Favorite Overall Promotion EVER

[KayfabeMan]

What is your favorite overall promotion?

Simple as that.

Please vote, and preferably, then explain why.

[SammyG]

I have to go with WCW. The nWo storyline was the hottest angle ever. It had me wanting to tune in every monday night, I remember I was looking forward to Nitro more than anything in the world. Sting coming down from the rafters, the whole "WE GOTTA GO, WE GOTTA GO" at the end of Nitro. Fucking amazing shit.

[KayfabeMan]

I too voted for WCW.

WCW was indeed the developing point for nearly all of the hottest stars of the 1990's and today. Steve Austin, Mankind, Booker T, Chris Jericho, Eddie Guerrero, etc. - Not to mention WCW's ability to do what WWE could not & would not do, blend international styles on their broadcasts and roster.

WCW always kept me entertained, from the time of the Diamond Studd and DDP and The Freebirds, etc. to Johnny B Badd, Arn Anderson, Steven Regal, etc. to Hogan, Sting, Savage, etc. to the very final days of the company & many great prospects.

Not saying that WWF wasn't just as good, WCW was just FAR better in many aspects - like cruiserweights, international styles and definitely my favorite - tag team wrestling. WCW was also overall more wrestling based than WWE.

[SammyG]

WCW had amazing tag team wrestling. Steiner Brothers, Harlem Heat, the Outsiders... great matches. High Voltage... VICIOUS N DELICIOUS. Luger and Sting too. Stables/ Tag teams kicked ass in WCW.

[Bad Company]

WCW, I never saw ECW, and WWF was shit.
WCW had amazing workers who were given a chance to shine, especially in the ring. Despite the opinion of Hogan etc holding them down, which was probably right in most senses, but with the main eventers they had I could see why. Guys like DDP, Rey, Jericho, were amazing, and shit, I could even stomach Luger in WCW. Loved it, watched it every week, and was gutted when it was sold to the WWE. Especially considering vince blew it.

Also, everyone seemed credible in WCW, guys like Alex wright, Disco Inferno, may of seemed like jobbers, but you believed the matches could go either way.

[Russenmafia]

I liked the original ECW. The stuff on that show was mindblowing. The show had a combination of violent brawls and excellent wrestling. What got me hooked on ECW was the matches The Eliminators and RVD/Sabu used to have. And the first sick bump I seen in ECW was when Brian Lee choke slammed Dreamer through a stack of tables.

[Jeritron]

Kayfabeman, I wouldn't say WCW was the developing point for Eddie Guerrero Jericho Benoit Austin and Foley.
The first 3 wrestled in ECW first, and the last two, although they wrestled in WCW were treated like complete shit, hated it, left and in ECW were allowed to show themselves and get signed with WWF, who made them into household names.

I guess its all opinion, but I hate WCW. I rank it behind WWF by a mile, and though it had its high points and better "quality" than ECW, I'd prob put it right behind ECW.
It's certainly better than TNA though, by a mile. And I'm not gonna lie and say I'm extremely familiar with Indy feds. I've seen a handful of ROH and Japan matches.

[Jeritron]

Oh and pre WCW NWA was the goods too, but still doesnt touch WWF to me. I know it's cool to hate McMahon and WWE now, but come on.

[The Ravishing One]

I too would choose WWF/E.

I know the promotion sucks as of late. But they have done some good in the past. I think people wouldn't be answering WCW to this question if they won the Monday Night Wars and WWE wasn't around.

[Loose Cannon]

Benoit, Jericho, Guerrero, Malenko, Saturn, Foley....all these guys were put into the spotlight with WCW. I had no clue who the first five were until they arrived on WCW programming, as did most wrestling fans. ECW and Japan may of gave them thier first opportunities, but let's be real here, WCW Made them. With Foley, I recognized him first as Cactus Jack in WCW. And he was given a decent push, so it's not like he was a jobber.

Yes, I agree WWF did make Austin into a Major Star, but he was one of the prime time players in WCW. He won the TV, Tag, and US Title in a span of like 3 years. I wouldn't really call that being treated like shit.

Gonna say WWF is/was/ever will be my favorite.

[Jeritron]

WWF made them

[Jeritron]

except for saturn and malenko

[Doc Brown]

WWF made them

I always thought Jericho was FAR more entertaining in WCW.

As far as WWF/E Making those guys? I find it hard to agree as well, Benoit was always steady Mid-Card from the minute he walked into WCW, from his Fueds with Sullivan over Woman. Fueds with the NWO. He was always up there.

Eddie, also got it well, (Mind you, the idea itself was a bit silly) As leader of the LwO.

Etc. Etc.

Keeping in mind, this is only an opinion :).

[Jeritron]

tbh, nobody made Jericho. He did his thing everywhere he went and he got over on his own merit. I may be wrong, but in my opinion nobody ever really made or put over Jericho. I can think of more wrestlers who hindered his career than made it.
I've always respected the fact that he wasn't given much in WCW, but he allowed himself to get over pretty big. WWE didn't give him the world either, they just gave him the freedom to do his thing, and he was over pretty well. They made him champion, but they really never gave him much other than a working microphone and tv time.


note: with that being said I feel the WWE was great in how they handled it. They let him be a star. In WCW he was a star on a smaller level, despite them not wanting to allow him to be. He was never their champ or even their US champ. He was a cruiserweight who was getting over and they didn't have any interest in despite that.
In WWE, they wanted to allow him to become a star. So they did. So although at times he was equally as entertaining in WCW, those moments were few. In WWE they gave him the stage and the oppurtunity to apply his craft, and did it with all the intentions of him being all that he could be. He didn't have to perform knowing he wasn't going anywhere.
Yes, the WWE didn't make Jericho what I think he could have been. But he had one of the greatest careers of anyone in WWE regardless. He became a solid draw, wrestled in meaningful fueds and matches, was given great segments and creative freedom, and main evented. Held all the major titles, and was treated as a major star. He was in many ways, the Roddy Piper of our generation. A legend nonetheless.

I think Chris Irvine would share similar sentiments as mine about WWF when compared to WCW, by any stretch of the imagination. And just about every wrestler ever who worked for both companies with the exception of maybe Hulk Hogan and the money grubbing strip miners on top from day one.

[Doc Brown]

tbh, nobody made Jericho. He did his thing everywhere he went and he got over on his own merit. I may be wrong, but in my opinion nobody ever really made or put over Jericho. I can think of more wrestlers who hindered his career than made it.
I've always respected the fact that he wasn't given much in WCW, but he allowed himself to get over pretty big. WWE didn't give him the world either, they just gave him the freedom to do his thing, and he was over pretty well. They made him champion, but they really never gave him much other than a working microphone and tv time.


Very well put, and i will have to agree. Regardless, Jericho = Ratings.

[The One]

NWA isn't a promotion. The NWA was, and continues to be today and collection of various different promotions around the country and world. Having said that, Jim Crockett Promotions/Mid-Alantic (a NWA territory) will always be the best promotion in my mind. Nothing can beat the work they were pumping out through the mid to late 80s. The Horsemen, Ricky Steamboat, Harley Race, Roddy Piper, Terry Funk, Barry Windham, Dusty Rhodes, Ronnie Garvin, Magnum TA, Road Warriors, Les Lugar, Nikita Koloff, Kerry Von Erich, Sting, Wahoo McDaniel, Ted DiBiase, Larry Zbyszko, Paul Orndorff, The Steiners, Rock'n'Roll Express, Fabulous Freebirds, Brian Pillman...I mean literally, that promotion through the 80s was the who's who of professional wrestling. While WWE was banking on Hogan's pythons, Jim Crockett/Mid-Atlantic was doing some of the best wrestling in history. Nothing in the world of professional wrestling will ever be able to touch, hell not even compare to JCP. Nothing.

[Jeritron]

banking on Hogan's pythons is something I highly doubt WWE or any wrestling promotion would be ashamed to have done.

[The One]

Hogan is a hack. He's a charismatic, black hole of talent. My point is, while he was running around flexxing for 10 minutes and actually wrestling for none, Ric Flair was leading the charge of JCP with some of the greatest wrestlers ever under him. Did WWE make a boat load of money? Yeah they did, but as far as personal taste, I simply can't see how any logical wrestling fan with half a brain can look back at all promotions that there have ever been and not say that JCP during the 80s was the best. And let's not forget, there were times when JCP was out drawing WWE. It's just that their goal was never world wide dominance. It was a territory, WWE was atempting to become a global company. WWE was successful, and eventually JCP/Mid Atlantic and Georgia was bought up by Turner to make WCW. WCW then had to play catch up, but during the actualy mid 80s and into the later part of the decade, JCP was the bigger promotion.

I suspect you wern't even a wrestling fan back then, nor have you seen much from the time outside of maybe a few lair matches here and there or a couple of Dusty Rhodes' from his DVD. Trust me, you simply can not compare the climate and aura of JCP from the 80s to any other time in wrestling. It was simply incredible.

[Jeritron]

Yea he sucks, I'm not defending crazy Hogan and how much he sucks, I'm just defending the WWE and what they did with him. It was needless to say the right decision. I'm defending their business moves and success as a promotion, not the quality of matches and how enjoyable it was to a smark.

[The One]

Oh I'll admit, they made a boat load of money. I'm happy to say that Hogan has never in any way received a single dollar of my money. I didn't watch WWE during his Hulkamania period, never bought anything associated with Hogan (not even the nWo shirt which I am now kind of sad about), and even stopped watching WWE when they gave him his incredibly offensive and pathedic last reign. I hope Hogan dies today.

[Jeritron]

I've never liked Hogan or spent a dime on him either.

[Jeritron]

I'm just a WWF guy. Thats where my allegiance has always lied, and I'm sure you can understand that. Never watched in Hogan's WWF time, always preferred it over WCW, and though I know how badly Hogan sucks and sucked, I still "respect" what was done in the late 80s. It was key. I probably never would have been a wrestling fan if it weren't from the things that came out of that era. So for that I have respect. Not for Hogan, since he was lucky enough to be plugged into the machine, but Vince is who I give that credit.

[KayfabeMan]

NWA isn't a promotion. The NWA was, and continues to be today and collection of various different promotions around the country and world.

I knew this much.

Just figured I'd list all the divisions of NWA collectively, as someone would've possibly said "I grew up on Championship Wrestling from Florida", etc. So any of them, as you said, would fall into that category.

[KayfabeMan]

I too would choose WWF/E.

I know the promotion sucks as of late. But they have done some good in the past. I think people wouldn't be answering WCW to this question if they won the Monday Night Wars and WWE wasn't around.

That's true.

It's hard to tell the direction any promotion, or wrestler for that matter, would have taken had it continued or a performer not died. Would people praise WCW if it were still around? Depends on what happened. WWF/E was many people's favorite promotion for a long time, and now they bash them; change in direction, etc. lead to that.

Just like performers, let's say Owen Hart, or someone, remained alive, would people be as favorable of him as they are now that he's dead? It's hard to say. His in-ring skills or ability may have decreased, or people may have tired of him, and people would knock him ala Ric Flair or anyone else.

[Jeritron]

The truth is probably no. Everyday a wrestler dies, and its always someone people mourn the loss of, but didn't give two shits about whether they lived or died the day before. In some cases, like Mike Awesome, its the type of guy that fans in the past have probably wished death upon because he "betrayed them". But many of them probably feel the need to type R.I.P and put a sad face for their "loss".

[Loose Cannon]

tbh, nobody made Jericho. He did his thing everywhere he went and he got over on his own merit. I may be wrong, but in my opinion nobody ever really made or put over Jericho. I can think of more wrestlers who hindered his career than made it.
I've always respected the fact that he wasn't given much in WCW, but he allowed himself to get over pretty big. WWE didn't give him the world either, they just gave him the freedom to do his thing, and he was over pretty well. They made him champion, but they really never gave him much other than a working microphone and tv time.

Are you kidding me? The guy was put on WCW TV humuliating crusier after cruiser week in and week out. He was given a lot of TV and segment time on Nitro and had the greatest crusierweight title run of all-time. Everyone knew who Chris Jericho was the minute he walked through the curtain on Raw because of WCW. WCW would have never allowed Monday Night Jericho to go through if they had no plans on making him a star. Yes, WCW did screw him over after his crusier run. He should have been US Champ at least. But they got his name out there and if not for WCW putting him over for like 2 years, he wouldn't have had a great name recognition. WCW put Jericho on the map in the US and WWF took him and made him bigger.

[Jeritron]

WCW did nothing for him. He did it for himself. Granted WCW gave him a place to apply his craft for a time, but he got over on his own in a short time. He was given now upward room for growth. He was buried for a year before coming to WWE as well. Just because he was on programming for 5 minutes in the first hour of 3 and getting himself over at a time where WCW was on top of the ratings, doesn't mean the WCW was helping him out.

[The One]

This may sound cold and hard, yet never during any point of Owen's life was he that big of a player, and truly, he was never going to be a World Champion/ Since his death, he's praised as the greatest to never get that honor and many people's favorite. Nothing boosts popularity quite like an unexpected death...

[Jeritron]

its true

[KayfabeMan]

Kayfabeman, I wouldn't say WCW was the developing point for Eddie Guerrero Jericho Benoit Austin and Foley.
The first 3 wrestled in ECW first, and the last two, although they wrestled in WCW were treated like complete shit, hated it, left and in ECW were allowed to show themselves and get signed with WWF, who made them into household names.

I'm not claiming they gave them their start, although for many guys they did, just saying what LC basically said - that's where they hit the big time and in total, got a stage upon which to showcase their craft. Had WCW not been in existence, it's hard to say whether or not they'd have ever been in WWF/E - or for some - even in ECW for that matter.

A lot of guys wrestled in WWF/E first too and then jumped to WCW, and had greater success there than in WWF. Randy Savage is an example of this. The prime of his career was arguably in WCW, where overall, he made the most of his stay and the bigger impact.

[The One]

WCW did nothing for him. He did it for himself.

LMAO! Jericho wasn't handed a silver platter, but come on now, you can not for one second seriously believe that his run in WCW had nothing to do with how over he was. Seriously, that's just asinine.

[KayfabeMan]

This may sound cold and hard, yet never during any point of Owen's life was he that big of a player, and truly, he was never going to be a World Champion/ Since his death, he's praised as the greatest to never get that honor and many people's favorite. Nothing boosts popularity quite like an unexpected death...

Not specifically singling out Owen Hart, just saying that when they did it's hard to tell what would've happened in many situations and it often seems altering to people's opinions of them, as you said - just like they would with promotions :y:

[The One]

I'm not claiming they gave them their start, although for many guys they did, just saying what LC basically said - that's where they hit the big time and in total, got a stage upon which to showcase their craft. Had WCW not been in existence, it's hard to say whether or not they'd have ever been in WWF/E - or for some - even in ECW for that matter.

A lot of guys wrestled in WWF/E first too and then jumped to WCW, and had greater success there than in WWF. Randy Savage is an example of this. The prime of his career was arguably in WCW, where overall, he made the most of his stay and the bigger impact.

I would disgaree whole heartedly. Randy Savage's career highlight was WWE. A WWE Champion, main eventing WrestleManias, having THE definative wrestling love story of all time...come on. In WCW he was a reck, then kind of was in nWo for no reason whatsoever, then dropped off...

[Jeritron]

no I do, but I dont' credit them. They held down all of their young talent. He got over their, thanks to their TV time. But come on, he was a cruiserweight they gave a stick. I don't credit WCW at all for his success. They naturally played a part because that was the show he was on. But they did nothign to help him

[Jeritron]

I would disgaree whole heartedly. Randy Savage's career highlight was WWE. A WWE Champion, main eventing WrestleManias, having THE definative wrestling love story of all time...come on. In WCW he was a reck, then kind of was in nWo for no reason whatsoever, then dropped off...


Randy Savage's career highpoint was CLEARLY in WWF. I didn't even think it was possible to argue that.

[Jeritron]

I want to know who went to WCW that had greater sucess. Come on, Savage went their past his prime and got another run. Everyone they got was getting a new lease on life when they should have been putting guys over and shopping for retirement homes.
With the exception of Nash and Hall, they signed few wrestlers in their primes. Nash and Hall had great sucess in WCW, maybe even greater success, but they had great success in WWE before that too.

So who comes up as being someone who went the other direction and was pushed? Jeff Jarret? I really can't think of many so maybe someone can help me out.
But Savage, Luger, Hogan, Warrior, Bret were all examples of guys who came over to WCW and were pushed due to past success in WWE and were quite simply, past their prime.

[The One]

no I do, but I dont' credit them. They held down all of their young talent. He got over their, thanks to their TV time. But come on, he was a cruiserweight they gave a stick. I don't credit WCW at all for his success. They naturally played a part because that was the show he was on. But they did nothign to help him

They pushed him as a four time Cruiserweight Champion, not to mention a Television Champion as well. They gave him an incredible character of finding loop holes to avoid losing the belt, they gave him a fued with Dean Malenko (who was HOT at that time), they even allowed him to tease a Goldberg fued. How can you say they gave him nothing?

[Jeritron]

Maybe I was a little rash to say "nothing". I just feel they didn't give him much, they hindered him more than they helped him. He flourished and got over on their program but I dont' credit them with helping that, at least not as much as they were hurting it. Yes, they gave him a job and tv time so thats worth something. I just can't even compare his use in WCW to how he was used in WWF, and the same goes for Benoit Eddie Rey and ESPECIALLY Foley and Austin. Even the Big Show and Booker T.

But 4 time Cruiserweight and Television champion, yes thats something. But if he was 4 time lightheavyweight champion and european champion, and then went over there to WCW and was World Champion, US champion and tag champion and headlining PPVs, would you use a double standard against WWE because they're "so evil" now?
I'm not saying you would, but a lot of people would.

[The One]

I want to know who went to WCW that had greater sucess. Come on, Savage went their past his prime and got another run. Everyone they got was getting a new lease on life when they should have been putting guys over and shopping for retirement homes.
With the exception of Nash and Hall, they signed few wrestlers in their primes. Nash and Hall had great sucess in WCW, maybe even greater success, but they had great success in WWE before that too.

So who comes up as being someone who went the other direction and was pushed? Jeff Jarret? I really can't think of many so maybe someone can help me out.
But Savage, Luger, Hogan, Warrior, Bret were all examples of guys who came over to WCW and were pushed due to past success in WWE and were quite simply, past their prime.

You're talking out of two sides of your mouth. Your saying that if they got more over in WCW then is was only because they were given WWE time, and yet when someone says Jericho got over on WWE because of his WCW time you claim he did it all himself.

Besides, Luger was pushed in WWE due only to his former success during his first run with WCW.

One could argue that Benoit by the time he made it to WWE, was past his prime. As far as matches go, I would argue that Jericho was as well. Mysterio, Goldberg, Booker...all guys who did enjoy success in WWE based of of their best work in WCW. It's just reversed for guys like Hogan and Savage who went from WWE in their prime to WCW to collect big pay checks.

[The One]

Maybe I was a little rash to say "nothing". I just feel they didn't give him much, they hindered him more than they helped him. He flourished and got over on their program but I dont' credit them with helping that, at least not as much as they were hurting it. Yes, they gave him a job and tv time so thats worth something. I just can't even compare his use in WCW to how he was used in WWF, and the same goes for Benoit Eddie Rey and ESPECIALLY Foley and Austin. Even the Big Show and Booker T.

But 4 time Cruiserweight and Television champion, yes thats something. But if he was 4 time lightheavyweight champion and european champion, and then went over there to WCW and was World Champion, US champion and tag champion and headlining PPVs, would you use a double standard against WWE because they're "so evil" now?
I'm not saying you would, but a lot of people would.

Slight difference in Cruserweight Title and Lightheavyweight Title. The Cruiser belt was a belt that was highly honored in WCW. The LHW title was used to keep Taka and then Gillberg's pants up. And I will say that WWE got over a TON of people that jumped ship to WCW. Equally so, WCW got a TON of people (Jericho included) over who jumped then to WWE. Some had more success in their original company, others once they jumped, but that never changes the fact that if it wern't or the first promotion pushing them to any degree, the mark they made on their second promotion would have most likely been severly less impactful. A new fresh face is NEVER as exciting as the new hot pick who just jumped from the other team...

[Jeritron]

those guys weren't past their prime, maybe in ring but not as stars. In ring means little in this business and I think you know that.

Seriously tho, I realize what I'm saying to various arguments is getting tangled, and I'll admit, I'm having trouble making my point here so I'll make it really simple.

I hate WCW. I loved WWF. WCW didn't make new stars and failed to push their roster. They relied off of talent that was established and gave them fresh runs, that were inferior to their original. Foley and Austin, and Jericho and company were NOT made be WCW. They flourished in WWF.

I also feel fans, due to current day disenchantment, credit WCW and fault WWF/E for the past, when its not deserved in either department.

[The One]

Well than if we are talking on a strictly financial stand point, WWE ailed to use Hulk Hogan correctly. It's not a secert that WCW made more money with Hogan than WWE has ever done. And on the other side of the coin, Hogan made more money during his WCW run then he has the rest of his career combined.

Tron, you obviously have a huge chip on your shoulder about WCW. And hell, they wern't great at getting new young guys over...to a World Title worthy position. But if it wern't for WCW bringing in guys like Jericho, Benoit, Guerrero, Mysterio, Malenko, and others...we'd never have gotten that kind of entertainment. Because look at who WWE was hiring at the time. Big, muscle men. Outside of HBK and the Harts, it was all guys who were huge. And let's not go overboard with WWE used Austin wonderfully. He floundered for YEARS in WWE. They knew he had talent, they had no clue how to use it though. Then they tried to make him a bad guy, it turned out they accidently made him the biggest babyface of all time, and boom. Suddenly WWE is a bunch of geniuses for knowing how to use Austin.

And let's not forget now, WCW gave Austin Tag Title runs, and a run with the US Gold. WWE gave him...the Million Dollar Belt for the first few years... not exactly flourishing him there.

Quit trying to make WCW as this place were people went to die and WWE this place were the young and restless were always rewarded. It's jaded and so full of bias it makes almost anything you say sound tainted.

[KayfabeMan]

You're talking out of two sides of your mouth. Your saying that if they got more over in WCW then is was only because they were given WWE time, and yet when someone says Jericho got over on WWE because of his WCW time you claim he did it all himself.

Besides, Luger was pushed in WWE due only to his former success during his first run with WCW.

One could argue that Benoit by the time he made it to WWE, was past his prime. As far as matches go, I would argue that Jericho was as well. Mysterio, Goldberg, Booker...all guys who did enjoy success in WWE based of of their best work in WCW. It's just reversed for guys like Hogan and Savage who went from WWE in their prime to WCW to collect big pay checks.

This was more my point, just stated a lot better.

A lot of guys, like you mentioned Luger, only were pushed in WWE because of success or potential for it in WCW. Luger, Scott Hall, Nash, Marc Mero, The Steiner Brothers, Ric Flair, etc. were cases of that as well.

Arguably, most wrestlers that was past their prime and went to WCW for the checks [which is a whole 'nother story, because that's why everyone's here] were still money makers. Hogan, Hall & Nash, Savage, Hart, etc. prove that.

[KayfabeMan]

Also, I'm not saying what I'm saying about WWF/WWE based on today's product. IMO, WWF and WWE should be rated seperately really. They're almost two completely different things, yet so much alike at the same time.

I grew up on all the promotions evenly. I used numerous tv's to tape shows that were on at the same time so I could see everything. I had relatives that stayed up early mornings to tape shows that aired then, and have thousands of tapes. All of the promotions entertained me, without a doubt. WWF, WCW, ECW and other programming as well. Just to me, not forcing it on anyone else, WCW was the organization who did it best.

[Jeritron]

Hogan was a huge money maker for them, but he had clearly been ridding the succes fromt he federation. Same with Savage on a smaller level.

Nash and Hall I love, so its hard for me to say here. I personally feel they did as well, probably better in WCW. However they were huge stars in WWE before. They were used in the same capacity. Nash was a main eventer. Hall was a huge star, but uppermidcard in WWE. He never advance from that in WCW. nWo and how successful that was is what made their run technically more successful.

As for Hart, he was one of the biggest misuses and wasted investments in wrestling history when he came over to WCW. He clearly was never used even close to what he should have been, and had been in the federation. Thats not Brets fault tho. Its Bischoffs, and Vince's for how he was sent there.

But seriously, I don't deny WCWs good sides. I don't deny the many great talents they had, and many great things they did. I also don't deny that they had talent there that would go on to greatness. But I just feel they had major failings as a promotion. Especially when it came to utilizing and pushing talent.

I just think WWF > WCW, by leaps and bounds. At least in the long run, and overall in terms of quality. I suppose its my opinion, and maybe I do have a chip on my shoulder about WCW, but even though its an opinion regarding what promotion was "better", I see it as hard to argue some of these differences.

Just my 2 cents.

[KayfabeMan]

:y:

[NeanderCarl]

For history, prestige, sentimentality, character development, business acumen, impact on the industry, development of the wrestling business, opportunities given, superstars created, standing in the wrestling business, success, fan loyalty.... I'm going to have to go with the USWA.

[NeanderCarl]

Of course not! WWE. In it's prime, nothing could touch it.

Even now, well past it's prime, you'd be hard pressed to find a promotion today with the overall total package WWE boasts in nearly every aspect of the wrestling business.

[Jeritron]

NeanderCarl uses his noggin. Thats why even though I lock horns with him at times, I respect and like him.

[The One]

Of course not! WWE. In it's prime, nothing could touch it.

Even now, well past it's prime, you'd be hard pressed to find a promotion today with the overall total package WWE boasts in nearly every aspect of the wrestling business.

As far as historical impact on the world of wrestling, yeah nothing can touch WWE. But the thread wasn't asking about which was the biggest of made the move waves, it was asking about personal favorite.

[Fignuts]

Pre-Noah split All Japan Pro Wrestling.

Even though I enjoy the story aspect of wrestling, I enjoy the actual wrestling so much more, that they could cut out storylines all together, and I wouldn't really mind. So naturally I prefer the Japanese product more as it is.

Classic All Japan is imo the greatest period of wrestling ever. Every match on the higher part of the card had such an epic feel to it, be it singles, tag, or 6man contests. I have yet to see any six man tag contests even come close to the quality of the ones in All Japan. The singles matches ere absolute wars. The "Super Generation" of Misiwa, Kobashi, Kawada, and Taue, were way ahead of their time. Doing stuff we didn't see in America til the very late 90's.

Even the old school stuff from the 70's and 60's as amazing. Harley Race, the Funks, Jack Brisco, And the Destroyer had some classic match ups in All Japan. Also, if you are a fan of old school wrestling, do your self a favor and watch some Destroyer matches. The guy is amazing.

Some people don't understand the japanese style of wrestling, which is fine. It's not for everyone. But if you are a fan, I don't see how you could possibly argue that All Japan wasn't at one point the pinnacle of wrestling in Japan

[Arashi Kage]

WWF 80's-early 90's is my favorite promotion ever, late era WWF and WWE are a different promotion. Nothing beats childhood nostalgia.

[Destor]

Yea he sucks, I'm not defending crazy Hogan and how much he sucks, I'm just defending the WWE and what they did with him. It was needless to say the right decision. I'm defending their business moves and success as a promotion, not the quality of matches and how enjoyable it was to a smark.Please refraine from using that word. Smarks ARE marks. A bunch of marks got together andecided that they didn't like being called marks so they made up this faggot ass word. You cant pick what people call, you're either a mark or a smart. And if you aint in the biz, you're a mark.

Go ahead and try to dispute that. You'll be wrong.

[KayfabeMan]

And if you are in the biz, you're a mark too.

If you're not, then you're not really here for the biz.

Everyone who got into wrestling because of the interest in it, not the dollar signs, is most definitely a mark for someone. This continues throughout your entire career. If it stops, then you're not having fun anymore.

For the others, they're mainly marks for themselves - so they'd still count.

[The One]

There is a world of differance to the man who works in an industry, and even the biggest fan of that industry. While people in the business were 99 times out of 100 originally a mark, it's a completely different world than if you are just a fan. Smarks are simply marks who all came together, decided "they didn't just like the good guys and hate the bad guys because..." whatever reason, and the moment you cross that line people feel they deserve a special title to their enjoyment of a product.

Trekies don't have levels of importance. Marks don't have levels of importance. It's the way superfandom works. It's a lot more than your average joe, but at the end of the day you're still just a fan...

[KayfabeMan]

Yep :y:

[srnrew]

First of all on Savage:

Greatest WWF/E moments for me were
1. His match against "The Dragon" at WM3
2. His winning 4 straight matches at WM4 to win the WWF title.
3. His feuds with Hogan, Flair, & Jake Roberts.

Greatest WCW moments:
1. Had to be his feud with DDP.

[srnrew]

Like i say, the name "Stone Cold" may have been born in WWE, but the attitude of "Stone Cold" was born in ECW. Jericho, on the other hand, may have been more successful in WWE because he became WWE champ, but no offense to all the WWE Jericho fans, WCW Jericho was a hell lot more entertaining. Same thing with Rey Mysterio, winning the World title "which by the way is a fucking joke considering its the ole' WCW belt" but his matches against Malenko, Jericho, Guerrero, etc. in WCW were 10x better. Benoit, hmmmm sorry but no WWE Benoit feud even, and i mean even remotely comes close to his feud with "The Taskmaster" in WCW.

[Jeritron]

okay then, take smark out of my paragraph. Does it change what I was saying? This side argument really has no bearing on the argument. It's just a word that I used because it happens to be in my vocabulary I never thought into it. I don't claim to be an industry insider or a superior fan. I just used it to refer to the IWC, since I was talking about their liking for the quality of matches and factors thats not really a the main concern of most casual fans or the industry catering to them.

[Jeritron]

Like i say, the name "Stone Cold" may have been born in WWE, but the attitude of "Stone Cold" was born in ECW. Jericho, on the other hand, may have been more successful in WWE because he became WWE champ, but no offense to all the WWE Jericho fans, WCW Jericho was a hell lot more entertaining. Same thing with Rey Mysterio, winning the World title "which by the way is a fucking joke considering its the ole' WCW belt" but his matches against Malenko, Jericho, Guerrero, etc. in WCW were 10x better. Benoit, hmmmm sorry but no WWE Benoit feud even, and i mean even remotely comes close to his feud with "The Taskmaster" in WCW.

dude, I've watched Jericho all along. He's been just as entertaining all along. I have a hard time stomaching WCW marks who come in here and try to talk about it like it was a real fucking promotion and not just Ted Turners bully stepchild who shit his pants and got sent home crying.

[Jeritron]

I also have no problem giving ECW credit for the talent they discovered and allowed to advance their craft. You're right about Stone Cold. But thats something he did, difference was that ECW and WWE were the two companies that allowed him to do it and had a push and tv time to go along with it.

[The One]

dude, I've watched Jericho all along. He's been just as entertaining all along. I have a hard time stomaching WCW marks who come in here and try to talk about it like it was a real fucking promotion and not just Ted Turners bully stepchild who shit his pants and got sent home crying.

I have a hard time stomaching anti-WCW marks who don't know what they're talking about. WCW was a real promotion. For years WCW was THE dominate promotion. Did WCW spend a lot of money to secure countless talent to prevent them from going anywhere? Yeah, but let's be real, it also was earning 300 million dollars a year. It had one of the hottest angles of all time. It brought quick/light wrestling to the mass American audiance. WCW was the first promotion that brought wrestling to the main stream for anyone over the age of 10. Tell me one other promotion in history who was so massively popular that people would throw parties themed around one of their stables.

WCW was a real promotion. Jericho was equally good, if not slightly better, in WCW. The first of those was a fact, the second was opinion.

[Rammsteinmad]

WCW.

Both have/had the strong/weak points, but I always like WCW, and I love going through my WCW tapes and remembering it all.

[Savio]

WSX