View Full Version : Prometheus (Alien prequel?)
RoXer
06-29-2011, 11:46 PM
Damon Lindelof writes. Ridley Scott directs. Starring Magneto, Stringer Bell, and Rita Leeds. Out next summer.
RoXer
06-29-2011, 11:47 PM
Writer Damon Lindelof Explains Alien Connection to Prometheus (http://www.filmofilia.com/2011/06/29/writer-damon-lindelof-explains-alien-connection-to-prometheus/)
By Fiona (http://www.filmofilia.com/author/fiona/) | June 29, 2011 @ 5:07pm | Movie News (http://www.filmofilia.com/category/news/)
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So, what do we know about the upcoming Ridley Scott‘s Prometheus? We know that it’s going to be a sci-fi action spectacle. That’s for sure.
We also know that the movie was originally developed as an Alien prequel. And, that some great cast is on board, because Logan Marshall-Green, Noomi Rapace, Michael Fassbender, Charlize Theron, Rafe Spall, Idris Elba, Sean Harris and Kate Dickie are all set to star in it.
But we hate the fact that the plot details are still a mystery and that, beside above mentioned things, we know absolutely nothing about this project!
So, thank God somebody finally revealed some interesting details about the whole thing! And that person is Damon Lindelof, man responsible for the Prometheus story, who appeared on the Kevin Pollak’s Chat Show (http://www.kevinpollakschatshow.com/archive/?cat=304) and spoke at length about the genesis of Prometheus and its connection to the Alien universe.
Here’s what he had to say: “It started as an ‘Alien’ prequel. That is what everybody wanted it to be. Obviously, Ridley Scott has not made a science fiction movie in 25 years, sinceBlade Runner, so the idea that he’s returning to this genre is huge. But there is a real issue which is – what is the state of the ‘Alien’ franchise at this point in our lives? There has been ‘Alien vs. Predator’ and all these things, and its been completely and totally diluted. I’ve always felt that really good prequels should be original movies.
And the sequels to those prequels should not be the movie which already exists because, with all due respect to anyone who makes a prequel, but why would you ruin the greatest twist in the history of cinema, “Luke, I am your father”, by showing me three movies which basically spoil that surprise. You can do movies which take place before ‘Star Wars’, but I don’t need to see the story of the Skywalker clan. Show me something else which I can’t guess the possible outcome of. There is no suspense in inevitability. So a true prequel should essentially proceed the events of the original film, but be about something entirely different, feature different characters , have an entirely different theme, although it takes place in that same world. That was my fundamental feeling about what this movie wanted to be.”
“And truth be told” – continued Lindelof – “it wasn’t script doctoring in the strictest sense because the draft that existed before I came on was written by this guy named Jon Spaihts and it was very good. And there were a lot of things in the movie, ‘Prometheus,’ which were Jon Spaihts’ and I feel like somewhere in the media reconstruction of this story, the tale is that I come in, I pitch an entirely new story, and its so original that everything else gets thrown out and that’s what we’re doing. In my brain, that’s not exactly what happened.
But I also do feel that this movie is the movie I would want to see as a fanboy, take place in that ‘Alien’ universe, which precedes the events of the original Alien, but is not necessarily burdened by all the tropes of that franchise with Facehuggers and Chestbursters, and all that stuff that I love… but its sorta like, we’ve seen it before, can we do something different this time? And thats the movie that Ridley wanted to make. And when you’re working with an auteur, you basically just shut your mouth and listen and try to transcribe and channel the vision of that person, and get out of the way.”
As you already know, Prometheus will hit the theaters on June 8th, 2012 in 3D.
We brought you some interesting details from the interview that we definitely recommend you to check out right here on FilmoFilia!
Hanso Amore
06-30-2011, 10:10 AM
Did anyone else read that and have no fucking clue what he means.
So its a Prequel that is nothing like the originals because by being like it you would be spoiled by knowing what happens in the future?
WHAT
LuigiD
06-30-2011, 10:19 AM
Yeah that shit didn't really make sense.
Mad excited for this tho. A screenshot was leaked a while back and was immediately taken down from every site.
Kalyx triaD
06-30-2011, 10:49 AM
It's a prequel that explains the Space Jockeys and 'possibly' the original engineering of the Xenomorph biological weapon (which went on to be bred by the Predators as ultimate game). An android, Wayland Corp, Space Jockey, and perhaps an early ancestor of the Xenomorph should be present. I'm very excited.
What he meant was you can do a prequel without direct links to the current movies; it would be all too easy to have, say, Ripley's mom turn out to be a former board member of Wayland-Yutani who screwed them over, so Ripley's task on LV426 was some kind of revenge ploy by a later member. Some shit like that.
cardsharkrob
07-05-2011, 04:33 PM
I think what he means is he wants to do a prequel where you can't guess or already know how it ends. Like in "Star Wars." Well we already know Anakin Skywalker is going to be Darth Vader, so wheres the fun in that?
He wants to do a move in the same universe as the Aliens movies but not have too much tie in with the original movie.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 06:46 PM
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Current Official Synopsis
Ridley Scott, director of 'Alien' and 'Blade Runner,' returns to the genre he helped define. With PROMETHEUS, he creates a groundbreaking mythology, in which a team of explorers discover a clue to the origins of mankind on Earth, leading them on a thrilling journey to the darkest corners of the universe. There, they must fight a terrifying battle to save the future of the human race.
Original Official Synopsis
Visionary filmmaker Ridley Scott returns to the genre he helped define, creating an original science fiction epic set in the most dangerous corners of the universe. The film takes a team of scientists and explorers on a thrilling journey that will test their physical and mental limits and strand them on a distant world, where they will discover the answers to our most profound questions and to life's ultimate mystery.
What we know so far:
Little is known about Prometheus' plotline. But what we can share with you is that the film is set in space for the most part. Similar to that of "ALIEN"; the jumping off point to this project. The film's name "Prometheus" is that of the space vessel, used by a crew of select individuals who set off to explore and investigate fragments of "Alien DNA".
The film itself revolves around the Space Jockey creature; as seen in the original film ALIEN (1979). When the team of scientists embark on this journey, they get stranded on an Alien world which tests their limits; both mental and physical.
Prometheus is also largely based on the creation of mankind, life and the Earth. From the recent synopsis publicly released by 20th Century Fox, we can determine roughly that Prometheus involves a team of scientists, "The Company" representatives and robot / synthetics which investigate and search for keys to unlock man's ultimate mystery. But in the process, they threaten the future existence of mankind and are faced with unimaginable horrors.
The Aliens themselves are said to be much larger than the original "Xenomorphs" we are used to. However, their overall construction will be easily noticable to that of the original Alien canon.
Prometheus will be much more than just an Alien sci-fi horror. Ridley Scott is digging deeper for this project and Prometheus will unlock many questions and will touch on many aspects of life and existence. A true masterpiece.
http://www.prometheus-movie.com/
I've been interested in this ever since I read the premise months ago.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 06:58 PM
Space Jockeys are neat.
Droford
12-22-2011, 07:24 PM
ah yes, I didnt see this got its own thread already..
RoXer
12-22-2011, 07:32 PM
it has like 4
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 07:37 PM
Meh.
Kalyx triaD
12-22-2011, 09:47 PM
"Not an Alien Prequel" my ass.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 10:02 PM
I wonder if chronology is really going to matter with this one.
Kalyx triaD
12-22-2011, 10:53 PM
What do you mean? It pretty much takes place before Alien.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 11:06 PM
Yeah, but if there are no real connections in the storyline it wouldn't really matter.
Also, what's considered canon with this project? Is this a universe where Predators exist? Did Alien 3 and Resurrection happen or will they happen?
I get that doing a prequel makes sense and was Scott's original idea because he wanted to tell the story of the Pilot/Space jockeys...but do you really need to go backward to understand their story?
My understanding is that a lot of major changes have taken place with the script/story and I just get this feeling after reading a lot of this that it wouldn't matter if it happened ten years before Ripley made contact or fifty years after Aliens.
Time will tell...
XCaliber
12-22-2011, 11:08 PM
Not sure what to make of this one it could be great but I remember trailers for what look to be great sci-fi movies (ie Mission to Mars) only to find out they were utter crap but Charlize Theron is in it so it can't be that bad.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 11:14 PM
I like Ridley Scott enough to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Kalyx triaD
12-22-2011, 11:14 PM
I'd wager they made this with Alien in mind, and everything after is up to the fans as far as canon goes. Predators will likely not get a mention, as Ridley had nothing to do with the merging of the latter end of the franchises.
This takes place before Alien, but doesn't aim to explain Alien. As I wrote in the original thread (now merged with this):
What he meant was you can do a prequel without direct links to the current movies; it would be all too easy to have, say, Ripley's mom turn out to be a former board member of Wayland-Yutani who screwed them over, so Ripley's task on LV426 was some kind of revenge ploy by a later member. Some shit like that.
So I understand you. I'm just pointing out that this is certainly a prequel in the timeline, and it certainly precedes Alien in mythology. It's not Star Wars prequel direct but it's a story that takes place before Alien.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 11:17 PM
Ahhhh. Good then. I trust Scott not to fuck this up. It looks fantastic, I am hopefully going to see it in the theater.
Kalyx triaD
12-22-2011, 11:21 PM
This is something I would not give public people a chance to fuck up for me. I will watch this when it drops on DVD in the dark, lonely quiet of my own home. Long wait, yeah, but way worth it.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 11:31 PM
I feel like that, but my own home entertainment gets ruined by my two lovable yet annoying children.
Nowhere Man
12-22-2011, 11:40 PM
I'm super-psyched for this. Alien is one of my favorite movies of all time, and from what I can tell from the trailer, Scott's going out of his way to recapture the same atmosphere from the original. Whether the Xenos themselves are in it or not, it looks cool as hell.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 11:42 PM
They should be like queen sized xenos in this one, actually.
Nowhere Man
12-22-2011, 11:44 PM
I remember there was a comic in the late 90s I think, that featured Xenos that had come out of Jockeys. They were like dinosaur-sized.
Kalyx triaD
12-22-2011, 11:46 PM
Kids gotta sleep sometime.
Kalyx triaD
12-22-2011, 11:47 PM
I wonder if the Xenomorphs are tied to us in some way. Maybe we're both creations of the Jockies.
Swiss Ultimate
12-22-2011, 11:49 PM
From that website that's the direction of the story from what I gather.
Captain of Fun
12-23-2011, 12:26 AM
Alien is in my opinion, the greatest horror movie of all time. Hopefully this is a return to form.
Also, I hope this spawns a true Alien sequel. A horror sequel. Not the action movies we've gotten.
Swiss Ultimate
12-23-2011, 12:29 AM
Maybe James Cameron will direct the sequel. ;)
ClockShot
12-24-2011, 09:07 AM
Ooh. They grabbed Noomi Rapace for this.
That girl is on her way up in hollywood.
LuigiD
12-24-2011, 09:10 AM
Frame by frame breakdown of the trailer:
http://io9.com/5870560/frame+by+frame-breakdown-of-the-prometheus-trailer-who-is-that-man/gallery/1
This seems to be the origins story of how Xenomorphs came to be. Excited.
Swiss Ultimate
12-24-2011, 10:01 AM
Niiiice.
Hanso Amore
12-24-2011, 02:38 PM
Xenos are somehow Decendant from humans. Some Disease or Virus changes humans into them...Which Explains why they lay eggs in Humans.
Something like that. My guess at leasrt.
Swiss Ultimate
12-24-2011, 02:57 PM
Want nothing to do with the plot of Alien Rez...
I think we're all tiny Space Jockeys and that aliens are an experiment gone wrong.
Kalyx triaD
12-24-2011, 04:59 PM
Most likely they're weapons of some sort.
LuigiD
12-24-2011, 05:35 PM
I don't know if this canon will count as part of Promotheus or not but..
In a lot of the Alien comics and books..the space jockey race is explored further. It is mentioned that they are bastards. Like to invade planets and just suck them dry off their resources. The xenomorphs are a biological weapon they developed which backfired and ultimately consumed their entire civilization.
I am sure some elements of that will be borrowed.
Swiss Ultimate
12-24-2011, 05:38 PM
Yes, but there's issues with the comic books as far as canon goes. In the comics they were basically elephant people for instance.
Ridley might decide to throw that out for what he orginally intended them to be...
Kalyx triaD
12-24-2011, 06:52 PM
Doubt the comics will factor.
LuigiD
12-24-2011, 11:09 PM
Well, right..that is what I said.
I doubt they will follow the comics or books but I can see them looking at the idea of aliens being a weapon. Who knows. Interested in Scott's take of the subject.
Captain of Fun
12-24-2011, 11:25 PM
I'd be surprised if they even know the comics exist.
Kalyx triaD
01-29-2012, 09:54 PM
Alien recapped from the POV of the cat. (http://catsonfilm.blogspot.com/2011/04/alien.html)
Swiss Ultimate
02-06-2012, 08:34 PM
Alien recapped from the POV of the cat. (http://catsonfilm.blogspot.com/2011/04/alien.html)
Thank you for this.
Kalyx triaD
02-28-2012, 04:31 PM
http://io9.com/5889058/ridley-scotts-amazing-prometheus-short-film-reveals-the-weyland-corps-shining-future
Until a YouTube link is found.
Guy Pierce is awesome.
Kalyx triaD
02-29-2012, 03:05 PM
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/UW-8GMN8Srs" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Nowhere Man
03-18-2012, 12:57 AM
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/yR8oR304hfY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
......holy shit. I need a cigarette.
Kalyx triaD
03-18-2012, 01:15 AM
Holy god yes.
Captain of Fun
03-18-2012, 01:22 AM
Looks amazing.
Swiss Ultimate
03-18-2012, 01:23 AM
Fuck it. I'm going to invest emotionally.
Swiss Ultimate
03-18-2012, 02:24 AM
Check out the viral website
https://www.weylandindustries.com/#/timeline
Swiss Ultimate
03-18-2012, 02:36 AM
Weyland Industries earns patent number 18,364,003 for Method and Apparatus for device able to temporarily restart brain activity of deceased individuals.
August 16, 2071
Nowhere Man
03-18-2012, 05:08 PM
Here's the international trailer. Not quite as noisy, but gives us a little more detail:
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/a9jRaa4Wkbk" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Swiss Ultimate
03-20-2012, 06:46 PM
Anyone else subscribed to their viral website? I mean...has it gone viral yet?
Kalyx triaD
03-20-2012, 06:53 PM
Don't usually do the ARG thing with movies. I had fun with Cloverfield's campaign, though.
Reavant
03-20-2012, 10:35 PM
is this a prequel to alien? theres a quick glimpse of an alien in the trailer and it looked nothing like an alien from the originals
Kalyx triaD
03-20-2012, 11:06 PM
It is a prequel to Alien.
Nowhere Man
03-21-2012, 07:09 AM
It's a prequel in the sense that it's in the same continuity and features stuff like the Space Jockey ship and Weyland Industries (which eventually becomes Weyland-Yutani in the Alien movies), but Ridley Scott's said several times that the xenomorphs themselves will not be in it.
Either way, it looks phenomenal.
Kalyx triaD
03-21-2012, 10:57 AM
I have a feeling we'll see the xenomorph lifeform perfected in some way by the end of the movie, or it's development hinted at. We'll probably know for sure that they are weapons or some kind of 'galactic cleaning' measure like the installation rings in Halo.
My thing is these Space Jockies, or from what I guess... this one Space Jockey, fell victim to a facehugger. His fate is sealed from what we see in Alien. So are we gonna see a Space Jockey xenomorph as a final boss sort of deal? It must have been dealt with way before Ripley's crew found the ship, otherwise Kane and the others never would have made it out with some beast in there (assuming these things live that long without... whatever they eat to live).
Also, it seems like the Space Jockies been to Earth before. Aside from the obvious questions of whether or not they created us or assisted us in the past, what makes this Jockey flip out and wanna come to us with xenomorph cargo ("If we don't stop it, there won't be a home to return to!"). Did we do something wrong? Did the Prometheus crew do something wrong?
Prometheus paid a price for stealing fire (which Weyland likened to technology) from the gods. He also gave pause to mention of the invention of gunpower ("A game changer, that one."). There's hints that while Elizabeth and her guy are on an exploration trip, Vickers and David may be there for reasons closer to how Weyland-Yutani conducted themselves in the later movies. The android on Ripley's crew revealed that the company knew about the xenomorphs (or at least that there was something worthwhile on the planet).
Is the Prometheus crew's real mission to steal fire from the gods, only to suffer the mythological figure's fate? In this way Peter Weyland's viral speech was some sly way of giving the general events of the movie.
From what I see Weyland is ego-maniacal, and more than likely considers himself a god already. The Space Jockies would pose an interesting measuring stick for him, that I assume he probably would not accept. He would think nothing of sending a crew in to clean up that alien ship and claim anything found at the expense of his workers. Hell, this may be the true intent of the company's 'Building Better Worlds' colony expansion.
Swiss Ultimate
03-21-2012, 11:46 AM
Weyland cured cancer.
...
Kalyx triaD
03-21-2012, 12:27 PM
Yeah.
Swiss Ultimate
03-21-2012, 01:06 PM
Also Global Warming...
Nowhere Man
03-21-2012, 02:32 PM
Weyland's a badass.
Swiss Ultimate
03-21-2012, 08:21 PM
https://a248.e.akamai.net/f/248/25855/14d/ig.rsys1.net/responsysimages/fxus/Prometheus_Registration/Prometheus_InvestorNotification_Mar2073/PROM_Emailer_JJ03_img01.jpghttps://a248.e.akamai.net/f/248/25855/14d/ig.rsys1.net/responsysimages/fxus/Prometheus_Registration/Prometheus_InvestorNotification_Mar2073/PROM_Emailer_JJ03_img03.jpg
Kalyx triaD
04-17-2012, 02:50 PM
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/DOOJl5lWNfM" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Swiss Ultimate
04-18-2012, 11:05 AM
Was just about to post that.
XCaliber
04-18-2012, 11:16 AM
That Fassbender is a great actor I hope that he doesn't become a flash in the pan like many others have in the past.
Kalyx triaD
04-18-2012, 03:10 PM
He's an X-Man; he's set.
Swiss Ultimate
04-18-2012, 03:19 PM
Want to see this in the theater.
Kalyx triaD
04-18-2012, 03:34 PM
This and Peter Weyland's TED speech are almost certainly DVD extras.
YOUR Hero
04-22-2012, 09:25 PM
Went and seen a shitty movie last night (Wrath of the Titans) and saw he trailer for Prometheus.
Yum
Yum
Looks like something I'd want to see
Swiss Ultimate
04-22-2012, 09:29 PM
It looks pretty awesome.
Kalyx triaD
04-29-2012, 07:26 PM
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/1byZkbNB3Jw" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
Swiss Ultimate
04-29-2012, 07:40 PM
Going to see this in the theater...fuck it looks so good.
stultiloquy
04-29-2012, 09:27 PM
Just saw the trailer before Hunger Games....I am a huge Alien fan, and was trying to avoid it so I could go in seeing it 'cold', but I couldn't look away once I saw the little familiar things, and then I saw all of the big familiar things.
Damn, I am so excited for this movie now.
Miotch
04-30-2012, 02:40 PM
This is going to be the best film of the summer.
Buzzkill
04-30-2012, 02:59 PM
Shit is real son
Heyman
05-02-2012, 04:16 AM
Hopefully, this gay Prometheus movie is cooler than Avengers............Agent Coulson dies in the movie by the way. :(
#BROKEN Hasney
05-02-2012, 05:46 AM
Gosh, that is going to suck.
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Swiss Ultimate
05-05-2012, 07:09 PM
This movie is going to be so hardcore.
RoXer
05-11-2012, 01:41 PM
Damon Lindelof on whether 'Prometheus' is an 'Alien' prequel, plus life after 'Lost'
by Chris Nashawaty (http://www.ew.com/ew/chris-nashawaty)
Tags: Damon Lindelof (http://insidemovies.ew.com/tag/damon-lindelof/), Lost (http://insidemovies.ew.com/tag/lost/), Prometheus (http://insidemovies.ew.com/tag/prometheus/), Ridley Scott (http://insidemovies.ew.com/tag/ridley-scott/), Summer Movies (http://insidemovies.ew.com/tag/summer-movies/)
Comments 18 (http://insidemovies.ew.com/2012/05/11/damon-lindelof-prometheus-life-after-lost/#disqus_thread)
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http://img2.timeinc.net/ew/i/2011/07/07/Damon-Lindelof_240.jpg Image Credit: Brian To/Filmmagic.com
For six seasons on the cult TV show Lost, writer Damon Lindelof learned a few things about keeping fans in the dark. Not a day would go by that someone wouldn’t come up to him and ask what it all meant. Needless to say, he became good at keeping secrets and stoking an air of mystery. All of which has come in handy on his latest project, Ridley Scott’s hush-hush sci-fi space epic, Prometheus.
Lindelof, who shares a screenplay credit on the film with Jon Spaihts, has been tight-lipped about the film in the walk-up to its release on June 8 — in particular about the question that’s on every fanboy (and girl’s) mind: Is Prometheus an Alien prequel as has been rumored? EW spoke with Lindelof for this week’s cover story; here’s a transcript of the full interview.
ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY: Did you get a chance to visit the set of Prometheus?
DAMON LINDELOF: Yes, I spent about a month at Pinewood Studios in London — a couple of weeks at the very beginning and then a couple of weeks about a month in. To me, after working on Star Trek, where we did a lot of green screen, I was bowled over by the vastness of Ridley’s sets at Pinewood. It felt like old-school filmmaking in all of the right ways. You walk through those doors and you are transported just by the sheer audacity and magnitude of some of those sets.
The studio has been keeping Prometheus very secret. So I’m going to try to pull some teeth and get you to talk about some stuff you’re sworn not to talk about. How does that sound?
You do your job, I’ll do mine.
Okay. Let’s start at the beginning. Tell me how you came onto this project?
We finished Lost in May of 2009. And following that, after doing a show for six years, I dropped off the face of the planet and went with my family to Italy for a month. I told everyone I would be incommunicado. When I returned, I let everyone know that I would like to do a movie project. We had already committed to Trek 2, but J.J. [Abrams] was still putting the finishing touches on Super 8 and I had two or three months before we had to dive in on Trek. So about two days after I put that signal out that I was ready to go on some casual dates, I was driving down Ventura Blvd. in the Valley and my agent called and said. “Are you available to talk to Ridley Scott in five minutes?” I slammed on my brakes for some inexplicable reason and pulled over. I didn’t want to be driving through some bad cellular zone on the phone with Ridley Scott. So I just sat there and prepared to sit there for two hours. Because ‘Are you ready in five minutes’ when you’re talking about someone of Ridley Scott’s stature, just be prepared to wait a while.
Did he say what the call was going to be about?
My agent said he had no idea. They wouldn’t tell him. And as I was sitting there I was praying that it was the Alien prequel that I had been hearing about. As a fanboy, I knew that they were developing it. I said to myself, Please let it be that. And sure enough, five minutes later, my phone rang and it was Ridley. There was no pomp and circumstance. There was no assistant saying, “Please hold for Ridley Scott.” It was just him. And he doesn’t know that he’s Ridley Scott, so he just dove right into the conversation. And he basically said, “Hey dude, I’m going to send you a script. Let me know what you think.” And I’m not going to be like, What is it? I just said, “Yes, sir. I look forward to that.” And that was the entire conversation. And so about an hour later this guy shows up at my house with a screenplay and says, “I will be sitting in my car. When you are finished with the screenplay, you can hand it back to me.” So at this point, I’m like, It’s the Alien prequel! Because with this level of tightened security what else could it be? So I read the screenplay.
RoXer
05-11-2012, 01:43 PM
(Page 2 of 4)
This was Jon Spaihts original draft of Prometheus?
Yes. And I thought it was really cool. It was not at all what I expected it to be. But obviously they were giving it to me for a reason. And this is one of those situations where you’re given no advance sense of what they like, what they don’t like, you just have to walk out on the plank and say, Here is my fundamental reaction to this thing. So when I finished it I went into my office and I wrote an email to Ridley and his producing partners. And this response was basically my job interview. I wrote maybe a four or five paragraph email saying here are all the things I love about it, I think there are some incredible set pieces here, I love the fundamental idea behind the movie, I feel like it’s a cool think piece. BUT I think it’s relying a bit too heavily on the Alien stuff that we’ve seen now five or six times in different movies. Chest-bursting and face-hugging and xenomorphs and I just feel that your idea is so strong and the characters can be made so strong that we don’t need any of that stuff. We can present iterations of that stuff in different ways. That isn’t to say that this isn’t a movie that should be set in that universe, but I look at it more like a story that is running parallel to the original Alien, so that if there was a sequel to this movie, it would not be Alien, it would be Prometheus 2. And then Prometheus 2 is parallel to Aliens. And here’s how we could do that. And so I sent off that email and I got into my bed. I didn’t sleep at all. And at 10 a.m. the next morning, my agent called me and said, ‘Whatever it is you did, they liked it. Can you go in and meet now?’
Who was at that meeting?
Ridley, two producing partners, and the executive from Fox on it. On my way over there I wrote in my head this sort of very formal speech on how much Ridley’s influenced me and what a thrill it is to be considered for this job… and I got about six words into that speech and he cut me off. He goes, “Let’s talk about your email.” So there we were sitting at a table talking about this science fiction movie that he wanted to direct and that they were considering me to write and I kept trying to leave my body and hover above the table and look down thinking, Oh my god, this might actually happen for you! And we had this great meeting. I think it was on a Friday afternoon. And at the end, he said, “Are you available to come in this weekend and talk some more?” And I said, of course. And at that point I realized they were probably going to hire me. That’s the long-winded origin story.
Did Ridley tell you at any point why he chose you? Was he fan of Lost?
He was definitely aware of Lost. Ridley is not the kind of guy who watches a television series. He will watch 20 minutes of a show here and an episode there. He was aware of it, he knew what it was, he knew what I did. He had seen the show, but he was not trying to present to me, like, Oh my God, I’m a huge Lostie! John Locke is my favorite character! As much as a writer can have a specific skill set or a brand, he was very interested that my brand seemed to be in mystery and ambiguity. And that’s what’s so cool about the original Alien — Hey, here’s this distress call, we just went down there, we see this weird massive alien creature sitting in a chair and there’s eggs everywhere and there’s nobody there to explain what happened. It’s just the situation they’re in. And I think the idea for this movie was, well, let’s have characters who are a little more interested in answering those questions before the s— hits the fan. They don’t just happen upon the haunted house, they’re actually looking for it. They just don’t realize it’s haunted till they get there. We talked a lot about mystery. That was my only hint of why he sought me out.
Did you have any reluctance about working on someone else’s script? Not being the guy who was there from go?
Yeah! Definitely! Especially since I felt like Jon had done a really good job of executing his drafts. I sent him an email as soon as I was formally hired saying, ‘Hey, you’re gonna read about this — that I’ve been hired to do this thing and I want you to know that whatever gets said, I’m going to try to retain as much of what you did as possible because I thought it was great. And then the story came out: Lindelof comes in and pitches this radical new take on this movie that used to be a prequel and is now transforming into its own original thing. I reached out to Jon again to say that’s not at all what happened. Ridley had a very specific idea of the story he wanted to tell. And sometimes you have to look at different versions of it to know what it is you want and what you don’t want. Whatever it is, I didn’t get the sense that there was any bad blood with Jon. They were just looking for someone to say to them, Hey, we don’t need the Alien stuff in here. It shouldn’t be about that. It can be a part of this movie, but it shouldn’t be what it’s about.
RoXer
05-11-2012, 01:47 PM
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So how did you flesh out your version of the script with Ridley?
What happened was, I sat in a room with Ridley Scott for five days a week for three- or four-hour sessions and asked him a series of questions like an investigative journalist in an attempt to understand what exactly the movie he wanted to make was, what he wanted it to be about, what he wanted the characters to be looking for, what did he want to get out of the set pieces, is it going to be heady or scary or both? Who did he see being the audience proxy? And when I finished that project, I went off and wrote. You just listen to what they say and you write it down. That’s the way it is in movies, especially with visionary directors like Ridley.
And then how long did you sit down and write?
We met all through July and into the beginning of August. And then I turned in my first draft in mid-September. So it took me four or five weeks to write my first draft.
So the original script was more of an Alien prequel than yours?
Yes. The job that I was hired to do was to scale back the familiar tropes or symbology of what we think of when we think of an Alien movie. When I say Alien to you, you think face-hugger, chest-burster, eggs, acid blood, queen — the concentration of those things was much higher in Jon’s script than they are in Prometheus.
Let me just come out and ask on the record — Is this an Alien prequel?
I do not want to be evasive, but I do have to challenge what you mean by that word. Because that word is a very recent thing. I hadn’t really heard the word “prequel” before Phantom Menace. If your definition is: this is a series of events that precedes an existing movie, then, yes. This series of events that happens in Prometheus precedes the series of events that occurs in Alien. However, one of the other definitions is that the ending of the prequel leads you right up to the beginning of the preceding movie. The Thing prequel ends with a dog running across the Arctic landscape being pursued by a helicopter….
Okay, so this doesn’t lead to the first scene of Alien, but it does take place before Alien in the same world as Alien?
Correct.
Thank you. I’ve interviewed Ridley four times about this movie now and every time I get a different answer. How do you feel about all of the speculation about the film on the internet? Does it help the movie or hurt the movie?
I usually just put myself in the position of, let’s say I had nothing to do with this movie, and I was one of the people on the internet who was really curious about what it was, my feeling would be — and this is just me — to hear that it’s a prequel, makes the movie less interesting to me than if I don’t really have a clear sense of what it is. And I anticipated that at a certain point the fact that we weren’t openly addressing that question — or being cagey about that question — would lead to a certain degree of frustration, because that’s what I would be feeling as a fan. That’s when Ridley thought that it would be cool that in the teaser he’d have the word “Prometheus” reveal itself exactly the way the title Alien revealed itself in the original trailer for Alien. This is him saying, I’m making this choice for a very specific reason. If you want to continue asking me what this movie’s relationship is with Alien, why in God’s name do you think I would do that? The second thing is we wanted to generate viral content that starred and featured the characters from the movie. Let’s see if we can talk Guy Pearce (http://insidemovies.ew.com/2012/02/28/prometheus-ted-talk-guy-pearce/) and Michael Fassbender (http://insidemovies.ew.com/2012/03/18/prometheus-promo-fassbender/) into doing some stuff that would speak very directly to the prequel issue. So I pitched the idea of the TED talk, which everybody was responsive to and Ridley was able to convince Guy to do. And that TED talk really speaks to the prequel question because it’s Peter Weyland! And Weyland is a name that is very familiar in all of the Alien movies. And we’re going to tell audiences that he is a part of Prometheus. So here’s another way we are showing them, as opposed to telling them, what the relationship between the two movies is. But hopefully with enough ambiguity that you’re generating some anticipation for what the movie is. And I will tell you, the hardest thing to do from the insides of these things is, you and I hate it when you sit in a movie theater and after the trailer, you say, I guess I feel like I just saw the whole movie! So you don’t want to do that. But at the same time, you don’t want to be so vague and precious and pretentious about what you’re working on that you build an expectation that you couldn’t possibly live up to. Everyone wants to know what the relationship is between this movie and Alien. And one could argue that we’ve set ourselves up for an inevitable disappointment. But look who you’re talking to right now. If there is anybody who is known for inevitable disappointment, it’s me. I’m Mr. Inevitable Disappointment!
When you were a kid, were you an Alien fan? Do you remember when you first saw it?
Yeah. I was born in 1973, so I did not see Alien when it was released theatrically. I saw Alien when it was on Home Box Office. I think I was probably 10. I was watching it for four or five minutes toward the end of the movie when Ripley is looking for her cat. I didn’t even know that there was an alien in play. And my dad caught me watching it and he turned off the TV and said, “Do not watch that movie — that movie is inappropriate!” He was upset. And as soon as I got the opportunity to watch it in its entirety, now that it had been stigmatized, I watched it. And I got to the point where the face-hugger bursts out of the egg and breaks through John Hurt’s faceplate and suddenly understood that my father was right. I did not continue beyond that point in the movie. I don’t think I watched the whole thing until I was 13 or 14 with my friends at a sleepover party at my friend Dave Spiegel’s. We watched the whole movie on VHS.
RoXer
05-11-2012, 01:51 PM
(Page 4 of 4)
Ridley calls the original an “old dark house film.” Does that sound right to you?
Yes, because when you say to me: Old Dark House film, I think of a bunch of characters whose car breaks down on the side of the road and they have to go into a place of which they have no understanding whatsoever and they discover that place’s secrets and bring those secrets out of the house with them. It’s classic Hammer Films filmmaking. And of course the marketing around the original Alien was geared to that: “In space, no one can hear you scream.” It was more horror than it was sci-fi. That being said, there were so many incredible science-fiction ideas presented in Alien — the whole movie being about the gestation process for what this being is and how original that was and how original that looked, but also the idea of Ash as sort of malevolent artificial intelligence was sort of a direct nod to Kubrick 10 years later. I’m hard-pressed to think of any movies that were released between ’69 and ’79 that had crazy robots in them. The idea of taking HAL and making him into a man and then playing it closed, not knowing that Ash is a synthetic being until he starts to freak out. That was an incredible idea. The biggest thing that makes it an old dark house movie is that one by one the characters are going to be killed and so the most revolutionary thing that happens in Alien is Sigourney Weaver is not really presented to the audience as the main character. So when Tom Skerritt dies about an hour in, you’re suddenly going, ‘Oh my God, I don’t know if anyone’s going to make it out alive! Dallas is supposed to be my guy!’ He’s the hero, right? It’s not going to be Harry Dean Stanton! So that Ten Little Indians idea of one by one people are getting killed, is why Ridley, I think, looks at it that way.
What do you think Ridley’s influence on the sci-fi genre has been?
When I saw Blade Runner, my understanding was that Blade Runner and Alien were sequels to each other — or they were related. They were set in the same world. I was not sophisticated enough to know that Ridley Scott directed both of them or even know what a director was. Ridley decided to say, I’m going to look at the future the way it might actually look. I’m going to think about what urban design is going to look like, the ships are going to be gritty and grungy, the people who inhabit this world are blue-collar people. He took the fantasy out of sci-fi and grounded it in a profound way, which laid the track to look at the future in a different way, which was dystopian instead of utopian.
Did you and Ridley ever discuss why he wanted to go back to a movie that he made 30 years ago? Did he feel like there was some unfinished business there?
The only sense of it that I ever got — because by the time I came into the process he was already very excited, he was already ramped — is that in his journey as a film director over the past 30 years, it seems like the movies that people are most interested in and the movies he probably gets asked about the most are Alien and Blade Runner. And so, for him, he doesn’t look at himself as a science fiction director. In fact, when he talks about the five other guys that he was up against to direct Alien, he’s sort of befuddled as to why they chose him. He was the unlikely guy. I don’t think he sees himself as a sci-fi director. So probably over the course of the last 30 years it’s probably confusing to him why people keep asking him about these movies. But I would assume that over time, it would start to get into his head: Wow, these movies that I made 30 years ago really resonated and people are still curious about them, maybe there’s more story there! And I can guarantee you that many times over the intervening years, he was aware of what was happening with the Alien franchise. And his silence on those movies, with the exception of Aliens, which I think he is a fan of and I know he’s also a huge Fincher fan, but post-Alien 3 — both Resurrection and the Alien vs. Predator mash-ups, I think Ridley’s feeling was, It’s time for me to now take the reins and put the ship back on course. I feel a sense of parenthood and I feel like my child needs a stern talking to. That’s my sense of it, it’s not anything that he has said to me.
It sure sounds right though. Let me ask you about the lead character that Noomi Rapace plays in Prometheus. How important is it for this film to have a strong female action lead like Ripley?
I think it was very clear — and this was in the script before I came to it — that she was clearly at the center of this thing. And the inevitable comparisons to Ripley are going to come down the pike and therefore it was really important that although she is the lead of the movie, she be different from Ripley in a lot of ways. And I think that from a jumping off point, Ripley is a blue-collar miner/terra former who is basically doing a gig for money and wanders into this horrific situation and she has to react. It’s just a survivor’s story. And in Aliens, Ripley’s story begins to get fleshed out in a more significant way where she becomes maternal with Newt. But if you just look at Alien, you can’t tell me much about Ripley. We don’t know much about her as a character. Whereas Noomi’s character, Shaw, has a very specific background that leads her to where this movie leads her. She is a seeker. The Mulder character for lack of a better pop culture metaphor. And classic sci-fi, to me, is based on the principle that science has the opportunity to cross a line — the line is defined by cultural and religious ideas. Should we do this? Are we breaking God’s will by doing this? That’s sci-fi. So the idea of just because we have the technology to create life, should we create life? This is the be careful what you wished for, I shouldn’t have crossed that line story, which is what all sci-fi is. In Alien that doesn’t happen. All they do is answer a distress call, which is what they’re supposed to do. They’re not paying for anything they did wrong. I think it was important for Shaw to be directly responsible for everything that happens in this movie. For the hero of the movie to say I want to go find this out and I understand that it may be dangerous, that became a critical driver for her. And something that existed in Jon’s work, but really we talked about a lot as we developed the screenplay.
As someone who’s worked in TV and movies, what is it that you like about film vs. TV?
They’ve each got their own benefits. I think the advantage of film is the canvas is much smaller, which would seem like a contradiction. If you take something like Lost where the story was told over 121 episodes, and you take something like Prometheus where the story is told over two hours, it’s a smaller canvas. But because of that, you have to be so much more detailed. There’s a lot less area for screw-ups. I think movies are more exciting– it’s a slower moving ship. So the idea that I started on the movie in July 2009, I wrote on it essentially through the beginning of production in March, 2010 — that’s seven or eight months of writing. And then Ridley called me into the editing room a bunch of times, so all told it was a year of my life. In a year of my life in TV, you make 30 hours of it.
Last question, tell me about what the title means in terms of the story you’ve told.
I don’t want to sound like the movie is a history lesson, but I do think that the primary take away from the myth of Prometheus is that the Gods were nervous about mankind. They were nervous about what they would be capable of if they had fire. Fire was a big piece of technology that they would build off of. And the story of any creation is eventually a child will try to destroy its parents. It’s a very paranoid world view, mythologically-speaking it pops up a lot. Especially for us Star Wars aficionados. So the essential story is: I don’t want to give my kid this toy because eventually he will develop it into a weapon that will kill me. So I will therefore withhold it from him. And what is the price I must exact on somebody who betrays me? So Prometheus steals the fire from the Gods, gives it to mankind, knowing exactly what mankind is going to do with it and even though he knows he’s going to be punished for it. So this myth felt perfect for this movie because the movie is all about creation, it’s all about punishment, and it’s all about our desire to understand why we’re here in the first place. It just felt like the natural way to go even though we knew people would have a hard time pronouncing it and that it was wildly pretentious.
Swiss Ultimate
05-11-2012, 07:11 PM
Nice.
nolanve
05-13-2012, 05:04 AM
God I can't wait for this one.
mitch_h
05-31-2012, 10:24 PM
So far the reviews for this haven't been that great, but they haven't been bad either. I have really high expectations for this, so I was hoping for raves, still excited though.
RoXer
05-31-2012, 10:32 PM
<small class="time"> 15h (https://twitter.com/DamonLindelof/status/208145466150490112) </small> https://si0.twimg.com/profile_images/1133454029/Damon_Lindelof_26th_Annual_Television_Critics__cb62X2Hvzcl_normal.jpg Damon Lindelof <s>@</s>DamonLindelof (https://twitter.com/#%21/DamonLindelof)
So it begins! RT <s>@</s>jbiz91 (https://twitter.com/#%21/jbiz91) <s>@</s>DamonLindelof (https://twitter.com/#%21/DamonLindelof) Reading the reviews. Seems like you screwed up Prometheus with your crappy writing. Good job.
Reply (https://twitter.com/#)
Retweet (https://twitter.com/#)
Favorite (https://twitter.com/#)
<small class="time"> 1h (https://twitter.com/DamonLindelof/status/208356977389215745) </small> https://si0.twimg.com/profile_images/1133454029/Damon_Lindelof_26th_Annual_Television_Critics__cb62X2Hvzcl_normal.jpg Damon Lindelof <s>@</s>DamonLindelof (https://twitter.com/#%21/DamonLindelof)
... You're welcome? RT <s>@</s>MickBim (https://twitter.com/#%21/MickBim) Hey <s>@</s>DamonLindelof (https://twitter.com/#%21/DamonLindelof), you are the second person to rape my childhood after George Lucas ! Congrats !
The Destroyer
06-01-2012, 03:07 AM
So far the reviews for this haven't been that great, but they haven't been bad either. I have really high expectations for this, so I was hoping for raves, still excited though.
Reviews I've seen so far seem to be averaging out around the 3 star mark.
Pity, but I'll still see it.
The Mackem
06-01-2012, 10:22 AM
There's no way it can be any worse than what followed Alien 3
Kalyx triaD
06-01-2012, 02:04 PM
Yeah, I'm still way down for this.
Crimson
06-01-2012, 05:41 PM
Im guessing the ending is a big let down
Requiem
06-02-2012, 06:22 PM
Has an 8.3 on imdb. Dunno.
Kalyx triaD
06-02-2012, 06:42 PM
How about fuck what people have to say and watch the damn thing.
Ermaximus
06-02-2012, 06:49 PM
How about fuck what people have to say and watch the damn thing.
Exactly this. The only "review" that should matter is your own. See the movie because YOU want to and not because some overpaid idiot tells you why you should or shouldn't.
Damndirty
06-02-2012, 07:40 PM
I think as long as this flick has alot of HR Giger elements in it, I'll be satisfied, just as long as there's still that sexually-designed dark concept I get from the other movies he inspired.
Kalyx triaD
06-02-2012, 07:42 PM
I don't think so. Very different look.
mitch_h
06-02-2012, 08:10 PM
Exactly this. The only "review" that should matter is your own. See the movie because YOU want to and not because some overpaid idiot tells you why you should or shouldn't.
What , shut up. No one has said they aren't going to see the movie. Seriously, can the only discussion be gushing over production stills and trailers (which are just as useless as critics). We're just expressing some minor anxiety about how the early word of mouth seems to be that the movie is lacking in certain ways. And I agree that American criticism is largely a wasteland (albeit for different reasons) but there are still some quality critics who I often agree with and are good writers to boot, some even liked this movie (Todd McCarthy)
Kalyx triaD
06-02-2012, 08:14 PM
I wouldn't say trailers and stills are as useless as reviews, because media helps you shape your own opinion going in.
Why have even minor anxiety about what people have to say? I've never been any more or less excited by good or bad reviews. I've liked badly reviewed movies (SW Eps. III), and hated good reviewed movies (The Notebook). Sometimes reviewers agree with me. But they're agreeing with me; I don't look for the other way around.
This sort of thing makes reviews the overstated thing it is now.
mitch_h
06-02-2012, 08:29 PM
I wouldn't say trailers and stills are as useless as reviews, because media helps you shape your own opinion going in.
Why have even minor anxiety about what people have to say? I've never been any more or less excited by good or bad reviews. I've liked badly reviewed movies (SW Eps. III), and hated good reviewed movies (The Notebook). Sometimes reviewers agree with me. But they're agreeing with me; I don't look for the other way around.
That sort of thing makes reviews the overstated thing it is now.
Because it's more than if the movie got a good review or a bad review, it's what a knowledgeable critic says about the movie. Maybe you don't, but I have certain tastes and if I find a critic with similar tastes I kind of care about what they say. Plus a really good critic can open me up to things that I never noticed on my own. Sure i've had times where i've deviated from them and the critical consensus and that's why i'm still going to see this movie and i'm still excited, but I do see the value in certain critics.
Also I hardly think reviews are overstated seeing as most high grossing movies usually aren't critically praised.
Swiss Ultimate
06-02-2012, 08:31 PM
I loved the Notebook.
Kalyx triaD
06-02-2012, 08:50 PM
Also I hardly think reviews are overstated seeing as most high grossing movies usually aren't critically praised.
I suppose I'm channeling my issues with game industry reviews.
mitch_h
06-02-2012, 08:59 PM
That I don't know, but you shouldn't be too hostile towards film critics because they play/played a big part in bringing attention to smaller films and filmmakers like Christopher Nolan, Coen Bros, Tarantino, Clerks(don't like K Smith's other movies), PTA etc etc
Already bought tickets for the opening night, fuck whatever others want to say.
Ermaximus
06-02-2012, 11:41 PM
What , shut up. No one has said they aren't going to see the movie. Seriously, can the only discussion be gushing over production stills and trailers (which are just as useless as critics). We're just expressing some minor anxiety about how the early word of mouth seems to be that the movie is lacking in certain ways. And I agree that American criticism is largely a wasteland (albeit for different reasons) but there are still some quality critics who I often agree with and are good writers to boot, some even liked this movie (Todd McCarthy)
That was more of a general statement, not specifically aimed towards this movie dude.
Crimson
06-03-2012, 03:12 AM
imdb is not a place to judge if you want to see a movie or not. Every board for every movie ever made has a "worst movie ever made" topic.
I usually go there to see movie history info on actors/directors/writers.
The Destroyer
06-04-2012, 10:09 AM
Im guessing the ending is a big let down
I didn't find the ending completely satisfying but I still thought it was a good film overall. Michael Fassbender was great as usual.
I still can't work out if the ending is designed to set up Alien, since it seems to be set on a different planet, despite the obvious birth of some kind of proto-Alien and the ship being identical to the crashed one from the first two films.
El Vaquero de Infierno
06-04-2012, 02:04 PM
I'm going to see this on Wednesday.
El Vaquero de Infierno
06-06-2012, 11:05 AM
Sono andato a vederlo oggi. Non è stato niente speciale.
OssMan
06-09-2012, 02:14 PM
This was stupid. It just turned into a typical Hollywood monster movie.
Nowhere Man
06-09-2012, 03:29 PM
Got my full review of the movie here (http://bazzardthebazz.blogspot.com/2012/06/movie-review-prometheus.html), if you're so inclined.
Buzzkill
06-09-2012, 04:06 PM
Here's a huge breakdown of some of the themes/motifs throughout the movie (spoilers obviously)
Prometheus contains such a huge amount of mythic resonance that it effectively obscures a more conventional plot. I'd like to draw your attention to the use of motifs and callbacks in the film that not only enrich it, but offer possible hints as to what was going on in otherwise confusing scenes.
Let's begin with the eponymous titan himself, Prometheus. He was a wise and benevolent entity who created mankind in the first place, forming the first humans from clay. The Gods were more or less okay with that, until Prometheus gave them fire. This was a big no-no, as fire was supposed to be the exclusive property of the Gods. As punishment, Prometheus was chained to a rock and condemned to have his liver ripped out and eaten every day by an eagle. (His liver magically grew back, in case you were wondering.)
Fix that image in your mind, please: the giver of life, with his abdomen torn open. We'll be coming back to it many times in the course of this article.
The ethos of the titan Prometheus is one of willing and necessary sacrifice for life's sake. That's a pattern we see replicated throughout the ancient world. J G Frazer wrote his lengthy anthropological study, The Golden Bough, around the idea of the Dying God - a lifegiver who voluntarily dies for the sake of the people. It was incumbent upon the King to die at the right and proper time, because that was what heaven demanded, and fertility would not ensue if he did not do his royal duty of dying.
Now, consider the opening sequence of Prometheus. We fly over a spectacular vista, which may or may not be primordial Earth. According to Ridley Scott, it doesn't matter.
A lone Engineer at the top of a waterfall goes through a strange ritual, drinking from a cup of black goo that causes his body to disintegrate into the building blocks of life. We see the fragments of his body falling into the river, twirling and spiralling into DNA helices.
Ridley Scott has this to say about the scene: 'That could be a planet anywhere. All he’s doing is acting as a gardener in space. And the plant life, in fact, is the disintegration of himself. If you parallel that idea with other sacrificial elements in history – which are clearly illustrated with the Mayans and the Incas – he would live for one year as a prince, and at the end of that year, he would be taken and donated to the gods in hopes of improving what might happen next year, be it with crops or weather, etcetera.'
Can we find a God in human history who creates plant life through his own death, and who is associated with a river? It's not difficult to find several, but the most obvious candidate is Osiris, the epitome of all the Frazerian 'Dying Gods'.
And we wouldn't be amiss in seeing the first of the movie's many Christian allegories in this scene, either. The Engineer removes his cloak before the ceremony, and hesitates before drinking the cupful of genetic solvent; he may well have been thinking 'If it be Thy will, let this cup pass from me.'
So, we know something about the Engineers, a founding principle laid down in the very first scene: acceptance of death, up to and including self-sacrifice, is right and proper in the creation of life. Prometheus, Osiris, John Barleycorn, and of course the Jesus of Christianity are all supposed to embody this same principle. It is held up as one of the most enduring human concepts of what it means to be 'good'.
Seen in this light, the perplexing obscurity of the rest of the film yields to an examination of the interwoven themes of sacrifice, creation, and preservation of life. We also discover, through hints, exactly what the nature of the clash between the Engineers and humanity entailed.
The crew of the Prometheus discover an ancient chamber, presided over by a brooding solemn face, in which urns of the same black substance are kept. A mural on the wall presents an image which, if you did as I asked earlier on, you will recognise instantly: the lifegiver with his abdomen torn open. Go and look at it here to refresh your memory. Note the serenity on the Engineer's face here.
And there's another mural there, one which shows a familiar xenomorph-like figure. This is the Destroyer who mirrors the Creator, I think - the avatar of supremely selfish life, devouring and destroying others purely to preserve itself. As Ash puts it: 'a survivor, unclouded by conscience, remorse or delusions of morality.'
Through Shaw and Holloway's investigations, we learn that the Engineers not only created human life, they supervised our development. (How else are we to explain the numerous images of Engineers in primitive art, complete with star diagram showing us the way to find them?) We have to assume, then, that for a good few hundred thousand years, they were pretty happy with us. They could have destroyed us at any time, but instead, they effectively invited us over; the big pointy finger seems to be saying 'Hey, guys, when you're grown up enough to develop space travel, come see us.' Until something changed, something which not only messed up our relationship with them but caused their installation on LV-223 to be almost entirely wiped out.
From the Engineers' perspective, so long as humans retained that notion of self-sacrifice as central, we weren't entirely beyond redemption. But we went and screwed it all up, and the film hints at when, if not why: the Engineers at the base died two thousand years ago. That suggests that the event that turned them against us and led to the huge piles of dead Engineers lying about was one and the same event. We did something very, very bad, and somehow the consequences of that dreadful act accompanied the Engineers back to LV-223 and massacred them.
If you have uneasy suspicions about what 'a bad thing approximately 2,000 years ago' might be, then let me reassure you that you are right. An astonishing excerpt from the Movies.com interview with Ridley Scott:
Movies.com: We had heard it was scripted that the Engineers were targeting our planet for destruction because we had crucified one of their representatives, and that Jesus Christ might have been an alien. Was that ever considered?
Ridley Scott: We definitely did, and then we thought it was a little too on the nose. But if you look at it as an “our children are misbehaving down there” scenario, there are moments where it looks like we’ve gone out of control, running around with armor and skirts, which of course would be the Roman Empire. And they were given a long run. A thousand years before their disintegration actually started to happen. And you can say, "Let's send down one more of our emissaries to see if he can stop it." Guess what? They crucified him.
Yeah. The reason the Engineers don't like us any more is that they made us a Space Jesus, and we broke him. Reader, that's not me pulling wild ideas out of my arse. That's RIDLEY SCOTT.
So, imagine poor crucified Jesus, a fresh spear wound in his side. Oh, hey, there's the 'lifegiver with his abdomen torn open' motif again. That's three times now: Prometheus, Engineer mural, Jesus Christ. And I don't think I have to mention the 'sacrifice in the interest of giving life' bit again, do I? Everyone on the same page? Good.
So how did our (in the context of the film) terrible murderous act of crucifixion end up wiping out all but one of the Engineers back on LV-223? Presumably through the black slime, which evidently models its behaviour on the user's mental state. Create unselfishly, accepting self-destruction as the cost, and the black stuff engenders fertile life. But expose the potent black slimy stuff to the thoughts and emotions of flawed humanity, and 'the sleep of reason produces monsters'. We never see the threat that the Engineers were fleeing from, we never see them killed other than accidentally (decapitation by door), and we see no remaining trace of whatever killed them. Either it left a long time ago, or it reverted to inert black slime, waiting for a human mind to reactivate it.
The black slime reacts to the nature and intent of the being that wields it, and the humans in the film didn't even know that they WERE wielding it. That's why it remained completely inert in David's presence, and why he needed a human proxy in order to use the stuff to create anything. The black goo could read no emotion or intent from him, because he was an android.
Shaw's comment when the urn chamber is entered - 'we've changed the atmosphere in the room' - is deceptively informative. The psychic atmosphere has changed, because humans - tainted, Space Jesus-killing humans - are present. The slime begins to engender new life, drawing not from a self-sacrificing Engineer but from human hunger for knowledge, for more life, for more everything. Little wonder, then, that it takes serpent-like form. The symbolism of a corrupting serpent, turning men into beasts, is pretty unmistakeable.
Refusal to accept death is anathema to the Engineers. Right from the first scene, we learned their code of willing self-sacrifice in accord with a greater purpose. When the severed Engineer head is temporarily brought back to life, its expression registers horror and disgust. Cinemagoers are confused when the head explodes, because it's not clear why it should have done so. Perhaps the Engineer wanted to die again, to undo the tainted human agenda of new life without sacrifice.
But some humans do act in ways the Engineers might have grudgingly admired. Take Holloway, Shaw's lover, who impregnates her barren womb with his black slime riddled semen before realising he is being transformed into something Other. Unlike the hapless geologist and botanist left behind in the chamber, who only want to stay alive, Holloway willingly embraces death. He all but invites Meredith Vickers to kill him, and it's surely significant that she does so using fire, the other gift Prometheus gave to man besides his life.
The 'Caesarean' scene is central to the film's themes of creation, sacrifice, and giving life. Shaw has discovered she's pregnant with something non-human and sets the autodoc to slice it out of her. She lies there screaming, a gaping wound in her stomach, while her tentacled alien child thrashes and squeals in the clamp above her and OH HEY IT'S THE LIFEGIVER WITH HER ABDOMEN TORN OPEN. How many times has that image come up now? Four, I make it. (We're not done yet.)
And she doesn't kill it. And she calls the procedure a 'caesarean' instead of an 'abortion'.
(I'm not even going to begin to explore the pro-choice versus forced birth implications of that scene. I don't think they're clear, and I'm not entirely comfortable doing so. Let's just say that her unwanted offspring turning out to be her salvation is possibly problematic from a feminist standpoint and leave it there for now.)
Here's where the Christian allegories really come through. The day of this strange birth just happens to be Christmas Day. And this is a 'virgin birth' of sorts, although a dark and twisted one, because Shaw couldn't possibly be pregnant. And Shaw's the crucifix-wearing Christian of the crew. We may well ask, echoing Yeats: what rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards LV-223 to be born?
Consider the scene where David tells Shaw that she's pregnant, and tell me that's not a riff on the Annunciation. The calm, graciously angelic android delivering the news, the pious mother who insists she can't possibly be pregnant, the wry declaration that it's no ordinary child... yeah, we've seen this before.
'And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God. And, behold, thy cousin Elisabeth, she hath also conceived a son in her old age: and this is the sixth month with her, who was called barren.'
A barren woman called Elizabeth, made pregnant by 'God'? Subtle, Ridley.
Anyway. If it weren't already clear enough that the central theme of the film is 'I suffer and die so that others may live' versus 'you suffer and die so that I may live' writ extremely large, Meredith Vickers helpfully spells it out:
'A king has his reign, and then he dies. It's inevitable.'
Vickers is not just speaking out of personal frustration here, though that's obviously one level of it. She wants her father out of the way, so she can finally come in to her inheritance. It's insult enough that Weyland describes the android David as 'the closest thing I have to a son', as if only a male heir was of any worth; his obstinate refusal to accept death is a slap in her face.
Weyland, preserved by his wealth and the technology it can buy, has lived far, far longer than his rightful time. A ghoulish, wizened creature who looks neither old nor young, he reminds me of Slough Feg, the decaying tyrant from the Slaine series in British comic 2000AD. In Slaine, an ancient (and by now familiar to you, dear reader, or so I would hope) Celtic law decrees that the King has to be ritually and willingly sacrificed at the end of his appointed time, for the good of the land and the people. Slough Feg refused to die, and became a rotting horror, the embodiment of evil.
The image of the sorcerer who refuses to accept rightful death is fundamental: it even forms a part of some occult philosophy. In Crowley's system, the magician who refuses to accept the bitter cup of Babalon and undergo dissolution of his individual ego in the Great Sea (remember that opening scene?) becomes an ossified, corrupted entity called a 'Black Brother' who can create no new life, and lives on as a sterile, emasculated husk.
With all this in mind, we can better understand the climactic scene in which the withered Weyland confronts the last surviving Engineer. See it from the Engineer's perspective. Two thousand years ago, humanity not only murdered the Engineers' emissary, it infected the Engineers' life-creating fluid with its own tainted selfish nature, creating monsters. And now, after so long, here humanity is, presumptuously accepting a long-overdue invitation, and even reawakening (and corrupting all over again) the life fluid.
And who has humanity chosen to represent them? A self-centred, self-satisfied narcissist who revels in his own artificially extended life, who speaks through the medium of a merely mechanical offspring. Humanity couldn't have chosen a worse ambassador.
It's hardly surprising that the Engineer reacts with contempt and disgust, ripping David's head off and battering Weyland to death with it. The subtext is bitter and ironic: you caused us to die at the hands of our own creation, so I am going to kill you with YOUR own creation, albeit in a crude and bludgeoning way.
The only way to save humanity is through self-sacrifice, and this is exactly what the captain (and his two oddly complacent co-pilots) opt to do. They crash the Prometheus into the Engineer's ship, giving up their lives in order to save others. Their willing self-sacrifice stands alongside Holloway's and the Engineer's from the opening sequence; by now, the film has racked up no less than five self-sacrificing gestures (six if we consider the exploding Engineer head).
Meredith Vickers, of course, has no interest in self-sacrifice. Like her father, she wants to keep herself alive, and so she ejects and lands on the planet's surface. With the surviving cast now down to Vickers and Shaw, we witness Vickers's rather silly death as the Engineer ship rolls over and crushes her, due to a sudden inability on her part to run sideways. Perhaps that's the point; perhaps the film is saying her view is blinkered, and ultimately that kills her. But I doubt it. Sometimes a daft death is just a daft death.
Finally, in the squidgy ending scenes of the film, the wrathful Engineer conveniently meets its death at the tentacles of Shaw's alien child, now somehow grown huge. But it's not just a death; there's obscene life being created here, too. The (in the Engineers' eyes) horrific human impulse to sacrifice others in order to survive has taken on flesh. The Engineer's body bursts open - blah blah lifegiver blah blah abdomen ripped apart hey we're up to five now - and the proto-Alien that emerges is the very image of the creature from the mural.
On the face of it, it seems absurd to suggest that the genesis of the Alien xenomorph ultimately lies in the grotesque human act of crucifying the Space Jockeys' emissary to Israel in four B.C., but that's what Ridley Scott proposes. It seems equally insane to propose that Prometheus is fundamentally about the clash between acceptance of death as a condition of creating/sustaining life versus clinging on to life at the expense of others, but the repeated, insistent use of motifs and themes bears this out.
As a closing point, let me draw your attention to a very different strand of symbolism that runs through Prometheus: the British science fiction show Doctor Who. In the 1970s episode 'The Daemons', an ancient mound is opened up, leading to an encounter with a gigantic being who proves to be an alien responsible for having guided mankind's development, and who now views mankind as a failed experiment that must be destroyed.
The Engineers are seen tootling on flutes, in exactly the same way that the second Doctor does. The Third Doctor had an companion whose name was Liz Shaw, the same name as the protagonist of Prometheus. As with anything else in the film, it could all be coincidental; but knowing Ridley Scott, it doesn't seem very likely.
Kalyx triaD
06-09-2012, 04:11 PM
Think you can space that out and clean it up? Epic wall-o-text there.
Reavant
06-09-2012, 05:10 PM
I liked it
Reavant
06-09-2012, 05:40 PM
I do have a question though...
So is the typical alien that we see at the end and is in all these alien movies made first in this film or is it an existing species and just pops up here.
If it was first made here, was it just because the creature implanted in the humanoid creature? If so then the chain of events would be infected scientist impregnating other scientist... her birthing/aborting a squid alien which face hugs an engineer, which causes a typical xenomorph to birth?
What about the deep throat snakes in the pyramid? did the black slime cause the meal worms to turn into that? then once they jumped down the throat of the scientist, why did it turn him into a miami resident and not impregnate him with an alien?
Actually why didnt he start to disintegrate when he drank the shit like the engineers did?
Reavant
06-09-2012, 06:13 PM
also was there another dark knight rises trailer before prometheus... i got there a little late
Buzzkill
06-09-2012, 06:14 PM
Fixed...I didn't write that, BTW
Nowhere Man
06-09-2012, 06:57 PM
Here's a huge breakdown of some of the themes/motifs throughout the movie (spoilers obviously)
Prometheus contains such a huge amount of mythic resonance that it effectively obscures a more conventional plot. I'd like to draw your attention to the use of motifs and callbacks in the film that not only enrich it, but offer possible hints as to what was going on in otherwise confusing scenes.
Let's begin with the eponymous titan himself, Prometheus. He was a wise and benevolent entity who created mankind in the first place, forming the first humans from clay. The Gods were more or less okay with that, until Prometheus gave them fire. This was a big no-no, as fire was supposed to be the exclusive property of the Gods. As punishment, Prometheus was chained to a rock and condemned to have his liver ripped out and eaten every day by an eagle. (His liver magically grew back, in case you were wondering.)
Fix that image in your mind, please: the giver of life, with his abdomen torn open. We'll be coming back to it many times in the course of this article.
The ethos of the titan Prometheus is one of willing and necessary sacrifice for life's sake. That's a pattern we see replicated throughout the ancient world. J G Frazer wrote his lengthy anthropological study, The Golden Bough, around the idea of the Dying God - a lifegiver who voluntarily dies for the sake of the people. It was incumbent upon the King to die at the right and proper time, because that was what heaven demanded, and fertility would not ensue if he did not do his royal duty of dying.
Now, consider the opening sequence of Prometheus. We fly over a spectacular vista, which may or may not be primordial Earth. According to Ridley Scott, it doesn't matter.
A lone Engineer at the top of a waterfall goes through a strange ritual, drinking from a cup of black goo that causes his body to disintegrate into the building blocks of life. We see the fragments of his body falling into the river, twirling and spiralling into DNA helices.
Ridley Scott has this to say about the scene: 'That could be a planet anywhere. All he’s doing is acting as a gardener in space. And the plant life, in fact, is the disintegration of himself. If you parallel that idea with other sacrificial elements in history – which are clearly illustrated with the Mayans and the Incas – he would live for one year as a prince, and at the end of that year, he would be taken and donated to the gods in hopes of improving what might happen next year, be it with crops or weather, etcetera.'
Can we find a God in human history who creates plant life through his own death, and who is associated with a river? It's not difficult to find several, but the most obvious candidate is Osiris, the epitome of all the Frazerian 'Dying Gods'.
And we wouldn't be amiss in seeing the first of the movie's many Christian allegories in this scene, either. The Engineer removes his cloak before the ceremony, and hesitates before drinking the cupful of genetic solvent; he may well have been thinking 'If it be Thy will, let this cup pass from me.'
So, we know something about the Engineers, a founding principle laid down in the very first scene: acceptance of death, up to and including self-sacrifice, is right and proper in the creation of life. Prometheus, Osiris, John Barleycorn, and of course the Jesus of Christianity are all supposed to embody this same principle. It is held up as one of the most enduring human concepts of what it means to be 'good'.
Seen in this light, the perplexing obscurity of the rest of the film yields to an examination of the interwoven themes of sacrifice, creation, and preservation of life. We also discover, through hints, exactly what the nature of the clash between the Engineers and humanity entailed.
The crew of the Prometheus discover an ancient chamber, presided over by a brooding solemn face, in which urns of the same black substance are kept. A mural on the wall presents an image which, if you did as I asked earlier on, you will recognise instantly: the lifegiver with his abdomen torn open. Go and look at it here to refresh your memory. Note the serenity on the Engineer's face here.
And there's another mural there, one which shows a familiar xenomorph-like figure. This is the Destroyer who mirrors the Creator, I think - the avatar of supremely selfish life, devouring and destroying others purely to preserve itself. As Ash puts it: 'a survivor, unclouded by conscience, remorse or delusions of morality.'
Through Shaw and Holloway's investigations, we learn that the Engineers not only created human life, they supervised our development. (How else are we to explain the numerous images of Engineers in primitive art, complete with star diagram showing us the way to find them?) We have to assume, then, that for a good few hundred thousand years, they were pretty happy with us. They could have destroyed us at any time, but instead, they effectively invited us over; the big pointy finger seems to be saying 'Hey, guys, when you're grown up enough to develop space travel, come see us.' Until something changed, something which not only messed up our relationship with them but caused their installation on LV-223 to be almost entirely wiped out.
From the Engineers' perspective, so long as humans retained that notion of self-sacrifice as central, we weren't entirely beyond redemption. But we went and screwed it all up, and the film hints at when, if not why: the Engineers at the base died two thousand years ago. That suggests that the event that turned them against us and led to the huge piles of dead Engineers lying about was one and the same event. We did something very, very bad, and somehow the consequences of that dreadful act accompanied the Engineers back to LV-223 and massacred them.
If you have uneasy suspicions about what 'a bad thing approximately 2,000 years ago' might be, then let me reassure you that you are right. An astonishing excerpt from the Movies.com interview with Ridley Scott:
Movies.com: We had heard it was scripted that the Engineers were targeting our planet for destruction because we had crucified one of their representatives, and that Jesus Christ might have been an alien. Was that ever considered?
Ridley Scott: We definitely did, and then we thought it was a little too on the nose. But if you look at it as an “our children are misbehaving down there” scenario, there are moments where it looks like we’ve gone out of control, running around with armor and skirts, which of course would be the Roman Empire. And they were given a long run. A thousand years before their disintegration actually started to happen. And you can say, "Let's send down one more of our emissaries to see if he can stop it." Guess what? They crucified him.
Yeah. The reason the Engineers don't like us any more is that they made us a Space Jesus, and we broke him. Reader, that's not me pulling wild ideas out of my arse. That's RIDLEY SCOTT.
So, imagine poor crucified Jesus, a fresh spear wound in his side. Oh, hey, there's the 'lifegiver with his abdomen torn open' motif again. That's three times now: Prometheus, Engineer mural, Jesus Christ. And I don't think I have to mention the 'sacrifice in the interest of giving life' bit again, do I? Everyone on the same page? Good.
So how did our (in the context of the film) terrible murderous act of crucifixion end up wiping out all but one of the Engineers back on LV-223? Presumably through the black slime, which evidently models its behaviour on the user's mental state. Create unselfishly, accepting self-destruction as the cost, and the black stuff engenders fertile life. But expose the potent black slimy stuff to the thoughts and emotions of flawed humanity, and 'the sleep of reason produces monsters'. We never see the threat that the Engineers were fleeing from, we never see them killed other than accidentally (decapitation by door), and we see no remaining trace of whatever killed them. Either it left a long time ago, or it reverted to inert black slime, waiting for a human mind to reactivate it.
The black slime reacts to the nature and intent of the being that wields it, and the humans in the film didn't even know that they WERE wielding it. That's why it remained completely inert in David's presence, and why he needed a human proxy in order to use the stuff to create anything. The black goo could read no emotion or intent from him, because he was an android.
Shaw's comment when the urn chamber is entered - 'we've changed the atmosphere in the room' - is deceptively informative. The psychic atmosphere has changed, because humans - tainted, Space Jesus-killing humans - are present. The slime begins to engender new life, drawing not from a self-sacrificing Engineer but from human hunger for knowledge, for more life, for more everything. Little wonder, then, that it takes serpent-like form. The symbolism of a corrupting serpent, turning men into beasts, is pretty unmistakeable.
Refusal to accept death is anathema to the Engineers. Right from the first scene, we learned their code of willing self-sacrifice in accord with a greater purpose. When the severed Engineer head is temporarily brought back to life, its expression registers horror and disgust. Cinemagoers are confused when the head explodes, because it's not clear why it should have done so. Perhaps the Engineer wanted to die again, to undo the tainted human agenda of new life without sacrifice.
But some humans do act in ways the Engineers might have grudgingly admired. Take Holloway, Shaw's lover, who impregnates her barren womb with his black slime riddled semen before realising he is being transformed into something Other. Unlike the hapless geologist and botanist left behind in the chamber, who only want to stay alive, Holloway willingly embraces death. He all but invites Meredith Vickers to kill him, and it's surely significant that she does so using fire, the other gift Prometheus gave to man besides his life.
The 'Caesarean' scene is central to the film's themes of creation, sacrifice, and giving life. Shaw has discovered she's pregnant with something non-human and sets the autodoc to slice it out of her. She lies there screaming, a gaping wound in her stomach, while her tentacled alien child thrashes and squeals in the clamp above her and OH HEY IT'S THE LIFEGIVER WITH HER ABDOMEN TORN OPEN. How many times has that image come up now? Four, I make it. (We're not done yet.)
And she doesn't kill it. And she calls the procedure a 'caesarean' instead of an 'abortion'.
(I'm not even going to begin to explore the pro-choice versus forced birth implications of that scene. I don't think they're clear, and I'm not entirely comfortable doing so. Let's just say that her unwanted offspring turning out to be her salvation is possibly problematic from a feminist standpoint and leave it there for now.)
Here's where the Christian allegories really come through. The day of this strange birth just happens to be Christmas Day. And this is a 'virgin birth' of sorts, although a dark and twisted one, because Shaw couldn't possibly be pregnant. And Shaw's the crucifix-wearing Christian of the crew. We may well ask, echoing Yeats: what rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards LV-223 to be born?
Consider the scene where David tells Shaw that she's pregnant, and tell me that's not a riff on the Annunciation. The calm, graciously angelic android delivering the news, the pious mother who insists she can't possibly be pregnant, the wry declaration that it's no ordinary child... yeah, we've seen this before.
'And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God. And, behold, thy cousin Elisabeth, she hath also conceived a son in her old age: and this is the sixth month with her, who was called barren.'
A barren woman called Elizabeth, made pregnant by 'God'? Subtle, Ridley.
Anyway. If it weren't already clear enough that the central theme of the film is 'I suffer and die so that others may live' versus 'you suffer and die so that I may live' writ extremely large, Meredith Vickers helpfully spells it out:
'A king has his reign, and then he dies. It's inevitable.'
Vickers is not just speaking out of personal frustration here, though that's obviously one level of it. She wants her father out of the way, so she can finally come in to her inheritance. It's insult enough that Weyland describes the android David as 'the closest thing I have to a son', as if only a male heir was of any worth; his obstinate refusal to accept death is a slap in her face.
Weyland, preserved by his wealth and the technology it can buy, has lived far, far longer than his rightful time. A ghoulish, wizened creature who looks neither old nor young, he reminds me of Slough Feg, the decaying tyrant from the Slaine series in British comic 2000AD. In Slaine, an ancient (and by now familiar to you, dear reader, or so I would hope) Celtic law decrees that the King has to be ritually and willingly sacrificed at the end of his appointed time, for the good of the land and the people. Slough Feg refused to die, and became a rotting horror, the embodiment of evil.
The image of the sorcerer who refuses to accept rightful death is fundamental: it even forms a part of some occult philosophy. In Crowley's system, the magician who refuses to accept the bitter cup of Babalon and undergo dissolution of his individual ego in the Great Sea (remember that opening scene?) becomes an ossified, corrupted entity called a 'Black Brother' who can create no new life, and lives on as a sterile, emasculated husk.
With all this in mind, we can better understand the climactic scene in which the withered Weyland confronts the last surviving Engineer. See it from the Engineer's perspective. Two thousand years ago, humanity not only murdered the Engineers' emissary, it infected the Engineers' life-creating fluid with its own tainted selfish nature, creating monsters. And now, after so long, here humanity is, presumptuously accepting a long-overdue invitation, and even reawakening (and corrupting all over again) the life fluid.
And who has humanity chosen to represent them? A self-centred, self-satisfied narcissist who revels in his own artificially extended life, who speaks through the medium of a merely mechanical offspring. Humanity couldn't have chosen a worse ambassador.
It's hardly surprising that the Engineer reacts with contempt and disgust, ripping David's head off and battering Weyland to death with it. The subtext is bitter and ironic: you caused us to die at the hands of our own creation, so I am going to kill you with YOUR own creation, albeit in a crude and bludgeoning way.
The only way to save humanity is through self-sacrifice, and this is exactly what the captain (and his two oddly complacent co-pilots) opt to do. They crash the Prometheus into the Engineer's ship, giving up their lives in order to save others. Their willing self-sacrifice stands alongside Holloway's and the Engineer's from the opening sequence; by now, the film has racked up no less than five self-sacrificing gestures (six if we consider the exploding Engineer head).
Meredith Vickers, of course, has no interest in self-sacrifice. Like her father, she wants to keep herself alive, and so she ejects and lands on the planet's surface. With the surviving cast now down to Vickers and Shaw, we witness Vickers's rather silly death as the Engineer ship rolls over and crushes her, due to a sudden inability on her part to run sideways. Perhaps that's the point; perhaps the film is saying her view is blinkered, and ultimately that kills her. But I doubt it. Sometimes a daft death is just a daft death.
Finally, in the squidgy ending scenes of the film, the wrathful Engineer conveniently meets its death at the tentacles of Shaw's alien child, now somehow grown huge. But it's not just a death; there's obscene life being created here, too. The (in the Engineers' eyes) horrific human impulse to sacrifice others in order to survive has taken on flesh. The Engineer's body bursts open - blah blah lifegiver blah blah abdomen ripped apart hey we're up to five now - and the proto-Alien that emerges is the very image of the creature from the mural.
On the face of it, it seems absurd to suggest that the genesis of the Alien xenomorph ultimately lies in the grotesque human act of crucifying the Space Jockeys' emissary to Israel in four B.C., but that's what Ridley Scott proposes. It seems equally insane to propose that Prometheus is fundamentally about the clash between acceptance of death as a condition of creating/sustaining life versus clinging on to life at the expense of others, but the repeated, insistent use of motifs and themes bears this out.
As a closing point, let me draw your attention to a very different strand of symbolism that runs through Prometheus: the British science fiction show Doctor Who. In the 1970s episode 'The Daemons', an ancient mound is opened up, leading to an encounter with a gigantic being who proves to be an alien responsible for having guided mankind's development, and who now views mankind as a failed experiment that must be destroyed.
The Engineers are seen tootling on flutes, in exactly the same way that the second Doctor does. The Third Doctor had an companion whose name was Liz Shaw, the same name as the protagonist of Prometheus. As with anything else in the film, it could all be coincidental; but knowing Ridley Scott, it doesn't seem very likely.
That actually makes me enjoy the movie an awful lot more. Who did write that, by the way?
mitch_h
06-09-2012, 06:58 PM
Didn't even meet my lowered expectations, awful.
YOUR Hero
06-09-2012, 09:24 PM
oh jeez. not liking what im hearing
DLVH84
06-10-2012, 12:26 AM
If they do make another one, I bet the new android's name will start with E.
Think about it...Ash, Bishop, Call, David.
Mr. JL
06-10-2012, 11:12 PM
I don't ever really comment here, but man they botched this movie BADLY.
There was no real payoff to the movie. The movie left more questions than it answered. Just an ending that teases you into believing they might make a sequel that will deliver what this movie SHOULD HAVE delivered.
Only bright spot was Michael Fassbender's acting.
Blitz
06-11-2012, 12:10 AM
I feel bad because I think this movie is getting a lot of flack because it was way overhyped, and not what people expected it to be.
It's not a bad movie, but I feel like it doesn't really know what it wants to be. It sort of vacillates between a regular sci-fi action/horror flick, and something slower and more meditative. In the end it seems like it just sort of walks the line between those, and I wish it would've picked a side.
That said, Fassbender is dynamite, and Theron atones for her awful Snow White overacting with a nicely modulated performance. I'm also intrigued by the implications for the whole Alien universe.
Overall I liked it, but I don't think it's quite as great as some are saying.
I saw it today.
First things first. I was expecting it to be a lot deeper than it was. I was wondering why all the darwinism/evolution freaks weren't flipping out about this movie. The reason, is because they basically threw the premisE of them being on this planet out the window. But atleast there was god reason. But I suppose if I went to a planet searching for the meaning of life and a bunch of mud snakes started mouth raping my crew, id forget too.
The 3d is questionable, but my vision might be bad or something. Its tough wearing 3d glasses over prescription glasses. There were several times where the backround was rendered completely blurry at the expense of the 3d shot. Several scenes where charachters are standing behind a 3d map and atleast for me, it didn't look that awesome. The character would become distorted and it would take the focus away from the acting.
The Wire fans! Idris ” Stringer Bell ” Elba, was not just a throwaway character. He was outstanding. Id day he was the third or maybe even second best performance depending on what you thought of Fasbenders charachter.
Fasbender was awesome per usual. The charachter had great legs to go places, but I didn't feel like they did enough with the charachter, writing wise. They could have made Fasbenders character sadistically awesome and it looks like it was headed there, but it never made it. It was one of my biggest disappointments.
Charlize Theron got blown off the screen by Noomi Rapace. Rapace was amazing. They didn't make her a badass like Sigorny Weaver. They made her a survivalist. It was perfect. Noomi Rapace was fantastic. More on Theron in a spoiler ...
Speaking of Rapace. She provided what I believe will be one of the great scenes in cinematic history. Anyone who's seen this, knows what I'm taking about. Its worth the price of admission.
Some of the story got shakey towards the end. Not to give anything away, but ...
the super humans turned on the regular humans and then gets raped by alien.,I really lost track if who the bad guy was and what any of it meant. Tbh, I was really thrown off by the giant bald human/alien dude.
Hey Guy Peirce is in this movie! Is what I said when the opening credits started. It took me about an hoir in a half to figure out who he was.
Now to Charlize
first I must say, ass looked a little flabby. But that's not the spoil I wanted to talk about. I haven't read much of this thread, but Charlize Theron was a robot right? Stringer foreshadowed it when he was trying to bang her. Then theres that scene where she man handles Fasbender and threatens to turn him off. Which became curious because Fasbender bot was very strong. He lifts and opens that helmet. Then she shows no emotion when her dad dies and the last clue for me was that the bypass machine in her room wasnt made for a woman. I thought that was curious. Maybe all this is obvious and been talked about, I dunno. ”
I give this movie 3 out of 4 stars. It was an excellent summer movie. Noomi Rapace is worth the price alone.
Oh yah,.the accordion reference flew over my head. Can anyone clue me in?
Sorry, wrapped that Theron.spoiler up
Blitz
06-11-2012, 01:17 AM
Now to Charlize
first I must say, ass looked a little flabby. But that's not the spoil I wanted to talk about. I haven't read much of this thread, but Charlize Theron was a robot right? Stringer foreshadowed it when he was trying to bang her. Then theres that scene where she man handles Fasbender and threatens to turn him off. Which became curious because Fasbender bot was very strong. He lifts and opens that helmet. Then she shows no emotion when her dad dies and the last clue for me was that the bypass machine in her room wasnt made for a woman. I thought that was curious. Maybe all this is obvious and been talked about, I dunno. ”
I think it's left deliberately ambiguous. My guess is she was human, and her cold nature was sort of a compare/contrast with the actual android, David. The fact that the med tank was calibrated for a man was because it was actually there for Weyland, just in case.
The Repace scene was so brilliantly executed, that for about an hour you know its coming. The moment Fasbender dips his finger in that drink, you could see how this was going to happen. Then when it starts to happen, its like 3 minutes of ” oh fuck here it comes, she's about to do this thing. ” and then it happens and it was fucking glorious.
The Genius
06-11-2012, 01:33 AM
also was there another dark knight rises trailer before prometheus... i got there a little late
no new dark night trailer.
I think it's left deliberately ambiguous. My guess is she was human, and her cold nature was sort of a compare/contrast with the actual android, David. The fact that the med tank was calibrated for a man was because it was actually there for Weyland, just in case.
I thought there were strong vibes that Theron and David were suppose to be brother and sister, but I might have looked to far into that. Then again, she was in the pod for two years and David didn't need to be, becausE he was a droid, BUT THEN AGAIN, they made it obvious that the droid was developing more human emotions and thought of himself as a human. Like the scene where David is putting on the oxygen helmet.
Ermaximus
06-11-2012, 10:00 AM
Oh yah,.the accordion reference flew over my head. Can anyone clue me in?
Crosby, Stills, & Nash reference.
Elba was even singing their song while playing it.
Reavant
06-11-2012, 10:39 AM
I do have a question though...
So is the typical alien that we see at the end and is in all these alien movies made first in this film or is it an existing species and just pops up here.
If it was first made here, was it just because the creature implanted in the humanoid creature? If so then the chain of events would be infected scientist impregnating other scientist... her birthing/aborting a squid alien which face hugs an engineer, which causes a typical xenomorph to birth?
What about the deep throat snakes in the pyramid? did the black slime cause the meal worms to turn into that? then once they jumped down the throat of the scientist, why did it turn him into a miami resident and not impregnate him with an alien?
Actually why didnt he start to disintegrate when he drank the shit like the engineers did?
Ermaximus
06-11-2012, 12:04 PM
http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/s480x480/534266_466063210090043_1393786850_n.jpg
Too funny to not share.
Buzzkill
06-11-2012, 02:25 PM
About Theron and Fassbender:
Fassbender calls her "mom" early in the film...just like she calls Weyland "father' later on. I interpreted this as them both being androids, but maybe Theron had a hand in creating Fassbender, just like Fassbender had a hand in creating the eventual Alien. Dunno.
I liked the movie for the most part tho. Better than 90% of sci fi movies. 7.5/10
Ermaximus
06-11-2012, 02:29 PM
About Theron and Fassbender:
Fassbender calls her "mom" early in the film...just like she calls Weyland "father' later on. I interpreted this as them both being androids, but maybe Theron had a hand in creating Fassbender, just like Fassbender had a hand in creating the eventual Alien. Dunno.
I liked the movie for the most part tho. Better than 90% of sci fi movies. 7.5/10
So he did say "mom." I swear I heard "mum" too, but thought he might have said ma'am. Does make you think thought.
Nowhere Man
06-11-2012, 06:28 PM
About Theron and Fassbender:
Fassbender calls her "mom" early in the film...just like she calls Weyland "father' later on. I interpreted this as them both being androids, but maybe Theron had a hand in creating Fassbender, just like Fassbender had a hand in creating the eventual Alien. Dunno.
I liked the movie for the most part tho. Better than 90% of sci fi movies. 7.5/10
I'm pretty sure "Mum" is just how British people say "Ma'am" (at least from what I can tell from watching James Bond movies and Doctor Who). I've seen it before, when a woman in a higher ranking position is addressed as "Mum." So I imagine David is just referring to Vickers' status as a high-ranking official in the Company.
I do have a question though...
So is the typical alien that we see at the end and is in all these alien movies made first in this film or is it an existing species and just pops up here.
If it was first made here, was it just because the creature implanted in the humanoid creature? If so then the chain of events would be infected scientist impregnating other scientist... her birthing/shorting a squid alien which face hugs an engineer, which causes a typical xenomorph to birth?
What about the deep throat snakes in the pyramid? did the black slime cause the meal worms to turn into that? then once they jumped down the throat of the scientist, why did it turn him into a miami resident and not impregnate him with an alien?
Actually why didnt he start to disintegrate when he drank the shit like the engineers did?
think the point being made was that humans as we know then where essentially descendants of Aliens
Reavant
06-12-2012, 01:14 AM
i mean the xenomorph
Buzzkill
06-12-2012, 02:51 PM
think the point being made was that humans as we know then where essentially descendants of Aliens
I'm pretty sure that the Alien shown at the end was the first ever species, and it goes back to the theme of creating a "perfect" creature. David was considered a "perfect" creation, and after rewatching Alien last night, the species created at the end of Prometheus is considered "absolute DNA perfect". So from my stand point it seems like David poisoned that bro, so that he would impregnate Rapace with the tentacle beast, which would thru "divine providence" save her in the end and create the perfect being (the Alien).
I am pretty new to the Alien universe tho so I really dont know wtf I'm talking about
Buzzkill
06-12-2012, 04:51 PM
Dude asks almost every possible question relating to prometheus
<object width="560" height="315"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/-x1YuvUQFJ0?version=3&hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/-x1YuvUQFJ0?version=3&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="560" height="315" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true"></embed></object>
This was cut down from 30 mins...get the full video here http://www.criticswatch.com/reviews/redlettermedia-half-in-the-bag-prometheus
Mr. JL
06-13-2012, 03:23 AM
Dude asks almost every possible question relating to prometheus
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This was cut down from 30 mins...get the full video here http://www.criticswatch.com/reviews/redlettermedia-half-in-the-bag-prometheus
That video was awesome.:y:
I'm pretty sure that the Alien shown at the end was the first ever species, and it goes back to the theme of creating a "perfect" creature. David was considered a "perfect" creation, and after rewatching Alien last night, the species created at the end of Prometheus is considered "absolute DNA perfect". So from my stand point it seems like David poisoned that bro, so that he would impregnate Rapace with the tentacle beast, which would thru "divine providence" save her in the end and create the perfect being (the Alien).
I am pretty new to the Alien universe tho so I really dont know wtf I'm talking about
I took it a little deeper I guess
I took it as evolution fast forwarded. The black stuff obviously was some alien organism. It got into the Dna of the doctor, who then fucked a baby into the female, who then produced an alien form. That allen form then impregnated the alien/humanoid and he birthed what we've all known as the traditional alien. I think this theory might be wrong tho. I thought what the movie ultimately was trying to say, was that the original alien that we know and love, was essentially part human.
Now, this could be wrong becausE, when they walk into the room with the mural on the ceiling, I remember seeing something silver plated that looked a lot like the queen alien.
Lol that video is amazing. I didn't even think about half that stuff.
Blitz
06-13-2012, 04:32 AM
http://art.penny-arcade.com/photos/i-LZg3Rz5/0/L/i-LZg3Rz5-XL.jpg
Hanso Amore
06-13-2012, 01:07 PM
Xenos existed before this film. Remember the first time they enter the chamber with the Giant head? there is a Giant Green Crystal under a mural of a Xeno.
Mooияakeя™
07-06-2012, 09:38 PM
Agree with the comment this film creates more questions than it gives answers. i have total faith in Scott and assume there is a sequel on the way.
Swiss Ultimate
08-02-2012, 04:04 PM
Let's talk sequel. (http://www.contactmusic.com/news/prometheus-sequel-slated-for-20142015-release_1381807)
The 'Prometheus' sequel is set for a 2014 or 2015 release.
The eagerly anticipated follow-up to the blockbuster is being actively pursued by studio Fox but co-writer Damon Lindelof may not be available to work on it due to scheduling conflicts.
Fox told The Hollywood Reporter: ''[Sir Ridley Scott and Fox] are actively pushing ahead with a follow-up,'' and looking to a 2014 or 2015 release.
Ridley has previously hinted at the name for the sequel which is expected to again feature Michael Fassbender and Noomi Rapace.
When discussing what he envisages in the second movie, he referenced the film's original working title, 'Paradise', suggesting it will be used next time.
He said: ''From the very beginning, I was working from a premise that lent itself to a sequel.
''I really don't want to meet God in the first one. I want to leave it open to Shaw saying, 'I don't want to go back to where I came from. I want to go where they came from.'
''I'd love to explore where [Dr. Shaw] goes next and what does she do when she gets there because if it is paradise, paradise can't be what you think it is.''
The director views paradise in his movie as ''sinister and ominous''.
He added: ''Because [the Engineers] are such aggressive f*****s. I always had it in there that the God-like creature that you will see actually is not so nice, and is certainly not God.''
Kalyx triaD
08-02-2012, 04:49 PM
May be looking at a rebellion here. This means xenomorphs are still unlikely, but I'm interested.
DLVH84
08-02-2012, 10:01 PM
The pieces of the puzzle is slowly being put in place.
Kalyx triaD
09-12-2012, 07:34 PM
Prometheus reminds me of really smart people who pretends to be stupid to get as many friends as possible. I keep feeling they nerfed what it wanted to be just to be that kind of summer tentpole flick.
3/5
Nowhere Man
09-12-2012, 07:39 PM
I keep wanting to like Prometheus, even though I still feel let down by it. I honestly think it just tried to do too much given the time constraints of a movie. If they had played with maybe just one of the themes it evoked (the ramifications of creating life, the interaction between a creator and his creation, the natural acceptance of death vs. the selfish prolonging of life--hell, just more character interaction with David and Vickers and old man Weyland), it could have been incredible, but there's just no way you can do all of those to their fullest extent in just two hours. So instead, they just kind of took a couple of steps in five different directions before winding up with a par-for-the-course monster movie.
I have a feeling that it would have made for a fucking incredible novel, though.
Kalyx triaD
09-12-2012, 07:54 PM
Yeah it should be better explored in a longer movie or some alternate medium. Maybe even split it into two or three movies. I can't imagine Prometheus 2 (code named Paradise) being really good. And for what Promethus ended up being, they should have just kept it in line with the Alien movies.
Taker it Easy
09-17-2012, 04:54 PM
I love this movie. Within three days of first watching the film I have watched it nearly three times.
Ridley Scott is a master of scifi. If you want to you can find beef with this film yet those things are minor and rarely matter to the story or experience and the questions answered and asked.
Fignuts
10-14-2012, 01:32 AM
Loved it.
OssMan
10-14-2012, 02:56 AM
Fuck this movie. The tagline for the DVD is "questions will be answered." As if any questions were answered in that movie at all.
Fignuts
10-14-2012, 04:10 AM
Yeah, I knew going in that it was purposely left open.
Doesn't make me angry. Dudes wanted to tell a story, but it ended up being too big for just one movie, and they didn't want to sacrifice their vision by hacking the shit out of it to fit it into one film.
Scott has even said that the sequel wouldn't be a direct tie in to the first Alien, and that it would in fact move even further from the Alien franchise. If they were to make the tie in film, it would be a third movie.
Fignuts
10-14-2012, 04:13 AM
Besides, I feel like the whole movie is more about delving into our intsinctual curiosity into where we came from, and different peoples motives for wanting to know our origins, rather just straight up answering it.
Skippord
10-14-2012, 04:38 AM
I just downloaded this and when I was skipping through it to make sure it work I saw that Engineer guy, hope he does some crazy shit
Fignuts
10-14-2012, 04:47 AM
Kinda.
Kalyx triaD
10-14-2012, 05:24 AM
Let's just say he's not a morning person.
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