View Full Version : Crown Jewel / Saudi Arabia
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Crown Jewel removed from <a href="https://t.co/07CGuuQYOG">https://t.co/07CGuuQYOG</a> calendar <a href="https://t.co/RpMP3SkaoZ">https://t.co/RpMP3SkaoZ</a> <a href="https://t.co/pTj7WNX3eW">pic.twitter.com/pTj7WNX3eW</a></p>— Wrestling Observer (@WONF4W) <a href="https://twitter.com/WONF4W/status/1051506444283965440?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 14, 2018</a></blockquote>
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DAMN iNATOR
10-14-2018, 01:52 PM
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Crown Jewel removed from <a href="https://t.co/07CGuuQYOG">https://t.co/07CGuuQYOG</a> calendar <a href="https://t.co/RpMP3SkaoZ">https://t.co/RpMP3SkaoZ</a> <a href="https://t.co/pTj7WNX3eW">pic.twitter.com/pTj7WNX3eW</a></p>— Wrestling Observer (@WONF4W) <a href="https://twitter.com/WONF4W/status/1051506444283965440?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 14, 2018</a></blockquote>
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If it means they end up cancelling the show and we don't have to watch DX v. Brothers of Destruction, I'd count that as a win.
Mr. Nerfect
10-15-2018, 05:12 AM
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Crown Jewel removed from <a href="https://t.co/07CGuuQYOG">https://t.co/07CGuuQYOG</a> calendar <a href="https://t.co/RpMP3SkaoZ">https://t.co/RpMP3SkaoZ</a> <a href="https://t.co/pTj7WNX3eW">pic.twitter.com/pTj7WNX3eW</a></p>— Wrestling Observer (@WONF4W) <a href="https://twitter.com/WONF4W/status/1051506444283965440?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 14, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Meltzer and David Bixenspan are both hearing from WWE sources that the event is still scheduled and that this is just an "error." Oh god. The sadist in me hopes they go ahead with this show.
Mr. Nerfect
10-15-2018, 05:14 AM
Vince is such a stubborn prick. This might be one of his biggest public humiliations all because he won't admit this is dumb. Liberals and progressives hate the company for its propaganda, and conservatives are going to hate them because it is unpatriotic. He could seriously piss on everybody with this move.
Meltzer and David Bixenspan are both hearing from WWE sources that the event is still scheduled and that this is just an "error." Oh god. The sadist in me hopes they go ahead with this show.
Vince is such a stubborn prick. This might be one of his biggest public humiliations all because he won't admit this is dumb. Liberals and progressives hate the company for its propaganda, and conservatives are going to hate them because it is unpatriotic. He could seriously piss on everybody with this move.
Calm down, Noid. Your erection is showing.
Mr. Nerfect
10-15-2018, 05:30 AM
Shut up, Dave.
Nicky Fives
10-15-2018, 07:28 AM
Vince is such a stubborn prick. This might be one of his biggest public humiliations all because he won't admit this is dumb. Liberals and progressives hate the company for its propaganda, and conservatives are going to hate them because it is unpatriotic. He could seriously piss on everybody with this move.
Kids under 13 do not give two fucks about politics, only if "The Big Dog" gets to conquer Lesnar & Strowman inside a steel cadge....
Droford
10-15-2018, 08:31 AM
Seems WWE can't catch any real break with their handling of the upcoming Evolution event.
Took them weeks to finally realize Alexa Bliss is not a draw as a big star since ticket sales for the event were very sluggish after her match with Trish was announced. Then the belt maker for the Women's Tag title said he hasn't heard anything definite for plans for the belts status at the event.
Now the rumored NXT UK Women's match for the event might be off because WWE waited way too long to start airing the tapings from the summer. Current champ recently mentioned she hasn't been told of any plans for her at the moment for the event.
Don't even think ticket sales spiked after they announced Nikki Bella as Ronda's opponent for the RAW Women's title match.
1 thing I sorta assumed in regards to Akexa Bliss is that she must still be somewhat injured which is why they made it a tag match
Kids under 13 do not give two fucks about politics, only if "The Big Dog" gets to conquer Lesnar & Strowman inside a steel cadge....
You are correct, they don't care.
Also, WWE's largest viewing demographic is over the age of 50.
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-15-2018, 01:54 PM
Gertner gets a question answered this week on Jim Cornette's Drive-Thru.
Cool King
10-15-2018, 02:10 PM
John Oliver has CENA NUFF of WWE and Saudi Arabia
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Here are the sections about WWE from the feature story about Saudi Arabia on the new “Last Week Tonight with John Oliver” that premiered earlier tonight on HBO. <a href="https://t.co/NNOVgzVftW">pic.twitter.com/NNOVgzVftW</a></p>— David Bixenspan (@davidbix) <a href="https://twitter.com/davidbix/status/1051685815313723392?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 15, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Will there ever be a time where someone doesn't play the "wrestling is gay" card when ridiculing something wrestling related?
Cool King
10-15-2018, 02:11 PM
I actually thought we were living in those times now (and have been for a while) but apparently not.
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-15-2018, 02:13 PM
Joey Ryan bro.
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-15-2018, 02:14 PM
I think only Trump can get them to cancel. He probably got them the deal in the first place so yeah no. It's gonna happen.
Cool King
10-15-2018, 02:15 PM
Joey Ryan bro.
Well that's a gimmick and he isn't exactly ridiculing wrestling, is he?
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-15-2018, 02:20 PM
No but he is giving people who think wrestling is stupid bullets for their arguments.
I actually thought we were living in those times now (and have been for a while) but apparently not.
It would be nice if they didn't.
They seem to play that card w/ MMA now too.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Multiple members of the WWE roster have told SI that they’re uncomfortable with performing in Saudi Arabia—and they should be (by <a href="https://twitter.com/JustinBarrasso?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@JustinBarrasso</a>) <a href="https://t.co/RiT6tgwXy0">https://t.co/RiT6tgwXy0</a></p>— Sports Illustrated (@SInow) <a href="https://twitter.com/SInow/status/1051894244644937729?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 15, 2018</a></blockquote>
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UFC parent company pulls out of deal w/ Saudi Arabia
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">For those unaware, Saudi Arabia was in the process of buying a small minority stake in Endeavor, which happens to be the parent company of the UFC. While ostensibly for less $ for the life of the deal, this is arguably a bigger step than WWE would be taking it they pulled out. <a href="https://t.co/VqgE5EF54y">https://t.co/VqgE5EF54y</a></p>— David Bixenspan (@davidbix) <a href="https://twitter.com/davidbix/status/1051908494952226818?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 15, 2018</a></blockquote>
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I also think there's zero percent chance WWE will pull out of the deal.
Fignuts
10-15-2018, 03:18 PM
No but he is giving people who think wrestling is stupid bullets for their arguments.
Wrestling IS stupid.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Steadfast & Glorious ����<br>Demise is the outcome of these weak endeavors <a href="https://t.co/WBb9yusaE6">pic.twitter.com/WBb9yusaE6</a></p>— Foreign Ministry ���� (@KSAmofaEN) <a href="https://twitter.com/KSAmofaEN/status/1051505106628284417?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 14, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Emperor Smeat
10-15-2018, 04:12 PM
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Multiple members of the WWE roster have told SI that they’re uncomfortable with performing in Saudi Arabia—and they should be (by <a href="https://twitter.com/JustinBarrasso?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@JustinBarrasso</a>) <a href="https://t.co/RiT6tgwXy0">https://t.co/RiT6tgwXy0</a></p>— Sports Illustrated (@SInow) <a href="https://twitter.com/SInow/status/1051894244644937729?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 15, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Considering the recent feud between Saudi Arabia and Canada, could see the Saudis be crazy enough to request WWE's Canadian wrestlers be banned from the event.
Plus you have your Corey Graves and Seth Rollins types that know they will get roasted on social media if they mention anything positive about the event on social media or tv. Same for if they try to act being disgusted since they got ridiculed for their fake outrage last time (Graves with Greatest Rumble, Rollins for Boobygate).
#1-norm-fan
10-15-2018, 06:17 PM
Wrestling IS stupid.
At its core it’s only as stupid as movies, TV or any other form of entertainment.
Now the way it’s currently presented...
Emperor Smeat
10-15-2018, 06:40 PM
If WWE had any slim hope of the Saudi embassy scandal dying down before Crown Jewel occurs, that's pretty much impossible now. Same for the backlash being even greater if they still go ahead with the event.
According to CNN, Saudi government will release an official report soon admitting they killed the dissident journalist. Also going to confirm reports of them luring him into the embassy in order to abduct him from Turkey.
https://twitter.com/CNN/status/1051922561846657025
https://twitter.com/jaketapper/status/1051912600391479298
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-15-2018, 08:26 PM
Will there ever be a time where someone doesn't play the "wrestling is gay" card when ridiculing something wrestling related?
but I mean it's a little gay. It's not a negative.
It’s about the connotation. Calling it “homoerotic” is doing a disservice to the art form.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-15-2018, 09:25 PM
It’s about the connotation. Calling it “homoerotic” is doing a disservice to the art form.
lol but I mean it is homoerotic. Who cares?
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-15-2018, 09:27 PM
I played rugby for 12 years. Homoerotic as fuck. It's not a slight against anyone or anything. You've gotta be v insecure as a fan and unrealistic with yourself if that bothers you in any way.
The joke is "low hanging fruit" I suppose, but really, c'mon... it's right there for the taking.
Mr. Nerfect
10-15-2018, 10:16 PM
Kids under 13 do not give two fucks about politics, only if "The Big Dog" gets to conquer Lesnar & Strowman inside a steel cadge....
Disagree. Kids are not as stupid as people say. They know Roman Reigns is not cool. They know wrestling is not cool. And they do care about politics. They watch the news, either with their parents or without them, and they get a sense of the urgency our world is in.
You are correct, they don't care.
Also, WWE's largest viewing demographic is over the age of 50.
There's also this point. Kids don't watch WWE because of the aforementioned cool factor. It's older fans who fell in love when they were younger and are holding out a candle for hope.
WWE has turned into 1998 WCW.
This is the smartest thing you've said in quite a while. Completely agree. It's not even that the guys are old, it's the emphasis the rudimentary "Here this is," heatless interjection of guys who just have matches because "Hey, hey..." There's no real continuous thread or evolution in the issues.
Gertner gets a question answered this week on Jim Cornette's Drive-Thru.
I loved this week's episode. I can't wait for the Meltzer episode this Thursday.
Well that's a gimmick and he isn't exactly ridiculing wrestling, is he?
Um, well, yeah, he kind of is. He reduces it to a parody of itself, which makes fun of the process of making fun more than it actually has a serious target to critique.
At its core it’s only as stupid as movies, TV or any other form of entertainment.
Now the way it’s currently presented...
Yeah, I hate the phrase "wrestling is stupid." I often think that myself in the sense that it's really not life or death and in the trivial sense that everything is stupid, but in the context of it being this ridiculous pantomime...nah. It can be the art of crowd manipulation through conflict that warrants serious intellectual appreciation and emotional involvement. When it works, wrestling is smarter than its audience and critics.
How often have you seen some bullshit reported by the AP that makes them look like absolute marks? "Oh, they use fake blood," or Jerry Lawler and Jim Carrey work them on the set of the Kaufman movie. They thought Donald Trump actually bought the company at one point.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Multiple members of the WWE roster have told SI that they’re uncomfortable with performing in Saudi Arabia—and they should be (by <a href="https://twitter.com/JustinBarrasso?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@JustinBarrasso</a>) <a href="https://t.co/RiT6tgwXy0">https://t.co/RiT6tgwXy0</a></p>— Sports Illustrated (@SInow) <a href="https://twitter.com/SInow/status/1051894244644937729?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 15, 2018</a></blockquote>
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People always give me shit for saying this, but if I were in the talents' position, I absolutely would not go. I don't think I would work for WWE, to be honest, but damn if you can't have a bit of pride.
I've been very fortunate in my professional life. I can admit that. I've never been starving on the streets, and whenever I've had the chance to weigh up my values over a job, I've always been able to choose my values. I've left places that I can't agree with philosophically, because I knew I could get employment elsewhere. Maybe that's privilege?
But I would absolutely not go on this tour. I wouldn't compromise my own integrity by participating in a propaganda campaign like that. And what are they going to do? Fire me? Okay. I'll go work for New Japan or ROH or something. I'm sure I'd be an internet darling after doing it. But the thing is they're not going to fire anyone, because the PR for that would be disastrous. That's why New Day and Titus O'Neil can speak out about Hogan. As if Vince is going to fire black talent for saying they are uncomfortable working around a racist in 2018 with their image concerns, lol.
Worst case scenario about not going: You get more over.
UFC parent company pulls out of deal w/ Saudi Arabia
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">For those unaware, Saudi Arabia was in the process of buying a small minority stake in Endeavor, which happens to be the parent company of the UFC. While ostensibly for less $ for the life of the deal, this is arguably a bigger step than WWE would be taking it they pulled out. <a href="https://t.co/VqgE5EF54y">https://t.co/VqgE5EF54y</a></p>— David Bixenspan (@davidbix) <a href="https://twitter.com/davidbix/status/1051908494952226818?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 15, 2018</a></blockquote>
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And WWE begin to trail. For a guy who likes to present himself as a man of action, Vince is looking mighty subservient right now.
Ronda also doesn't feel 'special' at all anymore.
They killed that off in less than 6 months.
Ugh, I'm on the fence about this one. Ronda herself is really good. She's got a great game face when she isn't smiling, and it's nice to see someone that can actually punch. She's intense in all the right ways, and she can sell her ass off. They've done the best job they can do with her. But has she really made a difference?
There's the problem of the division around her. You've only got a few women who can be believable in opposition, and the rest of the time she has to spend working with Divas. This has always been a problem with the dynamics of the division. She's heading into a match against Nikki fucking Bella at their PPV. Is she going to be selling for her? That's not going to go over well. They'll be in front of a New York crowd, all of whom have bought tickets probably intending to be "polite" to women's wrestling, but if they peak early, the show is underwhelming, the work is soft, the show is booked poorly, Nikki Bella is given too much star treatment, or they feel that this is golden goosed, they could potentially shit ALL over it. What's that going to do to their psyches?
The crowd is the most interesting element to this upcoming show. But yeah, I'm worried about whether or not Ronda is going to be the star for them they really want her to be.
Will there ever be a time where someone doesn't play the "wrestling is gay" card when ridiculing something wrestling related?
Well, it is quite homoerotic. They haven't caught on to how nerdy it is now. But when comparing it to MMA, it is a bunch of men firing up their testosterone, at least in theory, to explode in a burst of toxic masculinity. It's pretty gay, haha.
It's even weirder when you consider the socialist compount the industry has openly become. Everyone co-operates in such a weird and performative way. It's less suppressed in its homoeroticism, and now embraces almost an actively camp aura.
I played rugby for 12 years. Homoerotic as fuck. It's not a slight against anyone or anything. You've gotta be v insecure as a fan and unrealistic with yourself if that bothers you in any way.
The joke is "low hanging fruit" I suppose, but really, c'mon... it's right there for the taking.
You're stretching a bit, TDO. Considering how informed Oliver's writing staff is, I expect a bit more.
Simple Fan
10-16-2018, 02:15 AM
I don't understand the reasoning behind wanting to cancel the WWE Crown Jewel event. I'm not big on politics but I understand that the most progressive Saudi Arabia has been is when WWE is in town. I don't see why a democracy would look down upon a company from their country trying to work with a country like Saudi Arabia.
Mr. Nerfect
10-16-2018, 02:41 AM
I don't understand the reasoning behind wanting to cancel the WWE Crown Jewel event. I'm not big on politics but I understand that the most progressive Saudi Arabia has been is when WWE is in town. I don't see why a democracy would look down upon a company from their country trying to work with a country like Saudi Arabia.
Because they cut up journalists and cut off women's heads. They're not progressive when WWE is in town. Wtf? They're a country owned by a dictating family that pay WWE to come in and say how great they are basically as a vanity project so they can enter crooked deals with more Americans.
It's not even politics, really. It's common decency. If a murderer pays you $5,000 to say he's great on television, would you do it? If so, get some personal pride.
Mr. Nerfect
10-16-2018, 02:43 AM
A democracy looks down on it because Saudi Arabia isn't a democracy. Women get locked up for expressing themselves and daring to drive. They're a totalitarian regime. Accepting money from them to pretend that they aren't is the cheapest kind of whoring you can do. In terms of ethics.
Simple Fan
10-16-2018, 03:30 AM
Doesn't matter if Saudi Arabia is a democracy or not. The whole point of democracy is to hear everyone's ideas. The people of Saudi Arabia have no control over what their government does so I don't see a reason to punish these people by pulling the show. And yes what I seen from WWE's first event in Saudi Arabia they showed how the country was progressing to let women have more rights.
We kill our own in the US every day so I don't see this Saudi Arabia problem killing a journalist a big deal. Shit happens every day over here. As far as the women go that's their culture and its getting better. I couldn't give a shit about it. If the WWE is going to put on a big show for these people and treat it as a big deal than as a wrestling fan I want to see it.
Emperor Smeat
10-16-2018, 03:41 AM
I don't understand the reasoning behind wanting to cancel the WWE Crown Jewel event. I'm not big on politics but I understand that the most progressive Saudi Arabia has been is when WWE is in town. I don't see why a democracy would look down upon a company from their country trying to work with a country like Saudi Arabia.
Because its all smoke & mirrors and BS marketing considering WWE is being paid to shill propaganda-like videos boasting about it. The general consensus is WWE pretty much does whatever the Saudis want to please them and have no real say in the deal.
In regards to politics, its a huge deal because the Saudis violated a big unwritten rule and international laws regarding the status of embassies. Need to check but don't think even some of the more well known evil regimes in history did something like this before.
Doesn't matter if Saudi Arabia is a democracy or not. The whole point of democracy is to hear everyone's ideas. The people of Saudi Arabia have no control over what their government does so I don't see a reason to punish these people by pulling the show. And yes what I seen from WWE's first event in Saudi Arabia they showed how the country was progressing to let women have more rights.
We kill our own in the US every day so I don't see this Saudi Arabia problem killing a journalist a big deal. Shit happens every day over here. As far as the women go that's their culture and its getting better. I couldn't give a shit about it. If the WWE is going to put on a big show for these people and treat it as a big deal than as a wrestling fan I want to see it.
Dear Simple Fan, they're using WWE's "global reach" for propaganda. I understand that you're a fan and would love to see the event. Knock yourself out. Please don't attempt to justify it by comparing the United States to Saudi Arabia. That's just wrong (on so many levels). We are lightyears ahead of them in almost all aspects of society and rights. The working class is treated as slaves FFS.
Simple Fan
10-16-2018, 03:48 AM
It's still a great deal for WWE and I don't see this as a reason to pass that up. Yeah it's all propaganda but if you're not used to that with today's media than you are doing pretty well. I could care less what goes on in Saudi Arabia unless it's a WWE event.
Simple Fan
10-16-2018, 03:50 AM
Alot of people ignore the problems in the United States when they're given something like this in another country to worry about. You're being worked by the media to ignore what's really important.
WWE's incentive is money. You can spin it however you want. Whatever helps you sleep at night.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-16-2018, 07:41 AM
You're stretching a bit, TDO. Considering how informed Oliver's writing staff is, I expect a bit more.
shut the fuck up, Dave.
shut the fuck up, Dave.
Nah man, I think I've given you more time than you deserve. Calling me out for being insecure or unrealistic because some idiot on the writing staff decided to make a lazy joke about pro-wrestling being "homoerotic". You completely disregarded a legit point because of my past transgressions. You are pathetic, TDO. Also, you don't need to remind how fucked up I am. I am very aware of it.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-16-2018, 08:02 AM
Pro wrestling is homo erotic. You fucking knob.
Pro wrestling is homo erotic. You fucking knob.
That is your opinion, dipshit. It's not a fact. It's about you going above and beyond to defend a pathetic attempt at humor. It's cringeworthy in 2018.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-16-2018, 08:48 AM
Why are you taking me characterizing wrestling as homoerotic as an insult? It isn't an insult. It's the truth. I don't watch it because of that (OR DO I), but it's two oiled up men in their underpants, in a business largely based on aesthetics rolling around with one another. It's just like how women's beach volleyball is very sexual even though I'm sure volleyball purists watch it for the athletic display.
I just think wrestling fans get very butt hurt about these things. Why would you be offended about someone calling wrestling homoerotic? As I said, it isn't an insult. He didn't even say it as an insult. Your own preconceived notions and sensitivities left you feeling that way. Maybe you just need to get the pacifier out of your mouth and grow up.
Cool King
10-16-2018, 09:20 AM
For the record, I wasn't offended by the joke.
I just thought we were past the stage of calling wrestling gay for a cheap laugh. Kinda like how we all used to call each other gay as a joke and I've been seeing it a lot on signs during my 2002 watching on the network.
There's a lot of signs with someone's name on it and then "is gay" after it but you don't get that anymore. I haven't heard a "wrestling is gay" joke for ages now and I just thought that nobody made those jokes anymore.
Cool King
10-16-2018, 09:20 AM
But yeah, wrestling can be kinda gay at times.
Cool King
10-16-2018, 09:22 AM
Also, I'm sure the Saudi's have paid Simple Fan.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-16-2018, 09:33 AM
FTR I know you weren't offended King. I was specifically directing my lambasting towards Dave.
But in regards to what you were saying... wrestling is actually gay. It's not the same as me saying "Hey Cool King, you're gay because your mom packs your lunch". That isn't gay, that's using 'gay' as a negative and implying being gay is somehow a bad thing. And wrestling's rampant homoeroticisim is easy to laugh at because it's so latent while trying to disguise itself behind a veil of machismo-infused hetero-sexuality.
The joke itself wasn't even to highlight how gay wrestling is, it was to actually to highlight how deep in the Saudi's pockets they are.
Simple Fan
10-16-2018, 09:40 AM
I wish, Im just don't think the show should be cancelled because of a dead journalist.
Cool King
10-16-2018, 10:32 AM
I don't think it's because he's dead.
I think it's all got to do with the way he died. If he died because of a heart attack or something, nobody would care.
He died because the Saudi government actually went out of their way to have him killed. He was interrogated, tortured and then killed. His body was then cut up into pieces and removed from the Saudi consulate.
Saudi Arabia are trying to portray themselves as this progressive nation but progressive nations don't hunt down and kill their own people when they don't like what those people say.
That is why people want the event canceled, because the WWE are getting paid by the Saudi government to basically tell the world how great Saudi Arabia is even though it's quite clearly not because they're hunting their people down and killing them (and in this case, also breaking International Law to do so).
If the WWE do go ahead with the event, some people may see it as the WWE advocating those previously mentioned actions.
Innovator
10-16-2018, 10:37 AM
FTR I know you weren't offended King. I was specifically directing my lambasting towards Dave.
But in regards to what you were saying... wrestling is actually gay. It's not the same as me saying "Hey Cool King, you're gay because your mom packs your lunch". That isn't gay, that's using 'gay' as a negative and implying being gay is somehow a bad thing. And wrestling's rampant homoeroticisim is easy to laugh at because it's so latent while trying to disguise itself behind a veil of machismo-infused hetero-sexuality.
The joke itself wasn't even to highlight how gay wrestling is, it was to actually to highlight how deep in the Saudi's pockets they are.
Dudes shave their bodies, oil them up to listen, get a pump before grappling each other and trying to make the other submit to their will
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-16-2018, 10:56 AM
Dudes shave their bodies, oil them up to listen, get a pump before grappling each other and trying to make the other submit to their will
that's just like your opinion, man.
Vice covering #CancelCrownJewel now too
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">WWE's Saudi Arabia nightmare. <a href="https://t.co/pTDwUR5C2Z">https://t.co/pTDwUR5C2Z</a></p>— VICE (@VICE) <a href="https://twitter.com/VICE/status/1052206127193178112?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 16, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Triple A
10-16-2018, 02:48 PM
Moved the Saudi Arabia stuff to its own thread (from 101k replies) because there are a lot of posts and it is a "major topic"
Why are you taking me characterizing wrestling as homoerotic as an insult? It isn't an insult. It's the truth. I don't watch it because of that (OR DO I), but it's two oiled up men in their underpants, in a business largely based on aesthetics rolling around with one another. It's just like how women's beach volleyball is very sexual even though I'm sure volleyball purists watch it for the athletic display.
I just think wrestling fans get very butt hurt about these things. Why would you be offended about someone calling wrestling homoerotic? As I said, it isn't an insult. He didn't even say it as an insult. Your own preconceived notions and sensitivities left you feeling that way. Maybe you just need to get the pacifier out of your mouth and grow up.
I see that you went back to middle school to fetch that insult. "Homoerotic" wasn't used as a term of endearment. The connotation was blatant. I expect a lot more from them. It was a lame attempt at humor and not something that deserves to be dignified in 2018.
#1-norm-fan
10-16-2018, 04:19 PM
Gotta agree with Dave here. Regardless of how anyone took it, he clearly MEANT it as an insult. That was the whole joke. It wasn't just a passing reference to wrestling's homo-eroticism. It was "LOL Wrestling's gay! Now let's all have a laugh about it, audience!"
Now... how offended you wanna be about it is up to you. But the context was clear.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-16-2018, 07:14 PM
I mean it's a joke about its latent homoerotocism, but that doesn't mean it's an insult. And tbh it was a pretty funny joke particularly as an analogy.
#1-norm-fan
10-16-2018, 08:34 PM
Alright, now we’re definitely gonna disagree. He basically said “WWE likes Saudi Arabia as much it’s gay!” A 12 year old could have written that. Lol
Not gonna give him credit for saying it slightly more eloquently.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-17-2018, 09:57 AM
Not gonna give him credit for saying it slightly more eloquently.
It's all about the delivery and the spin and is largely why Jon Oliver is funny. You can call the material uninspired (I even called it low hanging fruit in one of my posts) but I laughed because it's pretty hilarious how gay wrestling is. Largely due to the "tough guy/ hetero" narrative it tries to portray contrasted with how absolutely over the top and "camp" it is. I mean there's only ever been Darren Young who was gay and a babyface and there was never a storyline about his bravery for coming out. Whereas every other gay character has been a predatory heel who fans booed due to their perceived "gayness".
Then on top of that, wrestling fans (not saying you) lose their shit when you call it gay.
I don't see what's so hard to understand about that. I wonder if LPGA fans get annoyed when people discuss its association with lesbians.
My point, is similar to literally everyone I played rugby with, we embrace the latent homoeroticism. It's one of the many things that make wrestling particularly quirky. Never mind the amount jobber squash fetish channels on Youtube.
#1-norm-fan
10-17-2018, 10:49 AM
The John Cena “You can’t see me” joke after was pretty cringeworthy, too. I’m more offended by the bad comedy than anything.
Also I think you’re adding your own spin to make it funny. You know about Goldust and Darren Young and wrestling’s history of preying on gay stereotypes. I highly doubt he was going any deeper than “lol sweaty men grappling. GAYYYYY.” He was mad at WWE for being pro Saudi Arabia and needed to burn them and that was his way of doing it. By insulting it for being homoerotic. Lol
Low-hanging fruit isn’t necessarily a bad thing. Just... put a new twist on it.
#1-norm-fan
10-17-2018, 10:53 AM
And I’m sure there are plenty of LPGA fans and even more golfers who get upset when someone makes a joke about it being for lesbians.
Big Vic
10-17-2018, 11:05 AM
TDO called Steve Buscemi 'fucking ugly' then tried to explain to him that it wasn't an insult because it's true.
#1-norm-fan
10-17-2018, 11:10 AM
:lol:
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-17-2018, 11:13 AM
The John Cena “You can’t see me” joke after was pretty cringeworthy, too. I’m more offended by the bad comedy than anything.
Also I think you’re adding your own spin to make it funny. You know about Goldust and Darren Young and wrestling’s history of preying on gay stereotypes. I highly doubt he was going any deeper than “lol sweaty men grappling. GAYYYYY.” He was mad at WWE for being pro Saudi Arabia and needed to burn them and that was his way of doing it. By insulting it for being homoerotic. Lol
Low-hanging fruit isn’t necessarily a bad thing. Just... put a new twist on it.
Not really. I can use specific examples because I'm a wrestling fan, but it is a form of entertainment so laden in machismo it is naturally funny to consider how homoerotic it is. That's not to say you can't display lots of machismo and be flagrantly homosexual, but our initial bias/preconception is to see the funny contrast. Like... from what I've garnered, most outsiders think "look at these big sweaty 'tough men' pretending to beat one another up, but really they just want to touch one another."
It's the same with most sports tbh.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-17-2018, 11:14 AM
TDO called Steve Buscemi 'fucking ugly' then tried to explain to him that it wasn't an insult because it's true.
"fucking ugly" is a negative descriptor. Homoerotic is not.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">“Don’t kill journalists” <a href="https://t.co/cI8TvxpdHs">https://t.co/cI8TvxpdHs</a></p>— DavKind (@DavKind76) <a href="https://twitter.com/DavKind76/status/1052536443296509952?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 17, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-17-2018, 11:16 AM
Me calling Big Vic a dumb mongoloid however is an insult, but is also the truth :cool:
Big Vic
10-17-2018, 11:33 AM
Ok, beta-cuck. (Not an insult, just an observation)
Tonya Harding
10-17-2018, 11:33 AM
Ok, beta-cuck. (Not an insult, just an observation)
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-17-2018, 11:35 AM
Ok, beta-cuck. (Not an insult, just an observation)
Mine was better. TRY AGAIN
Big Vic
10-17-2018, 11:36 AM
Do you think Boxing and UFC is homoerotic too?
Tonya Harding
10-17-2018, 11:37 AM
What about Figure Skating?
Big Vic
10-17-2018, 11:39 AM
That's the best insult you can come up with for me, mongoloid?
Someone is trying to frame me of being Tonya Harding
Tonya Harding
10-17-2018, 11:40 AM
Stop framing me.
Big Vic
10-17-2018, 11:43 AM
Sorry Slik
Tonya Harding
10-17-2018, 11:44 AM
Sorry Slik
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-17-2018, 12:19 PM
Do you think Boxing and UFC is homoerotic too?
UFC is. Boxing not so much.
Big Vic
10-17-2018, 01:23 PM
2 shirtless men hugging:
https://i2.wp.com/extremestrikers.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Boxing-clinch.jpg?resize=300%2C207
#1-norm-fan
10-17-2018, 01:50 PM
Such a loving look in Pacquiaos eyes, too. Definitely wants to go further but he knows society isn’t ready yet.
xrodmuc316
10-17-2018, 03:55 PM
I love when PC conflicts with PC. If dude just called somebody gay there would be protests and boycotts calling for his job. But calling something gay as a way to push a PC agenda like "how could WWE still do business with Saudis after what they did, I mean we already know they are gay but come on!" and suddenly it's cool.
Saudis kill a journalist, and everybody should just exclude the whole country from everything, and you are a monster if you dont. But the President says he doesn't want refugees cause a few terrorist posed as refugees, and he is pure evil. It's all about spinning a story.
It's like that lady who called the police on the kid for what she thought was him grabbing her ass. She would have been a #metoo #timesup hero if it wasn't for who she called the police on, but she failed to realize a white woman calling police on a black person is more offensive than a woman being sexually assualted. End result, she gets mocked with cute nicknames and has to apologize.
Swiss Ultimate
10-17-2018, 04:12 PM
Vince is such a stubborn prick. This might be one of his biggest public humiliations all because he won't admit this is dumb. Liberals and progressives hate the company for its propaganda, and conservatives are going to hate them because it is unpatriotic. He could seriously piss on everybody with this move.
lol, conservative are going to what now?
Tonya Harding
10-17-2018, 04:48 PM
2 shirtless men hugging:
https://i2.wp.com/extremestrikers.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/Boxing-clinch.jpg?resize=300%2C207
Cool King
10-17-2018, 05:35 PM
Notice how Mayweather is pushing the referee away from the hug?
Only shirtless men can hug in boxing.
Mr. Nerfect
10-17-2018, 06:34 PM
Doesn't matter if Saudi Arabia is a democracy or not. The whole point of democracy is to hear everyone's ideas. The people of Saudi Arabia have no control over what their government does so I don't see a reason to punish these people by pulling the show. And yes what I seen from WWE's first event in Saudi Arabia they showed how the country was progressing to let women have more rights.
We kill our own in the US every day so I don't see this Saudi Arabia problem killing a journalist a big deal. Shit happens every day over here. As far as the women go that's their culture and its getting better. I couldn't give a shit about it. If the WWE is going to put on a big show for these people and treat it as a big deal than as a wrestling fan I want to see it.
That is exactly the problem. WWE is showing this place as a progressive regime when it really fucking isn't. I read a thing about a woman (the woman?) they got to appear actually being put in prison for expressing herself. They are spreading these false messages to cover up human rights abuses. That's what's so egregious about this. I honestly didn't care when they just ran a show. I didn't care when they run China despite that being a complicated nation. It's the fucking disgusting fact they call it "progressive" and brainwash marks like you into placation so they can behead more women.
The US's problems are many, but what the fuck does that have to do with what we're talking about? It's a straw-man to marginalize the regimented evil in Saudi Arabia. It's irrelevant.
It's still a great deal for WWE and I don't see this as a reason to pass that up. Yeah it's all propaganda but if you're not used to that with today's media than you are doing pretty well. I could care less what goes on in Saudi Arabia unless it's a WWE event.
Then you, sir, are a cunt.
And on a further point about "everybody does it, so what's the big deal?", the thing about this is that almost every other entertainment property and many big businesses have actually pulled the fuck out, because they know how toxic this is. So no, not everybody is doing it. WWE is, which is the point -- not what happens in the US.
Alot of people ignore the problems in the United States when they're given something like this in another country to worry about. You're being worked by the media to ignore what's really important.
No one is ignoring the problems in the United States. Wtf? You can care about two things simultaneously. And the statement "what's really important" is incredibly disgusting. The issues in Saudi Arabia are very important. Fuck you.
Gotta agree with Dave here. Regardless of how anyone took it, he clearly MEANT it as an insult. That was the whole joke. It wasn't just a passing reference to wrestling's homo-eroticism. It was "LOL Wrestling's gay! Now let's all have a laugh about it, audience!"
Now... how offended you wanna be about it is up to you. But the context was clear.
I get what you're saying here. It was a little cringe in terms of delivery. It's just that he isn't wrong, haha.
The John Cena “You can’t see me” joke after was pretty cringeworthy, too. I’m more offended by the bad comedy than anything.
Also I think you’re adding your own spin to make it funny. You know about Goldust and Darren Young and wrestling’s history of preying on gay stereotypes. I highly doubt he was going any deeper than “lol sweaty men grappling. GAYYYYY.” He was mad at WWE for being pro Saudi Arabia and needed to burn them and that was his way of doing it. By insulting it for being homoerotic. Lol
Low-hanging fruit isn’t necessarily a bad thing. Just... put a new twist on it.
I don't disagree that it wasn't funny. There is an amazingly barbed rant about WWE's hypocrisy and their history of disgusting promotional tactics. I'm not a big fan of John Oliver, honestly, or the left-wing "let's take easy shots at the dumb Republicans" comedy. It's like shooting fish in a barrel and it often feels like punching down. I wouldn't defend it as a sterling example of wit.
I think what is telling about it is that even with his comedians and research teams, and all the press WWE is getting in regards to this deal, people still don't give a fuck about WWE enough to dig beneath the surface and actually probe them for the insightful stuff. There's an amazing take-down piece on WWE and how they run ship waiting to happen, but no one with brains is going to waste them on this company, which is why they've gotten away with shit for so long, haha.
I love when PC conflicts with PC. If dude just called somebody gay there would be protests and boycotts calling for his job. But calling something gay as a way to push a PC agenda like "how could WWE still do business with Saudis after what they did, I mean we already know they are gay but come on!" and suddenly it's cool.
Saudis kill a journalist, and everybody should just exclude the whole country from everything, and you are a monster if you dont. But the President says he doesn't want refugees cause a few terrorist posed as refugees, and he is pure evil. It's all about spinning a story.
It's like that lady who called the police on the kid for what she thought was him grabbing her ass. She would have been a #metoo #timesup hero if it wasn't for who she called the police on, but she failed to realize a white woman calling police on a black person is more offensive than a woman being sexually assualted. End result, she gets mocked with cute nicknames and has to apologize.
It's not PC contradicting PC. It's not that Oliver was saying that being gay is a bad thing. The perception about wrestling is that it's full of men that are afraid of the idea of being gay (not true, but again, no one cares enough to follow), so it's calling them out on the latent homosexuality. It's like when a super-conservative gets caught having a gay affair in a bathroom stall. There's nothing wrong with being gay, it's the hypocrisy of guys going around acting like "men" and then being idiosyncratically what they pretend to be the opposite of.
If the audience saw it as an anti-gay slur, they wouldn't have laughed and Oliver would have gotten heat for it. It probably wouldn't have made the air. They think about these jokes. The joke was not at the expense of being gay, it was at the expense of wrestling. That being said, I do think jokes about latent homosexuality are passe, easy and off in their aim anyway. And it is far more applicable to wrestling two or three decades ago -- back when it was culturally relevant. The writers were probably thinking about Randy Savage, Hulk Hogan and Ultimate Warrior more than they were thinking about Seth Rollins and Dean Ambrose.
The rest of your post doesn't really make sense to me, haha. They're completely separate issues. Not doing business with an oppressive regime and not accepting refugees from those regimes are actually opposite issues. I don't see a contradiction there at all. And I'm not that familiar with the story about the kid and the woman beyond the headline, but from what I read her statement was based on fear and prejudice? I don't really want to get into that, but it sounds like you're making some massive sweeping generalizations there that don't accurately reflect the issues.
Droford
10-17-2018, 07:11 PM
I'll break this down to the simplest thing you need to know.
If Donald Trump wasn't best buddies with Vince the media wouldn't give a fuck about the WWE running a show in Saudi Arabia.
xrodmuc316
10-17-2018, 08:32 PM
Noid, your post is too long to quote, but droford got my point. Everything gets spun to fit a narrative that is desired.
I just find humor in the hypocrisy of the guy trying to get on his high horse while at the same time taking a cheap shot.
Emperor Smeat
10-17-2018, 09:06 PM
I'll break this down to the simplest thing you need to know.
If Donald Trump wasn't best buddies with Vince the media wouldn't give a fuck about the WWE running a show in Saudi Arabia.
I disagree because of the sheer amount of companies pulling out of their Saudi deals since the embassy scandal went down. Makes the WWE look a lot worse by comparison for still trying to hold the event and their unwillingness to make a real public statement on the issue.
They'd be getting the same negative reception even if Vince didn't have any personal connections to Trump.
Mr. Nerfect
10-17-2018, 09:19 PM
I disagree because of the sheer amount of companies pulling out of their Saudi deals since the embassy scandal went down. Makes the WWE look a lot worse by comparison for still trying to hold the event and their unwillingness to make a real public statement on the issue.
They'd be getting the same negative reception even if Vince didn't have any personal connections to Trump.
Yeah, I agree with this. They're covering a lot of companies that aren't at all affiliated with Trump.
xrodmuc316
10-17-2018, 10:25 PM
Yeah, I agree with this. They're covering a lot of companies that aren't at all affiliated with Trump.
Incorrect, Trump hates Amazon, he is always complaining about them for no reason.
Amazon not only sells to Saudi Arabia, they have their version of Amazon.com, called souq.
Nobody is calling out Amazon.
Do I think WWE should promote how great Saudi Arabia is, hell no, even before all this.
But because of Trump, Linda McMahon, the WWE HOF, all that intermixing, WWE is getting the heat. A big part of it is because Trump likes their money and selling them weapons, so this is a way to protest that after what happened.
If Trump was dead set against America working with Saudi Arabia, WWE would get praise for standing up to Trump by the same people who are mad at them now.
Emperor Smeat
10-17-2018, 10:48 PM
If Trump was dead set against America working with Saudi Arabia, WWE would get praise for standing up to Trump by the same people who are mad at them now.
That legit makes no sense. Why would WWE get praised for siding with the regime involved in the embassy murder. People are made at the WWE because they don't buy the "progress" excuse and WWE trying to sneakily go ahead with the event. Even WWE's shareholders are not entirely in all praise for the Saudi deal since WWE refuses to let them know the exact details of it.
If anything, it would lead to even more backlash and get rid of any pretext of them being with the Saudis for non-monetary reasons. They'd also be opening themselves to potentially serious legal repercussions if the US were to pass sanctions.
Swiss Ultimate
10-17-2018, 10:53 PM
I played rugby for 12 years. Homoerotic as fuck. It's not a slight against anyone or anything. You've gotta be v insecure as a fan and unrealistic with yourself if that bothers you in any way.
The joke is "low hanging fruit" I suppose, but really, c'mon... it's right there for the taking.
Does it make you tingle?
xrodmuc316
10-18-2018, 01:35 AM
That legit makes no sense. Why would WWE get praised for siding with the regime involved in the embassy murder. People are made at the WWE because they don't buy the "progress" excuse and WWE trying to sneakily go ahead with the event. Even WWE's shareholders are not entirely in all praise for the Saudi deal since WWE refuses to let them know the exact details of it.
If anything, it would lead to even more backlash and get rid of any pretext of them being with the Saudis for non-monetary reasons. They'd also be opening themselves to potentially serious legal repercussions if the US were to pass sanctions.
No no no. Nothing to do with the regime or supporting it.
My point is regardless of the situation, the media will spin it and make it about hating Trump.
If WWE could not be tied to Trump, it would not be such an issue. If they were against Trump, the same media would spin WWE in a positive light for going against Trump.
That is all I am saying. Nothing political or a moral stand, just that WWEs portrayal in this story is skewed by the media's hatred for Trump.
WWE going would be a bad move in my opinion either way, but the level of anger and disgust toward them by the high horse media would be far less if WWE was not seen as "Trump Friendly".
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-18-2018, 01:40 AM
No no no. Nothing to do with the regime or supporting it.
My point is regardless of the situation, the media will spin it and make it about hating Trump.
If WWE could not be tied to Trump, it would not be such an issue. If they were against Trump, the same media would spin WWE in a positive light for going against Trump.
That is all I am saying. Nothing political or a moral stand, just that WWEs portrayal in this story is skewed by the media's hatred for Trump.
WWE going would be a bad move in my opinion either way, but the level of anger and disgust toward them by the high horse media would be far less if WWE was not seen as "Trump Friendly".
Trump's son-in-law has a lot to do with US/Saudi relations. Trump is fully supportive of WWE in this for now.
Mr. Nerfect
10-18-2018, 01:58 AM
No, the media would not be praising WWE for going if Trump were against it, lol.
Emperor Smeat
10-18-2018, 01:59 AM
No no no. Nothing to do with the regime or supporting it.
My point is regardless of the situation, the media will spin it and make it about hating Trump.
If WWE could not be tied to Trump, it would not be such an issue. If they were against Trump, the same media would spin WWE in a positive light for going against Trump.
That is all I am saying. Nothing political or a moral stand, just that WWEs portrayal in this story is skewed by the media's hatred for Trump.
WWE going would be a bad move in my opinion either way, but the level of anger and disgust toward them by the high horse media would be far less if WWE was not seen as "Trump Friendly".
But they haven't really done so. Most of the discussion involving Trump and WWE revolves around if Trump talked to Vince, maybe WWE would be more likely to cancel or move the event.
Since Trump seems to be of the mindset that it is unfair people are blaming the Saudis, chances of WWE doing anything themselves are slim to none.
WWE would still be catching a ton of heat even if they never had any involvement with or were hated by Trump. In a way, WWE brought this to themselves with their constant and unashamed PR blabber about being a driver of progress for women's wrestling.
Pretty much night & day of how WWE was treated for an event in the UAE I believe when it came to women's wrestling. The government didn't ban it because of ultra conservative religious reasons and WWE's women wrestlers wore full body gear as an acceptable compromise.
Mr. Nerfect
10-18-2018, 01:59 AM
You're putting the cart before the horse there. People are upset becaus of Saudi Arabia's human rights abuses and the corruption of the regime. If the regime is corrupt because of Trump, sure, they might be mad at Trump too, but the terms aren't conditional based on that. It's because Saudi Arabia is a shitty, shitty place that does shitty, shitty things to its people.
xrodmuc316
10-18-2018, 03:07 AM
You're putting the cart before the horse there. People are upset becaus of Saudi Arabia's human rights abuses and the corruption of the regime. If the regime is corrupt because of Trump, sure, they might be mad at Trump too, but the terms aren't conditional based on that. It's because Saudi Arabia is a shitty, shitty place that does shitty, shitty things to its people.
Correct, but Trumps response to this incident, and the comments he made which are so absurd, saying about he wants their money so it doesn't go to Russia and rouge hit squads, that the media is pushing back against all things Saudi, including Crown Jewel.
WWE should have bailed from the deal after the Saudis were upset about Carmella in a promotional video and Davari got death threats after the GRR.
Innovator
10-18-2018, 10:44 AM
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">People should step up and fight injustice and if they won’t I will. I’ll come out and say it. Hey Fin Baylor your dick is way too prominent man put it away</p>— Chuck Taylor (@SexyChuckieT) <a href="https://twitter.com/SexyChuckieT/status/1052796948929896449?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 18, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Mr. Nerfect
10-18-2018, 11:47 PM
Correct, but Trumps response to this incident, and the comments he made which are so absurd, saying about he wants their money so it doesn't go to Russia and rouge hit squads, that the media is pushing back against all things Saudi, including Crown Jewel.
WWE should have bailed from the deal after the Saudis were upset about Carmella in a promotional video and Davari got death threats after the GRR.
Okay, but Trump's response and WWE's response are both awful. I don't think they need to be causally linked. And yeah, WWE should have bailed from the deal earlier. Hell, they shouldn't have made it.
Droford
10-22-2018, 01:33 PM
the Rock is in trouble for having dinner with the Prince (https://www.mediaite.com/online/the-rock-calls-out-cnns-oliver-darcy-for-pointing-out-his-dinner-with-saudi-crown-prince/)
To be fair a bunch of famous people had dinner with him too
Triple A
10-22-2018, 01:40 PM
Good... was an embarrassing post by The Rock
Triple A
10-22-2018, 01:46 PM
Dude is totally right
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">You had dinner with a brutal authoritarian, playing a role in his PR campaign to convince the West that he was, as you’d say, someone with “modern views.” Then you gushed about it on social media. Ppl look up to you. Do you regret giving him a platform? Has your opinion changed? <a href="https://t.co/yPHazTLIRt">https://t.co/yPHazTLIRt</a></p>— Oliver Darcy (@oliverdarcy) <a href="https://twitter.com/oliverdarcy/status/1053671765082341378?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 20, 2018</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Triple A
10-22-2018, 01:47 PM
But yeah basically like 75% of the world's most famous / powerful people did the same thing
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-22-2018, 01:49 PM
Rock might have just been misinformed. Dude is trying to blow up his spot for clicks.
Simple Fan
10-22-2018, 01:50 PM
I see nothing wrong with his post. If being a nice person and listening to other's views is embarrassing then that's pretty sad. That's what America is all about but people don't like to listen to views they don't share anymore.
Triple A
10-22-2018, 01:50 PM
All of the famous people who did PR for Saudi Arabia should be criticized for it
Why should he be exempt from criticism?
A reporter is asking him to follow up to see if his thoughts have changed.
Triple A
10-22-2018, 01:52 PM
I see nothing wrong with his post. If being a nice person and listening to other's views is embarrassing then that's pretty sad. That's what America is all about but people don't like to listen to views they don't share anymore.
Doing propaganda for a mass murdering dictator to your millions of fans isn't just "being a nice person and listening to other people's views"
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-22-2018, 01:53 PM
All of the famous people who did PR for Saudi Arabia should be criticized for it
Why should he be exempt from criticism?
A reporter is asking him to follow up to see if his thoughts have changed.
They can be criticized but there's likely a much better way to go about it than shaming him on social media.
Swiss Ultimate
10-22-2018, 01:54 PM
The Rock will be the next President after Trump probably.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-22-2018, 01:54 PM
Keep in mind, they could have just drank the kool-aid and thought the dude was actually "progressive" only to later realize otherwise.
Simple Fan
10-22-2018, 02:12 PM
Doing propaganda for a mass murdering dictator to your millions of fans isn't just "being a nice person and listening to other people's views"
You say he's a mass murdering dictator, I don't know about that.
Sepholio
10-22-2018, 05:00 PM
…….You can't be serious.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">WWE Crown Jewel could be in trouble.<br><br>I was just told Reigns is currently injured and that Cena and Bryan are "refusing" to work the show. Many on the current WWE roster have expressed concerned with going, as well, but obviously not all of them have the power like Cena/Bryan.</p>— Robbie Fox (@RobbieBarstool) <a href="https://twitter.com/RobbieBarstool/status/1054445652011302912?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 22, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Emperor Smeat
10-22-2018, 05:16 PM
Keep in mind, they could have just drank the kool-aid and thought the dude was actually "progressive" only to later realize otherwise.
Highly doubt it or else they would have no problem pulling out of the deal by now. If they actually thought they were conned or played, the embassy scandal gave them the perfect excuse to pull out while saving face.
Between what's been reported about the deal and their own actions, WWE comes off as only caring about the money and having no issue sprouting whatever message the Saudis want put out.
More sites starting to report Cena/Dbry have told WWE they aren't working Crown Jewel and Roman being injured for a few weeks
xrodmuc316
10-22-2018, 05:29 PM
…….You can't be serious.
Technically he isn't a dictator, he is the son of a dictator lol
xrodmuc316
10-22-2018, 05:57 PM
More sites starting to report Cena/Dbry have told WWE they aren't working Crown Jewel and Roman being injured for a few weeks
I would not be surprised if WWE simply tapes their matches elsewhere and use tricky editing cuts to appear they are actually there. Close ups on the action, spliced in shots of the audience at Saudi Arabia, then back to the pretaped match.
They might also do something where Bryan gets an injury angle, and Joe takes his spot in the match.
Cena is easy, they could just say he forfeit's his match in the American Cup.
Roman being injured also doesn't really matter in a triple threat. They can hide/work around that.
In the end good for Bryan and Cena for not compromising their morals if the story is true about them refusing to go. It is nothing but a cash grab.
I think too as a fan, this doesn't feel like the last show thanks to the last show. GRR felt like it was gonna be a HUGE event, then it ended up being a worthless house show. No title changes, no storylines, bell even the actual GRR meant nothing, Braun didn't get anything from winning other than a green title that has never been used since. No title shots, they don't even mention it on tv.
My point is I would not be upset one bit if they cancelled it, because it just isn't important, and with it not being important all that is left is being offended WWE is willing to overlook everything for maybe $45 Million. Which by the way, WWE as a company is worth roughly $6.5 Billion, so we are talking about them overlooking horrific things to make less than 1% of their total value.
Simple Fan
10-22-2018, 07:08 PM
…….You can't be serious.
Oh I'm serious, I don't know anything about the guy so I'm not going to pass judgment just because the media says he's a bad guy. I have nothing against Saudi Arabia or how they run their country either.
Oh I'm serious, I don't know anything about the guy so I'm not going to pass judgment just because the media says he's a bad guy. I have nothing against Saudi Arabia or how they run their country either.
Hm, you really ARE simple.
Sepholio
10-22-2018, 08:34 PM
Oh I'm serious, I don't know anything about the guy so I'm not going to pass judgment just because the media says he's a bad guy. I have nothing against Saudi Arabia or how they run their country either.
LOL. Who has to say he's a bad guy before you'll pass judgement? Who has to tell you that Saudi Arabia is among the worst, if not THE worst, human rights abusers on the planet? Or do you have to personally witness the atrocities yourself?
LOL. Who has to say he's a bad guy before you'll pass judgement? Who has to tell you that Saudi Arabia is among the worst, if not THE worst, human rights abusers on the planet? Or do you have to personally witness the atrocities yourself?
Fan will not believe it until they torture and murder HIM.
Sepholio
10-22-2018, 08:45 PM
Fan will not believe it until they torture and murder HIM.
Maybe he's refusing to say anything negative about the crown prince because he's scared a hit squad might get him next!
Fan, don't ever enter a Saudi embassy!
Simple Fan
10-22-2018, 09:38 PM
LOL. Who has to say he's a bad guy before you'll pass judgement? Who has to tell you that Saudi Arabia is among the worst, if not THE worst, human rights abusers on the planet? Or do you have to personally witness the atrocities yourself?
I'd actually have to hear or see some proof. I don't really care that Saudi Arabia is a human rights abuser, they have a different culture and I can accept that, I don't condone it but I also don't know much about it. It's like a bible pusher trying to push his beliefs and way of life on you is how I see the US and whoever trying to make these countries more progressive. From what I've seen they've made some steps towards allowing woman to do more things but it feels like people want a 100% turnaround in one day.
Mr. Nerfect
10-22-2018, 10:09 PM
the Rock is in trouble for having dinner with the Prince (https://www.mediaite.com/online/the-rock-calls-out-cnns-oliver-darcy-for-pointing-out-his-dinner-with-saudi-crown-prince/)
To be fair a bunch of famous people had dinner with him too
I don't get why people think that because a whole bunch of other people do the wrong thing it excuses them from doing it. All of them deserve criticism for aligning themselves with this scumbag. The Rock doesn't get a pass because he's not the only guy.
I see nothing wrong with his post. If being a nice person and listening to other's views is embarrassing then that's pretty sad. That's what America is all about but people don't like to listen to views they don't share anymore.
It's not nice to support regimes that kill people. It's not nice to go to someone's house and hear screaming from the basement and just continue to drink wine. Listening to other people's views is a gross euphemism for enabling people to do evil shit.
The Rock will be the next President after Trump probably.
Lol, it really wouldn't surprise me if he was President one day, but that is way too early. And a lot of the "memes" about President Rock are based on the foundation that he is a cool guy, the #1 guy in Hollywood and can do no wrong. If he shatters that illusion the well will dry up.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">WWE Crown Jewel could be in trouble.<br><br>I was just told Reigns is currently injured and that Cena and Bryan are "refusing" to work the show. Many on the current WWE roster have expressed concerned with going, as well, but obviously not all of them have the power like Cena/Bryan.</p>— Robbie Fox (@RobbieBarstool) <a href="https://twitter.com/RobbieBarstool/status/1054445652011302912?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 22, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Thank fuck some guys get it. Good for Cena and Bryan. Cena took a shot in that John Oliver piece, and he's got a career and public image to worry about. Doing the propaganda promos is a great way to make sure no one takes him seriously as an up-and-coming celebrity.
Oh I'm serious, I don't know anything about the guy so I'm not going to pass judgment just because the media says he's a bad guy. I have nothing against Saudi Arabia or how they run their country either.
Dude, you owe it to yourself to learn. It's not hard to do a Google search on "human rights abuses in Saudi Arabia." "Just because the media says," -- wtf, it's not just the media. It's the media (all forms, not just your paid and bought), it's people who have lived there, it's their documented history of executions and imprisoning people for voicing an opinion. If you have nothing against how they run their country...I can't help you.
I'd actually have to hear or see some proof. I don't really care that Saudi Arabia is a human rights abuser, they have a different culture and I can accept that, I don't condone it but I also don't know much about it. It's like a bible pusher trying to push his beliefs and way of life on you is how I see the US and whoever trying to make these countries more progressive. From what I've seen they've made some steps towards allowing woman to do more things but it feels like people want a 100% turnaround in one day.
Then look at the proof, Fan. It's fucking out there. How can you not give a shit they abuse human rights? How can you just call that a "different culture?"
It's just a "different culture" that they killed and hacked up that journalist. Not going to pass judgment on the morals there, guys. Fuck you.
I don't care it's legal to fuck and marry 12 year olds in the Philippines. It's just their culture.
Mr. Nerfect
10-22-2018, 10:22 PM
Yeah, it's pretty wtf.
Simple Fan
10-22-2018, 11:29 PM
Dude, you owe it to yourself to learn. It's not hard to do a Google search on "human rights abuses in Saudi Arabia." "Just because the media says," -- wtf, it's not just the media. It's the media (all forms, not just your paid and bought), it's people who have lived there, it's their documented history of executions and imprisoning people for voicing an opinion. If you have nothing against how they run their country...I can't help you.
Then look at the proof, Fan. It's fucking out there. How can you not give a shit they abuse human rights? How can you just call that a "different culture?"
It's just a "different culture" that they killed and hacked up that journalist. Not going to pass judgment on the morals there, guys. Fuck you.
You are talking about a country that is still a monarchy, their citizens don't have the same rights I do. Human rights isnt a universal thing that every country abides by and I can accept that. As long as they don't come attacking my rights here in the USA then I could care less how their country is run.
You are talking about a country that is still a monarchy, their citizens don't have the same rights I do. Human rights isnt a universal thing that every country abides by and I can accept that. As long as they don't come attacking my rights here in the USA then I could care less how their country is run.
Incredible.
Mr. Nerfect
10-22-2018, 11:57 PM
Now having an Eli Drake avatar is your second biggest flaw.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 12:08 AM
It's just being real, you can't expect the whole world to be equal just because we're all human. Thats a fantasy that is never going to happen.
Sepholio
10-23-2018, 12:11 AM
LMFAO this is surreal.
Sepholio
10-23-2018, 12:12 AM
"I don't care if the neighbor murders people constantly as long as he doesn't murder me"
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 12:20 AM
"I don't care if the neighbor murders people constantly as long as he doesn't murder me"
I don't think Fan gets that this is what he's saying.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 12:21 AM
"I don't care if the neighbor murders people constantly as long as he doesn't murder me"
Saudi Arabia is far from being my neighbor.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 12:24 AM
It's just being real, you can't expect the whole world to be equal just because we're all human. Thats a fantasy that is never going to happen.
It's not being real at all. Being real is looking at a real crisis and saying "that's fucked" and not tucking your head between your legs and saying "la-la-la-la!". What do you think happened to that journalist? Be real about it -- what do you think happened and why?
I don't think your point about the whole world being equal really fits the framing of the conversation. It's not about "expecting" sunshine and roses. It's about not entering into business with shady dictators and trying to work towards change and making sure justice is served where you can.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 12:25 AM
Saudi Arabia is far from being my neighbor.
Dude, we are all born on the same planet.
Dude, we are all born on the same planet.
This made me chuckle.
Triple A
10-23-2018, 12:29 AM
You are talking about a country that is still a monarchy, their citizens don't have the same rights I do. Human rights isnt a universal thing that every country abides by and I can accept that. As long as they don't come attacking my rights here in the USA then I could care less how their country is run.
The people of Saudi Arabia don't choose to have a brutal, backwards monarchy rule over them.
The monarchy/dictatorship uses hundreds of billions of dollars in American (and other countries') weapons and spy technology to rule over their population and crush any dissent. Peaceful protest is punishable by death.
The US (and UK and others) support the dictatorship because they can be controlled. Be our "allies" and do what we want and we'll keep you rich and in power. If the people of Saudi Arabia had a pesky democracy, they might start doing things that the US government and elite don't like and can't control.
In the <a href="https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/03/politics/trump-saudi-king-intl/index.html">words</a> of Donald Trump, the Saudi monarchy would not last two weeks without US support.
"We protect Saudi Arabia. And I love the King ... King Salman but I said 'King, we're protecting you. You might not be there for two weeks without us.'"
So it's not just some far off place that we have nothing to do with. Our government directly supports the monarchy.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 12:34 AM
This made me chuckle.
It's probably the most hippy-esque thing I've said in my life, but it's just amazing how cunty people get when geography is involved. Like, they can't actually imagine the suffering because the people aren't living right down the road from them. These people have lives until this government strangles it out of them.
The people of Saudi Arabia don't choose to have a brutal, backwards monarchy rule over them.
The monarchy/dictatorship uses hundreds of billions of dollars in American (and other countries') weapons and spy technology to rule over their population and crush any dissent. Peaceful protest is punishable by death.
The US (and UK and others) support the dictatorship because they can be controlled. Be our "allies" and do what we want and we'll keep you rich and in power. If the people of Saudi Arabia had a pesky democracy, they might start doing things that the US government and elite don't like and can't control.
In the <a href="https://www.cnn.com/2018/10/03/politics/trump-saudi-king-intl/index.html">words</a> of Donald Trump, the Saudi monarchy would not last two weeks without US support.
"We protect Saudi Arabia. And I love the King ... King Salman but I said 'King, we're protecting you. You might not be there for two weeks without us.'"
:y:
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 12:35 AM
It's not being real at all. Being real is looking at a real crisis and saying "that's fucked" and not tucking your head between your legs and saying "la-la-la-la!". What do you think happened to that journalist? Be real about it -- what do you think happened and why?
I don't think your point about the whole world being equal really fits the framing of the conversation. It's not about "expecting" sunshine and roses. It's about not entering into business with shady dictators and trying to work towards change and making sure justice is served where you can.
I think that journalist ran into the wrong people. I don't know what he did or what or knew but it doesn't concern me.
Good look working towards change and justice if you don't want to do business with them.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 12:36 AM
I think that journalist ran into the wrong people. I don't know what he did or what or knew but it doesn't concern me.
Good look working towards change and justice if you don't want to do business with them.
The wrong people were the Prince's hit squad. His main crime was speaking out against the Prince. Good luck working towards change when you actively try to help them stay in power and kill the people working towards change.
I think that journalist ran into the wrong people. I don't know what he did or what or knew but it doesn't concern me.
Good look working towards change and justice if you don't want to do business with them.
Ran into the wrong people?
Dude, those people were people that rule that country and he didn't "run into them", he just criticized them.
I can't believe we're really having this conversation.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 12:39 AM
"Well, I've got to keep donating to my church. I mean, there was a big expose on how they use that money to relocate child abusers and pay lawyers to intimidate anyone who speaks out about their suffering, so a bunch of people are getting hurt because of it, but if I don't shake their hand and pay my tithing, they'll never be forced to do anything else."
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 12:41 AM
Fucking TNA fans.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 12:56 AM
I can't believe we're really having this conversation.
I can't believe it's such a big deal really. If not for this place I'd not even know about it. I'll admit I'm ignorant to the situation but fucked up things happen everywhere and I don't concern myself with something on the other side of the earth.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 02:44 AM
I am seriously stunned. a) That you choose to live in such ignorance; b) That you can't believe that people actually care when an evil regime does such horrific things. And for fuck's sake, stop trying to justify the evil actions by one dictator by pointing out that other people do terrible things too. Those are just as terrible. It's all terrible. It doesn't mean it doesn't matter.
#1-norm-fan
10-23-2018, 02:49 AM
How close to where you currently are does something need to happen for you to have an opinion on it?
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-23-2018, 03:08 AM
I can't believe it's such a big deal really. If not for this place I'd not even know about it. I'll admit I'm ignorant to the situation but fucked up things happen everywhere and I don't concern myself with something on the other side of the earth.
<img src="http://i.crackedcdn.com/phpimages/article/6/2/0/128620.jpg?v=1" width="320" alt="See the source image" style="width: 320px; height: 290px;">
I can't believe it's such a big deal really. If not for this place I'd not even know about it. I'll admit I'm ignorant to the situation
You're only ignorant by choice.
It's not like 'current events' are hard to hear about on the internet.
"Hitler is killing Jews because it's a different culture. I don't know anything about Hitler, I don't feel like reading about him, it's not my problem".
- Simple Fan in decades past
Droford
10-23-2018, 04:30 AM
This show seems doomed
Roman can't go
Cena and Bryan won't go
Everyone wants them to not go
I figure something else will happen
Swiss Ultimate
10-23-2018, 08:33 AM
"Hitler is killing Jews because it's a different culture. I don't know anything about Hitler, I don't feel like reading about him, it's not my problem".
- Simple Fan in decades past
There is a political narrative throughout the civilized world that Islam is a religion of peace and not a backward violent death cult aimed at the obliteration of gays, Jews, and atheists. Crimes committed by these theocratic states often go ignored by nightly news and political comedy shows. It's politically correct to ignore the atrocities committed in the name of Islam and instead to drone on and on about, "Not all Muslims" when ever something terrible happens.
Big Vic
10-23-2018, 08:45 AM
Imagine if WWE pulls out and the Saudis rope in TNA for the deal and that gives them enough captial to become #1? lol
There is a political narrative throughout the civilized world that Islam is a religion of peace and not a backward violent death cult aimed at the obliteration of gays, Jews, and atheists. Crimes committed by these theocratic states often go ignored by nightly news and political comedy shows. It's politically correct to ignore the atrocities committed in the name of Islam and instead to drone on and on about, "Not all Muslims" when ever something terrible happens.
You talk too much. What matters is if it's far away from where you're at, you should not give a shit.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 09:18 AM
I am seriously stunned. a) That you choose to live in such ignorance; b) That you can't believe that people actually care when an evil regime does such horrific things. And for fuck's sake, stop trying to justify the evil actions by one dictator by pointing out that other people do terrible things too. Those are just as terrible. It's all terrible. It doesn't mean it doesn't matter.
A) This guys death impacts my life in zero ways. O can believe people actually care about this but I still think it's a waste of time. I don't because murders happen all the time here in America which are much more important to me.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 09:22 AM
You're only ignorant by choice.
It's not like 'current events' are hard to hear about on the internet.
Agreed but I don't follow the news or politics. I could start reading one of those articles and be bored by the first paragraph and quit reading it.
Big Vic
10-23-2018, 10:02 AM
A) This guys death impacts my life in zero ways. O can believe people actually care about this but I still think it's a waste of time. I don't because murders happen all the time here in America which are much more important to me.
Yes but the American government is a lot more efficient at killing people in their country and making it look like accident or at least not the governments fault. People aren't' mad that the Saudi's killed him, just the fact that they did such a poor job of getting away with it.This post is a joke
#1-norm-fan
10-23-2018, 10:09 AM
A) This guys death impacts my life in zero ways. O can believe people actually care about this but I still think it's a waste of time. I don't because murders happen all the time here in America which are much more important to me.
Why are murders in America important to you?
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 11:23 AM
Because I'm American.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-cards="hidden" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JohnCena?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JohnCena</a> is reportedly off of <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/WWE?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#WWE</a>’s <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CrownJewel?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#CrownJewel</a> Pay-per-view! - <a href="https://t.co/OgIDfdQq9p">https://t.co/OgIDfdQq9p</a> <a href="https://t.co/G5jZFraU18">pic.twitter.com/G5jZFraU18</a></p>— WWE on PopCulture (@WWEonPopCulture) <a href="https://twitter.com/WWEonPopCulture/status/1054763126107848705?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Droford
10-23-2018, 12:25 PM
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-cards="hidden" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr"><a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/JohnCena?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#JohnCena</a> is reportedly off of <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/WWE?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#WWE</a>’s <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CrownJewel?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#CrownJewel</a> Pay-per-view! - <a href="https://t.co/OgIDfdQq9p">https://t.co/OgIDfdQq9p</a> <a href="https://t.co/G5jZFraU18">pic.twitter.com/G5jZFraU18</a></p>— WWE on PopCulture (@WWEonPopCulture) <a href="https://twitter.com/WWEonPopCulture/status/1054763126107848705?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
The Prince paid good money to see Cena he better be looking over his shoulder
When you guys keep referring to him just as Prince, I can't stop imagining this guy.
http://bi.gazeta.pl/im/15/08/13/z19958037V,Prince.jpg
He even looks like he's ordering someone killed in this photo.
#1-norm-fan
10-23-2018, 12:35 PM
Because I'm American.
You’re also an earthling. Why is the American classification the one you find important? If you’re gonna narrow it down, why stop there? Why not only care about murders in your state? Or your city? Or on your street? Or inside your house?
murders happen all the time here in America
How do you know murders happen if you don't follow any news tho
I wish Simple Fan well but I think it'd be easier if he just posted he doesn't care about other people and is apathetic to what happens to them. Unless they are standing next to him, then he is mildly concerned.
The man's honest, gotta give 'em that!
Big Vic
10-23-2018, 12:44 PM
Maybe Simple Fan is the Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia and he just wants us not to care either.
#1-norm-fan
10-23-2018, 12:54 PM
Simple Prince
Supreme Olajuwon
10-23-2018, 01:05 PM
I'm not big on politics but I understand that the most progressive Saudi Arabia has been is when WWE is in town.
And yes what I seen from WWE's first event in Saudi Arabia they showed how the country was progressing to let women have more rights.
You're being worked by the media to ignore what's really important.
You say he's a mass murdering dictator, I don't know about that.
Oh I'm serious, I don't know anything about the guy so I'm not going to pass judgment just because the media says he's a bad guy. I have nothing against Saudi Arabia or how they run their country either.
I think that journalist ran into the wrong people. I don't know what he did or what or knew but it doesn't concern me.
.
I can't believe it's such a big deal really. If not for this place I'd not even know about it. I'll admit I'm ignorant to the situation but fucked up things happen everywhere and I don't concern myself with something on the other side of the earth.
Agreed but I don't follow the news or politics. I could start reading one of those articles and be bored by the first paragraph and quit reading it.
And that, ladies and germs, is how propaganda works.
Supreme Olajuwon
10-23-2018, 01:07 PM
Dude knows nothing about a country, sees 1 shiny video about that country, now has hard opinions about that country
Supreme Olajuwon
10-23-2018, 01:08 PM
And not only does he have opinions about it, he will now reject additional facts that don’t support the opinion he formed from watching that 1 shiny video.
Ol Dirty Dastard
10-23-2018, 01:13 PM
He doesn't call himself Simple Fan for ironic reasons.
He doesn't call himself Simple Fan for ironic reasons.
Yeah, it's very good that he went with "simple" and not "regular fan" or "just a fan".
Spot on.
Droford
10-23-2018, 04:18 PM
As of 90 min ago there's a rumour they're scouting alternate venues.
Let me win 1.6 billion tonight and it'll be in my backyard
If I win 1.6 Billion, Alexa Bliss and Mandy Rose are getting this dick. They'll never have to work again.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 04:31 PM
And not only does he have opinions about it, he will now reject additional facts that don’t support the opinion he formed from watching that 1 shiny video.
I watched zero videos on this subject. What facts have I rejected? I wouldn't say I have a hard opinion either, I just don't give a shit about what goes down in Saudi Arabia.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 04:35 PM
I wish Simple Fan well but I think it'd be easier if he just posted he doesn't care about other people and is apathetic to what happens to them. Unless they are standing next to him, then he is mildly concerned.
The man's honest, gotta give 'em that!
It's not that I don't care about other people, I think you should treat others how you want to be treated. As far as forign countries go though they rarely cross my mind. I also don't think all humans share the same rights.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 04:37 PM
You’re also an earthling. Why is the American classification the one you find important? If you’re gonna narrow it down, why stop there? Why not only care about murders in your state? Or your city? Or on your street? Or inside your house?
Because I live in America in that's more likely to impact my life than this journalist death. My state, city, street, and house are all in America as well.
It's not that I don't care about other people, I think you should treat others how you want to be treated. As far as forign countries go though they rarely cross my mind. I also don't think all humans share the same rights.
I could understand this if we were talking about a pedophile, not a journalist.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 04:42 PM
How do you know murders happen if you don't follow any news tho
Because that shit happens everyday. When I do catch the news its full of murders, kid nsppings, and thefts. Who wants to watch that?
Cool King
10-23-2018, 04:42 PM
Because I live in America in that's more likely to impact my life than this journalist death. My state, city, street, and house are all in America as well.
You obviously don't know then that Jamal Khashoggi lived in self-imposed exile in America.
Cool King
10-23-2018, 04:43 PM
He lived in America for over a year.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-conversation="none" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">UPDATE: WWE is currently in the process of frantically scouting locations to move Crown Jewel to. This is NOT definite confirmation that it's out of Saudi Arabia, but the location and date are unquestionably in major jeopardy right now.</p>— Robbie Fox (@RobbieBarstool) <a href="https://twitter.com/RobbieBarstool/status/1054808292361453568?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
xrodmuc316
10-23-2018, 05:01 PM
What a shitstorm this has to be for Shawn Michaels. Comes out of retirement after 8 years for a $2Million paycheck, gonna end up getting probably like $50,000 for a house show at Full Sail University.
Supreme Olajuwon
10-23-2018, 05:01 PM
I watched zero videos on this subject. What facts have I rejected? I wouldn't say I have a hard opinion either, I just don't give a shit about what goes down in Saudi Arabia.
Bruh, you literally said your knowledge of this was from watching WWE’s video about Saudi Arabia. Then when multiple people pointed out all that is terrible about Saudi Arabia, your response was that you weren’t sure if you believed all those stories. They’re your words, babe.
Savio
10-23-2018, 05:02 PM
WWE's Pay-per-view Crown Jewel has found a new location Aleppo, Syria. It has also found a new date and time as well it will take place on October 28, at 8:00pm (est) the pre-show will take place at 7:00pm. This was originally the time slot for WWE's other upcoming Pay-per-view, the all female, Evolution. It is likely this event will not be canceled but instead be moved to the NXT arena at Full Sail and take place Friday Afternoon at 2:30pm (est)
Supreme Olajuwon
10-23-2018, 05:10 PM
I also don't think all humans share the same rights.
This is interesting. Can you please rank the humans in order from most rights to least rights?
Dark One
10-23-2018, 05:20 PM
https://media.giphy.com/media/BfiL8ZJWqfw7C/giphy.gif
Splaya
10-23-2018, 05:39 PM
What a shitstorm this has to be for Shawn Michaels. Comes out of retirement after 8 years for a $2Million paycheck, gonna end up getting probably like $50,000 for a house show at Full Sail University.
At least he would be in front of a crowd who knew what they were cheering for :shifty:
Emperor Smeat
10-23-2018, 05:40 PM
https://media.giphy.com/media/BfiL8ZJWqfw7C/giphy.gif
:( those poor pizzas getting smooshed and ruined all because of that dastardly Crown Jewel thread.
Vastardikai
10-23-2018, 05:41 PM
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/9gNG3-4LUVY" frameborder="0" allow="autoplay; encrypted-media" allowfullscreen></iframe>
just got home so I can now embed this. I say that the video about sums up the whole Crown Jewel debacle.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 05:55 PM
This is interesting. Can you please rank the humans in order from most rights to least rights?
Most: Humans born under a free democracy.
Least: Humans born under a currupt monarchy/dictatorship.
Simple Fan
10-23-2018, 05:56 PM
You obviously don't know then that Jamal Khashoggi lived in self-imposed exile in America.
He lived in America for over a year.
He should have stayed in America.
Most: Humans born under a free democracy.
Least: Humans born under a currupt monarchy/dictatorship.
You don't cease to amaze me.
Is Simple Fan playing a character?
Supreme Olajuwon
10-23-2018, 06:32 PM
Most: Humans born under a free democracy.
Least: Humans born under a currupt monarchy/dictatorship.
That’s cool, that’s cool. Which rights do the people born under a corrupt monarchy/dictatorship not get?
I'll be honest. This reporter was fucking stupid for going back to Saudi Arabia. I think his stupidness is being overlooked here.
I'll be honest. This reporter was fucking stupid for going back to Saudi Arabia. I think his stupidness is being overlooked here.
IT happenned in Saud Arabian consulate in Turkey.
IT happenned in Saud Arabian consulate in Turkey.
Even dumber. He should have stayed in America. Dude was dumb.
THey literally were baiting him to come back. And he knew he was being baited. AND HE STILL WENT BACK! WHAT THE FUCK!
It seriously feels like Trump gave him assurance that he was safe, knowing he wasnt, and then he went back and got saw'ed up.
THIS IS JACK BAUER 24 SHIT
Emperor Smeat
10-23-2018, 07:21 PM
I'll be honest. This reporter was fucking stupid for going back to Saudi Arabia. I think his stupidness is being overlooked here.
Not really since he had a legal reason to go to the embassy in Turkey and the Saudis just used his previous marriage as the bait for their trap.
Since he was married in Saudi Arabia but got divorced due to being in exile, he didn't have the legal paperwork needed to officially annul it and legally marry someone else in Turkey. Since the Saudis knew everything about his predicament and exactly when he would be at the embassy, it made it easier for them to plan the trap and send the hit squad.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 07:59 PM
There is a political narrative throughout the civilized world that Islam is a religion of peace and not a backward violent death cult aimed at the obliteration of gays, Jews, and atheists. Crimes committed by these theocratic states often go ignored by nightly news and political comedy shows. It's politically correct to ignore the atrocities committed in the name of Islam and instead to drone on and on about, "Not all Muslims" when ever something terrible happens.
So which is it? Do the politically correct look only at criticizing the United States, or do they ignore the issues in the US to focus on international atrocities, like Simple Fan states?
Agreed but I don't follow the news or politics. I could start reading one of those articles and be bored by the first paragraph and quit reading it.
You do realize that I have forever won all debates about our taste for content in the future, right? "No, Impact is really, really good!" You can't read, Simple Fan. "Eli Drake isn't awful!" Human rights bore you, Simple Fan.
You have lost forever.
You’re also an earthling. Why is the American classification the one you find important? If you’re gonna narrow it down, why stop there? Why not only care about murders in your state? Or your city? Or on your street? Or inside your house?
:y:
I don't get how some people can be arbitrarily born in a place -- no choice of their own -- and be so proud and concerned with it like it wasn't a matter of being the lucky product of their parents fucking. All the people killed by this regime are exactly the same products, they're just not lucky enough to be born in the United States where they can get bored by world events instead of bulldozed by them.
And that, ladies and germs, is how propaganda works.
Right on. Dude watches WWE video and actually thinks they are bringing about change. He argues what a big deal it is, proving exactly why this is so disgusting and why so many are pissed off.
I watched zero videos on this subject. What facts have I rejected? I wouldn't say I have a hard opinion either, I just don't give a shit about what goes down in Saudi Arabia.
You watched the WWE video. You reject the fact that the prince did this. "Oh, I don't know who he ran into." The prince's men. "Oh, he must have known something." He was a critic of the prince. "I think they're a more progressive country when WWE is in town." No, they're not. What do you call that if not rejecting facts? And you actively reject them on their own. "I'm ignorant to the issue." You are rejecting the facts.
And you do have a hard opinion about Saudi Arabia: you don't give a shit. Also, it happened in Turkey. And Turkey is pissed. You fucking idiot.
It's not that I don't care about other people, I think you should treat others how you want to be treated. As far as forign countries go though they rarely cross my mind. I also don't think all humans share the same rights.
Okay, well, we won't care if someone decides to beat the shit out of you and cut you up with a bonesaw. Just for speaking your mind as an American. Got it.
He should have stayed in America.
He went to the embassy in Turkey because he was told he needed to get some marriage papers. Suspicious or not, the guy was doing it because he loved his wife. The audio Turkish authorities and the CIA have is apparently because he was suspicious of the arrangement and set his Apple Watch or something to send out the recording of his own death so they could get something on this fucker, just so you can say "Well, I don't really care." Dude may have actually sacrificed himself so you can be a comfy fucker and say "Well, I don't get what is really so bad about the prince. Some people just don't get rights" and he can continue to operate in the United States (they have embassies there too and could still kill him), and do business with absolute cunts like WWE who spread the message that he is actually good.
His mistake wasn't because he was stupid, his mistake was thinking that you weren't.
You obviously don't know then that Jamal Khashoggi lived in self-imposed exile in America.
:y:
This dude loved and embraced the United States. Oh well, wasn't born here, not good enough for Simple Fan.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-conversation="none" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">UPDATE: WWE is currently in the process of frantically scouting locations to move Crown Jewel to. This is NOT definite confirmation that it's out of Saudi Arabia, but the location and date are unquestionably in major jeopardy right now.</p>— Robbie Fox (@RobbieBarstool) <a href="https://twitter.com/RobbieBarstool/status/1054808292361453568?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 23, 2018</a></blockquote>
<script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Thank fuck, but the word "frantically" really irks me here. This isn't a new story, guys. You're getting frantic now?
What a shitstorm this has to be for Shawn Michaels. Comes out of retirement after 8 years for a $2Million paycheck, gonna end up getting probably like $50,000 for a house show at Full Sail University.
Shawn Michaels will be getting paid for his appearance. Why do people honestly think the dude is hurting for money and wouldn't get paid 7 figures for a WWE return? It's crazy to me.
I'll be honest. This reporter was fucking stupid for going back to Saudi Arabia. I think his stupidness is being overlooked here.
Do you even know why he went to the consulate in Turkey?
Even dumber. He should have stayed in America. Dude was dumb.
How is going to the embassy/consulate even dumber than going to Saudi Arabia?
You need some friends you can drink with. Away from the computer.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 08:17 PM
How is going to the embassy/consulate even dumber than going to Saudi Arabia?
You need some friends you can drink with. Away from the computer.
Yeah, I don't know how on earth this could possibly be seen as stupider.
#1-norm-fan
10-23-2018, 08:41 PM
You’re also an earthling. Why is the American classification the one you find important? If you’re gonna narrow it down, why stop there? Why not only care about murders in your state? Or your city? Or on your street? Or inside your house?
Because I live in America in that's more likely to impact my life than this journalist death. My state, city, street, and house are all in America as well.
lol Hate to pile on here, Fan. You know that didn't answer my question though.
The country is the point where you narrow it down to what you care about. You say only murders in America matter to you because they're more likely to effect you (Which isn't true. But that's a different subject.)
My question is, if that's the case, why stop narrowing it down? If someone was like "I don't care about murders outside of my street?" would you find that silly? If you would, why? They live on that street and that's more likely to impact them than some guy getting murdered on the next street over. It you wouldn't find that silly, then why don't you agree with that guy and only care about murders on your street?
Dark One
10-23-2018, 08:46 PM
I'm gonna suggest maybe Simple Fan shouldn't go to his local TPWW embassy.
He's just a Simple Fan, from a Simple family.
xrodmuc316
10-23-2018, 09:32 PM
Shawn Michaels will be getting paid for his appearance. Why do people honestly think the dude is hurting for money and wouldn't get paid 7 figures for a WWE return? It's crazy to me.
Not saying he is hurting for money, but he got offered so much he couldn't turn it down.
Now that it has been set up and announced, he is gonna wrestle. If WWE isn't getting $45 million for a house show and are instead getting a standard house show gate, then nobody is getting the pay they would have in Saudi Arabia.
Savio
10-23-2018, 09:36 PM
Not really since he had a legal reason to go to the embassy in Turkey and the Saudis just used his previous marriage as the bait for their trap.
Since he was married in Saudi Arabia but got divorced due to being in exile, he didn't have the legal paperwork needed to officially annul it and legally marry someone else in Turkey. Since the Saudis knew everything about his predicament and exactly when he would be at the embassy, it made it easier for them to plan the trap and send the hit squad.
Further proof that marriage is a scam.
OssMan
10-23-2018, 09:38 PM
Yeah, it's very good that he went with "simple" and not "regular fan" or "just a fan".
Spot on.
His original username was "im just a fan"
Sepholio
10-23-2018, 09:41 PM
Marriage is just a scam by women to get men assassinated by the Saudi crown prince.
His original username was "im just a fan"
It's nice of him to change the name so we know what we're dealing with.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 09:42 PM
Not saying he is hurting for money, but he got offered so much he couldn't turn it down.
Now that it has been set up and announced, he is gonna wrestle. If WWE isn't getting $45 million for a house show and are instead getting a standard house show gate, then nobody is getting the pay they would have in Saudi Arabia.
I think we've discussed this before, but while you're reasoning there is perfectly logical, I'll just throw out this:
Shawn Michaels could have made a shit-ton of money to come back at any time. He's perceived by many to be the GOAT, legit. Is the rumored sum $5 million? He could very easily have worked out a contract with Vince for that much previously. Plus merchandise, specials and all that. I don't buy money as being the reason. I really don't.
There are plenty of reasons HBK might want to come out of retirement. His children are older now. Maybe they want to see him work a match? He's been working with the young kids and might think he can teach them better by showing them what he can do. He might just have the itch. I'm sure he's not doing it for free, don't get me wrong, but I don't think it's a case of the prince throwing a whole bunch of money at him and Michaels thinking "Well, in that case..."
I predicted Michaels would be coming back the moment I saw The Rock rumors. I think backstage politics and Triple H's insecurities to function as a top level draw are as likely to be involved as the money. But all these issues compound into a plethora of reasons that Shawn Michaels might want to come back. But he can't really come back and not work the Saudi show. What if the Saudis asked for him and they said "No, he's retired," and then he popped up for WrestleMania?
If this show doesn't happen, Shawn will still get paid a shit-ton -- regardless if it is as much or not. WWE has $5 million lying around. But they may not give him that much. He may not want that much. But I'm sure the plan has been for him to come out of retirement for quite a while, and I'm sure it's not just isolated to one match.
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 09:43 PM
Marriage is just a scam by women to get men assassinated by the Saudi crown prince.
Reminds me a little of an ex.
Emperor Smeat
10-23-2018, 09:47 PM
Marriage is just a scam by women to get men assassinated by the Saudi crown prince.
With all the twists and turns from this story, wouldn't be surprised at all if the higher power in charge turned out to be the ex-wife this whole time.
Might as well go all out and pull a Vince with a live feed of the hooded person reveal.
Savio
10-23-2018, 09:48 PM
"Babe, can we not get married? I think the Saudis might try to kill me"
"I guess you didn't mean it when you said you loved me more than life it self :("
OssMan
10-23-2018, 09:52 PM
Simple Fan has a history of being conservative talking points guy who takes no responsibility for anything
I have one that hangs in my room. I can see why people dislike the flag for the history that it represents. I have a shirt that reads if this flag offends you, you need a history lesson. I don't understand why people would want to erase history. Were I'm from there are even black people that wear Confederate flag shits and hats. I also have black friends who seen the flag and called me a racist. Its all in ones viewpoint of the flag and what they see it as. It should remain in South Carolina unless the citizens of the state vote to take it down in my opinion.
Its just a shit. Never said it was important to me. Its just a shirt that gets worn when it gets pulled out of the dresser.
its just a shirt. its just a flag. im just a fan.
Pretty simple dude.
I like how he called his shirt "shit" twice.
I think we've discussed this before, but while you're reasoning there is perfectly logical, I'll just throw out this:
Shawn Michaels could have made a shit-ton of money to come back at any time. He's perceived by many to be the GOAT, legit. Is the rumored sum $5 million? He could very easily have worked out a contract with Vince for that much previously. Plus merchandise, specials and all that. I don't buy money as being the reason. I really don't.
There are plenty of reasons HBK might want to come out of retirement. His children are older now. Maybe they want to see him work a match? He's been working with the young kids and might think he can teach them better by showing them what he can do. He might just have the itch. I'm sure he's not doing it for free, don't get me wrong, but I don't think it's a case of the prince throwing a whole bunch of money at him and Michaels thinking "Well, in that case..."
I predicted Michaels would be coming back the moment I saw The Rock rumors. I think backstage politics and Triple H's insecurities to function as a top level draw are as likely to be involved as the money. But all these issues compound into a plethora of reasons that Shawn Michaels might want to come back. But he can't really come back and not work the Saudi show. What if the Saudis asked for him and they said "No, he's retired," and then he popped up for WrestleMania?
If this show doesn't happen, Shawn will still get paid a shit-ton -- regardless if it is as much or not. WWE has $5 million lying around. But they may not give him that much. He may not want that much. But I'm sure the plan has been for him to come out of retirement for quite a while, and I'm sure it's not just isolated to one match.
Could Shawn just keep doing his Ted Nugent impression and NOT come back?
Mr. Nerfect
10-23-2018, 10:15 PM
Between the confederate flag and TNA, Simple Fan really does like backing losers.
Droford
10-23-2018, 10:58 PM
You obviously don't know then that Jamal Khashoggi lived in self-imposed exile in America.
He was also a Muslim Brotherhood member
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-23-2018, 10:59 PM
I hope the World Court goes after his ex-wife for this too.
SlickyTrickyDamon
10-23-2018, 10:59 PM
Between the confederate flag and TNA, Simple Fan really does like backing losers.
he is a dummy, yeah?
Sepholio
10-23-2018, 11:17 PM
He was also a Muslim Brotherhood member
And the Saudi's actually set up and bankrolled 9/11. What's your point?
Droford and Simple Fan should be a tag team.
Rumored that Crown Jewel is being moved to Albany, NY at the Times Union Center arena.
Simple Fan
10-24-2018, 01:14 AM
It's proven I'm a red neck that shares different views than most of you. I don't hide that or deny it. I respect other people's views though and don't hate on any of you. My whole point though is people are quick to judge on everything these days and I'm not one of them.
Simple Fan
10-24-2018, 01:19 AM
Big props to Ossman for keeping up with the history of im just a fan/Simple Fan.
Supreme Olajuwon
10-24-2018, 10:34 AM
It's proven I'm a red neck that shares different views than most of you. I don't hide that or deny it. I respect other people's views though and don't hate on any of you. My whole point though is people are quick to judge on everything these days and I'm not one of them.
Except you didn’t say you’re reserving judgment. You said
I wish, Im just don't think the show should be cancelled because of a dead journalist.
Your mind was already made up before you knew anything about anything. So let’s drop the aw shucks can’t we all just get along nonsense, please.
RaginRonic
10-24-2018, 12:41 PM
Rumored that Crown Jewel is being moved to Albany, NY at the Times Union Center arena.
For those who don't keep up with certain naming conventions for public venues, the Times Union Center Arena is the former Knickerbocker Arena, where the 1992 Royal Rumble happened...the night that Ric Flair became the WWF Champion upon winning the Rumble Match from Slot No. 3.
Just giving some help there.
=P
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Can someone get me the Google Earth coordinates for Null, Null? <a href="https://t.co/3QYeOvncc1">pic.twitter.com/3QYeOvncc1</a></p>— Bryan Alvarez (@bryanalvarez) <a href="https://twitter.com/bryanalvarez/status/1055150960014585856?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 24, 2018</a></blockquote>
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#1-norm-fan
10-24-2018, 02:07 PM
I believe it’s in the country of Parts Unknown.
Big Vic
10-24-2018, 02:07 PM
http://www.oneweirdglobe.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/0-degrees-lat-and-long-800x411.jpg
Wehttam
10-24-2018, 02:10 PM
Vacant hails from there
Big Vic
10-24-2018, 02:16 PM
So he will have home field advantage for the Universal Title match :eek:
Sepholio
10-24-2018, 02:38 PM
Is that anywhere near the middle of nowhere? Might have to attend if so.
Triple A
10-24-2018, 05:03 PM
Via Meltzer on Observer forums:
It's no longer up to Vince. Vince will never make the decision not to go. He's too far out of touch now.
Company is hoping to get word tomorrow if they can still go.
There's a reason tickets aren't on sale. Because they've been told you may not be allowed to go.
Creative was most definitely told yesterday that Cena was off the show and they need to think about a replacement. Maybe the fact that the show itself is up in the air was why they still pushed. Maybe if the date or location changes Cena will do the show. But the Cena story isn't wrong. As for Bryan, I have no idea. Nobody has confirmed it, but WWE didn't deny it when I asked them.
Swiss Ultimate
10-24-2018, 05:15 PM
So which is it? Do the politically correct look only at criticizing the United States, or do they ignore the issues in the US to focus on international atrocities, like Simple Fan states?
The American Left only cares about Saudi Arabia now because Trump is in power, period. They ignore atrocities all over the world to push their agenda. If Trump came out strong against Saudi Arabia they'd call him an Islamaphobe.
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet" data-lang="en"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">BREAKING NEWS: <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/HulkHogan?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#HulkHogan</a> Announces His Return To <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/WWE?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#WWE</a> At <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/CrownJewel?src=hash&ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#CrownJewel</a> In Saudi Arabia <a href="https://t.co/M4lgIUYid2">https://t.co/M4lgIUYid2</a> via <a href="https://twitter.com/wnwnews?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@wnwnews</a></p>— Ciarán James (@TheCiaranJames) <a href="https://twitter.com/TheCiaranJames/status/1055216798021402624?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">October 24, 2018</a></blockquote>
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Mr. Nerfect
10-25-2018, 04:57 AM
The American Left only cares about Saudi Arabia now because Trump is in power, period. They ignore atrocities all over the world to push their agenda. If Trump came out strong against Saudi Arabia they'd call him an Islamaphobe.
:lol:
Jordan
10-25-2018, 08:30 AM
Well at first I was blindly excited to see the return of the GOAT, my FOAT, HBK. But I can't think of a worse way to do it now upon the drama of this Crown Jewel show. Especially if they end up moving the show to ALBANY. What a dumb ass move this is. At first I didn't care that nobody in the arena would be FREAKING out the way that I will when HBK starts running the ropes and taking bumps, but now with all the drama, I realize what a waste this is of a moment of a lifetime.
Jordan
10-25-2018, 08:31 AM
Very surprised MAYOR KANE hasn't John Cena'ed himself out of this show.
Sepholio
10-25-2018, 08:46 AM
Very surprised MAYOR KANE hasn't John Cena'ed himself out of this show.
For real. That's crazy to me.
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