"The next ultimate fighter" is awesome

[Savio]

I'm pumped for next weeks match Coshceck vs Chris. I wanna see these 2 tear each other apart

Anyways I'm glad they made that decision other then kicking someone off.

[Shaggy]

I was gonna make a post about this but since you already did I guess that just means less typing for me....

The whole time this show has been going on I wanted to see Chris get his ass kicked so bad but now im actually rooting for him. Only because of what happened recently. After this week I will boo him again unless he goes against Bobby. This show has gotten real interesting and Im really anticipating the next episode.

As for who should of been kicked off I agree with the let them fight choice. I was hoping that they would do that instead but in my mind I was thinking they wouldnt because of Chris's hand. But the match is set and I cant wait.

[AareDub]

The show is incredible. I'm so pumped for next week, it's gonna be crazy. I think on any normal day Koscheck would've beat the shit out of Leben. He is the most solid athlete on the whole show. He's always the first done with challenges and in that one team challenge he even did half of the other guy's work as well. HOWEVER, they will have to kill Leben to keep him down now. Koscheck took what I think would've been an easy win and fucked himself into a losing situation.

I just don't understand now what happens if Leben wins and still has to live in the house with Southward. It's a shame they're in different weight classes.

[AareDub]

I am so pumped for this fight right now. Is anybody else watching it tonight?

[Shaggy]

I watched it....was a pretty good fight except for the end. Smart tactic keeping him to the mat. I saw a few times in there where Chris could of gotten a submission in but guess he just didnt see it. Pretty good and pretty obvious that UFC will probably look forward to a rematch of this sometime in the future.

[AareDub]

I was really disappointed in the fight. I was starting to believe all of Leben's hype that he was such a great fighter. Throw all that emotion in on top of it and I thought it was going to be one hell of a fight.

Leben's ground skills are horrible. He knew Koscheck was just going to lay on him, yet he kept wrapping his legs around him. How can you expect to escape when you're wrapped around your opponent?

Koscheck was a disappointment as well. I wrestled in high school and college and I know that if you ask any decent wrestler what they feel about people who get ahead and stall, you will get a very negative response. Sure Koscheck said in this situation a win is a win, but I garauntee if you asked him about a staller when he was stil wrestling he would've had some very negative comments. He should be ashamed of himself.

I guess Koscheck deserved the win because if Leben was as good as he claimed, he could've gotten up from those sorry ass covers. However, it's not a victory that Koscheck should be proud of.

[Shaggy]

Yea I hope that if Koscheck wants to win this thing that he works on his ground skills. Both guys had great spots for submissions and at one point Koscheck had Chris ready for one....it was possibly the first time that I was actually yelling at the tv getting pissed that he wasnt going for it.

Training will definently be needed.

[AareDub]

I think what happened is that both men talked so much before hand that they ended up scaring each other. Both men were really too scared to try anything too risky.

[Shaggy]

still pisses me off thought that Chris didnt win. Ive wanted him gone from the start but atleast he should of won this round.

[Shaggy]

Just came across this news:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From MMAWeekly.com:

Quote:SHAMROCK VS FRANKLIN ALMOST SET FOR SPIKE TV

As MMAWeekly.com first reported, it appears Ken Shamrock will face off against Rich Franklin in the main event on the Spike TV free show on April 9th.

The show of course will highlight the 185lb finals and the 205lb finals from the show The Ultimate Fighter on Spike TV.

MMAWeekly has also learned that not only will there be the two final fights, plus the Shamrock vs Franklin main event, but it also appears that other fighters on the TUF show will compete against one another on the free Spike TV show on April 9th.

That means fighters who have been kicked off the show, could come back and fight other fighters who have been or will be booted off the show.

Here's the three guaranteed fights...

The Ultimate Fighter Finals

185 pound Final - TBA vs TBA

205 pound Final - TBA vs TBA

Ken Shamrock vs Rich Franklin - verbally agreed to, waiting for both contracts to be signed according to Shamrock on a radio interview yesterday.

Plus five or six other fights that will take place between fighters who have been or will be kicked off The Ultimate Fighter show

[AareDub]

Awesome! I think the show is definitely acomplishing what it set to, at least for me. I'll watch the free show and I'm probably going to order the next Liddel v Couture ppv as well.

[McDoogle]

Awesome! I think the show is definitely acomplishing what it set to, at least for me. I'll watch the free show and I'm probably going to order the next Liddel v Couture ppv as well.

Definitly agree that the show accomplished what it set out to do and I as well will order the next ppv.

[Shaggy]

I would order the next ppv but I already got my one for the month that I usually set out ot do....Would like to order it. Probably go to a bar around here and watch it.

But yea I think all thanks to this show they now have more people who like the UFC...Im bettin that they do another season of Ultimate Fighter

[Adder]

It's funny how, like already mentioned, you end up disliking Chris but root for him in that particular fight.

It's true what they said about him after the loss, he needs to mature, to "grow up".

Hopefully the show can build back up after this suspense. I feel there may be a let down now that this conflict has passed.

[AareDub]

Tonight's show was pretty good. I agree with the judges decision, as far as punches landed (while striking) and number of takedowns and escapes Bonnar did win. Southworth did do more damage, but that doesn't mean he fought better, he just hits harder.

I'm curious to see who they bring back next week and why. My money would be on Lodun Sincaid. I have no idea why, my only guess would be something to do with Southworth's weight or something. Koscheck didn't seem pissed off about it (if that's what he was even referring to), that means it won't be Leben. I really doubt it would be Thacker. It just occured to me though, if Nate Quarry has to leave due to injury maybe they would bring Karelexis back in to fill his spot. *shrug*

Anybody else have any theories?

[Nark Order]

Bonnar really surprised me. I thought it was a horrible decision made by Team Coture to put Bonnar up against Southworth when they could've had an easy elimination with Sam but they proved me wrong. Bonnar is one toouch son of a bitch, he never quit fighting until the very end.

Bye Bye Bobby....

[Nark Order]

Hopefully the show can build back up after this suspense. I feel there may be a let down now that this conflict has passed.
I think Bobby being eliminated was enough to keep me watching for aw2hile. I didn't think Bonnar had a chance. I'm gonna follow this guy now....

[AareDub]

he never quit fighting until the very end.

Yea, that was impressive. He could barely stand up at then end, yet he managed another takedown in the last minute.

It looks like this show is going to boil down to some very tough competition in the coming weeks.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

It was a pretty damned good fight, it was pretty suspenseful, I had no idea who was going to win. Southworth is a freakin bitch though, if Bonnar lost you could tell he had what it took to accept it. The Leben/Koscheck/Southworth trio are just 3 whiney little bitches, who the sport would probably be better without. I call them whiney little bitches with full knowledge that the 3 of them could whoop me with an arm and a leg tied behind their back, but MEH.

[Apocolyptik1]

This last fight was pretty nice. No KO, but a lot of solid punches thrown and some good take downs. Much better then Leben/Koscheck fight. I didnt know if Bonnar had what it took before he went in but he really suprised me. He took a lot of mean punches in round 1, but also gave a few good ones too. I think he could be one of the final people just because of that display I saw on monday.

Bobby would have definetly been one of the last but that sucks for him. Like Dana White said, the judges rule and you just have to take what you are dealt. If he doesnt like the decision he should of tried harder for a KO or submission.

I saw in the preview for the next show that Bobby starts going off on White and white says something along the lines of "I know you are mad but you arent going to fucking talk to me like that". Its gonna be a good one.

[YOUR Hero]

Sanchez once again killed his opponent. He's got to be the best of the middleweights by far.

[Apocolyptik1]

Wow I watched it monday and felt so bad for Josh. You just watched him get the shit kicked outta him. Poor guy didnt land anything, except on the mat when Deigo took him down and pounded his face in.

[YOUR Hero]

Good riddance to Josh anyways. He didn't have 'it' at all. Nevermind the fact that he wasn't friendly with his new teammates. I mean come on, in the end, it's all about yourself VS your opponent. There's no team in this inside the octagon. Diego showed him just how focused he was and where his friendship really ranked... he held nothing back on Josh, rightly so.

PS. Have you guys seen any of this new show 'The Contender'? Same concept, but about boxers. Sugar Ray and Sylvester Stallone are the chief trainers. It looks damn good. I missed the beginning of the shows premier, but yeah. :y: as well.

[Innovator]

All throughout the episode, all i kept saying was "Diego is gonna fuck him up"

[Anybody Thrilla]

I'm just glad Chris is back.

[Innovator]

and why would that guy skip out on Lidell's practice? Last thing I'd want is the Iceman pissed at me

[Savio]

I like Forrster and that little guy who does the submissions I hope they go to the end.

[AareDub]

Last night's fight was good, but it once again pointed out the flaw of this show. These guys weren't meant to fight a number of fights this close together. If Forrest has to leave because of the cut on his eye that makes 2 contestants that had a very good shot of winning that were forced to leave early. I know Nate Quarry never fought on the show, but you could just tell he would've kicked some ass. I can't wait to see some of the semi finals matches. It seems like Sam and Kenny are the only two easy wins left. I'd really like to see Sanches v. Koscheck and Bonnar v. Forrest (can't remember his last name). I hope those happen at some point. I also really think that Mike Swick could kick some ass, but he should've stayed a middleweight. He may be outmatched in the light heavyweight division.

[Anybody Thrilla]

I don't know what it is exactly, but I can't stand Koscheck.

[AareDub]

Wow, I don't know if I've ever seen anybody legitimately bleed that much before.... and in such a small time frame. Sucks to be Leben, and I wouldn't be surprised to see Florian destroyed in the finals (probably against Sanchez).

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

I dunno Florian is pretty tough, I think he weathered the storm pretty well. That was a sick fight.

[Innovator]

Diego better beat Josh, Josh runs his mouth too much

[Apocolyptik1]

I am not sure if Diego will beat Josh. They are both chain saws on the ground, but I think Josh will pull it out. I dont like Josh, but I think he is going to end up taking Deigo down first because of his size advantage.

I do believe Deigo has had more fights though, so maybe his experience will help him. If you watch the preview for the next show, it shows Josh take Deigo down hardcore in the black gloves. Might be a preview of whats to come.

[Terra Ryzin]

Both fighters last night were impressive, Leben fought real good and Kenny took a beatin pretty hard but seemed to stayed calm and land a few real good shot in there. Im realy surprised Kenny didnt shoot on him more, he is a blackbelt in BJJ and from the vidoes i seen of him he can dominate on the ground.

Though break for Leben, either way we will see hin fight in the UFC probably sooner than later. Chris is a member of Team Quest(as is Nate, since before the show) and Dana is goin to ride the mainstream exposure as much as he can.

Next week, i think Diego beats Josh. Koscheck may out wreslte him, but i think Deigo catches him in a sub. Ate least i hope, i cant stand Josh

[AareDub]

The reason I'm giving next week's match to Diego is based on the two fighting backgrounds. Koscheck is an amatuer wrestler, no matter how much mma training he's had since he was a wrestler (which isn't that much afaik), his very first priority is to stay off his back. I garauntee it. A wrestler is always concerned with his positioning, his balance, and most importantly that his back is not touching that mat.

On the other hand you've got Sanches, a submission fighter (and same with Florian and his brazilian jujitsu), they don't care what position their body is in, they can make you tap on their back, on their knees, on their side, it just doesn't matter.

Koscheck will get a good takedown or two, but once they're down Sanchez will dominate.

[YOUR Hero]

I can't see Sanchez losing. From what I've seen of him, Koscheck and Florian he seems by far the the superior fighter. Florian has heart, no doubt, and I appauld his victory over Leben, but he was losing that fight right up until the nice elbow to his eyebrow.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

I dunno though, up to this point Diego has had some pretty weak looking opponents.

Maybe he's made them look weak, but I think both of his fights were blatant mismatches.

[Apocolyptik1]

I dunno though, up to this point Diego has had some pretty weak looking opponents.

Maybe he's made them look weak, but I think both of his fights were blatant mismatches.

No doubt. Rafferty? I dont even remember the other guy. He will get tested come monday.

Like I said I dont like Josh, but you dont even have to fight to win. Leben is a DAMN good fighter, and look what happend with his first match. Josh took him down and layed on him, DIDNT EVEN DAMAGE, just layed. He is very capible of doing this to Deigo. He is good on the ground, but applying any sort of submission will not be easy.

[AareDub]

No doubt. Rafferty? I dont even remember the other guy. He will get tested come monday.

Like I said I dont like Josh, but you dont even have to fight to win. Leben is a DAMN good fighter, and look what happend with his first match. Josh took him down and layed on him, DIDNT EVEN DAMAGE, just layed. He is very capible of doing this to Deigo. He is good on the ground, but applying any sort of submission will not be easy.

I think that's wrong though, Koscheck was able to just lay on Leben because Leben sucks at submissions. Diego won't care that Koscheck is laying on him, he'll just put a submission lock on his arm or something and make him tap out on top. Just laying there is the last thing Koshcheck should do if he wants to win against Sanchez.

[Lone Wolf]

Sanchez has never been beaten and is a former king of the cage winner. He will most likely tap Koscheck out after a decent ground battle. If kenny plays his ground game right, he'll do better then anyone thinks. He looked bad cause he tried to fight Chris as a striker, not to mention he moved up in weight for the show.

I can't wait to see Sam get his smug ass knocked the fuck out. hopefully it's forrest that does it.

[Apocolyptik1]

Good Fight.

Great ground work by both men. Stand-up was decent coming from ground specialists. Diego did his job. Koscheck I have a few things to say about though:

He did good on striking this match, much better then against Leben. He did however do very poor once again with damaging on the ground. It looked like throughout the match that he was scared of getting hit, which is totally normal I guess from a normal persons stand point (nobody likes getting hit in the face), but for a "fighter" the last thing you need to worry about is what the other guy is going to do to you. Koscheck should have been more offensive throughout the fight. He did a great job on shutting down Diego's submissions. Diego got off one good choke in the first round that tired him, but it didnt seem like it did much to him in the overall.

I was happy with the decision because Diego did win 2 rounds to 1. Koscheck needs to get some more training in, have a few more matches, and I think he will be a great fighter in the end. He's young, is in great shape, and is a good wrestler. Only thing he needs to change is his lame attitude he has.

After watching the previews for next week, did it seem like they will have both fights on one show? The last show was April 9 I think I heard, so that leaves only 1 more Monday night before the 9th, but with 2 fights left. Looks like next Monday will be action packed.

SAM IS GOING TO GET WHOOPED!

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

lol it always takes a while for Forrest to get his head into it, but chris he whooped the shit out of Sam when it came down to it.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

by chris I meant christ.

[Innovator]

I was getting worried about Forrest. It looked like he was really concerned about his eye in the fight. Thank god he clinched and took that fucker out.

[YOUR Hero]

Good fights last night. I like Forrest, hope he wins.

Koscheck, well he got wooped, plain and simple. He was beat up and completely out of gas.

This show's awesome. So is contender.

[AareDub]

I don't like the contender because of the way they edit the fights. I know they have no other option, but it kills the excitement for me. Anyway, that's a different topic.

I've seen a couple of Swick's fights before and I knew he was an awesome fighter but last night's fight against Bonnar blew my mind. It's a shame he moved up to light heavyweight for the show, I would've loved to see a Swick v. Sanchez fight. Forrest v. Bonnar will be pretty good though, they are both heavy hitting strikers and they both have good submission/ground skills.

Everybody from the show is going to have another fight at the finale, but they aren't being televised. Off the top of my head these are the ones I remember..

Leven v. Thacker
Quarry v. Sincaid
Southworth v. Hogar
Swick v. Schounouer (both have dropped to 185)

The rest are fighting too, but I can't remember who fights who. They have the matches posted at www.ufc.tv

[John la Rock]

can't wait to see Ken Shamrock next week :love:

[YOUR Hero]

The edit of the fights in contender is a bit of a let down, there's no denying it. Anyways...


Swick was two seconds away from getting out of that round. Too bad for him....LOL when he had Bonner in that guillatine, just about had him early. He'll be a hell of a fighter they claim, once he drops down to middleweight.

Getting pumped over here.

[Innovator]

Yeah Swick was too small going up against a natural 205er. He would be better off at 185.

Oh yeah I was happy as shit when Koscheck got a nice purple forehead.

LETS GO DIEGO!

[Savio]

Is it friday at 9 or saturday at 9?

[YOUR Hero]

Saturday.

[James Steele]

All I have to say about the finale is "Holy Shit!"


Seriously,


Diego got a TKO victory in under 3 minutes. (I thought it would be a quick victory, but damn).

The Forrest/Stephen fight was literally just "HOLY SHIT" the entire fight.

Then Ken Shamrock getting TKO'd in the first round in under 3 minutes was just shocking. I was shocked.

I can't wait for Season 2, and I am a UFC fanboy now. I would say that The Ultimate Fighter did exactly what it wanted to do.

[slextremely]

Poor Shamrock, if he would'nt have slipped who knows what would have happened. :-\

[James Steele]

Indeed, I was marking out (ala Chris Jericho Style for me) because I am relatively new to MMA and stuff and I was wanting Shamrock to rip the bastards leg or foot off.


Oh well, Shamrock is still the man!

[YOUR Hero]

I can't believe I missed the finale.

Well I can, I took the family out for dinner and a movie, forgot to set the vcr. When I got home and turned it on, the Shamrock fight was just about to start so I got to see that one. What a fight. Even though it was over fastish it was very even and action packed.

They did a re-cap of the earlier fights and all I can do is " :'( " because it sounds like I missed one hell of a show.

Even though I know who won, I hope they repeat it so I can see it for myself.

This show rocks. I hope the exposure they got tonight, propels them into a new bigger and better marketplace. These guys deserve it as far as I'm concerned.

[James Steele]

SpikeTV will be reairing it tommorrow before HeAT if I believe.

[YOUR Hero]

Yup, WOOO tommorow 10pm.

[Bazooka]

Well, I predicted the fights right, with Diego and Forrest (im not good with names) winning. It was all in all an awesome show. Forest came out to Vampiro's them preformed by ICP which I thought was strange, isn't Vampiro repeated many times in that song? I use his pics for c-fedding so I was just curious by that.

Shamrock lost to that one dude which sucked, I dunno if he's worse now than he was before but the last few times I've seen Shamrock, he's lost in the UFC.

I don't normally watch UFC but this tournament show caught my eye, although alot of the guys training are not that smart, they're still awesome fighters and it payed off in the end. UFC "Ultimate Fighter" brought in alot of mainstream, next season should be all right.

[Innovator]

WOW....the Forrest/Stephen fight was amazing. I didn't know which way the judges would go. Forrest kept coming though, after getting hit with those knees he kept on coming.

Diego is the man

I couldn't believe Shamrock got TKOed. As soon as Franklin got on top and layed into him, I knew it was over. Shamrock wasn't expecting a barrage of fists to his face I think, he thought Rich would try and wrestle him. HUGE win for Rich Franklin, this boosts him up in the UFC.

[The Outlaw]

Pritty hot

[Terra Ryzin]

Dana should be on his knees for Forest and Bonnar right now. He was seeing dollar signs with every punch that landed(and damn that was alot!). They put on one of the best MMA matches ever and the time couldnt have been more perfect. Both of them showed an insane amount of heart and toughness, though they arent near ready for any of the top LHW's but both have huge potential.

Classy move by Dana giving Stephan a contract, not to mention great business move too. Its too bad that match went to the judges, didnt like the decision. I dont see how Forrest unanamous, if even at all.

Diego/Kenny was pretty much what i expected. I though Kenny would go longer than he did, but Deigo was just dominating. Would love to see Diego fight Lawler in his first UFC match. For some reason i just dont like him.


I saw Franklin beating Shamrock, but damn that was quick. Kenny is done, hopefully that was it for him. Amazin career and a poineer of MMA and the UFC. Looks like Franklin/Tanner at 53.

Overall TUF was huge for the UFC and MMA in general. We will see at least 3(Diego,Bonnar,Forrerst) from the show, and id be surprised if at least Nate and possibly Leben dont get a show. the casual and new TUF fans already have some name and faces to know.

[Apocolyptik1]

Shamrock lost to that one dude which sucked, I dunno if he's worse now than he was before but the last few times I've seen Shamrock, he's lost in the UFC.



Ken Shamrocks last match was almost a year ago against another fighter named Kimo Leopoldo in UFC on June 19 of 2004. Ken Shamrock won by KO from one of the most brutal knee shots I have ever seen a man take. It was infact so brutal it made the top 10 knockouts in UFC show that airs on spike TV sometimes. Rich Franklin has I think 3 spots in the show also. The kid has some good hands.

Before that match with Kimo, Ken Shamrock hasnt had a match with the MMA since his November 22, 2002 lost to Tito Ortiz.

[Loose Cannon]

Here's the thing. I see a lot of you talking about how you hope it gets bigger.

Well, I really can't see how it would get any bigger. With this kind of product, the only way for it to get bigger would to be on mainsteam TV. And I'm not talking about the reality show, I'm talking about the fights being on TV all the time. But without any stories or anything like that, I don't see that happening. Who wants to watch guys fighting in a cage every week? It's life is only going to survive on PPV. So that puts a limit on to how big it can get.

Now the problem is, All these new fans that watched the show aren't going to all of a sudden going to start forking out $35 to watch this on PPV. If there goal from this show was to get a few more buys for the next couple of PPV's, yea, they probably suceeded. But 4 months from now, I really see it just fading away. When UF 2 comes on again, people will probably watch, but a lot will have forgotten about UFC by then.

But what if? What if they did start to write scripts and stories for thier characters. Now unlike wrestling, everything that goes on in the cage/ring would all be real. No bullshit fakeness here. But outside the ring, they created a world like wrestling. Heels, babyfaces, stables, etc.... Would that sell? In my opinion, I think it would not only sell, but I think it would be over more then WWE right now.

Look, people love drama, but people also love to see good fights. Well males for that part at least. But if you add a little soap opera storylines to the reality in the ring, you could bring in an audience from a lot of different segments.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

Sorry Loose Cannon, that was possibly the dumbest thing I've ever read.

You don't need big storylines when it's billed as something that is real and as a brutal sport. They need to have cable specials a week before every ppv because that'll garner huge ratings and people will learn about the ppv via the promoting.

Don't bastardize MMA, wrestling is a business for dirty carny hicks, MMA is a business for guys who train their nuts off and have more integrity than that.

[Loose Cannon]

Usually the dumbest things read become the greatest ideas. If you don't know that, look at the history of some big time products. Telling you right now. It's not going to get that much bigger with how it is now. You think they are going to get cable specials a week before PPV's when people have no clue a PPV is even on? Why would they watch the special? It's a pretty big risk for reward chance for Spike or whomever. The way it is now, it doesn't appeal to a mass audience. Really just males 25-34 demographic.

And you're last statement makes absolutely no sense at all. Makes you come off real ignorant too. You think wrestlers don't train as hard as these guys? I'll argue they train harder. More integrity? How? That's a pretty bold statement to make. "Westling is a business for dirty carnyy hicks" :lol: Tell Vince McMahon that. :y: Wrestling is a business and so is this. What's your point?

Hey maybe I'm wrong and UFC will start to appeal to a mass audience. But right now, I just don't see that happening without a few changes. Maybe HBO/SHO shows will be as far as they can go.

[YOUR Hero]

Sorry Loose Cannon, that was possibly the dumbest thing I've ever read.

[Loose Cannon]

well I expected that from you :y:

Anyway, that's my idea to make it more 'mainstream' and accepted by not just one audience.

Do you guys have any? Other then a reality show of course.

[YOUR Hero]

I simply think if the show was aired on regular TV, like boxing, it would develop a bigger fanbase. It doesn't need to be bastardized with soap operatic plots.

They could televise past PPV matches and/or undercard matches of up and comers. It doesn't have to be weekly, as I don't know if there's enough depth in the sport to support that. However bi-weekly on 'ESPN2' or something would be viable. Mix in the Spike TV airing of 'The Ultimate Fighter' every year of 6 months, and I'd say they'd gain a much larger fan base.

I think some personal background and the like of the fighters is a great idea, as it helps you 'connect' to them better, but NEVER EVER would I consider trying to produce heels and faces and stables. Perhaps you didn't realize on 'The Ultimate Fighter' that that stuff sort of develpoed on it's own. Without being forced. You can't make that stuff up.

[Innovator]

When Tito and Chuck Liddell fought, Tito was running his mouth the entire time. Chuck just said, "he's got a big mouth and I'm gonna shut it up". Just their natural promo spots and previous fight experiences made Tito a heel. When Tito went down, the place went apeshit and it boosted Liddell up huge.

Point being, you don't need to make heels and faces. They come out naturally. If they got on HBO, I think it'd be huge for UFC.

[Loose Cannon]

Ok, see your points.

Innovator: When did this Liddell/Tito promo spots go down? I never saw it or heard anything of it. See, what they need is a "show" or anything on TV where you give these guys time to say what they have to say about thier opponent and thier match. Just promoting a match on PPV of "this guy" vs "this guy" really does nothing if you're not a UFC fan.

Yea, Hero, you're right, and that's what I was actually trying to get at. You need these guys to have personalities for people to connect with. I'm sure some of these guys are arrogant jackasses in real life, so have that come across on TV. Maybe the "face/heel." thing is a little over the top, but they to show personality with thier main guys.

And with Ultimate Fighter, I know that people came off as jackasses and alliances developed on the show. But that's a reality show like Tough Enough, with a minimal shelf life.. It's not the "main show." I want to see UFC have a weekly or bi-weekly show. But with how they are right now, kind of exactly like Boxing, I don't see it going a lot further and I would love to see it.

And by the way, Boxing is struggling right now to bring in the casual fans. Its reality TV shows like "The Contender" are doing bad numbers and it's PPV's aren't really that appealing anymore.

[Loose Cannon]

Basically to sum everything up. My main point is this:

In two months, how does a casual fan follow UFC, without any kind of show, any kind or publicity, and without paying $35 for a PPV?

Myself would be a perfect example of a casual fan. Until Ultimate Fighter aired, I had no idea who anyone was in UFC, had no idea of the rules, or anything. I onLy knew that Ken Shamrock and Dan Severn faught in UFC. That's it.

Now I know a little more from the reality show, but know the reality show is gone for a while, so what's left for me?

[YOUR Hero]

Tito Ortiz and Kevin Randelman (spelling?) were great natural heels. They were cocky and they thought they were invinsible. Not so bad, unless of course you go around stating it and bad mouthing other people. Showing 'specials' on guys like these, "their rise and fall", would be great IMO. Then you do the same thing with Ken Shamrock and others.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

Wrestling is a carny business man. It's all about conning people into believing it is real. And Vince McMahon is the biggest of the hicks, look how juiced up he is. I dunno, but a 50+ year old guy who runs a company doing steroids and who's probably cheated on his wife more times than most guys have had sex screams hick to me.

UFC guys train every god damned day, and are in far better shape than a pro wrestler, pro wrestlers are just juiced.

Plus the reality show will be back, and instead of trying to go carny you could just promote it professionally once the reality show runs its course, you know show undercard bouts every 2 or so weeks, show classic matches, profile guys and pump up ppvs.

You don't need to make it like pro wrestling because then it's no longer unique, it becomes like Roller Jam or that stupid trampoline basketball deal TNN tried.

[James Steele]

Slamball was the shits you son of a bitch! :rant:

[Loose Cannon]

I don't know, maybe your use of the word carney and hick is different from America's or something. Don't know how you can call a billion dollar corporation carney. Here the word carney is reserved for traveling side shows that make $200 a month. The word hick is reserved for racist hillybilly's from the south, who live in trailor parks. Don't see the hick in Vince McMahon.

And I think you're thinking from an 80's perspectivce there or something. I don't think the WWE is "conning" anybody anymore :lol: And if anybody still thinks wrestling is real, they're fucking stupid.

Do you seriously believe wrestlers don't train every god dam day? I thought you were smarter then that. Of course they do. Have you not watched any of these WWE shows where wrestlers talked about thier "personal" lives or read ANY wrestling books out there, have you see the DVD's, have you ever been to a wrestling school? "PRO WRESTLERS ARE JUST JUICED." That's it huh? Just inject and done for the day right?

And are you so sure none of these UFC guys are juiced? Cause they train really really hard everyday of thier lives right?

I'm getting off topic, I know, but to see someone post ignorant crap like about the wrestlers and the business, when the facts aren't even close, just amazes me.

[Loose Cannon]

Oh and Hero, yea I agree with that. If these guys really come off as natural heels, then they really should run with that and start promoting these guys into the main stream.

[James Steele]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Loose Cannon again.

[YOUR Hero]

Yeah, just edit fights and interviews they've done. You can show their nasty or goodly side easy in that manner.

PS the replay is underway. The first fight is about to take place.


I wouldn't discount how much training WWE or other pro wrestlers do Dave.

[YOUR Hero]

Diego killed Kenny, OMG, the bastard.

He was way better. I knew he'd win, I had predicted it, plus read what you guys had to say after seeing it yesterday. I didn't think however that Diego would win by such a wide margin.

[YOUR Hero]

OMG OMG OMG


These guys are insane.

2 rounds so far and I can't believe just how much action there has been.
At this point I'd have to say the fights even. 1st round Griffin, 2nd round Bonner.

[YOUR Hero]

What a fight, these two had. Seriously, that was a fight to remember. I can see now whysome of you guys thought that it should have been a split decision. I say that as a Forrest fan.

[AareDub]

Well, I really can't see how it would get any bigger. With this kind of product, the only way for it to get bigger would to be on mainsteam TV. And I'm not talking about the reality show, I'm talking about the fights being on TV all the time. But without any stories or anything like that, I don't see that happening. Who wants to watch guys fighting in a cage every week? It's life is only going to survive on PPV. So that puts a limit on to how big it can get.

Yea, and without scripted storylines and drama who would want to watch a bunch of grown men playing football every weekend, or play an entire season of baseball. It ridiculous!!

But anyway, my comments on the finale..

The Sanchez/Florian match was pretty much what I expected, but damn they need to let Sanchez talk a lot less on the mic in the future. The Sanchez/Koscheck match would've been much more suited for this show.

Bonnar v. Griffin... holy shit. If I had to bet money going into the fight I was betting on Bonnar simply for the fact that if it came down to submissions I thought Griffin would tap before Bonnar. I guess you all saw how much effect any of that had on the fight. I had no real bias for who I wanted to win, I thought both men were equally deserving. I was doing my own scoring at home and I came up with the same decision the judges did. The first round was close but Griffin landed more punches and was aggressive with takedown attempts. Round 2 went to Bonnar without a doubt, he did more damage, he kept coming, and all Griffin did for most of the last 2 minutes or so was stall and try to make it to the last round. Round 3 went to Griffin because of his agressiveness with the takedowns and the amount of punches he threw. Bonnar was agressive as well, but nothing he did in the 3rd seemed to do much damage (other than drawing more blood). Dana White would've been an idiot not to give both of those men a contract.

The Franklin/Shamrock match was entertaining but short. The only real observation I made here was how much quicker these experienced guys react, how much tighter their holds were, and really just how skilled and refined they were compared to the young guys on the show.

If anybody is interested in the undercard results...

Sam Hogar d. Bobby Southworth by split decision after 3 rounds
-said to be a really bad fight with almost no action at all

Chris Leben d. Jason Thacker by punches in the 1st round

Nate Quarry d. Lodune Sincaid by ref stoppage in the 1st round

Josh Koscheck d. Chris Sanford by KO in round 1

Mike Swick d. Alex Schounouer by KO in 20 SECONDS IN ROUND 1!!!

Alex Karalexis d. Josh Rafferty by KO in round 1

[Loose Cannon]

Yea, and without scripted storylines and drama who would want to watch a bunch of grown men playing football every weekend, or play an entire season of baseball. It ridiculous!!

That was a shot at me right? Probably. Anyway, the baseball argument is pretty ridiculous as baseball has lost a ton of popularity and comparing baseball to ulitmate fighter is like comparing apples to oranges. Even comparing football to that is pretty ridiculous because Football has been around for ages, has a ton of sponsors, corporations, TV deals behind it and is a such a different sport then ultimate fighting. Same with Baseball too.

UFC has been around for a while now and it hasn't really went anywhere, since it began, until this year. This upcoming PPV is going to be crucial for them.

The only thing you can compare UFC with is Boxing, Karate, and all the other martial art crap.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

I know wrestlers train hard, but I'm looking at it from a certain standpoint.

Pro wrestling is not a business built around dignity...it's always been one to con people. Whether or not they do it anymore is irrelevant, it's still the point of the business. And even now that they have come out and said "this is fake" (circa 1997) the storylines are so hick, I mean necrophillia? come on. Sure there are aspects of pro wrestling MMA can adapt, like cutting promos, but they already have that. If you bastardize it into pro wrestling, it loses the uniqueness that it's supposed to have.

And MMA guys are generally not juiced, because there is standardized drug testing, if they're caught juicing they are fired.

Now of course UFC hasn't gotten anywhere, it's only been around for 10 or so years and it hadn't gotten a television deal, now it has, and now is its chance to lift off. You can adapt some pro wrestling aspects like cutting promos and whatnot, and showing montages of guys training, but they don't need to be attacking each other in the locker room and triangle choking each other's wives, because then it becomes a farce, where pro-wrestling is already somewhat of a farce and always has been.

[AareDub]

That was a shot at me right? Probably. Anyway, the baseball argument is pretty ridiculous as baseball has lost a ton of popularity and comparing baseball to ulitmate fighter is like comparing apples to oranges. Even comparing football to that is pretty ridiculous because Football has been around for ages, has a ton of sponsors, corporations, TV deals behind it and is a such a different sport then ultimate fighting. Same with Baseball too.

I'm not saying the sports are anything alike, just that they both are sports. Football is just an example of a sport that comes on every week (for half of the year) that has no story lines or scripts and people love it. If something like the UFC had more mainstream exposure it could become very popular. Do I think it will ever be as popular as football or even boxing? No, not really, but that wasn't my point. I just wanted to point out that not everything needs to have a script to make it interesting.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

Yeah, MMA is a sport, not sports entertainment.

[Savio]

And are you so sure none of these UFC guys are juiced? Cause they train really really hard everyday of thier lives right?One of the champs was juiced and had to drop the title.

[Savio]

UFC should have a show on spike where every week no names got at each other and the main event is a well known kickin the crap out of a rookie.

[Loose Cannon]

heh.

And who ever said UFC wasn't a sport? I never said it wasn't.

[Loose Cannon]

One of the champs was juiced and had to drop the title.

heh. Nice argument there Dale if that's true.

[Loose Cannon]

UFC should have a show on spike where every week no names got at each other and the main event is a well known kickin the crap out of a rookie.

Exactly. That's what I would do. And also take time to introduce the "main guys" to the public. Show old footage, have them talk etc....

[Savio]

heh. Nice argument there Dale if that's true.Why would I lie? He was in the main evet at UFC 48 and broke his arm I forgot his name.

[Savio]

Tim Sylvia (http://www.ufc.tv/fighterPage/fighterPage.asp?weightClass=Heavyweight&fighterID=286) was his name tpye his name ans steriod in to google.

[Loose Cannon]

I need to get me some of the old school UFC fights. Like the very first ones when there was no weight classes.

[Loose Cannon]

Tim Sylvia (http://www.ufc.tv/fighterPage/fighterPage.asp?weightClass=Heavyweight&fighterID=286) was his name tpye his name ans steriod in to google.

:y: I saw

[Savio]

Shut up Loose Cannon













j/k

[M. Banana]

Was I only one to mark out when Shamrock lost?

Can we use mark out when talking about UFC?

[YOUR Hero]

I need to get me some of the old school UFC fights. Like the very first ones when there was no weight classes.
Some great stuff. Guys fighting 2,3,4 times a night. One style of fighter against another. Some real train wrecks.

[The Outlaw]

Some great stuff. Guys fighting 2,3,4 times a night. One style of fighter against another. Some real train wrecks.
Word...

[Innovator]

UFC hits vol 1, Tank Abbott knocks a guy stiff

[YOUR Hero]

Wrestling is a carny business man. It's all about conning people into believing it is real. And Vince McMahon is the biggest of the hicks, look how juiced up he is. I dunno, but a 50+ year old guy who runs a company doing steroids [...]
LOL, I was re-reading this topic and had to go find a Vinny Mac photo.

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

Case

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

and

[Ol Dirty Dastard]

point.

[M. Banana]

w

[M. Banana]

t

[M. Banana]

f

[James Steele]

Vince just busted his ass really really hard. Hell, didn't any of you see the training highlight videos?


:shifty:

[Savio]

So is shamrock done for good?

[AareDub]

That's what they made it sound like after the fight. I don't think they said for sure though.

[Innovator]

Next season is Heavyweights and Welterweights

[YOUR Hero]

Have they stated when the next eason starts?

[Innovator]

I think they're just casting now, I haven't heard anything else

[Nark Order]

I didn't even hear that they were gonna do a second season. That's fuckin sweet. I hope Leben somehow weasels his way on the show again... I like that guy.

[AareDub]

I didn't even hear that they were gonna do a second season. That's fuckin sweet. I hope Leben somehow weasels his way on the show again... I like that guy.

Probably won't happen because his weightclass won't be on the show at all.

If anybody is interested in the results of UFC 52 show....






Liddel won by KO in round 1.

[Apocolyptik1]

I watched the ppv. Had some ok matches in it.

I wanted Chuck to win too. I used to live in San Lious Obispo, just a few blocks from where Chucks gym is. I have met him a couple of times on occasion. He is a crazy sob. One day I was at his gym with my brother and Chuck was their just sitting around talking to guys. My brother wanted to talk to him so we went over and had a chat with him. Halfway through the conversation I got thirsty, so I went and got a soda and whenever I came back my brother and chuck were just sitting their staring at each other like real uncomfertable like. After we had left I asked him what the hell happened and apparently while I was gone, my brother asked Chuck if he was scared of anyone in San Lious and Chuck just looked up at him and said "I am not scared of any motherfucker on this planet." He said after that they kinda just didnt say anything until I came back. He said he felt like shitting his pants.

The KO punch was pretty nasty that Randy took. Right on his left side of his jaw, and as he was going down Chuck just jumped on him and hit him 3 or 4 more times. Randy was laying on the mat for a couple of minutes while Chuck ran around the ring and was celebrating. He didnt get up until the end where they raised Chucks hands. He had the damn I just got hit by a freight train look in his eyes.

[AareDub]

So many people are trying to blame the KO on the eye poke thing. They can't seem to accept that Couture got knocked the fuck out. He should've known better than to try and stand up agains Liddel 2 fights in a row. He's probably lucky he didn't get knocked out the first time.

[Rob]

Sorry did you see the first fight? Randy was hardly lucky he didn't get KO'd. His standing was better than Liddell's. Ignore the eyepoke if you want but it blatantly happened.

[AareDub]

Sorry did you see the first fight? Randy was hardly lucky he didn't get KO'd. His standing was better than Liddell's. Ignore the eyepoke if you want but it blatantly happened.

I meant he was lucky that Chuck wasn't on his game during the first fight. Randy WAS better that night, but he shouldn't have let himself believe that he would be better again. I think most people would agree that Liddel is way better at standing up than he showed during the first fight, Couture should've known he was going to bring it x10 this time around. He should've known he would have to take this one to the ground.

[Apocolyptik1]

Sorry did you see the first fight? Randy was hardly lucky he didn't get KO'd. His standing was better than Liddell's. Ignore the eyepoke if you want but it blatantly happened.

The only reason why Chuck's standup wasnt as good as normal was because he didnt know how to go at Randy. The whole fight he couldnt find his space for striking, and thats why he lost.

The 2nd fight was obviously different. Chuck knew what he was doing going into this fight, and YES it was very stupid on Randy's part to try to go the same gameplan as the first fight. NO ONE goes into a rematch and repeats whatever they did in their first fight. Thats just out right stupidity.

The eye poke happened, but Randy said it was ok to continue. You cant blame a loss on something if you say that you are fine to continue. He got caught in the face, not because of the eyepoke, but because he thought "Hey I beat Chuck on standup last fight, I will do it again!".

[Apocolyptik1]

I started to think about it, and this is Randy's first KO with a punch since he moved down a weightclass. When he was heavier, he was getting hit in the face by stronger guys and not going down.

This just makes me wonder how hard Chuck can actually hit if he is KO'ing a guy that was not KO'ed by people who are bigger then him. That punch to the face must of hurt realll bad.

[Rob]

The eye poke happened, but Randy said it was ok to continue. You cant blame a loss on something if you say that you are fine to continue. He got caught in the face, not because of the eyepoke, but because he thought "Hey I beat Chuck on standup last fight, I will do it again!".

I never directly blamed it on the eyepoke. Doctor cleared him, Randy wanted to fight so it's not a direct excuse. It still played a major part in the fight though.

[Savio]

Was it a waterboy style eyepoke?

[Rob]

No it was a open handed punch where the fingers scraped against Couture's face and in his eye socket.

[Jacko]

That's 2-0 for Courture on the poke.

Nowhere near as bad as the Belfort one :D