NBA PERMANENT Off Season Thread [Archive] - Page 2

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Nark Order

12-09-2011, 12:29 AM

After all of the shady stuff in the Lakers past, I can't help but smile at this. After the ref scandals and after the shady Gasol deal, all eyes are on the Lakers in the off-season. If you're going to run shady business practices, all eyes are going to be on your franchise. Now a team that is owned by the NBA gives up their best player for scraps to one of the biggest markets in the league? It looks awful. And you can try to justify what NO would've gotten out of the deal all you want, but the bottom line is that you don't progress in the league with a slew of mediocre players in exchange for the best point guard in the NBA. It all just looks ridiculous. If they're going to trade Paul, they should have the long term in mind and go for either young top guys or high draft picks. Kevin Martin and Lamar Odom are not going to bring you to a championship. Hornets would have a better chance at a championship with the current Hornets team with Chris Paul than they would with everything they would've gotten out of that trade.

It all just doesn't seem right. It's not so much what the Lakers gave up, it's what the Hornets got out of the deal.

Juan

12-09-2011, 12:31 AM

That's all well and good, but the Commissioner nixing a deal just because he was pressured by owners is complete bullshit and the backlash from all of this seems to have been quick and almost universal. There's no denying that

Nark Order

12-09-2011, 12:38 AM

Well, the team is owned by the NBA and the owners... are part of the NBA. I'm not saying that it's a standard practice or that it should be done all the time, but this is quite the unique situation. If the Hornets weren't owned by the NBA, this wouldn't even be an issue. Then again, if the Hornets weren't owned by the NBA, this trade probably wouldn't have gone down in the first place. It's slippery, but it all just looks awful from a PR standpoint and David Stern can't afford to have any more money or trade scandals, especially when the Lakers are involved.

Juan

12-09-2011, 12:43 AM

FearedSanctity

12-09-2011, 12:44 AM

I don't blame the owner's for this, they have every reason to be pissy about a trade that would make LA even more ridiculous. But given that it's the league's team, I think it's stupid that Stern let the trade get as far as it did without at least consulting it's "owners" first. Unacceptable on his part, and now he was to clean up the mess. If it costs him his job I wouldn't be surprised

FearedSanctity

12-09-2011, 12:46 AM

Cavs owner wanted trade blocked

By Yahoo! Sports Staff

Cleveland Cavaliers owner Dan Gilbert called the New Orleans Hornets’ proposed trade of Chris Paul to the Los Angeles Lakers a “travesty,” and urged NBA commissioner David Stern to put the deal to vote of the league’s 29 owners in an email obtained by Yahoo! Sports. Gilbert sent the email to Stern, deputy commissioner Adam Silver and a handful of Gilbert’s ownership peers on Thursday.

The following is the email in its entirety:

Commissioner,

It would be a travesty to allow the Lakers to acquire Chris Paul in the apparent trade being discussed.

This trade should go to a vote of the 29 owners of the Hornets.

Over the next three seasons this deal would save the Lakers approximately $20 million in salaries and approximately $21 million in luxury taxes. That $21 million goes to non-taxpaying teams and to fund revenue sharing.

I cannot remember ever seeing a trade where a team got by far the best player in the trade and saved over $40 million in the process. And it doesn’t appear that they would give up any draft picks, which might allow to later make a trade for Dwight Howard. (They would also get a large trade exception that would help them improve their team and/or eventually trade for Howard.) When the Lakers got Pau Gasol (at the time considered an extremely lopsided trade) they took on tens of millions in additional salary and luxury tax and they gave up a number of prospects (one in Marc Gasol who may become a max-salary player).

I just don’t see how we can allow this trade to happen.

I know the vast majority of owners feel the same way that I do.

When will we just change the name of 25 of the 30 teams to the Washington Generals?

Please advise….

Dan G.

An NBA spokesman said owners “didn’t kill the deal,” instead citing “basketball reasons,” for why the league office blocked the trade.

RoXer

12-09-2011, 12:49 AM

He did not send that.

Juan

12-09-2011, 12:50 AM

These whiney ass owner's should just worry about making their teams better instead of asking the Commissioner to bail them out.

RoXer

12-09-2011, 12:50 AM

When will we just change the name of 25 of the 30 teams to the Washington Generals?

That did not go to his boss. No way.

Juan

12-09-2011, 12:53 AM

Pau Gasol for Kwame Brown = OK. Pau Gasol + Lamar Odom for CP3 = NOT OK!

Nark Order

12-09-2011, 12:54 AM

If the Hornets weren't owned by the NBA then this deal would have gone down for sure.

Stern wants to sell the team, so he wants Paul on the team to attract a buyer.

He would rather hurry up and sell the team, than let the Hornets actually get SOMETHING for Paul right now, than in 66 games when his contract is up and they get NOTHING for Paul.

Why would Chris Paul attract a buyer when they know he's going to leave in the next year or so? He's almost outright said so. Having Chris Paul on the team at the time of the sale means jack shit really.

FearedSanctity

12-09-2011, 12:55 AM

lol NBA is so fucked. Better hurry up and just re-lockout

Nark Order

12-09-2011, 12:58 AM

The trade basically painted the Hornets into mediocrity for quite some time while giving the Lakers a huge superstar and saving them quite a bit of cap money. I can see why a lot of owners would have a problem with this deal.

FearedSanctity

12-09-2011, 01:00 AM

But...but...the trade wasn't canned because of the owners, it was BASKETBALL REASONS

Aguakate

12-09-2011, 01:00 AM

Juan

12-09-2011, 01:02 AM

Why would Chris Paul attract a buyer when they know he's going to leave in the next year or so? He's almost outright said so. Having Chris Paul on the team at the time of the sale means jack shit really.

Because if he stays on the team there's at least a chance of him staying?

I know he's said he wants out, but I just can't see a team without Paul costing the same as a team with Paul, regardless of his contract situation.

Dragon

12-09-2011, 01:04 AM

Juan

12-09-2011, 01:05 AM

Looks like the Player's Union are gonna "fight" the NBA over this blocked deal.

Dragon

12-09-2011, 01:06 AM

I don't know if Dan Gilbert really was the person who basically went whining to the Commissioner about this deal, or if he wrote that email...but if he DID, I applaud LeBron for leaving Cleveland, because Gilbert is a disgrace.

I'm sure Gilbert wrote the letter. He's still hurting over Lebron leaving. Don't people remember the letter he wrote after that whole fiasco?

Dragon

12-09-2011, 01:07 AM

At least Stern was smart enough to pull this move after ratifying the new CBA. Would have been chaos if this happened before it was official.

Aguakate

12-09-2011, 01:07 AM

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/7334410/dwight-howard-ask-orlando-magic-trade-new-jersey-nets-sources-say?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

By Chris Broussard
ESPN The Magazine

Dwight Howard is preparing to ask the Orlando Magic to trade him to the New Jersey Nets, according to sources close to the situation.

Howard's representatives have told the Nets that they are his preferred destination.

Howard has yet to tell the Magic that he will not re-sign with them after this season, but the sources said he will within the next few days, perhaps as early as Friday. There is also a chance that Howard will not attend the opening of training camp Friday, according to one of the sources.

As ESPN.com reported last week, the Nets are ready to offer the Magic a package built around center Brook Lopez and two first-round draft picks, New Jersey's own and one the Nets acquired from Houston in a previous trade, according to sources.

If necessary, New Jersey is also willing to take back Hedo Turkoglu and the three years, $34 million remaining on his deal.

The appeal of the Nets for Howard is the chance to play with all-star point guard Deron Williams and excitement over the Nets' move into a brand new arena in Brooklyn for the start of the 2012-13 season.

Williams and Howard spoke several times about teaming up during the lockout.

If Howard is indeed committed to joining the Nets, he can all but force the Magic to make the trade by declaring his intentions not to sign a long-term contract with any other team, thereby assuring that those clubs make low-ball offers to Orlando.

Howard's decision to go to the Nets would put a monkey wrench in the Los Angeles Lakers' plan to team Howard with Kobe Bryant by trading Andrew Bynum for the Magic center.

The Nets are continuing to pursue free agent center Nene just in case their plan to acquire Howard falls through. That would seem to indicate that they expect a deal for Howard to begin coming together fairly soon.

Dragon

12-09-2011, 01:10 AM

LOL, perfect timing by Dwight to ask to get traded to a specific team. Exactly what the owners and Stern were crying about with the Paul thing.

Nark Order

12-09-2011, 01:26 AM

Dwight Howard should be commended for wanting to go to the Nets. Who in their right mind wants to go to the fucking Nets?

alvarado52

12-09-2011, 01:29 AM

Stern shouldn't have nixed the deal when it got as far as it did, but I don't really understand why the Hornets would want to do that deal anyway. I mean they were getting back no young players at all and taking on $15M in the process. I don't see how that helps the team for the future. One thing for sure is that the team obviously needs to be sold though.

Are you kidding me? They would have been a playoff team easily. The 'future' was Chris Paul/West, and it didnt work out well...maybe they wanted to try the present?

Fact of the matter is, Stern is stupid for killing this trade because:
1) this late in the trade, all of a sudden he becomes untouchable? Lets just put every player and team involved in an awkward position after the intention has been made.
2) Chris Paul is LEAVING, be it in 66 games, or now...and youre gonna stop the Hornets from getting anything in return? Not sure that 'future' looks any better by keeping him.

Fuck Gilbert. Guarantee if James said 'im out this bitch' to them before he became a FA in Cleveland, they'd have traded him for an entire team's roster if it came up.

alvarado52

12-09-2011, 01:32 AM

im not understanding the thought of the Hornets getting the shit end of this deal. The Rockets would have by basically giving up Scola, K.Mart, and others for one player in Pau Gasol.

Look at those pieces the Hornets were getting and tell me they wouldnt have been a solid team. Look at them now and tell me how they're a better team.

SammyG

12-09-2011, 02:01 AM

Seriously, NO wins from this trade. And yes, I do believe that letter from the Cavs' Owner. D12 just asked to be dealt to NJ... I'm sure Stern will allow that one.. Fucking jew.

Juan

12-09-2011, 02:14 AM

Danny Granger:
Due to the sabotaging of the LA/NO trade by david stern, and following in the footsteps of my athlete brethern Metta World Peace and Chad Ochocinco, I'm changing my last name to "Stern's Bi#&h" #effectiveimmediately

jrich23 Jason Richardson
Once again Buck Nasty a.k.a Dan Gilbert is letting his wrath being felt by being the main voice in the CP trade block.

@jalenrose
JALEN ROSE
It will NEVER be an equal way to distribute star players for every
team/city! #NBA

jrich23 Jason Richardson
Speechless about the @CP3 block trade. Smh

Jason Richardson: I'm a lil lost. What is the term "For Basketball Reasons" isn't it the NBA? yesterday

Andre Iguodala: Best wishes to @Chris Paul - that (bleep) cray.... yesterday

Jason Richardson: Speechless about the @Chris Paul block trade

Mario Chalmers: I can't believe they doin my homie @Chris Paul like that wow is right. Twitter

Micky Arison: Whatever happens with @Chris Paul all I can say is I wish him the the best. A class act. Twitter

Terrence Williams: It's krazy @Chris Paul is not waking up a laker and it's dumb I'm not able to run that pick and roll with gasol smh sad disappointing day 4 NBA about 7 minutes ago

Danny granger:
Did Stern just kill the @chrispaul deal!?! Wait...what..? #canhedothat?

Droford

12-09-2011, 02:20 AM

Dwight Howard should be commended for wanting to go to the Nets. Who in their right mind wants to go to the fucking Nets?
When they move to Brooklyn in 2012..I imagine it'll make them a big deal.

Juan

12-09-2011, 02:24 AM

I honestly think the deal was nixed because Stern & Co. were afraid that D12 was next. Now that D12 is going to NJ, what are the odds that the CP3 deal "miraculously" goes thru?

FearedSanctity

12-09-2011, 02:27 AM

It's possible, but I think it'll stay canceled. Stern looks stupid enough, things would get worse for him if he backs off

Droford

12-09-2011, 03:02 AM

I like how the Wiz need to spend $9 million based on the salaries from last year just to hit the salary floor and they're basically gutting 1/2 the team as well..can't wait for Washington Wizards basketball..gonna be ugly..getting all excited for Roger Mason Jr. coming back..oooh

ugh

Droford

12-09-2011, 03:04 AM

Also, Im pissed off no ones starting the TPWW fantasy league up.

Juan

12-09-2011, 04:30 AM

Nixed Paul deal makes NBA look like second-rate bush league
By Ken Berger | CBSSports.com NBA Insider

On the very day that the NBA was supposed to be back, embracing us with this charade of a 66-game season after five months of a pointless lockout, it stepped into the worst kind of purgatory.

What happened Thursday, the incomprehensible events you'd expect from a second-rate, minor league sport, did far more damage than the lockout ever did -- or ever could. After years of fans, both casual and hard-core, not to mention the disciplined executives and coaches working in the business, believing that something always wasn't quite right -- something was rotten in Denmark -- the NBA finally proved it.

This whole thing Thursday reeked to high heaven, and the NBA is going to pay a very dear price for it.

Having spoken with team executives getting back into the swing of things since the tentative deal on a new collective bargaining agreement was reached two weeks ago, I heard the anger. No sooner had the beleaguered negotiators slept off the 15-hour bargaining session that finally resulted in the deal, it was back to business as usual. After a five-month lockout that was supposedly about restoring competitive balance -- we can all hear deputy commissioner Adam Silver's mind-numbing, and as it turns out, empty soliloquy ringing in our ears -- it was right back to Chris Paul wanting to be in New York, Dwight Howard in L.A., and on and on and on.

"Pathetic," is how one team executive described the mayhem that played out Thursday, before commissioner David Stern somehow found a way to make it worse by canceling a trade that would've sent superstar Chris Paul from the Hornets to the Lakers for what a league spokesman laughably called "basketball reasons."

On a day when it became apparent that the Knicks would maneuver for the top free agent on the market, Tyson Chandler, the Lakers brokered a three-team deal to acquire Paul from the Hornets. One of the brightest GMs in the league, Houston's Daryl Morey, was involved in the transaction, as was Hornets GM Dell Demps -- a savvy, no-nonsense basketball man who came up through the San Antonio Spurs organization, which is like getting your MBA in NBA.

Everybody in the sport has known for a long time that Paul was leaving New Orleans; it was only a question of when, and how. Paul was fleeing the Hornets, a decrepit, decaying franchise that was put there by Stern as part of a contagious disease of over-expansion that, more than anything, led to the crippling financial losses and the lockout that the league just endured.

Or had endured, until this.

When owner George Shinn, who couldn't hack it in Charlotte, couldn't hack it in New Orleans, either, the NBA's other 29 franchises assumed custodianship until a new owner could be found. The Hornets had been able to manage their basketball affairs as they saw fit, with Demps and coach Monty Williams reporting to -- and only to -- league-appointed governor Jac Sperling. The Hornets finally got their act together last season, miraculously eclipsing an attendance quota that prevented their arena lease from opening, and they made trades and did the other business of running a basketball team without incident.

In February 2011, the league-owned Hornets took on more than $2 million in salary as part of a trade in which they acquired Carl Landry from the Sacramento Kings. Dallas Mavericks owner Mark Cuban, responsible for 1/29th of that money, decried the move as "absolutely, positively wrong."

The incident highlighted why a league or the other owners shouldn't collectively own one of the franchises in a sports cartel, but it blew over and everyone went on their merry way. It was swept under the carpet, the same one under which all the other carcasses of NBA scandals are buried.

It was all fine and dandy in the fantasy world of the NBA until Stern on Thursday decided to undercut and permanently impugn the power of the general manager who's supposed to be in charge of basketball decisions for the team that the league shouldn't own, but does. Until Stern passive-aggressively took out his frustration, and that of his owners, over a collective bargaining agreement that he couldn't negotiate punitively enough. Was it for "basketball reasons" that Stern did this, making a full-on mockery of the men who run his teams in a way that sullied the NBA's public image and credibility far more than any superstars flocking toward each other could?

"We are ruled by a dictator," said one of several angered and flummoxed team executives I spoke with Thursday night in the aftermath of this bush-league decision, one that threatens to blow the lid off the power struggle that has brewing between owners and players for months in the bargaining room -- and, in truth, for decades otherwise.

"What if this had been done before the players voted on the deal?" a management source said. "They wouldn't have voted for it."

And while Paul was said to be discussing his legal options with Billy Hunter, the executive director of the National Basketball Players Association, the frustration across the league is such that a grievance or protest letter will hardly suffice. And if the players and their union were capable of organizing a press conference -- much less getting, oh, half the union membership to vote on the new CBA -- then the only rational and meaningful course of action here would be for 450 players to refuse to show up for work Friday when training camps are scheduled to open.

I know of at least one player who won't be at training camp Friday; that would be Paul, who almost assuredly will be a no-show, according to a person in contact with the Hornets' hierarchy. This is only a minor symptom of the pandemic Stern unleashed on the NBA Thursday. He turned Paul, one of the bright, smiling stars of the league who had never once publicly griped or demanded to be traded, into a villain.

"I believe in free agency," Stern said, incredibly, at the news conference announcing that owners had ratified this CBA they're now railing against by a vote of 25-5. "We have a deal where a player who has completed his time at a team under a contract has a right to go someplace else. And then there are potential judgments to be made by teams about whether there's a time when they want to consider getting something more for that player in the event he will leave. ... So nothing has changed about that. That dynamic is the same."

Unless you're the team that's owned by the rest of the teams, and they're out to get the pound of flesh they couldn't get at the bargaining table -- even though they did get a cool $3 billion over 10 years, no matter where Chris Paul or anybody else plays.

Make no mistake, this is pure ugliness -- warped, second-rate foolishness you'd expect to find in some half-baked, fringe semi-pro league office in Topeka or Toledo. This is the NBA becoming the Bad News Bears right before our horrified eyes.

Small- and mid-market teams being angry with the big-market star-poaching that was happening on the very day when the new CBA was approved is only half the story. Half the story is what Cavaliers owner Dan Gilbert told in a letter he wrote to Stern Thursday requesting that the Paul trade be disallowed.

"I just don't see how we can allow this trade to happen," Gilbert wrote in the letter, obtained by Yahoo Sports. "I know the vast majority of owners feel the same way I do."

Gilbert pointed out that the trade would net the Lakers the best player in the deal and save them $40 million in salary and luxury taxes over the next three seasons. But this is not what would've happened. It was widely known that Paul, after a six-month waiting period instituted in the new CBA, would sign a new five-year, $100 million contract with the Lakers after opting out of his contract on July 1. And the Lakers, who'd be bereft of big men after sending Pau Gasol to the Rockets and Lamar Odom to the Hornets, would need to spend more to replace that size or risk having Kobe Bryant keel over in frustration while Paul futilely dribbled in circles with nobody to receive his magical passes.

While there was no question the Lakers were getting a huge star, it was hardly a guarantee that the trade would make them appreciably better. In fact, several rival GMs calculated that the trade may have made the Lakers worse in the short term, and applauded Demps for getting a haul of quality players (Odom, Luis Scola, Kevin Martin) plus Goran Dragic and a first-round pick for a player everybody knew would one day leave on his own.

"Are they saying that Stu Jackson or David Stern or whoever the ___ it is knows more than the experienced GMs who made this deal?" one person involved in front-office dealings said.

Of the players Demps was going to get, three are capable starters, and one (Dragic) is a low-priced yet effective backup point guard. The draft pick in 2012, formerly belonging to the Knicks and only top-five protected, promises to be in the middle of the first round round of a deep and loaded draft. Only one player -- Scola, one of the most efficient post players in the league -- carries significant financial obligations beyond next season. Martin, who scores 20 points a night in his sleep, is 28 and has two years left totaling about $25 million -- or, the same total amount the Clippers lavished on Caron Butler Thursday without anyone stepping in to stop that.

It made sense, too, for the Rockets, who cleared $3.5 million and would've had room with the amnesty of one player to offer a max contract to a free agent like Nene -- or use the space in other creative ways. Gasol, among the league's most gifted big men, would fill the gaping hole in the middle left by Yao Ming's premature retirement.

Would the Lakers turn around and offer Andrew Bynum to Orlando in a trade for Dwight Howard, and is that what Stern and his petulant owners were afraid of? Well, with no other assets to offer, if the Lakers had traded Bynum straight-up for Howard between now and Christmas, that would've been a trade no one would argue with if it were called off for "basketball reasons." The Lakers weren't trading for Howard any more than Paul was staying in New Orleans beyond this season.

But more than that, the NBA has the fresh stench of a scandal wafting over it as it re-opens for business Friday -- re-opens for business as usual. The lockout ended, but the circus tent and all the pent-up anger and aggression inside of it hasn't gone away.

Immediately on the heels of a lockout that obviously accomplished nothing, the NBA managed to step into an even bigger pile of its own waste before the first whistle had even been blown or basketball dribbled. This supposedly healed economic model resulted in a trade that was disallowed because the sad-sack, charity case team supposedly couldn't be trusted to make its own decisions. And after this, how will that team possibly be able to make it any more? After making a credible, beneficial trade under the circumstances, how is Demps going to find a way to save his franchise with a better one?

But something bigger than that happened Thursday. The NBA became the place where conspiracy theories and frozen envelopes and suspicious whistles are no longer the stuff of overactive imaginations or the objects of cold stares from company men. It all came home to roost with this decision from Stern Thursday night, a fine way to take something that was already going to be a struggle -- a lockout-shortened season filled with bad blood and worse basketball -- and turn it into something far worse.

The punchline of a sorry excuse for a joke, under a circus tent growing more inflated by the minute.

Juan

12-09-2011, 04:38 AM

Do yourself a favor, if you want to understand why not just Laker fans are upset at what happened Thursday, read that article

Juan

12-09-2011, 04:51 AM

and David Stern can't afford to have any more money or trade scandals, especially when the Lakers are involved.

Except that everyone knows that the cloud of doubt and "shadyness" was cast over David Stern and Tim Donaghy over the events you're alluding to.

There is no "eye" to keep on the Lakers, except if you're in the train of thought that the NBA favors the Lakers, which after today, should be obvious is non-existent.

DaveWadding

12-09-2011, 08:37 AM

Also, Im pissed off no ones starting the TPWW fantasy league up.

I did. Did you miss that?

Droford

12-09-2011, 09:09 AM

I did. Did you miss that?
yes, obviously

Im in..may not make the draft but I will try.

Evil Vito

12-09-2011, 10:47 AM

Brandon Roy retires.

Triple Naitch

12-09-2011, 12:01 PM

This trade is causing problems with execs in the league like a bullshit trade in a fantasy baseball league.

Evil Vito

12-09-2011, 12:50 PM

LOL apparently the Nets met with Dwight Howard yesterday. Would be a major violation of tampering rules.

Emperor Smeat

12-09-2011, 02:46 PM

Brandon Roy retires.

Too bad he got too injured prone considering the Blazers were building up for a while to become the next potential big team in the West.

RoXer

12-09-2011, 03:01 PM

The Sixth Day of NBA Christmas
Day 6: When Chris Paul let us know David Stern had stayed too long
By Bill SimmonsPOSTED DECEMBER 9, 2011

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2011/1208/nba_g_paul_bryant_b8_576.jpg

Note: This could end up being one of the craziest months in NBA history. To celebrate the signings, trades, rumors, roster shuffling, insanity and (almost definitely) ensuing hilarity/incompetence, I have unleashed a special series called "The 12 Days of NBA Christmas." Every weekday through December 19 (give or take a day), I will be writing about this unexpected NBA Christmas.

Day 1: The Road to Groundhog Day (and more dumb contracts than ever)
Day 2: The Donut Dilemma (the bubble in the center market)
Day 3: Is Arron Afflalo really worth $50 million?
Day 4: Where the hell is Chris Paul going?
Day 5: Inside Grantland Featuring Blake Griffin, Part II
Day 6: (12/9) The Day the NBA Lost Its Way

Norm MacDonald's Comedy Central show may not have lasted long, but it left behind my favorite two-word phrase of 2011: "Wait, what?" The bit went like this: Norm would read a completely insane story with a totally straight face, milk it for a beat, then do a double-take and scream, "Wait, what???" It always slayed me.

See, life is full of those "Wait, what???" moments … you know, like yesterday, right after the Lakers pulled off a three-team trade for Chris Paul, when everyone was still digesting that stunning news through phone calls, e-mails and tweets. I had just tweeted a joke about coming to grips with my favorite point guard — Paul, a true artist, maybe the best pure point guard who ever lived — playing across the street from my office, for the team I hate the most, ultimately deciding that I just needed to get drunk. Not even a minute later, my cell phone rang. A friend of mine was on the line. He's never steered me wrong. And now, he was about to put me into a freaking stupor.

"The trade's off! The NBA vetoed the trade!!!"

Wait, what?

"The NBA vetoed the trade! They said it wasn't in the best interests of the league."

WAIT, WHAT?

"You heard me. They said it wasn't in the best interests in the league. Chris has to play out the year in New Orleans."

You know the rest. One of the strangest things about loving sports: Those random moments when you're sitting in your house, your office, your classroom, wherever … and suddenly you get blown away by a legitimate bombshell. This was crazy. This was insane. This made no sense. By blocking the trade, David Stern was willingly creating his own Watergate and validating every critic who ever claimed, "That guy stayed too long." Tim Donaghy was just one guy acting alone — we think — and tampering with dozens of games before they caught him. Blocking the Paul trade? This was different. This was Big Brother stuff. This was one of the biggest conflicts of interest in sports history. This was a league intentionally jeopardizing its own credibility. This was a scandal popping out of thin air, self-created, almost like a man-made lake or something.

These are the facts: Twelve months ago, the NBA bought the New Orleans Hornets for a little more than $300 million. Every other owner (29 in all) split the price for the franchise, the same way you'd split a meal 12 ways for your buddy's birthday or something. Stern and his cronies claimed this wouldn't be a problem, that Hornets GM Dell Demps would be able to swing moves just like any other general manager. When Mark Cuban flipped out in February after a Carl Landry/Marcus Thornton swap caused New Orleans' payroll to rise, nobody really cared. When the lockout dragged on for five months and nobody ever seriously considered contracting the Hornets — a franchise that lost money AND couldn't find an owner — nobody really cared. When the Hornets stole the spotlight after the labor agreement by immediately being involved in 50,000 different trade rumors, nobody really cared. We all assumed things were "on the level."

And why not? We had no reason to think differently … right? The league made a point of saying that Demps had been empowered to make any trade (without interference). Every team dealing with New Orleans believed that Demps was in charge — without any question — and that they weren't wasting their time spending their days batting around ideas with him. On Wednesday morning, when I was working on my column about Paul trades, I sniffed around on Stern's role in the trade talks and got the same answer from different people: It's Dell Demps' call. I ended up joking in that column that Stern might block a Clippers/Paul trade to avoid having Donald Sterling own one of the league's signature franchises. Everyone read that and got the joke.

I mean, Stern wouldn't actually BLOCK a trade. That's preposterous. Right?

Fast-forward to Thursday night: Those first few minutes after word spread (not only that the trade was canceled, but that Paul would probably remain in New Orleans for the entire season), as everyone came to the same sobering conclusion. The old man finally lost his mind. Sure, he was pushed there by a cluster of bitter owners, but the old Stern never would have rolled over like that. Twenty years ago, 10 years ago, maybe even five years ago, Stern would have brushed them off in his endearingly condescending way, quelled the fire, called in a favor or two, acted like the politician he always secretly was. Not this time. The old man doesn't have the same sway. We just witnessed it during that lockout. Few people understood how much time and effort he spent pushing his holdout owners toward that final compromise. He barely got there.

If you want to know the truth, Stern started losing control of the league during the middle of last decade, when a new generation of wealthy billionaires started paying full boat for franchises. The days of Abe Pollin and Bill Davidson were long gone — family guys who bought in early, stuck with their investments and watched their league flourish into something much bigger than they ever expected. Stern's favorite owner was Larry Miller, a dynamic Salt Lake City businessman and philanthropist who bought the Jazz in 1985, then ran the franchise with his family for the next 24 years. A year after diabetes claimed Miller in May of 2009, Stern met the press before a playoff game and spoke earnestly about his affection for Miller. Someone asked the commissioner about Jerry Sloan's longevity. At the time, Sloan was still coaching the Jazz at 67 years old, six months older than Stern.

"We're a dying breed," Stern admitted. "It's not happening anymore. But it sure is reassuring to look there and expect to see him, and darn, he's there. It's kind of neat."

That's probably how Stern thought people saw him. Or, how he hoped people saw him. And in some cases (like with me), it was true. Little did he know that Sloan was losing control of his players — in 2011, an ongoing clash with star Deron Williams caused Sloan to resign — just like Stern was slowly losing control of his owners. The newer generation of guys wasn't indebted to him. They found him to be increasingly obstinate, stuck in his ways, more of a condescending bully than anything. After paying full sticker price for their teams, they weren't interested in answering to some aging know-it-all. Stern's control slowly started to erode, whether he realized it or not.

Leaders thrive when they feel creatively empowered, when they trust the people around them, when their confidence is swelling. Leaders make mistakes when they lose that same confidence, when they're fretting about their power base, when they're reacting instead of acting. The worst kind of leaders hang on too long, get seduced by their own voice, start doing things from memory — because that's the way we've always done it! — stop thinking outside the box, start playing checkers instead of chess. Stern reached that point last night. I think he caved because of the whining owners, but also out of exasperation: because yet another superstar was trying to push his way to another big city, because he's in charge, because THIS IS DAVID STERN'S LEAGUE. It's like the old Will Ferrell/Dodge Stratus SNL sketch:

You don't talk to me like that! I'm David Stern! I make the rules here! You don't get to pick your team, I do! I'm the commissioner of the NBA! I DRIVE A DODGE STRATUS!!!!!

Fact: That trade was totally, undeniably, 100 percent defensible.

Fact: Of the three teams involved, New Orleans made out the best. Repeat: the best. By my calculations, it landed one of the better offensive big men in basketball (Luis Scola), one of the better scoring 2-guards in basketball (Kevin Martin), a playoff-proven forward who can play either spot (Lamar Odom), a scoring point guard with upside (Goran Dragic), and a 2012 no. 1 pick (via the New York Knicks). Can you do better for someone who was leaving in seven months anyway? I hate trading superstars, but if you HAVE to trade a superstar? That's pretty good.

Meanwhile, the Rockets spent the past three years stashing enough pieces to make that trade: Acquiring the second-best center in basketball (Gasol) while leaving enough cap room to sign a marquee free agent (and yes, they were closing in on Nene). And the Lakers paid the steepest price: giving up their best low-post guy and all of their frontcourt depth, giving Andrew Bynum an immense amount of responsibility (you know, the same guy who stormed off the court half-naked during the playoff sweep last spring) and reinventing their team around Paul's aching knee and Kobe's aching knees. It would have been a brilliant move had it worked and a legendary disaster had it failed — especially if Kobe rebelled against sharing the ball with Paul — only now we'll never know.

Once word leaked of the deal, rival owners started rebelling almost immediately. What was the point of that lockout, and all the talk of competitive balance, if the Lakers were allowed to immediately acquire Chris Paul? Dan Gilbert sent a scathing e-mail to a few of the other owners that, of course, was leaked on the Internet last night.

The best part of the letter: "This trade should go to a vote of the 29 owners of the Hornets."

(Translation: "Let's cut Demps' balls off, throw the last few weeks of negotiating out the window and go back on our word. Also, I'm thinking of starting a support group for small-market owners who overpaid for their teams, don't have the balls to sell and would rather whine, bitch and bully about their lot in NBA life. I'm going to call it O.A.: Overpayers Anonymous.")

The second-best part of the letter: "I just don't see how we can allow this trade to happen. I know the vast majority of owners feel the same way that I do. When will we just change the name of 25 of the 30 teams to the Washington Generals?"

(Translation: Boooooooo hooooooo.)

There it was, in all its Comic Sans MS glory, that whopping conflict of interest that had been staring at everyone for 12 solid months. How can a league own one of its own franchises? What happens if it has to, you know, make important trades and stuff? The league always knew that, at some point, the Hornets might have to trade Chris Paul. They claimed they had a plan in place. And they did. Until O.A. started bitching with even more fervor than usual. That's when Stern's eroding power finally sank him. Instead of backing a decision he had already made, Stern choked like Nick Anderson. The unthinkable happened.

He blocked the trade.

Wait, what?

Was it the worst moment of David Stern's entire tenure? I never thought anything would top an official fixing games, but man … how can anything be worse than this? Imagine this happened in your fantasy league. Imagine spending weeks shaping a deal, executing it, then having your commissioner waltz in and say, "Nah, I'm vetoing that one." Would that ever happen? And now this is happening in a PROFESSIONAL SPORTS LEAGUE?

Just know that I'm a die-hard Celtics fan and die-hard Lakers hater … and even I am appalled. I hope Chris Paul sues. I hope the Rockets sue. I hope the Lakers sue. I hope Dell Demps resigns and makes a sex tape with a stripper wearing a David Stern Halloween mask. Whatever happens, the season has been irrevocably tainted — we just watched FIVE teams have their seasons screwed up by this debacle. Houston's three-year plan just went up in smoke; now the Rockets have to make up with their two best players. (Good luck with that.) The Lakers need to determine if their relationship with the notoriously sensitive Gasol and the even more notoriously sensitive Odom is salvageable; and if it's not, what then? The Hornets are just plain screwed. It's a basketball catastrophe for them. As for the Celtics, Pinocchio Ainge's ill-fated pursuit of Paul ruined the team's relationship with Rajon Rondo, only its best young player. Even the Knicks got screwed — supposedly they closed the deal with Tyson Chandler yesterday, never expecting Paul to become available this summer (and now they can't chase him).

The total tally: Five teams were screwed by one cowardly decision.

Here's what saddens me: We should have remembered December 8, 2011, as one of the best random basketball days in years. It was like climbing on a Twitter/e-mail/phone call/texting roller coaster from the moment I woke up. First, Boston was in the lead for Paul as Golden State and the Clippers were falling out. Then, Boston fading as the Knicks were gaining steam. Around lunchtime, I called a Knicks buddy who was gleefully planning a future with Chandler, Carmelo and Paul, with poor Amar'e headed to New Orleans, Orlando, Houston … who the hell knew? And then, boom! That went up in smoke. The Lakers came roaring back, word of a three-teamer spread … and my Knicks buddy went from euphoric to despondent in less than three hours. My Laker fan buddies were crowing, my Boston peeps were freaking out, my dad was practically having a heart attack about the Kobe/Howard/Paul possibilities, Twitter was blowing up … I mean, could that have been a more fun day to be a basketball fan?

The best point guard of his generation was switching teams, in his prime, to the Los Angeles Lakers … and only after the Celtics and Knicks failed to get him. Read that sentence again. It's what Dan Gilbert and the other Overpayers Anonymous owners will never understand. In professional basketball, history trumps everything else. It's not just about playing in Los Angeles. It's about playing for the fucking Lakers. It's about following the footsteps of Magic, Kareem, Wilt, West, Baylor and Shaq. It's about Showtime, Nicholson, the yellow jerseys, the Laker Girls, even that awful Randy Newman song. It's about that buzz before a big Laker home game, when the place is packed with celebs and eye candy, when you're the best guy on the team, when you might as well be the king of the world. When these idiots complain about a "big market/small market" disparity, it's almost like they never followed the league before they bought their teams. Of course there's a disparity! What kid doesn't grow up wanting to play for the Celtics, Lakers or Knicks?

Remember what pissed us off most about LeBron picking Miami over New York? It wasn't just that he tried to stack the decks with a superteam; it's that he walked away from New York, the city with the most basketball fans, the city with the biggest spotlight, the city that would have either made him immortal or broken him in two. He didn't want it. He copped out. He could have picked loyalty (Cleveland) or immortality (New York); instead, he chose help (Miami). That killed us. We hated him for it. What was telling about Chris Paul's choice was that he eschewed the Clippers (a safer basketball situation for him; he would have been able to grow with Eric Gordon, DeAndre Jordan and Blake Griffin) for the Lakers (a much more volatile basketball situation with Kobe's miles and Bynum's knees) for the simple reason that he wanted to be a Laker.

For the right players, it's not about cities as much as teams, uniforms, histories, owners, fans, titles … and Chris Paul cares about the right things. He's the best teammate in the league. As much as it killed me that my least favorite team landed him, the "basketball fan" side of me loved it. Chris Paul and Kobe Bryant … together? Playing across the street from my office? How cool was that? I remember when KG landed on the Celtics, one of my Lakers-fan buddies told me, "I hate KG and I hate the Celtics, but this is going to be cool."

That's how I felt about Chris Paul and the Lakers. If you love basketball — if you truly love it — you appreciated what was happening. And it had nothing to do with the Washington Generals. Believe me.

Of course, that's not how December 8, 2011 will be remembered. Years from now, I won't remember anything about that day except for David Stern losing control of his own league. Once upon a time, it was reassuring to look there and expect to see him, and darn, he was there. It was kind of neat. Those days are long gone. The National Basketball Association has lost its way. I feel like crying.

http://www.grantland.com/story/_/id/7334835/the-sixth-day-nba-christmas?view=print

Splaya

12-09-2011, 03:16 PM

The NBA is an absolute circus right now. I agree with Juan on this subject but I also see everyone else's opinion on it. Who I do not agree with is David Stern and the owners. This is why a league cannot run a team...this basically boils down to collusion. If I were the Hornets, I would threaten to boycott the season. No practice, no games, nothing. If I were the Hornets and Rockets GM's (and this might very well happen) I would quit. Would not be surprised to see more executives quit over this

Splaya

12-09-2011, 03:16 PM

Haven't read that yet, but I absolutely love Bill Simmons. Possibly my favorite author/blogger of all time

Emperor Smeat

12-09-2011, 03:19 PM

Stern's official response basically confirmed the owners saw Chris Paul more valuable in helping selling the Hornets to a new owner than the deal itself either helping or hurting Lakers/Hornets/Rockets.

The owners felt getting rid of a superstar would have dropped the value too much than what Gasol or Odom could regain due to the NBA being too heavily dependent on a few stars than teams or more players.

MLB had the same mess with the Expos once they ran the team and tried very hard not to over do their influence with the Dodgers.

Hanso Amore

12-09-2011, 03:39 PM

Thats true, and somewhat fair. The NBA owns that team. Therefore, the owners have a vested interest in someone buying that team. Nobody is lining up to buy the Hornets with an Old Lamar Odom as the star.

Hanso Amore

12-09-2011, 03:42 PM

Still, whole thing is just fucked.

Splaya

12-09-2011, 03:50 PM

Problem is...no one is going to buy the Hornets if you think Paul is going to be their star. There is no way in hell he re-signs with them, even if they were to throw 20-25 million a season at him...wanna know why?? Paul wants to do what few players do: Put winning the ring first, money second

Aguakate

12-09-2011, 05:53 PM

The NBA has to sell the Hornets.

No matter how you look at it, the NBA nixing a trade so they can "protect" the team it owns is a conflict of interest.

Emperor Smeat

12-09-2011, 06:03 PM

Celtics trade Big Baby Glen Davis to the Magic for Brandon Bass in a sign-and-trade deal.

Celtics will agree to a new contract extension for Davis before shipping him off with 4 years added to his current contract and around maybe $24 million extra.

Stats and player-wise, both players are almost the same but the Celtics get a cheaper player.

Juan

12-10-2011, 01:40 AM

So.......... if the Lakers/CP3 deal isn't made by Monday, the players union and/or CP3 himself will pursue legal action against the NBA.

Aguakate

12-10-2011, 03:28 AM

http://i40.tinypic.com/m9bsc5.gif

Juan

12-10-2011, 03:30 AM

Feel so bad for Odom and Gasol. My 2 favorite players on the team aside from KB

alvarado52

12-10-2011, 04:07 AM

Not so much Odom, but Pau im definitely gonna miss.

alvarado52

12-10-2011, 04:08 AM

Honestly wish theyd throw them Bynum instead.

Juan

12-10-2011, 04:10 AM

i agree on Bynum, but I have a soft spot for Odom after all he's been thru personally. Seems like such a sweet heart

12-10-2011, 04:43 AM

i agree on Bynum, but I have a soft spot for Odom after all he's been thru personally. Seems like such a sweet heart

You're so gay

Juan

12-10-2011, 04:45 AM

Little bit

Nark Order

12-10-2011, 12:09 PM

I have absolutely no respect for Chris Paul anymore. If you want to play for the Lakers on purpose, you are automatically a fucking asshole.

SammyG

12-10-2011, 03:58 PM

lol, ok Narc. Anyway, I'm hoping for some reason that with this restructured trade we can somehow keep Gasol.. DOUBTFUL, but hoping.

alvarado52

12-10-2011, 04:28 PM

Narc, can you at least pretend to appreciate the game? Youre seriously on another level here, and its hard to take someone serious as a 'fan' of the sport if they give no constructive criticism.

I fucking hate the Celtics, but i dont write off everyone on the team, or who goes to them...and i appreciate what they, and their players, bring to the GAME of BASKETBALL.

Cant stand Rondo, but i also feel he is one of the best pure PGs of the game in a long time.

SammyG

12-10-2011, 05:47 PM

This trade will be done by tomorrow.

owenbrown

12-11-2011, 12:19 AM

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/nba/story/_/id/7340640/los-angeles-lakers-pull-trade-talks-chris-paul-according-sources

Updated: December 11, 2011, 12:16 AM ET
Sources: Lakers out of Chris Paul talks
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692
By Marc Stein
ESPN.com
Archive
The Los Angeles Lakers have pulled out of the three-team deal with New Orleans and Houston that would have landed Chris Paul in L.A., according to sources close to the talks.

The reason for the Lakers' withdrawal was not immediately known.

The Hornets, Rockets and Lakers had been working for the past 48 hours to complete a reconfigured version of the trade that the teams struck Thursday that had been vetoed by NBA commissioner David Stern.

The Hornets, according to sources, will now now redouble their efforts to trade Paul elsewhere, who can become a free agent at season's end.

The Lakers are now expected to turn their full focus to obtaining Dwight Howard, who has asked the Orlando Magic to trade him.

One source close to the process said that the Lakers will instead trade Lamar Odom to the Dallas Mavericks.

The Lakers will receive unspecified draft considerations from the Mavericks in exchange for Odom, whose contract slots into the Mavericks' trade exception created in their three-team trade earlier Saturday that sent Tyson Chandler to New York.

Marc Stein is a senior writer for ESPN.com.

Follow Marc Stein on Twitter: @ESPNSteinLine

DaveWadding

12-11-2011, 12:39 AM

This trade will be done by tomorrow.

You were right. :lol:

Aguakate

12-11-2011, 12:44 AM

Dwight Howard is the guy the Lakers should've gone after in the first place.

alvarado52

12-11-2011, 03:34 AM

trade LO to...another title contender in our same conference? Makes sense. Not really.

DaveWadding

12-11-2011, 10:36 AM

Khloe & Lamar Take Dallas?

alvarado52

12-11-2011, 12:01 PM

My only assumption here is that theyre (obviously) gonna make a run at D12, and potentially sign Chauncy Billups. At least this is what im hoping.

Evil Vito

12-11-2011, 05:00 PM

Triple Naitch

12-11-2011, 05:03 PM

Apparently LO asked to be traded after the Paul trade fell apart.

alvarado52

12-11-2011, 06:33 PM

Cant say i blame him. As someone said earlier though, they shouldnt take things so hard...its a business, its their job, and they get paid damn well. I think any one of us here would have no problem relocating for 8 million a year...hell, even 1 million a year.

So anyway, im hoping our starting my wet dreams now of:
PG Billups
SG Bryant
SF Artest (refuse to call him World Peace)
PF Gasol
C Howard

though something tells me if we land Howard, we'll probably have to part with both Bynum and Gasol.

Triple Naitch

12-11-2011, 06:42 PM

I don't think Orlando would take Gasol. Probably would take Bynum, LA's 1st round pick, Dallas' 1st round pick, and the trade exception they acquired to get Howard.

Emperor Smeat

12-11-2011, 06:48 PM

They were also rumored to want some lottery range picks along with the regular draft picks although that would require a multi-team deal which could explain what they would do with Gasol if the Lakers make the deal.

SammyG

12-11-2011, 07:50 PM

Fuck this shit. Just start the season. I'm not even that excited anymore.

Skippord

12-11-2011, 07:58 PM

hope Chauncey goes to the Heat

Nark Order

12-11-2011, 07:58 PM

This whole sequence of events was incredible.

SammyG

12-11-2011, 08:54 PM

Lamar to Dallas for a trade exception and a draft pick. Fuck that. Unless we're setting up a massive trade, I don't know what the fuck is going on.

Emperor Smeat

12-12-2011, 12:19 PM

Clippers very close to getting Chris Paul with the biggest holdup being the NBA wants either Bledsoe or a few more draft picks from the Clippers tossed in the deal.

The NBA also don't really want to trade Paul until a new owner is found but if they can get the team a lot younger and stocked with draft picks, it helps their future value a lot. Biggest problem with the Lakers deal was how it would have given them at least 2 good players for now but nothing set for the future and Paul was seen more valuable than an Odom and Gasol pairing.

Orlando is asking any deal from the Lakers has to include Bynum, and Gasol or a lot of draft picks from the Lakers to go along what the other teams would give in a multi-team deal.

Dragon

12-12-2011, 12:59 PM

<font color=goldenrod>I'm slightly irked that the Knicks used their amnesty right away on a guy who only had one year on his deal...but I guess trading him would have been rather difficult at $14.2 million.

I see Billups going to either the Heat or the Lakers, hopefully the latter because I'd hate to see him draining 3's against the Knicks.</font>

Yeah, sucks they had to get rid of Chauncey but I don't really mind them using the amnesty. You could only use it on players signed before this new CBA happened so their only other options would have been using it on Carmelo or Amare down the line. I could have seen why it would have made sense to hold on to it in case Amare's knees don't hold up but thats really the only situation.

FearedSanctity

12-12-2011, 01:15 PM

lol CP3/Clippers deal is apparently dead now

Dragon

12-12-2011, 01:20 PM

And if he clears waivers I think he's definitely going to the Heat. He's gonna play like an animal against the Knicks.

RoXer

12-12-2011, 03:02 PM

http://a3.twimg.com/profile_images/1685231740/dannyhate_normal.jpg (http://twitter.com/#%21/sportsguy33) @sportsguy33 (http://twitter.com/#%21/sportsguy33) Bill Simmons

Impossible NOT to think of this video when thinking about David Stern's performance these past 4 days: http://youtu.be/QFKRUGfJm78

DaveWadding

12-12-2011, 03:29 PM

The league wanted

Eric Gordon
Eric Bledsoe
Al-Farouq Aminu
Chris Kaman

and

Minnesota's unprotected 1st round pick

for CP3. Christ.

alvarado52

12-12-2011, 10:04 PM

lololol?

The Los Angeles Clippers claimed Chauncey Billups off amnesty waivers, just hours after they backed out of trade talks with the NBA for New Orleans Hornets guard Chris Paul, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AvKDJFCwuL1trQXfu9ZNXLo5nYcB?slug=ys-free_agent_buzz_121211

Aguakate

12-12-2011, 11:47 PM

JJ Barea signs a 4 year $14 Million contract with the Minnesota Timberwolves.

Aguakate

12-13-2011, 12:36 AM

http://i40.tinypic.com/2wdn8k9.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/eip6ic.jpg

Juan

12-13-2011, 12:45 AM

JJ Barea signs a 4 year $14 Million contract with the Minnesota Timberwolves.

lol poor guy

Aguakate

12-13-2011, 12:50 AM

lol poor guy

Poor guy? Fuck him.

He has one good season, where he contributes, and then a very good postseason, and all of a sudden he thinks the Mavs have to give him a multi-year contract worth Millions and Millions of dollars. Apparently the Mavs offered him a 1 year deal worth like $4, and he was "offended". What he SHOULD'VE done is take that contract, prove that he's for real, not just a "one year wonder", and then after the season, when he's in better position to actually demand something, cash in. Now he goes from a World Champion team, to last place.

These Puerto Rican players are so fucking stupid. They think they deserve it all just because they made it to the NBA. Carlos Arroyo is the same way.

Juan

12-13-2011, 12:55 AM

Pretty sure that any NBA player would have done the same thing, regardless of ethnicity.

12-13-2011, 04:47 AM

Pacers are sending McRoberts and Rush for O.J Mayo.

I thought the Pacers were already contenders when they added David West. Now if Mayo reaches his potential in Indy and they got George Hill???

I think the Pacers can take the Eastern Conference.

Hanso Amore

12-13-2011, 09:35 AM

FearedSanctity

12-13-2011, 06:24 PM

Who the fuck are Rudy Fernandez and Corey Brewer and why should I care?

Skippord

12-13-2011, 06:25 PM

well they fill in nicely for the half of the team that is still in China/Europe I guess

DaveBrawl

12-13-2011, 09:29 PM

I suppose we could also fill in for them if they just need bodies.

Juan

12-14-2011, 02:43 AM

Marc Stein @ESPNSteinLine 2 mins

Just filed w/@Chris_Broussard: NBA officials and Clippers traded Chris Paul proposals into TUES night, but sources say Lakers back in hunt

SammyG

12-14-2011, 12:54 PM

WOO JOSH MCROBERTS, CHAMPIONSHIP

Gertner

12-14-2011, 12:57 PM

Jazz signed according to RP, the best point guard in the league 3 years ago : Jamaal Tinsley

Triple Naitch

12-14-2011, 06:32 PM

http://cache.gawkerassets.com/assets/images/11/2011/12/754990406cd691ee4dfa2ff495f6e6d9.jpg

RoXer

12-14-2011, 06:35 PM

fuckin sweet

Juan

12-14-2011, 07:27 PM

Josh McRoberts signs with the Lakers. RP's gonna be pissed

RoXer

12-14-2011, 07:36 PM

NBA trades Paul to Clippers
Yahoo! Sports Staff

By Adrian Wojnarowski and Marc J. Spears, Yahoo! Sports Staff 31 minutes ago

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The NBA has reached an agreement to trade New Orleans Hornets point guard Chris Paul to the Los Angeles Clippers, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

The Hornets will receive guard Eric Gordon, center Chris Kaman, forward Al-Farouq Aminu and the Minnesota Timberwolves’ unprotected first-round pick.

Nark Order

12-14-2011, 08:40 PM

LOL YESSSS. This is incredible.

Gertner

12-14-2011, 09:06 PM

hahaha fuck you Lakers!

Juan

12-14-2011, 09:17 PM

http://www.lamarodom.com/files/images/NewMavsFive.jpg

:(

Crimson

12-14-2011, 09:32 PM

Clippers will finish with a better record than the Lakers

Juan

12-14-2011, 09:42 PM

I'm no SammyG, but I can almost guarantee that doesn't happen.

Nark Order

12-14-2011, 09:47 PM

Billy Crystal is off somewhere flipping his shit.

SammyG

12-14-2011, 10:39 PM

lol Clippers. Oh well. Lakers run was fun while it lasted.

Gertner

12-14-2011, 10:46 PM

Kobe's gonna have to rape a bitch hard tonight!

Juan

12-15-2011, 12:41 AM

lol Clippers. Oh well. Lakers run was fun while it lasted.

So that's it? You're off the bandwagon?

Aguakate

12-15-2011, 12:45 AM

http://www.lamarodom.com/files/images/NewMavsFive.jpg

:(

Had no idea Vince Carter was a Maverick :wtf:

This Dallas team, IDK...they may be better than last season's version.

RoXer

12-15-2011, 12:53 AM

is anyone under 39 in that pic?

Juan

12-15-2011, 01:12 AM

They all are. The oldest one is Vince Carter (34)

ddpBANG

12-15-2011, 04:19 AM

Jason Kidd is 38

SammyG

12-15-2011, 09:55 AM

So that's it? You're off the bandwagon?
lol you fat Mexican. Of course not. It's not a bandwagon I'm on either, I've been a Lakers fan my whole life and will continue to do so. Just disappointed we couldn't get CP3. With this current roster, and its age, I don't know if LA can seriously make a run at a championship. Let's hope so.

Hanso Amore

12-15-2011, 10:31 AM

Caron butler went to LAC too? Not bad, I thought they were spreading themselves thin with the trade, but that works.

They now have CP3, Mo Williams, and Chauncey Billups. Trade for a Swingman me thinks?

Hanso Amore

12-15-2011, 10:32 AM

Send williams or billups to detroit and save Ben Gordon. That would be a sick ass move.

Hanso Amore

12-15-2011, 10:46 AM

lol you fat Mexican. Of course not. It's not a bandwagon I'm on either, I've been a Lakers fan my whole life and will continue to do so. Just disappointed we couldn't get CP3. With this current roster, and its age, I don't know if LA can seriously make a run at a championship. Let's hope so.

I think they will have a good record, and could win a round or two in the playoffs, maybe even make the title series and win. But it wont be a given like it has been. I still think they are the class of the west.

Rip Hamilton is a Bull...

Not sure I love this. I think the Bulls are on the fringe of being the 2nd best team in the East.

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 11:07 AM

DaveBrawl

12-15-2011, 11:30 AM

I have always loved the Clippers.

Gertner

12-15-2011, 12:36 PM

Let's get something straight. Every Lakers fan that doesn't live in Los Angeles is a bandwagon fan. Now let's shut up about them now that they are about to fade into obscurity. Also, any Clippers fans that start to surface on this board should be banned. Nobody was a Clippers fan ever.

Every Laker fan not living in LA is a former Jordan era Bulls fan. So yes, they are.

Hanso Amore

12-15-2011, 12:43 PM

Let's get something straight. Every Lakers fan that doesn't live in Los Angeles is a bandwagon fan. Now let's shut up about them now that they are about to fade into obscurity. Also, any Clippers fans that start to surface on this board should be banned. Nobody was a Clippers fan ever.

Sweet Logic. You can only like teams that you live near. Totally legit.

Agree on the Clippers part. Its only a matter of time until those muties show up.

SammyG

12-15-2011, 01:58 PM

That is seriously retarded logic. My dad lived in LA before I was born, taught me to be a Lakers fan when I was growing up in Greece. How the hell am I a bandwagoner.

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 02:09 PM

No, no. I never said that Hanso. You're allowed to like teams that you don't live near. Just not the Lakers.

Hanso Amore

12-15-2011, 02:15 PM

Had no idea Vince Carter was a Maverick :wtf:

This Dallas team, IDK...they may be better than last season's version.

Ladies and Gentleman, the 2001-2003 Dream Team

Buzzkill

12-15-2011, 03:10 PM

Blazers sign Jamal Crawford!!! Who needs B Roy???

Emperor Smeat

12-15-2011, 03:27 PM

Huge scare concerning Jeff Green on the Celtics with medical tests showing a "red flag" and a new round of tests required. It also appears to be something major and not a simple fracture or otter medical issue that gets revealed quickly (nor any drug violations either).

Already some people are starting to fear he might have something wrong with his heart being similar to what ended up killing Reggie Lewis after he had a heart attack during a practice in the late 1980s (and 1 year after Len Bias suddenly died).

Won't know how serious it is until Friday at the earliest.

Juan

12-15-2011, 05:08 PM

Let's get something straight. Every Lakers fan that doesn't live in Los Angeles is a bandwagon fan.

Every Laker fan not living in LA is a former Jordan era Bulls fan. So yes, they are.

Two of the most ignorant posts in this whole thread

McLegend

12-15-2011, 05:11 PM

Going to be honest here...

I think the Sixers this year can be a top 5 seed team in the Eastern Conference. Not because I think they are good, but because I think they are better equiped to handle this lockout season then most other teams. They are young, and have all been together for a season plus.

I think it will work out this year for them.

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 05:25 PM

No, what's ridiculous or ignorant is that everybody seems to push the fact that you "have to respect" the Lakers franchise. No, I don't. Not even a little bit. The Lakers getting unfair advantages is not only a large reason of why my favorite basketball team doesn't have a championship, but it's also a large reason why I may not even have a team to cheer for anymore after next year. Fuck the Lakers and their fans. After the year that we were blatantly raped by the referees to get the Kings/Lakers series to a 7 game series ( See 'Greatest Tragedy in Sports' doc on youtube), our fans pretty much gave up. Sacramento didn't have it in them anymore to put faith behind a team that the league didn't want to win a Championship. Not only was it a disgrace to the sport, but the Lakers and most notably Shaq tried to rub a victory in our faces that they didn't earn whatsoever. After the ref scandals comes the Pau trade and from that moment I just knew that's how it was going to be. I have a big problem with how large market teams get preferential treatment in the league, but above all other teams, I will always hate the Lakers with a brutal and burning passion.

Aside from the Lakers organization being abysmal, Lakers fans are only second to Raiders fans in how fucking ridiculous they are. If they win a big game, they riot. If they lose a big game, they riot. If they start to lose by a large margin, they leave. If they are up by a large margin, they leave. The Lakers and their fans are everything I hate about sports all wrapped up in a bow. Also, anytime you bring up how big of a piece of shit the Lakers organization is, their fans spout off about how they had nothing to do with the reffing scandals or the trade scandals and that it's all the leagues fault. But they have absolutely no qualms benefiting from all of the ridiculous shady behavior. If you are a Lakers fan, then you inherit ALL of the history from the team, not just the stuff you want to highlight.

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 05:28 PM

Juan

12-15-2011, 05:31 PM

Yeah, what ever

Juan

12-15-2011, 05:32 PM

Next you're gonna tell me 9/11 was an inside job

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 05:42 PM

Tim Donaghy admitted it and it was documented in a report to the Board of Governers in explicit detail. It isn't a theory.

The entire report is here if you'd like to read it.

http://assets.espn.go.com/media/pdf/081002/PedowitzReport.pdf

You can put your hands over your ears and yell "LALALALALA" as much as you'd like, it doesn't make it any less real. You could just watch the game and know something ridiculous was at work and then an actual NBA referee whistle blows on the whole situation and it still isn't enough. Alright.

Juan

12-15-2011, 05:52 PM

Tim Donaghy fixed games so he could bet on them and control the point spread.

It sucks I know, but it's not like the Lakers slipped him a twenty to fix the game for them.

Juan

12-15-2011, 05:54 PM

Also, LOL @ the league not wanting Sacramento to win a championship. Come on.

Talk about theories

Juan

12-15-2011, 05:57 PM

But they have absolutely no qualms benefiting from all of the ridiculous shady behavior.

Are you insinuating that if the Kings had been the ones on the winning end, that they would have given back their Western Conference Championship?

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 05:59 PM

Also, LOL @ the league not wanting Sacramento to win a championship. Come on.

Talk about theories

What other conclusion could I possibly come to if our biggest competition to get to a championship is the LA Lakers and a championship series was already rigged in their favor? Not really going out on a limb there.

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 06:02 PM

Tim Donaghy fixed games so he could bet on them and control the point spread.

It sucks I know, but it's not like the Lakers slipped him a twenty to fix the game for them.

Tim Donaghy wasn't even officiating in that game. This is far beyond just Tim Donaghy.

Juan

12-15-2011, 06:18 PM

But he fact remains that they were fixing games to put money in their pockets, not to help out their buddies against the Kings

Emperor Smeat

12-15-2011, 06:20 PM

Didn't the scandal also involve other series and teams stretching for a few years although the Kings-Lakers 2002 series became the worst due to how badly it was officiated and people at the time being convinced it was fixed. I know the Bucks complained a bit about potentially lopsided officiating during either the year Philly or Indy went to the NBA Finals.

ESPN managed to completely break down the Chris Paul deal involving the Clippers and the failed one against the Lakers.
The Lakers deal would have made the Hornets playoff-ready for the next few years but the team's age would be around 30-31 and not enough salary cap flexibility.

The Clippers deal makes the Hornets a lot younger (24 years old) with a better stockpile of draft picks for future needs but potentially would need a couple of years to rebuild back to a quality playoff spot level.

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 06:21 PM

Tim Donaghy claims that certain games were officiated a certain way by request of the NBA. Which makes complete sense in this particular game in question seeing as how a lengthy series brings in more revenue, as does a big market team winning a championship (as opposed to a small market team like the Sacramento Kings).

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 06:23 PM

Juan

12-15-2011, 06:57 PM

as does a big market team winning a championship (as opposed to a small market team like the Sacramento Kings).

If the NBA was really "against" small market teams winning a championship, I don't think Spurs would have 4 championships.

Crimson

12-15-2011, 07:20 PM

Donaghy is far from reliable.

Crimson

12-15-2011, 07:21 PM

Im no Clippers fan..but Im totally seeking and would rather buy tickets for their games instead of going to a Lakers game this year

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 07:28 PM

Donaghy is far from reliable.

Which is exactly why the NBA can get away with denying something pretty clear to see. Donaghy or not, I think it's fairly common knowledge by now that the NBA has been corrupt in certain aspects of their business for years. The Lakers/Kings 2002 Game 6 incident is only a clear indication of an ongoing problem, not the entire problem.

Triple Naitch

12-15-2011, 07:35 PM

I think Frankie Muniz is the only real Clippers fan.

Nark Order

12-15-2011, 07:55 PM

Don't forget Billy Crystal!

Triple Naitch

12-15-2011, 07:59 PM

Nah, if the Knicks moved to LA he would jump in a heartbeat.

alvarado52

12-16-2011, 01:09 AM

owenbrown

12-16-2011, 05:09 AM

Nark Order

12-16-2011, 10:13 AM

Okay Mr. Miami Heat as soon as they signed LeBron.

I think it's quite obvious that I'm not a Miami Heat fan by any means. I will say though, I enjoyed how Lakers fans on this board were flipping their shit over it. Funny how every major decision is "bad for the league" or "is destroying the legitimacy of basketball" unless it benefits the Lakers. Getting shady deals and winning undeserved championships is fine for basketball.

Gertner

12-16-2011, 10:48 AM

Two of the most ignorant posts in this whole thread

It's 100% true. Thankfully the Clippers play in LA so they don't have to travel far to jump on the next bandwagon.

alvarado52

12-16-2011, 05:18 PM

I think it's quite obvious that I'm not a Miami Heat fan by any means. I will say though, I enjoyed how Lakers fans on this board were flipping their shit over it. Funny how every major decision is "bad for the league" or "is destroying the legitimacy of basketball" unless it benefits the Lakers. Getting shady deals and winning undeserved championships is fine for basketball.

first off, youre very general about this all. Second, youre full of shit.

Im a diehard Lakers fan, but i hate super teams. When the whispers had D12 and CP3 going to LA i was NOT, repeat, NOT for it. On the other hand, landing one of those young talents would have been good, because the Lakers are aging, and very soon will have to make a semi-youth movement.

So why the fuck wouldnt you do that with an established all-star if you could? Would you have verbally trashed the situation if it was those two going to the Kings? Highly doubt it.

You are ridiculously biased, so much to the point where nobody here can really consider you a fan of the sport, league, whatever.

Juan

12-16-2011, 05:34 PM

Nark Order

12-16-2011, 05:40 PM

How am I supposed to be not biased when the one chance my team actually had at a championship was unfairly taken away by biased officiating in favor of the largest market team in the league (The Lakers)? As a direct result of us not winning that championship, the Kings may be leaving my city as soon as next year. Why would I not hold a grudge about that? Of course I'm biased but it's not like I don't have history backing me up. If the Lakers didn't have a history of shady behavior (or at least a history of the NBA favoring them as a franchise because they make money) I wouldn't have anything to work off of.

I don't like the Lakers because they aren't subject to the same rules as every other team in the league. Why would I not hate a team that gets constant unfair advantages over and over again because of the amount of revenue they bring in? It's complete bullshit. All I've ever wanted was for the NBA to just be a fair and balanced display of competitive sport, not a popularity contest that rewards the colors that bring in the most cash.

And of course I would want CP3 and Dwight on my team. I would want Pau Gasol on my team too, but it matters how these deals are made. I guarantee that if the Kings were in the situation the Lakers were and offered the same trade for Pau, that there is absolutely no fucking way it would've happened. EVER. Why do you think that is? The Hornets are a team owned by the NBA and were about to trade their best young asset for a slew of older mediocre players to the biggest market team in the league. Why do you think that is?

It's complete horseshit. Coming off the heels of the lockout, which partly dealt with how smaller market teams are supposed to stay competitive with the large markets... we have a top 5 NBA player being traded from a small market (owned by the league) to the biggest market for mediocre players that are 30+ years old. What is anybody even doing if they let that happen?

Juan

12-16-2011, 05:51 PM

http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm217/Allume-Le-Cirque/Sig/Kobe-U-Mad.jpg

Nark Order

12-16-2011, 05:53 PM

And that's about as intelligent of a response as I ever get from Lakers fans.

Juan

12-16-2011, 05:58 PM

You're complaining about the 2002 Conference Finals (again) - Get over it

You're complaining about the Lakers wanting CP3 and D12 - It didn't happen, get over it.

Nark Order

12-16-2011, 06:01 PM

The thing is though, there's no real response to allegations of cheating or shady behavior because it's true. Nobody can really say anything besides things like "QQ" and "U Mad." It's all true and there's adequate documentation. You say I've said the same things before...

Yet nobody yet has come up with an adequate rebuttal. I mean, go ahead. Take a shot at it. Justify getting unfair advantages because of revenue. I'm listening.

Triple Naitch

12-16-2011, 06:23 PM

Nark Order

12-16-2011, 07:01 PM

How many have won a championship because of it?

And I don't know if I agree about the Cavs this past year but who knows. That just seemed like horrible luck for the Clippers.

MoFo

12-16-2011, 07:13 PM

I think that even the Cavaliers got a little bit of assistance from David Stern in getting the #1 pick this year for what happened to them and LeBron.

Lost 26 in a row last yr, need all the help we can get :foc:

Triple Naitch

12-16-2011, 08:46 PM

Kobe's wife is filing for divorce. I wonder if David Stern can do anything to block it.

Emperor Smeat

12-16-2011, 09:25 PM

A lot of teams get unfair advantages in the NBA. Do you really think the Knicks drew the top spot in the NBA Draft when they took Patrick Ewing? I think that even the Cavaliers got a little bit of assistance from David Stern in getting the #1 pick this year for what happened to them and LeBron.

I'd argue the whole situation with the Lottery being a different type of "rigging" because of how many times the actual worst or 2nd worst team never ends up with the #1 pick. If the NBA lottery was done in real life lottos, everyone would be hitting the jackpot a lot more than statistically possible.

Celtics alone got robbed twice when they were the worst or 2nd worst in recent past. They lost out on Tim Duncan who ended up going to San Antonio and then in the Durrant draft.

Usually ends up being a team who needs the potential star power the most wins it rather than a really horrible team who needs it to improve. A lot more smaller market teams have benefited but even then only when the situation is in dire need than normal.

Ermaximus

12-16-2011, 10:07 PM

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/dd/Luol_Deng_Wizards.jpg

Ermaximus

12-16-2011, 10:09 PM

http://www.picturessports.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Derrick-Rose-Dunk.jpg

Ermaximus

12-16-2011, 10:12 PM

http://www.nba-pictures.net/data/media/53/Joakim-Noah-6.jpg

Ermaximus

12-16-2011, 10:13 PM

The real big 3. Fuck those posers in Miami.

Buzzkill

12-16-2011, 10:23 PM

Wish Dwight would go to Chicago. I need a new team now that the Blazers are rebuilding, and I loved rooting for them in the playoffs.

screech

12-17-2011, 12:26 AM

The real big 3. Fuck those posers in Miami.

I don't watch much basketball, so forgive me. I don't recognize those first two guys.

RoXer

12-17-2011, 12:37 AM

That would be Ron Harper, Randy Brown, and Luc Longley.

Juan

12-17-2011, 12:38 AM

lol

screech

12-17-2011, 12:54 AM

If I didn't know Joakim Noah, you probably would've had me.

Triple Naitch

12-17-2011, 08:05 AM

Luol Deng looks frightened of the basketball.

12-17-2011, 09:37 AM

Do the play bye play guys say " Deng!....A-ling!" , when he hits a three?

SammyG

12-17-2011, 09:59 AM

god damn, this has the makings to be an awful season for LA. This Kobe divorce thing might really suck.

Ermaximus

12-17-2011, 10:39 AM

If I didn't know Joakim Noah, you probably would've had me.

1) Luol Deng
2) Derrick Rose

Emperor Smeat

12-17-2011, 02:07 PM

Worst fears about Jeff Green were confirmed as he needs heart surgery and will be out the entire season. They found an aortic aneurysm in his heart and could be similar to what Reggie Lewis had.

According to WebMD, an aortic aneurysm occurs when a bulge forms in part of the aorta. That area weakens, leaving it more susceptible to bursting and potentially fatal bleeding.

The good news is while his contract gets voided for the year, the Celtics have locked up his rights for next season and will provide him with a new contract.

Nark Order

12-17-2011, 02:10 PM

http://blacksportsonline.com/home/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/Jimmer-Fredette-Sacramento-Kings.jpg

screech

12-17-2011, 02:13 PM

1) Luol Deng
2) Derrick Rose

Word. I know who Derrick Rose is. No idea of that first guy, though.

alvarado52

12-17-2011, 05:16 PM

alvarado52

12-17-2011, 05:18 PM

on another note...while the Lakers have made a wtf trade and got shafted by the commish with a simple 'no.', i like the small signings we have made. Under Phil, our rookies never got a chance to develop, but i think with Mike Brown he will play our youngins, and im stoked to see what Ebanks becomes.

Kinda bummed Caracter didnt stick though.

Skippord

12-17-2011, 07:03 PM

Do you think Kobe's wife wants a divorce because he wanted her to dress like Chris Paul when they had sex?

Juan

12-17-2011, 08:28 PM

Juan

12-17-2011, 09:07 PM

Also, Lakers sign Troy Murphy to a 1 year deak

Aguakate

12-18-2011, 12:50 AM

http://i297.photobucket.com/albums/mm217/Allume-Le-Cirque/Sig/Kobe-U-Mad.jpg

Well, we all know Kobe is.

Juan

12-18-2011, 07:33 AM

All BS aside, I really can't wait for the NBA to start.

Lakers aren't the favorites and I'm ok with that. Just really anxious to see how the season plays out.

Triple Naitch

12-18-2011, 11:18 AM

Is there still room in the TPWW Fantasy NBA league? Or did that start already?

Triple Naitch

12-18-2011, 04:55 PM

Evil Vito

12-18-2011, 05:00 PM

<font color=goldenrod>Baron Davis to the Knicks on a 1 year deal.</font>

DaveWadding

12-18-2011, 05:40 PM

Is there still room in the TPWW Fantasy NBA league? Or did that start already?

We drafted on Saturday. sorry.

Gertner

12-19-2011, 03:01 PM

Jazz sign Josh Howard. Not gonna sure who's gonna pass him the ball, but whatever.

MoFo

12-19-2011, 08:37 PM

ESPN here showing

Knicks/Celtics
Mavericks/Heat
Lakers/Bulls

on Xmas day.....so buzzing

Gertner

12-20-2011, 12:07 AM

Kirlenko signs with the Nets. My favourite player is gone :(

Crimson

12-20-2011, 01:05 AM

Clippers running the Lakers outta the building lol..

Supreme Olajuwon

12-20-2011, 10:54 AM

Emperor Smeat

12-20-2011, 02:09 PM

NBA Preseason is just 2 games?

Seems like a waste considering the compact schedule this year although the camps being 2 weeks was fine enough to get back into playing shape.

SammyG

12-20-2011, 02:23 PM

No Drew for 5 games scares me.

DaveWadding

12-21-2011, 03:50 PM

THE BLACK MAMBA has a torn ligament in his shooting wrist

LA HOLLAAAAAAAAAA

SammyG

12-21-2011, 09:31 PM

It's Kobe, like that's gonna stop him. Dude is a machine. I expect him to play on Christmas.

SammyG

12-21-2011, 09:31 PM

By the way ROFL @ MSG booing the fuck out of Kris Humphries for no reason today

Triple Naitch

12-21-2011, 09:41 PM

Honestly feel bad for Kris Humphries. It's like he's the only guy who isn't in on the joke. He should hang out with Rebecca Black.

Nark Order

12-22-2011, 01:21 AM

CLIP SHOWWWWW

Nark Order

12-22-2011, 01:21 AM

Also, Jimmermania is running wild in Sacramento.

ddpBANG

12-22-2011, 02:20 AM

Honestly feel bad for Kris Humphries.

I don't. He's a dick.

SlickyTrickyDamon

12-22-2011, 02:29 AM

I don't watch reality tv shows. Why is he a dick?

Juan

12-22-2011, 02:40 AM

The only reason I can come up with for why Kris Humphries and Lamar Odom are on the most hated NBA players list is because they married Kardashian's

ddpBANG

12-22-2011, 02:53 AM

I don't watch reality tv shows. Why is he a dick?
I don't watch them either. I've met him. That was long before Kim. Lamar is a decent guy.

SammyG

12-23-2011, 12:35 AM

lol @ Blake Griffin shamelessly flopping. Embarassing for a man that size to be flopping left and right

DaveWadding

12-23-2011, 01:06 AM

You would know. I mean, you have to watch Pau Gasol flop like a bitch every night.

Juan

12-23-2011, 02:56 AM

Dave, I think you've officially made more posts about the Lakers than the Suns.

DaveWadding

12-23-2011, 03:04 AM

It's more fun to talk about the Lakers sucking shit than talking about the Suns sucking shit.

SammyG

12-23-2011, 01:00 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=7-sIJ_URnAA

SammyG

12-23-2011, 01:01 PM

We are all witnesses.

12-24-2011, 02:29 AM

Pacers will go 56-10

Juan

12-24-2011, 02:31 AM

I hope they do, actually. That'd be awesome

12-24-2011, 03:05 AM

Andddddd......

Tyler Hansbrough for MvP

Aguakate

12-24-2011, 03:06 AM

Here's to the Chicago Bulls pulling a "1999 Spurs" and winning the whole thing on a shortened season.

:y:

Crimson

12-24-2011, 04:56 PM

This should be Miami's season really.

Aguakate

12-25-2011, 03:40 AM

This should be Miami's season really.

Wasn't that last year?

And this year?

And next year?

SlickyTrickyDamon

12-25-2011, 09:20 AM

Heat don't deserve another title. Instead of sending the Heat with a standing ovation in the first round against the 76ers they all left. The game actually looked like they got blown out and everybody left to escape the pain. They all left "cause the game was over" and to "beat traffic." Real fans don't give a shit about traffic.

"Fans" like that don't deserve shit.

SlickyTrickyDamon

12-25-2011, 11:27 AM

30 MINUTES UNTIL THE START OF THE SEASON! LET'S GO CELTICS!

Evil Vito

12-25-2011, 03:29 PM

<font color=goldenrod>New York Knickerbockers</font> :love:

Aguakate

12-25-2011, 03:39 PM

<font color=goldenrod>New York Knickerbockers</font> :love:

Mike D'Antoni saying on National TV that some of his players are out of shape wasn't exactly...nice.

Kris P Lettus

12-25-2011, 08:00 PM

Nice win by the Bulls..

Crimson

12-26-2011, 12:50 AM

Wasn't that last year?

And this year?

And next year?

I didn't think they would win last year. But from here on out they should be the favorites to be in the finals at least. Bulls rely too much on Rose..Celtics are old..who else you got? And Knicks don't play defense