First time World Cup winner?

[BCWWF]

To this point, all of the World Cups have been won by a couple countries, just off my head: Brazil (five), Italy (four), Argentina (two?), England (one), France (one), Uraguay (one), I assume Germany has been in there, a couple other countries probably.

So who do you think could be the next country to break into that group? My first guess would be Portugal, but Spain is bound to not screw up sometime.

This is just a random thread, but whatever.

[ct2k]

Uruguay won it twice I think, and Germany (and formerly West Germany) have won it three times...I think


Spain are like England, great players, great squad on paper, never produce.

But still I'd assume someone like them or Portugal, maybe even someone like Nigeria, huge country, already a lot of talented players, the sport is relatively young there, give it time and who knows?

[Bad Company]

Australia :rofl:

[BCWWF]

Nigeria seems to have a good young core of players coming up. They used to be pretty strong, I remember, but haven't done much recently.

[El Capitano Gatisto]

Portugal won't win it until they produce a really class striker. Their World Cup history is relatively short.

It's hard to predict really since even teams who get a super-talented generation of players can miss out. Like the Dutch in the 1970s, and the 1980s/1990s as a more recent example, the French in the 80s, or the Hungarians/Swedes/Czechs in decades previously. European teams tend to get waves of great players too and have the infrastructure to do well.

[SammyG]

Ghana or Greece.

[BCWWF]

If an African or North American team is going to do it, the next couple tournaments are going to offer a much better chance. Europe has the infrastructure to run a great World Cup, but no other countries can win over there. With South Africa and Brazil, it will be interesting to see if some team comes up.

[El Capitano Gatisto]

I can't see a North American or African team winning it any time soon. If anything, a different European team will eventually find a side good enough to win and get the luck that sees them through.

Thinking about it, it really should be Spain.

[Mr. Monday Morning]

Yeah I'd have to go with Spain or the Dutch, if they can ever stop fighting with each other

[BCWWF]

It seems like Czech Republic should have had a legitimate chance in 2006 but just did not come out at all.

[Ogen]

Yeah I'd have to go with Spain or the Dutch, if they can ever stop fighting with each other

Have the Dutch never won it? I'd have them so though I could have sworn they had.

[ct2k]

European Championship 1988

[BCWWF]

BRAZIL : 5
ITALY : 4
GERMANY : 3
URUGUAY : 2
ARGENTINE : 2
ENGLAND : 1 FRANCE : 1

[CSL]

Yeah I'd have to go with Spain or the Dutch, if they can ever stop fighting with each other

[El Capitano Gatisto]

It seems like Czech Republic should have had a legitimate chance in 2006 but just did not come out at all.

No, they weren't really that good. Some very good players but without a really class striker or any class defenders. They have one of the best goalkeepers in the world but at least once really top outfield player would be needed then. It was too late for Nedved, Rosicky is inconsistent. It was their first World Cup as the Czech Republic too, they were really never "legitimate" contenders.

[Ogen]

They had their chance a few years back and didn't quite make it won't come around again for a good while

[AdrianM]

Holland r the best chance, followed by Portugal.

The dark horse are Australia, Japan and South Korea.

[Ogen]

If any of those 3 win it within the next 20 years I'll eat my hat, I'll have to buy one specially for it but I will

[BCWWF]

Lol, just had a big gulp of water in my mouth and almost spit it out reading Ogen's comment. I don't even know why it was funny, probably because I was thinking the same thing. If I had to guess, AdrianM is Australian, I have no idea where you get Japan, and South Korea is still probably a ways off (especially if the World Cup isn't on their home soil).

To be honest, in the next 20 years I don't think there is a country other than Holland, Portugal or Spain that would really have a good chance.

I think a few African countries could have a chance, but at this point they are all too incomplete. Once one of those teams gets a solid distributing midfielder... Just think what Ivory Coast could have done with Essien?

[Fignuts]

lol Yeah, USA will win it before Japan or Korea.

Unless Japan produce more players like Nakamura. But thats doubtful.

[Ogen]

11 players of Nakamura's standard wouldn't even come close to being good enough though, you need world class not decent

[OssMan]

Holland I hope, my favorite team

[yianni]

Wales :rofl:

[Impeccable]

I honestly believe that the next first time winner will be the USA...but it won't be for about 40 years.

[Fignuts]

I really don't think it will take that long. They have drasticly improved in the last decade. And their last performance wasn't condusive of what they are really capable of imo.

STill I don't think they will win the next cup, or even the one after that. But within 40 years I think it will definitly happen.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

What about someone like the Ukraine or Croatia? Ukraine can't be too disappointed in getting to the quarters last time and they could build on that

[El Capitano Gatisto]

Croatia's big chance went in 1998 when they were 1-0 up against France in the semi-final, they had a brilliant side back then. Probably my favourite national team after an Irish one ever, they had several of my favourite players ever.

But it's just too small a country really to reliably produce another team of players good enough as a collective. They'll always be pretty good, but rarely ever get that good again.

The Turks should really do much better than they have, but they seem to really have a problem travelling away from Turkey.

[El Capitano Gatisto]

I really don't think it will take that long. They have drasticly improved in the last decade. And their last performance wasn't condusive of what they are really capable of imo.

STill I don't think they will win the next cup, or even the one after that. But within 40 years I think it will definitly happen.

England haven't won a World Cup in the last 40 years, not even close. Argentina haven't won in 20 years. Italy's win there was their first for 24 years.

These are teams with established systems who produce strong teams time after time, yet they can easily go decades without winning, so it's far from definite that the USA will produce a team capable of even getting close in the next 40 years given that they do not regularly produce top players, don't have a strong domestic league or many players at top European sides, and haven't really produced even a single group of impressive players at this point.

[ct2k]

I really don't think it will take that long. They have drasticly improved in the last decade. And their last performance wasn't condusive of what they are really capable of imo.




Thing is England fans have been saying the same thing for over 40 years now and nothing to show for all the potentially great teams we've had. The US were dreadful in the World Cup, truly awful, regardless of the size of the country its just not one geared anywhere near enough towards football to produce a world cup winning team IMO, maybe in 40 years that'll be different but I dunno.

[ct2k]

ECG wtf is going on with us symultaneously posting the same thing?

[BCWWF]

USA was as good as it will be in a while in 2002. Claudio Reyna was in his prime and there were a few strikers who could really put the ball in the net. Now USA is in a total makeover stage unless it can somehow build around Landon Donovan. Even so, the US has much further to go before it is competing with Italy, Brazil, Argentina, Germany etc. in a World Cup.

The hype before the World Cup was so misguided. They looked at the FIFA rankings and then made the assumption that Fignuts did, you can only get better. USA is bound to finally produce a bona fide superstar player soon, but they are on the plateau now. Even though the countries are much smaller, many countries have a much more sophisticated developmental system whereas the US is based on recognizing it in college.

USA has made great strides and can be considered a top 30 team now, but the development of soccer is still a long ways away. The next step would probably be to incorporate the latin version of the game that has been all but disregarded by most of MLS. The US needs its own identity and right now it is basically England with worse players (but a better coach, apparently)

[The Mackem]

You'd think Northern Ireland at the moment

[yianni]

I disagree with people saying a small country won't win a world cup. At the end of the day it's 11 on 11 and all it takes is a country to hit a golden period where everything falls their way (like it did for Greece in 2004 in Portugal) then anyone can win it. Look at the Koreans in 2002, they were fucking woeful but almost made it. Germany in 2002 was terrible but made the final. Plus small countries like Uruguay have won World Cups before.

[McDoogle]

I don't understand this reasoning of USA being on the verge of making a star or due to make a star. Why? Their domestic league is garbage, all their "stars" are garbage. If you tell me they'll have a quality star in 40 years sure I can believe that but it definitly takes more than one player. USA won't win shit for a long, long time.

[McDoogle]

I disagree with people saying a small country won't win a world cup. At the end of the day it's 11 on 11 and all it takes is a country to hit a golden period where everything falls their way (like it did for Greece in 2004 in Portugal) then anyone can win it. Look at the Koreans in 2002, they were fucking woeful but almost made it. Germany in 2002 was terrible but made the final. Plus small countries like Uruguay have won World Cups before.

I can see where you're going with this but the fact remains the Germany didn't win it in 2002 nor did South Korea (and if you tell me you don't think that whole tournament was garbage then you're retarded). Yes Greece did win and smaller countries have the possibility of winning but the chances of it happening are incredibly remote. 8 out of 10 times the better team always wins.

[El Capitano Gatisto]

I disagree with people saying a small country won't win a world cup. At the end of the day it's 11 on 11 and all it takes is a country to hit a golden period where everything falls their way (like it did for Greece in 2004 in Portugal) then anyone can win it. Look at the Koreans in 2002, they were fucking woeful but almost made it. Germany in 2002 was terrible but made the final. Plus small countries like Uruguay have won World Cups before.

Greece isn't that small a country, plus it has a long history of football, a strong domestic game and they had a very good coach. Also a lot of the top European sides were woefully off form. I think that if a new country is going to win it, it will come from Europe. Uruguay only won right at the very beginning when barely any teams played and they had to travel for months to get there. South Korea had the refs on their side, big time.

Germany in 2002 had a world class goalkeeper, a world class midfielder (Ballack) and a striker who can score goals regularly at that level (Klose). This is enough to go very far in international tournaments, but very few teams can boast even that. They weren't terrible, they were an average side with a couple of brilliant individuals, some other talented players and typical German tactical awareness.

Having one great player goes a long way in the world cup, especially for teams with organisation. If they can keep it tight, a match-winner can bring them a long way.

[BCWWF]

I don't understand this reasoning of USA being on the verge of making a star or due to make a star. Why? Their domestic league is garbage, all their "stars" are garbage. If you tell me they'll have a quality star in 40 years sure I can believe that but it definitly takes more than one player. USA won't win shit for a long, long time.

It's pretty simple really. The US has 300 million people and as many soccer players as England has population. Now that the US has a somewhat sophisticated national system, the young players can at least be spotted early. Most of the top players for USA did not have any specialized training like the top players in Europe. Finally, the US has facilities to develop the most world class athletes. Not saying the athletes on England aren't in shape, but there is a reason why you are no good at track and field.

My claim before wasn't implying that the next Zinedane Zidane is going to come from the U.S. I was simply saying that eventually, the U.S. will have a true standout player in a European league. Right now McBride, Onyewu or Tim Howard are probably the top guys, but they are merely good players on average teams. I am talking more about getting an American to be an everyday player at Manchester United.

I don't think the United States is going to win a World Cup in the next 40 years either. I just think it's silly to assume they can't produce players who can play at the top level in 2007, and even moreso that one of them will not eventually be a star.

[Supreme Olajuwon]

But the problem with the US system is they're developing players who are much older than other players from other countries. In all fairness the high school system is really what's holding the US back. The American development of athletes primes athletes to be ready to compete at a world class level when they are in their early to mid 20s. That works for American football and baseball but not for soccer.

[BCWWF]

I agree with that, but players are starting to get recognized well before high school now and moved to the camps in Florida and stuff. Not to the extent that it is in Europe, but most of the top 17-year-olds aren't playing high school soccer anymore.

[El Capitano Gatisto]

Holland only has a population of only around 16 million, yet consistently produces great footballers. Numbers of people is one thing, another is having a culture of training players. Brazil has both a defined style of play and coaching and the numbers. The English have been getting it wrong for years and are continuing to get it wrong.

For the USA to do better, they need to focus on the skills that translate to making good international footballers. Athleticism and will to win is no problem for the States, but intelligent, technically grounded footballers may continue to be.

[yianni]

Holland only has a population of only around 16 million, yet consistently produces great footballers. Numbers of people is one thing, another is having a culture of training players. Brazil has both a defined style of play and coaching and the numbers. The English have been getting it wrong for years and are continuing to get it wrong.

Couldn't agree more with this.

[Downunder]

Australia will win it in 2022

YOU HEARD IT HERE FIRST FOLKS!

[BCWWF]

Australia has the same issues as the US though. A good soccer population, but to this point just a handful of players are making modest impacts in Europe. A good team for years to come, but a World Cup is a ways away.