wCw belt

[Optimus Bone 69]

i saw a picture of a 90's wcw world title which kind of looked like a winged eagle style belt, whats the story behind this

[The One]

http://www.midwestwrestling.com/images3/WCW1.jpg

I assume you mean this. Well the story is al kind of bullshity, but here we go...

1991 - Ric Flair beats Sting to become the NWA Champion...also in that match Flair became the first WCW Champion (though WCW didn't have a title belt, they just continued to use the NWA Title, as he was also the NWA Champ at the time). The NWA belt at this time was "The Big Gold Belt" design currently used by WWE's "World" Title. Anyway,. July of '91 Flair goes to WWE, but Flair brings with him the NWA World Belt - which for all intents and purposes was acting as the physical symbol of both the NWA and WCW belts. SO, NWA after a year so decides to hold a WCW/NJPW tourny to crown their new NWA World Champion, using a new belt with the same "Big Gold Belt" design which was won by Masahiro Chono...WCW on the other hand had Dusty bring up some regional title belt which they put a plate over it to read "WCW" and that then became the official WCW World Title, the belt your refering to. (by the way, Lugar won it originaly)

As time went on the NWA World Title found it's way BACK to Flair after he had returned to WCW. However at this point WCW left the NWA, and as such they had floating around their WCW World Heavyweight title and Flair's NWA World Heavyweight Title. Somehow the taped segement of Rick Rude winning the NWA Belt got leaked and so the NWA no longer would honor the title change as legit. The NWA belt now completely seperated itself from WCW, they began refering to the NWA belt (now no longer honored by the NWA) as the "International" World Heavyweight Championship. This was all very confusing and everyone wondered why one promotion had two world Champs, so eventually Flair won the WCW belt, Sting was the International World Champ, and they wrestled to unify the belts into one...which Flair won.

From that point, they dropped the WCW belt, and continued on with the "Big Gold Belt" as the WCW Title.

Hope that made some level of sense. The short answer to your question is the belt your questioning is actually the "real" WCW Belt from 1991 to 1994.

[Juan]

Good stuff

[KayfabeMan]

Yeah I was explaining this situation to my wife the other night, and she thought it was completely confusing as well. To be honest, I had to stop a time or two telling the story as I started to somewhat confuse myself. Crazy stuff.

A similar thing happens today with people tracing the lineage of the WWE Championship and the World Championship.

[Funky Fly]

... wow

[KayfabeMan]

BTW, I think having a WWE Champion and a World Champion are ridiculous.

It is not as though the WWE Champion just defends his title within the WWE, and the World Champion actually travels to Mexico, Japan, etc. defending it against the stars of their top promotions.

[Lord-Of-Darkness]

Is that the WCW title thats used as the 'Classic WCW championsip' in the SVR games? I'm having a hard time picturing it.

[CSL]

Yup

[DAMN iNATOR]

BTW, I think having a WWE Champion and a World Champion are ridiculous.

It is not as though the WWE Champion just defends his title within the WWE, and the World Champion actually travels to Mexico, Japan, etc. defending it against the stars of their top promotions.

No, but WWE does do World Tours every once in a while, and I'm sure even if it's predetermined, that probably at least one location they go to each trip has a World Title match, but I know what you are saying.

[The MAC]

i want to cum on that belt..

[KayfabeMan]

I have cum on that belt.

Though it looks like it'd give you a good go, it was kinda bland, and I had to do most of the work myself.

[KayfabeMan]

it was kinda bland, and I had to do most of the work myself.

Ironically, that describes wrestling against HHH.

[The One]

Bwahahaha! Jackass. Do you have any idea how many workers put HHH at the top tier of guys to work with. Time and time again people have said that with him in the ring, you basically don't need to do a thing. And while we're skimming the surface, I might as well point out that Hunter is one of the most diverse, interesting, and influential characters in history. The guy who can be a cruel merciless killer and a practical jokester all in one...the last guy to pull of that kind of character won an Oscar.

TOVO Fact: Tovo doesn't like the smell of freshly cut grass. I know a lot of people dig it, and I just don't understand why. It's an offensive odder.

[KayfabeMan]

OMG! HHH rulz, he is so cool.

Relax.

The world is full of diverse and entertaining 'jackassii', all of whom are entitled to their own opinions on various situations - including Triple H. Just as I do not find HHH to be extremely entertaining or worthy of being called 'King of Kings', etc., etc. - you may also like him and want to give him a rimjob.

Moral: We're all entitled to our own opinions.

Jackass.

[The One]

...OK, the Q&A really isn't the place to get into this sort of thing...but fuck it...

Ironically, that describes wrestling against HHH.

Where in that does it say that you, AS A FAN, don't find him entertaining? Nowhere. Your comment was that wrestling, as in being in the ring with him was an activity that required you, the other performer, doing most of the work.

Now explain to me how it is that one of the highest praised workers in history, someone who has earned the respect inside of the ring by nearly everyone he's ever wrestled against (again, inside of the ring, which was the context of your statement) can be judged in terms of how much a fan likes him? Your statement was said from a point of view that you simply have no reference with, and one that is backed up by virtually NOBODY. I've heard people say that they wouldn't cross the road to piss on Hunter if he was on fire, but still say inside the ring he's one of the best.

So again, please explain to me how me calling you a jackass for making an unsupported statement in turn makes me a jackass.

TOVO Fact: Tovo enjoys a glass of water before going to bed every night.

[Krimzon7]

I am not sure why HHH is being brought up, and consequently buried, in a thread about the WCW Belt. His legacy is certified. THe respect that he garners isn't forced. People shoot about HHH and they heap praise on him professionally.

Kayfabeman, ease up.

[abec]

This is the only belt i have any respect for.

[James Steele]

KayfabeMan, I thought you were above being a whiny little cunt and a ubersmark.

Please explain to me why you dislike Triple H's character? What is it about his character you dislike.

Please refrain from referring to backstage activities or some lame attempt at sarcasm because that only makes you look like an even bigger dipshit then you look like now.

[Sovereigntywillpr]

No, but WWE does do World Tours every once in a while, and I'm sure even if it's predetermined, that probably at least one location they go to each trip has a World Title match, but I know what you are saying.

I always saw it as Vince getting the NWA belt, or World Heavyweight Title that his dad was screwed when I believe it was Buddy Rogers beating Thez (I think it was) and NWA not recognizing it, so Vince Sr (I guess) made his own belt and maid Rogers WWWF World Champ... now 50 years later he has both after buying WCW, could it be the ego trip?
Of course that’s all speculation...

[The One]

I always saw it as Vince getting the NWA belt, or World Heavyweight Title that his dad was screwed when I believe it was Buddy Rogers beating Thez (I think it was) and NWA not recognizing it, so Vince Sr (I guess) made his own belt and maid Rogers WWWF World Champ... now 50 years later he has both after buying WCW, could it be the ego trip?
Of course that’s all speculation...

The history of the WWE Title begins, in kayfabe, when Buddy Rogers beat Antonio Rocco in Rio de Janeiro (hmmm, and they had the first IC champ there too :roll: ) however it actually came into being when, as you said, Rogers won a match in which the NWA refused to acknowledge the title change. However, even with Vince McMahon owning the WCW Title, he DOES NOT own the NWA Title history in any way, shape or form. Technically, the WCW Title History dates back 1991. That's the belt he owns. The NWA Title is still it's own entity. It still has both legal and practical claims to one of the oldest titles in history, dating back to 1948.

Having said that, Vince McMahon insists that the World Title isn't even an extension of the WCW World Title. Therefore, it is, for all practical purposes, a belt that was created in 2003. Now granted it shares the classic "Big Gold Belt" design that has been used for both the WCW World Championship and the NWA World Heavyweight Championships at various points in time, but they are NOT the belt belts, nor do they carry the same linage. Just like the WCW World Title didn't carry the NWA World Title's history just because the belt design was the same.

In conclusion, if you have any questions about the World Titles and their proper history consult the thread I wrote about the issue several years back....

TOVO Fact: Tovo loves playing with paperclips.

[Theo Dious]

Bwahahaha! Jackass. Do you have any idea how many workers put HHH at the top tier of guys to work with. Time and time again people have said that with him in the ring, you basically don't need to do a thing.

And why exactly would we take the word of guys who have actually worked with HHH over the word of a guy on a message board?

[Sovereigntywillpr]

I know in Brets book it said the big gold belt was more prestigious to the guys back in the day but you made more money as the WWF champ.

What about the NWA Title. it's existed in NWA, WWF(DanSevern)....I believe Severn left WWF with it and lost it in Japan, does that linage go all the way to when they lent it out to TNA, and if so where are belts like the north American championship and NWA world Championship now?
and how does Vince own all of the crocket promotion stuff and not the belt? or does he, and he just says it's a different linage?(i'm assuming he doesn't want the same belt held by David arquette) I’m confused I should Wikipedia this stuff.

So at one point Vince, Crocket, Hart, Tunney, And all other major bookers belonged to the NWA where the belt was passed around territories. Who actually owns the NWA council now? Why hasn’t vince bought it out, it has name recognition to make another promotions title look stronger if they can claim the same linage (that Vince denies)

Is there a NWA champion now or was Christian the last in TNA ( I think it was him) and *is it*(edit) free to be defended on say, ring of Honor or even Smackdown if Vince wanted to do another NWA angle?

Sorry If I confused you.

[KayfabeMan]

KayfabeMan, I thought you were above being a whiny little cunt and a ubersmark.

Please explain to me why you dislike Triple H's character? What is it about his character you dislike.

Please refrain from referring to backstage activities or some lame attempt at sarcasm because that only makes you look like an even bigger dipshit then you look like now.

You guys are hilarious.

I wasn't actually whining about anything.

I made a joke about HHH; on a board where people make jokes about Eddie Guerrero, Owen Hart, Chris Benoit's murdered family, and children who die an untimely and unfortunate death - and everyone has gotten their feathers ruffled over it. Irony.

I refer only to backstage activities that I know about. I don't really look like a dipshit. I look like someone who posts a comment related to HHH. In the comment that follows, I'm called a jackass. In my comment, I defend myself and make reference to the fact that (unless different rules apply on the Internet than they do in the real world) we are all entitled to an opinion.

So yes, you're entitled to call me a jackass, etc. However, I don't see the need to waste my life arguing in a thread over HHH or anyone else related to the business.

A simple, one line comment, and you guys get that worked up - and then call me a mark? Might want to read up a little more on the subject. Marks.

[XIII]

fu kin jack ass

[Sovereigntywillpr]

so if the IC title came from unifying north and south american "in rio" and it was years later unified with the European title, they should do angle with new japan/all japan and get one of their Jr heavyweight titles or heavyweight title and have someone claim he's the champ of the world minus (affrica) even have him bring in some phony Affrican Wrestling Championship he can say he won in South Africa? or even do it their next time they tour down under.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Wow, everyone took the joke KayfabeMan made way too seriously. It was a fucking joke. Also, come on, Triple H does not deserve an Oscar. The guy is a horrible actor.

Anyway, the history of the WCW World Heavyweight Title and WCW International World Heavyweight Title have been explained, but I have to ask: Do you consider the International World Heavyweight Title a legitimate "World Title?" I mean, if TNA and the WWE can invent World Titles on the spot, then why can't WCW?

The WWE Title situation is a very funny one indeed. I like to look at the titles as if they are sort of a family. The father of all professional wrestling World Titles is the NWA World Heavyweight Championship. According to what I've read, the NWA did not want to recognise Buddy Rogers winning their belt, so a new title was spawned by the WWE to recognise Rogers as the "World Heavyweight Champion." The WWE Title is almost the son of the NWA Title.

It seems that whenever the NWA Title moves in with a company, it has at least one love child. It has led to the creation of not only the WWE Title, but the WCW Title, WCW International World Heavyweight Title, the ECW Title and the TNA World Heavyweight Title. The WWE Title and WCW Title were the children that really made it. Together they produced the World Heavyweight Championship, which is the first third generation World Title. The WCW International Title was so quite, that hardly anyone remembers it exists. The ECW Title is sort of the black sheep of the family, and TNA Title is the baby that no one really respects.

[Mr. Nerfect]

so if the IC title came from unifying north and south american "in rio" and it was years later unified with the European title, they should do angle with new japan/all japan and get one of their Jr heavyweight titles or heavyweight title and have someone claim he's the champ of the world minus (affrica) even have him bring in some phony Affrican Wrestling Championship he can say he won in South Africa? or even do it their next time they tour down under.

That's almost something Santino Marella did. He claimed that because he was the "Champion of the Continents," that he was also "Champion of the World." It's really quite ridiculous that the name "IC Title" means so much compared to the US Title, but they are somehow comparative as secondary titles. The name really doesn't mean anything.

[XL]

That used to confuse me. I presumed that, as the IC and US titles were both secondary titles they were both on the same level, therefore "Intercontinental" meant "within the US".

As it happens "Intercontinental" actually means between 2 or more continents. Thus, theoretically, could be considerd on the same level as any "World" Title really.

As for the WWE/World Title lineage, my assesmment was that the current WWE World Title (held by Orton) holds the lineage of the WWF title (held by the likes of Backlund, Hogan, Hart, Michaels, Austin) and the WCW title ("Big Gold Belt" held by Flair, Sting, Steiner, Booker, etc) as the two belts were unified by Jericho at Vengeance 2001. As an aside, the WCW World Title became known as the World Championship after WCW had been disbanded post-Survivor Series 2001.

That title became one physical belt when HHH won it at WM18 and was later held by Hogan, Taker, Rock and lastly by Brock Lesnar.

When Lesnar "signed exclusively to SmackDown" Bischoff was forced to create a new title, which once again used the physical "Big Gold Belt". If I'm correct in thinking, this belt then took on the lineage of the IC title (which had earlier been unified with the European, Hardcore and WCW US Titles at various points prior to this) until the IC Title was recommissioned.

So, we have:

WWE World Title
Holds the history of the WWF Title and WCW Title.

World Heavyweight Championship
Created in 2003 by Bischoff, technically holds the lineage of the Hardcore, European and pre-2002 IC belts (and thus WCW-era US Title).

US Title
Carries the lineage of the original WCW US Title (despite having been unified with the
IC Title and then later recommissioned).

IC Title
Carries the lineage that started with Patterson's fictional win in Rio De Janeiro despite having been unified then recommisioned.

ECW Title
I think also carries it's original lineage (with Shane Douglas being the original ECW World Champion) although could claim to be tied into the WWE Title lineage as Rob Van Dam "recommissioned" it as WWE Champ.



NOTE: I appreciate that this has all been discussed and pointed out elsewhere on the forums and doesn't, in fact, relate to the original question in the thred.

[Mr. Nerfect]

Well, when you look at the continents the IC Title represents, it was originally the unified form of a fictional "North American Championship" and "South American Championship." It also was unified with the European Championship and Hardcore Championship, which to me says that the IC Title represents:

North America
South America
Europe
Hardcore culture

The difference between it and a World Title, would be the missing presence of Asia, Africa, Australia and Antarctica being represented by it. :shifty:

[Sovereigntywillpr]

i don't think bishoff created that title, wasn't he going to and than someone one the belt so he didn't have to.

I know the IC title was the world title on raw for awhile (as both others were on smackdown affter the first draft) but the big gold belt came back(the same one) and was unified with the IC title. than they brought that back....

[Mr. Nerfect]

i don't think bishoff created that title, wasn't he going to and than someone one the belt so he didn't have to.

I know the IC title was the world title on raw for awhile (as both others were on smackdown affter the first draft) but the big gold belt came back(the same one) and was unified with the IC title. than they brought that back....

Not too sure what you mean with your first sentence, but you might be thinking of when Theodore Long was going to create the "SmackDown! Championship" after John Cena was drafted to RAW with the WWE Championship, before Batista was drafted to SmackDown! with the World Heavyweight Championship, so the Six-Way Match he had planned to crown the first champion became a #1 Contender's Match, which I believe JBL won?

[parkmania]

Bischoff did create a Raw championship, used a belt that resembled the WCW belt, called it the World Championship, and presented it to HHH after Brock Lesnar went exclusively to Smackdown.

The IC and US belts were unifications with the European and Hardcore titles, IIRC. I just don't remember which was which.

[Xero]

European and Hardcore are both in the IC title. I think Van Dam consolidated the HC title. Not sure about the European.

[parkmania]

Then the TV title is in the US belt or something... I remember it was one mid-card WWE and one mid-card WCW belt that combined in both instances.

[Hornicane]

European and Hardcore are both in the IC title. I think Van Dam consolidated the HC title. Not sure about the European.

RVD beat Jeff to unite the IC and Euro titles.

[James Steele]

I find it sad the WWE didn't use the TV Championship during the inVasion angle.

[James Steele]

I also wish somebody would bring in the WCW Design for the US Championship. The US Title looks ridiculous now.

[mike adamle]

To whoever asked the question "is there an NWA champion now and could it be defended on ROH or SmackDown?" the answer is yes. Blue Demon Jr. is the reigning NWA Champion. And the NWA Title has actually changed hands twice on ROH shows in 2008.

[Sovereigntywillpr]

he earned some respect (While) inside steph too

[Sovereigntywillpr]

North American WWF Championship wasn`t made up, just the south...