DISCUSSION - Could a FACE Christian become RAW's answer to Eddie Guerrero?

[Heyman]

<font color=white>CAUTION - may contain RAW spoilers. Reader discretion is advised.</font>

DISCUSSION - Could a FACE Christian become RAW's answer to Eddie Guerrero?

I briefly touched upon this in the RAW thread last night, and here is the gist of what I said. Christian has been a heel for a long time, and seems to have hit a wall there. His character is a great one (IMO), but consider the following arguments:


-There's only so many times a heel Christian can win the IC title, or tag team title.

-There's only so many times a casual mark will "seriously" boo someone....after awhile, the "respect boo" becomes a "get the fuck off my TV screen" boo. Christian has a great personna, but how long will it last?

-His current music seems kinda "face-ish" (think Matt Hardy).

-It would be easy to cheer for Christian (i.e. C-L-B!, "Let's go Chris-Tian!"). Christian already has his "peeps" (like The Rock had his "millions"), and a semi-cool moniker (Captain Charisma).

-Christian has decent charisma, and strong in-ring ability.

-Christian, like Guerrero, is also a well-known "liar, cheater, and stealer". The guy has won countless IC and tag titles based on cheating!


If the WWE do it right, maybe they can still have Christian cheat to win, etc.,..........but have the fans take delight in that? (kinda like they do with Guerrero).

I think it would be kinda funny to see Christian (acting like a "big shot", etc.) beating super serious guys like Gene Snitsky.....and Edge...by cheating, etc.



To some degree, I think Christian could be a smaller scale version of The Rock. Remember how when The Rock was a heel, he kept deluding himself into thinking that he was "The People's Champ"? When he turned face however, he became acknowledged as such..........because the fans got used to him saying it so much. Could the same happen with Christian?



As long as they keep Christian


So?............what do you think?

Could Christian work as a face?

As long as they keep Christian's face character close to his heel character (for the most part), I think it could possibly work. Furthermore - it gives a new element to Christian's character....which would intrigue the fans.....which could warrant a future main-event push? :?:

[The Answer]

How would you get rid of Tomko?

[Shadow]

How would you get rid of Tomko?

Who's Tomko?

That's how you get rid of Tomko.

[The Answer]

Who's Tomko?

That's how you get rid of Tomko.

They unexplained disappearence how sutle

[Heyman]

How would you get rid of Tomko?


Don't know. Maybe he could still be a part of Christian's campaign?

All "legends" have a manager. ;) Tomko adds to Christian's "superiority complex"......which is why it would be even more hilarious to see Christian getting his ass kicked only to either....

a) cheat and win
b) have Tomko help him out, which leads to a Christian victory.......this of course, over his enraged and super-serious opponents. :D



Has anyone here seen the Cartoon TV show "Darkwing Duck?"

I'm not sure if it still comes on, but I used to watch it a bit when growing up.

Basically - Darkwing Duck was a 'hero' that would usually get this ass-kicked by villains, but would always end up getting the final victory (due to outside forces/luck.........which was mainly because of Dark Wing's daughter and/or friend helping DW out).

[Gouda]

I think a face turn for Christian is a good idea. If only to try out something new with him.

I'd retain elements of his current gimmick. I like the whole superiority thing you're talking about. He can come out and just challenge top heels.

I wouldn't have him get his ass kicked completley though. I'dlet him get in some good offense. Also, while I have nothing against him cheating to win, it is crucial he get some clean victories as well.

Oh yeah, and CLB wouldn't be a good chant considering it's supposed to be a negative chant against him. Calling him a Creepy Little Bastard.

[Innovator]

I've been saying this for awhile, this is the next big thing the WWE could do. Christian going face gives him a hell of a lot more opportunities than right now.

Maybe he can finally beat Edge

[RGWhat316]

I dunno, it might work. Unlike a bunch of people on these boards, I'm really not a fan of Christian. But it does seem like he's hit a wall. He doesn't make fun of the fans or really do anything to get heel heat, but he doesn't do much to get face reactions either. He also jobs alot, so that doesn't get heat either.

The music might trigger a change. Usually people change music when their characters change. Christian got the Waterproof Blonde song in November, but his character has basically been the same since he came back from injury in September. But a face turn would be fresh and actually give me some interest in his character.

[Gone Mad]

BTW Heyman, I totally forgot about Darkwing and had no idea he was so much like Inspector Gadget from the way you described him. But that's for another forum..

Yeah, I wouldn't mind seeing Capt. Charisma as a face. Don't think it would be all too successful but it would be interesting to see what comes out of this, since Xtian could be alot higher up the card as a face than a heel (since the top heel is HHH and no one can top that,unfortunately).

Plus he does notice the crowd and can get them behind him, like the old E and C days.

[Sting Fan]

I used to detest Xtian right up until his haircut and feud with Booker T, ever since I have become a fan of everything but the guys moveset. I think this idea has potential but I also dont see why he couldnt try for the World title in his current heel persona. Not necesarily win but I think he could be a great foil for Orton as it seems there determined to push him.

[Mr. Nerfect]

The thing about Christian is that he is so likeable. He is literally Reeking of Awesomeness. Regardless of the reaction he gets he carries his own presence.

Christian would work as a face, in my opinion, rather well. He could be the landmark for a new era if done right. I'd keep him with Tomko, and just have him as that little guy who isn't afraid to get heat. Have him come out and use an opening line like "Hello to all my Peeps in *Gets the town name wrong on purpose*". It's good for a quick round of heat, but Christian is so awesome and would be so easy to root for it doesn't matter.

If you have The Unprettier sold like death, have Tomko remain as a close ally on Christian's and have Christian remain Captain Charisma, he will slowly become more and more people's favourite wrestler. If they put him in scenarios where it is clear Christian is the guy to cheer, that is. Christian vs. Triple H would be a great example of it, even though it is not going to happen anytime soon.

[corey99999]

How would you get rid of Tomko?

have tomko team up with edge and they beat down tomko turning xtian face

[Hired Hitman]

I like corey99999999999999999999999999.... 9999999999999...999999's idea, Christian.. peeps united!

[Afterlife]

Oh yeah, and CLB wouldn't be a good chant considering it's supposed to be a negative chant against him. Calling him a Creepy Little Bastard.

Kurt Angle: You know why these people tell me I suck each night? Because I earned it!

*Cheers for Angle, followed by a friendly "You suck!" chant in support of their temporarily faced Olympic Hero.*

[PorkSoda]

I think that Christian face turn would be great. But the WWE doesn't need another singles guy with the Lie, Cheat, and Steal gimmick. I agree with everything said above.

Here's an idea for Christian to get into the main event scene: They could build some more Evolution members and then Christian can form his own stable to battle against them. Christian does have the mic skills and charisma, and I think a stable lead by him would go great.

Also, his theme is awesome.

[The Fitz]

Christian/Tomko = Michaels/Diesel

[DarkAngel]

i've been waiting for him to turn face for 2 years now :(

did you hear his pop yesterday!

[Mr. Nerfect]

i've been waiting for him to turn face for 2 years now :(

did you hear his pop yesterday!

Being in Toronto probably had a bit to do with it. I think he would get similiar reactions with a face turn, though.

[RemyRed]

LOL Darkwing Duck.

[The Naitch]

Tomko is useless. Everytime he tries to interfere, he gets smacked down. Get rid of him. Or make him a "Rosey" type sidekick

[Azriel]

Yeah, get rid of Tomko. I would love to see Christian face and then have a new killer feud with Edge to get him over as face, and like Heyman said don't make him a complete babyface, make him something like the Rock.

[The CyNick]

Christian is too far down the depth chart to get any kind of serious main event type push.

Guys liek Orton, Batista, Benoit, HHH, Kane, Jerihco, Edge, Benjamin and Hassan all seem to be ahead of him in terms who the WWE wants to push. So whether he's a face or a heel, I dont think he's getting close to the top for some time.

He might have a better shot on SD, but even over there, they already have Carlito who basically has the same type of spot Christian has on RAW. Maybe he would get a main event push on SD, but that would mean they would have to give up on Bradshaw, and I dont see that happening.

I think he's talented enough to do pretty much anything, but I just dont think the WWE sees him as a top guy.

[Heyman]

Christian is too far down the depth chart to get any kind of serious main event type push.



True, but who the HELL would've predicted that Acolyte Bradshaw would one day become WWE champion? :).

Granted - Bradshaw got a complete gimmick overhaul, but perhaps anything is possible?

Christian probably won't get a main-event push anytime soon (for the reasons that you stated), but I'm still interested to see how he'd look as a face.

In my opinion, Christian has all the qualities in becoming a successful face......which is more than I can say for most of the current WWE superstars.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Most people seem to think otherwise, but I believe Triple H will head on over to SmackDown! once he has jobbed to Dave Batista at WrestleMania.

With Flair as a face managing Batista, this allows for Edge and Muhammad Hassan to step up as major heels. I think the WWE could use another one, so let's say Randy Orton or Christian (depending on whether or not you turn them).

So now we have:

Faces
Batista
Chris Benoit
Chris Jericho
Shelton Benjamin
Kane

Heels
Edge
Muhammad Hassan
Randy Orton
Christian
Gene Snitsky

I think people like Christian will benefit greatly if/when Triple H relinquishes his stangle-hold on RAW.

[Heyman]

Christian should just start acting like a "semi-humble" big shot (if that makes sense


Before Christian's matches start:

-Have him come down to the ring as he normally does (with Tomko). Tomko carries a huge 'amplifier' of sorts to the ring.
-Have him pose on the turnbuckle (a la Rock) like a true hero
-Have Tomko hook up the 'amplifier' near the ring, and have loud pre-recorded, "Let's Go Chris-Tian!" chants play.

During Christian's matches:
-Have Christian and Tomko act the same way as they are now.
-Have Christian create a "gesture" of sorts which positively acknowledges his 'peeps' (kinda the same way that DX used to have their crotch chops.....or how Benoit has his 'throat slit' thingy).


After Christian's matches
-Have Christian show GREAT enthusiasm after he wins his matches (along with Tomko). This would be somewhat similar to Angle in 99' when he debuted....although not as extreme.
-Have Christian pose once again on all 4 turnbuckle's.
-Have Christian sign autographs at ringside (if he wins)


Christian backstage and/or cutting promos

-Christian genuinely tells people positive things such as "Stay in school", and "you can do anything you set your mind to, etc".



Through time, I think the fans would really get behind a gimmick like this. It would be "dorky"...............but in a cool sort of way (if that makes sense).

[Mr. Nerfect]

Those are interesting ideas for Christian, but I'd rather see him as the real smartass who you'd love to see get his, but he never does ebcause he's just too talented. have signed autographs fall from the roof after everyone of his matches or something just to add a special feeling to him.

I think Christian already has the power to turn face, though, so I'd only use some of the ideas you mentioned if he doesn't seems to be getting over as well as he could.

[CYCLOPTERSAURUS]

Christian should just start acting like a "semi-humble" big shot (if that makes sense


Before Christian's matches start:

-Have him come down to the ring as he normally does (with Tomko). Tomko carries a huge 'amplifier' of sorts to the ring.
-Have him pose on the turnbuckle (a la Rock) like a true hero
-Have Tomko hook up the 'amplifier' near the ring, and have loud pre-recorded, "Let's Go Chris-Tian!" chants play.

During Christian's matches:
-Have Christian and Tomko act the same way as they are now.
-Have Christian create a "gesture" of sorts which positively acknowledges his 'peeps' (kinda the same way that DX used to have their crotch chops.....or how Benoit has his 'throat slit' thingy).


After Christian's matches
-Have Christian show GREAT enthusiasm after he wins his matches (along with Tomko). This would be somewhat similar to Angle in 99' when he debuted....although not as extreme.
-Have Christian pose once again on all 4 turnbuckle's.
-Have Christian sign autographs at ringside (if he wins)


Christian backstage and/or cutting promos

-Christian genuinely tells people positive things such as "Stay in school", and "you can do anything you set your mind to, etc".



Through time, I think the fans would really get behind a gimmick like this. It would be "dorky"...............but in a cool sort of way (if that makes sense).

That sounds to me like too much of a rip-off of other gimmicks. I think they should just let Christian do whatever he wants, he can really connect with the fans. Really, if he were to ditch Tomko and stop insulting fans/local sports teams, he'd be pretty much face. But really, I prefer him as a heel (much like how I prefer everybody with an ounce of charisma as a heel).

Also, that last thing about telling people to stay in school is just too much. That would not fit Christian at ALL.

[Hired Hitman]

I already like him, he is a cool Heel, so playing this character a bit longer people could possibly like him. :cool:

[Heyman]

To some degree, I think Christian could be a smaller scale version of The Rock. Remember how when The Rock was a heel, he kept deluding himself into thinking that he was "The People's Champ"? When he turned face however, he became acknowledged as such..........because the fans got used to him saying it so much. Could the same happen with Christian?


I made this thread a few months back, and I still feel that Christian could become huge. Here's what I'd do starting next Monday.


-DON"T have Christian job to Batista. Have their match be DQ'ed (Triple H interferes). Don't make Batista completely dominate Christian.

-For the next month, have Christian continue to score huge victories. Christian defeats Jericho, HBK, Benjamin, and Edge in singles victories (with the help of Tomko).

-Draft lottery occurs. Christian goes to Smackdown.

-Christian reminds people about the amazing winning streak he's on.......and how he's going to kick Cena's ass.

-Cena and Christian begin their feud, and finally meet at a PPV. Their first decision goes to a No Contest.

-At the PPV after that, Christian defeats Cena to become WWE champion.


-Christian, much like The Rock was back in the day, becomes sooooo good at being a heel.......that the fans basically convert him into a face.

[Londoner]

Who else reckons Christian is the one superstar the WWE have that can match the Rock? I do. Considering all the stuff he has like 'captain charisma' etc...hes very creative with that kind of stuff. Which is why i could see him matching the Rock.

[Loose Cannon]

^^Totally agree

[Fignuts]

And an interpromotional match at WM, between Ediie and christian, to determine who is the best cheater, would be the goods.

[Kane Knight]

Basically - Darkwing Duck was a 'hero' that would usually get this ass-kicked by villains, but would always end up getting the final victory (due to outside forces/luck.........which was mainly because of Dark Wing's daughter and/or friend helping DW out).
So Tomko is Launchpad? :wtf:

[Kane Knight]

Errrr...I think we're missing one point here. The Answer to Eddie Guerrero? Eddie was mad over before they turned him face. He was over even while heel, and while he got pops in Toronto, he hasn't gotten that much elsewherethat I've noticed.

Can he turn face? Yes. Can he be turned into a heelish face? Evev better. Is he anywhere near Eddie? No.

[dalegendkilla]

I thought it was pretty much a certainty that Christian was going to Smackdown in the Draft. As a heel.

[PullMyFinger]

In my opinion, face Christian would kill any kind of momentum he has.

He should continue to portray the same character he has now, and if people want to cheer him for that..then so be it. The face wrestlers that are all goody goody make me sick to my stomach.

Christian should be sent to SD..and be a face for a few weeks...then have him turn into an ultimate heel screwing Cena of his title (a la Rock before/after Survivor Series 98 and Austin).

[Londoner]

^I disagree with you, i think if anything it would gain momentum by turning him slightly face atleast. It's easy for the fans to support him because how he always claims to be peoples champ,and hes funny as fuck on the mic. he really reminds me of the Rock in someways when Rock was a heel.

[KillerWolf]

i like Christian the way he is. as a heel. when someone turns face, they lose their edgy-ness. and Christian would be no exeption. his hillarious mic segments would turn into pandering and catch-phrases.

they should just push his current character into the main event scene.

[Londoner]

I bet you felt that way about the Rock to when he was a heel.

[Kane Knight]

I bet you felt that way about the Rock to when he was a heel.
The Rock DID lose some of his Edge, but in the Current environment, I think he'd be even more stifled.

Look at John Cena. From awesome heel with some risque freestyles to 7 minutes of "the CHAMP IS HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERE!"

It's like from dream theater to linkin park.

[Londoner]

True, though i wasnt into wrestling at the time when rock was a heel, but have some old tapes n shit...so i dunno what the feeling was back then. Though i think Christian could pull off being a proper face.

Kurt Angle is one example of what your talking about though, look when he was heel everyone wanted him to be face, he turned face,and it turned out shit. So, now he's heel again.

[KillerWolf]

I bet you felt that way about the Rock to when he was a heel.
yes.

now, obviously we cant have a roster full of just heels. but it is a FACT that the Rock was more entertaining as 'hollywood heel' than as 'hollywood face'. it is also a fact that when a wrestler turns face, their great mic segments lose a lot of their humor, and become more or less pandering to the crowd.

exceptions: Eddie Guerrero, Steve Austin.

[CYCLOPTERSAURUS]

Christian is a riot. I'm just afraid they'd screw up his gimmick, or make him super-serious or something. Heels are always more entertaining IMO. If the keep his personality as it is now though, it could be cool.