at the feet of Heyman, Heyman cuts a passionate promo surrounded by Booker, Jericho, Benoit, RVD, Rhino and all of the invaders about taking the WWE down. They continue destroying everything in sight as the show goes off the air. Makes them look strong right off the bat.

Over the course of the feud, have Heyman basically hint that he's being backed by Turner (only never mentioning the name, if people don't buy it, go with Shane) to take over WWE, get the WWE belt on the strongest invading guy (probably RVD, Jericho or Booker) after a few months have the match that happened at Invasion between teams from both sides (at Summerslam maybe) with a WWE win and the invaders are done, Invaders win and they get the company. Invaders win, modify the sets enough to show it's somebody else in control but still a WWE product, the WWE guys basically have to invade to get back on TV and essentially build towards a huge blowoff match at WrestleMania X8 where WWE/Austin/Vince win it back. Have Austin win the Rumble, instead of a title show, the blowoff match is somehow set up, still have Rock/Hogan etc. Try and get people like Hogan, Nash, Hall, Flair etc involved a bit earlier if possible. The Alliance would essentially be styled after the nWo, with Heyman playing the Bischoff role.

Or something.

[Lord-Of-Darkness]

To be perfectly honest, at the time I enjoyed the angle. I was only 14 and wasn't looking so much into the backstage shit and 'who's over' and 'who's being buried' etc.

This. I loved, and still do love, watching the Invasion angle play out. I think even if they did have the nWo etc from day one, they should have kept it as it was. Having Goldberg, nWo, Steiner etc come in after the Invasion allowed them to have separate story lines later on.


Personally, I think the only things I would change would be to have ECW and WCW separate, and have it as the 3 way war everyone had wanted to see for years.

And if it were possible, the only 'big name' that didn't come in during the Invasion, that I would bring in would be Goldberg. Simply because you could have WWF's Austin vs WCW's Goldberg, which would have been big money. Unfortunately because of circumstances, Goldberg didn't debut until the night after Austin retired. We got Goldberg/ Rock in the end, but it wasn't what everyone would have had, given the choice IMO.

[Lord-Of-Darkness]

The NWO, easily top 3 stables of all time in it's earliest form, was made to look like clowns from day 1.


Can you just explain, or anyone for that matter, what was wrong with the WWF's version of the nWo?

I was hooked to it from the moment it was announced. Yeah, it sucked that Hogan had to drop out, but with the pops he was getting, it was unavoidable. But what they had in the end with X-Pac, Nash, Hall(before he got fired), Big Show, Booker T and HBK, with their alliance with Flair was great IMO.

I really enjoyed the final storyline of 'Will Triple H join the nWo and reunite the Kliq'. It's a shame that never panned out. Sure, we got the HBK return match at Summerslam which was awesome, but you can't help but wonder how it would have all worked out with the nWo/ Kliq story behind it.


The disband also really sucked. One week you have the big tag match, and Nash tears his quad. The next week it is just announced on commentary that Mr Mcmahon as 'disbanded the nWo'. Was it just because they had no remaining original members?

[Mr. C]

Diamond Dallas Page would at least have won one or two matches, that’s for sure. Vince McMahon should’ve bought out the contracts for Goldberg and Sting and used them from the start. Paul Heyman should’ve led ECW, and they should’ve been kept separate from WCW without any alliance as their own group just attacking everyone and doing what they wanted.

[XL]

Given that a lot of guys chose to sit out their big money WCW contracts I'd have tried to hold off the invasion until they became available (for a much cheaper price no doubt). A WCW invasion led by the nWo (Hogan/Hall/Nash) and Flair (amongst others) would have been perceived as much more of a threat. Maybe try and sign those guys to pre-contracts if that was legally possible.

Aside from that I think they chose to switch the wrong guys to the Alliance side. They should have shipped Big Show and Jericho given that they were actually in WCW. Hell, Jericho was still a heel dispite being on the WWE side.

[The Naitch]

lol didn't realize how bad the nWo was near the end. Booker T was even in it. Hell, there was even Goldust lurking in the shadows wanting in too.

I remember they changed the WWF logo at the bottom corner of the screen to a WCW logo for the 2nd hour of RAW. Changed the apron to a WCW apron, during the Buff Bagwell vs. Booker T match :lol:

[The Naitch]

LOL

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[The Naitch]

I loved BookerDust back then

[The Naitch]

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[The Naitch]

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[Next Big Thing]

Those two are everything Kozlov and Santino dream to be.