Why Was Evolution so popular

[Splaya]

I am sitting here watching Wrestlemania 20 and I'm sitting here wondering why Evolution was so popular. I want to know your opinion of it

[RP]

because stone cold said so?

[Kane Knight]

Because they wanted a stable?

[Blue Demon]

because stone cold said so?
and that's the bottom line

[D Mac]

cuz da legend killa wuz born111111111111

[ron the dial]

Because they were a mystery full of change that no one could see?

[Just John]

'They had a great recipe for success':

Triple H - Main event heel to rule it and piss people off
Ric Flair - There because of HHH really, but gives something for the older marks
Randy Orton - The cocky bastard you wanna hit in the face multiple times
Batista - Dumb muscle who is supposed to come off as 'scary'


Its just an 'Every type of heel' fest, but what can I say, it worked great.

[Kane Knight]

'They had a great recipe for success':

Triple H - Main event heel to rule it and piss people off
Ric Flair - There because of HHH really, but gives something for the older marks
Randy Orton - The cocky bastard you wanna hit in the face multiple times
Batista - Dumb muscle who is supposed to come off as 'scary'


Its just an 'Every type of heel' fest, but what can I say, it worked great.

Except people still loved Flair, and Batista ws such an effective heel he was getting pops, and Orton was the kind of guy people wanted to hit in the face with a shovel even when he was a face.

Sounds like a perfect recipe to me.

[Just John]

Except people still loved Flair, and Batista ws such an effective heel he was getting pops, and Orton was the kind of guy people wanted to hit in the face with a shovel even when he was a face.

Sounds like a perfect recipe to me.


Yeah, that was from a marks point of view kinda, although saying that you can get marks to hate anything without much effort.


I dont see Orton as a good heel simply because he is probably like that in real life, so he doesn't try to be an ass, it just comes naturally. At least its effective though I guess.

[ron the dial]

I dont see Orton as a good heel simply because he is probably like that in real life, so he doesn't try to be an ass, it just comes naturally. At least its effective though I guess.
Wouldn't that make him the perfect heel?

[Kane Knight]

Yeah, that was from a marks point of view kinda, although saying that you can get marks to hate anything without much effort.


I dont see Orton as a good heel simply because he is probably like that in real life, so he doesn't try to be an ass, it just comes naturally. At least its effective though I guess.

Yeah, but I was talking mark reactions too.

It was fans in the audience who popped for Flair. It was fans in the audience who popped for Bats, even when the IWC hated him (Trust me, I defended the faggot). Similarly, it was fans who didn't buy him as a face, and still hated him....Though this time, the IWC seemed to be pretty much on the same page.

[Just John]

Wouldn't that make him the perfect heel?


Well, perfect as in extremely effective, yeah. But for someone to be a good heel (In my book) would have to try to be an ass, and do it well. Rather than just stand there and get heat because he is a cocky bastard.

[Kane Knight]

I don't think it matters why people hate him, as long as he puts asses in the seats at the same time.

It's not exactly like he's getting X-Pac heat, far as we can tell.

[Just John]

Yeah, I suppose

[Kane Knight]

It's like JBL, only Orton's a draw.

...Far as I can tell, again.

[addy2hotty]

Evolution was popular? And here's me think it was just a Triple H wankfest.

[Caged Heat18]

I liked Evolution.

[FourFifty]

Evolution was popular because you touch yourself at night.

[Kane Knight]

You just had to do it. Now Shadow's gonna get all territorial...I just cleaned up the last pissing contest....

[Crippla]

I liked Evolution because WWE needed a good stable. Most people liked them because they were kind of a knockoff of the Horseman which was the point of Flair in there and Orton was the best up and comer at the time, a lot of people liked him and I still do.

[Jeritron]

Evolution ended too quickly. Orton was getting over big as IC champ and with his fueds with Foley, but then they jumped the gun and made him champ, a face, and fueded him with HHH. They should have ran with it, and put the belt on Orton after him turning on HHH and becoming the new leader of Evolution, allowing a face HHH to put him over and lead to a legitimate run.
They fucked everythign up and, IMO, Orton and Batista were prematurely made stars and now they're starting to fade out.

[Londoner]

Evolution bored me, it was just their theme music that made them partly entertaining to me, also Ortons IC title run was good to watch but that's about it.

[Mr. JL]

Randy Orton was awesome from the 2004 Royal RUmble until a month before Summer Slam 2004. Within a span of a month they killed Orton's credibility and character just because they needed a transitional champ in order to get the belt off of Benoit and back onto Triple H.

[Dorkchop]

Randy Orton was awesome from the 2004 Royal RUmble until a month before Summer Slam 2004. Within a span of a month they killed Orton's credibility and character just because they needed a transitional champ in order to get the belt off of Benoit and back onto Triple H.

I agree that Orton was awesome during that time. During those months, you knew he was going to be a main eventer within a year or two, but the WWE speed time up and instead of him being a main eventer in 2 years, they tried to make him one in 6 months. No one bought it.

Carlito does have a future in the main event. As long as he stays around and doesn't do anything to fuck up his career in the WWE, he's going to be one of thier main guys within a couple of years. The WWE over pushed him too soon, but luckily he didn't get a Chris Masters type push. It's too bad they don't really know what to do with him right now. I say have him feud with Shelton, Hardy, Nitro, and other IC guys and build the IC title and these guys into future main eventers.

[Kane Knight]

Evolution ended too quickly. Orton was getting over big as IC champ and with his fueds with Foley, but then they jumped the gun and made him champ, a face, and fueded him with HHH. They should have ran with it, and put the belt on Orton after him turning on HHH and becoming the new leader of Evolution, allowing a face HHH to put him over and lead to a legitimate run.
They fucked everythign up and, IMO, Orton and Batista were prematurely made stars and now they're starting to fade out.

Orton's reign could have been gold, but they had to try and turn him into a babyface. That really killed it for most, I think.

[Dorkchop]

Orton's reign could have been gold, but they had to try and turn him into a babyface. That really killed it for most, I think.

He was doing so well as a heel too. Very very well. Then just like that he was a baby face.

[Kane Knight]

He was doing so well as a heel too. Very very well. Then just like that he was a baby face.

He would have made a great heel champion, I think. It's a shame. He was a bit green, but the main problem was they decided to make him a babyface. I mean, that seemed to be their thing at the time, too. If they get cheers, turn 'em into shitty faces nobody likes.

[V]

it's a mystery

[Jeritron]

Its a shame to see something messed up like that. Orton remains a main eventer and has the potential to be big again, but not like he could have been. Similar to what they've done with a few other guys. I think the WWE underestimates the importance of an up and coming stars first title push/reign. Biggest 2 screwups I would say are Orton and Jericho.
Great idea, they're way over as heel/face respectively, so they switch it around right when its time to get the belts and feed them to HHH.
I'm pleased they kept Edge a heel when they let him get the belt, but both times thus far they've taken it off him prematurely.

[Kane Knight]

Keeping Edge a heel is easy. Nobody likes him.

Jericho entertains, so he eventually gets cheers. Orton and Cena entertained, so they eventually got cheers. WWE knows how to keep someone face or heel when the reactions are universal. But when they're not, WWE gets all confused.

Hell, they don't even understand "boring" chants or no reactions.

[Jeritron]

They suck in that department. They think just because people cheered Austin and Rock as heels, and then when made faces they exploded, that that will be the case for any heel whos entertaining. They need to learn that the fans just love to hate some guys.

[Shadow]

See I really think Orton could've gone over as champ but he got fucked up the ass by HHH's politicing.

[Destor]

Wow Trips politicking is more powerful than I thought... You mean to tell me he can now manipulate the perception of the entire audience into believing that Orton is a shit face?

[El Fangel]

well next to him, really most heels do look like shit faces, and Orton had the natural talent to make it easily possible.

[.44 Magdalene]

You two have gotta be fucking kidding me.



Fucking. Kidding me.

[Blitz]

No one is kidding you.

[.44 Magdalene]

Orton was a face against heel HHH. Heel HHH gets arena-level boos for only shaking once after a piss. If he can't get face pops against that, something's wrong.

Look at Orton's face. Look at his bizarre build. Look at that shit eating grin. He would have to STOP SMILING to get a good face reaction. He would have to never be happy. He would have the emo kid's working hero to get any sort of less-than-hatred reaction from anyone short of his personal fanbase. Or wear a mask. Maybe, someday, in the future where I have a flying car that runs on water and farts, Orton will be good at being a face. For right now, though...and especially during his Evolution days and the handful of months following...

Well, turning Orton face is retarded.

[Destor]

Yeah, and Orton is still a shit face.

[Splaya]

Orton's reign could have been gold, but they had to try and turn him into a babyface. That really killed it for most, I think.

Back when Edge called Orton out a couple of weeks ago, did you hear the crowd chanting for Orton. It was nuts

[Jeritron]

Thats only because Edge has the crowd in the palm of his hands.

[Shadow]

Wow Trips politicking is more powerful than I thought... You mean to tell me he can now manipulate the perception of the entire audience into believing that Orton is a shit face?

No no no...let me see if I can explain.

I think it was the sudden face change that just made people not like Orton. I mean, throughout the fued, he was the one chasing HHH, not the other way around. I think that's what made people turn on Orton the way he did.

That and the fact that he's a shit face.

[addy2hotty]

I don't think Orton has ever been that good, the way people blow their loads over him and his IC title run is pretty amusing. Think back, name one good feud he had FOR the IC title during that title run (without looking it up on the internet)? His run was as great as Sheltons first run.

I can think of one moment in his entire career that I went 'wow'. That was when he gave some DDT to RVD from the top.

It's kinda good that Edge and Orton are together, as a tag-team feud with DX is about as good as it will get for them.

[Loose Cannon]

Foley. Nuff said.

[Dave Youell]

Foley. Nuff said.
:y:

Foley 'Made' Orton IMO, gave him his first memorable match really.

Since then nothings come close, Maybe his match with Taker at Mania, but it wasn't great, plus he jobbed then.

Oh and LC, where the fuck have you been recently?

[Kane Knight]

Thats only because Edge has the crowd in the palm of his hands.

:rofl: Okay.

[Splaya]

Evolution was great because of obvious reasons.

HHH- Leading another group
Orton- The young cocky heel that everyone was hating.
Batista- The alleged monster that everyone feared
Flair- Enough said.

Flair would always get the pops because of his status, HHH would get major heel heat due to obvious reasons. Tista was there to be molded and get "taught" the ropes. Orton was the man of Evolution. When I was watching Wrestlemania 20, and the promo he gave with Flair and Tista standing by him, and it reeked of him being the leader of Evolution.

[tucsonspeed6]

It comes down to this: They weren't the same crap that was being shoved down our throats with every heel at the time. WE didn't see the same crap over and over with them.

How many times do we see the same heel repackaged with a new, bland bag of muscles. Sure, they may be cocky like Chris Masters, mean like Finlay, or otherwise hated just for their gimmick by being foreign, an authority, etc, but they always act the same way. They always talk big until the face shows up, at which time they run scared. They always dominate the match with rest holds until the last minute when the face turns the match completely around with a single move at which time the face either wins, or the heel cheats for the win. And how often do we see a heel champion who actually earned the belt they wear?

People are sick and tired of seeing the same undeserving champions, the same chicken-shit act, the same non-finishes to matches. I'm not saying that Evolution didn't have their own share of fluke victories or retreats from the ring, but they were a hell of a lot better than the crap that's dished out to us week after week these days.

[M-A-G]

Whoever said they were popular?

[Crippla]

"They" did.

[Crippla]

They really were popular though. I actually miss the Evolution days.

[the wwe champion]

BECAUSE IT WAS THE ONLY STABLE ON THE RAW ROSTER.

[DominateR]

I'd be willing to wager that because Ric Flair was once again in a 4-man stable, it kind of reminded people of the Four Horsemen...just a guess...

[AdrianM]

I was never a huge fan of Evolution.

Trips completely dominated the roster, up to the point where in his final title run, there really was no viable contender to the title except HBK.
Ric Flair's role in evolution was a lap-dog like character...it made me sick honestly, saying Hunter is the greatest wrestler ever...c'mon!!!
Batista was boring most of the time. He was the one who was jobbed out the most and honestly didn't seem like a big deal until Randy left.
Randy Orton however was awesome. I think that was his best time as a wrestler so far. However, him losing the title aftera month was ridiculous. If they'd done it right, they could have carried that feud all the way up to Wrestlemania 22 IMO

[AdrianM]

I don't think Orton has ever been that good, the way people blow their loads over him and his IC title run is pretty amusing. Think back, name one good feud he had FOR the IC title during that title run (without looking it up on the internet)? His run was as great as Sheltons first run.

I can think of one moment in his entire career that I went 'wow'. That was when he gave some DDT to RVD from the top.

It's kinda good that Edge and Orton are together, as a tag-team feud with DX is about as good as it will get for them.



ummm, Orton VS Mick Foley...and yes, it was for the IC title at Backlash. He also had a good little feud with RVD and a good longer feud with Edge.
But that whole Orton run wasn't just about the IC title, it was also about killing legends. Great time for Orton

[M-A-G]

Sure, great for Orton. A pain for everyone else.

[M-A-G]

They really were popular though. I actually miss the Evolution days.

D-X was popular. The Four Horsemen were popular. The NWO was popular. Evolution was just all over the shows and given the best angles (well what would count as the best in WWE world) to give the illusion that they were worth a damn.

[AdrianM]

D-X was popular. The Four Horsemen were popular. The NWO was popular. Evolution was just all over the shows and given the best angles (well what would count as the best in WWE world) to give the illusion that they were worth a damn.


:y: