They really are trying to kill CM Punk's heat *ECW Spoilers*

[KingofOldSchool]

Before ECW got underway, a dark match took place in which Kevin Thord with Ariel defeated Scotty Too Hotty with his TKO finisher off the ropes. Does this move have a name yet. This match got a decent amount of time with Scotty hitting the worm and being super over (probably because this was the first thing out).

ECW began with the video displaying that tonight's main event would pit Lashley vs. Paul E's Security Team in a handicapped match. Also C.M Punk would be facing off against Hardcore Holly.

The first match was Test defeating RVD. This was surprisingly a good match, and in my opinion, the best of both tapings which is shocking...I know. RVD was super over, hitting his trade mark dive to the floor, Rolling Thunder, and many spinning back kicks. He was thrown off the top midway through to the floor and missed an attempted frog splash later on. Test went for a powerbomb but Rob rolled over with a sunset flip. Test sat down on RVD holding the ropes and scoring the three count.

Matt Striker made his way out for a special classroom in Boston. He made reference to Red Auerbach being dead, along with the fat losers in Boston as well as BIll Bunkner. How many times can these insults be re-used? We already won our World Series and the crowd only reacted to the Celtics' Auerbach being that he is a legend in Boston. His dead comments were really tasteless, what else can we expect from a company who exploits death to the EXTREME? Striker called out Balls who came to the ring to a good reaction. Balls began hitting a flurry before being kicked low by Striker. Striker left exclaiming he just left Balls looking and feeling more like "Blue Balls".

Punk got a great response from the Boston crowd. The match he had with Hardcore Holly was a major let down. The match felt like it never began, and ended with an awful finish which long time ECW faithful will look down upon. Hardcore Holly was disqualified for using excessive punches in the corner and not obeying the referee's count. The crowd absolutely crapped on the finish and rightfully so. Punk applied the Vice post match before finally releasing Holly. Looks like we have a new feud in ECW.

Tommy Dreamer came out to a good response from the crowd and challenged Great Khali. Khali came out, but as he was entering the ring Daivairi attacked Dreamer. Dreamer won with a DDT in two minutes. It was very forgettable. Post-match Khali pulled Dreamer out and did his finisher on the floor leaving Dreamer laying. He walked to the back on his own power and got some good sympathy cheers.

ECW Champion Lashley defeated Paul E's Secuirity in a handicapped match. Lashley was over and hit all his trademark spots. He pinned one of the security with a dominator before attacking both with the night stick's. Both "Bashams" sold this like death and did not move or leave for a good few minutes. They had already begun setting up for Smackdown before they eventually left.

Forgettable show, with a few we want table chants mixed in with the old ECW chants that quickly died down. Credit: rajahwwf.com

[Xero]

"...and ended with an awful finish which long time ECW faithful will look down upon."

That can be applied to the entire concept of a "New" ECW...

[Destor]

Looks fine to me. Punk went over, he got the win and the last word. Don't see a problem.

[KingofOldSchool]

The fans shat all over the finish of the match, that can help kill the heat for both of the wrestlers involved. But since Holly was in the match, it only hurts Punk.

Just because someone wins a match, doesn't mean they won't lose any momentum. Especially if the finish is a joke.

[D Mac]

They need to move him to Raw.

[Arnold HamNegger]

Sounds like the ones they're killing are RVD and Thorne. Losing to Test...a dark match?!? :nono: I just hope they aren't leading to a Test/Lashley feud. This is why I quit watching ECW because the writing team is too stubborn to give us any storyline/feuds that I give two shits about.

[Destor]

The fans shat all over the finish of the match, that can help kill the heat for both of the wrestlers involved. But since Holly was in the match, it only hurts Punk.

Just because someone wins a match, doesn't mean they won't lose any momentum. Especially if the finish is a joke.Well I can only talk about what I know. I don't know this match was shit (haven't seen it,) but lets say it's the worst match of all time. Just hypothetically, I wont hurt Punk or Holly. It's one match. Plus it's gonna be on a Saturday night, so at least no one will see it. And as far as you saying that they are trying to kill Punk's heat, I have a hard time believing they wanted the match to suck every bit as much as they wanted the finish to get shit on.

It probably will suck, but it's no big deal. No one is out to get Punk. you're overreacting.

[KingofOldSchool]

Well I can only talk about what I know. I don't know this match was shit (haven't seen it,) but lets say it's the worst match of all time. Just hypothetically, I wont hurt Punk or Holly. It's one match. Plus it's gonna be on a Saturday night, so at least no one will see it. And as far as you saying that they are trying to kill Punk's heat, I have a hard time believing they wanted the match to suck every bit as much as they wanted the finish to get shit on.

It probably will suck, but it's no big deal. No one is out to get Punk. you're overreacting.

It was the finish that sucked and the fans let it show. Booking 101 says that a poorly booked finish can hurt a person's heat. If this is shown on an ECW show and the match ended because of someone punching another person repeatedly, you know that the finish will not be well received.

Hell even if this was a Raw match, that kind of finish would be booed out of the building. That will only hurt the wrestlers involved. A 3 year old girl would be able to tell that this kind of finish would suck.

I'm not overreacting, I'm just making a casual observation. An overreaction would be "OMGGGGG WWE SUCKS, I'M NEVER WATCHING IT AGAIN!!! PUNK NEEEDS TO GOTO TNA!"

[KingofOldSchool]

Sounds like the ones they're killing are RVD and Thorne. Losing to Test...a dark match?!? :nono: I just hope they aren't leading to a Test/Lashley feud. This is why I quit watching ECW because the writing team is too stubborn to give us any storyline/feuds that I give two shits about.

RVD's contract is nearing its end and it's possible that RVD won't resign, so why not?

[Destor]

It was the finish that sucked and the fans let it show. Booking 101 says that a poorly booked finish can hurt a person's heat. If this is shown on an ECW show and the match ended because of someone punching another person repeatedly, you know that the finish will not be well received.

Hell even if this was a Raw match, that kind of finish would be booed out of the building. That will only hurt the wrestlers involved. A 3 year old girl would be able to tell that this kind of finish would suck.

I'm not overreacting, I'm just making a casual observation. An overreaction would be "OMGGGGG WWE SUCKS, I'M NEVER WATCHING IT AGAIN!!! PUNK NEEEDS TO GOTO TNA!"I promise, Punk will just as over come next Tuesday as he was going into the match. If these kinds of happenings continue for several weeks then you'll have an arguement. 1 bad finish doesn't mean someone is trying to kill his heat. He lost at D2D, no big deal. Last week he went over strong. This week a poorly booked finish. He's fine man. You're overeacting.

[Arnold HamNegger]

RVD's contract is nearing its end and it's possible that RVD won't resign, so why not?

Yeah, I know he hasn't helped is own cause either. Just sad to see IMO. When is his contract up?

[Kane Knight]

Wow. Isn't Punk one of the guys they're actually BIG on?

Fuck's sake, they don't know how to get anyone over, do they?

[The Naitch]

Triple H is probably conspiring against him in some way

[Destor]

Triple H is probably conspiring against him in some wayThat's what everyone is saying (they're retarded, but that's what they are saying.)

[Champion of Europa]

I'm not overreacting, I'm just making a casual observation. An overreaction would be "OMGGGGG WWE SUCKS, I'M NEVER WATCHING IT AGAIN!!! PUNK NEEEDS TO GOTO TNA!"

This reminds me of something CM Punk said on his Q&A.

Someone said to him: "What will you do if WWE misuses you like they misused Shannon Moore?

CM Punk: I'll probably by a hummer and a nice house, just like he did.

[Destor]

That might be the greatest quote ever.

[Shaggy]

wait...did i read that right??

Dreamer Challenges The Great Khali........Dreamer wins in two minutes with a DDT......Wait...so did he beat Khali in 2 minutes???? If that is true then how does that make Taker look. The guy put on multiple matches against him that took forever...and Taker still lost...here comes Dreamer and beats the guy in two minutes?

[Kane Knight]

This reminds me of something CM Punk said on his Q&A.

Someone said to him: "What will you do if WWE misuses you like they misused Shannon Moore?

CM Punk: I'll probably by a hummer and a nice house, just like he did.

LOL. Not a new thing (Other people have said the same thing, or to the same extent), but still. :y:

[The One]

Dreamer beat Diavari.

The Triple H holding Punk down theories steam from the fact that before debuting Triple H openly talked about how Punk didn't have "it".

One poorly booked finish, on a show that doesn't even air during it's normal time, will not kill his heat. Was it a good thing? No. And if the crowd started chanting "Re-fund!" or "Bull-shit!" or anything or that nature I would be proud of them.

If RVD doesn't resign a contract, they better as hell do a heel Punk/Straight Edge vs. face RVD/Stoner angle damn soon. It's really the only potential light in ECW right now.

The Hummer and Big House quote by Punk shows he is the mang in and out of the ring.

I am done.

[KingofOldSchool]

I don't think HHH is holding down Punk, I just think they are trying to "stabilize" Punk so he won't get super over and out shine the true stars of WWE like Cena and Lashley.

It's just funny how since Survior Series, Punk has been starting to be treated like just any other Upper-Midcarder.

They could've used the ECW before D2D to build a Test/Punk fued, which looked like that was going to happen. Then at D2D, they eliminated Punk first which ruined his undefeated streak with little to no drama and nothing to build off of.

And now they put him in a match with Holly, which I don't mind. Then they might've killed their feud before it even got started by having that lame ass DQ finish. I mean jesus if they are going to use a DQ finish, at least make it somewhat decent. Like having them both bring chairs into the ring or copy the Test/Punk finish from a couple of weeks back and have them brawl outside to a Double Countout.

[Arnold HamNegger]

Dreamer beat Diavari.

OK, I could be wrong because I haven't watched ECW in a long time (only been keeping tabs online)...BUT didn't they have Diavari on a winning streak since debuting on ECW? They have been basically jobbing Dreamer out to EVERYONE since being on Sci Fi...yet now Diavari get's beat by him in 2 minutes????

The booking of this doesn't make any sense...but why should I be suprised?

[The One]

Diavari has already lost to Dreamer...by a DDT...in under 2 minutes...so this isn't new or shocking.

[Arnold HamNegger]

Oh, alright. Like I said, haven't been watching lately. Which means I probably shouldn't be bitching either......

[Innovator]

39. If you get fired from wwe would you go back to roh or any other fed?

No. I will sign a fat Pride contract and get paid more money than you'll ever see in your entire life to get knocked out by Mirko CroCop in under 7 seconds in what Dave Meltzer will hail as the best shoot fight of the year due to my awesome attempt to tell the ref that he pulled my hair.

[Destor]

39. If you get fired from wwe would you go back to roh or any other fed?

No. I will sign a fat Pride contract and get paid more money than you'll ever see in your entire life to get knocked out by Mirko CroCop in under 7 seconds in what Dave Meltzer will hail as the best shoot fight of the year due to my awesome attempt to tell the ref that he pulled my hair.OMG ROFL. Link me to the rest of this plz.

[Caged Heat18]

Sounds like a lame finish in the Punk/Holly match, but otherwise the show doesn't look bad. I still generally enjoy the show each week, although it may be harder to catch this week.

[thecc]

http://www.cmpunk.com/info.php?askpunk

[M-A-G]

Will you retract this thread if he still gets mad cheers for the next few weeks? I mean I understand what you're saying and all but I thought it was something horrible like having him job to a rubber chicken in a squash.

[Kane Knight]

Just because he gets popped next week doesn't mean they're not trying to kill his heat. They tried it with Christian and failed...

[KingofOldSchool]

Will you retract this thread if he still gets mad cheers for the next few weeks? I mean I understand what you're saying and all but I thought it was something horrible like having him job to a rubber chicken in a squash.

Notice the keyword "trying" as in to try to do something. Need I remind you about who they have done it to in the past?

ie: Christian last year, RVD from 2001-2003, and Booker T in 2003

[Jeritron]

And its all because Triple H doesnt like them.
Triple H called Booker T "inconsistent" in 2003, and thats why he wasnt given the belt at the height of his stardom.

[Kane Knight]

I doubt they're trying to though.

That would indicate WWE could make a conscious decision and make it work.

[Jeritron]

I dont think they're trying to bury him, they just dont know what the fuck they're doing.
Seriously, I'm against pushing him too soon, but with the state things are in and the heat hes getting...they need to make a move with him there now. Whether it be book him in a high profile fued, give him a new TV title, or even put the title on him (though i dont want it yet)
Either that or move the guy off the sinking ship and put him on Raw or Smackdown.
It'd be awesome to see him fued with Jeff or Benoit or somebody. Then they could really showcase him.

[Kane Knight]

They need to push someone fast. And if Punk has serious heat, they probably should push him. Though I hate the guy. From his overrated skills to his total face persona, I would rather see him dead than on TV, and will personally be happy to see him totally buried.

On the other hand, that doesn't make it the smartest move. Not everyone thinks their fetishes are the answer to WWE's problems.

[CSL]

They need to move him to Smackdown.

[Gray]

35. Dear CM Punk, First I want to let you know, that you have (at least!) one big fan in Luxembourg! Secondly, as I know, you have already wrestled a few times in Europe. So, what is your opinion about Europe, about the lifestyle, the people and, of course, the wrestling? Dude, i'm HUGE in Luxembourg. As far as Europe goes, Germans don't know how to drive. England has the most piss poor transvestites i've ever seen. Wales likes to throw lit cigarettes at me. I love Europe, I love the weather, I always found it a bit hard to eat properly while over there. P.S. Fuck France.

Everyone hates the French

He has my love <3 <3

[M-A-G]

Notice the keyword "trying" as in to try to do something. Need I remind you about who they have done it to in the past?

ie: Christian last year, RVD from 2001-2003, and Booker T in 2003

Oh. :o

[M-A-G]

And its all because Triple H doesnt like them.
Triple H called Booker T "inconsistent" in 2003, and thats why he wasnt given the belt at the height of his stardom.

Not to mention he wanted to 'keep the belt strong' for when Goldberg got it. So what happens when Goldberg is supposed to get it in the chamber? HHH wins.

[Jeritron]

not to mention he comes in and doesnt do one wrestling move to retain. That night sickened me.
If it was strong leading up to that, it wasnt very strong after that night. And whats the point of making a belt 'strong' when the guy you've put a year into obtaining it only gets to run with it for 2 months
I'm sure Punk is too small for Triple H's liking. Punk fits more into the category of guys Foley or Heyman would push for backstage (Jericho, RVD, Booker) and not the types Triple H and Flair seem to gush over (Batista).

[The One]

WWE needs to do something with Punk, and they need to do it now. If I had it my way I would send him to SmackDown and put him in a program with Benoit for the US Title that would last from Royal Rumble until WrestleMania. Or I would send him to RAW, and put him in some high profile fueds. But they absolutely need to do SOMETHING because while he is retaining his heat on ECW, it's only a matter of time before it becomes stale.

[Mr. Nerfect]

WWE needs to do something with Punk, and they need to do it now. If I had it my way I would send him to SmackDown and put him in a program with Benoit for the US Title that would last from Royal Rumble until WrestleMania. Or I would send him to RAW, and put him in some high profile fueds. But they absolutely need to do SOMETHING because while he is retaining his heat on ECW, it's only a matter of time before it becomes stale.

That's what I'd do, too. CM Punk has stated in an interview (with IGN, I believe) that his dream match is Chris Benoit & CM Punk vs. William Regal & Finlay. Where are three of those men now? Moving Punk to SmackDown! would help the WWE out greatly. It provides them with another babyface, a solid worker for the mid-card, and it helps put Punk into perspective amongst WWE Superstars. Does it leave ECW looking weaker? Sure, but who gives a fuck, it sucks these days anyway.

And I am of the belief they are trying to kill Punk's heat. Not majorly, to the point where they can't build him up again, but to just keep him down until they think he's been in the WWE long enough to justify making money off him. As KoOS said, the excessive punching finish would be called bullshit in the WWE. Even for the new ECW, that is a stupid fucking way to end the match. Why not have Holly use a steel chair, or bring out his trash can lids and go windmill style on Punk?

I thought Triple H was taken out of context when he said Punk didn't know how to control a crowd, and that he was being sarcastic. I guess I was wrong, hence the post-Survivor Series bitterness towards Punk by the creative team. :-\

[KingofOldSchool]

I stand by my statement after tonight.

[Innovator]

Good call

[KingofOldSchool]

aka I'm beyond pissed, even moreso than after sitting through that Rosie/Trump shit last night.

Holly made Punk look as much as a jobber as Triple H did to RVD during a match they had a couple of years ago.

This whole feud has made Punk look pathetic.

[Innovator]

Pretty much, Punk was gonna lose at some point but that was horrible. I would have rather WWE used the typical feet on the ropes roll up, just so they made it look like Holly couldn't beat Punk clean..........but cmon it's Hardcore Holly, he's awesome, he's over, he's shit.

[ron the dial]

What the fuck? I'm glad that I've decided to only catch ECW on Hardcore Hangover, because they only reason I tuned in was for Punk. I don't need to see him jobbing to Holly CLEAN. Retarded.

[Jeritron]

It's retarded. But they're not TRYING to kill his heat, they just are because they don't know any better as to what they're doing.
Vince has regressed. He knows as well as anyone what works now, and what used to work. And he's made a point of making his priorities shift back to the cheesy, unskilled, bull fights of the 80s, and has given up on the CM Punk types. Thats why Great Khali, Umaga, Lashley and whoever are pushed...while RVD, CM Punk and others flounder in the midcard.
Its probably because HHH doesn't like "little punks" like CM or Jericho. Whatever, they're funeral.

[NeanderCarl]

Of all the people to put over C.M. Punk, why let it be Job Holly?

[#BROKEN Hasney]

That Q+A on Punks site rocks

27. Are you going to ever ware your Long Shorts again. No.

28. So far what has been your biggest achievement in Wrestling? Switching to trunks.

[Innovator]

Is the WWE going to make you change your finisher, since a variation of the move is used by Triple H? Yeah, they want me to beat people via count out ala the BERZERKER. Or maybe it was the anaconda vice...I forget.

[addy2hotty]

Is it me or were a lot of Punk-sters saying that he should win the ECW title at Mania a month or so ago. Now he's dead, buried and paid his dues to Bobcore, lots are saying he's not ready.

Man, Vince has you all figured out.

[ron the dial]

I (being a "Punk-ster") never wanted him with the ECW title at WM. That would be blowing the load way too soon. And I really don't mind him losing. But to go down clean to Holly at the beginning of the feud makes him look like a bitch. Especially after he couldn't lock on the Anaconda Vice a few weeks back. The man who's all about competition goes down to the barely-ever-was.

[Kane Knight]

It's retarded. But they're not TRYING to kill his heat, they just are because they don't know any better as to what they're doing.
Vince has regressed. He knows as well as anyone what works now, and what used to work. And he's made a point of making his priorities shift back to the cheesy, unskilled, bull fights of the 80s, and has given up on the CM Punk types. Thats why Great Khali, Umaga, Lashley and whoever are pushed...while RVD, CM Punk and others flounder in the midcard.
Its probably because HHH doesn't like "little punks" like CM or Jericho. Whatever, they're funeral.

JEsus Christ. Jericho was around the main event/upper midcard scene most of his time in WWE. He's actually liked backstage, too. RVD? RVD blew a monster push, a huge moment, and a championship reign because he had to get baked and then get caught in a car with drugs. Van Dam blew his chance, Jericho helped make Milli Vanilli look good (He enhanced the ME scene, perdiod). These are bad examples (Well, Van Dam would be a good example except for this "back to the old school of wrestling" complaint about recent events, since RVD was wasted like 5 years ago almost).

[redoneja]

39. If you get fired from wwe would you go back to roh or any other fed? No. I will sign a fat Pride contract and get paid more money than you'll ever see in your entire life to get knocked out by Mirko CroCop in under 7 seconds in what Dave Meltzer will hail as the best shoot fight of the year due to my aweome attempt to tell the ref that he pulled my hair

:lol:

[M-A-G]

Are any of you REALLY shocked that he lost?

[ron the dial]

Shocked is not the right word. Disappointed. But that's a feeling that I generally associate with WWE.

[Kane Knight]

Nope.

[NeanderCarl]

You know, it makes me laugh when people say "he's not ready yet" about guys who have been wrestling for years. RVD was the most over guy in the company in 2001 and the RIGHT time to put him over as the champion was No Mercy 2001. He had only been there for a few months, but he was white-hot. That they let it play out for so long lessened the impact when he finally won it, years later.

The RIGHT time to put C.M. Punk in as the champ, if that IS the eventual plan, would be by or at WrestleMania. So fucking what if he's new to the company? He's paid enough dues in the business (even if that isn't in WWE)not to be jobbed out to Job Holly. They need to strike while the iron is hot.

[Kane Knight]

Yes. Working in the indies is the same as being onboard for WWE's biggest rivals, and already being a high profile character.

[NeanderCarl]

What I'm saying is it doesn't matter where somebody has worked before, or even how long for, if they are super-over and the fans WANT to see it happen, then make it happen. It's good business in my view. Give the people want they want to see.

Fuck the boys in the back, 90% of them will never be satisfied with their position anyway, and there will be backstage animosity to a new guy put in the main event whether he's a rookie or a 10 year veteran. You can't please everyone, but you can try to please your audience.

[addy2hotty]

What I'm saying is it doesn't matter where somebody has worked before, or even how long for, if they are super-over and the fans WANT to see it happen, then make it happen. It's good business in my view. Give the people want they want to see.

Fuck the boys in the back, 90% of them will never be satisfied with their position anyway, and there will be backstage animosity to a new guy put in the main event whether he's a rookie or a 10 year veteran. You can't please everyone, but you can try to please your audience.

Jericho as a face Champ
RVD 2001
Carlito

Shall we go on?

[Jeritron]

Booker T 2003

[Jeritron]

and coming soon to an online smark rant near you...CM Punk and Ken Kennedy

[addy2hotty]

Chris Jericho once said 'mediocrity is excellence'. It now is.

[Jeritron]

Chris Jerichos entire debut speech is eerily relevant haha. Literally every word rings true.

[Kane Knight]

What I'm saying is it doesn't matter where somebody has worked before, or even how long for, if they are super-over and the fans WANT to see it happen, then make it happen.

Worked well for Matt Hardy.

And Orton.

And Cena.

Well, actually, it did work for Cena, but only because WWE doesn't care that he was getting booed, or buyrates started to suffer.

[The Naitch]

who cares. I hope WWE fails miserably.

[Kane Knight]

and coming soon to an online smark rant near you...CM Punk and Ken Kennedy

That's kind of loaded though. Unless CM Punk is Unified Champ on all four shows, he'll not get close to what the smarks expect. Kennedy? He'd better win the Rumble, hold all titles on Smackdown, and single handedly eliminate every man in the Royal Rumble...

[Kane Knight]

Basically, I'm saying that Punk could be pushed to the moon, and Smarks would insist they should have pushed him to Mars instead.

[Fox]

Mars > Moon

[Kane Knight]

Mars > Moon

[Fox]

:(

[Kane Knight]

Sorry, but it does miss the point. The point being, even if they use him well, and give him everything the Smarks normally say someone should have, he'll be underused. Because, like Kennedy, Burchill, RVD, Kurt Angle and many others in the past, he is the internet Golden Boy, who will deliver wrestling to salvation, and no ammount of attention from WWE will ever change the fact that one man cannot do that. Even Austin and Hogan really didn't.

It's more or less setting WWE up for a fall, which is tiresome in and of itself. They do a good enough job of fucking shit up without holding them to impossible standards. The IWC will never let well enough alone. Chris Jericho was so underused, despite being given more leeway on the mic than a lot of wrestlers in WWE, being a Unified Champ, and being in the ME scene a LOT. Many Kurt Angle fans jumped on the bandwagon when he left and said that Kurt was underused and Underappreciated. Yeah, the guy who had just been champ on Smackdown, had been sent to ECW to try and gain ratings, and has been treated by the WWF/E since his arrival as though he had a solid Gold DICK, was underused.

No matter how well it goes with Punk, he won't have been pushed far enough, hard enough, in the right way. He won't have gotten the titles soon enough, he didn't ME Mania soon enough, etc. The multiple threads we have on the subject already before his push is even dead should indicate this.

[Londoner]

^ But that doesn't excuse them from the shit job they're doing, sounds like you're trying to take the attention away from the real point here KK.

[NeanderCarl]

Jericho as a face Champ
RVD 2001
Carlito

Shall we go on?

That's my point. I'm saying they SHOULD try to please their audience, not that they actually DO.

[Kane Knight]

^ But that doesn't excuse them from the shit job they're doing, sounds like you're trying to take the attention away from the real point here KK.

You mean the dead horse the smarktards are flogging?

Sure, do go on about it. I'm not sure what else can be said, except that they're overreacting. That's what got me on this tangent i the first place. You...DO know the internet, right? Most threads on this board sidetrack into other things.

But please. Don't let me get between you and the horse. There's still a little bit by the anus that I was saving for the One.

This is totally jumping the gun. This still isn't the end of CM Punk's push, until WWE proves otherwise. You're already jumping the gun, too. Unless they are taping ECW three weeks at a time now, you know as little about next week as I do, and that means a loss here or there in and of itself is not the end. If they do it next week, if they work an entire program where CM Punk loses or looks horribly worse for the wear consistently, then you will have a valid reason to complain about the "Shit job" they're doing. But so far, you've got no pattern. You've got a match. Isolated.

And again, this is where my "loaded" comments come in.

Nobody's stopping you from diving in with the Smarktards and discussing how this is the end of Punk's career, how he'll never work again, and how he'll be taken out back and given the "Ole Yeller" treatment, or whatever you guys want to make this out to be. The fact is, they've got sweet fuck all to complain about. Granted, I'd laugh my ass off if they did kill his heat. But I wouldn't want to take attention away from that, either.

I'd be howling with laughter, but I wouldn't want to take away from the enjoyment.

I see the death of his push as inevitable, but it's stupid to write him off after one match. After all, I don't like Punk, so he'll probably Main Event.

[Kane Knight]

That's my point. I'm saying they SHOULD try to please their audience, not that they actually DO.

They've tried to. Several times. It was usually disaster, but if all you're looking for is an attempt, then open your eyes.

[Londoner]

You mean the dead horse the smarktards are flogging?

Sure, do go on about it. I'm not sure what else can be said, except that they're overreacting. That's what got me on this tangent i the first place. You...DO know the internet, right? Most threads on this board sidetrack into other things.



I personally think that after that post, that you're the one who is overreacting. Punk lost to Holly clean, how is that overreacting? Of all heels to lose to clean he lost to Holly. I'm not surprised people are reacting this way. But I guess you're right and they're all wrong yeah? Ofcourse...

[addy2hotty]

I personally think that after that post, that you're the one who is overreacting. Punk lost to Holly clean, how is that overreacting? Of all heels to lose to clean he lost to Holly. I'm not surprised people are reacting this way. But I guess you're right and they're all wrong yeah? Ofcourse...

And exactly which heel on ECW could he have lost to and it not resulted in the long tirades?

[Londoner]

^Maybe test?

[addy2hotty]

^Maybe test?

'Of all people to job him to, TEST! He's done nothing since the McMahon/Helmsley angle! He used to be in a tag team with ALBERT for fucks sake! I would have preferred Holly, at least he's 'hardcore'! They are killing Punks heat......(and so on)'

That's how it would have been.

[Londoner]

^ Um no, stop sucking upto KK please. Test is far better/ more credible than Holly. But don't let the truth step in the way of you thinking that way.

[ron the dial]

Saying that Test is more credible than Holly is like saying that Britney Spears is more credible than Jessica Simpson.

[addy2hotty]

^ Um no, stop sucking upto KK please. Test is far better/ more credible than Holly. But don't let the truth step in the way of you thinking that way.

I'm sucking up to no-one. My opinion is my own. Stop changing the subject because you've backed yourself into a corner.

Test is no more and no less credible than Holly.

[Kane Knight]

I personally think that after that post, that you're the one who is overreacting. Punk lost to Holly clean, how is that overreacting? Of all heels to lose to clean he lost to Holly. I'm not surprised people are reacting this way. But I guess you're right and they're all wrong yeah? Ofcourse...

Yes, that's exactly what I said.

God, now you're not just going out of your way to find a reason to bitch about WWE, but also about me. Good one. :y:

[Kane Knight]

^ Um no, stop sucking upto KK please. Test is far better/ more credible than Holly. But don't let the truth step in the way of you thinking that way.

:lol: you sure don't.

[KingofOldSchool]

Saying that Test is more credible than Holly is like saying that murder is more credible than suicide.

[Xero]

Probably been said, but since when is one loss to ANYBODY considered a de-push?

If he's continued to be jobbed out then there's reason for concern, but people, it's one loss in a feud.

Will it destroy Punk if he goes on and wins the feud? No, it'll push him up a level, no matter who he beats. If he loses the feud? Again, then there's reason for concern. But one loss is nothing. Are you all expecting him to be an unstoppable force?

There's more than one way to push someone.

(Didn't read the whole thread so I'm guessing I missed something...)

[Kane Knight]

Actually, I takle it back. You're all right. CM Punk is such a loser that a single loss will kill off all his support and end his miserable career. I mean, it's not like he's got talent, momentum, or a following.

So let's just start asking now: Whatever happened to "Carry Me" Punk?

I mean, honestly..How shitty must the guy be to have his heat killed off by a single loss? ;)

[Kane Knight]

Probably been said, but since when is one loss to ANYBODY considered a de-push?

Stop sucking up to KK. Don't let the facts get in the way of your argument.

[Xero]

I didn't even read his posts. :shifty:

[Kane Knight]

Lies. The only way you could possibly disagree with TL is if you're kissing Kane Knight's Ass. I mean, what you're saying is that you're right and everyone else is wrong, right? Thought so. You're the one overreacting.

[Destor]

For the first time ever, I copletely agree with Kane Knight. You all are over-reacting, calm down, it was one match.

[Skippord]

NoDQ.com > WWE > CM Punk currently in the WWE dog house
Posted by Aaron Rift on 01/13/2007 at 05:13 PM

CM Punk is currently in the dog house for openly disagreeing with the layout of the Elimination Chamber match at December to Dismember. This is the main reason why his winning streak was ended on ECW TV this past week. Punk was personally told by Arn Anderson that "after 14 years on being on WWE televison, Holly is the bigger star" as an explanation as to why the heel should pin the babyface clean. Also Vince McMahon has suggested that CM Punk turn heel.

[ron the dial]

Fuck yeah, CM Punk heel turn.

Not that it would really make a whole lot of sense right now, but oh well.

[addy2hotty]

NoDQ.com > WWE > CM Punk currently in the WWE dog house
Posted by Aaron Rift on 01/13/2007 at 05:13 PM

CM Punk is currently in the dog house for openly disagreeing with the layout of the Elimination Chamber match at December to Dismember. This is the main reason why his winning streak was ended on ECW TV this past week. Punk was personally told by Arn Anderson that "after 14 years on being on WWE televison, Holly is the bigger star" as an explanation as to why the heel should pin the babyface clean. Also Vince McMahon has suggested that CM Punk turn heel.

:lol:

Looks like I was right after all. Backstage prick.

[ron the dial]

Not to sound like your stereotypical Punk mark here, but how do you know that he was being a prick? Just because you voice a disagreement doesn't mean that you were a bitch about it.

[NeanderCarl]

They've tried to. Several times. It was usually disaster, but if all you're looking for is an attempt, then open your eyes.

I'm talking most specifically about doing so when the opportunity presents intself on a plate ie. the aborted/neglected pushes of RVD, Booker T and more recently C.M. Punk.

I'm not a big C.M. Punk mark... I don't honestly see what all the fuss is about... but I do realise that he seems to have more of a cult fanbase now than anyone who has come through the pike in recent times. Rather than capitalise on this, they seem intent of making him "pay his dues". Fuck "dues". You're supposed to be running a business here.

It is history repeating itself. You can say that WWE does occasionally try to appease their fans by giving them what they want. More often than not, however, it is either so long since the moment passed that nobody really cares anymore (RVD's title win) or atrocious booking kills any momentum dead almost immediately (InVasion, Matt Hardy 2005).

C.M. Punk will probably be embroiled in the mid card for the next year, losing nearly as often as he is winning; the crowd chants getting quieter and quieter with each passing month. Then, he will eventually become a champion in ECW (or whichever brand he is on) but, bar a big pop for the novelty of his victory, his heat will have evaporated.

Hey, I don't care either way. I think the guy has potential to be the next huge guy, based on the character he is playing. It could connect with the whole emo/straight-edge rock movement and make WWE cool again. That would be a good thing for me, as a fan. It pains me to see WWE steer in the wrong direction once again, focusing more of their energies on celebrity endorsements and comedy spoofs than the direction the company should take to remain relevant in today's entertainment market. C.M. Punk could well be the key to their future success, if anybody in that company has any balls left.

[NeanderCarl]

I mean, I could really see the next generation of WWE led by C.M. Punk and Ken Kennedy as the modern day equivelants to Savage/Hogan and Austin/Rock, with one being an edgy character with great ring skills, the other being more of an entertainer, a speaker, the antithesis of his opposite.

I sound like I'm jumping on the internet bandwagon of loving Punk and Kennedy. I don't. I'm not a huge fan of either (yet, anyway).

But I can still see the potential, and if WWE played their cards right, I could easily see a WrestleMania one day headlined by C.M. Punk vs Ken Kennedy in a "Super Match", much like Hogan vs Savage, Hogan vs Warrior and Rock vs Austin; the two undisputed stars of the company go one-on-one at the biggest show of the year.

And I'm saying this as a guy who has never seen either guy have a match that I would personally class as above average. (But then I haven't seen much of Punk in ROH)

[addy2hotty]

Not to sound like your stereotypical Punk mark here, but how do you know that he was being a prick? Just because you voice a disagreement doesn't mean that you were a bitch about it.

I'm sorry, but you don't walk into a company and start voicing your disapproval with people that have been, not only in the business longer than you, but have made a vast success of running the business. Not openly either. Say what you have to say in private or bite your tongue. Punk appears (and always has to me) too big for his boots. His website says that, his blogs say that. If what is above is true, then he got his just rewards - that'll learn him.

Just because he has a internet fan base and one big pop event at Survivor Series, doesn't mean you wander around thinking you are the big cheese/the head honcho/the main man.

As Kevin Nash once said - 'Come back to me when you've main-evented a couple of Wrestlemania's'.

[addy2hotty]

I mean, I could really see the next generation of WWE led by C.M. Punk and Ken Kennedy as the modern day equivelants to Savage/Hogan and Austin/Rock, with one being an edgy character with great ring skills, the other being more of an entertainer, a speaker, the antithesis of his opposite.

I sound like I'm jumping on the internet bandwagon of loving Punk and Kennedy. I don't. I'm not a huge fan of either (yet, anyway).


I don't know why, but neither Punk nor Kennedy strike me as the next big stars. Trips and Rock while at mid-card level did. Austin did. I'm not seeing it really. I'm looking forward to seeing Kennedy vs Batista at Rumble tho. It's certainly his big chance.

[KingofOldSchool]

NoDQ.com > WWE > CM Punk currently in the WWE dog house
Posted by Aaron Rift on 01/13/2007 at 05:13 PM

CM Punk is currently in the dog house for openly disagreeing with the layout of the Elimination Chamber match at December to Dismember. This is the main reason why his winning streak was ended on ECW TV this past week. Punk was personally told by Arn Anderson that "after 14 years on being on WWE televison, Holly is the bigger star" as an explanation as to why the heel should pin the babyface clean. Also Vince McMahon has suggested that CM Punk turn heel.

That's not what I heard...

[Innovator]

Me too

[ron the dial]

That's not what I heard...
What did you hear...

[Innovator]

Heyman wanted Punk to choke Show out during the Elimination Chamber. The two agents (producers, whatever the fuck they call themselves) who were in charge of the match said Punk isn't over and the Vice isn't over. These two guys are Arn Anderson and Finlay. They go to Vince and tell him to put Lashley over in the Chamber. The rest is WrestleCrap history.

This week Holly was supposed to win, with either cheating or a weapon shot. Then again the agents changed the finish to Punk losing clean.

[Skippord]

Foolish NODQ

[Skippord]

BTW I'm gonna believe the one Innovator said

[redoneja]

Yea, Skippord, if you go far enough back on NoDq, they had the exact same thing Inno posted up. Take NoDq(and all sites like that) with a grain of salt.

[RGWhat316]

I may not be the biggest Punk fan, but some of the reasoning I heard is kinda crap. Unless some people are just starting out in wrestling, I don't get this whole "paying their dues". And there seems to be a double standard when it comes to big guys and little guys. They sign a freak out of a movie who can't even wrestle, and put him in the main events. But yet someone the size of Punk has to "pay dues" even though he has wrestled for years, albeit other companies.

It just seems now that Punk has the RVD path going for him. Since he has gotten over on his own pisses off all the big honchos, and therefore will do anything to kill his push.

And as far as Holly being there for 14 years, therefore he should get the win is BS. If he has been there that long, then he should be putting over the younger talent, not destroying them.

[KingofOldSchool]

source: Wrestling Observer Newsletter

CM Punk's loss to Hardcore Holly at the 1/9 ECW show was of course, the end of his undefeated streak. Punk is currently in the doghouse and this was punishment for it. However, it is currently unknown at the moment in regards to what Punk did to deserve to be in the doghouse in the first place.

It was well known backstage that Punk disagreed with the layout for the Extreme Elimination Chamber match the Dec. To Dismember. Arn Anderson, who was the co-producer of the match along with Michael Hayes, made the following remark: "After 14 years of being WWE television, Holly is the bigger star."

ECW writer Dave Lagana's original plan for the 1/9 match was for Punk to be on the verge of beating Holly with the Vise, but Holly would to struggle to the ropes and win with the feet on the ropes finish for a fluke pin. However, at the agent meeting before the show, the whole room turned on Punk. Anderson said that Holly should make Punk pay his dues. Also, some of the agents believe that he's "Heyman's guy", and that's he's not really very good and his being over is a fluke that was created by Heyman. Once again, Anderson said that Punk should pay his dues before they push him and there was no need for Holly to have to cheat to beat him because he's 'the real WWE Superstar'. The idea for the clean finish in the match came from Finlay.

Also, there were people backstage getting off on Holly chopping CM Punk hard during the match.

[KingofOldSchool]

And as far as Holly being there for 14 years, therefore he should get the win is BS. If he has been there that long, then he should be putting over the younger talent, not destroying them.

QUICK! Give Brooklyn Brawler the WWE title! He's been there for over 20 years!

[Innovator]

Finkel for WWE Champion

[Kane Knight]

:lol: I wonder if Punk did something (Smarktard: of course not! He's CM PUNK? PUUUUUUNK! WWE is just stupid) or if people are just against him backstage (Which would be a real change of attitude).

[Innovator]

:lol: I wonder if Punk did something (Smarktard: of course not! He's CM PUNK? PUUUUUUNK! WWE is just stupid) or if people are just against him backstage (Which would be a real change of attitude).Being associated with Heyman in WWE is like wearing a Nazi symbol down the middle of the street during a Jewish parade.

[Jeritron]

"Also, some of the agents believe that he's "Heyman's guy", and that's he's not really very good and his being over is a fluke that was created by Heyman"

Heyman's guy? What like Foley, Benoit, Jericho, Eddie, Rey, RVD and others?

[KingofOldSchool]

Being associated with Heyman in WWE is like wearing a Nazi symbol down the middle of the street during a Jewish parade and the Million Man March.

[FourFifty]

NoDQ.com > WWE > CM Punk currently in the WWE dog house
Posted by Aaron Rift on 01/13/2007 at 05:13 PM

Punk was personally told by Arn Anderson that "after 14 years on being on WWE televison, Holly is the bigger star" as an explanation as to why the heel should pin the babyface clean.

I'm sorry, but saying Holly is the bigger star is like telling my Jewish grandma that the holocaust never happened.



*edit- Had to take out a rant because for some reason I read the word "biggest" instead of "bigger"

[Skippord]

Kinda want to punch Arn in the face rn

[HardKore]

I predict that CM Punk will lose more than 50% of his matches over the next 12 months and that he will last about 30 seconds in the Rumble.

[Kane Knight]

Being associated with Heyman in WWE is like wearing a Nazi symbol down the middle of the street during a Jewish parade.

And yet, several people who would seem to fit that definition have done fine in WWE, so I'm not particularly sure this is the reason.

[Kane Knight]

Spoiler Alert:


(1) CM Punk vs. Matt Striker. Joey Styles notes that Punk lasted 28 minutes in the Royal Rumble. Striker wins a short match by holding the ropes. I guess Punk remains in the dog house.

Okay, babies, you now actually have some sort of trend to piss and moan about. Your crying is now somewhat justified.

...As is the urine in your training pants.

[redoneja]

credit:wrestling observer newsletter

- CM Punk's push is now completely dead. Almost nobody backstage likes him, as they feel he's got an attitude that only the top guys should have. He won't be cut however, as there is concern that he could become a star in TNA

Someone may want to confirm this though as I didn't get this from the Observer myself.

[RP]

Has the thought even crossed Vince's mind, that maybe he should have that type of attitude cause he's better then almost all the WWE's top guys ?

Wait. Am i kidding myself or what? Vince lost his mind years ago.

[Blitz]

credit:wrestling observer newsletter


Someone may want to confirm this though as I didn't get this from the Observer myself.
Read that too. It was on Observer.

[Champion of Europa]

If anyone else had the attitude CM Punk has right now, they'd be all over him on this board.

I like CM Punk, but he's doing some damn stupid shit.

[Corkscrewed]

:lol: Looks like my spoof (http://tpww.net/forums/showthread.php?p=1591706#post1591706) wasn't too far off the mark.

[Blitz]

If anyone else had the attitude CM Punk has right now, they'd be all over him on this board.

I like CM Punk, but he's doing some damn stupid shit.
What exactly has he done? I've heard all this shit about how he's got an attitude, but I've never heard exactly what he's done to earn that rep.

[Skippord]

Kissed his girlfriend

the bastard

[Corkscrewed]

Made Maria not want to give Vince handjobs.

[Blitz]

Seriously, if kissing his girlfriend is the only thing he did then that is just fucking sad.

[D Mac]

He's a jobber.

[Mr. Nerfect]

If Punk does have an attitude, maybe it's because he out-popped the biggest face act the WWE had (despite being on the C-brand)? I'm sure having Maria ride you doesn't help.

Randy Orton has an attitude, what happens to him? Push, push, push.

Even if CM Punk has an attitude problem, and that's a big if...why the fuck should that interfere with him getting a push? Money is money right? Punk is one of the few guys in the WWE that could be HUGE. The WWE is missing a huge opportunity.

[Dave Youell]

Let me get this straight.

They are de pushing Punk, cos he has an attitude problem and they don't think he's money.

But they are worried about him going to TNA and becoming a star?

Hypocracy alert!

[Kane Knight]

If anyone else had the attitude CM Punk has right now, they'd be all over him on this board.

I like CM Punk, but he's doing some damn stupid shit.

Gee, selective enforcement from the wrestling community?

Psh. You're full of shit. :roll:

[Kane Knight]

Seriously, if kissing his girlfriend is the only thing he did then that is just fucking sad.

It's apparently not, as lame as I think it is that they're reacting with "heat" for this. Reminds me of that Simpsons episode. "You're kissing a girl? That is so gay."

If Punk does have an attitude, maybe it's because he out-popped the biggest face act the WWE had (despite being on the C-brand)? I'm sure having Maria ride you doesn't help.

Randy Orton has an attitude, what happens to him? Push, push, push.

Even if CM Punk has an attitude problem, and that's a big if...why the fuck should that interfere with him getting a push? Money is money right? Punk is one of the few guys in the WWE that could be HUGE. The WWE is missing a huge opportunity.

I especially liked that Push where Orton jobbed out to the Undertaker for like a year straight.

Let me get this straight.

They are de pushing Punk, cos he has an attitude problem and they don't think he's money.

But they are worried about him going to TNA and becoming a star?

Hypocracy alert!

A "star" in TNA is about a "Velocity" level wrestler.

However, the major point is that they don't want him to get big. Though I think it's hypocritical (Hey, you didn't seem so worried about attitude with Brock), it's a pretty common thing. If Punk had half a brain, he'd be wary of being cocky without important friends or the support of Vince. Still, it comes back to They don't want him to succeed/they want to punish him. That's the bullet point.

Now, if you don't want someone to succeed, why send them off to someone else?

[Anybody Thrilla]

Well, there's still the notion that they think he COULD be successful that strikes me as kind of odd. People in wrestling seem to take things WAY too personally.

[Anybody Thrilla]

Also, I think a lot more people should lose to Matt Striker, seeing as to how he is the man. Moreso than CM Punk, for sure.

[Jeritron]

Yea CM Punk is dead as a doornail, just like Paul Levesque was in 1996 after getting in the doghouse. He never came back from that....

[Anybody Thrilla]

Henry Godwinn went on to huge stardom, though. :y:

[Mr. Nerfect]

I especially liked that Push where Orton jobbed out to the Undertaker for like a year straight.

What about main eventing WrestleMania when he can't even work on the fly?

[Shadow]

Yea CM Punk is dead as a doornail, just like Paul Levesque was in 1996 after getting in the doghouse. He never came back from that....

The only Mchman(gods I suck at spelling) availible for him to wed to get out of the dog house isn't a year old.

[Jeritron]

Triple H was out of the doghouse and headlining PPVs as champion long before he was involved with Stephanie off-screen.

[The Naitch]

Innovator better think twice before he kisses his boyfriend in public

[Kane Knight]

Jerictron's right. Shadow's being a 'tard again.

[addy2hotty]

I'd like to reiterate that I called this first.

Anyways, where was his 'pop' at the Rumble? Matt Hardy got more of a reception than him.

Most people keep saying that he 'got pops bigger than the stars' and all that, I'm still to hear them. Survivor Series aside, I'm not sure he was ever that over. Then again, Punk himself obviously thought he was. Arrogant prick.

[Jeritron]

His Survivor Series pop is extremely exaggerated on these boards.

[ron the dial]

Not that much of a disappointment if he is getting "depushed." I didn't expect him to be used properly from the outset, regardless of his backstage attitude.

[ron the dial]

And this is assuming that he is being depushed, which is assuming that he even had that much of a push to begin with. I love Punk, but he hasn't exactly been setting the world on fire in ECW.

[addy2hotty]

In fact, thinking about it, there isn't much lower than losing to Matt Striker on ECW is there? I mean, who is lower than Striker? Miz? I can't think of many more.

Punk REALLY must have fucked people off. Orton did the same, but the difference was that he had his daddy and an established name behind him. Punk waltzes in to the WWE's Z-show, starts dating a Diva and becomes one himself. I look forward to Mr Straight Edge in a Extreme Chocolate Sauce Bowl Evening Gown match with Pat Patterson any day soon.

[Kane Knight]

In fact, thinking about it, there isn't much lower than losing to Matt Striker on ECW is there? I mean, who is lower than Striker? Miz? I can't think of many more.

Punk REALLY must have fucked people off. Orton did the same, but the difference was that he had his daddy and an established name behind him. Punk waltzes in to the WWE's Z-show, starts dating a Diva and becomes one himself. I look forward to Mr Straight Edge in a Extreme Chocolate Sauce Bowl Evening Gown match with Pat Patterson any day soon.

I think WX was going more for the "assuming he had a push in the first place" bent.

I mean, I suppose you can call beating up jobbers a push, but...

[Kane Knight]

His Survivor Series pop is extremely exaggerated on these boards.

Of course. It's PUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUNK!

I bet you someone's described it as bigger than Rock or Austin's pops.

[Destor]

I think you all finally have an argument. While I personally think this is the begginings of a loosing streak angle, you'll get no argument from me. At least now you have some sort of foundation to your claims.

[KingofOldSchool]

I remember seeing someone mention in the Survior Series thread (I think) that Punk would probably get buried after out popping DX.

I doubted that, but then as time went on things started pileing up. I made this thread because it started to look like that's what they were doing. And then shortly after you keep hearing stuff about Punk having heat on him for various reasons.

Now I don't know how much of a cocky attitude Punk has, I mean afterall you can have confidence and someone can see it as them being cocky. And in all honesty I could see someone within WWE see Punk as being some cocky prick in all reality he is just confident in his abilities. But since we have no solid proof of him being or not being a cocky asshole backstage, we can't say for sure.

Although I do love that they won't release him because they fear he'll become a huge star in TNA. I mean if he'd become a star there then don't you think he could be a star in WWE and that they'd want to market him as such?

But that would be too logical for WWE's brain(less)trust.

[Destor]

Although I do love that they won't release him because they fear he'll become a huge star in TNA. I mean if he'd become a star there then don't you think he could be a star in WWE and that they'd want to market him as such?Well it's much easier to a star in TNA than it is in the WWE...just sayin'.

[KingofOldSchool]

Well it's much easier to a star in TNA than it is in the WWE...just sayin'.

But since TNA isn't near WWE's level, why should E care if Punk becomes a star in a smaller promotion??

This isn't 1997 and TNA isn't WCW.

[lort]

Until I see him falling in love with a mop or tag teaming with Snitsky I'm going to assume he isn't getting buried. I think the fact is most people are pretty worried about WWE yet again failing to capitalize on an obviously talented wrestler like CM Punk - especially when they are in such dire straights like now.

So any bit of evidence that could support this concern is seen as certain fact - including everything which is in the dirt sheets. I just think people are maybe jumping to conclusions.

[KingofOldSchool]

Well you DO realize that you can be buried without having to be saddled with a stupid gimmick, right?

[The Naitch]

Predictions on who he'll be jobbing to next?

People backstage probably think straight edge is gay

[KingofOldSchool]

Predictions on who he'll be jobbing to next?


Marcus Cor Von

[Kane Knight]

But since TNA isn't near WWE's level, why should E care if Punk becomes a star in a smaller promotion??

This isn't 1997 and TNA isn't WCW.

Yeah, but it doesn't take much to turn a minor deal into something interesting.

Anyway, in terms of"saw it coming," Like I've said before. Did anyone REALLY think Punk was going to go somewhere in WWE? He's not homegrown, he's not a hoss, he's not a brawler. Come on, we were calling this before he ever debuted. We were calling this before the deaf dumb and blind gimmick, and we were calling this about 3 seconds after the ink was wet.

So yeah. A lot of people saw this coming. Basically, anyone with a brain.

Just saying. If WWE booked based on pops or fan reaction, it'd all be about Van Dam or someone instead of Cena.

[Kane Knight]

Predictions on who he'll be jobbing to next?

People backstage probably think straight edge is gay

The only sensible thing to come out of the locker room.

[Destor]

Not home grown? Who in the WWE is if he isn't?

[KingofOldSchool]

I seriously never thought he was going to be WWE Champ or anything, but I always thought he would be a US/IC Title fixture.

You know, the guy that could always put on a good show when given the chance but never gets the ball just because of where he came from and the fact that he's not 6'10" 315lbs.

[KingofOldSchool]

Not home grown? Who in the WWE is if he isn't?

JOHN CEEEEEEEEEEEEEENNNNAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

BATISSSSTTTAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

LASSSSHHHLLEEEEYYYY

[KingofOldSchool]

KHALLLLIII

[Destor]

And CM Punk isn't like them how?

[Destor]

Where has he been? Three months in TNA hardly counts...

[KingofOldSchool]

ROH

[Destor]

John Cena was huge in UPW, so he clearly is UPW home grown talent.

[KingofOldSchool]

In order for one to be homegrown, he can't make his name any other place except WWE.

Punk already made a name for himself in ROH and to a lesser extent in IWA-MS.

[Destor]

Because the average wrewstling fan has heard of that comapny and all.

[KingofOldSchool]

But see UPW was somewhat of a WWE partner back then.

[Destor]

Really? Huh, news to me.

[Destor]

I concede then.

[KingofOldSchool]

Because the average wrewstling fan has heard of that comapny and all.

We're not talking about fans.

WWE has always been known to prefer pushing guys that they essentially created.

They didn't create CM Punk's character.

They created guys like Cena, Batista, Triple H, etc.

[Savio]

Punk shouldn't have gotten a bigger pop then DX

[Kane Knight]

John Cena was huge in UPW, so he clearly is UPW home grown talent.

Did WWE create punks image like the babyface wigger?

[the Illusionist]

Triple H is probably conspiring against him in some way

I think it's finlay, I remember his name coming up in a Punk related post. Remember triple h putting Punk over before survivor series?

[Champion of Europa]

Everyone seems to be forgetting that making out with his girlfriend wasn't the only thing he did.

Arn Anderson did attempt to give him advice and he shrugged him off. Thinking you're better than listening to a wrestling legend seems quite arrogant to me.

[Kane Knight]

Everyone seems to be forgetting that making out with his girlfriend wasn't the only thing he did. LIES!

[Corkscrewed]

Everyone seems to be forgetting that making out with his girlfriend wasn't the only thing he did.

Arn Anderson did attempt to give him advice and he shrugged him off. Thinking you're better than listening to a wrestling legend seems quite arrogant to me.

Did he? Well, Mr. Punk, that wasn't wise...

[Fox]

And Punk jobs to Matt Striker via a roll up with the ropes. We are witnessing the Tazz-in-i-zation of Mr. Punk.

[KingofOldSchool]

Arn Anderson did attempt to give him advice and he shrugged him off. Thinking you're better than listening to a wrestling legend seems quite arrogant to me.

Well what kind of a "shrug off" was it?

Once again overreaction can come into play.

Punk could've stood there and listened to him went "Okay" and walked away. Arn could take that as "Oh he didn't appreciate what I was saying." I mean like it's been said before, no one here knows to what extent things went down. WWE could be holding Punk under a microscope so everything he does or says could be blown out of proportion.

I mean would you really be surprised if WWE did that?

[Kane Knight]

Well what kind of a "shrug off" was it?

Once again overreaction can come into play.

Punk could've stood there and listened to him went "Okay" and walked away. Arn could take that as "Oh he didn't appreciate what I was saying." I mean like it's been said before, no one here knows to what extent things went down. WWE could be holding Punk under a microscope so everything he does or says could be blown out of proportion.

I mean would you really be surprised if WWE did that?

About as surprised as I would be if Punk was found fucking a headless corpse in the ass, and his fanbase urged me to give him the "benefit of the doubt."

[Xero]

About as surprised as I would be if Punk was found fucking a headless corpse in the ass, and his fanbase urged me to give him the "benefit of the doubt."
"He was so awesome that she died from orgasm! And the head just seemed to pop off."

[Kane Knight]

"He was so awesome that she died from orgasm! And the head just seemed to pop off."

:rofl: OMG. That was awesome.

[Jeritron]

I still say relax about CM Punk. Yes its more fuel on the fire but I watched it and was suprised, but it didn't seem to bad. It was clearly a cheap victory and CM Punk will pick up a beatdown on him soon.

Didn't Jericho lose cleanly to Chyna? That didn't kill any heat. There's plenty of examples of guys with heat early in their time with WWE who have LOST AN OCCASIONAL MATCH and still been fine. If he's as popular and entertaining as you all maintain, he will be fine.

Now if hes squashed thats another thing....but it hasn't happened, yet.

[Jeritron]

Oh and btw, if Punk wants to really get over, he needs to pick up a microphone and let the world know who he is.

[Xero]

Oh and btw, if Punk <s>wants</s> is to really get over, <s>he</s> Vince needs to pick up a microphone and let the world know who he is.

[ron the dial]

"He is straight-edge, he is all about competition, he is C...M...Punk."

I think he's about as established on the mic has WWE wants him to be.

[Jeritron]

I think hes just about as over as he ever will be, this guy would be a solid IC champion, but get ready for dissapointment if you think this guys gonna break into the main event. I like him, I'm just saying.
And as for the people who've said they see him as "a mainstream star", well I don't even wanna begin with that but, no. Not happening. Whats mainstream about a straight edge guy who looks like he should be operating the tilt a whirl.

I hope CM Punk continues to get over and makes a name for himself on the midcard, but I can't see this guy getting anymore over than Xpac or Road Dogg circa 1999 (not an insult, they were phenomenal back then), unless he goes through some drastic changes or Vince takes a shine to him.

[Kane Knight]

I still say relax about CM Punk. Yes its more fuel on the fire but I watched it and was suprised, but it didn't seem to bad. It was clearly a cheap victory and CM Punk will pick up a beatdown on him soon.

Didn't Jericho lose cleanly to Chyna? That didn't kill any heat. There's plenty of examples of guys with heat early in their time with WWE who have LOST AN OCCASIONAL MATCH and still been fine. If he's as popular and entertaining as you all maintain, he will be fine.

Now if hes squashed thats another thing....but it hasn't happened, yet.

Oh, it's still too early, but at least now they have something that actually constitutes the crying. You know, a pattern. And it's still not really much, but it's more than nothing, and nothing's what they had going for them prior.

[Jeritron]

It's because they know he's not going to win the title at Wrestlemania and dominate for 2 years like they all want. So since the inevitable dissapointment is on its way, why not blame WWE for "intentionally preventing" it.

[Kane Knight]

Actually, I sometimes wonder if wrestling fans tend to bank on these guys so they'll have a reason to bitch. I mean, I don't know why anyone would actually be delusional enough to think Punk is going anywhere, pop or no pop.

And by the way...

It's because they know he's not going to unify the titles at Wrestlemania and dominate for 25 years like they all want. So since the inevitable dissapointment is on its way, why not blame WWE for "intentionally preventing" it.

;)

Though I agree with your unrealistic expectations. But seriously.

[Testicle]

I think hes just about as over as he ever will be, this guy would be a solid IC champion, but get ready for dissapointment if you think this guys gonna break into the main event. I like him, I'm just saying.
And as for the people who've said they see him as "a mainstream star", well I don't even wanna begin with that but, no. Not happening. Whats mainstream about a straight edge guy who looks like he should be operating the tilt a whirl.

I hope CM Punk continues to get over and makes a name for himself on the midcard, but I can't see this guy getting anymore over than Xpac or Road Dogg circa 1999 (not an insult, they were phenomenal back then), unless he goes through some drastic changes or Vince takes a shine to him.

Exactly, while he is very talented, he is not the kind of guy that the WWE pushes to the top. He does not have the look that they want, it is not fair but thats the way it is.

[Jeritron]

He has the potential that Xpac and Road Dogg had in late 1998, sorry if that rubs some Punk marks the wrong way. I don't mean it as an insult to punk, he's just not the type of star who will go the distance. He is over with the crowd, and may get more over (just like them) but thats about it.
Survivor Series honestly doesn't impress me. Its a chant.