Was December to Dismember the worst PPV

[Testicle]

Was this the worst WWE PPV since 1997?

Discuss....

[Innovator]

worst PPV since Great American Bash 2004

[Jeritron]

worst ppv since survivor series 06. and that was the worst since no mercy.

[Fignuts]

Wow, wwe putting on crap ppv's, anglr going to tna, jericho running out of places to work outside of wrestling, and rvd's contract running out? If tna plays their cards right, and wwe continues to be shit, they could actually become athreat.

[The One]

TNA has Vince Russo stearing the ship. They'll be lucky to find the card table, nevermind playing their cards right.

[Jeritron]

TNA tends to go all in with bad hands, and folds good ones.

[Fignuts]

I know, they had a potentialy GREAT angle with samoa joe stealing jarretts title and sting beating jarrett for it. That could have gone in so many directions, all of them better than the one they chose.

Seriously there was no point in having joe take the title if he was just gonna lose it to jarrett before his match with sting anyhow.

[The One]

TNA can't clean up at the metaphorical poker game, and I'll tell you why. TNA is great and pleasing their marks, but they can't impliment change well. They simply don't have that special something that Eric Bischoff describes as a big noise. Facts are simple, wrestling's popularity is going down...even if TNA begins to steal WWE marks, it won't make a differance. WWE has a strong hold on the entire industry. And it's not just what happens during the programs, they have the history and the ability to get their guys on national shows. TNA has the ability to put their guys on Casino Cinema. And as history has shown it takes something special to over take the big boy. WWE over took NWA with WrestleMania, WCW with nWo, WWE again with Austin's new attitude...TNA has...nothing. And before someone says anything about better matches, there is one thing wrestling history has shown us it's that superior matches don't amount to better ratings. People watch wrestling for the stories, and TNA just can't put them together, let alone make a new brand of exciting stories.

[Impact!]

D2D was the worst PPV I've ever seen. It was like watching a plane crash in slow motion.

Terrible, absolutely terrible.

[The One]

Plane crashes in slow motion are awesome. Why do you think people watch World's Most Extreme Videos?

[Jeritron]

I could have told you that though. ECW can't support a one hour show, let alone a 3 hour ppv. Smackdown can barely do it either. And as for Raw, its so lackluster and un-eventful that its the same deal. Mis-booking, and terrible distribution of talent is whats bogging the WWE down.

[Impact!]

The problem I had with it was that the Elimination Chamber could have been great. Instead they take out Sabu...and replace him with Hardcore Holly. RVD becomes a complete idiot by eliminating Punk when that leaves him with Test and HH by himself, as well as climbing up onto Show's cage instead of an empty one. (shortly followed by his elimination).

Test eliminating HH was not only done quickly (it should have been done when it would have made more impact ie: First elimination, or keep them around until Lashley comes out n has to fight 3 on one.)

Also the fact that Lashley broke the chains with table annoyed me more than anything. Also the finish didn't even really have much build up, it was just out of now where...but not a good out of nowhere.

The only high points of the show (imo) were the opening bout which was solid, and the Know/KK V Arial/Thorn bout. As that match at least progressed a story line, unlike everything else on the show.

[Jeritron]

I too think that could have been a good match. I know its a tired theory to say it seems that everything they do is the only possible way to fuck something up, but its held water since 2001. They need to take the George Costanza approach to their booking, and do it the other way around. Seriously, If they did it the other way around Sabu would have been in the match, CM Punk would have lasted late into the chamber and gotten screwed, and Lashley would have gone over as a heel.
WWEs response to such fan criticism would be, the fans don't know what they want and you don't give them what they want. This is entirely untrue. Perhaps the casual marks don't know what they want, but us Smarks really do. We all disagree on specifics, but we all see the decline in decision making and booking and its not because we're idiots who don't know what we want. Its because we know how things have worked, and we know how things have failed, we know who we like and who we don't and WWE can't seem to do something that pleases us and marks alike. This PPV is a prime example.
Its sad to say, but I can promise that Armageddon will suck and it hasnt even taken place.

[Impact!]

I can't bring myself to order Armaggeddon because it looks as if it could be a solid PPV, and unfortuantly WWE has shown us of late that if the PPV has even a slight hint that it will be good it fucks it up royally.

Right now I honoustly have no appeal to watch wrestling, and that for me is really weird. Damn you WWE.

[Dave Youell]

The more they do stuff like this the more I watch TNA

[Impact!]

Exactly. I pay $30 for a pretty terrible PPV from the WWE, while I can pay $20 for a TNA PPV which even though they haven't been all that much better I still find myself interested in.

[Jeritron]

Yea see, i'm just generally unhappy with wrestling at the time. I havent really caught the TNA bug yet. I catch it when I can and I like a good amount of the talent over there, but they book shit too. I don't like Abyss, I don't like how they handle the title scene by having a new guy hold it every month and never get it back, and I'm generally turned off by some of the poor production and overdone spot-fests at times.
I find myself to be a WWE guy at heart, even knowing they suck. I hate WWE right now but I stick with them, for the hopes that they get better. I'm never as upset as I am dissapointed.
I only hope TNA succeeds and gets big only to see it bring out the best in WWE and eventually fail. I also watch TNA and guys like Styles and Daniels and hope for them to get way over so I can see them succeed in the WWE.
What I really want is another monday night war. I want to see TNA be cutting edge and see their young guys really get on the map and make it to the bigtime.
I dont know if you understand what I mean, I appreciate TNA just like I appreciated some of WCW, but I really just feel like I'm on WWEs team and always have been. Its like being a redsox fan and wanting the yankees to be good just so we can fight back and beat them in the playoffs.



However I must admit, I'm going to watch Impact more often from now on...
It just saddens me that at a time where wrestling is on 4 nights a week, with boatloads of talent on both sides, neither one can put on a show that I'm clammering to watch.

[Impact!]

For me theres only 8 people I watch WWE for and that's Chris Benoit, Ken Keneddy, Gregory Helms, Super Crazy, Carlito, Jeff Hardy, CM Punk, and RVD. And with how they have/are/will be booked I really have no reason to watch imo.

With TNA I like the majority of their roster, so even if they aren't doing much I can still see them and enjoy it.

[Afterlife]

My opinion of D2D is that it's exactly the way it was meant to be.

The first episode of ECW on SF was a blunderfest. Nothing was fluid or clean. But it was also the first step in a rebirth of a five-year dead entity.

Honestly, with this being the first "big show" of said reborn entity, I didn't expect anything magnanimus. I expected a 100% effort of a 50% product. They've still got a long way to go, and I think they gave us all they could for what they've got to give.

[RP]

I too think that could have been a good match. I know its a tired theory to say it seems that everything they do is the only possible way to fuck something up, but its held water since 2001. They need to take the George Costanza approach to their booking, and do it the other way around. Seriously, If they did it the other way around Sabu would have been in the match, CM Punk would have lasted late into the chamber and gotten screwed, and Lashley would have gone over as a heel.
WWEs response to such fan criticism would be, the fans don't know what they want and you don't give them what they want. This is entirely untrue. Perhaps the casual marks don't know what they want, but us Smarks really do. We all disagree on specifics, but we all see the decline in decision making and booking and its not because we're idiots who don't know what we want. Its because we know how things have worked, and we know how things have failed, we know who we like and who we don't and WWE can't seem to do something that pleases us and marks alike. This PPV is a prime example.
Its sad to say, but I can promise that Armageddon will suck and it hasnt even taken place.

So basically you want to dictate the show . Whats the point of being a fan?

[Corkscrewed]

I think wrestling in general has just been suffering from a severe case of "doesn't make sense itis."

[Jeritron]

I disagree, there was nothing inhibiting them from booking the chamber better.

As for the TNA roster stacked up against the WWE roster, I see such a wealth on both sides.
WWE: Benoit, Edge, Carlito, Jeff and Matt Hardy, Kennedy, Nitro, RVD, CM Punk, Shelton, Finlay, Rey Mysterio, Shawn and HHH (although they're politicians and DX borders on sucking, I still care about them and they're great wrestlers)

Basically what it really boils down to is I watch WWE for Edge. I really am starting to realize that he may be their only hope, hes one of the only guy who isn't past his prime or been buried.

TNA of course has Angle, Joe, Styles, Daniels and Christian who I all love. A guy like Sting, Jarret or Steiner is no different than WWE having Taker, Trips and Shawn still on top. And as for abyss, I really hate him and can't buy him as a champion. I just see him as an uniteresting and boring, third rate Kane/Mankind combo-knockoff.
Like I said, I'm really going to make an effort to catch Impact more, and I hope I can get more into than I have so far.

[Afterlife]

In all fairness, with Big Show's back as fucked up as it is, their champion could hardly wrestle. I would consider that a deterent in booking it better.

[Jeritron]

Its not that I want to dictate the show as much as it is that I think what they did was shitty/bad decision making. I dont always think the company should give me/us what I/we want, but sometimes I do think that what they do is wrong.
Thats really kind of an unfair attack, whats the point of being a fan? I dont want to dictate shit, I just don't like the way things are going and thats my suggestion and I'm sure most would agree with it.
They're putting out shit, and I think it sucks and could have been better, thats what this boards really for. Whats the point of being a fan? So I can criticize/praise what they do.
I suppose I should just see the WWEs way as the right way and accept it.

In the day, PPVs didn't always go the way people predicted/wanted, but they were done well. Fans criticism of the shit they put out now is correct, its just plain bad booking.

[addy2hotty]

But the thing is, it's certainly not popularity or marketing that's keeping the belt off RvD, its politics. Yeah, he got caught doing drugs, but he was made out to be the biggest chump in wrestling history in that 2 day period where he lost both titles. I'm sure if you looked hard enough, Lashley and most definitely Test would be in the doghouse for the same reasons.

He's been punished, he's the top face on ECW, far far more over than Bobby 'little voice' Lashley will ever be.

It just strikes me that they were too scared to give Lashley a run with the WHC as he wasn't ready, so instead we'll stick him on the C show and give him a title that means absolutely nothing in the grand scheme of things.

[Jeritron]

I agree.
However I dont get too upset about the way in which RVD lost, and will never gain back, the titles. Simply because he was probably going to drop both of them soon after as it was. And most likely, even on his best behavior, wouldn't have seen World gold again. Its all just an excuse.
Masters gets suspended for steroid use or what not, but somehow we're supposed to believe that Vince, his son in law, or none of the main eventers use them?

[Savio]

My opinion of D2D is that it's exactly the way it was meant to be.

The first episode of ECW on SF was a blunderfest. Nothing was fluid or clean. But it was also the first step in a rebirth of a five-year dead entity.

Honestly, with this being the first "big show" of said reborn entity, I didn't expect anything magnanimus. I expected a 100% effort of a 50% product. They've still got a long way to go, and I think they gave us all they could for what they've got to give.Yeah but they shitted on the fans making RVD and Punk go out first.

[Jeritron]

Not to mention it being devestating to both of them. And devestating to the show in the sense that its their only two over faces and probably the only two wrestlers who the fans get behind. RVD and CM Punk are probably their two biggest draws, and they buried them.

[Afterlife]

That's a very valid point. But, Punk is the only guy there that doesn't have some kind of WWE history outside of ECW. And, with Holly around, I'm sure we can all agree it was made clear that Punk had to "pay his dues". Wether this well-documented attitude had anything to do with the events in question, I cannot say, as I don't know how political Holly gets, but it's a notable thery in my opinion.

However, I hardly consider it "devastating" to either man. Yes, they both lost, but five ppl had to lose. Plus, it sets up some interesting scenarios and possibilities for storylines.

Obviously, it was not the best ECM, but it was pretty good for what they had. Again, they gave a 100% effort from a 50% force.

[addy2hotty]

Yeah but they shitted on the fans making RVD and Punk go out first.

RVD went out third, after Holly's peculiar 2-count elimination.

[addy2hotty]

Not to mention it being devestating to both of them. And devestating to the show in the sense that its their only two over faces and probably the only two wrestlers who the fans get behind. RVD and CM Punk are probably their two biggest draws, and they buried them.

Personally, I think they buried them all in the match. Test was going like a monster at one point, eliminating 2 people, then eliminated by Lashley. Show was nothing like the monster they built, he came in last and didn't eliminate anyone and got beaten by ONE take-down/spear. Like I posted in the D2D thread, had Lashley been in first, and ended up covered in blood holding the title like a baby, then it would have given him some credit. But the guy grabbed the belt, held it aloft, walked up the aisle acting like he didn't give a particular shit about it and then fireworks went off behind him. The guy looked like he hadn't broken a sweat. Didn't make Lashley look good at all.

[Afterlife]

RVD went out third, after Holly's peculiar 2-count elimination.

Yeah, that was feckin' weird. What's the deal there?

[addy2hotty]

Yeah, that was feckin' weird. What's the deal there?

Ref anticipated a kick out, didn't happen, whether or not that was down to Holly or the ref, I'm not sure. Tazz briefly said 'what the hell happened?', the camera switched to something else and you could just see Holly rolling out of the ring.

Perhaps Holly was injured or something, I'm kinda surprised Test pinned him tbh.

[Chavo Classic]

The first episode of ECW on SF was a blunderfest. Nothing was fluid or clean. But it was also the first step in a rebirth of a five-year dead entity.

Except it wasn't. You can't use an excuse like that baring in mind all the sudden changes and rotations that Vince & Co have made to ensure the people watching know ECW is a WWE brand, and not it's own entity.

The problem with the PPV IMO was the lack of build up. No casual fan was going to spend their cash on a PPV with only two announced matches. ECW might have done this back in the day but the loyal fanbase would've bought a turd if it had ECW stamped on it. It meant the arena was half full, and worse of all, the matches meant jack-shit.

[The Naitch]

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[Chavo Classic]

Wow. He's definately not hardcore

[Chavo Classic]

I mean look at his fukken smile

[The Ravishing One]

Get used to that Lashley picture.

[M-A-G]

Is anyone really surprised?

[M-A-G]

OK, here's the deal. I don't like ECW, ECW certainly doesn't like me. But I understand that there's a great number of fans who were loyal, and still are quite frankly, to the brand because of what it represented and what they did in the company. I may not GET IT but to each his own. When ECW was going to be resurrected, that pretty much says it all: ECW is going to be resurrected. Not the WWE or a half-assed attempt at ECW. It had no business being resurrected because it wasn't going to have the same style of booking. It's the booking that helps bring the feel and style of ECW. Not to mention the former superstars. Not a bunch of WWE guys that Raw and SmackDown! don't want anymore. No, I do not like ECW, never have and probably never will but the point is if you're going to do something, do it right. Either ECW can stand alone under it's own merits or it can't. That's why Big Show had no business main eventing against WWE guys every week. That's why ECW shouldn't be getting PPV time with Raw and SmackDown!. That's why you pull the plug when something isn't working. When it gets to the point where you have to supplement your roster with guys who have never worked in ECW before and you have almost 45 minutes left in your PPV and your main event's almost over, it's time to call it quits. But, no, according to the WWE, they're doing everything right. So expect Lashley vs. Show for the next few months, Hardcore Holly and Test more than likely winning a tournament to crown tag champions, and the Great Khali destroying Balls, Dreamer, and Sandman in one match. I'm exaggerating, sure, but you get the idea. Just more WWE programming in place of what's supposed to be ECW. I wouldn't care so much if it didn't effect the rosters and the writing of Raw and SmackDown!. Just be done with it. Call it another WBF and XFL and call it a day.

[Chavo Classic]

When it gets to the point where you have to supplement your roster with guys who have never worked in ECW before and you have almost 45 minutes left in your PPV and your main event's almost over

WTF? Did this happen? Lame

[M-A-G]

Dude, they had to kill so much time it wasn't even funny.

[Chavo Classic]

Couldn't they have at least brought out Mick Foley to dance with the Divas again?

[M-A-G]

Yeah, sure. More WWE stars.

[M-A-G]

Not even that, that's the kind of stuff WWE would do on one of their own PPVs.

[Chavo Classic]

Yeah, sure. More WWE <s> stars. </s> leftovers

[M-A-G]

It'd be funny if it weren't so sad.

[Chavo Classic]

I'm glad I turned my back on ECW more than a month ago, otherwise I would have watched that shitty PPV last night.

[M-A-G]

I'm sure you'd have turned your back on it regardless. How about that MNM vs. Hardys match? Probably the best one on the card BUT NO ONE THERE IS FROM ECW?!?!?!?!

[Chavo Classic]

Joey Mercury/Matthews

[M-A-G]

Yeah, but it's not like he currently works for them.

[Chavo Classic]

He's got a greater claim to be there than 90% of last night's card. Albeit it a short stint, he's got more ECW in his little finger than Lashley has in his whole over inflated, roided up body.

[M-A-G]

Fair enough but what about Matt, Jeff, and John?

[Chavo Classic]

The Hardys at least have that extreme style of wrestling going on. But it's hypocritical to be accepting of them just because I have a preference towards them. Matt and Jeff had no reason to be there either.

[Sadistic]

Was this the worst WWE PPV since 1997?


Yes.

[Avenger]

I just finished watching D2D.

It was a pile of shit. I'm sorry to be so blunt but it was just awful. :nono:

CM Punk is the only good thing that ECW have going and he has been buried.

[Mr. Nerfect]

To be fair, The Hardys have been competing in ECW for the last few weeks. Forgetting where they officially are designated, viewers of ECW would know who they are, the roll they are on, and could be invested in them. Joey Mercury is a former ECW guy, I just wish they'd had made mention of that.

They should of had Chris Benoit vs. Dean Malenko on the card. It was meant to happen at One Night Stand, but couldn't. It would have been fantastic last night. With The Hardys vs. MNM and Benoit vs. Malenko, the show would have been passable, in my opinion.

Better booking in the main event would have helped. Hardcore Holly should have been the first guy out. He was in the match longer than CM Punk, and he needs protecting less. Then CM Punk could have gone. He could have gone on longer, but from the moment he entered the match, it was obvious he was in there to bump. At least give your babyface the dignity of surviving longer than the lowest ranked heel. Rob Van Dam going next wasn't as bad as it was made out to be. At least he looked good. I'd have had him survive until Bobby Lashley got into the match, though.

To be perfectly honest, I'd have preferred it if all the guys in the match could have survived until Big Show entered. None of that Lashley vs. Show shit, let that happen down the line, just get some six-man spots going. Once all six guys were in the match, I'd have had this be the order of elimination: Hardcore Holly, Test, CM Punk, Rob Van Dam and finally Big Show.

[Savio]

He's got a greater claim to be there than 90% of last night's card. Albeit it a short stint, he's got more ECW in his little finger than Lashley has in his whole over inflated, roided up body.I don't think he uses roids to be fair.

[Fox]

There wasn't a single extreme rules match, was there?

[Afterlife]

Technically, the main event.