QUESTION - Why not Chris Jericho vs. Undertaker at Wrestlemania? Loser must retire.

[Heyman]

QUESTION - Why not Chris Jericho vs. Undertaker at Wrestlemania? Loser must retire.

From a 'fresh feud' perspective, I think it would hold interest as Jericho vs. Taker has never been done before (my guess is that Jericho likely had nuclear heat with Taker from way back in the day which is why Taker probably refused to work with Y2J, but this likely won't be the case in 2016).

From a wrestling perspective, I think Jericho vs. Taker should be decent. Won't be as good as HBK/Taker, but should be better than HHH/Taker.

What say you?

[Hanso Amore]

I think it's all just such a rehash it wouldn't be anything special.

[Maluco]

Jericho's PPV win/loss record over all his comebacks is very poor. I know people suggest that doesn't matter, but it does. His reaction was lukewarm last night and it comes from years of coming back for meaningless feuds which he loses. I don't think it would be intriguing mainly because of that unfortunately.

[Big Vic]

I know its not a dream match but I want to see Jericho vs Brock Lesnar. (Could happen on a network special for all I care.)

[Ultra Mantis]

It doesn't really do anything for anyone long term and both guys are past their prime. The lack of history also makes the retirement stipulation seem tacked on.

[Fignuts]

It doesn't really do anything for anyone long term and both guys are past their prime. The lack of history also makes the retirement stipulation seem tacked on.

It's okay to book something just because it would be an awesome moment every once in a while. There are plenty of other matches on the card to build for the future. The HBK/HHH vs Taker matches never elevated anyone any further than they slready were, but that didn't matter, because they were fantastic matches.

As for being past their prime, that's irrelevant. This isn't Nikolai Volkoff we're talking about here. They can still go. Hell, jericho had one of the best matches of his career in his last run.

They don't need history. In fact that's part of the appeal. Two living legends whose paths have never really crossed. They're both great enough performers to make the build up great, regardless.

[Sepholio]

If it's a loser retires match I would rather it be Big Show vs Undertaker tbh. For one of the 'older' superstars I feel Jericho still has it. He can give a hell of a lot more at this point. I feel that that is obvious to others as well and if put in a match against Taker for retirement people would all go in probably expecting Jericho to win or there to be a dirty finish.

[XL]

Jericho's PPV win/loss record over all his comebacks is very poor. I know people suggest that doesn't matter, but it does. His reaction was lukewarm last night and it comes from years of coming back for meaningless feuds which he loses. I don't think it would be intriguing mainly because of that unfortunately.

You parlay all of that into the storyline; Jericho is sick and tired of coming back and failing, having failed to win the Rumble, so he sets his sights on one of the biggest claims to game he could have - beating Taker at Mania.

[Tom Guycott]

Biker Taker vs. Thrillseeker Jericho only

[Maluco]

You parlay all of that into the storyline; Jericho is sick and tired of coming back and failing, having failed to win the Rumble, so he sets his sights on one of the biggest claims to game he could have - beating Taker at Mania.

I could get into that, am a real sucker for the emotional storyline.

[The Condor]

I'm a two decade Jericho fan, but I'd still prefer the rumored UT/Cena match.

[Stickman]

What heat did they have?

[Big Vic]

I'm a two decade Jericho fan, but I'd still prefer the rumored UT/Cena match.
Would you like to see Jericho/Brock?

[Fignuts]

What heat did they have?

They didn't outside of the heat Jericho had with everyone when he first came in. Dunno what Heyman is talkingabout there.

[#1-norm-fan]

I wrote out a plausible storyline where Johnny Curtis could challenge Brock Lesnar for the title at WrestleMania so I'm not against the idea of someone who has 0 momentum suddenly being booked right and becoming a star.

It would definitely take some VERY good writing for Jericho to be a realistic threat to Taker though because his part-time aura has been shat on too much at this point.

[The Condor]

Would you like to see Jericho/Brock?

It could work, but I'm not clamoring for such a match.

[The CyNick]

I don't think Jericho is ready to retire.

I'm kinda down with the idea of Taker now fighting for his career. In otherwords, next time he loses he's done. He could still win at Mania, if he wants to keep going, and that way each subsequent Taker match has meaning.

If someone is going to end Taker's career it shouldn't be Jericho. Not a big enough star to take that career. Would be a good notch on the belt for a guy like Rollins, Owens or Wyatt.

[slik]

Sure, why not.

I'm pretty open when it comes to the WM card this year since so many people are injured.

[slik]

Don't forget he also is probably having sexual relations with a baconator from Wendy's, re: Kane Knight

[Mr. Nerfect]

There was a time when Undertaker vs. Jericho had some sort of appeal to it. It was post-Jericho heel turn against Michaels and before he left again. Now it would just feel like we're supposed to buy him as a guy on a tier we're not used to thinking of him being on.

[The CyNick]

Jericho v Taker could be a decent match, I just don't think having both guys' career in the line makes sense.

I do think there is value in Taker saying "next guy who beats me, I'm done". Then you have a crop of young guys lining up to try to be the one to retire The Deadman.

I actually don't necessarily think this Mania needs to be his last. But if he wants to be done, then it would be cool for a guy like Owens or Wyatt to be the one to end his career. Although WWE would need to be VERY careful who they give that rub to. Don't want it to be someone like Punk who isn't dedicated to the company. Needs to be a lifer.

[#1-norm-fan]

The more times that passes, the more I feel like ending the streak before Taker was done was a Godawful idea.

The streak was an instant WrestleMania draw. It did wonders for Lesnar for a bit but then he lost the title without losing at the peak of his momentum, fucking up the chance to pass the rub to someone else. And on top of that, he ended up just giving Taker his win back and the streak match ended up being just the first in a split series.

And now they would kill to have the allure of Taker's streak match at WrestleMania to make up for the lack of star power that will be there.

[Emperor Smeat]

Career vs Career match would be pretty great although not with Jericho unless the WWE really built him up by Mania. Past few years Jericho's star power and rub has taken a big hit especially with the WWE doing nothing for those who beat him.


The more times that passes, the more I feel like ending the streak before Taker was done was a Godawful idea.

The streak was an instant WrestleMania draw. It did wonders for Lesnar for a bit but then he lost the title without losing at the peak of his momentum, fucking up the chance to pass the rub to someone else. And on top of that, he ended up just giving Taker his win back and the streak match ended up being just the first in a split series.

And now they would kill to have the allure of Taker's streak match at WrestleMania to make up for the lack of star power that will be there.
I'd argue the WWE feeling the need for Taker to win a meaningless Mania match at the expense of Bray and then completely ignoring that match with the Lesnar-Taker feud was worse than just losing the streak itself. Then taking the Mania rub Lesnar had and giving it straight back to Taker.

Bray ended up being the biggest loser of the three guys since he gained nothing from the Taker Mania feud nor the later Wyatts vs Taker/Kane feud. WWE didn't even bother to spare Lesnar from 50-50 booking which ended up leading to Taker getting his win/rub back instead of Rollins, Reigns, or someone else who needed it more.

[#1-norm-fan]

Honestly, there were such simple ways to make Bray a star through that match even if you were dead set on him losing.

Bray dominates Taker, Taker comes back, manages to lock Bray in Hell's Gate, Bray fights it for a bit before laughing like a lunatic while shouting "I'll see you in hell, dead man" and then ultimately passes out. After the match, you have Taker stand up, get his arm raised but give an unsettled look down at Bray as if to say "This guy is too fucked in the head even for me..."

Bray looks superhuman and Taker gets the win and doesn't suffer remotely from the match.

Instead they had Bray do his crabwalk and then seemingly shit his pants when Taker sat up before losing clean.

How the fuck did anyone think that was the best option? It was so lazy and careless.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Yeah, Taker vs. Bray was booked shitty. I think it was mainly there as a "feel good" moment to bounce back from WrestleMania XXX. Makes you wonder why they did it in the first place.

[#1-norm-fan]

They definitely intended it as a "return to dominance" for Taker. You could have accomplished that while making Bray look like a million bucks though. It should have been a win/win match. Instead they did the typical "This guy wins. Booking done. No one is better off." thing that they've fallen into the trap of doing over the years.

[Heyman]

They didn't outside of the heat Jericho had with everyone when he first came in. Dunno what Heyman is talkingabout there.

I figured Jericho had some heat with Taker considering they've never worked together despite being a part of the same company for 17 years and counting.

Jericho had heat with everyone when he first arrived, but I wonder if he had even more heat with Taker?

Having said all that, I agree with several other posters in this thread that Cena/Taker would be a greater match-up.......especially if Cena becomes the one to "retire" Taker. Cena and Taker go waaay back to 2002 when Taker first shook Cena's hand after Cena's first match. The storyline and history is definitely there, and Cena would be the perfect guy to retire Taker if the WWE went that route.

[#1-norm-fan]

Always thought the perfect story would be using that "What's your name, kid?" segment after Cena's first match heavily leading up to Cena ending the streak and Taker walking off into the sunset. It wouldn't be "passing the torch" per se but it would be a cool story of Taker being the last of his era calling it a career and handing over control of the yard to the "new kid" he met 15 years ago.

[The CyNick]

The more times that passes, the more I feel like ending the streak before Taker was done was a Godawful idea.

The streak was an instant WrestleMania draw. It did wonders for Lesnar for a bit but then he lost the title without losing at the peak of his momentum, fucking up the chance to pass the rub to someone else. And on top of that, he ended up just giving Taker his win back and the streak match ended up being just the first in a split series.

And now they would kill to have the allure of Taker's streak match at WrestleMania to make up for the lack of star power that will be there.

I think the timing made perfect sense, and Lesnar was the perfect guy to do it.

You have to remember the timing. Taker was telling people he was struggling to wrestle, and was thinking the end was near. It made Lesnar a bigger draw, created a huge moment, and helped drive business for the next 18 months.

[The CyNick]

Honestly, there were such simple ways to make Bray a star through that match even if you were dead set on him losing.

Bray dominates Taker, Taker comes back, manages to lock Bray in Hell's Gate, Bray fights it for a bit before laughing like a lunatic while shouting "I'll see you in hell, dead man" and then ultimately passes out. After the match, you have Taker stand up, get his arm raised but give an unsettled look down at Bray as if to say "This guy is too fucked in the head even for me..."

Bray looks superhuman and Taker gets the win and doesn't suffer remotely from the match.

Instead they had Bray do his crabwalk and then seemingly shit his pants when Taker sat up before losing clean.

How the fuck did anyone think that was the best option? It was so lazy and careless.

Lots of guys have lost clean to Taker. If you think that killed Bray, you dont understand booking.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Lots of guys have lost cleanly once established, or lost cleanly because they were never meant to be something. Losing to Taker because Taker isn't necessarily a good thing.

[#1-norm-fan]

Yeah, why would you wanna actually accomplish the same exact thing for Taker while also coming up with a way to put over the up-and-coming guy? What a silly idea. Much better to just use the up-and-coming guy as fodder and not put in the effort of making him look good for the future, too.

I definitely don't understand the genius behind that booking.

[#1-norm-fan]

Hated when Austin passed out to the Sharpshooter. He should have tapped out and possibly shed some tears. That whole "actually trying to put a guy over in a losing effort" thing is overrated. Whoever came up with that idea clearly didn't understand booking.

[Ultra Mantis]

But Fan, Bray losing clean and decisively to a strong Taker was just part of a bigger angle where he will go on to beat a less relevant Taker at an undisclosed point in the future. That's why they keep having Bray lose every single feud, to keep him hot for his big win. He is constantly gathering momentum by not looking like a legit threat to anybody, so when he finally wins his first feud, which will likely be against the Undertaker at some point, he will be a much bigger star than if they had made him look good in the first place. Lets not forget the big picture here is in HHH vs Seth Rollins at Wrestlemania and Bray winning a match isn't going to get more buys for that.

[Simple Fan]

Brays been mishandled since his debut and its really sad. He has one of the best characters on the show and probably one of the easier talents to build up and they have floped at every opportunity they have had.

[Damian Rey]

Wyatt and his group should've been in the main event by now. He's maybe their most blundered star this side of fandango

[Mr. Nerfect]

I can't believe that the WWE aren't using Johnny Curtis for anything.