At what point did wrestling (WWE) start to lose popularity?

[The Naitch]

Was it after WrestleMania X7? I know WWE continued to have it's moments but we look at it as 'smarks' aka internet geeks

IMO, as much as most of you think, I think once the people got to climax to Rock vs Austin, there was no need to watch wrestling anymore.

If Rock hadn't filmed his movie (which I fell asleep while watching) and went full fledged heel while Austin continued as a face, the product could've went further. Or had Triple played face feding with Austin, that would've been hot. Was it his idea to play second fiddle to Austin?

[dablackguy]

I'm of the opinion that it was in 2002 after summerslam. The Rock had left to go make movies, Austin had walked out, and really there was no real big attraction. Hogan was doing the injury angle from Lesnar, and they had just put the belt on Lesnar. Problem is, they had no one to feud with Lesnar, let alone anyone that looked legit that could beat him.

Lesnar couldn't draw, 2 of the biggest stars in the indutry had just left, it was only a matter of time before things went into the shitter

[The Naitch]

Lesnar was alright but didn't do enough for the casual fan. Had he stayed a monster heel for like a full year would be another story

[JohnnyA]

Gonna have to agree with dablackguy.

[D Mac]

When Cena won the title.

[Rammsteinmad]

Wrestling was popular?

Damn, I remember those days.

:p Nah, wrestling still rules though.

[Volare]

i think after X-8 X-8 had a lot of matches no one thought they would've seen. Then they got rid of half of that talent, and IMO fucked themselves for the future

[Mr. JL]

Yeah, after Wrestle Mania X8. I used to have a friend who was just like me who loved wrestling and he had like 5th row tickets to Wrestle Mania X8. Then like a few weeks later I was telling him that Eddie Guerrero returned and he's like, "what? really? I haven't watched wrestling since Wrestle Mania". And apparently he still hasn't 4 years later.

[Innovator]

When Austin turned heel

[Savio]

July 1999

[Stickman]

I think when the WCW really started to go downhill and when DX ended is when it decended. The McMahon-Helmsley era kept interest up but just stalled the decline. When that ended, all hell broke loose and wrestling was shit again.

[Sadistic]

Mid/Late 2002

[V]

brand split

[Team Sheep]

When Angle won the title.

[Kane Knight]

The problem is, when you build up a company around one or two people, you really screw yourself in the longrun. Once Rock/Austin was done, they should have had somewhere else to move, at least a contingency plan. The problem is, they were booked around people who were not long for WWE, and this fucked them horribly.

X7's probably a decent time to call it, but it's easily debatable. Ratings had been going down for a while before that.

[Rammsteinmad]

Really?

I'm pretty sure (though I'm probably wrong), I remember reading somewhere that for the first three months of 2001 (leading up to WM17) WWF's ratings were really high.

Anyhow, I'd say WM17 is probably the best place to call it. I remember watching through all my wrestling DVD's last year, and the first three PPV's of 2001 seemed amazing and really well booked etc... then Backlash, Judgement Day etc... they didn't have the same finesse and just kinda seemed the same as a PPV today.

Dunno if that makes sense, but I know what I mean.

[Dorkchop]

For me, I'd say when they became World Wreslting Entertainment. Yes, there was crap before that time like the Invasion, but I still enjoyed most of it. They had a different feel when they became the WWE.

Though shortly after Wrestlemania X7 things got less exciting.

[Kane Knight]

Really?

I'm pretty sure (though I'm probably wrong), I remember reading somewhere that for the first three months of 2001 (leading up to WM17) WWF's ratings were really high.

Anyhow, I'd say WM17 is probably the best place to call it. I remember watching through all my wrestling DVD's last year, and the first three PPV's of 2001 seemed amazing and really well booked etc... then Backlash, Judgement Day etc... they didn't have the same finesse and just kinda seemed the same as a PPV today.

Dunno if that makes sense, but I know what I mean.

The months leading up to Mania are almost always higher.

[ttetf]

Wrestlemania 2000. What a clusterfuck that was.

[mrslackalack]

My cousin who had watched the WWF since the days of Bob Backlund said he was done with it when Bischoff came on RAW in 02. He did tell me however he watched RAW last summer during the Hogan/HBK feud.

[mrslackalack]

I think while the brand spilt was nice to have it made a lot of people lose interest and HHH's long title reigns as well. Plus the highly anticpated Invasion was a complete bust. WWF thought they would get monster ratings from WCW fans for the Invasion but if I am correct only 1 out of every 6 WCW viewers tuned in to watch the Invasion.

[Savio]

TV Ratings

<table border="1" bordercolor="#808080" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="" width="280"><tbody><tr><td> April 3, 2000
</td> <td> 6.4
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> April 10, 2000
</td> <td> 6.2
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> April 17, 2000
</td> <td> 6.7
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> April 24, 2000
</td> <td> 7.1
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> May 1, 2000
</td> <td> 7.4
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> May 8, 2000
</td> <td> 6.2
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> May 15, 2000
</td> <td> 6.1
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> May 22, 2000
</td> <td> 7.1
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> May 29, 2000
</td> <td> 6.4
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> June 5, 2000
</td> <td> 5.9
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> June 12, 2000
</td> <td> 6.8
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> June 19, 2000
</td> <td> 5.8
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> June 26, 2000
</td> <td> 6.4
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> July 3, 2000
</td> <td> 5.3
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> July 10, 2000
</td> <td> 6.0
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> July 17, 2000
</td> <td> 6.2
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> July 24, 2000
</td> <td> 6.2
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> July 31, 2000
</td> <td> 6.4
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> August 7, 2000
</td> <td> 6.3
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> August 14, 2000
</td> <td> 5.9
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> August 21, 2000
</td> <td> 6.2
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> August 28, 2000
</td> <td> 4.9
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> September 4, 2000
</td> <td> 4.2
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> September 11, 2000
</td> <td> 5.8
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> September 18, 2000
</td> <td> 5.7
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> September 25, 2000
</td> <td> 5.4
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> October 2, 2000
</td> <td> 5.4
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> October 9, 2000
</td> <td> 5.4
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> October 16, 2000
</td> <td> 4.8
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> October 23, 2000
</td> <td> 5.5
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> October 30, 2000
</td> <td> 4.9
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> November 6, 2000
</td> <td> 5.1
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> November 13, 2000
</td> <td> 5.0
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> November 20, 2000
</td> <td> 5.0
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> November 27, 2000
</td> <td> 5.0
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> December 4, 2000
</td> <td> 5.0
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> December 11, 2000
</td> <td> 5.8
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> December 18, 2000
</td> <td> 4.8
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> December 25, 2000
</td> <td> 3.8
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> January 1, 2001
</td> <td> 4.6
</td> </tr> <tr> <td> January 8, 2001
</td> <td> 4.8
</td></tr></tbody></table>

[Kane Knight]

Those ratings are compiled fro msources that are faulty though. Places that, though they claim to use Nielsen ratings, almost always contradict the actual Nielsens.

[Londoner]

^^ They look roughly correct to me though KK. It's amazing the feeling it gives you just looking at the days when it used to be up in 6's/7's....

[Kane Knight]

^^ They look roughly correct to me though KK. It's amazing the feeling it gives you just looking at the days when it used to be up in 6's/7's....

Do you have access to the Nielsen data from that time?

[Londoner]

Nope, unfortunately. I just get the feeling they're probably correct.

[Savio]

I think the site was called steveswrestling.com dunno how accurate he usually is.

[DaVe]

Yeah, I use that site a lot. When I first noticed it back in middle of 2005 onwards, all the ratings were correct. Before that? I dunno, it'd really depend on how long he has had that page open.

[kingofkings]

wrestling went to shit when these events happened: sting left for undetermined amount of time, rock and austin called it quits, when edge got the title, lesnar vs goldberg and the way they had them play out the match, undertaker getting manhandled by khali, umaga being the top rising superstar on raw, mnm getting getting tag titles too quick, spirit squad(of all people) beating kane and show for the titles, dragging out kane's voices too damn long and not getting to a point, using veteran superstars as ladders for new guys example(goldust, val venis, viscera), when randy orton broke the rock's record as youngest champion ever in wwe, umaga beating rick flair, mick foley denouncing ecw, edge beating foley at wrestlemania, when jeff jarret became co-owner of tna and makes plot constantly revolve around him(cuz he has never been championship material), when taz quit due to injury, mcmahon constantly using spirit squad for title oportunities and screwing people out of matches, when they brought back mark henry, when farooq and bradshaw split up, bossman leaving, this is already too long so im stopping here for now

[jindrak]

The Attitude Era died after the botched Invasion angle.

Any one of us could've booked the Invasion angle better than what the WWE presented. Had the WWE originally signed Goldberg, Hogan, Steiner, Nash, Hall, Bischoff when the Invasion angle started, there would be no decline. In fact, the buyrate for the Invasion PPV illustrated that fans were willing to pay to see the concept of WWE vs WCW unfold. What the fans got was Austin, Angle, The Dudleys, DDP, and Rhino representing the Alliance. Austin had no justifiable reason (not one that was any good enough) to be apart of WCW. Angle was never affiliated with WCW in his career. THe Dudleys at the time had already established themselves as a WWE tag team. So...DDP and Rhino are the only serious outside threats to the WWE during the Invasion angle?

This is what led to the decline in wrestling popularity. A botched oppurtunity that fans used to salivate over. What's worst is that the guys WWE hadn't signed (that all could've been used to boost the Invasion angle) were later signed as bandage fixes to the speey decline. Those additions didn't help because people had already given up on the product.

[The One]

May 28, 2001. Or everything that jindrak just said.

[The Naitch]

A HHH/Austin program post X7 would've kept the popularity going

[Innovator]

Also when Hogan beat HHH for the title in 2002...horrible decision

[addy2hotty]

The day Bischoff handed the title to HHH, and one of the main contenders was Bubba-Ray Dudley.

Jesus, what a horrible time.