The real difference between Marvel and DC?

[Danny Electric]

Loads of them are either mutants, or have been mutated by something. :p

Shut it Highlander.

[SukkaChump]

I dunno guys, i suppose this has been kinda bugging me ever since i started reading comics, but why is it that most to all Marvel superheroes are mutants and go by their real name? like everyone in the comic book world knows that Jean Grey is well.. Jean grey, and Cyclops is scott summers, even though they wear costumes and such.

Why is it that all of Marvel is mutants and all of DC have to do mainly with space or some other kind of alien beings? and how come all of them dont hide their alter egos well? i mean what the fuck, Superman puts on glasses and a suit and combs his hair over and no on notices? i mean is it for comedy factor or what?

but yeah, i just needed to get the jist of that off my chest, its been bugging me

[Gouda]

Marvel, everybody is mutants.

DC, everybody is an alien, a rich boy, or has been caught in some science experiment.

[el fregadero]

Heard some comedian talking about that Superman thing. If Superman is supposed to be this super powerful amazing guy, why would you see Clark Kent at work with his glasses on at the newspaper thing and say "hey, if he wasn't wearing glasses, and had a cape and some spandex, he would look just like Superman".

I dunno, it was something like that if you know what I'm saying.

[SukkaChump]

also are there any superhero's you'd think to be gay? like flaming homosexual gay? not even on purpous...

Beast gets my vote, from the X-Men cartoon version, wearing a speedo and spouting off poetry and random logic Equals one big gay blue monkey

[Danny Electric]

In the last few years their has been gay X-Men characters.

Plus not all Marvel characters are mutants really, just the more well known ones.

[Face Heely]

Right, 'cause poetry is sooo gay. I mean, c'mon, take a look at Walt Whitman. Err, umm, I mean, uhh, Edna St. Vincent Millay. No, wait, umm...Sappho?

Okay, maybe you have a point there.

Anyway, one of the most iconoclastic elements of Watchmen (which can practically be read as a treastise on the superhero genre) was the "outing" of various superheroes in that universe. Not a major plot point, but another clever take on the traditional superheroic image.

[BlackDawn2024]

Even though she's not a superhero, Maggie Sawyer from the Superman comics is a lesbian.

[M. Banana]

The real difference?

Marvel > DC

[The Destroyer]

In the last few years their has been gay X-Men characters.

Plus not all Marvel characters are mutants really, just the more well known ones.
Loads of them are either mutants, or have been mutated by something. :p

[Jonster]

Heard some comedian talking about that Superman thing. If Superman is supposed to be this super powerful amazing guy, why would you see Clark Kent at work with his glasses on at the newspaper thing and say "hey, if he wasn't wearing glasses, and had a cape and some spandex, he would look just like Superman".

I dunno, it was something like that if you know what I'm saying.
Because it's not just on looks, it's in his mannerisms as well.

[mitchables]

Heard some comedian talking about that Superman thing. If Superman is supposed to be this super powerful amazing guy, why would you see Clark Kent at work with his glasses on at the newspaper thing and say "hey, if he wasn't wearing glasses, and had a cape and some spandex, he would look just like Superman".

I dunno, it was something like that if you know what I'm saying.

It's the same thing with Superman and his facade as Clark Kent - a lot of people have said to me over time "his secret disguise is a pair of GLASSES. As if people wouldn't realise it was him". This isn't so - for it ISN'T just the glasses, as often suggested. It's the fact that Clark is slovenly (in some cases, he has been shown as quite fat and out of shape - other times he just appears unkempt), quiet, mild-mannered, a fence-sitter and a lover of all things sugar-n-spice. When looking at a man FUELED BY THE EARTH'S SUN, built like a brick shithouse, and who has the ability to fly, see through solid objects, lift ridiculous amounts of weight and countless other amazing abilities, you're not gonna say, "heeeeeeeeeey... if he was wearing glasses...y'know...he'd look a lot like old Clarky. Must be the same guy!"

We've been through this. :mad:

[mitchables]

Marvel, everybody is mutants.

DC, everybody is an alien, a rich boy, or has been caught in some science experiment.

Exceptions to your Marvel rule (including, but not limited to): The Incredible Hulk; The Punisher; Daredevil; Elektra; Spider-Man; Iron Man; Captain America; Fantastic Four; Thor; Blade; Ghost Rider; Captain Britain; Captain Marvel; Hawkeye [RIP]; and Power Man/Luke Cage.

Exceptions to your DC rule (including, but not limited to): Hawkman; Hawkgirl; Hal Jordan, John Stewart and Kyle Rayner (Green Lanterns); Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Tim Drake and Stephanie Brown (Robins); Aquaman; Aqualad; Apache Chief; Captain Marvel; Arsenal; Wonder Woman; Barbara Gordon and Cassandra Cain (Batgirls); Booster Gold; the Wizard Shazam; Raven; John Constantine; Black Canary; Elongated Man; The Spectre; Adam Strange; Steel (John Irons); and Zatanna.

Personally, I think the main difference between the two labels is how they tell their stories. Recently, Marvel (and specifically Brian Michael Bendis) has been focusing very much on the people behind the masks and their struggles, as opposed to actual superhero adventure. This has been apparent in the Disassembled arcs, and especially in Bendis' recent Daredevil run. Marvel has been trying (too hard, some might argue) to make their characters more 'human'. :-\ DC has followed suit with all their stuff leading up to Infinite Crisis, but it's still mainly about the actual heroes.

I dunno. Just a thought. :-\

[Danny Electric]

I love Mitch.

[Danny Electric]

Yeah with the new Ultimate's series, Marvel has tried to make them more human.

[mitchables]

Yeah. In some cases it's been good. Like the Disassembled series was hell good reading, and the Punisher's recent arc, Up is Down and Black is White has been awesome. But honestly, Bendis made me want to kill him when he did Daredevil. Long monologues by a blind man staring at a wall does not = ratings. :n:

Hopefully DC don't screw up with their All-Star line. I have a good feeling though. All-Star Batman and Robin, the Boy Wonder is being done by Frank Miller and Jim Lee, so it's gonna be very hard for them to screw that up. :love:

[mitchables]

I dunno guys, i suppose this has been kinda bugging me ever since i started reading comics, but why is it that most to all Marvel superheroes are mutants and go by their real name? like everyone in the comic book world knows that Jean Grey is well.. Jean grey, and Cyclops is scott summers, even though they wear costumes and such.

Why is it that all of Marvel is mutants and all of DC have to do mainly with space or some other kind of alien beings? and how come all of them dont hide their alter egos well? i mean what the fuck, Superman puts on glasses and a suit and combs his hair over and no on notices? i mean is it for comedy factor or what?

but yeah, i just needed to get the jist of that off my chest, its been bugging me

Okay, what. You don't even know what you are talking about, here. I would say (talking DC) that commissioning Zatanna to WIPE THE MINDS OF VILLAINS WHO FIND OUT THEIR IDENTITIES is taking pretty decent steps to hide their alter egos, y'know? Even then, Superman is only one example, and a poor one at that. Everyone else seems to do alright at masking who they are, with the exception of Ralph Dibney, and look where that got him.

[mitchables]

also are there any superhero's you'd think to be gay? like flaming homosexual gay? not even on purpous...

Beast gets my vote, from the X-Men cartoon version, wearing a speedo and spouting off poetry and random logic Equals one big gay blue monkey


Beast has a wife, in some incarnations, so there goes that theory.

I know that Black Cat, Mystique, Frostbite, Mephisto and Paradox are all bisexuals.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Exceptions to your DC rule (including, but not limited to): Hawkman; Hawkgirl;

To be fair that only applies to the very first incarnation. After the 50s or so they has been 'officially' aliens.

[Danny Electric]

Northstar is openly gay too.

[Lamuella]

the biggest difference between Marvel and DC is twofold:

1) Power. DC heroes tend to be more powerful. There are few mainstream Marvel characters as powerful as Green Lantern, for example, and almost none (outside of elder gods and so forth) as powerful as Superman.
2) Power source. Marvel has fewer sources of super power, and more central origins for that power. Few people are born with powers, most gaining them from artifacts (quantum bands), accidents (being bitten by a spider, gamma rays) or alterations (super soldier serum). Those that are born with super powers tend to be either mutants (X-Men) or non-humans (Namor, Skrulls). DC has characters whose powers come from similar sources such as wizards (Captain Marvel), lab accidents (The Flash), alien rings (Green Lantern), inventions (starman), being from another race (aquaman), but a much larger number of characters simply have their powers because they have their powers, or because of badly explained origins like "a strange meteor fell by my house". Also, more people are simply born superheroes. In short, there seems to be a lot more "super-ness" just floating around the DC universe.

[Lamuella]

Okay, what. You don't even know what you are talking about, here. I would say (talking DC) that commissioning Zatanna to WIPE THE MINDS OF VILLAINS WHO FIND OUT THEIR IDENTITIES is taking pretty decent steps to hide their alter egos, y'know? Even then, Superman is only one example, and a poor one at that. Everyone else seems to do alright at masking who they are, with the exception of Ralph Dibney, and look where that got him.

Barry Allen was "out" as a superhero by the end as well.

And it was pretty obvious to all concerned that Ollie Queen was Green Arrow. There's an excellent moment in Quiver where he's pretending just to be "green arrow's buddy" and gets called on it by some random kid.

[Fryza]

*shrug* DC seems to be boring to me- minus Hellblazer, Swamp Thing, and Batman. They just seem to rehash several stories over, the heroes are almost cartoonish in a sense (Superman is pretty much indestructible, you know he's going to win), or they're just... Useless (I don't think I really have to explain myself with the likes of Aquaman).

Marvel just seems to have more character in their characters... I dunno, not a comic fanatic though...

[Lamuella]

Fryza, have you read "Identity Crisis"? It was a big help for me in making DC characters less one-dimensional.

Also, if you enjoyed Hellblazer and Swamp thing, you really need to read The Sandman. I'm guessing you have.

[Danny Electric]

From what I've read from the Sandman series, it is awesome.

Also add to Hitman to another great DC series and I'm not 100% certain whether it's DC but the Preacher series too. Vertigo is a part of DC isn't it?

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Yeah Vertigo is a DC imprint

The thing I find with Superman is most of the time I agree with Fryza, on the surface he's terribly boring, indestructible, etc etc. It depends how he's written though, and from what perspective. Superman: Red Son and the current Lex Luthor: Man of Steel are awesome, awesome stories.

[Lamuella]

From what I've read from the Sandman series, it is awesome.

Also add to Hitman to another great DC series and I'm not 100% certain whether it's DC but the Preacher series too. Vertigo is a part of DC isn't it?

Hitman and Preacher are awesome, mainly because Garth Ennis is the man.

Good comics that Vertigo and Wildstorm (DC imprints) publishe/published

All of the America's Best Comics line (Promethea, Top Ten, Tom Strong, League Of Extraordinary Gentlemen, Tomorrow Stories. All great Alan Moore comics)
Planetary (huge out-of-control superhero insanity with a wonderful edge. Maybe the best thing Warren Ellis has ever done)
Transmetropolitan (fuck it, THIS is the best thing Warren Ellis has ever done. If only for the line "I killed Santa Claus! I killed Santa Claus with my cock!")
The Authority
Y: The Last Man (post-apocalyptic saga in a world where all the men have died apart from Yorrick Brown. Utterly fucking phenomenal.)
We3
Seaguy
The Invisibles (holy shit. The conspiracy book to end all conspiracy books. Grant Morrison's finest hour)
V For Vendetta

And if you want to know why some people think the DC Universe can do no wrong, read:

Batman: The Killing Joke
Arkham Asylum
Superman: Red Son (holy fuck. Best Elseworlds title ever)
Kingdom Come
The Dark Knight Returns
Batman: Year One

god, I love comics

[Lamuella]

Yeah Vertigo is a DC imprint

The thing I find with Superman is most of the time I agree with Fryza, on the surface he's terribly boring, indestructible, etc etc. It depends how he's written though, and from what perspective. Superman: Red Son and the current Lex Luthor: Man of Steel are awesome, awesome stories.

Quoted for truth.

EVERYONE IN THE WORLD needs to read Red Son.

What if Superman's rocket had landed in the plains of Russia in the 1930s instead of landing in Kansas?

Best superman story ever written.

[weather vane]

What about Lobo? He is the greatest comic book character of all time.

[Gouda]

And if you want to know why some people think the DC Universe can do no wrong, read:

Batman: The Killing Joke
Arkham Asylum
Superman: Red Son (holy fuck. Best Elseworlds title ever)
Kingdom Come
The Dark Knight Returns
Batman: Year One

god, I love comics
For actual regular series I strongly recommend Starman. Though it's over by now. I'm currently reading it for the first time and it's awesome. I plan on picking up the graphic novels.

A series that is still going that is good is JSA.

Though, I just love all things Golden Age, and stuff that acknowledges history and whatever.

DC > Marvel in my mind.

The Marvel universe just doesn't appeal to me..... and they have like... how many of them?

[Fryza]

Fryza, have you read "Identity Crisis"? It was a big help for me in making DC characters less one-dimensional.

Also, if you enjoyed Hellblazer and Swamp thing, you really need to read The Sandman. I'm guessing you have.

Naw, I'm not really a fan of DC anyway, I like them being one-dimensional, lets me make fun of them easier.

I have read A LOT about Sandman, and how good it's supposed to be, but never actually read it. I have been meaning to check it out, but have never seen it around.

[Lamuella]

For actual regular series I strongly recommend Starman. Though it's over by now. I'm currently reading it for the first time and it's awesome. I plan on picking up the graphic novels.

A series that is still going that is good is JSA.

Though, I just love all things Golden Age, and stuff that acknowledges history and whatever.

DC > Marvel in my mind.

The Marvel universe just doesn't appeal to me..... and they have like... how many of them?

Starman is excellent. JSA is also fantastic. Alan Scott is the coolest Green Lantern ever. Fuck Hal Jordan.

[El Santo]

There are aspects of both Marvel and DC that I like.

Marvel carries with it the dynamic Jack Kirby designs from the 60's and still has remnants of that weird Stan Lee dialogue. Marvel, to me, has alway been the home of the better comic book artists (especially before all those guys jumped ship to Image), but with pencillers switching sides frequently since the late 90's, I know that isn't true anymore.

DC has the longstanding legacy, though that was changed somewhat since the "Crisis on Infinite Earths." I was collecting comics in the mid-to-late 90's, and I wasn't particularly a fan of the stories going on there. Sandman was great stuff, but the rest of the Vertigo line-up never met the hype.

Favorites (no particular order): Jim Lee's run on the X-Men, The "X-Cutioner's Song" arc, Rob Liefeld's run on X-Force, Frank Miller's "Man without Fear" (Daredevil), the Reign of the Supermen arc, the Sandman series, The Dark Knight Returns, all the Teen Titans comics from the Wolfman/Perez era, and the whole frikkin' Impulse series.

[Lamuella]

oh god. Rob Liefeld.

Rob frigging Lolfeld.

one of the few artists who I seek out work by BECAUSE it's so bad.

such as this masterpiece:

http://img221.echo.cx/img221/4430/180pxliefeldgloryavengelyne0kq.jpg (http://www.imageshack.us)

holy christ, what's happened to their spines?

and the best picture ever:

http://img221.echo.cx/img221/6835/liefeldcaptainamerica2um.jpg (http://www.imageshack.us)

[el fregadero]

We've been through this. :mad:
lol :o

I don't read comics, btw. So my only addition to the thread had already been added.

[BlackDawn2024]

On the subject of the Superman/Clark Kent/glasses thing, there's been a few occasions when Superman has had Bruce Wayne dress up as the Man Of Steel to fool Metropolis into thinking Clark Kent and Superman are different people.

[El Santo]

oh god. Rob Liefeld.

Rob frigging Lolfeld.

one of the few artists who I seek out work by BECAUSE it's so bad.

such as this masterpiece:

http://img221.echo.cx/img221/4430/180pxliefeldgloryavengelyne0kq.jpg (http://www.imageshack.us)

holy christ, what's happened to their spines?

and the best picture ever:

http://img221.echo.cx/img221/6835/liefeldcaptainamerica2um.jpg (http://www.imageshack.us)

Yeah, pretty much the same reason I look for Liefeld stuff, too. ;) Almost like caricatures.

That Cap picture is awesome. Notice how far his legs extend from the centerline of his neck.

[Lamuella]

A guy I know on another forum uses this as his avatar:

http://img296.echo.cx/img296/8732/titleboltvanderhuge2us.gif (http://www.imageshack.us)

[mitchables]

To be fair that only applies to the very first incarnation. After the 50s or so they has been 'officially' aliens.

No, they were only aliens in the Silver-age run of Hawkman's life in DC, when he was a Thanagarian police officer called Katar-Hol. In current continuity, Hawkman and Hawkgirl are re-incarnations of Egyptian royalty Khufu and Chay-Ara respectively, like they were originally - hence their predicament in the current Rann/Thanagar war. Only Hawkwoman is an actual Thanagarian alien. :-\

-edit-
Actually, to be fair, Hawkgirl is now Chay-Ara's/Shiera's grandniece, but even then, she's still human. :$

[mitchables]

Barry Allen was "out" as a superhero by the end as well.

And it was pretty obvious to all concerned that Ollie Queen was Green Arrow. There's an excellent moment in Quiver where he's pretending just to be "green arrow's buddy" and gets called on it by some random kid.

Oh yeah, forgot about Barry. :$

[mitchables]

Starman is excellent. JSA is also fantastic. Alan Scott is the coolest Green Lantern ever. Fuck Hal Jordan.

I dunno, for some reason I could never really 'dig' Alan Scott. I've never really been into the magic community in DC. I briefly enjoyed Spectre when Hal Jordan was fused with him but I dunno. :$

And I am loving Kyle Rayner as a GL at the moment. He seems more fallible than the others, and that's endearing, for some reason. :love:

[YOUR Hero]

On the subject of the Superman/Clark Kent/glasses thing, there's been a few occasions when Superman has had Bruce Wayne dress up as the Man Of Steel to fool Metropolis into thinking Clark Kent and Superman are different people.
Yes.

Also, Superman is said to be able to control minds to a limited ability. His Clark Kent personna does this.

[Gouda]

Pre-Crisis Superman had super-hypnotism and that was how he kept most people unaware.

Now he does not have that and it is mainly the things already said here. Plus I'm not sure if this is true and I actually did read it, or if I'm just making it up.... he is constantly vibrating slightly at superspeed (no one can detect it), which kind of blurs his features a bit.

[weather vane]

http://www.banana.com.tw/classic/dc/LOBOABCK.JPG

[Mr. Monday Morning]

No, they were only aliens in the Silver-age run of Hawkman's life in DC, when he was a Thanagarian police officer called Katar-Hol. In current continuity, Hawkman and Hawkgirl are re-incarnations of Egyptian royalty Khufu and Chay-Ara respectively, like they were originally - hence their predicament in the current Rann/Thanagar war. Only Hawkwoman is an actual Thanagarian alien. :-\

-edit-
Actually, to be fair, Hawkgirl is now Chay-Ara's/Shiera's grandniece, but even then, she's still human. :$

That'll teach me not to read the entire Wikipedia entry :$

[Lamuella]

http://www.banana.com.tw/classic/dc/LOBOABCK.JPG

this thread needed more artwork by the Biz. Awesomeness.

[Lamuella]

to slightly divert the topic from Marvel and DC, has anyone read an Alan Moore comic called Miracleman?

best superhero comic ever written. Seriously.

[BlackDawn2024]

Heard of Miracleman, never read it. I do dig Alan Moore, though, so I might try and track it down.

But on the subject of Marvel and DC, I've been reading back through my collection(four huge boxes), and realizing that DC's heroes are so much more interesting to me than Marvel's. Batman's personal crisis and the fact that he is truly insane make is far more interesting than Peter Parker's latest quarrel with the Green Goblin. I don't know, though, I'm always switching camps. Sometimes I'm a real hard DC guy, then I'll just suddenly prefer Marvel. Maybe I have split personalites.

But Marvel does have a very underrated character that desperately needs re-launched, Moon Knight. If anyone's ever read a Moon Knight comic, they know what a smart, entertaining piece of work it is. I highly reccomend it.

[mitchables]

That'll teach me not to read the entire Wikipedia entry :$

:D

I love you, Adam. :heart:

[Mr. Monday Morning]

to slightly divert the topic from Marvel and DC, has anyone read an Alan Moore comic called Miracleman?

best superhero comic ever written. Seriously.

I've got copies somewhere (downloaded) but I've never actually read them :$ Dunno I flipped through the first couple pages and didn't see anything that grabbed my attention. Then again this is Alan Moore so I should've known better.

On that note...better than Watchmen?

[Lamuella]

Better than Watchmen.

Miracleman is what would happen if the most creative mind on the planet decided to recreate the Captain Marvel family in the most twisted incarnation possible. It's brilliant. Utterly brilliant.

And now that Neil Gaiman has regained the rights to it (fucking Todd McFarlane) we may see the conclusion of the story.

[Shadow]

Heard of Miracleman, never read it. I do dig Alan Moore, though, so I might try and track it down.

But on the subject of Marvel and DC, I've been reading back through my collection(four huge boxes), and realizing that DC's heroes are so much more interesting to me than Marvel's. Batman's personal crisis and the fact that he is truly insane make is far more interesting than Peter Parker's latest quarrel with the Green Goblin. I don't know, though, I'm always switching camps. Sometimes I'm a real hard DC guy, then I'll just suddenly prefer Marvel. Maybe I have split personalites.

But Marvel does have a very underrated character that desperately needs re-launched, Moon Knight. If anyone's ever read a Moon Knight comic, they know what a smart, entertaining piece of work it is. I highly reccomend it.

Fuck yeah Moon Knight kicks ass.

The main thing for me that really seperates Marvel and DC is that....people who die in Marvel tend to stay dead. DC guys just get resurected on a whim.

[Gouda]

I'd heard that Marvel has it's fair share of resurection problems as well.

[Shadow]

Truely but not as many as DC has.

At least with Marvel, the only resurection problems it has is when it restarts a continuality.

[mitchables]

Truely but not as many as DC has.

At least with Marvel, the only resurection problems it has is when it restarts a continuality.

Tell that to Jean Grey, Colossus, Nighthawk, Wonder Man (multiple times), Human Torch, Professor X, The Punisher, and Elektra, among others. If anything, Marvel tends to kill off and resurrect their heroes more frequently than DC does.

[mitchables]

Also, 'continuality'?

Give me a break.

[Lamuella]

Fuck yeah Moon Knight kicks ass.

The main thing for me that really seperates Marvel and DC is that....people who die in Marvel tend to stay dead. DC guys just get resurected on a whim.

People who die in Marvel tend to stay dead?

Remind me how long Northstar was dead for.

And didn't Magneto get brought back about TWO MONTHS after Morrison killed him off?

The only Marvel character to stay dead is Bucky. AND THEY JUST BROUGHT HIM BACK

[Lamuella]

the only DC resurrections that I can think of off the top of my head are Superman (in one of the biggest comic book stories EVER), Ollie Queen, and Hal Jordan. And Hal Jordan wasn't properly dead and gone to begin with (he was the spectre)

[Gouda]

I think Aquaman too. And Hal was dead... for a time before becoming The Spectre (who technically is dead).

Other than that, yeah, I can't think of any more DC.

Possibly some villains here or there... villains are always coming back to life.

And possibly Jason Todd.

[Shadow]

So the pot has weakened my brain cells alot. SUE ME!

And if you really are sueing me, send your summons to Sharky, Attorny At Law.

[Danny Electric]

Lammy were you talking about Northstar from Alpha Flight?

Beast got killed in the Ultimate X-Men series a few months back :(

[mitchables]

the only DC resurrections that I can think of off the top of my head are Superman (in one of the biggest comic book stories EVER), Ollie Queen, and Hal Jordan. And Hal Jordan wasn't properly dead and gone to begin with (he was the spectre)

The only other ones I can think of are Ronnie Raymond/Firestorm, since he has just been resurrected (less than a year after his death in Identity Crisis), Hawkman and Guy Gardner. He was impaled on something and died, and now he seems perfectly okay. :cool:

But yeah, those 6 pretty much round out DC's resurrections, if we're not including villains like Sinestro and Jason Todd. :-\

But even then, the list is incredibly smaller than even that sample list I spouted off for Marvel (since Wonder Man counts for about six resurrections, and Jean Grey has 3 or 4 up her sleeve), so I'ma side with Lammy on this one.

[mitchables]

Lammy were you talking about Northstar from Alpha Flight?

Beast got killed in the Ultimate X-Men series a few months back :(

Are you reading X-Men: The End at the moment? Bucketloads of everyone's favourites are getting killed off. :(

[Gouda]

I don't know if Hawkman counts as ressurection.... Because he (Prince Khufu) was cursed to continually ressurect. So really.... IT WASN'T HIS... FAULT!!!

[mitchables]

I'm not counting the resurrections of Khufu. I am talking about the death of Katar Hol the Thanagarian (Silver Age Hawkman), and HIM being resurrected as today's current Carter Hall/Katar Hol/Khufu conglomerate Hawkman. All three personalities have been fused. :$

[Nowhere Man]

And possibly Jason Todd.

I still don't buy it. How could he have suddenly just sprang back up to life and grown up, when the Riddler had dug up and stolen his body? I'm wanting to call fake-out on this one, but I'm not sure if they'd do another one so soon after the 'Hush' arc.

Also, if you read this month's Batman, they're not even sure whether or not Superman's faux-death was for real or not anymore. So depending on which way DC goes with that, you could chalk that up as another 'resurrection.'

[Danny Electric]

Are you reading X-Men: The End at the moment? Bucketloads of everyone's favourites are getting killed off. :(

Damn, that's one thing I don't like about the X-Men Universe though, it's just so wide. I know the whole Ultimate series is a completely different universe to a certain extent, more a rebirth but it complcates things when you read Uncanny X Men for example.

I haven't read The End yet though :(

[Gouda]

I still don't buy it. How could he have suddenly just sprang back up to life and grown up, when the Riddler had dug up and stolen his body? I'm wanting to call fake-out on this one, but I'm not sure if they'd do another one so soon after the 'Hush' arc.

Also, if you read this month's Batman, they're not even sure whether or not Superman's faux-death was for real or not anymore. So depending on which way DC goes with that, you could chalk that up as another 'resurrection.'
Hence why I said possibly. I think it'd be kinda bad to bring him back. We voted him dead and bah gawd, he should stay that way unless we vote him alive again.

[Kane Knight]

:lol:

[Kane Knight]

Incidentally, not to bust up the nerd fest of mind control powers and hypervibrations, but isn't it simply possible that a guy looks difference in spandex than he does in a suit?

I mean, really. It doesn't take a lot of work for people to make themselves look slightly different, and glasses are a common way to obscure one's appearance. Why the fuck do people have to overthink something so simple so heavily?

[Lamuella]

Lammy were you talking about Northstar from Alpha Flight?

Beast got killed in the Ultimate X-Men series a few months back :(

616 universe Northstar got killed by Wolverine about 4 issues ago when Wolverine was a Hand zombie.

Northstar is back now as a Hand zombie.

[AlphaBean]

Exceptions to your Marvel rule (including, but not limited to): The Incredible Hulk; The Punisher; Daredevil; Elektra; Spider-Man; Iron Man; Captain America; Fantastic Four; Thor; Blade; Ghost Rider; Captain Britain; Captain Marvel; Hawkeye [RIP]; and Power Man/Luke Cage.

Exceptions to your DC rule (including, but not limited to): Hawkman; Hawkgirl; Hal Jordan, John Stewart and Kyle Rayner (Green Lanterns); Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Tim Drake and Stephanie Brown (Robins); Aquaman; Aqualad; Apache Chief; Captain Marvel; Arsenal; Wonder Woman; Barbara Gordon and Cassandra Cain (Batgirls); Booster Gold; the Wizard Shazam; Raven; John Constantine; Black Canary; Elongated Man; The Spectre; Adam Strange; Steel (John Irons); and Zatanna.

Personally, I think the main difference between the two labels is how they tell their stories. Recently, Marvel (and specifically Brian Michael Bendis) has been focusing very much on the people behind the masks and their struggles, as opposed to actual superhero adventure. This has been apparent in the Disassembled arcs, and especially in Bendis' recent Daredevil run. Marvel has been trying (too hard, some might argue) to make their characters more 'human'. :-\ DC has followed suit with all their stuff leading up to Infinite Crisis, but it's still mainly about the actual heroes.

I dunno. Just a thought. :-\
Mutant means mutated person, which means irradiated/genetically altered, etc. So at least half of your Marvel list is wrong.

[Lamuella]

"mutant" in the Marvel context means people with the X-Gene. This is all very well established in Marvel continuity.

[Fignuts]

The real difference?

Marvel > DC

Not recently.

Also, not all Marvel characters are mutants. Just the majority of characters in the X-books. Outside of that there are not a lot of mutant characters.

[Kane Knight]

"mutant" in the Marvel context means people with the X-Gene. This is all very well established in Marvel continuity.
Only recently.

Marvel creators themselves used to state quite the opposite--That they were going with the definition of inborn traits not shared by either of the parents. They even went into debates over the nature of certain mutant's offspring, whether or not they were technically MUTANTS.

It wasn't until the latest re-starts (and the Hollywood era) TMI that they started treating more of these folks into the all-inclusive "X-Gene" type category. Ironic, since they had been using the "Homo Superior" tag for Mutants since the early 70s at least. It was just conveniently forgotten when it came down to technical debates because Marvel is pseudoscience.

[Kane Knight]

Not recently.

Also, not all Marvel characters are mutants. Just the majority of characters in the X-books. Outside of that there are not a lot of mutant characters.
There are quite a few, dating back from when X-Men got popular to the modern day.

However, in the early days, it was common to just use radiation. How many characters were similar to the F4, the Hulk, or Spider-Man? Mutant became one of the major explanations, even outside the X-Titles.

The Major difference is that one is Marvel and one is DC. Coke vs Pepsi. Pringles vs chips. Blonds vs brunettes. It's a difference of preference. Both have had strong, KILLER runs. Even though I'm not big on DC, Batman has had Year one, and the whole Dark Knight returns. Even Superman has had a few interesting story arcs, and I find him to be one of the least interesting characters in general.

[Lamuella]

Superman is really only interesting when he's taken out of his regular situation. Continuity Superman is dull. Kingdom Come Superman is interesting. Red Son Superman is awesome.

[Fignuts]

The only reason Superman is here today, is because he is generally considered the first ever superhero. Marvel has the better crop of characters IMO, but when it comes to major crossovers, DC blows them right out of the water. The infinity gauntlet and the death of captain marvel are the only marvel crossovers that really can stand up to DC's.

[AlphaBean]

You can say that in Marvel context, only the X-Books (and others, such as Firestar etc.) are all mutants, however the comparison was in COMIC context, not Marvel context. If we were arguing in Marvel context... then only Mutants are Mutants.

But if you want to look at who are actual mutants, rather than the Marvel-centric definition, it should be somewhere in a dictionary how one mutates. And if memory serves me correctly, I am a fucking nerd, then X-Mutants are a result of some sort of uh, ambient radioactivity, or some half-assed explanation.