RAW 25 - The all day TPWW celebration!

[slik]

There's my dude!

[Droford]

Or not

[Lock Jaw]

R.I.P. Revival

[Droford]

They remembered the shirt

[Tom Guycott]

SAY YEAAAAHHHH! (holding out hope)

Welp...! :y:

[#1-norm-fan]

Hall: "I think everyone here can agree that this show has been too sweeeeet!"

I don't know about that.

[Lock Jaw]

Revival should join The Club and they should all beat down DX

[KIRA]

Proof positive that Vince hates Finn Balor look where he sent him

[ClockShot]

Why's there a ref in the ring?

[Sepholio]

Did I miss Kevin Nash? Or did they forget him? :'(

[Dark One]

I assume this tag match will last 30 seconds.

[Frank Drebin]

This like when TPWW Posters return and make threads to see if people fawn over them. Right, Drebin?

Faaaawwwwwnnnnnnn

[GD]

Say yeah!

[Droford]

Just noticed ref old school wear

[Triple A]

What a mess

[rez]

the revival basically just told their boss and his wildhog posse to leave the ring.

:rofl:

[Dark One]

Did I miss Kevin Nash? Or did they forget him? :'(

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Was so looking forward to being a part of RAW 25. It's nearly impossible to travel on our down sized airlines healthy. With a total knee replacement it would be self inflicted torture. See ya everyone at Mania</p>&mdash; Kevin Nash (@RealKevinNash) <a href="https://twitter.com/RealKevinNash/status/953784477360295938?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 18, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[owenbrown]

crowd doing a Mike Chioda chant :lol:

[#1-norm-fan]

Wait. Is this the main event?

[Droford]

Did I miss Kevin Nash? Or did they forget him? :'(

Nash couldn't make it

[Lock Jaw]

THAT TURNBUCKLE ISN'T MADE OF CHOCOLATE

[slik]

What are they chanting?

[Droford]

Lets go Festus

[KIRA]

Y'know what I hate about fans we whine and bitch but you trot out a bunch of immobile borderline geriatrics and its the greatest show ever

[Triple A]

This match finishing with a Gallows and Anderson win then the show abruptly ending would be a perfect finish for this show

[Heisenberg]

This venue reminds me more of jobber squashes than anything

[Lock Jaw]

Whenever I try to hum Revival theme, it turns into Power Rangers theme.

[Shisen Kopf]

What are they chanting?

"Owen White, Owen White"

[Evil Vito]

I would off myself if I spent $800 on secondary market tickets for the Manhattan Center

[slik]

We still have Braun/Brock/Kane at Barclays in a segment to main-event

[Nervous Ferret]

hey everyone, how's RAW been?

just tuned in. seems cool

[Lock Jaw]

Damn...... Revival pretty much getting squashed vs. Gallows/Anderson......... not even a distraction.....

And now they gotta be beat up by DX too

[ClockShot]

Poor Revival.

[GD]

Wow! Did The Revival just lose?

[Emperor Smeat]

Poor Revival, getting demolished because Scott Dawson said the forbidden word of "wrestler" last week.

[ClockShot]

hey everyone, how's RAW been?

just tuned in. seems cool

Turn it off while you still can.

[Heisenberg]

FUCK THE REVIVAL

KISS THE RING

[A.J.K]

X-Pac hit the X-factor.

[ClockShot]

RE-FUND!

[Dark One]

I guess to be fair, it's not like the first Raw was that great of a card either...

Yokozuna (w/ Mr. Fuji) defeated Koko B. Ware (3:45)
The Steiner Brothers (Rick Steiner and Scott Steiner) defeated The Executioners (Duane Gill & Barry Hardy) (3:00)
Shawn Michaels (c) defeated Max Moon to retain the WWF Intercontinental Championship (10:30)
The Undertaker (w/ Paul Bearer) defeated Damien Demento (2:26)
Dark Match: Crush defeated Bam Bam Bigelow by Disqualification

[Dark One]

I guess to be fair, it's not like the first Raw was that great of a card either...

Yokozuna (w/ Mr. Fuji) defeated Koko B. Ware (3:45)
The Steiner Brothers (Rick Steiner and Scott Steiner) defeated The Executioners (Duane Gill & Barry Hardy) (3:00)
Shawn Michaels (c) defeated Max Moon to retain the WWF Intercontinental Championship (10:30)
The Undertaker (w/ Paul Bearer) defeated Damien Demento (2:26)
Dark Match: Crush defeated Bam Bam Bigelow by Disqualification

TEN MINUTE MAX MOON MATCH. BARRY HARDY.

[#1-norm-fan]

lol Very fitting for this shit show to end with The Revival getting squashed and then beaten up by DX.

[Droford]

Curt Hawkins is a legend lol

[Lock Jaw]

lol at Curt Hawkins sneaking in with all the "Legends"

[KIRA]

I'll give DX this they managed to find and fit into blue jeans whose design hasn't been seen for years

[Dark One]

"Amazing atmosphere here"

Ehhhhhhhh

[Lock Jaw]

Oh, ok, everyone else is coming out too

[ClockShot]

I see a lot of victims for Braun.

[rez]

so ...passing of the torch. I'd be down with that if I knew it wasn't thrown together considering creative had no fucking idea what to do with Finn just a few weeks ago.

[slik]

Eric Bischoff didn't do anything really :(

[Dark One]

Yes, Eric Bischoff and Bruce Pritchard are going to help restrain Brock/Kane/Braun.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Y'know what I hate about fans we whine and bitch but you trot out a bunch of immobile borderline geriatrics and its the greatest show ever

Fucking truth.

[Nervous Ferret]

How was the Undertaker? I caught SCSA give SCSAStuners to the Vinny MAcs! LOL

[#1-norm-fan]

I guess to be fair, it's not like the first Raw was that great of a card either...

Yokozuna (w/ Mr. Fuji) defeated Koko B. Ware (3:45)
The Steiner Brothers (Rick Steiner and Scott Steiner) defeated The Executioners (Duane Gill & Barry Hardy) (3:00)
Shawn Michaels (c) defeated Max Moon to retain the WWF Intercontinental Championship (10:30)
The Undertaker (w/ Paul Bearer) defeated Damien Demento (2:26)
Dark Match: Crush defeated Bam Bam Bigelow by Disqualification

Pretty sure that crowd paid WAY less and didn't have to sit through literally nothing for long stretches of time though.

[Nicky Fives]

So how many legends going to "feel these hands"

[Tom Guycott]

Poor Revival, getting demolished because Scott Dawson said the forbidden word of "wrestler" last week.

Shame. Squandered what could have been at least a good tag angle for a few weeks just to have all the old guys piss all over them.

It's like The Ascention all over again.

[slik]

How was the Undertaker? I caught SCSA give SCSAStuners to the Vinny MAcs! LOL

he looked cool but he didn't really say or do anything

[Dark One]

Pretty sure that crowd paid WAY less and didn't have to sit through literally nothing for long stretches of time though.

I mean, they did have a Koko B Ware match.

[Lock Jaw]

Eric Bischoff didn't do anything really :(

Yeah.... really wanted to hear him talk...... was thinking he should have come out when Vince was saying he only has one person to thank.... Then he could have come out and started talking about Nitro.....

And THEN Austin could have come out and stunned them all

[Emperor Smeat]

With how many people are at the show tonight, RAW better end in a pre-Rumble massive brawl for the ages.

[Tom Guycott]

Pretty sure that crowd paid WAY less and didn't have to sit through literally nothing for long stretches of time though.

Could have been worse. Could be stuck outside the whole time like Heenan.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Lol, did DX beat up The Revival?

[Mr. Nerfect]

Can The Rock please start up his own wrestling promotion? Please?

[KIRA]

Fucking truth.

I'm just saying for me that would never be enough

The fact that people would cheer this while being ripped the fuck off is infuriating

[Bad News Gertner]

I guess to be fair, it's not like the first Raw was that great of a card either...

Yokozuna (w/ Mr. Fuji) defeated Koko B. Ware (3:45)
The Steiner Brothers (Rick Steiner and Scott Steiner) defeated The Executioners (Duane Gill & Barry Hardy) (3:00)
Shawn Michaels (c) defeated Max Moon to retain the WWF Intercontinental Championship (10:30)
The Undertaker (w/ Paul Bearer) defeated Damien Demento (2:26)
Dark Match: Crush defeated Bam Bam Bigelow by Disqualification

Steiner hit the Steiner Screwdriver during that match

[ClockShot]

Braun.

I don't even have it in me scream it in capital letters now.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I'm just saying for me that would never be enough

The fact that people would cheer this while being ripped the fuck off is infuriating

You're 100% correct. Any Trojan horse will fool those marks.

[Tom Guycott]

Lol, did DX beat up The Revival?

Yep. And also looks like Balor Club are the DX heir apparents.

Thought with The Revival talking trash last week, it was going to lead to a push.

Silly me. That made entirely too much sense. Should have known better.

[Dark One]

Corey clearly enjoying #Raw25

https://i.imgur.com/0oxOfdU.jpg

[rez]

it's a crime this thread is 21 pages and SDL thread repping a decent SDL won't sniff 4 pages.

[Tom Guycott]

Steiner hit the Steiner Screwdriver during that match

"HE AIN'T GETTIN' UP FROM THIS ONE!!!"

[Mr. Nerfect]

Total Divas genuinely seems more gripping.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

I guess to be fair, it's not like the first Raw was that great of a card either...

Yokozuna (w/ Mr. Fuji) defeated Koko B. Ware (3:45)


Yakazuma*

[Mr. Nerfect]

Yep. And also looks like Balor Club are the DX heir apparents.

Thought with The Revival talking trash last week, it was going to lead to a push.

Silly me. That made entirely too much sense. Should have known better.

Hahahaha!

[KIRA]

I mean, they did have a Koko B Ware match.

The chance to "do the bird,bird,bird!" would almost kinda make me reconsider setting fire to the place.....almost

[Lock Jaw]

'Member Pyro?

[Dark One]

it's a crime this thread is 21 pages and SDL thread repping a decent SDL won't sniff 4 pages.

Controversy Creates Cash

Trainwrecks Triple Threads.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Had to tune in for the Braun segment to see what all the fuss is about. Crowd is mild. You can hear them individually yelling "BRAUN!" when he does his thing. He still looks goofy.

[Lock Jaw]

Mike Lient

[Mr. Nerfect]

Lol, Kane pyro sound goes off with no pyro. And they still do the pyro before the song intro. And he now has a horrible remix. Ew.

[KIRA]

This whole show couldve been Bruan destroying a bunch of grandpas

[Evil Vito]

So glad to see the Raw and SmackDown superstars standing side by side helping each other after they viciously assaulted each other two months ago.

[rez]

Controversy Creates Cash

Trainwrecks Triple Threads.

you should be a poet

[slik]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Thank you <a href="https://twitter.com/WWE?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@wwe</a> and <a href="https://twitter.com/TripleH?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@TripleH</a> for remembering Chyna tonight. <a href="https://t.co/f2S8sLIXRR">https://t.co/f2S8sLIXRR</a></p>&mdash; Chyna (@ChynaJoanLaurer) <a href="https://twitter.com/ChynaJoanLaurer/status/955653259603013632?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
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[Mr. Nerfect]

Paul Heyman genuinely most over guy out there right now.

[Dark One]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Manhattan Center, did I book a wrestler named “Refund”</p>&mdash; VinceMcMahonGoogling (@VinceGoogling) <a href="https://twitter.com/VinceGoogling/status/955654066406793216?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
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[Mr. Nerfect]

Holy shit, Heyman taking some shots. Amazing what can happen when you're actually to promo.

[Emperor Smeat]

Everyone bailing from the ring sort of defeats the purpose of preventing Kane, Braun, and Lesnar from attacking each other.

[ClockShot]

Just give.................Braun.........................the belt.

The end.

[Lock Jaw]

Braun commits murder to end the show.

Guess who isn't winning?

[KIRA]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Thank you <a href="https://twitter.com/WWE?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@wwe</a> and <a href="https://twitter.com/TripleH?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@TripleH</a> for remembering Chyna tonight. <a href="https://t.co/f2S8sLIXRR">https://t.co/f2S8sLIXRR</a></p>&mdash; Chyna (@ChynaJoanLaurer) <a href="https://twitter.com/ChynaJoanLaurer/status/955653259603013632?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
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And you only had to lose your life for them to do it.

[Emperor Smeat]

That's it?

This might go down as the worst ever go-home Rumble show and special RAW show at the same time. If they weren't going to do a massive brawl, should have ended RAW with DX & The Club instead.

[Lock Jaw]

Not even the traditional pre-Rumble brawl.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Brock bumping like a beast for Braun. Crowd goes quiet. This "Braun is over shit" is shit.

[Dark One]

you should be a poet

Maybe time to change my custom title to TPWW POET LAUREATE

[Evil Vito]

And with this disaster of a show ending, we have out first real contender for Letdown of the Year.

[Dark One]

Brock bumping like a beast for Braun. Crowd goes quiet. This "Braun is over shit" is shit.

I mean, they go nuts most of the time.

CM Punk would probably get a "Ehh, cool." after the past three hours.

[rez]

welllll...it's about that time again to go and attempt to cancel the network only to get a free month for my effort.

[Mr. Nerfect]

No reaction for Braun on the ropes. And that's the actual end? Hahahaha.

[Lock Jaw]

That was truly a bad show.

At the very least I got to hear Christian's theme for like 2 seconds, and he got to say two sentences, which is a lot more than some other "Legends" got.

[Tom Guycott]

I wonder if Kane got hurt. Looked like he landed on his knee on that F5, kinda went to grab it, and instead just rolled out the ring... and then all the focus was on Brock and Brawn as Kane took a powder. Hope I'm overanalyzing this.

[Dark One]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">And stilllllllllll the worst stunner bump goes to VKM!!! <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/RAW25?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#RAW25</a></p>&mdash; Rusev (@RusevBUL) <a href="https://twitter.com/RusevBUL/status/955650766328475648?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
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WWE would like to wish Rusev the best in his future endeavors.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I mean, they go nuts most of the time.

CM Punk would probably get a "Ehh, cool." after the past three hours.

Don't believe it, sorry. I'm sure you enjoy him, but I haven't heard a crowd go "nuts" in a long time. I doubt they do with Braun. Who looked like shit here, still. Why is it that every time I hear of a wrestler suddenly being good, I tune in and that's always when they look like shit?

[Lock Jaw]

I feel like they should have just forgotten about doing Manhattan Center, and just did the "Old School" RAW set at Barclay's

[Tom Guycott]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Manhattan Center, did I book a wrestler named “Refund”</p>&mdash; VinceMcMahonGoogling (@VinceGoogling) <a href="https://twitter.com/VinceGoogling/status/955654066406793216?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Yeah. Came out to the Repo Man theme.

[Mr. Nerfect]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">And stilllllllllll the worst stunner bump goes to VKM!!! <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/RAW25?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#RAW25</a></p>&mdash; Rusev (@RusevBUL) <a href="https://twitter.com/RusevBUL/status/955650766328475648?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


WWE would like to wish Rusev the best in his future endeavors.

Holy shit, hahaha. Rusev is the biggest babyface in the company to me right now. He doesn't give a fuck. I doubt he's with the company come the end of the year, and I don't think he'll care.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I feel like they should have just forgotten about doing Manhattan Center, and just did the "Old School" RAW set at Barclay's

Or just done a nice show at the Manhattan Center as a change. The different aesthetic and hot atmosphere might make for an enjoyable TV show. Instead they bit off more than they are competent enough to chew.

[Tom Guycott]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">And stilllllllllll the worst stunner bump goes to VKM!!! <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/RAW25?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#RAW25</a></p>&mdash; Rusev (@RusevBUL) <a href="https://twitter.com/RusevBUL/status/955650766328475648?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


WWE would like to wish Rusev the best in his future endeavors.

I dunno. If Lio Rush could be back to get killed in NXT, beefy foreign heel seems pretty safe.

[#1-norm-fan]

lol @ Kane being in a world title PPV match against Brock Lesnar in 2018.

[KIRA]

No idea what you're talking about.

http://i.imgur.com/wCfDS.gif

Tell me again how shes on the same level as Biss

[rez]

If you reactivate your account before Wednesday, January 24, 2018 you can still enjoy all the benefits of the WWE Network


don't you dare try to call my bluff, Vince

[Mr. Nerfect]

I dunno. If Lio Rush could be back to get killed in NXT, beefy foreign heel seems pretty safe.

Vince McMahon is way more important than Emma. And Vince probably has way more Twitter followers than Lio Rush.

[Mr. Nerfect]

lol @ Kane being in a world title PPV match against Brock Lesnar in 2018.

Vince is just booking this for himself at this point.

[slik]

It wasn't terrible or terrific but ultimately I wasn't bored.

[slik]

No rasslemania 35 announcement

if they dont' do it tomorrow I bet Philly gets 35

[Lock Jaw]

Vince is a millionaire who should be a billionaire

[Tom Guycott]

True... but Lio Rush is "little". If Rusev were a smaller guy, I'd follow you on fearing for his job.

[Evil Vito]

The Raw 15th Anniversary Show was the most fun I've ever had at a live wrestling show. There was an utterly cringeworthy Vince/Hornswoggle segment at the start but beyond that it was a good show. There were actual wrestling matches (shocker!), and all of the legend cameos made sense and worked in the context of the show.

Oh and they did a battle royal with former members of the roster which gave purpose for some of the more obscure guys being there. I actually marked huge for Al Snow, Steve Blackman, IRS, Gangrel, and even Pete motherfucking Gas.

But this? Fuck everything about this show.

[rez]

pains me to say but russo could have thrown a better show together

[slik]

I need to re-watch Taker's promo with Meltzer precision analysis

[slik]

I am thinking this is the WM card so far...


Brock/Roman
AJ vs Shinsuke or Orton
Cena vs Elias
Asuka vs Alexa vs Nia
Miz vs Finn
Braun vs HHH (in some capacity...)
Rollins vs Jason Jordan
+ some other stuff

[Mr. Nerfect]

The SCG Radio podcast of Top 25 Raw Matches/Moments is going to be better than the Raw show. Guarantee that much.

[Savio]

Braun commits murder to end the show.

Guess who isn't winning?Kane

[Evil Vito]

I'm not sold on Cena/Elias being a Mania program. I think they just did that to give Cena someone to eliminate in the Rumble.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I am thinking this is the WM card so far...


Brock/Roman
AJ vs Shinsuke or Orton
Cena vs Elias
Asuka vs Alexa vs Nia
Miz vs Finn
Braun vs HHH (in some capacity...)
Rollins vs Jason Jordan
+ some other stuff

I can genuinely say that if I am not free that day, I will probably miss that show. I may watch AJ vs. Nakamura and Brock vs. Roman online somewhere, but I have ZERO interest in everything else. And that isn't me being a facetious smark -- I genuinely do not want to see any of it.

I also find it weird that the WWE would somehow get both title matches right. As we creep closer, and given that Reigns and Brock both looked pretty shit on tonight's show, I wonder if Mania plans have changed. Wouldn't surprise me if Strowman vs. Cena ends up being the Universal Title match and AJ vs. Baron Corbin is the WWE Title match.

I mean, would anyone really be shocked?

[rez]

i'm still trying to comprehend how they fucked this up so bad.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Oh, man, this show is going to be compounded by Roman likely winning the Rumble in Philly. That is going to be incredible.

[Evil Vito]

If Roman wins the Rumble in Philly again, you can flip on any major news network for coverage of the riot and beheading that takes place.

[Dark One]

Don't believe it, sorry. I'm sure you enjoy him, but I haven't heard a crowd go "nuts" in a long time. I doubt they do with Braun. Who looked like shit here, still. Why is it that every time I hear of a wrestler suddenly being good, I tune in and that's always when they look like shit?

I mean--don't misunderstand me, he isn't Rock/Austin/Hogan over or whatever, but he's about as over as just about anyone on the roster now.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/zXpJAliK1fs" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

He has some whiffs still, which is understandable given that he's been wrestling for like two maybe three years.

But I'd rather they put the rocket on someone the crowd is invested in (when they haven't been browbeaten by shitty TV for three-plus hours) than what they've mostly been doing. He's a cartoon character in a sea of otherwise bland, directionless characters.

If he's not your jam, that's cool. I get it. It's over the top and cartoony in a way we haven't seen in a long while and it does stand in pretty stark contrast to the rest of what's going on, but I think that's why it works.

Saying he's not over or nobody gives a shit about him because you've seen a few segments where the crowd was dead and he hasn't looked great when there's plenty of evidence of the crowd being heavily invested in him is a shitty argument.

We live in a time in WWE where people generally don't go nuts any more, just like they don't have flash bulbs go off during entrances and we don't have 10,000 signs in the crowd. Arguing that Braun isn't over because the crowd was dead after three hours of some of the worst TV in ages is a bad, CyNick-level nonsensical argument.

If he's not your jam, cool, but let's not pretend he's not over. You're better than that.

[Evil Vito]

Why the fuck was MVP brought back just to be in a backstage card game segment?

Seriously, if you're gonna bring the dude back for a one off just throw him in the Rumble, give him a shine spot, and send him on his way. Don't put him in a 20-person segment where you could easily not even notice he was there.

[Evil Vito]

Frank the Clown was in the Manhattan Center and bitched about the show nonstop on Twitter.

If you have access to Noelle Foley's vagina, you don't have the right to complain about anything.

[Tom Guycott]

So, I've seen most of.... whatever went on since about 10 (Elias/Cena).

Is it worth being Late To The Party and watching the show from the top on YT? Saw a lot of complaints about this being a shit show.

[Dark One]

So, I've seen most of.... whatever went on since about 10 (Elias/Cena).

Is it worth being Late To The Party and watching the show from the top on YT? Saw a lot of complaints about this being a shit show.

Opening segment then hard pass.

[Emperor Smeat]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Ric Flair makes an appearance for the live crowd at the Manhattan Center to close out the... <a href="https://t.co/ylr3fgiYwX">https://t.co/ylr3fgiYwX</a> <a href="https://t.co/ddXloPxik0">pic.twitter.com/ddXloPxik0</a></p>&mdash; Tim Fiorvanti (@tim00) <a href="https://twitter.com/tim00/status/955653537278513153?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">One last moment for the live crowd - Seth Rollins made his way over to the Manhattan Center just to hit a Blackout on The Miz to send the crowd home just a little bit happier. <a href="https://t.co/Uewy8qkXsd">pic.twitter.com/Uewy8qkXsd</a></p>&mdash; Tim Fiorvanti (@tim00) <a href="https://twitter.com/tim00/status/955657182938370048?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
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[Tom Guycott]

Why the fuck was MVP brought back just to be in a backstage card game segment?

Seriously, if you're gonna bring the dude back for a one off just throw him in the Rumble, give him a shine spot, and send him on his way. Don't put him in a 20-person segment where you could easily not even notice he was there.

Again, they had The Revival cut a promo just to set up them getting taken out by eight guys... five of which aren't even active roster members, and one of those five is a suit now. So MVP being around just to sit in a chair as an easter egg/extra isn't surprising.

However, it would be cool in a armchair booking kinda way if he were brought in as the manager of Street Profits.

[Emperor Smeat]

Apparently WWE didn't even bother to invite Lita for tonight's show.

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">I may not have made the guest list, but at least I made it on the chair. ����█♀️<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/RAW25?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#RAW25</a> <a href="https://t.co/S780sd9los">https://t.co/S780sd9los</a></p>&mdash; Amy Dumas (@AmyDumas) <a href="https://twitter.com/AmyDumas/status/955654559115788288?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


Also supposedly the tickets for the Manhattan show mentioned tonight's festivities was going to favor Barclays Center more. Guess the crowd got really pissed once they realized they were getting even less than they were expecting.

[Dark One]

from reddit:
Commercial log:

8:20-8:24

8:28-8:31

8:35-8:39

8:44-8:47

8:57-9:00

9:10-9:14

9:24-9:28

9:39-9:43

9:48-9:51

9:57-10:00

10:19-10:22

10:27-10:30

10:37-10:40

10:50-10:54

11:04-11:08


Woof.

[Mr. Nerfect]

There are only so many spots. What's offensive is what they actually did.

[Evil Vito]

I wasn't even, like...necessarily unhappy to see Torrie Wilson or Kelly Kelly again. But trailblazers

Were Lita, Alundra Blayze, Victoria, Beth Phoenix, and Molly Holly all booked? Some sort of combination punk rock show/monster truck rally/restaurant startup/rated R movie/church service or something?

[Mr. Nerfect]

Are there reports of people asking for refunds? Or did they take their lashings and ask for more like good marks?

[Tom Guycott]

Starting at the insanely long preshow full of recaps and whatnot. Skipping around.

Charley "You'll never guess who I ran into." Caruso says with all the excitement of an unlit lamppost. Also, she is right in front of the APA door without proper blocking or any kind of reveal. Just standing there. So I would guess it is the APA? Oh, looks like I was right.

Oh look, Eric Bischoff. Should have show'd up with the hermit beard he was rocking.

[Tonya Harding]

I could kick Frank The Clown's ass

[rez]

I could kick Frank The Clown's ass

you got a scissor fantasy with mick's daughter, ice killer?

[wwe2222]

Just got back home from Barclays. Poor show. Every segment was a waste and the multi venue show really took the air out of the live crowd.

[Ezra]

What was the big announcement Shawn was going on about?

[#1-norm-fan]

People paid over $1,000 for tickets to that Manhattan Center show apparently.

[#1-norm-fan]

What was the big announcement Shawn was going on about?

Vince McMahon got a plaque.

[Mr. Nerfect]

People paid over $1,000 for tickets to that Manhattan Center show apparently.

Hahahahaha.

[Lock Jaw]

https://media1.tenor.com/images/fb9ea879becabc75acbab1cdeef5f0e5/tenor.gif?itemid=3772729

[#1-norm-fan]

CyNick be like: "Excellent show as usual. Great action at the big arena, legendary moments in the small one. Everyone goes home getting their money's worth. WWE hits another home run."

[#1-norm-fan]

Really though, what better way to celebrate 25 years of Raw than by giving the paying crowd 25 minutes of live content during a 3 1/2 hour show.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Oooh, yeah.

[Droford]

from reddit:
Commercial log:

8:20-8:24

8:28-8:31

8:35-8:39

8:44-8:47

8:57-9:00

9:10-9:14

9:24-9:28

9:39-9:43

9:48-9:51

9:57-10:00

10:19-10:22

10:27-10:30

10:37-10:40

10:50-10:54

11:04-11:08


Woof.

52 minutes out of 195 isn't bad. Avg 30 minute show has 8 minutes of commercials. 8x6=48 + 4 for 15 =52 right on average

[BigCrippyZ]

So glad I didn't waste my time watching this tonight. Seems like I made the right choice.

[Droford]

I enjoyed it. But I think WWE has reached "peak nostalgia" because can you imagine trying to get people excited about current stars 25 years from now for RAW 50?

[Ezra]

I look forward to Austin with a walker stunning the skeleton of Vince.

[Lock Jaw]

I enjoyed it. But I think WWE has reached "peak nostalgia" because can you imagine trying to get people excited about current stars 25 years from now for RAW 50?

Not when they consistently tell and show us that current stars aren't as good as those from 20-25 years ago.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I'm looking forward to chunks breaking off and crumbling into the ocean.

[Mr. Nerfect]

This is the only way wrestling draws emotion out of me these days, dammit.

[Dark One]

52 minutes out of 195 isn't bad. Avg 30 minute show has 8 minutes of commercials. 8x6=48 + 4 for 15 =52 right on average

Less "Woof" at the total combined length of the commercials and more about some of the spans with like four minutes of content sandwiched between 4 or 5 minutes of commercials on either end. 8:20 to 8:39 was 11 minutes of commercials in 19 minutes.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Frank the Clown was in the Manhattan Center and bitched about the show nonstop on Twitter.

If you have access to Noelle Foley's vagina, you don't have the right to complain about anything.

I'd probably complain about everything, because nothing is as good in comparison.

[Droford]

There should have been some XFL banners somewhere

[Tom Guycott]

Actually, there should have been ICO PRO banners in the Manhattan Center.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Actually, there should have been ICO PRO banners in the Manhattan Center.

From what I saw there was. :lol:

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Braun commits murder to end the show.

Guess who isn't winning?

The Eagles.

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Actually, there should have been ICO PRO banners in the Manhattan Center.

There was but no Headlock on Hunger.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">AAAAAAAAAND ANOTHER ONE! STONE COLD STUNNER! STONE COLD STUNNER! STONE COLD STUNNER!<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/RAW25?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#RAW25</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/steveaustinBSR?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@steveaustinBSR</a> <a href="https://t.co/K2WAQmuUEv">pic.twitter.com/K2WAQmuUEv</a></p>&mdash; WWE (@WWE) <a href="https://twitter.com/WWE/status/955611007191142400?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

What in the fuck with that camera

[Mr. Nerfect]

Kevin Dunn really needs to be given his severance package and sent on his way.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">WOW! To keep people at the Manhattan Center they’re having DX and Balor Club watch from the ring haha. <a href="https://t.co/PDgOFM4BCB">pic.twitter.com/PDgOFM4BCB</a></p>&mdash; Big B (@BTuckerTorch) <a href="https://twitter.com/BTuckerTorch/status/955654557509419008?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

[Sixx]

So is Finn Balor a heel now?

[Mr. Nerfect]

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">WOW! To keep people at the Manhattan Center they’re having DX and Balor Club watch from the ring haha. <a href="https://t.co/PDgOFM4BCB">pic.twitter.com/PDgOFM4BCB</a></p>&mdash; Big B (@BTuckerTorch) <a href="https://twitter.com/BTuckerTorch/status/955654557509419008?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">January 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

Hahahahaha!

[Mr. Nerfect]

Kind of have a feeling that the men's Rumble isn't going to close the show. I can see it being the Women's Rumble or even Brock's match.

[slik]

Undertaker's promo was him saying that if he beat you in the past you can now sleep.
No one can decipher anything from that.

He might be retired, he might have gas, he might want some spaghetti. Who knows?

[#BROKEN Hasney]

In other words, "I'm still negotiating. If they pay me 3 million I might come to Mania"

[Sixx]

Is there a single person alive happy to see Taker these days?

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Even Michelle McCool probably groans when the deadman gets stiff.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Undertaker's promo was him saying that if he beat you in the past you can now sleep.
No one can decipher anything from that.

He might be retired, he might have gas, he might want some spaghetti. Who knows?

Tune in next week to find out!

[Rammsteinmad]

So Raw 25 was basically Raw 1000 all over again. Austin stunning McMahon. DX reuniting and the announcers acting as if it's the first time we've ever had the full DX roster with the New Age Outlaws and HBK etc. The same played out returns over and over. Some of the piped in pops were ridiculous. I don't believe for one second that Kelly Kelly or Brother Love are cared about that much to receive such pops.

Only five matches, with only two of them featuring any legit stars.

So glad I skimmed through the highlights of this on the main page. Absolutely awful show by the sounds of it.

[Evil Vito]

Kevin Dunn really needs to be given his severance package and sent on his way.

His severance package might bankrupt the company from the sounds of things. Thought I'd read he holds nearly as many shares as Vince.

[Mr. Nerfect]

He can keep his shares. Just get him out of production.

[Heisenberg]

So Raw 25 was basically Raw 1000 all over again. Austin stunning McMahon. DX reuniting and the announcers acting as if it's the first time we've ever had the full DX roster with the New Age Outlaws and HBK etc. The same played out returns over and over. Some of the piped in pops were ridiculous. I don't believe for one second that Kelly Kelly or Brother Love are cared about that much to receive such pops.

Only five matches, with only two of them featuring any legit stars.

So glad I skimmed through the highlights of this on the main page. Absolutely awful show by the sounds of it.



The flow could be considered worse than RAW 1000. They hooked me with Stone Cold and gave me a mini heart attack cutting to commercial during Razor Fuckin Ramon's entrance.

[Gerard]

Surprised at no appearance of Jake Roberts, Hogan was never gonna happen. Nash despite being in the poster for it said the plane ride after his operation would be torture and declined.

[Evil Vito]

Here's a final tally of what the Manhattan Center received:

-Mustafa Ali vs. Lince Dorado in about a 2 minute match wedged in during a commercial
-A short Undertaker promo which made no sense
-Akira Tozawa and Hideo Itami vs. Drew Gulak and Tony Nese, match went 2 minutes during commercial before they brawled backstage for a no contest. When the crowd chanted bullshit, they came back out and finished the match during the next commercial
-A 5 minute Bray/Matt match that was no different at all from their last match before Hardy got woke, including Bray going over clean as a whistle
-Jeff Hardy singing off-air
-A random Miz promo
-A terrible DX promo that the fed up crowd barely seemed to care about
-A 2 minute Revival/Gallows and Anderson match that seemed more about a bunch of old guys burying the Revival at the end
-Flair showing up randomly
-Rollins attacking Miz to "send the crowd home happy"

Beyond that, they had to watch over 2 hours of the Barclays show on a big screen. I realize that the original Manhattan Center Raws weren't exactly known for lengthy matches, but I don't think those fans were being charged $800 for front row. This may have been the biggest ripoff WWE have committed on an audience.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Would have been so easy to make them happy too. Nothing much going on at the Barclays Centre, so why not have Revival/AJ Styles Vs. Balor Club or some shit. Hell, have Ricochet make a dark match debut against Nakamura or something. The only people paying that money were hardcore enough to know who the fuck he is.

[Evil Vito]

Exactly. The Manhattan Center crowd didn't NEED to see the Barclays stuff. They weren't attempting to tell a cohesive story all night. I figured they'd just basically get a house show that two or three times a night WWE switched over to for a live feed.

[Evil Vito]

Hell, I'd have thrown War Machine vs. Bludgeon Brothers on for the Manhattan Center. They'd have loved it.

[Mr. Nerfect]

The old Raws not having long matches is not really relevant to giving paying customers what they want today. I hope each and every one of them asked for refunds.

[Loose Cannon]

That was a strange show. it was like they put it together yesterday at 6pm est. thank god for Reigns/Miz. but even that i thought went shorter then it should have. that was a pretty big match and it was obvious they just wanted the belt off Reigns to get him to Mania.

I don't know, the whole show was awkward and poorly produced.

[Loose Cannon]

kind of wished the Bullet Club with AJ beat the fuck out of DX to end the Manhattan Center part of the show

[#BROKEN Hasney]

The old Raws not having long matches is not really relevant to giving paying customers what they want today. I hope each and every one of them asked for refunds.

They did chant for refunds, not sure how many formally requested one.

[Rammsteinmad]

I want a refund just for skimming through the videos on the news page. Bloody rip off.

[slik]

Looking back - While I have positive thoughts on Miz winning the IC Title, seeing Austin/Vince and the show ending w/ Braun instead of Roman...overall it was a bit of a disaster, one week after the best RAW I've seen in ages.

I'm not sure why they thought 5 matches split between 2 venues was a good way to please both crowds, but that's the 'E for ya.

[Big Vic]

The old Raws not having long matches is not really relevant to giving paying customers what they want today. I hope each and every one of them asked for refunds.

Should have charged the fans "1st Raw" prices.

[Evil Vito]

If you think the nostalgia shows are bad now, I can't even imagine what they'll be like for the next big one which will be Raw's 1500th episode, Raw's 30th anniversary not long after that.

Yeah, sure...Randy Orton will be showing up to hit the RKO on a mouthy heel as a nostalgia pop, Daniel Bryan will be leading YES chants in backstage comedy skits, there'll be something there.

But, where are the IRSes and the Koko B. Wares of this generation? The midcarders that would be instantly recognizable if they popped up in a Battle Royal ten years down the line - is anyone going to be nostalgic for a Curtis Axel cameo? As great a wrestler as he is, is Cesaro the kind of guy you can give a thirty second cameo after he's retired and get instant recognition?

Beyond that, I think it's also the problem with the lack of roster turnover - particularly in the midcard - over the past ten years (compare the roster in WWE from 2013 to 2018, then look at the difference from, say, 2000 to 2005, or 1996 to 2000, or whatever), so there's very little to get nostalgic about when we've had Kofi Kingston and Dolph Ziggler on TV for ten years straight. How can I miss you if you don't go away?

It also doesn't help that WWE are intent on telling us, at every opportunity, how much better and more important the Attitude era crew are than the current roster. If they're going to make the current roster look like schmucks compared to the old-timers, we're still going to think they're schmucks once they're the old-timers.

[GD]

Even Michelle McCool probably groans when the deadman gets stiff.

Maybe he's not enough for her :shifty:

[Big Vic]

If you think the nostalgia shows are bad now, I can't even imagine what they'll be like for the next big one which will be Raw's 1500th episode, Raw's 30th anniversary not long after that.

Yeah, sure...Randy Orton will be showing up to hit the RKO on a mouthy heel as a nostalgia pop, Daniel Bryan will be leading YES chants in backstage comedy skits, there'll be something there.

But, where are the IRSes and the Koko B. Wares of this generation? The midcarders that would be instantly recognizable if they popped up in a Battle Royal ten years down the line - is anyone going to be nostalgic for a Curtis Axel cameo? As great a wrestler as he is, is Cesaro the kind of guy you can give a thirty second cameo after he's retired and get instant recognition?

Beyond that, I think it's also the problem with the lack of roster turnover - particularly in the midcard - over the past ten years (compare the roster in WWE from 2013 to 2018, then look at the difference from, say, 2000 to 2005, or 1996 to 2000, or whatever), so there's very little to get nostalgic about when we've had Kofi Kingston and Dolph Ziggler on TV for ten years straight. How can I miss you if you don't go away?

It also doesn't help that WWE are intent on telling us, at every opportunity, how much better and more important the Attitude era crew are than the current roster. If they're going to make the current roster look like schmucks compared to the old-timers, we're still going to think they're schmucks once they're the old-timers.

Of all the Male legends that appeared last night I think only one made his debut past 1999 and he's like 50 now.

[Big Vic]

Wait, I forgot MVP was there.

[Simple Fan]

Feel like they should have just did two shows and ran the Manhattan Center show on the Network. The Hardy/Wyatt match over there made sense as the gimmicks are representative of gimmicks of that time. Seems like there was alot of dead time over there though apart from the Taker and DX segments. Should have had a legends battle Royal for a spot in the Royal Rumble but that would have required them to bring in more guys that could have worked. Show overall wasn't all that good or well planned.

[Jordan]

The women used to be so much hotter in WWE. Crazy that all those women are mostly even hotter now.

[Jordan]

Miz and Daniel Bryan could main event a WM if they built it right.

[Jordan]

Roman's entrance for his match is edited out of the Hulu version. I guess he got booed pretty bad.

[Lock Jaw]

kind of wished the Bullet Club with AJ beat the fuck out of DX to end the Manhattan Center part of the show

Whoa, hold on.... they can't make their current stars look better than their old ones, are you nuts?!

[Jordan]

Shawn looked horrible

[Jordan]

The DX shtick and nostalgia is horrible too

[Evil Vito]

The last time Triple H was seen he was a corporate suit and a heel. But "DX" is just a button he can press to magically become face for a night. It's so dumb.

[Jordan]

I am tired of seeing Triple H "perform" especially when he's talking to the "Universe".

[Jordan]

Oh god when Vince dies Triple H is gonna act like him and "receive" the praise of the Universe. And he'll do these quarterly promo's to "fire us up" and remind us "just how far we've come" and "just how far we've yet to go".

[Jordan]

Billy gun looks incredible holy shit. Clearly didn't run his piss through a doctor before showing up here.

[Jordan]

Good lord the years of drug abuse in the clique. And somehow Scott Hall looks better than everyone save Triple H.

[Jordan]

HBK looks so bad. He needs a big time image consultant to hit him up and do some work on his look, it's just really sad.

[SlickyTrickyDamon]

Wait, I forgot MVP was there.

so did the bookers/writers.

[Jordan]

Oh wow watching The Revival vs The Club in this Manhattan Center old school set up is totally like going back in time, amazing.

[Jordan]

With Jr. and King.... this good stuff.

[Jordan]

I think Finn Balor and The Club should turn heel around WM and take on Roman and Cena later in the year.

[Jordan]

Well the tag match was too short to mean anything.

[GD]

I think Finn Balor and The Club should turn heel around WM and take on Roman and Cena later in the year.

Yeah! I am enjoying the fact that Balor's shtick is now not limited to smoldering and adjusting his jacket's collar.

[Simple Fan]

I hate the Balor Club name. Should become Bulletproof or just The Club again.

[Jordan]

Yeah! I am enjoying the fact that Balor's shtick is now not limited to smoldering and adjusting his jacket's collar.

Yeah man, what is it about people who adjust their collar that we all inherently hate?

[GD]

I hate the Balor Club name. Should become Bulletproof or just The Club again.

"The Club" makes sense. Imagine how weird it'd be if Styles got drafted to RAW and he joined "The Balor Club". Not only would it feel odd, he'd drop down a notch on the pecking order, becoming Balor's subordinate.

[#1-norm-fan]

As much as I love HBK and hate having to shit on him for any reason, that "WE AIN'T AS YOUNG AS WE USED TO BE, HARDY HAR HAR!" shtick he does every time he cuts a promo now is SOOOO bad. It's sadder to watch than current era Jerry Lawler on the mic.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Eh, he's just following the scripts. Considering half the show was just a remake of Raw 1000, they rehashed a lot.

[Emperor Smeat]

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/cA_qpimgEi4" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>

[Emperor Smeat]

RAW ended up hitting its highest numbers in almost 3 years. First time in a while it swept the top spots for rankings, all hours were 4+ million, and a massive increase for yearly comparisons.

For some reference, RAW 1000 had around 6 million as its average.

Monday’s 25th anniversary Raw drew an average of 4,530,000 viewers, up from last week’s 3,250,000 viewers.

That’s the highest viewer amount since March 30, 2015 (5,363,667 viewers), which was the night after WrestleMania 31. It’s also the first time Raw has broken an average of 4 million viewers since April 4, 2016 (4,094,000, night after WrestleMania 32) ...

Hourly breakdown:

8PM: 4,803,000
9PM: 4,641,000
10PM: 4,147,000

[#BROKEN Hasney]

Imagine getting that audience at your fingertips for a special event, then presenting that show to try and get them to stick around next week.

Woof.

[#1-norm-fan]

Listening to a Wade Keller clip and brought up the theory that WWE didn't want to do too much from the Manhattan Center on TV because it would make people clicking over think WWE is "small time". Considering how WWE comes off as the most insecure company imaginable at times, I can see that being the case. It's still funny that they did a 2 arena show and didn't plan it out better though.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Listening to a Wade Keller clip and brought up the theory that WWE didn't want to do too much from the Manhattan Center on TV because it would make people clicking over think WWE is "small time". Considering how WWE comes off as the most insecure company imaginable at times, I can see that being the case. It's still funny that they did a 2 arena show and didn't plan it out better though.

That makes sense, until you begin to question why the WWE booked the venue in the first place.

[Mr. Nerfect]

I don't know whether the ratings news is good or bad for the WWE. Is it bad that so many people who gave them a(nother) chance saw such a crappy show? Or is it good that their expectations are going to be low going forward?

[#1-norm-fan]

Well, they went over 6 million with a much better Raw 1000 show in 2012 and we see how well they did at keeping those people around.

[Maluco]

It does show that there is still an audience that enjoys WWE and wants to like it and watch it, but that what they serve up every week just isn't good enough.

Good, exciting TV and those fans are willing to come back I would bet. I am certainly one of them

[#1-norm-fan]

That makes sense, until you begin to question why the WWE booked the venue in the first place.

They probably had the idea and then booked it blindly without any forethought and then scrambled trying to figure out what to do and ended up with a huge clusterfuck. It's a very WWE thing to do.

[#1-norm-fan]

It does show that there is still an audience that enjoys WWE and wants to like it and watch it, but that what they serve up every week just isn't good enough.

Good, exciting TV and those fans are willing to come back I would bet. I am certainly one of them

They promoted it like crazy too. People who watch weekly can have their opinion on whether it was a good Raw or not but it definitely did not live up to the hype for someone who tuned in out of curiosity after seeing it promoted on Fallon or something.

[Savio]

If you were not really a fan but watched last night what would make you want to stick around and continue to watch?

[#1-norm-fan]

Quote from a TPWW "When did you get hooked on wrestling?" thread 20 years from now: "It was the night of the Raw 25th anniversary show. I saw it advertised and tuned in halfway through to see a Titus Worldwide vs Slater and Rhyno match. NEVER LOOKED BACK."

[Emperor Smeat]

I don't know whether the ratings news is good or bad for the WWE. Is it bad that so many people who gave them a(nother) chance saw such a crappy show? Or is it good that their expectations are going to be low going forward?

Probably both to be honest.

Good - WWE can uses this during the bidding wars for the next tv contract to show they have a lot larger pool of viewers than their weekly numbers suggest. Also people are still very interested in past stars which is why WWE still loves to trot them around, especially for Mania.

Bad - WWE likely blew their biggest chance in years to keep those viewers with how terrible the show was in general. Also bad the WWE could end looking at these numbers and think more focus on part-timers is the solution to their problems.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Well, they went over 6 million with a much better Raw 1000 show in 2012 and we see how well they did at keeping those people around.

That's a very good point. It'll be interesting to see the rating next week.

They probably had the idea and then booked it blindly without any forethought and then scrambled trying to figure out what to do and ended up with a huge clusterfuck. It's a very WWE thing to do.

That is true. By applying logic in the first place, I was handicapping myself.

If you were not really a fan but watched last night what would make you want to stick around and continue to watch?

I don't know, truthfully. I mean, the third hour was rated highly. I'm too stupid to figure out why I still even loosely follow though.

Probably both to be honest.

Good - WWE can uses this during the bidding wars for the next tv contract to show they have a lot larger pool of viewers than their weekly numbers suggest. Also people are still very interested in past stars which is why WWE still loves to trot them around, especially for Mania.

Bad - WWE likely blew their biggest chance in years to keep those viewers with how terrible the show was in general. Also bad the WWE could end looking at these numbers and think more focus on part-timers is the solution to their problems.

I see your points, but that rating is not going to matter much come negotiations. They want to get them done sooner rather than later, but if I'm NBC-U, I'm waiting for a while to find out where they're sitting at the end of 2018, and a brief pop for a special show in January isn't going to get me wet.

[Bad News Gertner]

Quote from a TPWW "When did you get hooked on wrestling?" thread 20 years from now: "It was the night of the Raw 25th anniversary show. I saw it advertised and tuned in halfway through to see a Titus Worldwide vs Slater and Rhyno match. NEVER LOOKED BACK."

Lol I lost my shit during this dream match. Slater Gator explodes!

[Mr. Nerfect]

Slater-Gator was the best Titus has ever been.

[Droford]

https://i.imgur.com/iLT1A6gr.jpg

CBS needs a grammar lesson because that makes me think Austin won and stunnered Vince and Taker and whoever Two Sweet is

[Anybody Thrilla]

As a WWE fan, this show pissed me entirely the fuck off.

[Anybody Thrilla]

But I still have a Royal Rumble ticket, so I guess I'll see those assholes in Philly.

[slik]

RAW was pretty shitty this week (outside of Austin/Vince) but I think the Royal Rumble will be good.

[Anybody Thrilla]

Honestly, the shitty Raw may be an added incentive to make the Rumble even BETTER. [/WISHFULTHINKING]

[Evil Vito]

I found it quite odd that they went out of their way to announce that The Miz was in the Rumble, but not Roman despite the fact they were in the process of having a match against one another. Last year it made sense for Roman not to be announced since he was in the Universal Title match earlier in the show, but this year they're just totally downplaying him being involved at all which has me nervous that he's actually going to win.

[Emperor Smeat]

:| Apparently the main reason why RAW 25 was a mess was due to Jimmy Fallon being late to the arena and WWE having a sizeable chunk of the show revolve around him.

Sports Illustrated has learned that much of the Raw 25 anniversary show was rewritten approximately three hours before going live after the creative team learned that Tonight Show host Jimmy Fallon could not arrive at Raw early enough in the day for pre-tapes and segments with many WWE legends.

Plans for backstage segments with Fallon, including the general manager segment, ultimately became introductions and waves to the crowd.

[Anybody Thrilla]

I'm not sure if knowing that makes it better or worse. I've always hated Jimmy Fallon anyway.

[#BROKEN Hasney]

I'm sure Fallon had a very full day prior to Raw

https://media3.giphy.com/media/xT5LMJ3cRNIWnHZJg4/giphy.gif

[Big Vic]

Hmm and I thought it was smart of WWE to only show him in the crowd, didn't realize their plans were different.

[slik]

If the 25th anniversary of RAW would have revolved around Jimmy Fallon that would have made the show even worse.

[Cool King]

• The opening McMahon/Austin segment was actually entertaining.

• The segment with Angle & Co. seemed a bit weird and like it had no real purpose. It was basically "look at all these guys you haven't seen in a while! Remember them?".

• The Undertaker promo was also a bit weird. What was that all about?

• I was pretty happy to see Big Johnny and seeing Regal just reminded me of how much I enjoyed his (depressingly) short run as GM. As for Bischoff, he's beginning to look his age.

• I'm so happy Miz won the title. Reigns did absolutely nothing for that title. The Miz has shown that he can make people care about The Intercontinental Championship and make it interesting.

However, with Regins dropping the title, it just means he's much more likely to with the Royal Rumble match and then win the Universal Championship at WrestleMania.

• I was pretty surprised to see MVP.

I actually wouldn't mind seeing him make a return.

• I get the feeling that The Peep Show was a replacement for The Cutting Edge as Edge couldn't make it.

• Ric Flair is looking old as shit these days.

I'm happy he's still alive though. That's always good.

• I never really cared for the whole Wyatt/Hardy thing but hopefully this is the end of it. It's served its purpose in changing Hardy. Hardy and pretty much everything about it sucked.

• They were pretty damn generous with their use of "some of the greatest female superstars of all time" when you see The Bellas, Kelly Kelly and even Maria there.

Terri was a big surprise however and no Lita was another big surprise.

Also, God Damn how great does Torrie Wilson look?

She must have drank that water that Lita and Beth Phoenix drank during their time there. She looks amazing.

As for Trish, she's like Bischoff, in that she's beginning to look her age.

• I found it Hugh Morris that they actually blacked out Johnny Cash's finger on Elias' shirt.

Why even wear it if it's going to be censored?

I've never really been into Elias since he debuted but I'll try and see what he's all about if his altercation with Cena leads to something between the two.

• The Slater/Dudleys & Co. segment made no sense.

Also, what the fuck is "Dilly Dilly"?

• Oh, DX. Cool. I guess.

The match (which surprisingly was the main event) was a bit rubbish and I'm not really a fan Triple H being all chummy and smarky with Bálor.

In fact, I don't really like it when Triple H is like that with anyone, but he seems to do it a hell of a lot.

• The show overall was pretty much just "look at all these guys you haven't seen in a while! Remember them?", just like the Angle & Co. segment. It was just a pretty bad show. Especially when it comes to The Manhattan Center. I really thought they would have used it more but all we got was two two minute matches and two weird promos.

What was the point of booking The Manhattan Center?

I think this Raw was probably the worst "special" the WWE has ever done. It's certainly a strong contender anyway.