View Full Version : Cena No Longer The #1 WWE Merch Seller, New #1
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 02:14 PM
WrestleZone has confirmed that an internal memo sent to WWE staffers this week listed the top 10 merchandise sellers, and John Cena has been replaced for the first time in several years as the number one seller.
The new number one?
CM Punk.
According to the memo, Punk is the number one merchandise selling WWE Superstar both on WWE Shop Zone and at the live events. The only time Cena was not number one was when The Rock returned to WWE Monday Night Raw, and his t-shirts sold a record number on ShopZone. According to a key source in WWE, two of Punk's shirts have already eclipsed the Rock's one-day sales record. "Punk's merchandise is hot," our source told us, "no one has dethroned Cena in over 5 years, and Punk's numbers are way above anything or anyone else."
Cena heel turn in the horizon?
St. Jimmy
10-03-2011, 02:19 PM
BEST. IN. THE. WORLD.
Lara Emily
10-03-2011, 02:24 PM
Well with CM Punk's role diminishing slightly on screen. That'll stop.
Vince saw the sales were going to eclipse Cena's and he was all:
http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lr8hceWAQ01qhl6vzo1_250.png
"LOL Nope."
Innovator
10-03-2011, 02:32 PM
Time for a couple more Pedigrees.
Innovator
10-03-2011, 02:34 PM
That and Cena's gonna get a new shirt color. What's left? Yellow, Green, .... Brown.
Rammsteinmad
10-03-2011, 02:35 PM
Cena heel turn in the horizon?
Of course. Punk sells more t-shirts and Cena's gonna snap.
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 02:39 PM
It will give the green light for sure...since it was reported that one of the reasons WWE resisted to give Cena a heel turn was due to his big merchandise sells...
Londoner
10-03-2011, 02:41 PM
Hope Punk mentions this. :D
Rammsteinmad
10-03-2011, 02:41 PM
No, won't happen.
Just because he's not #1 at the moment, doesn't mean his merch has stopped selling.
Cena will he a face forever, or at least for a very long, long time to come.
Emperor Smeat
10-03-2011, 02:42 PM
That and Cena's gonna get a new shirt color. What's left? Yellow, Green, .... Brown.
Limited edition Mystery Color which looks like white but it isn't.
Cena hasn't gotten a new shirt. That, combined with Punk's short burst of "mainstream" popularity are what caused this. Next quarter they'll settle and Cena will be #1 again.
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 02:51 PM
No, won't happen.
Just because he's not #1 at the moment, doesn't mean his merch has stopped selling.
Cena will he a face forever, or at least for a very long, long time to come.
I know his merch hasn't stop selling, but when the talk of a turn was floated around, it was rejected due to his top selling merchandise. I don't believe a heel turn will happen right now and I agree it will be a long time, but who knows?
Aguakate
10-03-2011, 03:21 PM
Cena won't turn heel, people.
He's the main reason why kids love WWE, whether we like it or not, so he won't turn.
Nicky Fives
10-03-2011, 03:54 PM
Proof in the pudding that Internet marks will spend their money on the stuff they like than the parents of the kids who love who WWE tells them to love......
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 04:09 PM
Cena won't turn heel, people.
He's the main reason why kids love WWE, whether we like it or not, so he won't turn.
Just like kids loved Hogan.
Aguakate
10-03-2011, 04:19 PM
Just like kids loved Hogan.
It's not the same at all.
Damian Rey
10-03-2011, 04:21 PM
Just like kids loved Hogan.
And it took, what, 10 plus years for Hogan to finally turn heel? Add to the fact there were countless rumors and reports floating around that Hogan was getting boo'd at WCW shows nearly from the moment he stepped foot there, and the turn was near immenent.
Cena's nowhere near that point, and if there was ever a heel turn to be had, they would have done while the iron was hot back in 2005. It wouldn't make a lick of sense to turn him right now or in the forseeable future.
Well with CM Punk's role diminishing slightly on screen. That'll stop.
Yo do know he's scheduled to feud with Del Rio, right?
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 04:36 PM
And it took, what, 10 plus years for Hogan to finally turn heel? Add to the fact there were countless rumors and reports floating around that Hogan was getting boo'd at WCW shows nearly from the moment he stepped foot there, and the turn was near immenent.
Cena's nowhere near that point, and if there was ever a heel turn to be had, they would have done while the iron was hot back in 2005. It wouldn't make a lick of sense to turn him right now or in the forseeable future.
WWE has the power to flip the switch at any time in the future. It wouldn't make sense you say? With this "conspiracy" angle and everything going crazy...it would be fitting to have Cena in on it in a big way. It didn't happen back in '05, but now that it has been marinated for sooo long, it would be perfect at anytime.
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 04:40 PM
It's not the same at all.
Why is that? Enlighten me.
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 04:44 PM
....
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 04:48 PM
Oh well...it's pretty cool though how the CM Punk t-shirts have become a hot sell. I'm looking forward into getting the WWE Ice Cream bar t-shirt.
addy2hotty
10-03-2011, 05:05 PM
Didn't Jeff Hardy once top Cena for a while?
I'm not taking away from Punk here, but Cena's shirts been around a lot longer, hasn't it?
Damian Rey
10-03-2011, 05:22 PM
WWE has the power to flip the switch at any time in the future. It wouldn't make sense you say? With this "conspiracy" angle and everything going crazy...it would be fitting to have Cena in on it in a big way. It didn't happen back in '05, but now that it has been marinated for sooo long, it would be perfect at anytime.
It hasn't been marinating, though. Though he still gets boo'd, it's nowhere near as intense or vocal as it was 6 years ago, when fans of the Attitude Era were still showing up and WWE was still a more mature program. With all the kids being catered to these days, and with Cena still getting a pretty solid face reaction night in and night out, and no real replacement hero in sight, turning Cena heel would be unwise, not to mention, take away Truth's and Miz' steam if Cena did turn via the conspiracy angle.
Just because WWE can flip the switch doesn't mean they should.
Punk is the best right now. He's out popping everyone on a consistent basis, his in-ring and mic work has been the best on WWE TV for a very, very long time, and he's been main eventing every PPV since MITB. Now he's beating Cena in merchandise sales.
I, for one, haven't been interested in a WWE t-shirt since 1999 when I wanted a DX jersey, and I was still a total mark. I'm planning on ordering a "BEST IN THE WORLD" t-shirt this month because I actually wouldn't be embarrassed to wear it in public (unlike ALL of John Cena's merch). It's an awesomely designed t-shirt. I hope they keep the great CM Punk shirts coming.
Blakeamus
10-03-2011, 06:14 PM
We will just have to wait and see
Punk is in exactly the same position right now as he was when he was World Heavyweight Champion, except he's more over and on the #1 show. Yes, he's in the main event every month, but that main event has been eclipsed by another angle that has very little to do with him. What mattered last night at Hell in a Cell? Was it that there was a new WWE champion? Or was it that Miz and Truth caused a riot? I'd find it hard pressed to find a legitimate argument for Del Rio winning mattering as much as or more than Miz and Truth's invasion.
CM Punk vs. Del Rio will not be a top feud. It's a secondary feud to the Miz/Truth/Hunter/Laurinitis/DAVID FUCKING OTUNGA storyline. Yes, David Bowtunga is about to be more important than CM Punk and the WWE Champion in terms of prominence in storylines. It hasn't happened JUST yet, but I just know it's coming.
I don't care at this point. I've accepted that Punk is and always will be no more than he was when he was WHC. I'll enjoy him for what it is. But I won't sit here and pretend like they're actually pushing him like he matters.
what? there is a pretty huge, noticeable difference between the way he's been booked/portrayed over the last 4-5 months than when he was WHC. If you honestly think he hasn't been pushed "like he matters" then I'm not seeing how you're ever going to be happy with somebody you want to see succeed outside of being given Cena's spot. And that Otunga line is completely ridiculous.
Yeah, I gotta agree with CSL here. Punk is being booked way more strongly now than he ever was.
Over the past 5 months? No. Going back to July, he was hot shit and was the hottest thing in probably 10 years. Over the past two months, I can easily say that yes, he's back to the point he was at when he was WHC.
And no, he HASN'T been pushed like he matters. How can you say he mattered last night? Aside from being there just to take the fall, he didn't. Neither did Del Rio, and I'll say that's an even bigger tragedy just because he's the new WWE champion.
I'm not expecting him to be the center of every top feud. But I will not say that what he's done in the last two PPVs feels anything like he really matters. It feels like the WWE championship is being pushed aside for the whole Miz/Truth/Triple H/Laurinits thing. And Triple H and Laurinitis, at this stage, should not be in the center of the top feud of the company, I'm sorry. And Hunter damn well should not have gone over Punk. There's no excuse for that shit.
Del Rio isn't over as a main eventer, and feuding with him will only pull Punk down a notch.
Yes, David Bowtunga is about to be more important than CM Punk and the WWE Champion in terms of prominence in storylines.
Really??
Yes. He's about to be inserted into probably "representing" Laurinitis. Him being in the middle of that storyline automatically makes him bigger than the WWE title feud (as it stands).
Over the past 5 months? No. Going back to July, he was hot shit and was the hottest thing in probably 10 years. Over the past two months, I can easily say that yes, he's back to the point he was at when he was WHC.
And no, he HASN'T been pushed like he matters. How can you say he mattered last night? Aside from being there just to take the fall, he didn't. Neither did Del Rio, and I'll say that's an even bigger tragedy just because he's the new WWE champion.
I'm not expecting him to be the center of every top feud. But I will not say that what he's done in the last two PPVs feels anything like he really matters. It feels like the WWE championship is being pushed aside for the whole Miz/Truth/Triple H/Laurinits thing. And Triple H and Laurinitis, at this stage, should not be in the center of the top feud of the company, I'm sorry. And Hunter damn well should not have gone over Punk. There's no excuse for that shit.
Del Rio isn't over as a main eventer, and feuding with him will only pull Punk down a notch.
Completely 100% disagree.
Sucks that you're not able to enjoy any of this
Yes. He's about to be inserted into probably "representing" Laurinitis. Him being in the middle of that storyline automatically makes him bigger than the WWE title feud (as it stands).
lol
By your logic Zack Ryder is being booked better than Punk
Nah, Ryder is being booked as a complete joke. Otunga would be used as a puppet. There's a difference.
And I'm enjoying parts of this. Don't get me wrong. I'm really enjoying the Punk/Truth aspect. But Laurinitis is playing Hunter to the point that he's coming off like a complete retard. And again, they really have no business being the top aspect of the company.
I'm just pointing out faults that may seem fine in the mean time, but in the long run are going to fuck things over and/or are foreshadowing of things.
I said it before and I'll say it again. Punk is going to mean nothing come the Rumble. He's on a steady decline in my eyes. After Del Rio (which I predicted he'd move onto a month ago) there's nothing there for Punk at the top of the card. He's becoming just another WWE face, not what I came to enjoy starting with his Hardy feud.
lol, if you honestly thing this mess dating back to SummerSlam has been "perfectly booked", we clearly have very differing opinions of what "good booking" is. Which is fine, I respect your opinion.
I said it before and I'll say it again. Punk is going to mean nothing come the Rumble.
What are you basing this on?
lol, if you honestly thing this mess dating back to SummerSlam has been "perfectly booked", we clearly have very differing opinions of what "good booking" is. Which is fine, I respect your decision.
Perfectly well booked*
I don't see anything wrong with it besides the fact that your favorite wrestler isn't being booked the way you want him to.
This is the same thing that happened when Christian lost the WHC to Orton a week after winning it. People were claiming Christian was being buried just because a guy they love lost a match
I believe what's transpired is shitty booking. Not "well booked", not "good booking". Shit booking. And again, differing opinions.
As for what I'm basing it on, I'm basing it on my perception of Punk and what to me has been a steady decline in importance.
I'm not expecting him to be the center of every top feud.
you pretty much are since he's been involved in the main event/top program of the company, booked stronger and given more mic time than anybody not named John Cena and have still found reasons to moan about the way he's been booked for the last few months. Randy Orton has jobbed on PPV twice in a month to Mark Henry, surely we should be complaining about the way he's been booked and "wasted" also? Has anybody pinned Cena the merchandise machine/undisputed franchise guy in 2 straight PPV mains since 2005? I don't know for sure but I don't recall it happening. Strange move for somebody that doesn't matter.
And how dare they put over one of the most over/believable performers that's been on top for 10+ years who's always been presented as the "most dangerous guy" even in front of Cena in a clusterfuck finish that did Punk no damage whatsoever. Everything you've said reeks of "Punk hasn't been given Cena's spot, nothing else is good enough".
I don't understand why they would go through all the trouble of pushing Punk to the moon only for them to let him not matter by the Royal Rumble. Doesn't add up to me
I don't see anything wrong with it besides the fact that your favorite wrestler isn't being booked the way you want him to.
This is the same thing that happened when Christian lost the WHC to Orton a week after winning it. People were claiming Christian was being buried just because a guy they love lost a match
Take Punk out of the equation. Del Rio has been booked as a fucking joke. He wins the WWE title at SummerSlam, is berated by Cena to the point that he's asked why he's in the ring with Punk and Cena, loses it the next month then gains it back. Can you honestly give me a good reason why Cena needed the title back on Del Rio's first defense? It makes Del Rio look like a joke.
I'd have been pissed if they gave the title back to Orton. Not because I love Henry, but because Henry cut to promos about how he's a dominating force in the business. It would have been ridiculous to do that.
And the Christian thing was stupid as well, and showed they had no faith in him. They had no real plans for him until fans starting throwing a huge bitch fit. I'm not even a fan of Christian and don't feel he deserves the title, and even I thought that was fucking stupid.
They had no real plans for him until fans starting throwing a huge bitch fit.
that is pure fantasy. The internet threw a bitchfit, the 2% of the fanbase they represent. The other 98%, the one's buying most of the merch, putting up the live gate and so forth seemed pretty happy Orton won.
Can you honestly give me a good reason why Cena needed the title back on Del Rio's first defense?
To prove that Del Rio was only champion because he cashed in on a vulnerable wrestler. Cena was right about Del Rio, so now Del Rio has to prove that he deserved to be WWE Champion.
It's not perfect, but if you listen to the promos, it makes sense.
And the Christian thing was stupid as well, and showed they had no faith in him. They had no real plans for him until fans starting throwing a huge bitch fit.
Again, what are you basing this on?
Are you saying that they no plans for Christian to turn heel and feud with Orton until some fans on the internet started bitching?
you pretty much are since he's been involved in the main event/top program of the company, booked stronger and given more mic time than anybody not named John Cena and have still found reasons to moan about the way he's been booked for the last few months. Randy Orton has jobbed on PPV twice in a month to Mark Henry, surely we should be complaining about the way he's been booked and "wasted" also? Has anybody pinned Cena the merchandise machine/undisputed franchise guy in 2 straight PPV mains since 2005? I don't know for sure but I don't recall it happening. Strange move for somebody that doesn't matter.
And how dare they put over one of the most over/believable performers that's been on top for 10+ years who's always been presented as the "most dangerous guy" even in front of Cena in a clusterfuck finish that did Punk no damage whatsoever. Everything you've said reeks of "Punk hasn't been given Cena's spot, nothing else is good enough".
If Punk was in a well-booked feud where he mattered, I'd be fine with it. You can have more than one feud on a main event level and have them matter equally. The Triple H/Laurinitis thing is taking precedent and Punk as well as Del Rio is being pushed aside.
I agree that Punk went over Cena twice and that was huge. I'm not complaining about July and August. But the second Nash came into the picture it all went to hell and Punk meant less and less. I honestly feel Punk should have lost the title to Cena so they could have done a rubber match at NOC (and I'm pretty sure I said that the week after SummerSlam, too). So no, I don't feel Punk needs to win everything. I'm feeling that everything is progressing way too quickly and, whether it's intentional or not, the hotshotting and running through six months of storylines in two months are hurting guys like Del Rio and Punk.
And I disagree that Hunter going over Punk didn't matter. It just shows that the old guard > new guard. I personally don't want Triple H going over anyone who hasn't been on top of the company for less than three years, because you send the message of the old guard is important and these new guys mean shit.
To prove that Del Rio was only champion because he cashed in on a vulnerable wrestler. Cena was right about Del Rio, so now Del Rio has to prove that he deserved to be WWE Champion
Again, what are you basing this on?
Are you saying that they no plans for Christian to turn heel and feud with Orton until some fans on the internet started bitching?
Fair enough on Del Rio, I can accept that to a point. But I still feel it makes someone who had been yo-yoed for months less strong than he should have been, because he had been reduced to next to nothing to fans.
As for Christian, if they had plans for him, why would they have taken the title off him immediately? It made zero sense and should have been stretched out to another PPV at least. They took it off him and I honestly don't believe it was going to be Christian vs. Orton.
And that's the pattern that's emerging. It's not necessarily that the storyline concepts themselves are bad, it's that things are going a million miles an hour. Hunter got physical way too early into his reign as COO which lead to a power struggle which, again, was way too early, Punk vs Cena was ended too early, Del Rio's first reign as champion was a joke and ended too early. They've really blown through a lot of possible simmering and build in like a quarter of the time.
If Punk was in a well-booked feud where he mattered, I'd be fine with it. You can have more than one feud on a main event level and have them matter equally. The Triple H/Laurinitis thing is taking precedent and Punk as well as Del Rio is being pushed aside.
I agree that Punk went over Cena twice and that was huge. I'm not complaining about July and August. But the second Nash came into the picture it all went to hell and Punk meant less and less. I honestly feel Punk should have lost the title to Cena so they could have done a rubber match at NOC (and I'm pretty sure I said that the week after SummerSlam, too). So no, I don't feel Punk needs to win everything. I'm feeling that everything is progressing way too quickly and, whether it's intentional or not, the hotshotting and running through six months of storylines in two months are hurting guys like Del Rio and Punk.
And I disagree that Hunter going over Punk didn't matter. It just shows that the old guard > new guard. I personally don't want Triple H going over anyone who hasn't been on top of the company for less than three years, because you send the message of the old guard is important and these new guys mean shit.
Even with the Triple H stuff taking precedence, it doesn't mean Del Rio/Punk isn't main event stuff.
And I'm still not getting this Punk meaning less and less part. He's been as big a part of the whole thing as anybody, only difference being he's been pinned on the last 2 PPV's.
And if it was Triple H cleanly beating Punk in a standard "grrr, I dislike you. Grrr I dislike you too, let's wrestle" match then I could maybe see where you're coming from on that but it's so far from that and involves much more stuff involving a lot of the said new guard and Punk, like Cena, Triple H, Miz, Cena, Truth, Johnny Ace and so forth is a cog in the wheel. And a pretty big one. Guys have to job every now and again. Guys have to not be in the main event every now and again. It's not the end of the world.
Tazz Dan
10-03-2011, 07:37 PM
Del Rio. Royal Rumble, MITB, HIAC, 2 time WWE champion, he's done a lot this year. Yes, his first title run wasn't that memorable but he's been the most pushed wrestler this year in terms of big occasions. I can't see how him and Punk feuding is a bad thing? It gives Del Rio more credibility against a more over wrestler, and gives Punk the opportunity to go with someone with more technical ability than Cena. And he'll no doubt end up with the belt again.
Malfeitor
10-03-2011, 07:42 PM
I don't believe Xero is saying that Punk feuding with Del Rio is bad. I believe he's just saying that the WWE title is playing second fiddle to the HHH storyline when it should be the other way around.
Lock Jaw
10-03-2011, 07:43 PM
Honestly, I think Punk is just "settling" now. He couldn't maintain being red hot forever. They probably could have milked it more, but whatever. He is now settling down into his face role.
Inevitably, I believe he will be built back up until he is WWE Champion again, for a lengthy run.
Emperor Smeat
10-03-2011, 08:12 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if Punk went back against Triple H taunting him and proving that he really doesn't have any control because he focused soo much on teaching Punk a lesson and still ended up loosing control with Miz and Truth causing havoc now. It lets Punk regain some of that "rebel" stuff he had before suddenly cooling down and Cena taking some of his momentum away by copying the whole "question authority" and being pissed off.
Del Rio vs Punk feud won't happen without Cena being involved because there is nothing else for Cena to be doing on the side and he still has a rematch clause. Probably ends up more as Del Rio vs Cena for a feud but Del Rio keeps the title for a while to build up the feud.
LewisTheTruest
10-03-2011, 09:04 PM
I agree with Xero's opinion on everything moving to fast and storylines not getting the long build ups they deserve but this relates back to the PPV situation.
Cut the PPVs, build the feuds and increase the buyrates.
blak23
10-03-2011, 09:49 PM
Xero what is going on with you bro been less than good lately
He figured he might as well turn heel if Cena won't.
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-04-2011, 02:12 AM
Well with CM Punk's role diminishing slightly on screen. That'll stop.
How do you dare call being in the MAIN EVENT of the last FOUR PPVs being a diminished role? Just because he lost? Chris Jericho has proved that you don't have to win every PPV to be over. Also CM Punk has done that for all of his career.
You don't have to win every match like John Cena to be over. Cena has lost his only claim to fame.
BEST IN THE WORLD!!!
Captain of Fun
10-04-2011, 02:55 AM
ugh.
Lara Emily
10-04-2011, 04:17 AM
I pretty much echo everything Xero said. Punk has gone from something special to a part that could easily have been played by anyone.
Punk has gone from something special to a part that could easily have been played by anyone.
Yeah, I'm sure Percy Watson would have pulled it off perfectly.
#BROKEN Hasney
10-04-2011, 04:44 AM
I love this thread. I wish Punk still had 2 segments a night even at this point and going on for the next two years so we can complain he's over-exposed.
I know that the quick fire PPV's aren't helping, but with the ADD and impatience people have that Punk isn't the 100% total focus after only a few weeks after headlining Night of Champions, who can blame them for constantly firing early?
I like it better like that right now, it's crazy the speed everything's happening and I want to watch every single week.
owenbrown
10-04-2011, 05:12 AM
I have a better shot of winning the Powerball and Mega Millions in the same week than Cena turning heel
"Punk out-sold Cena's shirts!"
IWC: Cena is finally turning heel!!! Yay!
WWE executives/shareholders: Cool. Now we have 2 huge merch sellers.
Although it appears that CM Punk's push has been cooled off in recent weeks, sources say that the straight edge superstar is in line for yet another strong push later this year that will likely include another WWE title run as well as a possible starring role in a WWE Studios movie.
CM Punk took somewhat of a backseat to John Cena and Alberto Del Rio heading into Sunday's Hell in a Cell pay-per-view, but with the title off Cena (who is expected to resume his feud with The Rock headed into Survivor Series), CM Punk will once again be placed back in the WWE title hunt and will begin chasing Alberto Del Rio for the title.
Coming of his surge in popularity earlier this summer, CM Punk has becoming one of the top merchandise movers in the entire company. WWE is looking to capitalize on Punk's popularity by releasing additional merchandise (including an autobiography) and are considering CM Punk as a leading man for an upcoming WWE Studios movie.
Overall, WWE officials are said to be very high on Punk right now, with Punk expected to be one of the centerpieces of Monday Night RAW heading into 2012. Despite many questioning whether WWE lost faith on CM Punk, the company is going "all in" on him in the coming months.
Source: pwinsider.com
Aguakate
10-04-2011, 05:08 PM
Honestly, I think Punk is just "settling" now. He couldn't maintain being red hot forever. They probably could have milked it more, but whatever. He is now settling down into his face role.
Inevitably, I believe he will be built back up until he is WWE Champion again, for a lengthy run.
Keeping Punk a "tweener", or a very VERY "light" face is where the money was.
#BROKEN Hasney
10-04-2011, 05:09 PM
I'm all for Punk cooling off, then being what shows are built around. It was an awesome summer, now we've got this HHH story arc to cap off which Punk will play a role in, then you'll have him/Del Rio and Rock/Cena taking it from Survivor Series.
Delicious.
Skippord
10-04-2011, 05:15 PM
I will watch a CM Punk movie
Lara Emily
10-04-2011, 05:27 PM
I will believe it when I see it and if I see it I will admit I was wrong.
I'll believe it when he wins the Rumble by eliminating all 29/39 other men with a single clothesline, before going on to become the WWE World InterState Tag Team Champion in a 4 hour epic at Mania where he wrestles himself.
Droford
10-04-2011, 06:14 PM
this would have only been news if it was someone like Ryder.
I'm with Xero on this one entirely.
CM Punk jump started the WWE this summer. It was a boring, slow, plodding, utterly predictable atmosphere until Punk came along with his little microphone and his list of complaints and shook things up. He cracked the boring ass foundation of what WWE RAW had become, and it's been much much more interesting ever since. Not because of some storyline, not because of good booking, but because CM Punk took the microphone on something like three-four different occasions and said things that needed to be said.
Punk was perfectly booked heading into MITB and Summerslam, but it was at Summerslam that things started to turn. The wheels were put into motion well before Summerslam for the WWE to capitalize on this rejuvenation, not by continuing to push the character of CM Punk: The Voice of the Voiceless, but by creating a storyline about guess who? Triple H. And like Xero said, as soon as Kevin Nash showed up, this whole thing started to go down the shitter.
Instead of Punk coming out and cutting his scathing promos and being "the guy", it's become about Triple H trying to be the WWE's leader/hero and going against the heels of the company. There is no clear cut storyline yet, but it's pretty damn clear from the past few RAW's that this will be about a group of heels going up against Triple H. It's no longer about CM Punk voicing his opinion and trying to stimulate true creative change within the company - that ship seems to have been sunk, and in its place is the new ship, and that new ship is captained by Triple H.
The transition happened between Summerslam and Night of Champions. It stopped being about CM Punk against the status quo, and became more and more about Triple H against "the conspiracy", which Punk seems to have no involvement in anymore. It's about Triple H, John Laurinaitis, The Miz, R-Truth, the rest of those heels, and soon enough, it will be about Vince McMahon. CM Punk is no longer part of this storyline, HIS storyline that HE created when he lit that first "pipebomb"; it has been hijacked from him and given to Triple H.
Don't believe me? Think I'm wrong? Pay more attention to RAW. Where was CM Punk at the top of the show? Nowhere; it was Triple H at the top of the show. Where was he at the end of the show, when Triple H was in the ring spouting off his bullshit comments about "being old school" and what the fuck ever? He was nowhere. It should be CM Punk in that ring, with a microphone, continuing the battle that I thought had begun before Night of Champions, and arguing against Triple H being in charge of the WWE, arguing against the status quo and the "sameness" that Triple H represents. Before NOC, CM Punk said that "he will not stop until Triple H is no longer the COO of the WWE." What happened to that? Where is CM Punk when the WWE roster is walking out on Triple H - when they're voicing their complaints against his new regime (and promptly being shut up by Triple H, I might add)? It shouldn't be Wade Barrett getting put in his place by Triple H during this storyline - it should be CM Punk putting Triple H in his place in this storyline, or atleast being given the opportunity to do so.
But like I said, this conspiracy storyline, this storyline that is now the centerpiece of RAW, is no longer about CM Punk, the very person who STARTED this whole thing. This storyline is about Triple H, and soon it will be about Triple H and Vince McMahon. I said it in another thread, and I'll say it again: CM Punk and Alberto Del Rio might be feuding over the WWE Championship, but they will NOT be the featured stars on RAW. They will play third string to Rock versus Cena and Triple H versus Laurinaitis/McMahon/random WWE heels.
And it's really fucking disappointing, because I'm getting more and more sure that this whole fucking thing is going to be the beginning of the storyline that leads to Vince McMahon versus Triple H at WrestleMania.
I hope that I'm wrong. I hope that Punk gets back into this angle in a big way - that he goes back to what he was doing this summer, saying what's on his mind, going AGAINST the grain, and going against a guy like Triple H who is using his stroke in the company to once again make himself the star of the show, when there are other guys who are far more deserving. But I don't think that's going to happen.
One thing that no one seems to see is that Punk is now WWE-ized. The whole point to his character, like Fox says, is to go against the grain. He pulled out three VERY awesome matches with Cena, the likes of which haven't been seen in some time, and never seen in Cena. And he was cutting promos, not reading from a script.
Instead, what is he doing now? High fiving Cena and playing bull fighter with Ricardo Rodriguez. He's making lame puke jokes at the feet of Triple H. And he's cutting more and more run of the mill written promos. Yes, there are still awesome moments because CM Punk can take shit and turn it to fucking gold, and at his core he's a professional wrestler who loves sports entertainment. Admittedly where he is isn't BAD in and of itself, it's just wrong for who and what he should be.
So I do say here that a big reason why I'm disappointed is not because Punk isn't at the top of the card so much, but that to me he's turned right back into the WWE drone he was when he was in Nexus. Again, he pulls it off well, but Punk is gradually going back to being CM Punk, the paint-by-numbers WWE character rather than CM Punk, the unique and fresh character. The character changed. I'm not crying "oh noez he's not saying things smarks are saying". I'm saying that, at its core, the character is currently having what made it interesting, CM Punk the man shining through entirely, cut out.
Exactly. He had a fresh angle going on, something we hadn't seen in a very long time, perhaps ever. He was breaking kayfabe without breaking kayfabe - fighting the WWE machine while still being part of the WWE machine, and for a moment, it actually looked like the WWE was going to run with it. But they've spun it in a different direction that removes Punk from the picture and paints a new one with Triple H as the new star. The edge that Punk had is gone, and now he's going to face Alberto Del Rio, who cannot challenge Punk in interesting and new ways.
To me, it's basically the equivalent of cooling off Stone Cold Steve Austin after two months of his storyline with Vince. If they took the story and had someone else come in and "fight the corporate honcho" and had Stone Cold go off and feud with someone else. They did the smart thing in that situation - they kept Austin hot by keeping the feud moving and evolving. They are not doing the same thing with CM Punk.
Again, like I said, maybe I'm wrong about this whole thing and Punk will go back to trying to dethrone Triple H as COO and "change things." But I'm really not seeing the WWE allowing Punk's storyline overshadow the upcoming Cena/Rock feud, OR the newly returned Triple H and his stupid conspiracy angle, which is bound to revolve around him and Vince McMahon in the coming months.
Rock Bottom
10-05-2011, 08:02 AM
Don't bother with this argument. People here are too stupid to even get past the "you're bitching because this guy is main eventing PPV's" logic.
Mr. Nerfect
10-05-2011, 08:58 AM
I can see where both sides are coming from. Take it from a guy who was so interested in the WWE that he actually watched RAW when CM Punk took the mic, and he very rarely watches RAW. But now I don't. Somewhere the WWE lost me. I completely get what people are saying with this storyline being hijacked away from Punk. Triple H is the central babyface on RAW and The Miz and R-Truth are in what was originally CM Punk's character -- the change maker.
That being said -- Punk selling merchandise is definitely great for his WWE career. Hopefully it doesn't cool off, the guy keeps getting pushed as a strong face, and he continues to speak the language any business understands. Money. If Punk is generating money for the WWE, then he'll be a big part of their storylines for the longest time. He's arguably the best speaker they have, is one of their best workers, and if he becomes comparably profitable to John Cena, then there is absolutely no reason to believe that he won't be a big star for years to come.
That being said, I do understand the creative disappointment people have. No one can argue that Punk is not being technically pushed, and no one is trying to say that. It's just that Punk went from having a live mic to being "another babyface," and while that is great for the man's sports entertainment career (and I have no doubt that Punk is absolutely loving his current position); it's disappointing for those who initially got behind the concept of a man bucking the system. Given that, though -- Punk could come out on RAW next week and bask in Triple H's situation and relish in the change that has come about and set everything right in the world. It wouldn't be the first time Punk has saved storylines from being uninteresting (he managed to make the bait-and-switch earlier this year when his scheduled rivarly was changed from Cena to Orton work so well).
To use an analogy, this is like hearing about your favourite television show from childhood being adapted into a modern film. You get excited. You get all these ideas of how it could go. Things seemed lined up to really validate your excitement. The casting is promising, and the special effects look great. But at the end of it you are unmoved, reminded of why you love the original, and realise that the new film is just a way to make money using the name and likeness of an existing franchise without any idea to really make it anything of its own.
CM Punk has become that, in my opinion. He was the hottest thing ever this year (exaggeration), and now he's still a hot product, but he's just that -- a product. The thing is, most idiots loved Transformers and The A-Team, though. It's just the fans who cling to what they love that ask the questions.
So, to summerize, Punk is The Green Lantern?
Anybody Thrilla
10-05-2011, 03:37 PM
Regarding that Fox post, Triple H was not at the top of the show. It was Randy Orton v. Drew McIntyre in what actually turned out to be a nice little match.
Anybody Thrilla
10-05-2011, 03:40 PM
Also, there were reports that Punk wasn't in the last segment (along with Cena, Sheamus, Kelly Kelly, etc.) because they anticipated fans booing the wrestlers who walked out, and they didn't want that heat on their top faces.
Anybody Thrilla
10-05-2011, 03:46 PM
On Punk high-fiving Cena:
In kayfabe, it makes perfect sense. Even when Punk set off the original pipe bomb after R-Truth put Cena through a table, he said that he liked Cena a lot more than most of the people in the back. His problem wasn't with Cena, but the notion that Cena was the best. They went back and forth in three matches and earned each other's respect, and Cena clearly wasn't part of Punk's "beef" with WWE. What animosity should Punk really have towards Cena at this point?
Let's also remember in kayfabe, he got a new very lucrative contract, which made him at least a little happier.
Mr. Nerfect
10-05-2011, 04:44 PM
Has Punk really proven his point yet? He beat Cena at Money in the Bank with a GTS after Cena took out Johnny Ace, and then he beat Cena at SummerSlam; but Cena then won the WWE Title and Punk lost it for Cena.
Anybody Thrilla
10-06-2011, 04:00 AM
Proven his point? Maybe not. Does he have any reason to be mad at Cena though? I think not.
CM Punk high-fiving Cena in the ring makes him a hypocrite.
He called Cena an ass-kisser and a phony. He said that John Cena represents what's wrong with the WWE. And now he's working side by side with him? High fiving him and being buddy-buddy with the WWE poster boy, who is STILL an ass kisser, and is STILL a phony? So, what does that make CM Punk? What does that say about the guy who is supposedly the anti-WWE bad boy when he's high fiving the WWE's golden child, who represents everything that CM Punk said he wanted to change in the WWE? It makes Punk look like a phony who goes back on his words.
That's what's wrong with it.
Anybody Thrilla
10-06-2011, 04:49 AM
You mean the same John Cena that punched Johnny Ace in the face when he was coming down to help keep the title around Cena's waist? The same John Cena that threatened to walk out if Vince McMahon didn't bring CM Punk back to have a title match with him because Punk earned it? Did you forget that?
Anybody Thrilla
10-06-2011, 04:58 AM
Here's how I see it. Punk's original beef was with Vince McMahon and the way that he ran things. Yes, he did go as far as to say that it wasn't going to get any better because Triple H would be an idiot as well. Punk got his title match, Vince McMahon was ousted, and Triple H came in and gave Punk the contract that he felt he deserved. Punk came back and ran down Triple H because he still wasn't convinced. Triple H tried to tell Punk over and over again that things WERE changing, but Punk still didn't buy it and pressed his buttons. Triple H got pissed off (as a man, not a boss) and challenged Punk to a fight. Punk accepted and hoped to cost Triple H his job, but the results of the match and the aftermath finally got Punk to believe that there was someone who wasn't Triple H that was making things screwy. For that reason, he laid off of Triple H.
Punk doesn't have a reason for personal beef with Cena outside of the spirit of competition. Punk doesn't have a reason for personal beef with Triple H, unless it is somehow revealed that Triple H IS the one pulling all the strings. At the end of the day though, he's still a professional wrestler who is under contract and wants to entertain the fans.
I don't feel his motivations are hard to follow here. Can't even believe I had to type all of that up, seeing as to how it's been on TV for all of us to see.
Sounds like someone has actually been paying attention to promos and storylines
Kane Knight
10-06-2011, 08:05 AM
CM Punk jump started the WWE this summer. It was a boring, slow, plodding, utterly predictable atmosphere until Punk came along with his little microphone and his list of complaints and shook things up. He cracked the boring ass foundation of what WWE RAW had become, and it's been much much more interesting ever since. Not because of some storyline, not because of good booking, but because CM Punk took the microphone on something like three-four different occasions and said things that needed to be said.
Conveniently, this is when ratings started to slip again.
Now I know, I know, when you like the guy who's on top during bad ratings it's not indicative and nobody cares about ratings, so this is meaningless due to fanboy convenience, but....
Just throwing it out there.
The NFL season also started around this time. So, there's that.
Kane Knight
10-06-2011, 01:32 PM
The NFL season also started around this time. So, there's that.
That would be especially nice if it had the same deleterious effects historically.
I'm not saying NFL has no impact on Raw, because that would be inane, but that excuse only works just so far. and it's only ever brought up selectively.
Innovator
10-06-2011, 01:47 PM
Conveniently, this is when ratings started to slip again.
Now I know, I know, when you like the guy who's on top during bad ratings it's not indicative and nobody cares about ratings, so this is meaningless due to fanboy convenience, but....
Just throwing it out there.
Conveniently, it's when the MITB buyrate jumped.
Mr. Nerfect
10-07-2011, 02:22 AM
That would be especially nice if it had the same deleterious effects historically.
I'm not saying NFL has no impact on Raw, because that would be inane, but that excuse only works just so far. and it's only ever brought up selectively.
You condition fans to expect crap, when they get something else it takes people a while to adjust. If people were watching Gossip Girl and then got an episode of The Shield, they'd freak. And Innovator makes a great point about the Money in the Bank buyrate. It's when Triple H got involved and John Cena won back the WWE Title that the buyrate for SummerSlam dipped.
Anyone can play that game.
Kane Knight
10-07-2011, 07:31 AM
apologetics
I shortened that for ya. Dude, you were one of the folks who used this sort of information against Cena. Don't be a hypocrite because you like Punk.
Conveniently, it's when the MITB buyrate jumped.
You mean the one where several of the first hits on Google stated they were drastically overreported? Well, that put me in my place. I'll wait and see what the financial reports say on that one, because at least there's some accountability there.
I'm betting even if it's the only PPV it happened at (assuming it to be true), it will be cleaved to as a trend and not a fluke. BECAUSE OH GOD WE'VE BEEN HERE BEFORE.
DAMN iNATOR
10-07-2011, 01:55 PM
That and Cena's gonna get a new shirt color. What's left? Yellow, Green, .... Brown.
...and pink. :shifty:
If people were watching Gossip Girl and then got an episode of The Shield, they'd freak..
absolutely. If I'm watching a show to see Leighton Meester and Blake Lively and Michael Chiklis's bald bonce shows up, I'm kicking off
Mr. Nerfect
10-07-2011, 08:56 PM
I shortened that for ya. Dude, you were one of the folks who used this sort of information against Cena. Don't be a hypocrite because you like Punk.
Cena was involved in those main events, too. Why does Cena not take accountability? Don't be a hypocrite because you dislike Punk.
His merch is selling, which is the reason the WWE have been huge supporters of John Cena and Rey Mysterio in the past. God knows it wasn't the ratings, dude.
StRaNgEr
10-08-2011, 04:11 PM
I can see the point of saying that punks role was diminished. And his on screen character has become less and less important. During the summer he was RED HOT, and like some people have already mentioned, it was the freshest thing seen on WWE programming in a LONG TIME. The way he was fueding with HHH, after being named COO was done REALLY well at first. But they had a super hot storyline, and they just blew through it WAY to fast. If done right, and given the right amount of time, (close to a year or so) they had their NEW austin vs. mcmahon program. But WWE kinda has a reputation for letting AMAZING story lines slip right through the cracks. It seems like they used punks HUGE boost in popularity, and flat out used the fact that he was super super over with the fans to put HHH back in the top spot.
Mr. Nerfect
10-08-2011, 07:09 PM
One thing to keep in mind: Triple H is not an active guy anymore. Yeah, he's dominating the storylines right now (and you can't argue against that), but eventually guys need to get in the ring against Alberto Del Rio, The Miz, R-Truth and Christian, etc. CM Punk is no doubt going to be one of those men.
Also, not that rumours mean shit -- but the mill has been reporting that the WWE is considering having Del Rio vs. Punk at WrestleMania next year. The guy is sticking around in the main event scene, it seems. Smarks buy his shit; and soon casual fans will because they are told to.
Survivor Series is also something to keep in mind. I'm not sure what the story will be by then (since angles are moving along so quickly these days), but The Rock and John Cena are confirmed to be two of a team of five -- and their opponents will obviously be the top heels of either RAW or SmackDown!. CM Punk would be an obvious choice to join their team, and it wouldn't surprise me if the other two guys on that team were Randy Orton and Sheamus. They'd no doubt be facing Alberto Del Rio, The Miz, R-Truth, Christian and another top heel -- with the top selections being Cody Rhodes, Dolph Ziggler, Jack Swagger and Wade Barrett (depending on who they are hardest for at the time). It'd probably be Barrett right now. I bring that up, because I'm asking one to consider the promo work that would go into that story. It's a perfect time for Punk to again get himself hot.
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