Gertner's about to blow....

[itsmeJD]

Partial Source: The Wrestling Observer Newsletter

ROH canceling the 7/27 event in Winston-Salem, North Carolina and the 7/28 event in Spartanburg, South Carolina due to poor advances led to talk among many circles regarding the state of the company.

Add in the fact that the company only has six events total for the rest of 2012 helps add to frustration with talent on the roster. Sinclair Broadcasting is also attempting to keep costs very low.



Could this be the beginning of the end of ROH? Will Gertner's head explode? Discuss.

[whiteyford]

Hope not, don't watch them but any place guys guys can work and get experience on tv is a good thing. If they are in trouble I hope they can establish a working arrangement with the big two, ala ECW, to help out and maybe give guys a way to get noticed, not sure how viable that is with TNA now, with the Kenny king issues and cornette though. At least their video library will be worth something I guess.

[MoFo]

WWE should buy them out to give Ryback a stream of vanilla midgets to squash.

[itsmeJD]

WWE should buy them out to give Ryback a stream of vanilla midgets to squash.

Ryback vs. ROH, next week, on Smackdown LIVE!!

[Saving Grace]

is it suprising considering they are owned and operated by a regional broadcasting company who is known for cost cutting and baseline budget costs for programming. If they only have 6 events planned through the remainder of 2012 it shows in that right there what Sinclair Broadcasting feels about the product or what kind of value they place on it.

[itsmeJD]

I also recall ROH being so fucking happy they were being bought by Sinclair. Be careful what you wish for.....

[CSL]

maybe Mark Madden was right

[Rammsteinmad]

I don't follow it enough to really care, but it would be a shame if they went bust. They've put on some great shows in the past and have produced some of the finest in-ring workers in the world.

[itsmeJD]

maybe Mark Madden was right

Please don't let his fat ass Baraka mouth know that.

[itsmeJD]

I don't follow it enough to really care, but it would be a shame if they went bust. They've put on some great shows in the past and have produced some of the finest in-ring workers in the world.

I don't follow it either, because I don't pick up Sinclair broadcasting, but know they do have a pretty significant history since being created by that child molester from RF Video. I would say it sucks to see people lose their jobs, but 6 events left in the year...didn't sound like they were working much anyway.

[DLVH84]

It's almost like when ECW got on TNN in a way. A pretty bad deal.

[itsmeJD]

It's almost like when ECW got on TNN in a way. A pretty bad deal.

Yeah ECW got fucked up the ass Sandusky style on that deal.

[Droford]

they should have kept the deal with hdnet..probably just as many people get hdnet and it was a better timeslot 8pm mondays

[Razzamajazz]

Yeah ECW got fucked up the ass Sandusky style on that deal.

rythmic slapping

[itsmeJD]

they should have kept the deal with hdnet..probably just as many people get hdnet and it was a better timeslot 8pm mondays

I agree, plus I got HD Net which means I might have watched it had I remembered. Impact gets that treatment often and I only catch the last 3-4 minutes.

[itsmeJD]

Where the fuck is Gertner...I want his commentary damn it

[CSL]

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/MgDU-Sb2i7k" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

2:20 onwards

[Emperor Smeat]

Haven't they been struggling talent wise the last few years once both TNA and WWE started to really raid their roster.

Before I think TNA and ROH had more of a gentleman's agreement on sharing wrestlers but that broke up a while ago and probably got worse once TNA took over OVW for their feeder system.

[erickman]

they should have kept the deal with hdnet..probably just as many people get hdnet and it was a better timeslot 8pm mondays

yeah now that i get hd net and that dish is playing it for more viewers, i could have watched it.

[Scott Roberts]

I knew this would happen the second I put them in the "Scott Roberts Wall of Shame"

[owenbrown]

Where the fuck is Gertner...I want his commentary damn it

he's probably getting ready to spam the forum James Steele style

[Shisen Kopf]

I sometimes watched it when it was on hdnet. But after that I never knew what channel it was on. Then when I found out what station it was on it was at 11pm on Saturday nights and I'm not gonna waste my precious videotapes on that. You know how hard it is to find blank VHS tapes these days?

[Saving Grace]

i watch replays of it on the net when i can, i watch it mostly to catch shelton benjamin and charlies haas. RoH has a great tag team division, the kind i wish tna and wwe had. Sucks that the All Night Express just won the titles and Kenny King bails and jumps ship to TNA guess the bullshit walked and the money talked.

[Tom Guycott]

I also recall ROH being so fucking happy they were being bought by Sinclair. Be careful what you wish for.....

ECW + The Nashville Network



addendum:

It's almost like when ECW got on TNN in a way. A pretty bad deal.

I posted before I got that far. Didn't mean to step on your toes.

[Tom Guycott]

WWE should buy them out to give Ryback a stream of vanilla midgets to squash.

That's actually not a bad idea. Having more than just NXT (now) would be a boon to the business as a whole and add more depth to the "farm system" idea WWE has been flirting with since ECW.

It would be cool if they took a promotion like ROH and/or a couple of other indy feds and, at the very least, compensated them for "raided" talent. Also, and this is a big one, SEND THEM SOME TALENT BACK TO HELP THAT FED PUT ASSES IN SEATS!

It may sound like bad business in the short end, but long run, it would help everyone.

Example: last year when Punk exploded and "quit with the title", he had made the threat that he might take it to Ring of Honor. What if he did? Didn't even have to do much: just appear and cut a promo. That would create all sorts of fucking buzz, get more people to pay attention to ROH, and in return, open up an avenue for some decent potentially decent talent to "jump ship". Again, the important part is to give them something for that talent... perhaps either directly financially, or some "vets" that creative currently doesn't have anything for. Somebody like, I dunno, JTG heads to ROH. Or the oft suspended Rey Rey, or even (given the state of speculation about him) Orton... to kind of bust his stones a bit, I guess.


I know that's all wishful thinking, but it would be cool if they could form a WORKING relationship (completely loaded statement) that doesn't end up how Cornette described his experience in OVW.

[Gertner]

BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

Shocking, since the vanilla midgets that get called up to the WWE don't draw either.

Fat virgins apparently aren't getting an advance on their allowances from their mom. That explains the poor sales.

[Rammsteinmad]

After the hype, that was a rather bland post by Gertner. :(

[Gertner]

Gertner is at work right now and can't be seen on here

[St. Jimmy]

They pulled the shows because of talent schedules, even Dave said that.

[Gertner]

the talent didn't get pulled. They didn't want to show their faces out of embarassment.

[Shisen Kopf]

http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w494/sneldingburlap/Picture2.png

This guy woulda been 26 time world champ in ROH with his work rate.

[Big Vic]

That's a lot of times to lose a title.

[Volare]

Yeah, I don't think Flair would've allowed it. Probably would've hired a sniper or someone else to take him out.

[Kane Knight]

I also recall ROH being so fucking happy they were being bought by Sinclair. Be careful what you wish for.....

Weren't the fans all up on how this was a great move?

[itsmeJD]

Yes they were. I never understood it because I didn't feel Sinclair had a big enough scope. The show on HDNET I felt fit better with their lineup, and honestly was about the best they were going to get.

[Curtis Anderson]

I think that RoH could get out of the hole they dug for themselves if they could snap up another high-profile WWE release to get mainstream fans excited. Haas and Benjamin, or even Maria, were a good start. They should aim for someone like Morrison, Chris Masters or Evan Bourne (The former Matt Sidal).

[Kapoutman]

I could really see Ring of Honor hiring a real talent like Rosey or Rodney Mack.

[CSL]

yesss, bring back The 5-Minute Whiteboy Challenge for 2012

[Kapoutman]

They would make a million bucks overnight with that. I hope they're reading this.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Yes they were. I never understood it because I didn't feel Sinclair had a big enough scope. The show on HDNET I felt fit better with their lineup, and honestly was about the best they were going to get.

Everyone is the same person to KK.

[Mr. Nerfect]

It kind of sucks for ROH, but they have really now captured much of the imagination recently, have they? Kevin Steen is usually awesome -- his stuff with El Generico and his recent run coming to mind -- but beyond that who else is there? There are no real personalities in ROH since Austin Aries left. Back in the day, you had Bryan Danielson, CM Punk and Samoa Joe go through ROH, and they each had their own vibe and something unique they brought to the promotion. Now everybody seems the same.

Charlie Haas tries his damn hardest to have a personality, and he is a really good heel. I think he and Shelton Benjamin will probably be fought over by the WWE and TNA to help rebuild either promotion's tag division. Most of the talent will probably find work in either the WWE or TNA, to be honest -- and it would suck if ROH closed their doors, since they have been a pretty decent alternative over the past few years, and their DVD library would be worth something to the WWE -- but the company has been so bland lately.

ROH should be trying to go after amazing ring talents with personality. Low Ki would be a great choice, although I'm not sure what his relationship with ROH is at the moment. Beyond that, I'm finding it hard to really think of anybody. Colt Cabana, maybe? What are Paul London and Brian Kendrick up to these days? Jimmy Yang is a great worker that knows how to talk when he needs to. Carlito could come in if he were willing, but I'm sure he enjoys working for his dad.

Signing Chris Masters would be a good move. The dude looks like a Superstar and can work -- he'd be great as Jim Cornette's choice for a new future of the company -- and something Steen can fight against. In fact, that is probably the best story ROH can go forward with -- Jim Cornette trying to turn ROH into a "sports entertainment" product, going for guys with "the look" instead of guys who can get things done. If Matt Morgan does leave TNA, he would be an obvious signing for this storyline, too.

[Kane Knight]

Everyone is the same person to KK.

That was kind of incongruous, Noid.

[Kane Knight]

Pretty sure Noid's just desperate for a reason to bitch about me.

[Vastardikai]

Crazier idea that may not work.

A variant of the old territory system. Basically, WWE is the place you want to end up at. It be the main touring thing goes all over the US and indeed all over the globe. However, the main touring group has a smaller roster that cycles in and out to keep talent fresh. Raw be the show that features the main group, with the CM Punks, John Cenas, etc.

Smackdown, however, should be a bunch of different shows catered to a certain area of the US. Each area can have their own roster and fit their own niche. They tour their own area, build up their own stars, and have their own minor championships.

If the WWE Network ever gets off the ground, each area gets their own night of the week. WWE occasionally sends a top star down to a region to help build up a guy. Occasionally, the guys looking to move up the ranks go from area to area.

Biggest downfall to this idea is the cost. WWE would be more or less tripling their overall payroll at the very least. Biggest upside is a much larger pool of up and coming talent, easier schedules for the smaller guys, and can test them on the road. You can even use the talent pool to give the top guys time off should they need it, and keep them fresh.

Just a dumb idea, might work, but Vince wouldn't do it.

[Kane Knight]

I like the territories idea, but I doubt it would work practically.

[Curd]

Crazier idea that may not work.

A variant of the old territory system. Basically, WWE is the place you want to end up at. It be the main touring thing goes all over the US and indeed all over the globe. However, the main touring group has a smaller roster that cycles in and out to keep talent fresh. Raw be the show that features the main group, with the CM Punks, John Cenas, etc.

Smackdown, however, should be a bunch of different shows catered to a certain area of the US. Each area can have their own roster and fit their own niche. They tour their own area, build up their own stars, and have their own minor championships.

If the WWE Network ever gets off the ground, each area gets their own night of the week. WWE occasionally sends a top star down to a region to help build up a guy. Occasionally, the guys looking to move up the ranks go from area to area.

Biggest downfall to this idea is the cost. WWE would be more or less tripling their overall payroll at the very least. Biggest upside is a much larger pool of up and coming talent, easier schedules for the smaller guys, and can test them on the road. You can even use the talent pool to give the top guys time off should they need it, and keep them fresh.

Agreed. Regarding the cost, thank goodness McMahon compensates his Superstars and Divas as if they were independent contractors...

[Gertner]

Once again: Jim Cornette is one of the WORST minds in wrestling.

[voncouch]

WWE should buy them out to give Ryback a stream of vanilla midgets to squash.

Then we get to watch Cornette's head explode as well!

[Mr. Nerfect]

ROH needs personalities. When the second most dynamic personality in your company is Charlie Haas, there's something sadly wrong.

I guess Rhett Titus kind of has a personality. I'd like to see him become a little bitter that Jim Cornette stripped him of the ROH World Tag Team Titles just because Kenny King got into trouble, and to sort of become a renegade against the current ROH set-up. Maybe Titus could align himself with Steen & Jacobs and whoever is on their side. ROH need to take steps to removing Jim Cornette, though. Also, they need to hire Low Ki. He's one of those few guys on the independent scene that has something resembling a personality. Oh, and they should make another play for Homicide.

[Curd]

ROH could have its wrestlers perform supercards with other indies. ROH would then make royalties from a broader base of tapes / DVDs. For example, ROH could send a few of its own to participate in the milder, non-tournament preliminary card of the CZW King of the Deathmatch Tournament (which I've read synopses of for each tournament, and that stuff is totally brutal, but the ROH folks would not be in any barbed wire or thumbtacks matches).

[Gertner]

What company has Cornette been a part of that you'd consider a "success"?

ROH has floundered
TNA did nothing
Smokey Mountain flammed out
OVW I guess, but it's top period was when Heyman was booking.

[Vastardikai]

What company has Cornette been a part of that you'd consider a "success"?

ROH has floundered
TNA did nothing
Smokey Mountain flammed out
OVW I guess, but it's top period was when Heyman was booking.

He was part of the booking team for WWF and for early WCW.

Cornette could have done more for TNA, but wasn't paid to. Can't really blame him for that one.

I'd argue that SMW was a victim more of bad timing than anything else. There is a market for old school wrestling, it's a niche market, but it exists.

[Gertner]

The WWF and WCW were terrible during his runs

[Curtis Anderson]

Cornette is too lost in his anger against anything modern to be effective these days. He needs to realize that the days of territories and slapping wrestlers because they did not perform to your standards are over. If I was Johnny Nitro, I would have slapped him back to Kentucky.

[James Steele]

He slapped Santino.

[Curtis Anderson]

Oh. I probably would have slapped Santino too just for what he would eventually do to the United States Championship.

[whiteyford]

Cornette is too lost in his anger against anything modern to be effective these days. He needs to realize that the days of territories and slapping wrestlers because they did not perform to your standards are over. If I was Johnny Nitro, I would have slapped him back to Kentucky.

Like HHH said, Santino, but yeah i dont think hes a poor booker just too stuck in his ways, alot of what he says is right but he refuses to accept the days of the territories are over.

[Schlomey]

Don't follow ROH but would still like them to exist.

[Kane Knight]

He was part of the booking team for WWF and for early WCW.



Not exactly helping.

[el bobbo]

I think that RoH could get out of the hole they dug for themselves if they could snap up another high-profile WWE release to get mainstream fans excited. Haas and Benjamin, or even Maria, were a good start. They should aim for someone like Morrison, Chris Masters or Evan Bourne (The former Matt Sidal).

JoMo or Bourne. I couldn't see Chris Masters fitting into the ROH style very well. The other two definitely.

[Ultra Mantis]

Carlito could come in if he were willing, but I'm sure he enjoys working for his dad.

Carlito has actually been quite vocal that he would love to work some ROH shows but they're not interested in him. He probably doesnt score high enough on workrate.

[Mr. Nerfect]

ROH are making me think they are stupid now.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I was reading a suggestion somewhere that Spike TV considers purchasing ROH and try to turn them into a profitable little block of programming, kept separate from TNA for the most part, but crossovers can be done between the two.

Imagine Shelton Benjamin and Charlie Haas in TNA's tag team division, or Kurt Angle wrestling a ROH match.

[Kane Knight]

Carlito has actually been quite vocal that he would love to work some ROH shows but they're not interested in him. He probably doesnt score high enough on workrate.

He has too much personality, too.