Nobody will ever be as over as Rock or Austin were [Archive]

Avenger

01-11-2012, 08:21 PM

.

Avenger

01-11-2012, 08:23 PM

Juan

01-11-2012, 08:27 PM

Ah, the weekly "Attitude era was better" thread :y:

Avenger

01-11-2012, 08:32 PM

I don't usually post here, sorry if I am repeating something that is done too often.

Juan

01-11-2012, 08:35 PM

I understand, don't worry about it

Avenger

01-11-2012, 08:38 PM

I wasn't going to. I would like people to reply though. I'd like to discuss wrestling, if that's ok.

Juan

01-11-2012, 08:43 PM

Who said you couldn't?

Avenger

01-11-2012, 08:44 PM

Nobody, but your reply was a little sarky and I assumed there was an issue. Clearly not though, so it's all ok.

MoFo

01-11-2012, 08:45 PM

Watched Goldberg v Raven in some clusterfuck squash match earlier on.

Guy was mad over. Rabid crowd.

OldSchoolFan

01-11-2012, 08:54 PM

I feel the issue is not the talent they have, hell half the roster now is "better" than A LOT of the big names from then and it is not the PG rating. It really is the mentally retarded people they hire to write. I am considering helping them... plan on getting run over by a semi and get at least 3 lobotomys and then MAYBE I will have enough wrong with me to be a writer there. Would still be better than what they been popping out lately.

Shisen Kopf

01-11-2012, 09:05 PM

Hulk Hogan was more over than bofum. WWE needs not go back to the attitude era but rather the Rock n Rasslin motherfuckin shit from the 80s. Goddam. Woooooooo!

CSL

01-11-2012, 09:11 PM

Watched Goldberg v Raven in some clusterfuck squash match earlier on.

Guy was mad over. Rabid crowd.

yesss the US title/Raven's rules match with the run ins? crowd were shitttt hot

CSL

01-11-2012, 09:11 PM

Nicky Fives

01-11-2012, 10:02 PM

Secondary talent of the Attitude Era (New Age Outlaws, Too Cool, Val Venis, The Godfather, etc.) will be more over than anyone today..... but this shouldn't come as much of a surprise....

Lock Jaw

01-11-2012, 10:24 PM

Proof that we need more gimmicks, catch phrases, and sheer repetitiveness.

New Age Outlaws could get a crowd to chant along with a whole damn introductory monologue.

Emperor Smeat

01-11-2012, 10:32 PM

I'd argue that Stone Cold and The Rock needed years to build up on their ability to get massive pops considering the feud between those 2 guys started on the IC title and carried over naturally to the main event scene.

The WWE tried to remake that with Orton vs Cena but kept repeatedly forcing the crowd to accept them as the next mega-feud which ended up dragging a lot and become stale to the crowd.

In Punk's case, he doesn't have anyone he could consider as a natural long-term rival and most of the time was pushed off to the side in favor of something else. Even when Punk finally became #1 with his Summer of Punk, the WWE still derailed some of his momentum in favor of Cena or someone else until very recently which has hurt his "overness" with the crowd.

JKWJRMON

01-11-2012, 11:16 PM

I was watching old videos of Hogan - Piper, and Attitude area. I realize, there is no more excitement in wrestling anymore.

Hanso Amore

01-12-2012, 12:49 AM

Hanso Amore

01-12-2012, 12:50 AM

When I think of HOT CROWDS i think late 90s WCW....

SEXUAL VANILLA

01-12-2012, 03:51 AM

the show was way better AND everyone was drunk

Disco Apocalypse

01-12-2012, 06:06 AM

Wouldn't have made a difference to the live crowd, but JR and King sold the crap out of everything. Listening to a couple of those videos reminds me how shit Cole is at fulfilling his primary purpose... :(

Avenger

01-12-2012, 07:15 AM

Avenger

01-12-2012, 07:37 AM

better version

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/gmLhLAf7kRI" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Avenger

01-12-2012, 07:38 AM

Kane Knight

01-12-2012, 09:52 AM

Secondary talent of the Attitude Era (New Age Outlaws, Too Cool, Val Venis, The Godfather, etc.) will be more over than anyone today..... but this shouldn't come as much of a surprise....

Fifth tier talent was more over than anyone today.

Iop

01-12-2012, 10:39 AM

Ahmed Johnson = best of attitude era,

Dont believe me? Why dont you stand up and punchy and real bad moon!

Kris P Lettus

01-12-2012, 10:41 AM

ace3025

01-12-2012, 11:52 AM

It's mostly a lack of solid writing. The Goldberg/Raven match is a great example. The match wasnt solid by any means, but when the flock runs in and goldberg destroys them, it got the crowd going, made us believe goldberg was a monster, and carried the momentum in the fans to throw him back (obviously scripted but still), and got them amped to see goldberg win the belt. 2 minutes of TV and you achieved so much.

Now a days, you have Punk who shits out golden opportunities, and instead of getting the crowd behind him and enjoy his rants, and pushing the whole "do not conform" idea of him...... they had him lose the title to a rookie, ignore the tension between him and cena for almost 2 months, and turned all of his momentum......into bad mouthing kevin nash!

The summerslam match shouldve setup HHH-Nash right away and let Cena and Punk focus on Del Rio, which wouldve helped his development into a legit player. Because the audience was ready to see it. but instead cena and del rio got their championship counts padded and punk was brought almost right back where he started.

But alas del rio is now hurt, and people remember him as much as they do sin cara, punk is struggling to make Johnny Ace a believable McMahon-esque dictator, and Nash came and went and no one cared.

MoFo

01-12-2012, 12:29 PM

Tbh I dont even know if its writing or anything, just crowds are so lame now.

Spose that the general audience is kids now and not rowdy drunk adults like Attitude Era, but still.

I wish WWE just based Raw in Chicago from now on, the crowd at MITB were awesome.

Guess the OP is right. Rock was so over that even when he went to cheap heat in that 'Rock Concert' and said Lakers would beat the Kings, the roof came off with boos. Anyone tries cheap heat nowdays they'd get indifference.

ace3025

01-12-2012, 08:02 PM

Also, I think Lesnar, Austin, Rock, and to a lesser extent Punk have actually helped create this present bland era.

All of them we HUGE stars, and at one point in time the all left WWE. Vince has taken these guys, shoved rockets in their asses and shot them to the moon. And he has gotten screwed quite a few times. Lesnar and Rock being the biggest.

Punk did it as part of a storyline, kind of, but where is at now shows that Vince needs total control of his talent. Punk was "let loose" and as soon as he took off, Vince handcuffed him with a contract, that was very lucrative or else punk wouldve left, and now things are calm again.

Kane Knight

01-12-2012, 10:21 PM

Also, I think Lesnar, Austin, Rock, and to a lesser extent Punk have actually helped create this present bland era.

All of them we HUGE stars, and at one point in time the all left WWE. Vince has taken these guys, shoved rockets in their asses and shot them to the moon. And he has gotten screwed quite a few times. Lesnar and Rock being the biggest.

Punk did it as part of a storyline, kind of, but where is at now shows that Vince needs total control of his talent. Punk was "let loose" and as soon as he took off, Vince handcuffed him with a contract, that was very lucrative or else punk wouldve left, and now things are calm again.

Lesnar I'll give you, but the Rock? The Rock moved to Hollywood with Vince's blessing, after giving a ton to the wrestling business. Austin's got like five thousand injuries and probably should count himself lucky he isn't in a wheelchair by now.

Vince screwed Vince. Or WWE screwed WWE, if you weeeeeeeeeeeeell. They treated the Attitude Era as though it was going to last forever, and when their stars started to leave, they had nothing to show for it. They had built precious few new stars and little to carry them over.

You don't have to have the bust/boom cycle WWE goes through if you use established guys to build name-brand stars. WWE didn't. In the end, it bit 'em.

Avenger

01-13-2012, 10:46 AM

Plus Rock has given back to wrestling since he left. His continued popularity is in Vinny's favour, particularly when it comes to non-wrestling shit. Rock could be a draw for WWE films and the NETWORK.

ace3025

01-13-2012, 04:03 PM

I agree, WWE definitely has no one to blame but itself. But the rock did leave pretty quick, blessing or not, and even though he came back here and there, I think he has given a ton back till recently.

However, I still see why vince won't push someone to moon like he did with those guys. I think it shows he has no faith in the companies ability to create for the future. Their short term mind has killed them time and time again

ace3025

01-13-2012, 04:05 PM

Also even before Austin left because of injuries he became a diva. I remember he rock coming out and giving the "get the F out" speach when they were changing names, and it was the night previous Austin didn't like the storyline and went home, for a good while if I remember right

Kane Knight

01-13-2012, 07:31 PM

I agree, WWE definitely has no one to blame but itself. But the rock did leave pretty quick, blessing or not, and even though he came back here and there, I think he has given a ton back till recently.

However, I still see why vince won't push someone to moon like he did with those guys. I think it shows he has no faith in the companies ability to create for the future. Their short term mind has killed them time and time again

You kidding? He's tried to push just about everyone to the moon.

The Rock returning was of benefit to both WWE and the Rock. Probably more WWE than the Rock. Even his worst films give him more than WWE can offer him in terms of promotion time and money.

You can choose to believe that he showed up because it was worth it financially, or you can choose to believe that he showed up out of some concept of loyalty. The former has no real evidence for it, leaving me to believe the latter. After all, it's silly to assume he was doing it for the money or publicity when there was more to be found by simply doing what he did.

Also even before Austin left because of injuries he became a diva. I remember he rock coming out and giving the "get the F out" speach when they were changing names, and it was the night previous Austin didn't like the storyline and went home, for a good while if I remember right

Austin was always a diva. Or at least, as far back as matters practically. This wasn't the first time something like this had happened.

Vince ran with and still does run with guys with attitude problems, substance abuse problems, and injury problems. Sometimes, all three, as I'm willing to wager Dancing Dave was taking more than vitamins.

When, exactly, did the change come about?

SlickyTrickyDamon

01-13-2012, 07:58 PM

Ahmed Johnson = best of attitude era,

Dont believe me? Why dont you stand up and punchy and real bad moon!

Wonton Beef Stew!?!!

Damndirty

01-16-2012, 12:13 AM

Lesnar I'll give you, but the Rock? The Rock moved to Hollywood with Vince's blessing, after giving a ton to the wrestling business. Austin's got like five thousand injuries and probably should count himself lucky he isn't in a wheelchair by now.

Vince screwed Vince. Or WWE screwed WWE, if you weeeeeeeeeeeeell. They treated the Attitude Era as though it was going to last forever, and when their stars started to leave, they had nothing to show for it. They had built precious few new stars and little to carry them over.

You don't have to have the bust/boom cycle WWE goes through if you use established guys to build name-brand stars. WWE didn't. In the end, it bit 'em.

For once, I do agree with ya on this one and the post after this one. Lesnar left for any alternative he could find due to his complaint of traveling stress, of which one he didn't fit, and the other he fit for a while until it also got too tough. The Rock tried movies out while still with WWE and decided to give it a try without being a full time wrestler and it worked out for him, but altogether, he was loyal to the place that truly made him who he is and I agree that is why he came back and not for the lesser pay he would have recieved for an appearance. Austin... although he did breathe life into the company, the company spoiled him a little too much more than they needed to and he got too greedy for his own good. As for the company, I have noticed that it is kinda slow in the process of adapting to trends that would actually work for its viewership, and maybe it just might be the mogul mindset of thinking it is above the people's opinion or it is getting desperate to the point of panic in quickly converting the show's segments and matches when the creativity is being frowned upon by the viewers. I have to stick by the lack of alternatives that can be found in a rival federation, unfortunately, cannot be found in TNA.... yet.