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Droford 01-25-2013 12:29 AM

Andrew Rickli @THE_REAL_RICKLI

Jurrjens ERA against AL since 2010? BAL 0.00 (CG 1 hit), BOS 1.17, HOU 1.23, TEX 1.69, TOR 3.00. @masnRoch @masnSteve #orioles

RoXer 01-25-2013 02:09 AM

Didn't know the Dodgers picked up Skip Schumaker. Good move, I like him.

screech 01-25-2013 02:43 AM

Great baseball name.

Boomer 01-25-2013 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damian Rey (Post 4096179)
Why? BJ Upton is essentially Michael Bourne, except he hits for power and has a better arm.

I don't know who should move to left, but using gold gloves as a basis of figuring it out is silly.

I don't think it's silly if it was deserved. And why make the incumbent move when he has been used to playing that side of the field for three years now? Justin has already said he was fine moving to left, so it's a moot point.

Boomer 01-25-2013 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith (Post 4096156)
They do have a good outfield, but if I was an Atlanta Braves fan, I would've preferred Justin Upton, Jason Heyward and Michael Bourne.

But ATL will be just fine.

Bourn goes somewhere else -> Braves should get a compensation pick. Coming back for one year (which is all the Braves could afford him) and probably losing that pick doesn't make sense. Braves' dealing Prado to free up cap space and then getting a deal on Justin Upton means Braves still have a similar amount of money to spend but are a better team because of it.

I'm hoping they aren't done, because they need a better third baseman, or some decent bench bats.

Evil Vito 01-25-2013 08:17 AM

<font color=goldenrod>The Mets are still appealing having to give up their first round pick for Bourn. I do see their point. They had the 10th worst record in baseball and should have had the 10th pick...and only the Pirates' failure to sign their first round pick last year bumped the Mets to 11th. The union had already said they will support the Mets in their argument.

But the new CBA just says the first 10 picks are protected, not the 10 teams with the worst records. If MLB supports the Mets on this, it will create a precedent that will drive up costs on certain players since teams with unprotected picks could now potentially get the rule vetoed in certain situations. Hard to imagine the owners want to create a situation where costs will be even higher.

MLB also said they won't even make a ruling until the Mets agree to sign Bourn. So the Mets will have to take a HUGE risk in signing Bourn and then potentially the protected pick thing falls through.

I'm at the point where I just want them to sign Bourn for 3 years and be done with it. You only have Strasburgs and Harpers in the draft every so often. Nobody they could take at #11 would be a lock to be a start anyway.</font>

Damian Rey 01-25-2013 09:06 AM

I have zero issue with either moving to left, but just feel that gold gloves are not a legitimate argument. Both are considered good defensive players, so regardless, it's a win.

Keith, there's no way, and I mean NO WAY BJ Upton would have remained in Tampa. None. They knew it, he knew it. Desmond Jennings will do fine in CF with Joyce eventually Myers flanking him.

Boomer 01-25-2013 10:29 AM

Well I've seen a lot of people cite current fielding statistics as misleading, so I'm not sure what you want me to say. Like plenty of other awards in sports and elsewhere, Gold Gloves only lose their muster because people who occasionally don't deserve them get them anyway. I don't think Heyward is one of those people - from me watching over 100 Braves games last year, he was damn good - much improved over his first two seasons.

Droford 01-25-2013 02:47 PM

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BBZ1tccCEAEQvMz.jpg

Keith 01-26-2013 12:02 AM

So Brian Cashman says it's possible ARod will miss the entire season.

Wow.

screech 01-26-2013 01:30 AM

Why didn't he have his surgery right after the season, anyway?

SlickyTrickyDamon 01-26-2013 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith (Post 4096963)
So Brian Cashman says it's possible ARod will miss the entire season.

Wow.

Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes!

Keith 01-26-2013 09:59 AM

The Yankees are just going to hand -out over $20million to ARod and he might not even have an at-bat this season.

LOL geez, what a bad contract.

Damian Rey 01-26-2013 10:38 AM

The Yankees aren't idiots. I'm sure Arod's contract is insured, which means, after filing a claim, the Yankees aren't stuck wasting the money on a lost year while Rodriguez gets paid.

YOUR Hero 01-26-2013 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by screech (Post 4097051)
Why didn't he have his surgery right after the season, anyway?

The reports say he had to condition it some first before having the surgery.

Emperor Smeat 01-26-2013 06:57 PM

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p>OFFICIAL: @<a href="https://twitter.com/cubs">cubs</a>, RHP Carlos Villanueva have agreed to terms on 2-year deal.</p>&mdash; MLB (@MLB) <a href="https://twitter.com/MLB/status/295298887374229504">January 26, 2013</a></blockquote>
<script async src="//platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

RP 01-27-2013 06:25 AM

w/e

Bad News Gertner 01-27-2013 11:17 AM

Prey to God he doesn't start

YOUR Hero 01-27-2013 11:58 AM

He wasn't terrible (always)

Bad News Gertner 01-27-2013 01:50 PM

If you enjoy your pitcher giving up multiple home runs a game, you'll love Carlos V!

Evil Vito 01-27-2013 02:54 PM

<font color=goldenrod>Mets may bring Jon Rauch back for another year.

I'd be fine with it. Rauch was actually way better than expected last year.</font>

Frank Drebin 01-28-2013 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RP (Post 4098309)
w/e

That is your reaction to everything the Cubs have done, RP. C'mon, what do you expect outta this offseason? Trade Brett Jackson straight up for Clayton Kershaw? I know, it would take way more than that to pry Brett Jackson away, but...just...c'mon.

If you are the GM, what do you do?

Skippord 01-29-2013 03:03 AM

God I wish the Cubs could trade Brett Jackson for Clayton Kershaw

Evil Vito 01-29-2013 12:52 PM

Mets sign Scott Atchison to a minor league deal with a ST invite. Looking at his stats, I'd say he's got a very god chance at making the team.

Keith 01-29-2013 01:29 PM

So A-Rod, Gio Gonzalez, Nelson Cruz, Melky Cabrera and Bartolo Colon, among others, showed up as customers for this clinic in South Florida whose owners are now under State and Federal Investigation for distributing PED's.


http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=8893588

ClockShot 01-29-2013 01:34 PM

Nick Johnson retires.

Steady Freddy Garcia goes to San Diego. 1-year, $1.3 mil. minor league deal

Softbank Hawks release Hideki Okajima. He wants to come back and play in the MLB.

Emperor Smeat 01-29-2013 02:43 PM

MLB and the Dodgers might be clashing soon over the new Dodgers tv network because of how the Dodgers are trying to weasel out of more revenue sharing requirements.

MLB already gave them a special discount as part of the deal for the new owners but the Dodgers found more ways to drop the required payments which is something MLB implied they are not to do.

http://espn.go.com/los-angeles/mlb/s...k-sportsnet-la

ClockShot 01-29-2013 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith (Post 4101990)
So A-Rod, Gio Gonzalez, Nelson Cruz, Melky Cabrera and Bartolo Colon, among others, showed up as customers for this clinic in South Florida whose owners are now under State and Federal Investigation for distributing PED's.


http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=8893588


Yankees are thinking about working on voiding A-Rod's contract. But they already said they're gonna sit tight and wait until MLB does their investigation before they make a move.

McLegend 01-29-2013 06:48 PM

I love every A-Rod story.

Keith 01-29-2013 06:58 PM

I see no way A-Rod is able to go back to the Bronx after this. As detailed as the information we saw today, I doubt these Bosch's are making this up.

It coincides with A-Rod coming back after hip surgery in '09, hitting 30 homers, and for once in his life having a good postseason, helping the Yankees win the World Series.

The Condor 01-29-2013 07:40 PM

A-Rod has that self-destruct mechanism built into his brain. Also, he is has a universal hatred gene that sets off everyone including 75% of Yankees fans. I hope NYY lawyers can find a way to get out of this.

screech 01-30-2013 03:24 AM

A-Rod is pretty easy to hate. Might be the purple lips in the playoffs. Why won't he share his drink????

SlickyTrickyDamon 01-30-2013 03:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazy Edgar (Post 4102179)
A-Rod has that self-destruct mechanism built into his brain. Also, he is has a universal hatred gene that sets off everyone including 75% of Yankees fans. I hope NYY lawyers can find a way to get out of this.

Fuck em.

The Condor 01-30-2013 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by screech (Post 4102490)
A-Rod is pretty easy to hate. Might be the purple lips in the playoffs. Why won't he share his drink????

Went to the stadium a few years back and two drunken fellas behind us started talking about his purple lips when his pic came up on the big screen. Their answer: Derek Jeter slathers purple icing on his dick after the games and A-Rod has to clean it. Thus, my friends and I decided that the MVP of every game would receive the Purple Icing award and A-Rod would service him. I'm glad you mentioned that and allowed me to tell that stupid, " you had to be there" story.

Evil Vito 01-30-2013 10:24 AM

I hope the Yankees can't get out of his contract. Watching them trying to stay within the luxury tax threshold while carrying A-Rod's contract would be entertaining.

Innovator 01-30-2013 10:27 AM

I hope the Mets pick him up after the Yankees dump him.

RP 01-30-2013 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank Drebin (Post 4100936)
That is your reaction to everything the Cubs have done, RP. C'mon, what do you expect outta this offseason? Trade Brett Jackson straight up for Clayton Kershaw? I know, it would take way more than that to pry Brett Jackson away, but...just...c'mon.

If you are the GM, what do you do?

What the hell? I would trade Brett Jackson for a bag of Taco Bell right now if i was the GM. He's worthless. I've seen enough of him and Vitters. I dont need to see much more. Everyone acts like hes being blocked by Dejesus. Dejesus is a pretty damn good CF that doesnt get enough props. He's the type of guy that will be a staple of a championship squad. Like Victorino during Phillies run or Eckstein during Los Angeles run. Brett Jackson had his chance and he stunk badly. And he already had issues with strike outs in the minors.

RP 01-30-2013 10:30 AM

I would trade Brett Jackson for owenbrowns dirty underwear.

Keith 01-30-2013 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Innovator (Post 4102676)
I hope the Mets pick him up after the Yankees dump him.

If Omar Minaya was still Mets GM, that would happen, actually.

Frank Drebin 01-30-2013 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RP (Post 4102677)
What the hell? I would trade Brett Jackson for a bag of Taco Bell right now if i was the GM. He's worthless. I've seen enough of him and Vitters. I dont need to see much more. Everyone acts like hes being blocked by Dejesus. Dejesus is a pretty damn good CF that doesnt get enough props. He's the type of guy that will be a staple of a championship squad. Like Victorino during Phillies run or Eckstein during Los Angeles run. Brett Jackson had his chance and he stunk badly. And he already had issues with strike outs in the minors.

I was being sarcastic about Jackson. Also love how you hate the kid who got called up and had a shitty half season. Would you have cut Rizzo, too?

You never answered my question, silly goose.

Evil Vito 01-30-2013 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keith (Post 4102680)
If Omar Minaya was still Mets GM, that would happen, actually.

I remember when A-Rod was first hitting free agency in 2007, some Mets fans were calling for the Mets to sign A-Rod and move Reyes to 2B :o thank fuck Omat wasn't THAT stupid.

RP 01-30-2013 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank Drebin (Post 4102693)
I was being sarcastic about Jackson. Also love how you hate the kid who got called up and had a shitty half season. Would you have cut Rizzo, too?

You never answered my question, silly goose.

Comparing Rizzo as a prospect to Jackson as prospect is ridiculous. It's not even close.

Keith 01-30-2013 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vito Cruz (Post 4102714)
I remember when A-Rod was first hitting free agency in 2007, some Mets fans were calling for the Mets to sign A-Rod and move Reyes to 2B :o thank fuck Omat wasn't THAT stupid.

I'm sure Omar at least made a call to Alex or his agent. Omar was signing every latino that hit the free agent market.

If he signed Miguel Cairo and Endy Chavez, I'm sure he tried to get A-Rod.

Frank Drebin 01-30-2013 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RP (Post 4102715)
Comparing Rizzo as a prospect to Jackson as prospect is ridiculous. It's not even close.

That's not what I'm doing.....Trying to show you the hole in your logic.

RP 01-31-2013 12:00 PM

I understand and maybe i'm overstating my argument a bit here, so i'll pull back a bit, but IMO, Brett Jackson wont amount to much. I rather have Dejesus.

Frank Drebin 01-31-2013 01:26 PM

Dejesus is the better player now, sure. Jackson will be in AAA when the season starts, anyway.

I'm just trying to figure out what you want them to do in order for them to contend sooner because you don't seem to think anything they are doing is worthwhile.

RP 01-31-2013 01:39 PM

Josh Hamilton would have been a really good gamble. Especially at the price he got. Dejesus, Castro, Hamilton, Rizzo would be a sick top of the lineup.

Emperor Smeat 01-31-2013 04:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ESPN
The Arizona Diamondbacks have agreed to a $40 million, four-year contract with Martin Prado just a week after acquiring the former All-Star infielder in a trade that sent Justin Upton to Atlanta.


ClockShot 01-31-2013 04:10 PM

So much for next year's plan b.

DaveWadding 01-31-2013 04:55 PM

so we got an extra year of a lesser player. Way to go, Towers.

Keith 01-31-2013 05:03 PM

Mark Grace is sentenced to 4 months in jail for a DUI

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-bi...3802--mlb.html

Evil Vito 01-31-2013 07:30 PM

<font color=goldenrod>Mets bring in LaTroy Hawkins on a minor league deal. I've always been conditioned to think he's terrible...yet looking at his numbers he's been deceptively good the last few years.

So assuming health and the minor league invitees coming through, their bullpen right now is: Francisco, Parnell, Edgin, Feliciano, Atchison, Hawkins, and a long man. That's actually got potential. Still hoping they manage to grab Brian Wilson or somebody though.</font>

Triple Naitch 01-31-2013 07:39 PM

I got to meet LaTroy "Your Boy" Hawkins at the last WBC. He was beyond awesome and I've been rooting for him ever since.

Skippord 01-31-2013 08:18 PM

I also root for LaTroy Hawkins

Frank Drebin 01-31-2013 09:46 PM

Fans in Chicago hated him. Never figured out why other than he sucked as a closer. No one boo'd Mel Rojas.

Sad to hear about Grace. My favorite Cub as a kid. :(

Boomer 01-31-2013 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveWadding (Post 4103776)
so we got an extra year of a lesser player. Way to go, Towers.

I think you vastly undervalue Prado. Braves fans think he is a steal at that price, and we would have signed him to that in a heartbeat if we had had the cash. He doesn't hit for much power, but he's a plus defender at any position not in the battery, he hits for a great average and is a fan favorite and a clubhouse guy. And third is currently a hot commodity in the MLB. A lot of teams have some shitty third basemen these days - the Braves now included.

I think Braves' fans are prone to overvalue him (myself included), but Prado is one of the best 2-hole hitters I've ever had the pleasure of watching. He was such a table-setter for the offense, and I'm not sure who is going to do that for the Braves now.

DaveWadding 01-31-2013 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boomer (Post 4104082)
I think you vastly undervalue Prado. Braves fans think he is a steal at that price, and we would have signed him to that in a heartbeat if we had had the cash.

4/40 is too much for Prado, but you just took on Upton's 3 years and 38 mil deal. Don't have the cash. Mmkay.

Keith 01-31-2013 10:18 PM

Yankees sign Matt Diaz and Juan Rivera.

Triple Naitch 01-31-2013 10:26 PM

Rickie Weeks, Brian Roberts, Chris Young, Michael Young, and Vernon Wells are all making more than Prado next year. I'd take him over all of them.

You're just still butt hurt that your local team traded your favorite player, even though he hasn't yet lived up to his hype/potential.

Droford 01-31-2013 11:11 PM

Hey now, Brian Roberts might actually play this year. Its a contract year after all, lol.

DaveWadding 01-31-2013 11:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Triple Naitch (Post 4104105)
Rickie Weeks, Brian Roberts, Chris Young, Michael Young, and Vernon Wells are all making more than Prado next year. I'd take him over all of them.

You're just still butt hurt that your local team traded your favorite player, even though he hasn't yet lived up to his hype/potential.

You can not try and tell me that Justin Upton is a lesser player than Marteen Prado. you can't. I can't see the logic in it. at all.

Triple Naitch 01-31-2013 11:39 PM

I never said he was, but things were not working for him in Arizona. He just was not fitting in with that team.

DaveWadding 01-31-2013 11:43 PM

Justin Upton is 25, 3 years remaining on his contract at $38.5 million.

Martin Prado is 29, with 4 years on a deal at 40 million.

Would you rather have Justin Upton from 25-28 (typically the prime years of a hitter), or Martin Prado from 29-33 (when the downside sets in typically)?? Come the fuck on.

DaveWadding 01-31-2013 11:44 PM

I cannot wait until Upton starts cranking out MVP seasons.

Triple Naitch 01-31-2013 11:49 PM

Wasn't he supposed to be doing that already? What happened to the greatest pure prospect since Ken Griffey?

DaveWadding 01-31-2013 11:52 PM

I dont believe any of the shit they say about prospects until I see that shit. Also, pushing him up to the big leagues at 19 probably stunted his growth. Could have used another year or 2 in the minors. Still has Top 5 MVP finish.

Triple Naitch 02-01-2013 12:02 AM

I don't believe MVP potential til I see it either. :p

Shannon Stewart has a Top 5 MVP finish too.

DaveWadding 02-01-2013 12:25 AM

I went and looked that up. I can hardly fucking believe my eyes.

RoXer 02-01-2013 12:35 AM

WHO CARES MORE TIME FOR PARRA TO SHINE SHUT UP

Skippord 02-01-2013 12:49 AM

Shannon Stewart was awesome :'(

YOUR Hero 02-01-2013 10:27 AM

Shannon Stewart was going to save the world.

Keith 02-01-2013 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Triple Naitch (Post 4104105)
Rickie Weeks, Brian Roberts, Chris Young, Michael Young, and Vernon Wells are all making more than Prado next year. I'd take him over all of them.

You'd take Martin Prado over Chris Young?

You're crazy.

Triple Naitch 02-01-2013 10:48 AM

Yeah I would. Young has never hit over .250 or had an OBP over .341.

screech 02-01-2013 12:48 PM

I would too. Chris Young stinks.

The Condor 02-01-2013 01:19 PM

Im marking my territory and pissing on Upton over Prado.

Keith 02-01-2013 01:52 PM

Now it is being reported Anthony Bosch himself injected A-Rod with steroids.

Things aren't looking good for him.

ClockShot 02-01-2013 02:44 PM

I hope these guys talk.

Unlike Greg Anderson. That guy kept his mouth shut and did a couple of stints in the slammer when they were going after Bonds.

Emperor Smeat 02-01-2013 04:00 PM

MLB hinted they won't be punishing anyone that gets exposed in this latest PED scandal. Only way they will get involved in this mess is if the Feds get involved to the point sworn affidavits are made.

Keith 02-01-2013 04:09 PM

MLB is going to have to do something. I have the feeling there's still a lot of info that's gonna come out and make the situation even worse for the players, especially A-Rod.

Triple Naitch 02-01-2013 05:04 PM

Were players suspended for being involved in the Mitchell Report? If not, then the players now may use that as precedence.

Emperor Smeat 02-01-2013 05:43 PM

Doubt it would be successful since I believe the roids policy at the time didn't cover anything done prior to the report and even some of the stuff listed didn't get covered until MLB redid the policy to be more strict after the report.

Keith 02-01-2013 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Triple Naitch (Post 4104691)
Were players suspended for being involved in the Mitchell Report? If not, then the players now may use that as precedence.

I don't think that'd work, because if I'm not mistaken, players were asked to speak to George Mitchell and were told they wouldn't be punished for anything they told him.

Boomer 02-01-2013 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveWadding (Post 4104093)
4/40 is too much for Prado, but you just took on Upton's 3 years and 38 mil deal. Don't have the cash. Mmkay.

Prado was rumored to be asking for 13 per from the Braves when they entered contract negotiations; they obviously tried to resign him, but the financials weren't there so instead of the them including Simmons they started including Prado. I'm no contract expert or anything.

And I don't think you can just compare Upton/Prado. You got Randall Delgado for like six years or something, and he will become a decent back-end starter at worst, from what I saw of him.

Boomer 02-01-2013 09:08 PM

I mean I wouldn't have made the trade either, but I imagine Prado will be the backbone of the top of your order. The only time he ever struggled in his Braves tenure was when he played half a year injured. He almost certainly won't get better than he has been, but he has been incredibly reliable at a position that is not reliable. The Braves will probably spend a while trying to find his/Chipper's replacement.

Triple Naitch 02-01-2013 09:11 PM

I have a weird feeling that Juan Francisco may have a very good season.

DaveWadding 02-01-2013 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by screech (Post 4104545)
I would too. Chris Young stinks.


DaveWadding 02-02-2013 03:43 AM

Lol @Mitch Williams

"Jim Johnson was 51/54 in save opportunities that's why the Orioles were so good."

Try absolutely unsustainable success in 1 run games, bro. Not some closer that will likely get shelled next season.

Innovator 02-02-2013 01:05 PM

I've over A-Rod and all A-Rod stories.

Frank Drebin 02-02-2013 04:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveWadding (Post 4105143)
Lol @Mitch Williams

"Jim Johnson was 51/54 in save opportunities that's why the Orioles were so good."

Try absolutely unsustainable success in 1 run games, bro. Not some closer that will likely get shelled next season.

Correct. Maybe that's what he was getting at, but probably not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank Drebin (Post 4033877)
O's might have been one of the luckiest teams I've seen other than the 2005 White Sox in the playoffs. Goes to show what a years worth of a shutdown bullpen can get you. Lets see that again.

One run games: 29-9
Extra Inning games: 16-2
Total Run Differential: +7


DaveWadding 02-02-2013 05:33 PM

Mitch Williams is a moron, so definitely not.

Triple Naitch 02-02-2013 05:44 PM

Please watch what you say about Mitch Williams. :'(

The Condor 02-02-2013 06:14 PM

Just met Mitch at a meet and greet last night. Any man who despises pitch counts is a good guy by me.

DaveWadding 02-02-2013 06:36 PM

Pitch counts are a useful guideline. Not a hard and fast rule to follow.

Skippord 02-02-2013 06:48 PM

the Rockies would inaccurately throw 75 baseballs at you for insulting pitch counts

Frank Drebin 02-02-2013 07:41 PM

After watching Mark Prior, you can't help but know that pitch counts should not be ignored.

Bad News Gertner 02-02-2013 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveWadding (Post 4104185)
I went and looked that up. I can hardly fucking believe my eyes.

Shannon Stewart used to be a beast for my Jays

The Condor 02-02-2013 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank Drebin (Post 4105640)
After watching Mark Prior, you can't help but know that pitch counts should not be ignored.

Mark Prior may have needed them, sure. But guys like CC Sabathia + Scot Shields have rubber arms and pitch counts are not really an issue. It is more of an arbitrary guide to use with pitchers depending upon their fatigue level, size, and body make-up. When Girardi limits CC to 110 pitches in September when the man can easily toss 145 and be ready for his next start, it drives me nuts because its unnecessary and puts the most important thing for a team (the W) At risk, but it's a trendy strategy that a lot of baseball people have bought into as gospel rather than a tool to be used in CERTAIN situations and not UNIVERSALLY by all pitchers.

Frank Drebin 02-02-2013 09:46 PM

Guys like CC and King Felix are different cases because they're built like dump trucks. (I assume you meant) James Shields isn't a power pitcher (ave 92.3 mph fastball in 2012, a career high and 90.9 career) who's best pitch is a changeup which is much less stressful to throw.

Innings limits on younger pitchers and pitch counts for individual games are a major part of pitching now due to the high attrition rate of young pitchers, especially when compared to position players.

Here is a favorite article of mine from Baseball Prospectus

The Condor 02-02-2013 10:40 PM

As a Yankees fan I see the otherside of pitch counts: inability of some pitchers to condition themselves past them-- Joba and Phil Hughes are prime examples. And body type is a main point I was making as a component of when pitch counts ought to be necessary. They are not something to be used in all cases, but for those who most need them in order to develop. And I did mean former reliever Scot Shields who was known in college for his freakish arm and its lack of frailty. I respect your side Drebs, and I'm not calling for teams to abolish them but to be more prudent In using them rather than treating all pitchers universally.

Frank Drebin 02-02-2013 10:50 PM

Understood. You basically agree with DaveWadding's comment then?

So what has gone wrong with Phil and Joba?


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