:(

Great episode

holy shit, great episode. Sad about Frank though, really loved this character.

NOOOOOOOOO :(

oh shit, didn't even realize Frank died too. christ :(

wtf, nobody even asked about him when they got to the shore. fuck you writers

jin, sun, sayid and frank right?

what ever happened to miles?

yep, I knew as soon as I saw that bomb that somebody was going to pull a Michael and I was thinking Sayid because that was going to be his redemption type deal. Just like Charlie and Michael

Miles went with Ben and Richard to somewhere I forget. We have not seen them for like 2 or 3 episodes

Sun and Jin's entire story is incredible. What a well developed story through 6 seasons. Two truly loveable characters. I can't believe how well done and perfect that ending was for them. At first I wsan't sure if they were actually going to die then and there, and wasn't sure if it was the time or place. It went down perfectly though. It was genuinely emotional.

Sayid was tied for my favorite character at one point. He was one of the first characters I loved, and up throughout the show I always considered him one of the best.
The past season or so he has kind of taken a minimized role. He was still great, but there wasn't much going on with him.
I'm glad he ended up dying in such a heroic way. It was probably time for him to go, and since he had been "claimed" I was happy to see the old Sayid return for some final heroics.

Frank was cool. Good comic relief but not really a major, fleshed out character. I enjoyed him but at this point he was probably just taking up space story-wise.

Yea those 3 are hiking through the jungle somewhere, avoiding the smoke monster at all costs.
They're due to show back up though.

I think tonight was really the icing on the cake for MIB. For the whole season everyone's toyed with the idea that he may actually be good, but now he's responsible for setting all our main characters up to die, and in the case of 4 of them succeeding.
I highly doubt he is anything but the total baddie he has shown himself to be. Next week we'll get his "side" of the story, but even still he's not really redeemed. It's sort of like Vader. Maybe he has a more complicated backstory than just being evil incarnate, but it still doesn't change the fact that he's pure evil right now.

that was a great setup.

I had been thinking about that for a while too. I thought, if MIB is really so evil, and he can't leave with them still on the island, why can't he just kill all of them?
I chalked that up to him either not being able to kill them, or actually having good intentions. Tonight was sort of a reveal in that sense.

I can't believe there are only 3 episodes left, and it ends this month.

Sun and Jin was so very depressing.

Was sure that Jin would leave her after she would say something like "Go. Be with our daughter." but nah. Neither one mentioned their daughter, and so Jin decided to make her an orphan.

She was left with family, but yea I didn't even think of that. I guess in the very short moment they didn't think things through to that extent

The finale is going to run 2 1/2 hours, instead of 2.

Fucking lost for words right now

One good thing is that I will now have a brand new crying Jack picture to use as my msn display picture:y:

They haven't mentioned how long he's been there other than it being a very long time. Really looking forward to next weeks episode.

Coming from a long time reader here, and few time poster..

I hated to see them go, but i can deal with the loss of all 3 "Main" characters, (Main, as in original crash survivors). Ive always considered Sayid one of my top 3 faves and was glad to see him go out as a hero. Hated it for Sun and Jin too, and thought the end of their story was good other than the fact that Jin never got to meet his daughter. As someone put it, i was thinking for sure that Sun would mention that and he would go...guess not. I think all 3 of those character's stories were complete for the most part and that them dying progresses the show to where it is heading and ending...and definitely clarifies the MIB's role..

I was a fan of Frank too, and hoped he wouldn't die....i guess we dont have a pilot now...with the sub destroyed and no pilot for the plane, can't wait to see how some (if any) are gonna get off the island...

Fucking awesome episode.

- I got teary eyed with the sub evacuation.

- Love Jack lately, his new 'faith' persona suits him and is just so good to see.

- Sayid's face turn was good, but never really understood or explained his heel turn.

- It's obvious now there are going to be so many things left unanswered with regard to the earlier seasons especially.

- Even though the cull has arrived/prob will carry on, I believe they are all going to come back once the realities merge.

- Cannot wait until 'my main man' Desmond does something cool.

Hurley is gonna save the universe.









Then he is going to say "Dude."

Like the way Frank has only 5 lines all season, why even have the character? Then you kill him off without mention...Just seems like they could have had him die in the crash or something, saving the plane, and have his character go out better.

Also, I dont think they even bothered to put Frank in the Alt verse yet.

I dont think it is Widmore's intent to leave the island. He wants the island back for himself, so he doesnt care of there is no plane or sub.

Really the only people who want to leave the island right now are MiB and Sawyer.

What other earlier season mysteries do people want answered? Adam and Eve, Walt?

They kept Frank around to keep up the possibility of leaving on the plane.

Also, it seems the kind of logic akin to the story and the Island that he indeed went down with his ship (he was controlling it by gun point at least), a kind of mirror to the actual Oceanic plane crashing down, and the fake one in the ocean. Afterall he was supposed to pilot it and the pilot indeed died.

Earlier mysteries and instances I am referring to are:

The sickness
The Dharma supply drop
Henry Gale
How Yemi's plane made it all the way from Nigeria to the SP
Walt's powers
Death during birth

Then there are little things like who was on the other end of the speaker telling Jack to try the door when he was captive on Hydra Island in season 3? There are tons of these instances where no logical or accountable source can be identified.

Henry Gale? Cmon

DHARMA Supply Drop they will answer but not on the show (which is weird)

The island tends to move according to Ms. Hawking, probably how the plane ended up there.

Walt probably wont be answered due to the actor not really wanting to be on the show anymore and that he's like 7 feet tall now.

The birth thing would be a good thing to have answered

I think they sort of explained the sickness with Sayid and Claire earlier in the season and with the French team flashbacks last year.

I think some of these are...


The sickness - Pretty much dure its "the infections of MIB"
The Dharma supply drop - I would like to know this as well. Maybe the others took over all Dharma issues and Widmore kept supplies coming for his peeps?
Henry Gale - Died when brought to the Island by Jacob?
How Yemi's plane made it all the way from Nigeria to the SP - I think this will be ignored - I think they had big plans for Eko that would help with this, but with him gone it will be forgotten
Walt's powers - I want to know this as well
Death during birth - I think we will find this as like a curse from MIBs mother without going into some weird things I have herd

Yeah Henry Gale, what? - was he brought there? What happened with him and Ben and why? ....not that it's related also, but how did Ben get trapped in Rousseu's net? ....small and not to significant things, but to be included in a story that made up to bigger story and plot arcs, it's a bit of a piss take to just have them happen and not explain how.

And yeah, the explained the sickness in terms of Claire/Sayid and the French woman's type sickness, but what about the Dharma version, why there was ever a vaccine to be injected if there never was one? (according to Desmond).

If what Elouise said is true, that the Island was always moving, how would anyone know when and where to make a supply drop?

I understand some of the things I put are minimal, but its ok to forget and not bother with them now because there are bigger questions to answer and we are at this late stage, but at the time, it did matter, and for that reason, when I look at everything from a far, it just would be nice/make sense if there could at least be an answer for everything even if it's not completely clear or whatever.

There are certain mysteries that will be left, and I think should be left, so that people will continue to talk about it. Mystery is one of the biggest aspects of the show, and although the big questions need closure, I have no problem with some of it remaining.
So far most of the burning questions have been given answers. I think there'll still be some more big answers to come.

I always felt like the sickness was either a mindfuck from Dharma, or their misunderstanding of MIB's ability to claim, as we saw with Roussea's team and Sayid.
Death during birth is another mystery I'm content with being left alone. I always saw that as the island's will. The Island/Jacob or whatever brings certain people to the island, and does away with certain people. It has no need for new life being created on it's watch.

I haven't thought about the Dharma supply drop in a while. That's definitely an unsolved mystery, but I always thought it was a result of the time pocket on the planet. Remember how it took the helicopter back in time by an hour or so before it reached the island? Or how the probe Faraday sent out arrived 15 minutes later or whatever?
Same with the boat captain that had his throat slit, and washed up on shore before it actually happened on the boat.
These things were all signs to me that the Dharma supply drop was probably made at an earlier point in history, when Dharma was still alive and kicking, but didn't reach the island until 2004.

Then there are loosely solved mysteries. The numbers have had various meanings throughout the shows, and until now the last meaning was The Candidates. It's just a number pattern that continually appears in key situations, and either has spiritual meaning or coincidental meaning. Leaving it mysterious and open to discussion really seems the better option.

Ben was only supposed to be a character for a few episodes. I don't think that getting caught in the net was meant to be part of what his story became, just the initial story.

I don't see Henry Gale as a mystery at all. He was just a guy who came to the island and died. Very similar to Yemmy, or tons of other nameless characters who were there and didn't do much.
As far as how he factors into any master plan, he factored into how Ben's relationship with Jack and co. began, so in that respect he was very important. That's how you would explain him being needed. Other than that he's just another person who got stranded on the island.
What about the dozens of other people on 815? Or all of the random others, and Rosseau's team?
They're all just minor players in the larger story. There needs to be pawns

One thing I always wanted a little more backstory on is how the Dharma Initiative got founded.
We know they were there to research things, and funded by Alvar Hanso (who knew about the island through family history/The Black Rock)
But why did he want to go there and research it? How did he know it was special?

It doesn't need an explanation. It's explained enough as it is, but I'd really have liked to know more about that.

I'm hoping that next week's episode answers some of these smaller questions. MiB has been on hte island a long time, he could have witnessed a lot of this happening. The sickness for one should get an answer.

Yeah, this is something I've brought up with friends when discussing what's left to answer.

You needed to/go through the LOST experience to get more insight into all that.

Like I said, and fair enough, not big things now or compared to others, but at least we knew where and why the french arrived from.

Yinno you are right, and I do actually agree and like the idea of small mysteries remaining. I’m just always split down the middle – wanting to know and finding out, and as well as the awesomeness of knowing and figuring out there are still mysteries to uncover.

I guess it does make sense that The Island wouldn’t want new life created on their if the point of it was to bring those who are products of the outside environment into an areana of good vs will. The only other idea I had was when I was reading about Taweret, the god/statue with above Jacob’s temple – apparently she/it is the goddess of fertility, so maybe it was once an Island of new life, and I simply thought the destruction of the statue would have the reverse affect, I dunno.

Thing is with what you said about the time pocket thing, all of those instances were between the Island, and a short distance offshore, and if the Island was always moving, whenever and wherever the supply drop was sent from, it still made it from god knows where and made it in 2004 like you said.


Another thing I remember – Ben told Michael if he left the Island on a bearing of 205, he would find rescue. I thought you could only get to and from the Island using the bearing 305? Maybe they just screwed up?

I've always been curious about the ancient civilization of people on the island. I know that's how Tawaret and The Temple got there, but I've always wondered if the others are a continuation of their order, or if they're just using their temples.

When the characters were time jumping, and they were being attacked by flaming arrows, I'm pretty sure that was the ancient civilization attacking them.
Like Hanso, it's another thing that has all the explanation it really needs, but I'm just curious about.
I wouldn't be suprised if we saw them or got a few tidbits about their culture in next weeks episode. If it's going to happen, that's where it will happen.

Yeah pretty sure the people who built the statue built the Frozen wheel and its chamber, and the wells and the temple. Wall markings are in all these places of the same kind. Think they will either be the people who were first chosen or who found the island also.

And yeah, I also thought the same with regard to the people who fired the flaming arrows. Lol, just noticed that, The Flame & The Arrow dharma station.

http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/7066/lostwr.jpg

Jacob's list for Ben from the finale of Season 2.

Jack wasnt supposed to be on the list though according to Pickett in one of the first Season 3 episodes. (Pretty cool though)

Henry Gale: Dont forget he showed up on a balloon from Widmore Industries. In my mind I decided Widmore sent him on some sort of hot air balloon trek as,and, unknowingly to Mr. Gale, a way to find the Island.

Yes the Island moves, but dont forget DHARMA used the Lamp Post station to track the island and where it would show up.

Going by Richard's episode, I took the Others to have started with Richard. Jacob mentioned all the other people brought to the Island had died (that does leave open the possiblity Richard joined up with the people who were born on the Island though)

This WWE2222 post is fucking dead on

I think the flaming arrows were Widmore and his people, didnt he hear Sawyer say everyone meet at the creek?

Whoever fired those arrows is responsible for the death of Frogurt. I wouldn't want that kind of blood on my hands

Probably haunted by Frogurt popping up out of the jungle every other day for 50 something years.

I just hope next weeks episode actually sort of explains what the smoke monster is, how it came to be and all that and don't just have somebody say something like "you will now be cursed with this monster living inside of you" or something.

Like in a similar fashion to how Jacob said he could make Richard ageless without actually explaining HOW he could do that.

He did it by touching his shoulder. How much more can you get into it? Im sure they will reveal why he has the power to do that, but what else can you really say about how he does it.

Nope, it has not.

Also, there are 2 sneak peaks up at abc.com

Jacobs Crackers

I am getting the feeling Frank escaped the sub.

Also, I can't wait for a Vincent apperance

also, the next episode is going to be awesome. more history behind MIB

I read a few of the previews on the next episode and it looks to

Not really a spoiler, but I wasn't sure if some of you want to know nothing going in

We can only hope so. Frank just seems like a cool dude to hang with.

Seth Norris aka Greg Grunberg aka Matthew Parkman of Heroes aka the pilot of the first plane aka the guy the MIB killed in the first episode.

MY 2ND choice would be Sayid cause he can pretty much figure it out based on his backround. But he's dead now.

Locke is dead right now too and he would be my 3rd choice.

Then I'd go to Jack, but he can't leave the island.

yea, they are fucked.

IT was a joke, I didn't actually seriously suggest him. Although I bet MIB wishes he hadn't killed him straight away.

I don't even think they will get to use the plane or have it as a serious way of leaving/finishing the story.

I don't really get how this is possible. It's paranormal stuff. How would it be explained?
As long as they explain how he came to get those abilities, I could care less how those abilities work.

Alternate Universe Locke will fly the plane.




Then crash.

Are we even sure MIB wants to leave the island still? I'm assuming he still does, and just wanted them all dead so he could.

He has said he wants to leave when he is in his true form, and to Jacob, where he would be at his most 'revealing', so I guess it is his overall plan still, although how I am unsure. I wonder why he doesn't just turn the wheel?

It is paranormal stuff but it would be good to see the source or find out where exactly they intend to base the whole mythology from. I get that its all a combination of supernatural, paranormal, metaphysical, science, religion etc but yeah, some kind of source of origin of such a power/place/purpose would be good.

This is totally going to happen. Not he crash. But like Alt Lockes redemption to his father

Ben is totally gonna die.

Probably saving everybody in a last minute full-fledged face turn.

I kind of really want a final scene where you get this and then as they are flying away we see every single major cast member who has died looking up at them and smiling as they fly away. I hope everyone gets that last send off.

I kind of just want everyone back for that last episode.

Hope you lot are not serious. That is a TERRIBLE possibility. Alt Locke killing MIB and flying everyone back home, jesus lol.

lol

you would absolutely love this

I read Walt and Mr Eko want back in. I say write them into the finale somehow

Lindelof tweeted the other day post-production on the finale was complete.

My money is on Jacob being Alan Parrish and MiB being Van Pelt. This is all just Walts imagination running wild while playing Jumanji. You heard it here first.

He flies them home on his back.

lol amazing. All because Jack healed Locke's spine. book it

Jack and Sawyer as the new Jacob and MiB. They have set Sawyer up perfectly for this....

1) Sawyer crashes onto the island along with 815ers
2) His raft explodes
3) His helicopter is leaking fuel and he has to jump off
4) His plan to get people off the island results in killing Sayid, Jin, Sun, and Frank
5) When he finally found a home on the island (in DHARMA), Juliet ends up dying and he gets transported to 2007.

I think more than almost anyone, the Island has been pretty shitty to Sawyer, no matter how hard he tries.

On top of it, his biggest advesary throughout the whole show Jack, is now trying to keep him from leaving the island.

It would be pretty awesome to see Locke fly everyone home on his back like that dog from Neverending Tale

But at more than one point Sawyer didn't care or he wanted to stay.

He got on the raft because he supposedly wanted to either be a hero or die, and he said himself he is no hero. Yet from Season 4 onwards he has grown and proven time and time again he is a hero.

He only really wants to leave because of Juliet and the pain he feels. I'm sure if he knew and realised as much as Jack and Locke did, he would stay.

Probably won't find it in this thread, but surely another, but ever since Flashes Before Your Eyes, season 3, I have said and always thought Desmond was/is the key to solving and finishing the story/task. But then everyone has their part and significance to the story.

If he can launch mortar strikes at them whys he wasting time with arrows

So who exactly is MIB allowed to kill and not kill, is it just candidates he isn't allowed kill or what?

He means in the 50's when Widmore was there with Elouise and Richard. Still they had guns then so I doubt it.

And I think he shouted to meet at the creek at a different point but I could be wrong.

It seems as though he cannot kill them by himself alone, rather through means of deception and courses of coincidence and choices of those people.

But then he is now on a war path intend on finishing what he started, so I don't know how he is going to go about that.

I think he has already broken the rules anyway.

According to Lostpedia, the arrow attack happend in 1954. I was always under the impression that it was ancient times, and the arrows were coming from the civilization.
I guess it was The Others though, if that information is correct. 1954 was the time period with Jughead.

Still, we know there was an ancient group of people.

Fuckin idiots using flaming arrows if they had guns. The Others were prob on a budget.

Surely hes killed loads of people on his own in his smokey form?

Or do you mean he can't kill candidates alone?

Yeah he can't flat out murder of kill a candidate of his own power and being. He has to rather trick them, put them in a situation where people's true fears, faiths and nature come to surface, and because he believes every man's very nature is to sin and corrupt, he bases his plans and methods of elimination on the people to make it actually happen. Or he manipulates them in the form of people they know who have died, as we are fully aware of. The bastard.

And yeah, he's killed tons of people in his true form.

Yep :'(

He died with honour, integrity, courage and a really cool inscribed Jesus stick.

If this doesn't end with Jack as the new Jacob I will be very surprised.

I know I'm owed a fiver (British slang for five English pounds) from a mate who only watched season one where he met Locke's character was gonna turn out to be a creepy pervert who would commit at least one rape on the show.