Raw did 1.69 million across the three hours. They’re almost doubling them, and I believe they saw an increase from last week. Who’s out of touch in this whole situation?

Across the two competitive hours, Raw got 1.71 million viewers, which is more than double. Imagine if Dynamite had a third hour dragging its numbers down every week. :eek:

The fact that they had a guy to throw into the tournament instead of having him in the tournament to begin with is a bigger blemish on the booking.

I mentioned this someone else, but that you can’t just give the heel a bye into the finals and have them brag about it and maybe do an angle with them and the guy that had to earn that last win is indeed an indicator of how silly this company can be. You can’t have Orange Cassidy in that PPV match against Danielson — so don’t book him to look good in the tournament!

Why they are even doing a tournament to crown a #1 contender right now when they just did a Ladder Match to give a guy his shot that he hasn’t even gotten yet is absolutely bonkers. They may as well do a Battle Royal to open up the PPV to give someone a title shot too.

The PPV should just be Omega vs. Danielson. You’ve also got Cole and Christian Cage. Jurassic Express vs. The Young Bucks. If you NEED Adam Page back, you could have him announced as the enforcer for the main event. He can win a prelim match. Whatever. Danielson wins when Page foils heel interference. Omega whines on Dynamite and Page comes out in his hometown to start a program with Omega as Danielson moves into something with someone like MJF, heel Cody, Malakai Black, maybe Miro. Maybe CM Punk or Adam Cole. This isn’t rocket science.

Bad numbers for both, damn


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Fast nationals for Friday night <br><br>SmackDown P2+: 1.978M<br>18-49: 663K <br><br>Rampage P2+ 556K<br>18-49: 267k<a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/wwe?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#wwe</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/smackdown?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#smackdown</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/aew?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#aew</a> <a href="https://twitter.com/hashtag/AEWRampage?src=hash&amp;ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">#AEWRampage</a></p>&mdash; Andrew Zarian (@AndrewZarian) <a href="https://twitter.com/AndrewZarian/status/1457056712100356100?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 6, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

But why would WWE leak that? Oh wait, that’s a load of shit.

Thats a good conspiracy theory, that nobody in the world has access to fast Nationals but WWE, and WWE only releases them to make AEW look bad :rofl:

I don’t think it can count as “leaking” if the information is available on request.

599k for Rampage. 2.093 million for SmackDown.

Exactly, but the dirt sheet writers have somehow ignored Rampage losing half its audience in 2 months as only because WWE leaks the fast ratings to make AEW look bad.

Oh yeah, it’s a load of shit. Dirt sheet writers are going to keep the lid on any truth that blows the “AEW is killing it and WWE better learn from all their mistakes” narrative. SmackDown seems to be the show that is holding up better than any of them. But when Rampage or Dynamite slips it’s...the news, football, basketball, baseball, Covid, a lack of Covid — whatever flies that week.

It can’t be that the show isn’t that compelling to people, can it?

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">WWE Raw got their lowest third hour audience ever -- 1.373 million viewers. 1.549 overall</p>&mdash; Sean Ross Sapp of Fightful.com (@SeanRossSapp) <a href="https://twitter.com/SeanRossSapp/status/1458183939403702281?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">November 9, 2021</a></blockquote> <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>

That’s only like 3 Rampages. :eek:

Fast nationals have SmackDown at 1.99 million and Rampage at 480k.

RIP, Rampage.

When that show gets canned, I wonder how that will affect Dynamite, since WarnerMedia paid for two shows when they extended the deal that Meltzer called “winning.”

That third hour of Raw people say is death? 1.37 million. Rampage? 480k. That’ll probably be bumped up to above 500k when the numbers come in, but I think it is safe to say this experiment has been a complete and utter failure.

The TBS move is probably going to hurt them further. Interesting times ahead.

Lol more like 4 Rampages now

WWE gets mocked when they do 1.6 million. If they lost half their audience over a span of a couple of months, they would be dragged over coal by critics.

Rampage debuted with like 750k viewers. Punk spiked them to 1 million. But the show is boring, patterned and bad and now they’re at 500k. Can people finally admit that AEW sucks?

515k for Rampage. :lol:

984k for Dynamite. That’s even with the post-show bump and title change. Given their story going forward is “bully Bryan Danielson” beating up losers, you can probably be rest assured that rating will sink lower and lower over the next few weeks.

556k for Rampage! A climb!

I apologize for ever doubting the drawing power of Billy Gunn. He truly is the future of this industry. And I apologize for ever thinking this show was going to end up cancelled and potentially casting shade onto the whole WarnerMedia/AEW deal. Rampage is the game-changer.

Bryan Danielson heel turn and feud with babyface jobber faction didn’t help ratings, apparently. 898k.

They better sign some more free agents or run a special theme Dynamite ASAP if they want to get a million one more time on TNT before being shipped off to TBS.

They buy an audience, then they whittle it down. I don’t think the move to TBS is going to be good for them. Just because it is in more homes doesn’t mean that more people watch it. I can see a lot of people tuning out when they do the switch.

TK out there bragging about this number by comparing it to previous years. Never mind that Dynamite was still against NXT last year and the year before there was a major blackout. :lol:

1.4 million people were watching wrestling last year. 37% of those people didn’t tune in this Wednesday. It’s not a win, Tony.

He is a turd. He has become the most unlikable thing about AEW by far.

They have this smug, sore winner thing about them. And they don’t even win anything, lol.

Rampage rocking a 431k rating, somehow Tony thinks he beat Smackdown and that TNT loves him. :rofl::rofl::rofl:

Ouch. People will point to Black Friday, but you also have a lot of people stuffed and at home looking for something to watch on TV. Is it a big party night? And let’s see if they ever recover from these disruptions that people peg excuses on.

The last thing you want is to disrupt viewing habits, and AEW just finds itself in position after position where viewing habits are being challenged. And that TBS move is going to do that too. And the big iceberg that I don’t think many apologists have seen coming is that people who watch TBS now are going to have their viewing habits challenged too. I’m no fan of The Big Bang Theory myself, but I know it is very popular, and I’m sure there are quite a few people who watch it now that don’t want to be sitting down enjoying their Wednesday evening with a BBT marathon, just to discover that trashy wrestling is on their screen. And if TBS works out they are taking a hit in advertising revenue by shoving this wrestling into the place this even cheaper sitcom marathon was? Yikes.

I did a quick scour of some places, and it seems that even AEW loyalists are taking pause at that Rampage number. It’s not good.

The thing is, that graveyard slot is what was assigned to them. TK acts like he “chose it,” but that’s where WarnerMedia sees AEW and how it sees AEW fans. They may have counted on more loyalty, but it’s not peak positioning like they want it to be the best dog in show.

Even though I’m no fan of this company or its ethos, I would probably at least try to out Rampage on at 7pm on Friday. You can move the movie back a bit to a later time (which might actually be more convenient for the film). I dunno, it depends how valuable AEW actually is for advertising and whether or not giving Rampage a better slot is “worth it.”

But this show is a detriment to everything. From AEW’s end, they should probably scrap Dark and Rampage. Focus on Dynamite and maybe Elevation if you are getting ridiculous money from a YouTube partnership. Maybe look into syndication if you can buy ROH and that slot, and maybe running house shows every now and then to keep fervor for ticket sales going, if projections predict that, where you can let guys go for longer and create fun shows for people to go to that isn’t risking overexposure. You can tape them for some sort of future tape library/streaming service.

1.68 million for RAW promoting Edge's return and Vince on tv.

So almost double what AEW got. How did the first two hours go? It’d be interesting to compare the prime time hours.

1.721 million for Raw’s first 2 hours.

If you do an AEW-like squint, where you just compare what you want, Dynamite + Rampage averaged 665k viewers. Raw doing 1.68 million doesn’t look so bad next to that, right?

"That number doesnt even count, it was Cyber Monday, so OF COURSE Raw's ratings were down!!!!" ~ Alternate Universe Dave Meltzer where he shills for WWE instead :kiss:

Noid this is why people think you are uhinged sir

I posted about RAW and you responded not once but twice, and both responses bring up AEW. You gotta get fresh air dude.

Noid and Xrodmuc are the tag team champions of the world.

The Truth Speakers

that sweet lil kiss in xrod's post was for noid

Naw, that was for alternate reality Dave Meltzer, still a douche but a WWE douche, so he is a tiny bit better :rofl:

“Don’t bring the truth into this, Noid.”

Wow! This page is just a hot pile of garbage. Grown ass men getting their jollies via being mean spirited douchebags because they weren't loved enough as children. I have no doubt in my mind that creepy Noid still lives in his mother's basement because no other woman would dare associate with him. He probably also has streamers on his bike so he could impress the kids in his neighborhood.

perfect timing

lmao

You catty bitch

Umm, who wouldnt want streamers on their bike???

I want to say it is indicative of a problematic childhood since he's in his fifties but that's not fair. He's other issues that deserve more attention. Professional help to be blunt. At the very least, he gets his ass eaten on Fridays. So it's not all that bad.

861,000 viewers for Dynamite lol


WWF LiveWire called. They'd like their ratings back


R.I.P

My arguments that Daniel Bryan isn’t a draw from 7 years ago are being vindicated.

Dynamite ratings have been slipping since they started doing more "serious" wrestling and Jim Cornette has started liking the show!!! SHould go back to more comedy wrestling imho... AEW was better back then!

That number is a direct result of Tony Khan's random booking of nobody's versus top guys in WAY too competitive matches. MJF was right mocking it taking Punk SOOOO long to beat a guy with 2 wins in AEW.

They have squandered the major gift that fell into their laps getting Punk, Cole, and Bryan. They have lost almost a third of their Audience since the episode of Dynamite after All Out, which was only 3 months ago.

Can you imagine the backlash WWE would be getting if 3 months from now Smackdown was getting a 1.4 rating? Losing that many viewers in 3 months time is bonkers.

First thing’s first. Let’s not pretend Adam Cole is, or ever was, on the same level as Punk and Bryan.

Also...

This could happen. WWE loses viewers at a pretty alarming rate.

I blame the Matt Hardy vs OC feud for killing off ratings

Show has been too focused on CM Punk for the past 3 months... Don't need to see him wrestling every person on the roster each week in 15 min matches that only get interesting in the last 2 mins

MJF feud is the first time he has been interesting to me besides his debut

Not enough Sammy Guevara, Ricky Starks on tv IMO

or Wardlow
or Dante Martin
or Rey Fenix
or Powerhouse Hobbes

Britt, Thunder Rosa, Jade all interesting but Jade never on tv it seems

Tony Khan prob will fix things by booking a 20 minutes Luther vs CM Punk match

Not saying it couldnt, just that if Smackdown lost a 3rd of their viewers in 3 months it would get a lot more backlash.

I'm definitely over seeing Punk and Bryan work with the green AEW talent. Would much rather see them face off against the mid card guys that have a name.

I do feel they have cheapened the biggest tickets (Punk and Bryan) a bit by having so many exhibition style matches.

I like that Danielson is just kicking the shit outta guys I’m mostly non competitive matches. Especially because they’re using it right now to get him over as a heel and tell a story.

I don’t know what is up with the ratings. I don’t care, to be honest. But it’s interesting they’re going through a lull considering they’ve been putting on pretty consistently strong shows in that time frame.

Here are some contributing factors to AEW’s slipping ratings:

* Taking one of the most beloved stars in wrestling and turning him heel for no good reason. People who follow him over because they like him get to see him act like a dick and be a bully. Validates any kayfabe talk he couldn’t cut it in WWE anymore. Bad booking.

* Having your top stars wrestle complete absolute losers competitively, and advertise this as a story. Last week MJF even pointed out Punk struggles with the easiest meals. These are not effective squashes. These are predictable and overexposing matches. You’re basically advertising the lettuce on the burger with this stuff. It’s also helped kill Rampage off. Bad booking.

* Having good stuff on your show can often highlight how utterly crap everything else is. People don’t want to wade through crap. They followed up CM Punk’s debut with Matt Hardy vs. Orange Cassidy. Bad booking.

* The new car smell continues to wear off. AEW made big promises and has barely made a splash. You can only ride being new and not being the dominant product for so long.

They don’t get it. They have never gotten it. They likely never will. This product is not for wrestling fans. Not really. It’s for a certain type of nerd who has such a sadomasochistic relationship with wrestling that they consider someone spitting in a cup providing them a drink. This shit does not functionally work for most people who have either tuned out wrestling for being terrible in the past or just want sincere pro-wrestling.

As I predicted, they got a little bit of a bump from their PPV, but have been riding interest down, down, down week after week by advertising shit people aren’t interested in.

The excuse last week was Thanksgiving. What’s the excuse this week?

Bryan Danielson is still a heel this week.

Last year, 1.571 million people were watching wrestling on a Wednesday. 45% of viewers have been run off that night. Last year was Winter is Coming, but this show had Danielson, Punk and a Street Fight advertised.

Interest is not being grown.

There was no reason to turn Bryan heel THAT quickly, with zero build other than a heel was no longer the world champion. Just because Hangman is the champ instead of Kenny, Bryan suddenly goes out and insults the fans? That is not logical.

But don’t worry, moving to a new network is definitely going to help them come January. :y:

Do you really believe that has an impact on the ratings?

And a lot of fans of Daniel Bryan that were into him because of his persona or his underdog wrestling style — and he had a deeper connection than most — are going to be challenged by this cursing bully on the other show. You’re just pissing in the wind.

I guarantee you, there are people who loved Daniel Bryan in the WWE who have sampled AEW and said “Eh, he’s not for me anymore” or some sort of variant. They make their product needlessly arcane.

Imagine being some kid in the Midwest, and Daniel Bryan was your favorite wrestler. You tune into this new promotion that he’s chosen to work for. Now you’ve got to put up with him saying “shit” every two words (Mom doesn’t like hearing that on the TV), him acting disingenuous (you loved his sincerity) and he’s beating up the nerds like you instead of wrestling the actual bullies.

“Meh, maybe I’ve grown out of wrestling.”

They’re tone fucking deaf.

Not specifically no, but it was still an illogical move and that is too common place in wrestling.

I'm not arguing about the logic. It's daft to suggest that Danielson's heel turn has anything to do with the fall in ratings.

It’s another drop in the bucket. And believe it or not, there are still people who sincerely want to enjoy wrestling, and don’t like it dripping in nonsense.

Punk and Danielson got eyeballs. They’ve lost eyeballs since. That either has something to do with the performer or their presentation.

Noid, you creepy old fuck. Nobody cares about your opinion, not even those in your retirement home. You're not the target demo in life anymore. Get over yourself.

Imagine being some fucking complete moron who believes that this is how a kid (or their mom) in the Midwest or anywhere else in the U.S. thinks. You're so fucking stupid and pathetic. If your opinion on what should be on U.S. television or even pro wrestling remotely mattered, you'd actually be working in the industry.

How many times can you see Steamboat vs. Savage in a night until it gets boring? In a week? In a month?

outstanding observation. wrestling has always needed to be a variety show to some extent.

Lol, they’re not thinking like AEW does. Cry harder about it. :lol:

Stupid AEW not booking Daniel Bryan to be like he was in WWE in order to retain the good Christian boys who loved him there.

But also AEW is just another WWE-lite promotion.

The mental gymnastics :nono:

What does religion have to do with it?? :rofl:

:rofl:

Why is everybody so pissed off?

That was my own assumption about this hypothetical nerdy midwestern kid with parents who don’t tolerate naughty language AEW should be targeting. Maybe a Christian upbringing isn’t at play here. Maybe he’s not even from the Midwest! We won’t know until we find him.

False dichotomy. Getting someone who has value because they are one of the biggest success stories in the WWE and using them to their strengths is not a bad idea. Wasn’t it you that said they should just sign good talent regardless of where they come from? Shouldn’t they just use good ideas no matter where they have also been used? ;)

Being different for the sake of being different, or bad because someone else chose good, isn’t productive. You know this. You’re just being difficult for the sake of it because I’m under your skin.

Believe it or not, the country you live in has loads of conservative people, loads of religious people, and loads of people who live in households that aren’t going to be receptive to the sort of programming AEW puts out. Evidence: THE FUCKING RATINGS!!!

When something doesn’t work, it doesn’t work. I know that’s a really hard concept to wrap your mind around. But the people saying “Hey, maybe this was a bad idea, or maybe that was a bad idea,” aren’t the fucking crazies.

It’s much easier to just misrepresent what someone is saying instead of actually responding to their points.

Like it or not, explicit content limits your reach.

Damn. Sorry for misrepresenting your point by implying that religion might play a factor in this hypothetical situation you brought up.

Wait...

That was in response to you. I didn’t bring up religious people, you did. And yeah, they exist. That’s not the only reason you would limit your explicit content when trying to attract a general audience though.

I hope the upcoming attempt to save face includes another Spider-Man analogy that exposes your disconnect from reality in one amazing post.

Tony Khan is out there bragging about DVR numbers now. :lol:

Can’t wait for Meltzer to talk about how that is a real measure of a company’s success. Then never bring up Raw or SmackDown’s.

So you agree that it’s a reason, double down on it as a reason but when I brought it up as a reason I was misrepresenting your point. It sounds like you were looking for a “gotcha” and go caught. Admit it.

Lol, disconnect from reality? I’m not the one in denial that AEW is losing viewers. And that is in large part because of the product they are putting out.

Ugh, back to this sealioning. It’s one reason. Of many. Anyone who has worked in any kind of media knows how explicit content limits your reach. This is not a strange concept. And yes, when you bring up something that someone didn’t say, it is misrepresenting their point.

When someone tells a child they shouldn’t stand on furniture, it can be for the child’s safety. It could also be to protect the furniture. It isn’t necessarily one or the other.

Listen man, people can think AEW is skyrocketing and on the brink of putting WWE out of business and that wouldn’t change the fact that the view you express about yourself and your role in certain arguments are not views that a sane person should hold.

And there’s the tap.

Turning wrestlers that a large fan-base wants to cheer can be detrimental. Overexposing your product is detrimental. Presenting predictable filler can be detrimental. Evidence: The declining ratings. They are down from Thanksgiving Eve. Throw ad hominem at me all you want. You aren’t sticking to the points because you know you’ve got nothing.

Actually what I’m doing is harping on that Spider-Man analogy because it was the greatest peak into how you perceive yourself and every argument presented to you yet. And it was batshit crazy. And all the lame “There’s the tap!” “Swing and a miss!”, “Try harder!” phrases you’ve picked up on as cool things to say in online debates don’t carry the weight you want them to.

Part of you probably knows you exposed a bit too much with that analogy. That’s why you get uncomfortable with it being brought up. You go ahead and look up more cool-sounding phrases intended to make yourself feel right though. It seems to be a “checkmate” in your reality.

Lol, I don’t even remember what analogy you are referring to. Please remind me. But I’m the one actually staying on-point here. We’re talking about AEW’s declining ratings and the possible reasons for them. You keep trying to veer away from that to try and go after my personality (or at least your perception of it, which you get monstrously wrong). And you’ve been that way since I called you out that one time, because I think you think you’ve got to be the smartest guy in the room. Since then it’s just been irrelevant trash from you.

Let me try and correct your course a bit:

Do you deny that AEW’s ratings are declining?

That question is specific and on the subject matter. Instead of going off into these insecure places where you keep trying to grab a gotcha or insult me instead of my actual arguments, can you kindly stay on topic, Mr. Internet Debate, and respond to that simple, relevant question?

I COULD go ahead and “continue” a discourse about the direction of AEW’s ratings that I was never actually having in the first place so that your warped view of reality can more easily stay on track.

I COULD explain in a new, less sarcastic/smartass manner why your Daniel Bryan gripe is another in a long line of weird, desperate reaches.

I COULD explain the horrible flaw in your attempted “gotcha” when you accused me of misrepresenting your point and how your explanation just made it worse.

All of that would lead absolutely nowhere because of the bigger issue which is that you argue based on a reality and a view of yourself that is fucking crazy. You’re free to head back to the Survivor Series thread and try to explain how you’re a rational person but barring that happening, I don’t trust your ability to assess any argument being made to you.

The gift that keeps on giving. I'm still chuckling over the fact that Noid doesn't have me on ignore and thought The Rock actually made an appearance at Survivor Series.