The Miz

[Dave Youell]

Personally, I think he's doing a decent job, as the guy can work and he seems to get decent heel reactions when he comes out.

Now I know there's alot of X-Pac style hate for him on the boards here, but if you all try jumping off the bandwagon and just taking him for what he is, I actually think he's a fairly solid worker

[Londoner]

Nah, sorry, I can't stand the guy. Can't stand his promos and he hasn't really had a good match yet. I have no reason to care about him, he'll be released soon enough. He's the modern day X-pac, certainly. In future people will be saying ' The Miz heat' instead of 'x-pac heat'.

[HaTeR]

He's annoying, and stupid.

[Funky Fly]

I haven't seen Smackdown in a long time, so I haven't seen him wrestle yet.

[Destor]

He's nothing much to speak of in the ring, but he can fire up a crowd (and that is what matters second most in my book.) So I cant really speak too badly against him. He's annoying, but he tries to be. That translates to job well done. Unfortunately in this day in age being an annoying heel isn't good for business. People turn the channel. Sucks for Poochy.

[Kane Knight]

I love how it's always about a bandwagon.

Sorry, I've defended Cena, and I still gloss over Miz matches. I know it's cool to be anti-bandwagon (Which is pretty much a bandwagon of its own), but if you can't respect that, fuck off.

[Dave Youell]

I love how it's always about a bandwagon.

Sorry, I've defended Cena, and I still gloss over Miz matches. I know it's cool to be anti-bandwagon (Which is pretty much a bandwagon of its own), but if you can't respect that, fuck off.
I see, my we are in a good mood today.

I'm not trying to be anti bandwagoning here, but the guy's been wrestling on TV for a little over a month and since the whole Poochy thing got started on here, every seems to hate him because it's cool to do it.

The guys got bags of charisma, a decent look, decent mic skills, yes his mat skills ain't at the Benoit level, but I think he's got the tools to be a solid mid-carder.

Just seems like no one ever gives anyone a chance anymore which is one reason why the new talent inititive is like a revolving door right now, guys can't get themselves over because the fans attention span seems to only last about 2 minutes before they get bored of a new guy

[Kane Knight]

I've seen you make several references to you taking an anti "smark" stance because you had a problem with people hating something because it's "cool." Why should I really see this example as anything different?

I'm not sure what you're talking about in terms of nobody getting a chance. Who isn't giving people a chance? The smarks who fawn over the Boogeyman, Burchill, the Highlanders and the Spirit Squad? The crowds who respond? Who?

Oh, and telling you to fuck off has nothing to do with a mood.

If you can't respect the fact that people might have given him a chance (It's not like he's even new to our TV), then fuck off. Your statement that people need to give him a chance strikes me as nothing more than proseltyzing from someone who seems to think he's the first guy to ever have this come to him.

[Afterlife]

Also, I would like to add that Hitler also had great mic skills, loads of charisma and a style all his own -- they even renamed it the 'Hitlerstache'.

Point being, sometimes, it is cool to hate someone. Because sometimes, there's a logical reason. You may like the guy -- hell, I get shit for being a fan of S2H. It's my opinion, I don't feel he gets the credit he deserves, and othrs disagree with me. But you don't want to force what you like -- or dislike -- on other people. "Youellstache" just doesn't have the same ring.

[TerranRich]

Jump on board my bandwagon and FIGHT BANDWAGONS!

Nah, seriously though, I kinda agree that, while he is GOOD at being annoying, it's still channel-turner or a piss-breaker.

[KingofOldSchool]

I hated The Miz long before he even appeared on WWE TV.

[Kane Knight]

Also, I would like to add that Hitler also had great mic skills, loads of charisma and a style all his own -- they even renamed it the 'Hitlerstache'.

Point being, sometimes, it is cool to hate someone. Because sometimes, there's a logical reason. You may like the guy -- hell, I get shit for being a fan of S2H. It's my opinion, I don't feel he gets the credit he deserves, and othrs disagree with me. But you don't want to force what you like -- or dislike -- on other people. "Youellstache" just doesn't have the same ring.

I'd love to see a S2H counter-culture revival..."You only hate the Worm because it's cool to do so..."

[Kane Knight]

Jump on board my bandwagon and FIGHT BANDWAGONS!

Nah, seriously though, I kinda agree that, while he is GOOD at being annoying, it's still channel-turner or a piss-breaker.

I think he's good at being annoying too. He's just so annoying I don't watch him.

[FourFifty]

My fav part about The Miz is how JBL talks about him. Hearing JBL talk about The Miz is worth seeing The Miz on tv.

[El Fangel]

He's annoying, and stupid.

[mike627]

everyone knows the twat won't be in WWE by this time next year.

[ron the dial]

^What he said.

The Miz is fucking annoying. I hate him, and not in a wrestling heat sort of way.

[owenbrown]

He's annoying, and stupid.

[Skippord]

I like him

[Kane Knight]

I like SLAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYER

[Skippord]

I do enjoy my Slayer

[Mr. Nerfect]

Dave, I agree with you 100%, but you're wisdom is falling on deaf ears here. I guess there must be a reason for it, but no one here wants to give a guy with decent ring skills and great heel abilities a chance.

I would willingly place a bet that this guy will be a major heel by this time next year. Not in the main event, necissarily, but a solid player in the mid-card, or in a lackey role to someone.

Most people here still think he's meant to be a face. His character is meant to be obnoxious, and before anyone says he makes people change the channel, find evidence of it. The fans are reacting perfectly to him in attendence. "Hoo-rah!" is met with "You suck!", and JBL's rants are great. Put him in a feud with Chris Benoit, or something, and people will be jizzing over the guy like they are Mr. Kennedy.

I think a lot of the hate in his direction is based more off the fact he's only really had two years to train than what people have seen in the ring from him. People were shitting all over him before he debuted (as KoOS said), and that's kind of given him the stigma of a guy who has a job because he fits in with the WWE's idea of "cool".

[AJHayes]

At first, I truely enjoyed him. I saw hm as someone who finally achieved his dream, and showed REAL passion for what he was doing. Tonight changed everything. After how he performed on Smackdown, I'd like to see Benoit "break him in" to the business.

[owenbrown]

The only reason people think The Miz is a face is because Smackdown's play-by play announcer(Michael Cole, who IS A FACE) treats him like one. :nono:

[Mr. Nerfect]

The only reason people think The Miz is a face is because Smackdown's play-by play announcer(Michael Cole, who IS A FACE) treats him like one. :nono:

Yeah, that is kind of a weird move. I honestly think Michael Cole is sticking to logic, though. He's taking a more logical view, whereas JBL is taking the pre-disposed view. JBL started shitting on The Miz before he started to wrestle. There's no reason for him to do that, and it is illogical. That is kind of a heelish thing to do in itself. JBL was playing the no-nonsense cowboy character he's been playing for the last few decades. Of course he wouldn't like The Miz's antics. Michael Cole kind of did the natural thing, and applied logic to the situation. Cole points out he is undefeated, shows athletic ability, etc.

They did start The Miz out as a face (back when he was a "host"), and he never really changed his personality, so Michael Cole had no reason to go "anti-Miz". The WWE kind of caught itself in a trap. I liked what they did at No Mercy, because it gave Michael Cole a reason to turn against The Miz. He just needs to stop playing Devil's advocate, and just talk about how the guy disrespects Layla, and how he's so obnoxious. JBL should probably adapt to the "if you want to stop T.O. from dancing, stop him from scoring" commentary shtick he often uses, with The Miz. Just have him justify it because he's "betting on a winning horse", as The Miz just keeps on winning.

[Dave Youell]

Thanks Alienoid06, you basically said waht I wanted to, but with better words and stuff

[Kane Knight]

Dave, I agree with you 100%, but you're wisdom is falling on deaf ears here. blah blah blah blah blah nobody gives him a chance blah blah blah blah other retarded platitudes.

[Afterlife]

Due to my current job, I've been missing both Raw and SD for nearly 2 months. I will say the "hoo-rah" is on a similar vibe as having a cheese grater ripped across the back of my neck...but I can't really judge the overall character, as I've yet to see him wrestle.

That being said, my Hitler comments were not to say that I've made a prejudiced decision on Miz's character, but that the possibility exists that he may, in fact, deserve the backlash of being a chigger.

One final note: Yes, he may be experiencing "X-pac Heat", but before people start throwing around trite little nuances like "he'll be gone by this time next year," let's just try to remember that Sean Waltman left on his own and the company is always willing to bring him back. These people are big on nepotism and favors.

[Kane Knight]

but before people start throwing around trite little nuances like "he'll be gone by this time next year,"
I'd like to also point out that throwing this shit around is merely guesswork, as it's as often as not wrong. It's not some insightful talent for prescience.

[Kane Knight]

Same's also true of the people who tell you "just wait and see," though.

[Afterlife]

I warn you now, most ppl will be totally befuddled by your wanton abuse of the word "as". Any flak you receive for the whoring of said preposition is flak well deserved.

[Jordan]

I fucking hate The Miz.

[Kane Knight]

I warn you now, most ppl will be totally befuddled by your wanton abuse of the word "as". Any flak you receive for the whoring of said preposition is flak well deserved.

You're just too narrow minded to understand the greatness that is "as." I know it's cool to hate "as," but if you could get off the bandwagon and just give it a shot...

[domononizuka]

The Miz ended up being one of the best mid card heels down at OVW and i expect the same will happen in WWE.He can work better matches the 90% of the smackdown roster,the just havent really given him a shot yet.Only thing that really held him back in the first place was his tag team partners consistently getting released(was originaly getting called up with Chris Cage but Cage got released due to drugs).Hell i can still go into a OVW crowd and yell HOO-RAH and the whole crowd will still respond with "YOU SUCK".

[Mr. Nerfect]

The Miz is so annoying. *Attempts at wit*. He can't wrestle, I haven't seen him, but he can't wrestle. I don't watch him so other people don't. *Attempts at wit*. Anyone who disagrees with me is just doing it because they want to be anti-bandwagon, as opposed to bandwagon, because being on the bandwagon as, as, as *Attempts at wit*.

Dude, you lost all credibility in The Miz arguement when you admitted to not watching SmackDown!.

http://www.obsessedwithwrestling.com/pictures/r/ronijonah/02.jpg

The Miz has so much potential to be a pitch-perfect girlfriend-stealing, arrogant fuckhead character.

[Kane Knight]

*attempt at witty editing joke* Dude, you lost all credibility in The Miz arguement when *falsehood for the sake of making u pan argument*.

http://www.obsessedwithwrestling.com/pictures/r/ronijonah/02.jpg

The Miz has so much *fellating character without any real backing or argument, just bland platitudes again*.

[Kane Knight]

:y:

[weather vane]

I kind of like him

[Afterlife]

You're just too narrow minded to understand the greatness that is "as." I know it's cool to hate "as," but if you could get off the bandwagon and just give it a shot...

I don't hate "as", I just hate when "as" is shoved down my throat; if anything is in my throat that deep and that often, it better damn well be 'cause I put it there.

[Batsu]

Miz sucks, but he's not quite X-Pac.
X-Pac was legitimately trying to be "cool" but ended up sucking in the process.
Most people that hate Miz knows what's up with him...it's intentional.

The modern day X-Pac is Jeff Jarrett (actually, he's worse than X-Pac ever
was...)

[Dave Youell]

Miz sucks, but he's not quite X-Pac.
X-Pac was legitimately trying to be "cool" but ended up sucking in the process.
Most people that hate Miz knows what's up with him...it's intentional.


Surely that makes him a good heel then?

[Kane Knight]

If people hate you so much that they don't want to watch you, then no. That's not a good heel. The difference is, Pac got X-Pac heat while trying to be a face. Miz is getting it while trying to be a heel. Either way, "get the fuck off my TV" heat is not a good thing.

[Dorkchop]

I hate Poochy because everything about him is annoying and stupid... not the good kind of annoying where you actually enjoy it. Even his ring attire is stupid.

I'm really annoying, but my friends love me for it. Poochy is really annoying and everyone hates him for it. When he's on tv, I don't pay attention or change the channel.


He was really annoying before he got even more "in your face".

I still want to hear a "Poochy" chant one day. My friend and I would be soooo happy to hear one.

This post is ADD-licious.

[Kane Knight]

This is the truuuuuuuuue story of when I was talking to my friend on the phone on Friday night. He called me slightly before the Miz came out. He doesn't even watch wrestling anymore, but the minute he heard "This is the truuuuuuuuuuuue story...." He was already groaning.

Stupid shit like this is why he stopped watching wrestling.

I'm not saying this is Universal, but this is the reaction I've been witnessing. This is not a good sign in my opinion.

[FourFifty]

OHHHH-RAH!!!!

[Mr. Nerfect]

If people hate you so much that they don't want to watch you, then no. That's not a good heel. The difference is, Pac got X-Pac heat while trying to be a face. Miz is getting it while trying to be a heel. Either way, "get the fuck off my TV" heat is not a good thing.

Again, no evidence given to suggest he's making people tune out, you're just suggesting it's true because your friend did it. Didn't Vermaat conduct an interview with his friends and put forward it as fact?

I'm not fellating The Miz, if he were released, I wouldn't give a shit, I'm just calling things like they are. The Miz is a decent wrestler with confidence on the mic.

You're the one not using evidence or supplying a backbone for your arguements.

[Kane Knight]

Dude, are you stupid? There's never any evidence. When have you ever seen the QHs on any show? Of course there's no evidence. There's also no evidence that Scotty II Hotty isn't the biggest draw on Smackdown, by that logic.

Wow...You sure showed me...Except this is an argument based around opinion, speculation, and observation...

[Kane Knight]

I'm also pretty sure that you're trying ti misdirect here, from your and Youell's attempt at retardation.

[Dorkchop]

Again, no evidence given to suggest he's making people tune out, you're just suggesting it's true because your friend did it. Didn't Vermaat conduct an interview with his friends and put forward it as fact?

I'm not fellating The Miz, if he were released, I wouldn't give a shit, I'm just calling things like they are. The Miz is a decent wrestler with confidence on the mic.

You're the one not using evidence or supplying a backbone for your arguements.

We can't know about everyone. A lot of people won't change the channel during wrestling. When I'm sitting and watching Smackdown, I usually change the channel when Poochy is on.

[lilly39]

Personally, I think he's doing a decent job, as the guy can work and he seems to get decent heel reactions when he comes out.

Now I know there's alot of X-Pac style hate for him on the boards here, but if you all try jumping off the bandwagon and just taking him for what he is, I actually think he's a fairly solid worker
Come on he is a jackass, i wish wwe would get rid of hom.

[Kane Knight]

We can't know about everyone. A lot of people won't change the channel during wrestling. When I'm sitting and watching Smackdown, I usually change the channel when Poochy is on.

It's a distraction shoe.

I never said I was indicative, nor did anyone else. Alienoid's basically arguing against the concept that someone who seemingly everyone admits is getting X-Pac heat (Including him, I THINK) isn't detremental, based on a statement I made that, if someone is getting X-Pac (which is go away or change the channel) heat, it's not a good thing or indicative of being a good heel.

But then, he's supporting someone retarded enough to proseltyse the "give him a chance" point of view, as though it's meaningful or something people haven't done (affirmatively) Alienoid himself was retarded enough to chastise me for not giving him a chance in another thread (retarded, because like Youell, the only logic behind it seemed to be "well if you don't like him, you must not have given him a chance....").

It's a good way to tapdance around bad footing. Nothing more, really.

We can't definitively know who's a draw and who isn't. 'Noid's argued against Occam's Razor on this point before. Hell, we could argue that Val Venis was the biggest draw on Raw. Nobody here can disprove it. Good logic to go by, right?

Oh, unless you actually want to put forth an argument worth a fuck.

You know what's amazing though? I've had literally dozens of friends, and known more than that, who watched pro wrestling. I've been to people's houses with large groups of people I didn't even know, watching WWF/WCW/whatever. And the overwhelming majority of them channel surfed. Either when things were boring, or when something was on commercial, or when a promo package was on (Which is technically "boring," but you get the point).

I find it hard to believe people don't change the channel quite a bit during Smackdown. It's not definitive, it's not indicative, but it's reasonable. And honestly, I can't think of a better pissbreak than Poochy.

But then, we can't prove a thing. Well, except that Vince is certainly doing something wrong, with shitty ratings on both shows (Comparatively speaking).

[Dorkchop]

Actually it seems like a lot of wrestling fans right now are more casual then, say, 6 years ago. I was in too much of a hurry to finish up my post so I

I knew a lot of people years ago that would watch all of Raw, Smackdown, Nitro, ECW and not channel surf. These days whenever I talk to someone about wrestling, it's usually "I saw this, but didn't see that". Raw and Smackdown have become more of an entertainment variety show than a wrestling show. People tune in, watching bits and pieces, checking out what they want to see.

I'm still with you, KK, that Poochy makes people change the channel. Well, at least me and you. And in the end, that's all that matters.

I don't like changing the channel during a wrestling show, but Poochy is that terrible that I don't want to watch him.

[Kane Knight]

I don't change the channel anymore. I walk out of the room. Maybe it's literally a pissbreak. Maybe Ido some cleaning. Maybe I jerk off to pictures of Shawn Michaels from his Playgirl spread...:shifty:

Actually, I wasn't questioning you. In a previous thread, when I proposed people might turn away from Poochy, Alienoid said, as though it were some incredible and unprecedented feat, that that meant viewers were turning away from WWE programming.

Truly shocking, eh? The concept that people might turn away?

[CYCLOPTERSAURUS]

If he's such a good heel, why do people still chant "HOO-RAH!" along with him?

The Miz sucks. I hate him.

[Dorkchop]

If he's such a good heel, why do people still chant "HOO-RAH!" along with him?

The Miz sucks. I hate him.

Because kids and marks will go along with any chant. And because Smackdown's audience is edited.

[Dave Youell]

My opinion of the hate he's receiving is purely based on the people that I've seen on these boards, I check out others and I don't see the hate that seems to exist on TPWW. Personally I don't think he's getting X-Pac heat at shows, I think it's genuine, but not as hot as it could be, because as already mentioned, they haven't defined him as an 'official' face or heel

Alot of the hate on here I feel is to do with that poochy comment from a few months back and everyone hated him on here before he even got a chance to wrestle as he was stuck in that diva contest presenter role, now if you're linked to the diva search you're bound to be seen a bad light on here anyway.

The guy has got loads of charisma and I don't think anyone can really disagree with that, whether you feel it's good charisma or bad charisma is another matter, but he has all the tools to be a decent mid-carder and I think the general audience are re-acting as expected, it just seems like it's people on here that hate him.

[D Mac]

Nobody will EVER be worse then X Prick. NOBODY :mad:

[CYCLOPTERSAURUS]

Because kids and marks will go along with any chant. And because Smackdown's audience is edited.

If he's suppoed to be a heel, wouldn't they want to edit OUT the chants?

[Kane Knight]

Because kids and marks will go along with any chant. And because Smackdown's audience is edited.

And for some reason, they edit in a stronger reaction. A heel character where they add essentially a face response.

[Kane Knight]

The guy has got loads of charisma and I don't think anyone can really disagree with that
I think anyone who leaves the room, changed the channel, or turns off the TV can.

I also think it's ridiculous to even argue that the fans are reacting appropriately, when the only live reactions we've had (His Raw appearances) were lackluster (As were his performances).

Do you know how the ratings are doing during his segments (What Alienoid would point out if he didn't agree with you)? What evidence do you have that his only live responses on TV are atypical?

[Dave Youell]

I think anyone who leaves the room, changed the channel, or turns off the TV can.

I also think it's ridiculous to even argue that the fans are reacting appropriately, when the only live reactions we've had (His Raw appearances) were lackluster (As were his performances).

Do you know how the ratings are doing during his segments (What Alienoid would point out if he didn't agree with you)? What evidence do you have that his only live responses on TV are atypical?
I don't have any evidence of the ratings, but you were the one who was making the speculation that viewers were tuning out during Miz sections, I've never made any claims that he increases or decreases viewers, with the exception of your friend, who doesn't really watch the show that much anyway.

My only agrument is the hate from TPWW, as i've not seen or heard it from anywhere else

[Kane Knight]

No, I'm the one arguing that I tune out, retard.

I argued that a heel getting X-Pac heat is not a good thing, but I'm yet to hear anyone actually dispute the X-Pac heat. Matter of fact, you argued that getting a response similar to X-Pac was a good thing, since he wasn't trying to be a face.

Okay, whatever.

[Dave Youell]

I think The Miz is in a unique situation as he's an over the top in your face guy, who's meant to get shoved down your mouth to the point where you don't like him.

Similar to the way that Rocky Johnson did.

So wait until the point he does something officailly heelish, thus far it's been limited to a few cheap shots, I know the character he has is far from perfect and there's things that need to be done with him to get him more over.

But right now given the character he's putting out there, he's getting the right sort of reaction.

But you've not seen any of this have you? Because it's mostly based on you watching him in a non wrestling presenter role on a different show

[Kane Knight]

Ummm...I don't know if you're trying to be a fucktard, but I do watch Smackdown. Now, maybe you are just listening to Alienoid's false claims that I admitted I don't watch Raw, or maybe you're reacting to mt statements that we can only judge him from Raw. The former, you're a fucktard, and so is he. The latter, I used the Raw results because they're the only undoctored results broadcast on TV. Not because it's the only show I watch, nor because it's the only time I've seen him.

What Alionoid is misconstruing (Besides his usual shtick) is my statement that I zone out during Miz matches. Why? Because I think he's that bad. Sadly, in that same thread, I pointed out that I still have made a point to watch him at points, specifically because of his claims and those of fellow fucktards. He whines that I never gave him a shot. False. I gave the Great Khali a shot, I think I can give the Miz one. I gave him a shot when he first came into the company, I gave him a shot when he was feuding" with Palmer Cannon, and I gave him a shot when he debuted in-ring. Three Strikes, he's out.

Just because I lose interest doesn't mean I don't catch anything. In fact, what I see is the reason I tune out, leave the room, etc.

But again, whatever.

[Afterlife]

Resolution:

Youell and Alienoid are willing to see what Miz develops into.

Kane Knight and the resounding others are either unwilling or uninterested, and have given up on said wrestler.

So, there you have it. Everyone can stop repeating themselves.

[Dorkchop]

Resolution:

Youell and Alienoid are willing to see what Miz develops into.

Kane Knight and the resounding others are either unwilling or uninterested, and have given up on said wrestler.

So, there you have it. Everyone can stop repeating themselves.
















....... themselves

[Dave Youell]

LOL Agreed

[Skippord]

Nobody will EVER be worse then X Prick. NOBODY :mad:
Sid Vicious was

[D Mac]

Sid Vicious was

Not EVEN funny:mad:

[.44 Magdalene]

My girlfriend refuses to watch Smackdown because Booker T is on it.





















Do we need to be married before I can beat her, or can I start now? :(

[.44 Magdalene]

Seriously, though, I don't know enough people that watch Smackdown to gauge the Miz's reaction off the boards. I zone out during his segments, though.

[Dave Youell]

My girlfriend refuses to watch Smackdown because Booker T is on it.
So she's a racist then?

[.44 Magdalene]

Well, she still watches RAW, nevermind the numerous negroes there (...Shelton Benjamin?). She's just a huge mark (despite how often I explain things to her) and King BOOKAH is damn good at his job.

Just sayin'. Not all "Turn off my TV" heat is X-Pac heat.

[Destor]

If you make people turn off the TV you ARE a good heel. Just like getting stabbed made a good heel 40 years ago. What you AREN'T is good for business.