Which debut intrigued or underwhelmed you the most?

[hb2k]

So, for this week's podcast, we're looking to talk about the debuts in wrestling that personally intrigued you the most or left you underwhelmed. Rather than asking what you think were the best and worst (which would likely bring back a horde of Jericho/Kane/Shockmaster responses), we'd like to know which character introduction, from any company at any time, personally resonated with you the most as a fan, on either end of the scale, and most importantly - why.

As always, the best responses will be read on the show and you'll be credited accordingly. So which one stands out for you as blowing you away or deflating your expectations?

EDIT - Our show debating the Best and Worst Debuts Ever, featuring many of your contributions, is now online and available to listen to at the following link: http://squaredcirclegazette.podbean.com/mf/web/8yx695/SCG_Radio_94_-_Best_And_Worst_Debuts_Ever.mp3

[broverboard]

The Ryback and DDP's and Tazz's debuts were the ones I've found most intriguing just because I was curious what direction they'd head in.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Alberto Del Rio, for whatever reason, comes immediately to mind for this. I really didn't like the original vignettes. I thought they were a bit cliched and it was hard to get me to believe this guy would be a big deal in a hurry. Then, on the week before his debut, they spliced them all together in a more aggressive way to some music that sounded more urgent, and I thought to myself "Hold on, this guy is meant to kick ass." Then he debuted against Rey Mysterio. My memory might not be photographic on this, but I seem to remember Rey going for a move off the top rope and Del Rio then hit his ninja run enziguri, knocking Mysterio to the mat. Del Rio then seemingly relaxed, knowing he had Mysterio where he wanted him, and winked before putting him in a Cross Armbreaker.

It was a good start -- strong, but surprisingly subtle -- Del Rio felt like he belonged in the main event mix right away, but there was still something surprising about it. It's just a shame the way things went after that.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Paul London against Brock Lesnar. Hi Paul! Oh...

[Evil Vito]

Muhammad Hassan and Khosrow Daivari's very first vignette made me sit up. It was surreal seeing a wrestling character openly talk about the stereotypes and prejudice that he was facing after 9/11. I just figured stuff like that would be off limits, even for Vince, simply because of the controversy it was bound to bring.

In spite of the Hassan character making valid points, I knew there was no chance that the average American wrestling audience was going to cheer for him. So in a way a lot of my intrigue leading into his debut was me thinking "there is no possible way this could end well, is there?"

Obviously once he debuted what we got was a character so memorable that people still talk about him 11 years later despite him only existing on WWE television for 7 or 8 months.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

I would have to say the most "intriguing" debut I can remember is probably Mankind's. I say this, because I had to have been nine-years-old and I found myself very disturbed by this shrieking ghoul of a man, who talked about his mommy in a troubling manner, while he tore out bits of his hair and camera zoned in on half of his ear missing.

He was supposed to be presented as a monster and as a guy who could actually be a threat to the Undertaker, and between all of the above and the mandible claw which actually seemed kind of disgusting and also a very visceral finishing move, I found it all very terrifying. The goal was to make me scared of Mankind, to dislike Mankind and to care about Mankind. As a nine-year-old there is always the possibility that I would change the channel because he made me so uncomfortable, but one has to say that is a testament to the presentation and Mick Foley's delivery of this twisted new character in the WWF.

[Swiss Ultimate]

I would have to say the most "intriguing" debut I can remember is probably Mankind's. I say this, because I had to have been nine-years-old and I found myself very disturbed by this shrieking ghoul of a man, who talked about his mommy in a troubling manner, while he tore out bits of his hair and camera zoned in on half of his ear missing.

He was supposed to be presented as a monster and as a guy who could actually be a threat to the Undertaker, and between all of the above and the mandible claw which actually seemed kind of disgusting and also a very visceral finishing move, I found it all very terrifying. The goal was to make me scared of Mankind, to dislike Mankind and to care about Mankind. As a nine-year-old there is always the possibility that I would change the channel because he made me so uncomfortable, but one has to say that is a testament to the presentation and Mick Foley's delivery of this twisted new character in the WWF.

Great post.

[Swiss Ultimate]

Underwhelmed by the nWo debut in the WWE. What better way to get a stable that was popular for it's sheer size and star power over by minimizing them to three members who end up getting their asses handed to them by Steve Austin and The Rock.

Would have been much cooler, if right off the bat they came in and recruited Austin.

[Big Vic]

I think the most intriguing debut of any wrestler was Tommy Dreamers debut in the WWE. They hyped him up as a person who did disgusting things like drink from the urinal or swallow Takers tobacco spit. How this didn't turn into a main event title run absolutely baffles me.

[Lock Jaw]

Honestly, El Gigante intrigued me as a child. As a kid this thing came out looking part man part beast and started manhamdling Undertaker while the announcers yelled "NO ONE HAS EVER MANHANDLED THE UNDERTAKER LIKE THIS!"

As a kid all that made me go "whoa"

Then I never did see any more of El Gigante's run. Only ever saw his debut.

[DAMN iNATOR]

One that's right up there for me is Jericho's WWF debut. Rock is in the ring, cutting one of his typical promos, and all of a sudden, the Y2J Countdown clock pops up on the tron, hits 0, and out comes Jericho. Jericho then proceeds to steal a page right out of Rock's own book and lays the verbal smack down on Rock. Truly a classic debut, and a textbook example of how to get anyone well on their way to being a future hall of famer.

DGsBRImD0po

[Simple Fan]

I've been underwhelmed by Finn Balor's main roster debut. Nothing that he's really done just the spot they put him in to start with. I feel like he could have got over on his own and didn't need to be thrust into the main event. Don't agree with the Demon King showing up on Raw all that much and the people I watched with thought he was silly. Big fan of his but I'd rather see him have more of a build to the main event.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

One that's right up there for me is Jericho's WWF debut. Rock is in the ring, cutting one of his typical promos, and all of a sudden, the Y2J Countdown clock pops up on the tron, hits 0, and out comes Jericho. Jericho then proceeds to steal a page right out of Rock's own book and lays the verbal smack down on Rock. Truly a classic debut, and a textbook example of how to get anyone well on their way to being a future hall of famer.

DGsBRImD0po

lmfao god dammit Daminator did you not read the OP, for fuck sake.

[Ruien]

Kurt Angle had an amazing debut.

Kevin Owen's debut was awesome too.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

But what were you intrigued by, Ruien?

[Simple Fan]

As for intrigued it would have to be the debut of Curtis Axel. The new name and having Pual Heyman as a manager had me interested from the start. Then he started beating guys like HHH and Cena by count out and DQ and I thought he would be a star. Then they did the Punk storyline and got Ryback involved and he fizzled out. That debut though is what made me a fan of the guy and I would love to see him get back to that level he was at before Rybaxel.

[Frank Drebin]

You know who I was intrigued by back in the day? Wrath. Think he was Adam Bomb in WWF. In WCW it seemed like they were building him up for something, then he kept on getting hurt and whatever pushes he was getting at the time fizzled.

[Frank Drebin]

Kharma was a major letdown. Exactly who and what I wanted in the "divas" division at the time. She came in and just mauled everyone for fun. Was great. I get she got preggers and lost the baby which is sad, but never understood why she never came back. Even had a surprise entrance in the rumble which made me think they had plans for her. Those three or so weeks of her implant busting bitches was great while it lasted.

[Sixx]

the demon in wcw. i was intrigued by how stupid it was and what next would the band kiss put their faces on. then i learned about kiss coffins.

[Ruien]

But what were you intrigued by, Ruien?

Your a goody goody reading the OP. Will go into depth on Angle when I am not using my phone though.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

I'm just interested lol

[Vastardikai]

Ahmed Johnson. Yes, I'm being serious.

He was hyped up as a member of the Main Event of Survivor Series '95, but all we got at first was a picture and his name.

Then, at the end of an episode of Raw, as Yokozuna was laying waste to Razor Ramon, 123 kid, and I think HBK, out comes Ahmed. He stands behind Yoko, no one knows what he's gonna do. Yokozuna turns around, and Ahmed slams him. I was sold. If he wasn't constantly injured, he would have been WWF Champion.

[Heisenberg]

It was catered to my age/gender demo at the time: Glacier

[Heyman]

So, for this week's podcast, we're looking to talk about the debuts in wrestling that personally intrigued you the most or left you underwhelmed. Rather than asking what you think were the best and worst (which would likely bring back a horde of Jericho/Kane/Shockmaster responses), we'd like to know which character introduction, from any company at any time, personally resonated with you the most as a fan, on either end of the scale, and most importantly - why.

As always, the best responses will be read on the show and you'll be credited accordingly. So which one stands out for you as blowing you away or deflating your expectations?

Jericho's debut in 1999 was an obvious one. Just the whole countdown thing was done extraordinarily well, and the fact that he interrupted The Rock really put a 'bang' in his debut.

The Wyatt Family is another one. After Kane chokeslammed Christian for the victory, Bray appeared on the titan tron and cut an amazing promo. The whole thing was really creative and unique, and I was sold on the Wyatt's from that day forward. Everything from their theme music, look, personna, etc.,

[Jordan]

It's gotta be KANE!

I was young, the story had built all summer long, finally Hell in a Cell comes and at the end of the most amazing match I'd ever seen, this GIANT red beast comes to the ring, I'll never forget JR's commentary, "That's gotta be... that's gotta be Kane! My god he's over seven feet tall!". He delivered the sickest Tombstone ever and my favorite wrestler got the pin. The intrigue had already been built by an awesome story line that was followed perfectly with a great program that more or less culminated at Wrestlemania, but ended up continuing in one way or another for over a decade.

[Jordan]

Oh man how Kane would come out in the red light during a beatdown or eventually matches. Kane/Mankind from Survivor Series 97 was fucking mayhem, I love it as a kid.

[Jordan]

Also way back in 96 when WWF was showing Vingettes for Mark Henry's debut I was pumped. Even as a little white kid I recognized the lack of diversity in the WWF, and wanted to see a black main eventer. He was so big and Vince sold him so well I was sure he was going to be awesome. Well needless to say, he wasn't awesome for well over a decade lol, but he is now, and that WHC run was fanfuckingtastic.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

Ahmed Johnson. Yes, I'm being serious.

He was hyped up as a member of the Main Event of Survivor Series '95, but all we got at first was a picture and his name.

Then, at the end of an episode of Raw, as Yokozuna was laying waste to Razor Ramon, 123 kid, and I think HBK, out comes Ahmed. He stands behind Yoko, no one knows what he's gonna do. Yokozuna turns around, and Ahmed slams him. I was sold. If he wasn't constantly injured, he would have been WWF Champion.

Yes, definitely. I remember watching him slam this newer, heavier version of Yokozuna was way more impressive than shitty Lex Luger bodyslamming the "slim" 500 lbs Yoko. Yoko was close to 700 lbs at this point. This new Ahmed Johnson character was a legit badass, and a breath of fresh air. ahhhh... to be 8 years old again.

If you listen to the New Generation Podcast (another amazing podcast) they have Ahmed to a tee. He was awesome, wild and unpredictable. It's only at around mid 1997 that he falls off a cliff. He was never a good worker in the classic sense but he always got awesome reactions, and he was a bad man and who cut the most amazing non-sensical promos.

[The Condor]

Not so much a debut, but the re-introduction and reboot of a character: Sycho Sid.

In 1991-92 he had a bland babyface run followed by a fun heel run and then had his shit heel run in the mid-90's. But when he re-debuted as Shawn Michaels' and Ahmed Johnson's partner and replacement for the Warrior in summer of '96 I lost my mind. All of a sudden he'd engaged his awesome charisma and became this badass monster. The next yar was the best he ever was, and his debut, hiding behind his partners and revealing himself to Jim Cornette, was god damn spectacular, and just a great pro-wrestling moment.

[Evil Vito]

I have to throw Sean O'Haire into here too, another TPWW favorite from back in 2003. He had 4 or 5 "Devil's Advocate" promos and it seemed like the character would go places and I couldn't wait for him to debut.

As I recall, SmackDown was hurting for heels around this point. You had Angle as the main heel but you also knew he was going to leave for neck surgery before long. After him the next biggest heel on SmackDown was probably Cena who hadn't totally come onto his own yet, and Matt Hardy Version 1, who was heading up the Cruiserweight division at the time. Basically there seemed to be an opportunity for O'Haire to become a huge deal pretty much immediately.

Then when he showed up he had a couple of dumb segments with Dawn Marie and Spanky, which felt like a let down. Then his character was totally dropped. Yes he did get to work with Hogan and Piper for a while which is good for most wrestlers but they did absolutely nothing with him after they both left the company.

[The Condor]

An underwhelming debut: the Club. I heard so much for months about these guys, and all they do is show up and beat guys up from the crowd for a few weeks, which is a basic debut device in wrestling, and then they proceed to suck on the mic, and leech AJ Styles' heel heat. They're average in the ring and they're lackluster on the mic, and as someone who saw some of their Japan stuff and was aware of them, I was exceedingly underwhelmed by their debut and the follow up.

[DAMN iNATOR]

Also way back in 96 when WWF was showing Vingettes for Mark Henry's debut I was pumped. Even as a little white kid I recognized the lack of diversity in the WWF, and wanted to see a black main eventer. He was so big and Vince sold him so well I was sure he was going to be awesome. Well needless to say, he wasn't awesome for well over a decade lol, but he is now, and that WHC run was fanfuckingtastic.

2011 Henry was the most awesome ever...I believe that's when he debuted the "Hall of PAIN" gimmick. I still can't help but laugh whenever I see the clip of him screaming at the sound guy, "YOU PLAY MUSIC?!" and grinning ear to ear as he picked the poor guy up and threw him like 10 or 20 feet.

[DAMN iNATOR]

lmfao god dammit Daminator did you not read the OP, for fuck sake.

You mean this bit?:
which character introduction, from any company at any time

Besides, I don't see you jumping on Fragile X for bringing up Kane.

[Emperor Smeat]

Intrigued - Nexus. Came off as a legit threat with the carnage they left from their debut and WWE actually referencing stuff that happened in NXT for storyline continuity.

Underwhelmed - Tensai. WWE tried to make it seem like a big deal that Albert was coming back but whole thing felt underwhelmed when he arrived. Instead of being someone cool, he was just a stereotypical Japanese type gimmick and WWE lost interest in him very quickly.

[KIRA]

Intrigued: Raven I knew who he was due to the WWF cross-promoting with ECW but when he showed up on RAW he just stood in the entryway and I was fascinated so,when he showed up sitting at ringside in WCW week in week out I wondered what he wanted and what he would say(I had yet to hear him speak at all)and for a while Steve Richards was doing all of his talking which pissed Raven off for some reason and I loved it.

Underwhelmed:Mordecai basically he was supposed to be the Anti-Taker. In promos it all seemed so awesome but when he finally showed up both his intro(which HBK wound up having a better version of)and his in-ring performance all felt so meh,plus he had this odd build to me at least,where his arms seemed too short for his body and he wasn't tall enough to be a monster but not small enough to be average kinda like The Wall in WCW.

[Jannettyzilla]

As a nine year old, Undertaker's debut was the most groundbreaking thing ever. I remember immediately thinking that there was no way anyone could ever beat that guy. They had him get counted out in one of those "too brutal to follow the rules" moves, but he still walked out as the most unstoppable force on the roster and an immediate replacement for Andre.

[Stickman]

I have been hooked in Bray Wyatt since his vignettes. Good thing he is always on a winning streak being relevant.

[Lock Jaw]

Needless to say, I was underwhelmed by the debut "Real Man's Man" Steven Regal. They got this great talent and then gave him some goofy vignettes and a goofy gimmick.

It is "funny" to look back on, but at the time it was like "What the hell?"

[Mr. Nerfect]

Eric freakin' Escobar

[screech]

Underwhelming: Kizarny. So many vignettes for him, then he beat MVP in his debut. The problem was: it was during MVP's losing streak angle.

So this dude was hyped for weeks and became an afterthought in his own debut, even though he won it. Think he was released after two months.

[Theo Dious]

Sierra
Hotel
India
Echo
Lima
Delta
SHIELD

That is all.

[Damian Rey 2.0]

Drew McIntyre. Had the chosen one gimmick, destroyed Truth in his debut. Had a decent run against Hardy, sweet finisher, entrance and theme, then went downhill in a hurry. For sure thought he was gonna be a top heel on Smackdown.

[drave]

Can probably pair this with the "against the grain" crowd too.... but Mordecai. Seemed like he was going to be amazing. He was strong, HUGE and had a very unique gimmick that seemed like it would have gotten over. I was impressed with his debut bit disappointed at the short life.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ZPCvtZisQ0E" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="420"></iframe>

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

It's kind of hard to be scared of someone who is attacking complete jobbers lol

[DAMN iNATOR]

Yeah, I don't get the part of the other post mentioning him and his gimmick and comparing it to 2002-retirement HBK. Shawn was just himself but as a born-again Christian, whereas I got the impression Mordecai was supposed to be more of a religious zealot/crusader/prophet type guy with probably more parallels in his character to Undertaker if anybody.

[thekrow]

http://www.chwbackyard.com/uploads/2/5/4/6/25465882/2234748.jpg


I'm going to go with JD BOLDUC.


His debut was pretty well hyped, here was a famous star in the metal music scene, lacing up the boots and training to be a wrestler. To top it off, he was going to debut in CHW and had the attitude to fit! I was really hyped for JD Bolduc.


Man was I disappointed! I expected that he wouldn't be the greatest in ring performer, and he wasn't, but his character was pretty boring and one dimensional as well. CHW didn't know what to do with him and he ended up as pretty much another jobber.


Its like if the WWE suddenly signed James Hetfield from Metallica. You'd expect him to not be good in the ring, but you wouldn't expect him to open up shows jobbing to other wrestlers.


That's what I feel CHW did with JD Bolduc.

[Mr. Nerfect]

The mystique in Mordecai disappeared that week they showed him having trouble digesting Hardcore Holly.

[Lock Jaw]

I was also intrigued by Mordecai..... the look and the music..... just got me all "Ohhhhh damn this guy is legit psycho and scary"

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Underwhelmed:

Los Matadores and the Shining Stars. At least the Shining Stars didn't try to steal Ole from Sami Zayn. Jim Ross once said a guy can be really talented but there is only so many times you can repackage Ray Traylor. Gives the same match as each character.


Intrigued: When Bob Backlund came back to challenge on Superstars against Bret Hart for the title. When he lost it turned into the best heel of the era Mr. Bob Backlund. Ended up winning the WWF Title in the end.

also Intrigued: Bobby Roooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooode. Glorious! Had the crowd eating out of his hands talking about how great NXT was and how he was enchanted by the crowd at TakeOver Dallas. Then he said that he was going to make NXT better and turned on the crowd saying they were all out. Glorious! Can't wait to see him wipe the floor with that 100 guy.

Also Sami Zayn's "debut" for the US title against Cena. Bret Hart introducing him in Montreal. Too bad it cost him about a year in injury but the match still was very good.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I was thinking about mentioning Epico y Primo. Just in general. Primo showed up doing cartwheels on RAW randomly, then just jumped to SmackDown. Epico showed up on SmackDown and was angry at Sin Cara or something. Then he randomly jumped to RAW. I think. Then they were repackaged as Los Matadores -- the green screen vignettes had a weird sort of charm to them -- but they never really got out the gate. I sincerely wonder if the WWE received money from the tourism department of Puerto Rico to do those Shining Stars vignettes.

How about giving them an actual wrestling feud? Kalisto and Sin Cara are doing nothing on their respective brands. Why couldn't they be wrestling in matches to open either RAW or SmackDown each week?

[The Condor]

Primo and Epico were actually tag champs in 2011. They've been pushed and repackaged several times in the past 5 years.

[Anybody Thrilla]

Oddly enough, I really liked them when they were just called Primo and Epico. Rosa Mendes didn't hurt, either.

[McLegend]

Intrigued by Kurt Angle's first vignette/promo in TNA. It was one of the best things TNA ever did.

[Jordan]

I was completely let down by the return of The Ultimate Warrior in 96. I was only 9 years old, but I had seen so many coliseum video tapes from the rental stores in my area, I was a huge huge Warrior mark. He comes in lame squash over Triple H and literally NOTHING good after that. The stuff with Jerry was great because he is a fantastic heel, but what a goddamn let down. Sid made up for it though.

[Anybody Thrilla]

The Warrior and Goldust had a five star classic involving a cigar.

[Tom Guycott]

Intrigued by Kurt Angle's first vignette/promo in TNA. It was one of the best things TNA ever did.

The debut/face off with Samoa Joe didn't hurt things, either.

Intrigued: Nathan Jones. The whole character was pretty unique in how well they fleshed it out in such a short time. Mountainous-yet-athletic ex-con with a reputation from his size, not quite all there in the head, but in a somewhat charming way (having his "debut match" in a locker room off camera). Add into that the supposed "history" with Biker 'Taker which lead to the "mentoring". Too bad the actor couldn't hack the road schedule. He could have been huge.

Underwhelmed: Chris Masters. Exactly 180 from "The Colossus of Boggo Road", this guy's ENTIRE gimmick was how physically impressive he looked. Everything else was meh, and it showed. Even after getting off the gas (good personally, but shooting the entire gimmick in the foot in the process), WWE still tried to push the idea of his physique ("leaner and meaner") with no other substance. Was as two dimensional as you could get outside of a pencil drawing.

[Sixx]

The Warrior and Goldust had a five star classic involving a cigar.

how bout that halloween havoc warrior vs hogan match where hogan was apparently trying to learn how to use a lighter? also a classic

[drave]

@ Chris Masters post - it also didn't help when HHH and/or HBK ripped him for looking 200lbs lighter or something dumb.

[Anybody Thrilla]

Anyone remember when Chris Masters interrupted that HBK promo? That segment turned out way better than it had any business being.

[KIRA]

Yeah, I don't get the part of the other post mentioning him and his gimmick and comparing it to 2002-retirement HBK. Shawn was just himself but as a born-again Christian, whereas I got the impression Mordecai was supposed to be more of a religious zealot/crusader/prophet type guy with probably more parallels in his character to Undertaker if anybody.

I mentioned HBK because they played up the contrast between Taker and Michaels going into their WM match right down to the promos, Shawns entrance and his attire and music or at (least the first half) I meant the visual aspect (though I did say whole gimmick my bad)

[hb2k]

I want to thank everybody for the contributions, we got to read many of them on the show, which is now available at the following link:

http://squaredcirclegazette.podbean.com/mf/web/8yx695/SCG_Radio_94_-_Best_And_Worst_Debuts_Ever.mp3

Join us as we discuss the Best and Worst Debuts in Wrestling History! Talking all about the introductions that intrigued or underwhelmed you most, we take your nominations and cover the lofty highs provided by the debuts of Chris Jericho, Kane, Shinsuke Nakamura, Tazz, The Undertaker, The Radicalz, Mankind, Phantasio (!), Sean O'Haire and many more. But fear not, we also cover the staggering lows gifted us by the Shockmaster, Mordecai, Glacier, Seven, Bret Hart in WCW, DDP in the WWF, ROCKABILLY, Tensai and numerous others. A fun show this week, as we banter about some of the most fun memories wrestling provides - check it out!