Steam (Moved from Skyrim thread)

[Pintint]

Bethesda reveals the game will heavily rely on Steamworks from Valve instead of just normally using Steam although they didn't reveal exactly will be done but Steam cloud saving and integrated voice commands appear to be likely.

http://www.giantbomb.com/news/praise-be-to-bethesda-skyrim-will-use-steamworks/3598/

Interest level dropped.

[Requiem]

Interest level dropped.

Why? Does your computer suck so bad that steam actually affects your system resources? Because if so, I doubt it would have ran Skyrim even without Steam. And if that's not the reason, then why?

Now, you'll have a friends interface like you would on either console version, plus achievements, and easy access to DLC, which will always remain with your copy of the game. (not to mention the game you purchase will always remain linked to your steam account for re-download at a later time if needed) And also, you can still play the games offline. (just covering my bases here, as to why this is not a bad thing)

[Requiem]

You'll also get quick/easy patches, save games to the steam cloud, a game web browser.

[El Fangel]

I really struggle to think of a reason why he would say that.

Steam is one of the best things to happen to gaming.

[Requiem]

I didn't used to like Steam, admittedly. It had a lot of stability issues, and used a lot of resources. But with technology advancing, and me wanting to streamline my gaming (ie; having less DVDs sitting around taking up space), I really like using it as a platform. Especially because as far as PC gaming goes, friends lists used to be nothing more than MSN/AIM and the like. If Steam keeps catching on and getting even bigger, it could easily become the PC equivalent of Xbox live or PSN. Really hope more games use it. It's disappointing that BF3 is using EA's Origin, as I have no interest in using their service at all. But then again, I was buying it on console anyways for hardware reasons.

[Pintint]

I really struggle to think of a reason why he would say that.

Steam is one of the best things to happen to gaming.

I dont like Steam because I dont like how it takes complete control over copies of the game I own. Now obviously, I don't own the game, but I do own a copy of the game that I have certain rights to.

First, Steam ties them to an account. If I lose my password or access to my account for whatever reason (for example, losing access to the email account, which has happened in the past with forums), then all the game copies I "own" are gone.

Basically, with Steam, I no longer "own" a copy of the game. Steam owns everything, I'm just renting it. Eventually programs like Steam and the movement for games to come in digital format only (for the same or higher price!) are going to lead to an END of a $59.99 game copy and a monthly fee for every game you want to play.

I know they want to fight piracy, but this is NOT the way to do it. I want a physical copy of the game. I want a manual, box etc. I dont want to pay the same amount of money and get even LESS control over what I bought, when the game ends up getting tied to a steam account that I might lose over the years. I still pull out and replay PC games that arent 15 years old...in 15 years, its very plausible that I would lose access to Steam and I wouldnt be able to play the games I paid for. I could UNDERSTAND Steam, if games on Steam cost half the price of retail games, accounting for the fact that you lose out on having a box, documentation etc.


I dont know where you guys live, but I dont live in a closet. I'm not rich either, but I have room to have...THINGS in my house, like games on the shelf, CD's on a rack and books on a bookcase. These days, it seems everyone complains about "DURR I DOESNT HAVE ROOM FOR ANYTHING IN PHYSICAL FORMAT". Are people living in closets?!? And scratching game discs? I own, probably around 70-100 PC games, and counting the ones on CD rom, (I own some floppies!), I have NEVER scratched a single CD. Everything is in pristine condition, neatly on a shelf. If you have a problem "scratching" CD's, maybe you shouldnt use them as coasters or use them to slide around on the floor. I dont understand how people can "scratch" CDs so often and easily.

As far as Steam "features" like achievements, I couldnt care less about. I dont need those features, I just want to be able to play the game I paid money for without running some program that steals control of it from me.


If they think programs like steam will help reduce piracy they are wrong...very wrong. Because right now pirates look a whole lot better in contrast when a person can pirate a copy of a game that doesn't require steam and be able to play it with no problems. I bought Morrowind and Oblivion. I'm not buying Skyrim.
Steam is junk, and the movement to all digitized games, is a movement to take more away from the consumer. You're paying more for less.

[Destor]

but that is the future of all media, games, dvds, tv shows...everything.

[Destor]

not saying thats a good thing, but it is the progression.

[Pintint]

Its the progression because of all the people who willingly give up their rights.

If Steam ended up with no following and people refusing to buy Steam games, guess what, the progression would slow down drastically and companies would look for ways to make more money off physical media.

This way they just drive more people to pirates.

[Destor]

of couse it would, but that isnt going to happen

[Pintint]

of couse it would, but that isnt going to happen

True, but I am not going to participate.

[Hanso Amore]

Pintint is like a Gay Furry Droford.

[Destor]

so basically you accept that the trend is heading to all digital format, you choose not to participate...so when we finally do fully tansition...you what? continue your platform of non involvement or do you rejoin the population?

[Destor]

if the latter: why needlessly wait? and if the former...well...even books age going digital...tic tac toe will onmly last you so long...

[Pintint]

If all games go digital, I will no longer buy games.

If all books go digital, I'll stop buying books.

In all likelyhood, at least where books are concerned, there will still be publishers making paper books (new LPs are still being made, I have a 2008 album on vinyl). I have no problems paying twice as much to get something in a real format instead of paying the same for less.

Ultimately, I can live without games and books, if they choose to no longer produce them in physical format. I still dont understand how people have trouble keeping their discs scratch free, or keeping their books intact. How do you live day to day if you're that careless? How do you use a stove without catching fire?

Mind boggling...

[Pintint]

Pintint is like a Gay Furry Droford.

Except I'm not gay. But carry on...

[Destor]

If all games go digital, I will no longer buy games.

If all books go digital, I'll stop buying books.

In all likelyhood, at least where books are concerned, there will still be publishers making paper books (new LPs are still being made, I have a 2008 album on vinyl). I have no problems paying twice as much to get something in a real format instead of paying the same for less.

Ultimately, I can live without games and books, if they choose to no longer produce them in physical format. I still dont understand how people have trouble keeping their discs scratch free, or keeping their books intact. How do you live day to day if you're that careless? How do you use a stove without catching fire?

Mind boggling...yeah, i can never understand how people let their disks get destroyed like they do.

[Poit]

I rather like Steam. When I got a new computer, I didn't have to go looking for all my game discs. I just downloaded & installed a single program (Steam), went to my game library, and installed everything I wanted. It's just so easy.

[Destor]

I rather like Steam. When I got a new computer, I didn't have to go looking for all my game discs. I just downloaded & installed a single program (Steam), went to my game library, and installed everything I wanted. It's just so easy.
^^^ thats what the future looks like. (and no i dont use steam)

[Requiem]

lolllllllll

his reasons basically consist of doubt, and bad memory. the fact that he doesn't know if he will have access to his email account is just hilarious. I have had the same email for 7 or 8 years now. i use it for everything related to account sign-ups, etc.. it is a gmail account. i don't think it will go anywhere for the next 20 years. honestly.. i feel it will still be there 20 years from now because it is google, and there is no way google is going anywhere. i have a 2nd email that i use for personal stuff, which i've had for 2 years. since i began using the internet, i have only stopped using -2- email addresses. the first, was a hotmail account that i stopped using because the email itself was just dumb. i also hated hotmail. the 2nd, was through a provider i knew was temporary because it was through a friend's hosting service.

how do you have that much of a problem with emails that you are worried you'll lose access to it? set up 2, each with a different password. link them to one another so that if you forget the PW of one, you can send it to the other. and if you somehow forget both, then you've got much bigger problems in your mind to deal with.

i find it kind of funny how a lot of people's reason for disliking steam involves 'well i dont actually own the game.. steam does'.

why is steam going to take away your access to it? are you really just that untrusting? what would they possibly have to gain from taking away someone's access to a game they paid for? why is this a reason for disliking the platform? what reason have they given you to think that you will one day no longer have access to the games you bought.

like it or not, this is the future, like Destor said.

just can't believe anyone would choose a hard format to take up space (it's not a matter of if you have the room.. it's a matter of useless formats sitting there doing nothing 99% of the time) when they could just install a single program and reinstall almost all of their game collection at once.

[Requiem]

Its the progression because of all the people who willingly give up their rights.

If Steam ended up with no following and people refusing to buy Steam games, guess what, the progression would slow down drastically and companies would look for ways to make more money off physical media.

This way they just drive more people to pirates.


Also, what? No they don't. DRM in the form of monitoring software, -limited use keys-, always on connections, and PRICE, drive people to pirate. Steam encourages me to buy games BECAUSE of its ease of use. Why would it encourage people to pirate?

I will say that I am probably one of the biggest game pirates on this board. I download a fuckton, and I have since I first found out how to download, years ago. But Steam is the first platform to actually ENCOURAGE me to purchase games because of all the special offers and deals they have all the time. They make it worth it to actually pay for things, ESPECIALLY because I will have access to them for years to come. All I have to do is load their program, log in, and boom.. I download what games I want from my collection, any updates right there, and start playing.

That's another thing. Updates. No longer do you have to go searching for updates to a game. They're just there, with a single mouse click, your game gets updated.

I get if you don't understand just how big Steam is and is becoming, but Valve is a company that will be around for a while. I have no doubt that Steam is one of their most profitable ventures now, and is only building in popularity. Even if their games bombed, they would still make a massive profit on Steam sales.

[Hanso Amore]

If Pintint wants to give up on something he enjoys due to some dated, idiotic definition of "Ownership", then FINE.

Do you use email Pintint? Or when they stopped mailing actual letters did you just stop?

[Hanso Amore]

IS IT EVER REALLY YOUR MAIL IF ITS DIGITAL AND CONTROLLED BY YAHOO?!?!?!?!?!

Really, that is your stance?

[Requiem]

If Pintint wants to give up on something he enjoys due to some dated, idiotic definition of "Ownership", then FINE.

Do you use email Pintint? Or when they stopped mailing actual letters did you just stop?

IS IT EVER REALLY YOUR MAIL IF ITS DIGITAL AND CONTROLLED BY YAHOO?!?!?!?!?!

Really, that is your stance?

Right? :lol:

No really, Hanso has a point. You don't really own any of the information in emails. They could decide to stop giving you access at any time.

[Requiem]

For instance. Steam just had a deal where I could buy -all- of the GTA games in a bundle for $12

I did. I now have all of the GTA games.

[Destor]

its like space age capitolism

[LoDownM]

Skryim thread derailed by steam argument :'(

I mean, I hate Steam(and the idea of games going digital distribution only) too. Not because of ownership reasons, but because of monthly bandwidth caps. But you don't see me going on a rant about it.

[Destor]

wasnt much of a damn thread tbh :mad:

[Destor]

FUCK YOU TPWW :foc:

[Pintint]

lolllllllll

his reasons basically consist of doubt, and bad memory. the fact that he doesn't know if he will have access to his email account is just hilarious. I have had the same email for 7 or 8 years now. i use it for everything related to account sign-ups, etc.. it is a gmail account. i don't think it will go anywhere for the next 20 years. honestly.. i feel it will still be there 20 years from now because it is google, and there is no way google is going anywhere. i have a 2nd email that i use for personal stuff, which i've had for 2 years. since i began using the internet, i have only stopped using -2- email addresses. the first, was a hotmail account that i stopped using because the email itself was just dumb. i also hated hotmail. the 2nd, was through a provider i knew was temporary because it was through a friend's hosting service.

how do you have that much of a problem with emails that you are worried you'll lose access to it? set up 2, each with a different password. link them to one another so that if you forget the PW of one, you can send it to the other. and if you somehow forget both, then you've got much bigger problems in your mind to deal with.

i find it kind of funny how a lot of people's reason for disliking steam involves 'well i dont actually own the game.. steam does'.

why is steam going to take away your access to it? are you really just that untrusting? what would they possibly have to gain from taking away someone's access to a game they paid for? why is this a reason for disliking the platform? what reason have they given you to think that you will one day no longer have access to the games you bought.

like it or not, this is the future, like Destor said.

just can't believe anyone would choose a hard format to take up space (it's not a matter of if you have the room.. it's a matter of useless formats sitting there doing nothing 99% of the time) when they could just install a single program and reinstall almost all of their game collection at once.

Because there is no way to lose an email without losing a password to it, oh wait, I lost an email account because someone hacked it and changed the pass, damn, must've been my imagination.

I prefer having a hard copy with access available at all time. What if I had no internet and wanted to play all of my steamworks only games? Oh wait, I couldn't do that because I'd need to log into my steam account.

I dont care if its the future or not. Just because something is "the future' doesnt mean its better. I mean, its great for publishers because they dont have to spend any money making packaging for the game and rake in bigger profits, but its bad for the people who ENJOY having a hard copy of their game.

Really, if they had an option where a steam game was $49.99 and a hard copy was $69.99, I'd pay the premium just to avoid dealing with Steam. And you may laugh all you want, but eventually they will make you pay hourly fees for ALL games you play when everything is distributed through digital services only.

Why would steam want to take away your access to it?

$

Why not? Lets start charging all our steam users a fee for using the service!



Do you use email Pintint? Or when they stopped mailing actual letters did you just stop?

I use email, but I still mail physical letters for certain things from time to time.

Of course I am old fashioned and its also personal preference. When I buy a hard copy of a game, I feel that I "bought" something. If I buy a digital copy, I feel like I paid money for nothing. Not to mention I like having a paper manual and a box with box art to display on my shelf. I like the old school large PC game boxes better then the half assed DVD boxes they use now as well.
If it comes to a point where I either pay to download a game through steam, I will either stop playing altogether or pirate.

[Requiem]

Gonna say this for like the 5th time on here, you don't have to be online to use your steam games. You wait till it fails to connect (like 30 seconds tops), then choose to use offline mode. Boom. Done. No internet required.

I know this, because at the last Steam discussion had on here, I tested it by disconnecting my internet and starting up Steam. Sure enough, after failing to auto-connect, it asked me what I wanted to do. Chose offline mode, and I was then able to use my games.

Why would steam take away your access for $? They would lose customers by taking away their access. Nobody would buy products from them if they took away their access. Why do you think they would take away your access? "For Money" isn't an answer. I want to know the marketing strategy that you think exists that would make a company (especially Valve) take away access to a product that you paid money for.

If you're referring to a subscription-based service, then that is probably the stupidest thing I've heard about Steam. Turning Steam into a subscription based service would be counterproductive, and non-competitive. Especially with EA making their Origin service. -Nobody- would pay for a service that's sole purpose is to let you purchase games. Nobody. Why would someone choose to use a premium service in order to purchase games, when they can purchase them elsewhere? It's not as if Steam is the ONLY place you can purchase games. -Guarantee- that if Valve decided to turn Steam into a premium service, it would bomb. It would destroy Steam, and provide less access to games, which would in turn make game developers less prone to release through their service.

They already make money by pairing with companies who make the games, to get a cut of the price they charge for games. Every single game sold on Steam, a % of that goes to Valve. That's the point of the service. It is a place where game creators can market and sell their products. Valve already makes money on Steam. They would gain nothing by what you've suggested could happen.

I know you don't seem to have a lot of knowledge on the industry, but Valve is a quality company that cares about their customers. This may seem like a foreign concept to a lot of customers who use EA or Activision's products, but Valve has never given me a reason to think they don't care.

And also, don't be loose with your information, and you won't get hacked. Don't download things that seem shady. -Learn how to use your computer-, and prevent spyware and viruses from getting there in the first place. Really, your excuses are all things that are your own fault. The quality of Steam isn't even in question, because so far, the complaints you've had about -it-, are easily refutable or just made up claims that you think make sense.

Saying "They're going to charge hourly fees for all games" is nothing but speculation based on nothing. I mean, you obviously have very little knowledge on the gaming industry as is, so I don't know what gives you the foresight to think that hourly fees for all games are going to be the business model of the future.

[Requiem]

You sound like you are just TRYING to find reasons not to like it. Like, there doesn't seem to be any valid reason for your hatred toward this service. You're just making things up in your head and believing them without any thought as to how ridiculous or baseless they sound.

[Razzamajazz]

plz stop derailing this thread. take it elsewhere por FAYvor

[Destor]

tpww was made for flame wars, its why i love this place <3

[Destor]

and req :heart:

[Pintint]

Gonna say this for like the 5th time on here, you don't have to be online to use your steam games. You wait till it fails to connect (like 30 seconds tops), then choose to use offline mode. Boom. Done. No internet required.

I know this, because at the last Steam discussion had on here, I tested it by disconnecting my internet and starting up Steam. Sure enough, after failing to auto-connect, it asked me what I wanted to do. Chose offline mode, and I was then able to use my games.

Why would steam take away your access for $? They would lose customers by taking away their access. Nobody would buy products from them if they took away their access. Why do you think they would take away your access? "For Money" isn't an answer. I want to know the marketing strategy that you think exists that would make a company (especially Valve) take away access to a product that you paid money for.

If you're referring to a subscription-based service, then that is probably the stupidest thing I've heard about Steam. Turning Steam into a subscription based service would be counterproductive, and non-competitive. Especially with EA making their Origin service. -Nobody- would pay for a service that's sole purpose is to let you purchase games. Nobody. Why would someone choose to use a premium service in order to purchase games, when they can purchase them elsewhere? It's not as if Steam is the ONLY place you can purchase games. -Guarantee- that if Valve decided to turn Steam into a premium service, it would bomb. It would destroy Steam, and provide less access to games, which would in turn make game developers less prone to release through their service.

They already make money by pairing with companies who make the games, to get a cut of the price they charge for games. Every single game sold on Steam, a % of that goes to Valve. That's the point of the service. It is a place where game creators can market and sell their products. Valve already makes money on Steam. They would gain nothing by what you've suggested could happen.

I know you don't seem to have a lot of knowledge on the industry, but Valve is a quality company that cares about their customers. This may seem like a foreign concept to a lot of customers who use EA or Activision's products, but Valve has never given me a reason to think they don't care.

And also, don't be loose with your information, and you won't get hacked. Don't download things that seem shady. -Learn how to use your computer-, and prevent spyware and viruses from getting there in the first place. Really, your excuses are all things that are your own fault. The quality of Steam isn't even in question, because so far, the complaints you've had about -it-, are easily refutable or just made up claims that you think make sense.

Saying "They're going to charge hourly fees for all games" is nothing but speculation based on nothing. I mean, you obviously have very little knowledge on the gaming industry as is, so I don't know what gives you the foresight to think that hourly fees for all games are going to be the business model of the future.

lol.

You do have to activate them online though.

And you can see into the future ? I dont know why so many people fellate Valve, they are hardly as great of a company as people make them out to be. Sure Half Life 1 was great, but 2 was junk imo. And of course, Valve wouldnt get an idea to start charging people for anything other than the $50 entry fee...oh wait, they sell crap for TF2.

I read an interview a while back with someone from the industry who claimed that in the future, all games are headed to pay to play with a monthly fee. Pretty similar to cable TV. Of course, first they'd have to gain full control over whatever you install on your PC and Steam lets them do that.

ROFL on the computer security lesson. Thanks buddy, because I just give out my pass everywhere...oh wait, I regularly (about once a month) run anti spyware, virus and malware programs, defrag and scandisc my HD. It was not a security issue on my end, but rather on Hotmail's end. If there are people who've hacked into military computer systems...then nothing can be made 100% hack proof.

And yeah, Steam isn't the ONLY place to purchase games...but wait! all Steam games, no matter where you purchase them force you to install the program and play through it anyway! So, it doesnt matter where you go it from...

And turning Steam into pay to play would bomb? Sure, when we still have ways to go around it...but not if every single game released is a "steamworks" game. And there are thousands of people who will pay money for Steam anyway and would buy a dog turd if it had "valve" written on it, because by god, Valve are the greatest company known to man. :rofl:

If you like Steam, more power to you. I'm not supporting anything that takes control of my games away from me. Game companies complain about pirates and then take steps to screw their customers... Pirates FTW http://www.emofaces.com/en/emoticons/p/pirate-emoticon-animated-flag-waving-emoticon.gif

[Hanso Amore]

I dont see how one can engage in lust for animals and people dressed like them, and consider themselves OLD FASHIONED

[Requiem]

alright guy. that you think valve isn't a good company speaks loads about your knowledge. half-life 2 wasn't a good game? get the fuck out of here. half-life, half-life 2, portal 1 + 2, Left 4 Dead 1 + 2, Counter-strike, Day of Defeat, the original Team Fortress.. there's a reason it takes them so long between sequels. because they're not like activision, turning out new products every other year for profit. they put out -quality-.

Valve is a classic company that stayed true to their roots and innovates through their technology and ideas. If you think Valve aren't that great of a company, then I'd LOVE to know what your idea of a GOOD company is. They must be paragons of the industry. :roll:

if your pc sucked too much to run it, then whatever that's your own fault too.. but half-life 2 was fantastic, from both a gameplay and a technological standpoint. and ESPECIALLY from a sequel standpoint. there is a reason it has won some -39- game of the year awards. i'd love to hear your reasoning if i didn't know it was going to be a bunch of self righteous made up bullshit in order to make yourself SOUND like you have some semblance of a clue what you're talking about.

and you mean TF2, the game which is now free2play? yeah that game, which has seen well over 100 patches since its creation, compared to more popular games like call of duty which see maybe 2 patches through their lives before the next crap game is churned out. patches which not only fix it, but also add countless new content for players to enjoy without having to purchase pointless expansions?

your comparison is a bit backwards.. they're not forcing you to pay anything to play it. they didn't take anything away from the players who bought the game. nor did they start charging for anything you can't get by playing the game. anything you can buy in the store can be crafted, gotten in a drop, or traded for anyways so there are no unfair items in the store.

so what's the point of your comparison? another 'game you dont like' so you think you can make things up in your head to give you a reason not to like it?

[Requiem]

just lol

all of your reasons are lol

[Requiem]

sometimes a bit rofl, but mostly just lol

[Requiem]

also, I'd love if you could link me to your source that states all games are going to be hourly.

because one voice in a sea of millions is obviously 'the way things are going to be'. :roll:

[Pintint]

alright guy. that you think valve isn't a good company speaks loads about your knowledge. half-life 2 wasn't a good game? get the fuck out of here. half-life, half-life 2, portal 1 + 2, Left 4 Dead 1 + 2, Counter-strike, Day of Defeat, the original Team Fortress.. there's a reason it takes them so long between sequels. because they're not like activision, turning out new products every other year for profit. they put out -quality-.

Valve is a classic company that stayed true to their roots and innovates through their technology and ideas. If you think Valve aren't that great of a company, then I'd LOVE to know what your idea of a GOOD company is. They must be paragons of the industry. :roll:

if your pc sucked too much to run it, then whatever that's your own fault too.. but half-life 2 was fantastic, from both a gameplay and a technological standpoint. and ESPECIALLY from a sequel standpoint. there is a reason it has won some -39- game of the year awards. i'd love to hear your reasoning if i didn't know it was going to be a bunch of self righteous made up bullshit in order to make yourself SOUND like you have some semblance of a clue what you're talking about.

and you mean TF2, the game which is now free2play? yeah that game, which has seen well over 100 patches since its creation, compared to more popular games like call of duty which see maybe 2 patches through their lives before the next crap game is churned out. patches which not only fix it, but also add countless new content for players to enjoy without having to purchase pointless expansions?

your comparison is a bit backwards.. they're not forcing you to pay anything to play it. they didn't take anything away from the players who bought the game. nor did they start charging for anything you can't get by playing the game. anything you can buy in the store can be crafted, gotten in a drop, or traded for anyways so there are no unfair items in the store.

so what's the point of your comparison? another 'game you dont like' so you think you can make things up in your head to give you a reason not to like it?

LOL

If it has 100 GOTY awards, it must be great!

Nah, I didnt like it. I loved Half Life 1, but 2 was annoying. You didnt have the same freedoms you had in 1. The game enviroment was extremely boring. Most of all, Alyx was probably the most annoying sidekick/character in any game I played. Worse than Superfly Johnson (I cant leave without my buddy superfly!). Granted, I didnt finish it...because I got sick of Alyx and the boring maps, and maybe it got better later in the game...but it's a FAR FAR worse game than Half Life 1. But, Deus Ex 1 is a better game than both of them :). Half Life is vastly overrated imo.


My PC wasnt "too crappy" to run it. I dont understand why you think that if a person doesnt like a game/service, it must mean that their PC is not good enough to run it. As if thats the only reason someone could dislike a game.

The point stands that in my opinion, the movement to all digital games is a step in the wrong direction. Valve has FORCED people to use their service. If Valve was truly as "great" of a company as everyone claims, they would've allowed people to bypass Steam if they bought the game at retail. But then again, you will probably have a reason why its a great move, hell, Valve could start killing people and its fanboys will praise it as "a great approach to murder!!!".

Its "cool" and "trendy" to like Valve and hate on EA and Activision. I've never had a problem with an EA or Activision game, so I really dont understand this. Its not a matter of the items giving you advantage in TF2 or not, its a matter of Valve experimenting whether they can charge for things in game and I think it will lead to people who pay more having advantages in the future. I could be wrong...but if they can make money of it, you can bet your ass they will. People treat Valve like some sort of saint, when really, they're just another corporation whose priority is their bottom line. And that's fine. But I dont like being forced to use their steam service and I have not liked the quality of their games since Half Life 1.

And Team Fortress wasnt even a valve game. It was a mod for Quake that Valve acquired and made into Team Fortress classic. Valve shouldn't get any credit for it. I loved the original TF and Classic for HL1 but hated the art style in TF2, so I never got into it.

Oh wait, I probably hated the art style of TF2 because my computer suxxorz! :rofl:

[Requiem]

lol 'cool and trendy to like valve and hate ea activision'. lolololololololol lololololololololol

lololol

not because EA has -proven- their worth by buying out countless quality companies and milking them dry and then shutting them down. nah that couldn't have anything to do with it. but i don't expect you to know that..... actually, I should. if you're going to sit here harping on Valve, you should at least know a little more about the industry you're discussing. (yeah, I keep saying you don't know shit about the industry because it is obvious you don't. you're attempting to sound like you do, but everything that comes out is clearly things you've made up and believe for no reason other than it sounds good in your head) you're assuming i have no reason for disliking companies like EA and Activision, when really I could sit here all day telling you why they are in the business for money and could care less about the quality of their products as long as they sell. That's another topic though which I don't really care to hear your side of, because it's just going to be even more nonsense.

ALL companies have a priority to make a profit. Nobody will debate that. (you probably would :roll:) But what sets some apart from others is the QUALITY they deliver to ensure that profit, as opposed to releasing quantity in order to achieve profit. you are a terrible gamer if you think the quality of valve's products have been lousy since half-life 1. i dont even have anything else to say to that.. it's obviously your opinion, but wow.. what a shitty, watered down bunch of nonsense. I could understand someone who doesn't like shooters not caring for a bunch of shooters. But you obviously like some shooters, so that's not the reason. if you think their games lack quality since then, i SHUDDER to think of what you think makes a good game, because it's probably more of this backward logic.

and even more lollllll at your reasons for disliking HL2. Alyx was barely even there through the game. You see her a few times. If you didn't even keep playing, then I know for a fact she was barely there in the first parts of the game. She wasn't even a sidekick. Comments like that are what make me think you just make things up in order to sound like you have a point. And if you found the environments boring then I just am having a hard time picturing you as a gamer, period. Ravenholm was fucking creepy. The gameplay itself was incredibly unique, and the graphics were spectacular. The textures, models.. ESPECIALLY the models... the physics based game engine which was ahead of its time. Keep in mind it came out in -2004- and it can still stand toe to toe with games 7 years later.

Would just like to point this out. You're right, a hundred game of the year awards don't mean a whole lot.

But typically, even the best games will get a couple 'panned' reviews from major critics. People will find something wrong with it, like you're doing, just to give it a worse review. But, out of 81 major reviewers, 80 of them gave it a 90 or higher. The 81st? an 85 complaining about the friendly AI. 31 were perfect 100's. I'll give you that awards don't mean a whole lot, but in this day and age it is near impossible to find a game so -universally- regarded as that fantastic. Games like that come along once or twice in a decade, if that. Player reviews average 9.3 and 9.4 depending where you look.


That you are even trying to argue that the game 'sucked', and then admit that you barely played it, just screams try-hard. If anyone is trying to be trendy here, it is you. Trying to act like you're too good for Valve products because of some misplaced elitist ego or something. I honestly don't know your actual reasons, because the ones you've given me so far are pitiful.

[Requiem]

And what sort of visuals would have made you like TF2? Its visuals make it stand out and give it charm, in a genre that takes itself way too seriously. What, you wanted realism? There are a hundred other games that strive for realism.

And also.. you realize that the people who made Team Fortress ended up working for Valve and making Team Fortress Classic, right? I mean, you wouldn't just make something up like 'Valve deserves no credit' while ignoring the fact that they are the reason the game got popular, would you?

Same with Counter-Strike. Valve had the foresight to hire the people who made it to work for them and develop future titles.

[D Mac]

Seriously dudes, take that shit somewhere else.

[Requiem]

If Destor likes what he sees, I aims to please. :cool:

[#BROKEN Hasney]

There is no way I'm having the Skyrim thread ruined like that. NOT ON MY WATCH.

[Poit]

Thanks Hasney. :heart:

[Requiem]

I have no problem having the thread split. :y:

[NoJabbaNoBogRoll]

Steam kicks six sides of ass, and Pintint is an idiot.

Close thread.

[D Mac]

Hasney, you're the fucking man. You should mod every forum.

[Xero]

I didn't read the whole thing, but good luck to Pinit when everything is digital (it's irreversible at this point and completely moot) and he's staring at the wall any time he has down time.

My favorite part is when he says he's going to stop reading books if they all go digital.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

ANYWHOO, offline mode is still fussy for me as to when it wants to work. I couldn't get on yesterday morning after not being online overnight. Worked fine just a second ago. Just doesn't like me being offline for x hours.

I don't buy games on Steam full-price either. I haven't found a game that's not on sale that isn't cheaper on Amazon. Then the three CD key sites for even cheaper games. The top 2 of these sometimes need you to be on a Russian VPN to activate the game, but the 3rd one is an official UK/US seller.

www.intkeys.com
www.cdkkeyhouse.com
www.greenmangaming.com

That's not a dig at Valve, I'm pretty sure that publishers get to set the prices on Steam since they're not buying stock of games then selling it at whatever price. But the pricing is bullshit.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Hasney, you're the fucking man. You should mod every forum.

I do

[D Mac]

Oh :shifty:

[NoJabbaNoBogRoll]

The Steam sales have changed my life. I buy almost all my games this way.

[D Mac]

I do

Why don't I see your name on them? Are you pulling my leg.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

The Steam sales have changed my life. I buy almost all my games this way.

Yeah, there's a load of back catalogue games I want to buy, but no way am I even touching them until after the Christmas sale.

[Requiem]

Years ago, when Steam first came out, I -hated- it. PCs were slower and it hogged resources. I thought it was annoying just to have to create an account to play counter-strike. I had problems with it back then, just to get it to run. It wasn't very stable, and on a shitty internet connection, I felt it just wasn't worth it.

Now though, it has so many positives that I have a hard time finding any negative in it. It's fast. Product downloads are BLAZING fast. Was averaging 1.4mb/s on the GTA collection yesterday, which is every bit of my connection and then some. Didn't even slow down the other things I was doing.

One thing we haven't even touched back on is the fact that it is a platform similar to Xbox Live and PSN. The friends list is wonderful, as is the steam interface when I'm in games. A quick shift+tab, and my friends list and messages are brought up. I can join people through it easily and quickly.

In the world of PC gaming, coordinating with friends to play games has always been a nightmare, IMO. With AIM, MSN, Yahoo, etc.. there are too many ways to communicate which not everyone is uniformly using. When one friend uses AIM, another MSN, another Skype.. it's so easy to just check Steam and see "Oh these 3 people are online.. lets see if they want to play X game". Within minutes, you're in a game playing with them.

[Requiem]

The fact that you can also add other game's executables to the list means that I can have every non-steam game in one easy place instead of having half my collection elsewhere on my PC, and half of it on Steam.

[Kane Knight]

Its the progression because of all the people who willingly give up their rights.

Bitch, people would give up their Constitutional rights for 2 dollar video games.

[Kane Knight]

That's not a dig at Valve, I'm pretty sure that publishers get to set the prices on Steam since they're not buying stock of games then selling it at whatever price. But the pricing is bullshit.

DD prices in general are bullshit.

[Pintint]

I dont get where you insist that I am "harping" on Valve. I dont care about Valve. Their games haven't entertained me since Half Life 1, I dont like Steam, so I have no problem not buying something I dont like. Trying to sit here and prove to me that Half Life 2 and Valve are the greatest things of all time is futile.

Nor am I going to suddenly going to start supporting "all digital" downloads, even if the future is heading there. I am going to keep buying retail as long as it is available at retail. If I can get more for my money (which I DO) by buying a physical copy, I will keep buying physical copies.

As far as Team Fortress goes, valve still did not develop it or the idea. Credit still goes to the original mod makers of the original team fortress for Quake 1, even if they did join Valve years after making the mod. Valve acquired the rights to the mod, but it makes no sense to credit Valve with its creation.

Modifications of the team fortress concept have been revived before Valve's TFC as well, such as with the EXTREMELY well polished Weapons Factory mod for Quake 2 which IMO, did Team Fortress better than even Team Fortress Classic.

I've never had a problem "co ordinating" games online, but that must be because everyone I know uses either MSN or Aim and I have both running all the time.

[Requiem]

Your problem with Steam is that you think Valve is a shit company that would sooner take away your access to games you purchased for more profit than they are currently already earning on the service known as steam.

So yes, you are harping on Valve.

Never said Valve created TF. Read it again. They certainly contributed to its popularity, so to say they deserve no credit for it is a farce. Team Fortress was a mod. Team Fortress Classic was a game owned by Valve.

Thinking that my point is that HL2 is great, is totally missing all of the other points I am making. You're the one that decided to start arguing that Valve's products were mediocre/shit. So again, YES, you are HARPING on Valve. Quite obviously, at that. I don't know why you would even try to act like that's not what you're doing. Your entire point revolves around insisting that their products are crap and thus the company is crap, that they would refuse you access to something you have paid for, and a number of other things which I have refuted about Steam and you instantly dropped in favor of finding new reasons for you to dislike the service.

Your argument has been embarrassing, honestly. You haven't stuck with any points that might have held merit if you actually felt 100% about them, and the ones you've stuck with are idiotic at best.

So in short (after an ironically long argument), you dislike Steam for a bunch of reasons that aren't true, based on assumptions about Valve that have no basis of fact to back them up, and are ignoring the things that make it good because.... uh... they don't apply to you because you don't want to use them? Sorry if I have a hard time finding your reasons. You've stated them terrible. Again, you're making things up in your head that sound great, because you don't have -good- reasons to hate the service.

[Pintint]

Your problem with Steam is that you think Valve is a shit company that would sooner take away your access to games you purchased for more profit than they are currently already earning on the service known as steam.

So yes, you are harping on Valve.

Never said Valve created TF. Read it again. They certainly contributed to its popularity, so to say they deserve no credit for it is a farce. Team Fortress was a mod. Team Fortress Classic was a game owned by Valve.

Thinking that my point is that HL2 is great, is totally missing all of the other points I am making. You're the one that decided to start arguing that Valve's products were mediocre/shit. So again, YES, you are HARPING on Valve. Quite obviously, at that. I don't know why you would even try to act like that's not what you're doing. Your entire point revolves around insisting that their products are crap and thus the company is crap, that they would refuse you access to something you have paid for, and a number of other things which I have refuted about Steam and you instantly dropped in favor of finding new reasons for you to dislike the service.

Your argument has been embarrassing, honestly. You haven't stuck with any points that might have held merit if you actually felt 100% about them, and the ones you've stuck with are idiotic at best.

So in short (after an ironically long argument), you dislike Steam for a bunch of reasons that aren't true, based on assumptions about Valve that have no basis of fact to back them up, and are ignoring the things that make it good because.... uh... they don't apply to you because you don't want to use them? Sorry if I have a hard time finding your reasons. You've stated them terrible. Again, you're making things up in your head that sound great, because you don't have -good- reasons to hate the service.

They're valid enough for me. I dont feel comfortable having to access all of my games through a digital service. I want my games in hard copy format. And I am not as trusting as all of you that Valve will NEVER EVER do anything "bad" or abuse the fact that they have contol of all your games.

I doubt that.

This is why I dont want to use Steam. You're the ones harping on me.

I didnt say Valve's products were mediocre, I merely said that I didnt think any of them were good after Half Life 1. That doesnt mean others wont think they are good. Its all subjective. Most people think Daikatana was a horrible game. I really enjoyed it and played through it twice. To me, that was a good game, even though most found it terrible. Crysis got great reviews. I found it horribly boring, much like Half Life 2.

What I dont understand is why you defend Valve so vehemently? Do you have stock in their company?

It makes no sense.

[Kane Knight]

Your problem with Steam is that you think Valve is a shit company that would sooner take away your access to games you purchased for more profit than they are currently already earning on the service known as steam.

So yes, you are harping on Valve.

Never said Valve created TF. Read it again. They certainly contributed to its popularity, so to say they deserve no credit for it is a farce. Team Fortress was a mod. Team Fortress Classic was a game owned by Valve.

Thinking that my point is that HL2 is great, is totally missing all of the other points I am making. You're the one that decided to start arguing that Valve's products were mediocre/shit. So again, YES, you are HARPING on Valve. Quite obviously, at that. I don't know why you would even try to act like that's not what you're doing. Your entire point revolves around insisting that their products are crap and thus the company is crap, that they would refuse you access to something you have paid for, and a number of other things which I have refuted about Steam and you instantly dropped in favor of finding new reasons for you to dislike the service.

Your argument has been embarrassing, honestly. You haven't stuck with any points that might have held merit if you actually felt 100% about them, and the ones you've stuck with are idiotic at best.

So in short (after an ironically long argument), you dislike Steam for a bunch of reasons that aren't true, based on assumptions about Valve that have no basis of fact to back them up, and are ignoring the things that make it good because.... uh... they don't apply to you because you don't want to use them? Sorry if I have a hard time finding your reasons. You've stated them terrible. Again, you're making things up in your head that sound great, because you don't have -good- reasons to hate the service.

They're valid enough for me. I dont feel comfortable having to access all of my games through a digital service. I want my games in hard copy format. And I am not as trusting as all of you that Valve will NEVER EVER do anything "bad" or abuse the fact that they have contol of all your games.

I doubt that.

This is why I dont want to use Steam. You're the ones harping on me.

I didnt say Valve's products were mediocre, I merely said that I didnt think any of them were good after Half Life 1. That doesnt mean others wont think they are good. Its all subjective. Most people think Daikatana was a horrible game. I really enjoyed it and played through it twice. To me, that was a good game, even though most found it terrible. Crysis got great reviews. I found it horribly boring, much like Half Life 2.

What I dont understand is why you defend Valve so vehemently? Do you have stock in their company?

It makes no sense.

ZEALOT FIGHT!

...Who brought popcorn?

[Destor]

this argument has become about whether or not Valve makes shit games...so this should in turn be moved into a new thread...with a poll SETTLE THIS

[Pintint]

this argument has become about whether or not Valve makes shit games...so this should in turn be moved into a new thread...with a poll SETTLE THIS

Ive got a poll you can settle...wait :shifty:

[Londoner]

Steam is fucking great. Just payed with no problems for fm12, and downloads quickly. Haven't had to order from amazon and wait a day or more for it to arrive or even bother going to a store. Steam haters are just clueless(believe me ive read loads of their complaints, a lot of them are as pathetic as pintint)

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Steam is fucking great. Just payed with no problems for fm12, and downloads quickly. Haven't had to order from amazon and wait a day or more for it to arrive or even bother going to a store. Steam haters are just clueless(believe me ive read loads of their complaints, a lot of them are as pathetic as pintint)

Did you pre-order FM2012 and not play Team Fortress 2?

I need those scout football boots :shifty:

[Londoner]

Did you pre-order FM2012 and not play Team Fortress 2?

I need those scout football boots :shifty:

I totally forgot about TF2 tbh.

[Pintint]

Steam is fucking great. Just payed with no problems for fm12, and downloads quickly. Haven't had to order from amazon and wait a day or more for it to arrive or even bother going to a store. Steam haters are just clueless(believe me ive read loads of their complaints, a lot of them are as pathetic as pintint)

OH NOES! NOT GOING TO THE STORE! :rofl:

[Kane Knight]

OH NOES! NOT GOING TO THE STORE! :rofl:

Maybe he's agorphobic. Or just a nerd.

[Londoner]

OH NOES! NOT GOING TO THE STORE! :rofl:

It was just an example of an advantage(especially when its first thing on a sunday), you anti steam paranoid dumbass. :)

[Kane Knight]

It was just an example of an advantage(especially when its first thing on a sunday), you anti steam paranoid dumbass. :)

You really wake up early on a Sunday and decide OH NOES! I NEEDZ A GAEM!

[Londoner]

You really wake up early on a Sunday and decide OH NOES! I NEEDZ A GAEM!

Nah, but was waiting till i could buy that game in particular. Way to be going OTT though.

[Kane Knight]

That's the problem. You kind of need to go "OTT" to argue that's really a merit.

Except to agorophobics.

Due to Comcast sucking ass in my new building, for a full release it's actually faster for me to go to Gamestop. Most people don't have great connection speeds, in fact. So unless your local game store is like 50 miles away....

[Londoner]

That's the problem. You kind of need to go "OTT" to argue that's really a merit.

Except to agorophobics.

Due to Comcast sucking ass in my new building, for a full release it's actually faster for me to go to Gamestop. Most people don't have great connection speeds, in fact. So unless your local game store is like 50 miles away....

Well whatever. I was in a lazy mood at the time of writing that so obviously was pleased about it.

[Kane Knight]

I think the REAL answer is you get out of the house less than Kane Knight. :p

[Londoner]

Stop trolling. ;)

[Kane Knight]

It's cool, bro. There's no shame in agorophobia.

I mean, I'll giggle at you, but I've always supported the "kick 'em when they're down" philosophy.

[Londoner]

You still continuing this?:D

[Kane Knight]

I find it amusing and I have nothing to do until my Doctor's appointment.

Yes, THE Doctor.

[Requiem]

DrA?