oh nevermind, I got it now. Sawyer says "I killed them, didn't I. had to listen to it like 6 times

'I killed them didn't I?'

'No. He did'

Hope we get more crappy CGI underwater island to be honest. Also it's not gonna be like Jack and Sawyer are new Jacob/MIB or any combo of that really. You know why? Cause that's too fucking obvious. As lame as lost has been lately, and as much as I hate it right now. They will definitely do something different than what you expect. Unless of course "you" are that asshole know it all nerd elitist friend who will obviously get like 10% of the finale correct and therefore have gotten 100% correct, cause 10% is close enough. Still waiting for my Vincent flashback episode.

Why does someone need to replace MiB/Smocke?

The way I see it, MiB/Smocke is ended/killed/trapped by whatever means which means we don't need a replacement Jacob or Mib/Smocke isn't ended/killed/trapped and we only need a replacement Jacob - not a replacement MiB.

In that scenario it'd come down to Jack and "Locke" - the 2 men that have had oppsosite ideologies throughout the show.

Jack and Sawyer are looking old.

lol smocke

Carlton Cuse is on the Bill Simmons report on espn.com if anyone cares

Yea I thought the last episode pretty much hammered home the fact that the smoke monster was a unique occurence, and not a role to be filled like Jacob.
He's apparently the result of touching the forbidden fruit. A cursed figure. I don't think he was filling a role, or has intentions of having his role filled.

Jacob seems to be next in a line of guardians, preceded by mother and possibly relieved by one of the characters.
I have come to terms with the fact that explaining where his powers, or mother's powers come from, just serves to raise more questions. That's the mythology of it. Allow it. How is God "God"? What's the point in trying to explain that in detail?
I will admit I am curious about what the exact specifications of their powers are, or what happens at every unaddressed point in time, but that's natural.
I sort of expected to see Jacob react to Smokey's birth, and touch on that a bit. But that is just something that occurs offscreen. The metaphsyical aspect of the show is perfectly okay with me. There is no way of logically explaining the smoke monster, or Jacob's godly powers, and any of the islands properities without writing a fictional science book. They just have to say "this is that." I'm happy with that. We saw where The Smoke Monster came from, and understand his motives.
All that matters is that those characters have been given their backstory. We know how MIB became The Smoke Monster, and how Jacob became the Guardian. We have a loose understanding of the island that will likely get some more "light" shed on it.

Remember when George Lucas gave us a biological explanation of how the force works? Everyone hated it. A little mystery and fictional faith is good.

Also, I love the fact that they haven't given the MIB/Smoke Monster a name.

could care less about the outrigger chase. What's the big deal with that? It's just a cool overlap in the time loop. It'll be fun to speculate on who was involved, but if it didn't effect what is occuring in the timeline now, it obviously didn't have major consequences.

I was loving last weeks episode, and then the Smoke Monster transformation seemed abrupt and underscored. I thought about it for a while, and realized it was right the way it was. That's how it should be, really. What would a 10 minute powerpoint by Jacob explaining his powers do? The problem with things that get as big and involving as Lost, is that everyone's got their visions and opinions of how things should be. Expectations become mythical in status.

I want to go back and watch the episode again this weekend too. I need to re-listen to the stuff Mother says about the cave of light, and how that relates to Jacob's explanation of the island as a cork in a bottle.

Not to raise expectations, but this week's episode is supposed to be pretty awesome according to early reviews from people who went to whatever event they had last week with the composer for Lost.

You cant explain powers like that. I dont know how one could even do it. There always has to be some mystery to the supernatural or else it just devalues it.

I'm in a good position though, because all along I've sort of purged myself of questions. I watch avidly to find out what's going to happen, but early on I taught myself that I was in it for the ride, and the characters/mythology, not the prize.
I probably got to be that way in the second or third season really. I really haven't been anything but pleased with what they deliver.
I'm glad I'm not as concerned with theories and everything fitting. I feel as though at this point, I've gotten what I wanted from that. I never had a real opinion on what I wanted everything to be anyways, I just wanted more Lost.

I've learned to expect quality, and not much more than that. I have things I'd like to see happen, and wouldn't like to see happen naturally, but as long as the story is given justice and they do good by what they have done for the past 6 years, that's fine with me.

I'm glad to hear that they've made a conscious effort to put the mythology stuff to rest at this stage, and focus in on the characters and current plot for the finale.
The mythology and mystery has been given plenty of answers, I feel. I am good with most of it. I like that some of it can be talked about for ages. That's what makes mystery and mythology compelling.
It's the characters and story that needs resolution, not the exposition.

One thing I can't help but "expect" is more resolution for the real Locke. I don't want to go in focusing on that happening, because it may not. And maybe it shouldn't. I will have to see how the story unfolds, and how it all fits in the end before I can judge that. I just can't help but have the desire and suspicion that he's coming back. I don't want to hinge my enjoyment of anything on that though, since it very well could fit into a plan we haven't seen unfold yet.
We shall see.

:y: well said The mythology means nothing if I didnt care for the characters so much

I've thought it's been awesome how they've managed to continually attach more and more meaning to "the numbers" without giving a flat out explanation or reason for them. They're just a meaningful pattern of numbers that arise in key situations of the show, and it's meaning is open to coincidence vs fate.
I thought having it ultimately culminate as the candidates was a huge payoff.

Agreed, especially that I thought we were done with the numbers headed into the season.

It also ties in really well with the Valenzetti Equation about saving the world, which is what we were told they originally were (through the Lost Experience)

Screw this "Lost Experience". If it isn't in the show then it is irrelevant to me.

Ok

You're supposed to say "Thanks for your take".

Thanks for your take

I hope we hear Hollywood and Vines in the finale

Na Dharmacide, Locke of the Island or Desperate Desmond.

pregaming

VERY EXCITED for tonight's ep.

Desmond is one of my top 3 characters and I cannot wait until him and Jack have a lil catch up. Not that I fully expect this to happen.

Jacob's a fucking heel. I know it.

I don't want to see such a twist tbh.

nah, I think we're safe as this episode progresses.

Jack Shepard

"I'll Do It" :love:

Awesome awesome episode.

Question- MIB's main goal is to get off the island, but now Jacob is saying that they must protect The Light from him.
I know he looked for the light for years, but why would he be trying to find it? Doesn't he just want to leave?

Maybe he needs to go back into the tunnel to leave?

Or at least into the light the same way?

I am pissed with the way characters are just going out without fully learning about them. grrrrr.

I thought he just wanted to flat out leave the Island, but maybe that was his way of trying to kill the candidates?
Like I said, I'm a bit unclear right now as to whether he wants to leave the island or steal the light. It seems as though those are two different things, and it's really a matter of what's at stake

Maybe Jacob just meant they need to protect the light from him in case he wants to use it?

Well after last week I truly feel he thinks of the light as his way off the island, expecially after going into it. He has to Kill Jacob and stop the candidates so that no one is protecting the light.

The Plane/Sub was just a way to get everyone together to be killed.

IMHO

but he also wants to destroy the Island now? Although that sounds like more of a reaction to what Whidmore told him.

Also, MIB recruited Ben by promising him he could have the Island once he was gone. Then he tells Ben flat out that he wants to destroy the island now.
Sweet deal...

I need to rewatch the episode, because I'm pretty confused on what the fuck MIB's motive is right now. The antagonists overall motive is a pretty important thing

I think the game changed when widmore said something to smock

well tonight's episode confirmed that MIB going into the tunnel is where the smoke monster originated. so that answers that.

Jeri, like Hanso was kind of saiyng, I think maybe MIB/Smoke/Locke has to go back into the tunnel to get his release if you want to call it that. But now he wants to destroy everything anyway.

So now my question is what or who was the mother protecting the light from in the first place because there was no Smoke Monster. Was thier some other "evil?" ugh


Can't wait for Desmond's plan to come to fruition

The other evil is Vincent.

When is it shown for you fuckers in U.S?

What episode are you on over there?

the final episode is Sunday

So we are like 2 weeks behind in the U.K?

Fuck, I need torrents.

I think it was just protecting it from anyone. That includes the ancients, Dharma, and of course the MIB.
MIB became the monster, but he wasn't really a threat until he killed Jacob. He couldn't hurt Jacob and Jacob was there to protect against him.

What a horrible ending for Richard

Amazing episode. Loved Ben and Desmond throughout.

So like, did Richard die or what?

I don't think Richard is dead. Jack will probably release him from his "life forever" thing in the finale.

What I want to know is where Miles got off to. Thought he went into the closet with Widmore.

Miles "took his chances running through the jungle". I wonder what part he's going to play in the finale, seems kind of like the odd one out in all of this.

Ben shooting Widmore gave me a throbbing erection

"He doesn't get to save his daughter."

Im glad they wrapped up the Ben-Widmore storyline like they did. Ben absolutely took advantage of the situation in (Michael Cole alert) VINTAGE Ben fashion.

You might be, but we're not.

The ep shown in the US on a Tuesday night is shown a Friday, so last's night episode will be on this coming Friday. The finale is on Sunday in the US and will be shown on the usual Friday slot over here.

All in all, the UK has been 3 days behind the entire series.

So we found out why Kate's (and Claire's for that matter) name was crossed out.

Also that Jin was the remaining candidate which in turn is probably why Sun didnt flash back till the 70's with the Ajira people.

My take on Ben's comment regarding summoning the smoke monster ("I realized he was summoning me"): I think by summoning the monster, you are doing exactly as he wants: Kill people, destroy, etc. etc.

This goes back to my theory that MiB came to the ancients on the Island as a God and had them build these temples. He manipulated them into doing exactly what Jacob was hoping they wouldnt.

The ancients were the ones who built the statue, as well as the chamber that housed the frozen wheel, also the underground chamber where MIB 'judged' Ben. There are hieroglyphs that show they worshipped smokey like a god.

Yes I know. I shouldnt have called it my theory, but this is what I mean. Basically Smokey used them to do his bidding.

Richard cant die no matter what right? Like he cant be murdered?

thats what I am thinking. He will show up to save the day...maybe miles helps him...and then he will be wrapped up. IF thye dont mention his death I assume he is alive.

I wish we could have learned more about Widmore before he went.

What's the deal with the alt-timeline concert anyway? Seems they will all be there, except Sawyer and Miles but including Dogen of all people.

This is incredible

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I got a feeling Desmond will make a call to Sawyer and Miles regarding Kate and Sayid's whereabouts at the concert and that's how they will make it there.

Also, let's not forget Juliet will be there!!

Care to refresh me why Juliet will be there?

The general theory going around is that Juliet is going to be the mother of David (Jacks Son)

Aha, I was wondering if they will reveal the mom to be someone from the actual island storyline and Juliet makes perfect sense.

I'm kinda interested because Miles 'spoke' to her and she told him it worked, the bomb. Just makes me think she is special like Desmond kinda, but they prob won't go that way regardless.

They got something like 1.5 hours of tv time at max, and I doubt they will pull in so much detail in there.

I know.

I'm not going to judge until the end, but I don't see it ending on too many explanations, I dunno we'll see soon enough I guess.

Anyone got a good site for the episodes in DIVX?? I need one that puts it up as soon as it has aired - I got two, but one of them doesn't seem to update it till several days later and the other doesn't work on my mac for some reason.

Miles said he will be there....His dad works at the museum with Charlotte. SDawyaer will go with Miles or to see Charlotte.

Daniel Faraday and Jacks son are playing there. Jack will bring Claire.

Penny will be a guest with perhaps charlie also playing.

Kate, Sayid, Hurley and Desmond will be there.

The question is, how do the Kwons, Locke and Ben fit in.

and charlie

Well Charlie was supposed to be playing with Daniel that night, maybe he will show up.

So I'm a bit more clear on MIB's endgame. His primary goal has been to get off the island all along. He's like a prisoner there.
Killing MIB was for revenge, and so he could get away.
Obviously...bear with me.

But then he had to kill the candidates to be free, so he cooked up the plane/sub idea. I think it's safe to say that was never an option, since if he could sneak off so easily he'd have done it.
He just wanted to kill them.

So he wants to leave, plain and simple. I assume that Jacob's line about them having to protect the light from them is either a secondary thing, or part of how he intends to actually leave the island.
That's what caused confusion a bit. I figured "wait, if he's trying to leave why the hell is Jacob worried about them protecting the light from him. Wouldn't they just have to keep him there?" I guess it's a bit of both.

Either way, I think now that he realizes Jacob/Whidmore/The Candidates have something up their sleeve to keep him from leaving, he's had it and just wants to destroy the whole fucking place to spite everyone and gain his "freedom" that way.

Don't forget about Christian's body. I don't think having it be misplaced by the airline was for nothing, and they finally brought that back up last night. They called Jack to tell him it had been found.

No they didnt.....Desmond did....

Oh yea. So there you go

I was thinking about how Locke will get to the concert; it's a bit of a shit way to have it, but isn't the concert THAT night? like a few hours forward from the point we left everyone at? are they really going to have it where Locke has a life changing operation, and have him able to work pass any kind of rehab and walk straight away? seems to me they shoulda just had Jack operate earlier on in the season.

If they don't do it that way, I can see Jin and Sun and Locke not being present at the concert because they are dead. But then again so is Sayid and he will be there so I dunno.

They will be there. Also, I'm sure this was all planned out well before the season started so I wouldn't start second-guessing the decision to have Locke not operated on yet

Yeah but Jin, Sun and Locke were candidates, the other were not. I can see being a candidate more of an important factor for whatever happens.

Think it's a bit of a cop out as well having just Hurley be the one who suddenly recalls everything way before 'whatever happens'. He coulda just done the favor for Desmond knowing it's important and pivotal to remembering and have whatever is going to happen, happen. Guess I'm nip picking again. But still.

That was funny. "Oh hey Ana Lucia..oh wait, I don't know you"

Obviously Desmond has filled Hurley in 100% on what's going on, and he either shared information or he's become enlightened too.

Yeah fair enough, but still. Having a life changing back operation, then a few hours later attending a concert, just seems like a wrong way to go about it imo.

I don't know why it would have to do with candidates. There's been no indication of that. Everyone is involved, whether they're living, dead, or a candidate in the original timeline. It's been that way since the first episode of the season.

There's nothing to indicate that will happen.

Because they were chosen to come to the Island, and have played a much bigger part in the story and mythology. You are right, its just if were discussing where they will all be and why, there have to be ideas for who will be there and who won't if that is the case. I'm sure it will involve all of them, but still.

I didn't say there was, I'm just exploring all/different scenarios or outcomes. I don't know what will happen so I'm just exploring such things.

Since the operation hasn't occured yet, and the concert is that night, I think it's safe to assume it's not going to happen.
Unless their office meeting was earlier in the timeline than the events with Hurley/Desmond/Jake/Sayid.

I think it has more to do with all of the "players" from the island, the overall meaning of it.
A big question is whether or not Jacob and MIB have any presence in that timeline.

Yeah guys, you really think he walks into Jacks office and is going to get an OR in a major LA hospital that day?

No, that is my point. And it's not that I think it will happen or there is any real suggestion to it - I think I never and will never truly come to terms with the fact John Locke didn't turn out the way I had hoped and so I look for ways where he can and still will be back alive and save the Island. Jack is the next best thing. I just miss the original character of John Locke.

So what is it? what is it that we will think will happen when all these people come together? - will that be the 'real' timeline/reality in the end? how will that work? Are they all going to be transported or an actual reality merge occur? my mind is frying itself right now.

Not really. At the beginning of the season we saw The Island at the bottom of the ocean.
It was complete with the Dharma barracks, and the Statue foot.
Things existed normally on that island at one time. Jacob, MIB, and Richard all date back to before those times.

Hmmmmm, interesting, since The Island itself is present, so why shouldn't they be in some form or another? - Maybe it's a representation of a reality where Jacob/good/light succeeds - fair few people are better off in that reality than prior to the crash. OR one where MIB succeeded in destroying the Island, I don't even know where I'm going with this...

Jacob has and therefore could leave the Island again.

I haven't really bothered speculating on what will happen with the alternate universe, because there's no way of knowing. Short of spoilers, there's very little speculation to be made other than knowing "something will happen" and paying attention to what's been indicated.
I can't really guess beyond that, because I have 0 clue.
I think it's interesting, and even though I have no idea what will happen I have faith in the writing that it will matter.
Lindelof has said that in the end it will be clear why it was done. We'll see, but basically I trust them.

Maybe Jacob will be "the conductor" at the concert

With regard to the Island at the bottom of the sea, this is all I can come up with:

- It was the result of jughead/pocket being secured.
- MIB 'destroyed it'/got off in another fashion/won and it 'died' and sank
- It didn't need protecting anymore/the life force/entity of the Island 'moved on'.
- Hurley dropped a bomb of his own and didn't stop flushing.

I just want to know why the went to 1974 through 1977 really

lol

I would also like to see the original Henry Gale as a doorman or something.

It was always destined to happen. It was key to the events of both timelines, so I'm assuming it was all part of the plan.

THe season will end with Jack taking the light, and spreading it out throughout the souls of all the losties in the alt timeline, as they will open a gateway once they all come together and remember. MIB iwll then lose, and Desmond will destory the island, killing all originals. but they are saved through the alt timeline,

MIB should be mopping the floors bitching about how he wants to go home

Well Sawyer, Faraday, Miles and Juliet were stuck there when Locke made it back to the real world and put the wheel back on it's axis. From the time Jack and co had made it back to when Locke approached them, 3 years had gone. Although it's been said time behaves differently on the Island, it appears the same amount of time went by there also.

77' was when they shot back to the present, detonating the bomb. That make sense?