Is Dave Meltzer full of shit?

[slik]

Just curious what your guys opinion on him is...was reading his twitter earlier and he said less than 1 million people in Europe watch wrestling, which seems strange for a continent with over 700 million people...


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">You'd be wrong about millions watching WWE. Don't think it's even 1 million. <a href="https://t.co/EDa1uEjAiB">https://t.co/EDa1uEjAiB</a></p>&mdash; Dave Meltzer (@davemeltzerWON) <a href="https://twitter.com/davemeltzerWON/status/793858999267438592">November 2, 2016</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Over 200,000 watch TNA in the UK but I believe it's 400k-odd that watch Raw from a number I read including all the repeats and that's the biggest market by far.

I'd need to see numbers, but of people legit watching Raw with delays in countries or behind paywalls, I could see it being under or around 1 million.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Actually, that 400k might be from my arse. Here's some PWInsider 2011 numbers but I'm hunting for something more recent:

TNA:
Bound For Glory drew 186,000 viewers on a three-day tape delay (with no replays, save for the Challenge +1 timeshift channel - something that is really annoying, given that Impact gets a replay!)

As for Impact, looking at the first airings only (3 days after the US):

September 15 - no rating (would mean 114,000 viewers or less)
September 22 - 141,000
September 19 - 137,000 (-4,000 viewers)
October 6 - 184,000 (+47,000)
October 13 - 169,000 (-15,000)
October 20 - 147,000 (-22,000)
October 27 - 191,000 (+44,000)
November 3 - 197,000 (+6,000)

Quite a fluctuation here; Impact fell off a cliff in mid September, leading to them not appearing on Challenge's top ten for what I think would be the first time since they moved onto the station earlier in 2011. The viewership did recover, before dropping off before Bound For Glory, although the post-BFG stuff with Roode and Storm looks to have helped the show back to some good ratings.

WWE:
On the WWE front, two pay-per-views aired on "free" TV on Sky Sports.

Night of Champions: airing live, drew 156,000 viewers, with a replay the following night drawing 98,000.

Vengeance got 130,000 live, with 43,000 the following evening on the replay.

Raw's ratings (all for the live airing)

September 12 - 145,000 (-1,000 viewers on the prior week)
September 19 - 159,000 (+14,000)
September 26 - 150,000 (-9,000)
October 3 - 112,000 (-38,000)
October 10 - 148,000 (+36,000)
October 17 - 130,000 (-18,000)
October 24 - 131,000 (+1,000)
October 31 - 116,000 (-15,000)

SmackDown (all for the first airing on Friday night)
September 16 - 142,000
September 23 - 195,000 (+53,000)
September 30 - 136,000 (-59,000)
October 7 - 75,000 (-61,000)
October 14 - 102,000 (+27,000)
October 21 - 93,000 (-9,000)
October 28 - 114,000 (+21,000)
November 4 - 124,000 (+10,000)

The Raw number is live though, so at 1am-3pm back in those days

[slik]

Interesting! Thanks for sharing that info.

[Emperor Smeat]

Unless he only meant major markets combined but even that sounds like he'd be wrong.

He'd be right if he was just talking about the Network or a specific country like the UK or Germany since those are the big 2 in Europe. It seems like that was what he meant on his Twitter account based on a few of the replies but wasn't clear about it.

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Wade Keller and Bruce Mitchell and Pat McNeil 4 life bro.

[ClockShot]

The Young Bucks love him so much they got a finisher named after him.

Although I'm curious as to if we're judging him by this tweet alone, or by his reputation/credibility overall?

[Destor]

Cant vote on your poll. Need a "he's prob the most reliable" option

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Ryan Clark is wrestling's shame!

Shame!

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Cant vote on your poll. Need a "he's prob the most reliable" option

He and Keller are about equal. Both have too much time invested in real sport ufc/mma. Him putting ufc in contention for best promotion against fake products proves he is unreliable.

[Evil Vito]

While I don't treat Meltzer's word as the total gospel (Meltzer sheep,,,,,), the guy has probably watched more wrestling than any other person on the planet. 30 something years of watching literally every promotion out there. He's seen everything and in turn he knows the industry inside and out and actually has credible sources.

Not everything he says is true I'm sure but I'd trust his word a lot more than any other "wrestling journalist"

[slik]

One thing he has said very recently which does sound pretty plausible...



Orton/Taker is a WM33 program likely. Orton's heel turn is legit and Orton might attack Taker on SD to hint at it. Orton is one of Taker's favorite past WM opponents. Cena will be focused on tying Flair's World Title record at WM against AJ.

[Shisen Kopf]

Meltzer sheep,,,,,,,

[XL]

I've always found it difficult to get ratings figures for the UK but they're not as high as you'd imagine.

[The CyNick]

Dave lives in a cable TV world, thats all he knows. I've heard him discuss digital media and he clearly has no knowledge of the industry. Guaranteed more than 1 million people view WWE programming in Europe on a weekly basis.

[RP]

I think he's correct. WWE has not done anything of significance for 10 years. And people are growing up and starting not to care. You think average fan is clamoring in hordes for Aj Styles vs Dean Amborse because of AJ's elite skills? Come on. Come to real world please. Average fan dont care that much and Smark fan aint in the millions. Do the math.

[RP]

Do you really think there are a million fans thinking " Oh shit Goldeberg vs Lesnar ??" or more realistic, " Oh shit ! Nearly 50 year old Goldeberg vs 25% appearance rate and average UFC fighter Brock Lesnar???? "

Nah. Sorry.

[Bad News Gertner]

Cant vote on your poll. Need a "he's prob the most reliable" option

I agree. He's pretty reliable. I love reading old Wrestling Observers.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Cant vote on your poll. Need a "he's prob the most reliable" option

This. And also him re-tweeting Seth82 being cool too.

[slik]

He also said soccer was more popular than baseball in Japan...that seems probably "not true"...

[Heisenberg]

Keller sheep,,,,,

[#BROKEN Hasney]

He also said soccer was more popular than baseball in Japan...that seems probably "not true"...

That doesn't seem hard to believe. The J League is a big deal over there.

[Mr. Nerfect]

He also said soccer was more popular than baseball in Japan...that seems probably "not true"...

I don't know the stats, but soccer is massively popular in Japan.

EDIT: Wikipedia still says that baseball is the most popular sport as of 2013, with a 12% lead over soccer. It is certainly growing at the fastest rate.

[Emperor Smeat]

Them co-hosting the World Cup in 2002 likely contributed a lot to soccer's rise in Japan over the years similar to the US and having the Cup in 1994.

Also their women's team having some really great success in recent years.

[The CyNick]

I think he's correct. WWE has not done anything of significance for 10 years. And people are growing up and starting not to care. You think average fan is clamoring in hordes for Aj Styles vs Dean Amborse because of AJ's elite skills? Come on. Come to real world please. Average fan dont care that much and Smark fan aint in the millions. Do the math.

The average fan isn't the target though. Anytime you're looking for a monthly commitment you're trying to convert the hardcore fans. The smart thing WWE is doing is to be as inclusive as possible. In my opinion, even if you didn't like the current product, between NXT and these special tournaments with the IWC darlings, you have something for all hardcore wrestling fans.

[Jordan]

I am very partial to Dave and Bryan. I love the audio they produce, it's apart of my routine most days. I can't stand the actual web site for Torch or PWInsider, it's filled with adds and clunky as hell, both of them. Dave is the most legit Pro Wrestling and one of the most legit MMA journalists that there is.

[DAMN iNATOR]

Meltzer sheep,,,,,,,

[/THREAD]

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

The CyNick is where I got to when I need wrestling news.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

I'm a cynick sheep,,,,,,

[The CyNick]

The CyNick is where I got to when I need wrestling news.

Stay tuned for my website

[#BROKEN Hasney]

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