HD-DVD or Blu Ray

[D Mac]

Yeah I'm bidding on an HD DVD and Blu Ray combo player on ebay so hopefully I won't have to worry about this, but which Hi Def system will win out in the long run?

Warner announced they will be only supporting Blu Ray and many of the so called "experts" are saying Blu Ray will win out but I don't know.

[LoDownM]

Blu Ray. HDDVD has like 3 companies supporting just HDDVD compared to the list of them supporting Blu Ray.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Blu Ray will win, which is good. Not only for the PS3, which I don't think you care about, but because if it wins, Bluray burners and blank media will become cheaper down the road quicker, and since Bluray is far better for storage, it's all good.

[ron the dial]

Blu Ray

[Lock Jaw]

Whichever one the porn industry backs.

[Bad Company]

WWKD sums up my thoughts nicely. Although I may get an HD-DVD Player for my 360, we just had a price drop to $120, which is tempting.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Originally I think people were betting on HD-DVD, but I think the vote has now swung to Blu-Ray. I'm not too sure, as I'm not an expert, but I'd like to see what everyone says.

Blu-Ray seems to have the current vote.

[HeartBreakMan2k]

Blu-Ray by far. Sony was smart. Neither HD or Blu Ray are really selling the stand alone systems very well but Sony is winning the war because people who have PS3's are buying Blu-Ray movie just because they can. With them having such a much better install base off the PS3 alone, HD will continue to fade. Add that into places like Blockbuster only supporting Blu-Ray and Target offering it over HD at a 75:25 ratio.

[Boondock Saint]

Nothing for me for quite some time. But Blu-Ray looks to be the winner.

[D Mac]

I'm in the lead on that combo player with $305 bucks. It would be sweet if that was the winning price, doubt it tho, still 2 days left.

[ct2k]

There'll be pc hardware to play both so right now I don't really care, not gonna be buying a player on its own for some time.

[DS]

If you are already up to $305 just let someone overbid and buy a PS3 with some extra money. Blu-ray is all you are going to need because HD-DVD is dying pretty quickly now that Warner jumped and the PS3 will at least allow you to have firmware updates down the road for better performance. You're not going to get that with your combo player.

[Kane Knight]

This is kind of like asking which would win: VHS or Beta after stores stopped carrying Beta.

[ct2k]

Out of curiosity for the future, are the stand alone players for each format generally backwards compatible with CD's and DVD?

Cos I mean if not fuck both of them

[DS]

Yes

[Kane Knight]

Out of curiosity for the future, are the stand alone players for each format generally backwards compatible with CD's and DVD?

Cos I mean if not fuck both of them

Yeah, they are. I have a cheap HD-DVD player which I use primarily as an upconverting DVD player and a CD player. There's no way they'd release players that weren't backwards compatable.

Though I hear the first hybrid models (BR and HD in one player) don't play CDs. I know the LG ones didn't.

[Jura]

Blu-Ray because it sounds cooler.

:shifty:

[Kane Knight]

For what it's worth, I was betting on HD DVD because of marketing constraints (It's still called DVD, for example), features, and price. However, being cheap means nothing if nobody supports you.

[ClockShot]

Blu-Ray is gonna win out in the long run. HD-DVD tried to get back in the game by adding online features within their disks and some other doodads (I mentioned this in another one of these threads), but I've yet to hear a movie that has done this. The hardware is out to burn and view as WWKD mentioned.

[ct2k]

The PS3 is a pretty huge factor I guess, particularly because it is an everyman console not a niche product, so average Joe is gonna get blu-ray with his PS3 (which he bought on the back of the previous two and the Sony brand in general) and take advantage of it:-\

[Kane Knight]

The PS3 is a pretty huge factor I guess, particularly because it is an everyman console not a niche product, so average Joe is gonna get blu-ray with his PS3 (which he bought on the back of the previous two and the Sony brand in general) and take advantage of it:-\

Which would have worked better if they hadn't worked so hard to make sure that the PS3 would lag in console sales. Still, it is a rather big determining factor.

[D Mac]

Well I won that combo player so I have the best of both worlds. :cool:

Now, which movies to buy and for what format...

[D Mac]

Probably will get 300 on Blu ray first. And Pirates Trilogy.

[WestNZ]

can all the DVD and HDDVD shit and stick with the VHS why dont ya, i hate upgrading epuipment all the time.

[Downunder]

Blu-Ray because it sounds cooler.

:shifty:

From a marketing point of view, Blu-Ray is way morfe marketable. It rolls of the tongue, and sounds "cool". HD-DVD just didn't have the same sizzle. People quite honestly were confused by it, some thought it was Hard Drive DVD, and wanted to know why they had to pay all that money for a HD Recorder.

Seriously.

[ct2k]

Hot Diggity DVD

[Downunder]

Also stick with regular DVD until the prices settle down.

[Kane Knight]

From a marketing point of view, Blu-Ray is way morfe marketable. It rolls of the tongue, and sounds "cool". HD-DVD just didn't have the same sizzle. People quite honestly were confused by it, some thought it was Hard Drive DVD, and wanted to know why they had to pay all that money for a HD Recorder.

Seriously.

Are you high?

Also, DVD prices have been going up. What makes you think prices will "settle down" on High Def formats?

[D Mac]

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/High-Def_Disc_Rentals/Netflix/Netflix_Goes_Blu-ray_Exclusive/1451

Netflix goes Blu Ray exclusive


Online rentailer Netflix has announced it will drop support of the HD DVD format, and will exclusively stock Blu-ray discs.

Citing the decision by four of the six major movie studios to publish high-def DVD titles only in the Sony-developed Blu-ray format, Netflix said that it would cease purchasing new HD DVD stock immediately, and that it would phase out existing HD DVD stock by year's end.

As we've previously reported, Netflix was the first major rentailer to support both high-def disc format, stocking HD DVD beginning in April of 2006, and Blu-ray in June of that same year.

"The prolonged period of competition between two formats has prevented clear communication to the consumer regarding the richness of the high-def experience versus standard definition," said Ted Sarandos, chief content officer for Netflix. "From the Netflix perspective, focusing on one format will enable us to create the best experience for subscribers who want high- definition to be an important part of how they enjoy our service."

The company says that although only a portion of Netflix subscribers have elected to receive high-def discs, a majority of those subscribers have chosen Blu-ray over HD DVD.

[Funky Fly]

HD DVD because I am stupid.

[D Mac]

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/Industry_Trends/Best_Buy/Best_Buy_to_Recommend_Blu-ray_over_HD_DVD/1455

Best Buy to Recommend Blu-ray over HD DVD
Mon Feb 11, 2008 at 04:17 PM ET

The nation's largest consumer electronics retailer says it will recommend Blu-ray as its preferred high-def format.

According to a just-issued press release, Best Buy says that in endorsing Blu-ray, the company hopes to take a step forward in addressing consumer confusion about high-definition formats

"Consumers have told us that they want us to help lead the way. We've listened to our customers, and we are responding," said Brian Dunn, Best Buy's president and chief operating officer. "Our decision to shine a spotlight on Blu-ray Disc players and other Blu-ray products is a strong signal to our customers that we believe Blu-ray is the right format choice for them."


The news amounts to a one-two punch on the heels of this morning's announcement from Netflix that it would drop HD DVD support.

Though Best Buy says it will continue to carry an assortment of HD DVD products, beginning in early March it says it will more prominently showcase and recommend Blu-ray hardware and software products.

"Best Buy has always believed that the customer will benefit from a widely-accepted single format that would offer advantages such as product compatibility and expanded content choices," explained Dunn. "Because we believe that Blu-ray is fast emerging as that single format, we have decided to focus on Blu-ray products."

[D Mac]

Yeah I went with Full Metal Jacket: Deluxe Edition as my first ever Blu Ray purchase. :cool:

[Kane Knight]

I think my first was Spider-Man 3. I still only have about five BRD titles.

[Lock Jaw]

http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSL1643184420080216?sp=true

[ct2k]

Are you high?

Also, DVD prices have been going up. What makes you think prices will "settle down" on High Def formats?


DVD prices are certainly not going up over here:-\

[D Mac]

Just bought 10 Blu Ray discs at Amazon for just a little over 100 bucks. Over a 200 dollar value. :cool:

Black Hawk Down [Blu-ray]
The Patriot (Extended Cut) [Blu-ray]
Evil Dead 2: Dead by Dawn [Blu-ray]
300 [Blu-ray]
The Best of Blu-ray Disc, Volume Three (Blazing Saddles / The Departed / GoodFellas / Superman - The Movie) [Blu-ray]
Troy - The Director's Cut [Blu-ray]
Superman 2, The Richard Donner Cut (Blu-ray)

[D Mac]

I'd post this in the other thread but I think no one is clicking that any more.

http://www.highdefdigest.com/news/show/High-Def_Retailing/Wal-Mart/Wal-Mart_to_Go_Blu-ray_Exclusive/1469

The nation's top retailer will phase out its HD DVD support by early summer.

That's the official word this morning from Wal-Mart, first announced on the company's gadget blog, CheckOut.com.


According to Wal-Mart execs, the company will begin emphasizing Blu-ray in both brick-and-mortar stores and online over the next thirty days, with plans to completely phase out HD DVD movie and hardware sales by June 2008. The company will continue to sell DVDs and standard-definition hardware.

"We've listened to our customers, who are showing a clear preference toward Blu-ray products and movies with their purchases, explained Gary Severson, senior vice president, Home Entertainment, Wal-Mart US.

"With the customers best interest in all we do, we wanted to share our decision and timeline with them as soon as possible, knowing it will help simplify their purchase decision, increase selection, and increase adoption long term. We anticipate enhancing our selection with continued great values in hi-definition Blu-ray products, so our customers can further enhance their entertainment experience at home."

As we've previously reported, Wal-Mart was a key promotional partner for the HD DVD camp this past holiday season, with the retailer prominently featuring a Toshiba HD DVD player in one of its television commercials.

Today's announcement from the retailer comes on the heels of news earlier this week that both Netflix and Best Buy had endorsed Blu-ray.

Sure glad I went for Blu. When Wal Mart endorses something over something else it's pretty much over.

[What Would Kevin Do?]

Yeah, Toshiba is assessing their future on the medium right now. Most people believe Toshiba will announce that it's removing itself from the next-gen race this week.

Oddly enough, news that Toshiba was planning on halting production came before the Walmart news.

[Kane Knight]

Just in case on Hi Def thread wasn't enough.

[Kane Knight]

And half of those were worth it.

[FakeLaser]

Looks like it's safe to buy a Blu-ray now

[ron the dial]

it looks like best buy is going to do the same thing. or at least that's the rumor i heard around the water cooler.

[ct2k]

I'm still giving it a few years before I bother tbh

[FakeLaser]

Yeah, same here, because them shits are still a fortune and now DVDs are really reasonable. Plus, I only have one HDTV. What if I want to watch my Blu-ray somewhere else in the house?

[D Mac]

Which aren't?

[ct2k]

We have precisely 0 HDTV's in our crib

Also DVD's have been mad reasonable here for years, most I ever spent was £15 and that was for Batman Begins on the day it came out, otherwise like between £3-£10

[Kane Knight]

300 and Troy just JUMP off that list at me, for starters.

[ct2k]

So do the Patriot and Evil Dead 2 for me:-\

[Kane Knight]

Evil Dead 2 especially.

[Bad Company]

dvds upscaled still look damn good.

[D Mac]

Fuck you. Evil Dead rules. :foc:

Have'nt seen Troy but it was dirt cheap and I heard good things.

And 300 was mentioned as a must own on Blu Ray. If nothing else to show off the system.

[Kane Knight]

Fuck you. Evil Dead rules. :foc:

Have'nt seen Troy but it was dirt cheap and I heard good things.

And 300 was mentioned as a must own on Blu Ray. If nothing else to show off the system.

Protip: Any movie where the Director's Cut is shorter than the feature film version will blow.

But liking Evil Dead, you might be pleasantly surprised.

Was the person who called 300 a must own the same guy who said "Troy" was a good idea? If so, get him help.

[ct2k]

I bet Blade Runner is tastey in hi def

[Kane Knight]

Well, all they can really do for Blade Runner is make a new transfer to 1080i/p and remix the audio. I'm sure it's nice, but don't expect miracles.

[IC Champion]

Well, it had to happen sooner or later, but no one saw if coming this soon, Toshiba has thrown in the towel, and will no longer be making HD-DVDs or recorders. So Blue Ray seems to have won the war.

[ClockShot]

Well. Toshiba made the announcement official today.

However, for those of you who have HD DVD players and are looking to add some movies to your collection, amazon.com is having a big 50% off sale.

[Downunder]

DVD prices are certainly not going up over here:-\

Both media and players (standard def and hi def) are dropping in price at a steady rate here, and will continue to do.


Personally I don't watch many movies in DVD format so I can't see the point in switching to Blu-Ray until I'm forced to do so.

[D Mac]

Because Blu Ray is awesome.

[Sepholio]

I just had a thought. What does Microsoft do with the Xbox 360 now in terms of high-def movies? Or are they just now compeletely out of the picture? I mean if Blu-ray is the winner, even in the next console generation, what can MS do? They will -never- have Blu-Ray and it is doubtful people will start switching if they create a competing format in a couple years because Blu-Ray will already have the huge install base.

I'm very interested in seeing where this goes.

[Triple A]

Well, they sell an HD-DVD add-on. I don't see why they wouldn't be able to create a Blu Ray add-on.

[Kane Knight]

Both media and players (standard def and hi def) are dropping in price at a steady rate here, and will continue to do.


Personally I don't watch many movies in DVD format so I can't see the point in switching to Blu-Ray until I'm forced to do so.

Prices on DVDs are actually going up here. Stores are now charging more for new movies, and list prices are actually higher as well. Instead of 15-20 dollars, you're looking at 20-25 dollars and a list price of 35, so sometimes people charge more. That's actually comparable to Blu Ray or HD

I just had a thought. What does Microsoft do with the Xbox 360 now in terms of high-def movies? Or are they just now compeletely out of the picture? I mean if Blu-ray is the winner, even in the next console generation, what can MS do? They will -never- have Blu-Ray and it is doubtful people will start switching if they create a competing format in a couple years because Blu-Ray will already have the huge install base.

I'm very interested in seeing where this goes.


Microsoft makes money off of every BR movie as well, for the record. Both formats use proprietary technology owned by Microsoft. I'm not sure why they wouldn't have Blu Ray, unless you're laboring under the misinformed assumption that this is a "Microsoft" versus "Sony" war. Sony isn't alone in the Blu Ray consortium, and though they brought in the big guns (Movie support), they don't particularly control the whole thing, nor would they be likely to limit the Blu Ray format.

Now for reality, Microsoft's primary aim is pushing their own digital distribution. Which is terrible because it's overpriced, proprietary, and you don't actually own the shit, not to mention it's not the same quality of true HD media.

[Triple A]

Yeah over here Blu ray and regular DVDs are around the same price. Maybe a $5 difference at most.

[ron the dial]

really? shit is still about $10-15 more here. ridiculous.

[Kane Knight]

really? shit is still about $10-15 more here. ridiculous.

Where are you at?

If I get lucky, I can find new DVDs for 20 bucks. And right now, that's about what I'm paying for Blu Ray discs. The catch is, I have to get both through specials/sales/retail deals.

[ron the dial]

northern illinois. dvds are generally $20 upon release and blu-rays are generally $30-35. they are both cheaper during their week of release, but after that it's just random sales you have to catch to get them cheap. and even then the blu-rays only go as low as $25.

[Kane Knight]

I've started buying from Amazon, because a lot of the BRDs are like 20 bucks.

Plus, I'm on a free trial of Prime, so I get three free months of free second day shipping.

[D Mac]

Just got my discs in and I have to say, Superman the Movie looks awesome. Totally looks perfect, not like a 30 year old movie. So does Goodfellas.

[D Mac]

http://www.reuters.com/article/entertainmentNews/idUSN2118265320080221

All Hollywood studios now lined up behind Blu-Ray

LOS ANGELES (Hollywood Reporter) - All six major Hollywood studios are now in the Blu-ray DVD camp, a day after Toshiba pulled the plug on HD DVD and Blu-ray became effectively the only next-generation game in town.

Paramount Home Entertainment quietly came onboard via a statement issued Wednesday to The Hollywood Reporter: "We are pleased that the industry is moving to a single high-definition format, as we believe it is in the best interest of the consumer," the statement read. "As we look to (begin) releasing our titles on Blu-ray, we will monitor consumer adoption and determine our release plans accordingly."

No further details were given.

Universal Studios Home Entertainment, in contrast, cast its lot with Blu-ray within hours of Toshiba's announcement Tuesday morning that it was ending the format war by ceasing the development, manufacture and marketing of HD DVD players by the end of March.

Janet Murray, director of Georgia Tech's masters and Ph.D. program in digital media, said a single format supported by all six major studios has a much better chance of success than two rival ones that each take only a chunk of Hollywood.

"It's a big victory for the consumer," she said.

Now that the studios are no longer battling each other over which format is best, Murray said, they can focus on generating awareness among consumers of the many benefits of high-definition media. Murray predicts "a standardization of extras" now that everyone's releasing films on a single format rather than two, each with its own set of capabilities. "This will lead to a much richer experience for viewers," she added.

Murray also foresees "much more content and much more breadth of content" now that Blu-ray is the only way to go. "When people have these higher-end screens at home, they take great pleasure in them, and this will push ahead the delivery (of movies) in high-definition," she said.

Universal had been exclusive with HD DVD since the format's launch in April 2006, while Paramount initially supported both HD DVD and Blu-ray. Paramount and DreamWorks switched to HD DVD-only in August, reportedly after receiving a $150 million payment from the format's supporters for "promotional consideration."

Neither studio has announced specific titles earmarked for early Blu-ray release, though both are expected to start with new theatricals coming the same day as the standard DVD, beginning in late spring or early summer.

The four other majors committed to Blu-ray are Sony Pictures Home Entertainment, 20th Century Fox Home Entertainment (along with its distributed MGM Home Entertainment label), Walt Disney Studios Home Entertainment and Warner Home Video (including distributed labels New Line Home Entertainment, BBC Video and HBO Video). Mini-major Lionsgate also has been an exclusive Blu-ray backer since the start.

Reuters/Hollywood Reporter

[ct2k]

So can someone explain to me again how Toshiba managed to fuck this one up so badly?

[Downunder]

Marketing

[Downunder]

Blu-ray could still lose HD video war: Toshiba

By Matthew Henry

SYDNEY: Toshiba claims that Sony’s victory in the high definition disc format war will be short lived due to the rise of HD digital video downloads over broadband, which the company claims was one of the key reason for abandoning HD DVD.

In a press conference this morning, Toshiba Australia general manager, Mark Whittard, said that while the US film and retail industries’ recent shift to support Blu-ray sealed HD DVD’s fate, other factors played a role in Toshiba’s abandonment of its high definition video disc business.

Whittard claims the penetration of both next generation disc formats is well below expectations while uptake of digital movie download services is accelerating, and could render HD discs redundant.

“We believe technology developments will soon leapfrog high definition discs, whether it be HD DVD or Blu-ray,” he claimed.

“This step is going to be leapfrogged by the next major format – digital content, internet downloads and video on demand.”

Whittard also identified DVD as a formidable competitor to Blu-ray.

According to figures quoted by Toshiba, total sales of HD movie discs reached a paltry $300 million last year compared to sales of over $23 billion for DVD discs.

Whittard claims Blu-ray will find it difficult to replace DVD in the same way DVD comprehensively replaced VHS.

Toshiba sold less than one million HD DVD players worldwide, and while Blu-ray has achieved higher penetration with the PS3, Whittard claims DVD will be “extremely difficult” for Blu-ray to overcome.

“DVD players still sell in their tens of millions worldwide today,” he said.

“DVD upscaling technology means you get near high definition quality, and to most people there is little discernable difference.”

However, while Toshiba is now moving towards a business model which will see it place more emphasis on other HD video delivery platforms, it has not ruled out joining the Blu-ray camp.

“You never say never, but at this stage there are no plans,” he said.

Toshiba's HD DVD players also have the potential for internet connectivity which gives them the potential to accept HD video streaming over ethernet connectivity, which could be utilised by the company in the future.

[Sepholio]

Haha, Toshiba tries to cop out. They just don't want to admit they completely blew it.

[Kane Knight]

Haha, Toshiba tries to cop out. They just don't want to admit they completely blew it.

Yes, because what they said was so unreasonable.

[D Mac]

DVD upscaling technology means you get near high definition quality, and to most people there is little discernable difference.”

Idiotic statement. The difference is like night and day.

[ct2k]

It seems logical what they're saying about the changing formats though, Blu Ray will probably not replace DVD in the comprehensive way DVD did VHS, because they'll use the same players if nothing else, not to mention DVD still provides great picture and sound quality, and the fact that a hell of a lot of people don't have HD tv's yet anyway

[Mr Regal]

Blu Ray is good, running on a quality 1080p tv the films look astounding. However they cost way too much (disc and machine) and there will be other ways of getting HD film that cost a lot less.

Toshiba are speaking sense.

[ct2k]

Online is definitely the way forward, hell I've watched the whole season 3 of Lost online on the DivX webplayer and its fantastic quality, not HD but still, it can't be far off

[Kane Knight]

Online will never completely replace hardcopies. Even HD on demand is lower quality than HD video discs, and there will always be people who want to own the movies. Yeah, I'm a dinosaur, I still pay for CDs, too.

[Mr Regal]

KK you're not really thinking ahead there at all are you.

[Mr Regal]

Oh and i just found out Stage6 is shutting down in a few days :'(

[Downunder]

All you base are belong to Kane Knight

[Kane Knight]

KK you're not really thinking ahead there at all are you.

Sure I am.

[ct2k]

56.com
tudou.com
ouou.com


Those sites have most of the tv stuff you're probably after, only problem being they're in Chinese or some shit so It can take a little while to find stuff:D

[D Mac]

Microsoft announced they will stop production on the HD DVD player for Xbox 360. And Circuit City.com has them for 50 bucks with FREE shipping.

Just bought one. Great deal.

Xbox 360 HD DVD Player w/King Kong HD-DVD $49.99
Subtotal: $49.99
Estimated shipping: Free!
Estimated tax: $2.11
Total: $52.10

[D Mac]

http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/Xbox-360-HD-DVD-Player-w-King-Kong-HD-DVD-882224379663/sem/rpsm/oid/166160/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do

[ClockShot]

Damn. That's not a bad deal.

Just read on my Wii that sony is taking a page out of the Toshiba book and has Blu-Ray players in production with internet capabilities.

http://www.blu-ray.com/news/?id=1041

[Kane Knight]

I suppose it's a good deal, but it's for a dying format.

[road doggy dogg]

lawl @ anyone getting anything HD-DVD. Might wanna get a Betamax with that too!!!!!

[Triple A]

Microsoft announced they will stop production on the HD DVD player for Xbox 360. And Circuit City.com has them for 50 bucks with FREE shipping.

Just bought one. Great deal.

Xbox 360 HD DVD Player w/King Kong HD-DVD $49.99
Subtotal: $49.99
Estimated shipping: Free!
Estimated tax: $2.11
Total: $52.10
Didn't you just say you bought a Blu Ray/HD DVD combo player?

And even if you didn't, why are you wasting your money

[Kane Knight]

Didn't you just say you bought a Blu Ray/HD DVD combo player?

And even if you didn't, why are you wasting your money

I thought he said he was bidding on one. I'm betting he lost.

Anyway, he's wasting his money because he's an idiot.

On a side note, anyone wanna buy my HD DVD player? If people are willing to buy a discontinued HD DVD Drive for the 360, there's gotta be some sucker who'll buy my player.

[D Mac]

Decided to go with just blu ray, but this is only 50 bucks as opposed to 120.

There are still a few movies that are only on HD DVD I wanna get.

[D Mac]

Suck a fat one KK. :mad:

[D Mac]

You also get 5 free HD DVD movies with mail in.

[Kane Knight]

Decided to go with just blu ray, but this is only 50 bucks as opposed to 120.

There are still a few movies that are only on HD DVD I wanna get.

Or you could have waited three months and gotten them on Blu Ray and not wasted the time and money.

[Kane Knight]

Suck a fat one KK. :mad:

What do I look like, Kano?

[D Mac]

Or you could have waited three months and gotten them on Blu Ray and not wasted the time and money.

Tax refund is made for wasting. :D

[Kane Knight]

Tax refund is made for wasting. :D

There are better places to invest.

Are you gonna blow money on BETAMAX, too?

[ct2k]

hmmm

[D Mac]

I got my nephew/roommate to pay for half of it. 25 bucks WOOOOOOO

[D Mac]

Christ I finally got my 360 HD DVD player in the mail and it's defective. I have to either drive 55 miles to the nearest Circuit City to replace it, or send it in the mail and wait a month to get it back. :mad:

[D Mac]

I took it up to Wal Mart and lied my ass off saying it was a gift and they exchanged it. :cool:

[Kane Knight]

I'm just going to point and laugh.