No you’re not mate, Connor is.

Good line that, shows you a lot about the real power struggle.

The funniest, saddest line I’ve witnessed in television. A perfect encapsulation of the show. (Re: eldest boy.)

Using “eldest” is perfect as a word choice because it’s kind of like a 7 year old older brother trying to sound grown up so he can pull rank.

Post that rep you sent me, that never crossed my mind and it holds up to scrutiny.
I am going to go back and listen to the speech he gave a few episodes back, the one about love.

I can never remember the reps I send (rampant marijuana usage). What did I say?

Also Peter Munyon is the fuckin best. Just a total shit stick.

He really is the most caring one, even if he’s a lunatic with crazy aspirations and a wife that pities him. Ruck’s best role by far.

And his three siblings treat him like shit, unappreciative and unaware that he’s always there to be supportive.

He’s a great piece of tragedy thrown into a show that makes so many un-likeable character’s likeable. I really am going to miss this and Barry as a great Monday night.

Ken’s birthday episode when he has one of his big meltdowns is where Connor shines most. Just refuses to give up his jacket, then when Kendall shows the the parody newspaper headline about Connor shitting himself on the camping trip, Con lets him have it. And he says how he took Ken and Roman because Logan wouldn’t and he ate bad fish.

I got the idea Con did “dad” stuff a lot. But Caroline’s children just think he’s a loser dumbass (lol and he is) so they don’t really appreciate it. I also noticed after that scene mentioned above Roman made fun of him a lot less lol. There came a point where they seemed to intentionally write Connor more sympathetically. They seemed to lean into more revelations about his past (loony cake, for instance). And with Willa it went from creepy and concerning to him being more portrayed as a harmless, deluded buffoon and her accepting him (as long as he’s keeping up his end of the arrangement).

TBH their transactional relationship is the only romantic relationship a Roy child could have. It’s the only way to cut the bullshit.

I write fiction as a hobby and I hope one day I'm secure enough with my characters to write someone as pathetic (and oddly loveable) as Kendall Roy.

Just finished 402


Few weeks back i told xrod he wasnt a serious person. Dale repped me saying that was very logan roy of me. I didnt follow the meaning until Logan literally said that to his kids in 402.


Fair enough.

Logan has a way with words lol

403


So like i said in the other thread this i wouldve imagined to be something for 408 or even 409. Doing it here sets the stage for a feeding frenzy across the next 7 eps which is a very interesting approach and completely shakes up the dynamic.


It does open the door for them to end in a more positive place than they otherwise could have. Finding unity through loss and all that...but this is secession. Every hug comes with a free knife.

Watching the behind the scenes and holy shit they shot a 28 min scene with no cuts. Obviously what we got had cuts to the plane but what was done on set was a 28min oner. Outstanding

Logan never in frame during the death scene. Quality.

Sarah Snook’s reaction especially on the phone was top notch.

One of my favourite parts of that episode is it's called Connor's Wedding.

Really is the perfect title. No one cares about conner

Dale says Connor is the real father figure. Hard to disagree. He gets good lines.

"Too Much Birthday" in season 3 seals the deal for me. The kids spend so much time vying for Logan's approval when Connor is the one taking them on camping trips and spending quality time with them, and all Kendall can do is make fun of him for shitting his sleeping bag after he ate bad fish.

Being a father figure isnt about throwing baseballs and hugs. Its about how the viewer emulates them. None of them look to conner as a model for how to live their lives. They look at him with disdain; like he's a cosmic punchline. They look to Logan and they mold their personas around his. He's the father figure theyve chosen, thats written all over their own actions. Kindness, morality or even quality aren't factors.

"The kids spend time vying for Logans attention" is because he's their father figure. Connors just the one with a good heart, and a really bad brain. Both of those reasons are probably why he was rejected by the patrafamilias to begin with; so goes Logan so goes the tribe.

I’d argue Connor shows and Logan tells. Logan says everything he does is for his family. Connor actually is there for his family. He lends emotional support. He steps up when asked.

But he is a dumbfuck. And thus, yes, his more intellectual sibs look down upon him. But he’s the one who’s there.

Logan is undoubtedly the chosen father figure, but he’s emotionally absent, as well as often physically absent. He’s a myth as both a man and a father.

I could change the verbiage and say Connor has been “more of a dad” than Logan, as opposed to all an consuming patriarchal force (which Logan is).

Connor might have been a better choice for a father figure but they didnt chose him. He certainly has a larger capacity for compassion.

Theres a potentially interesting take if you look a Roman though. Roman has a similar heart as Connor but he's layered on a false persona that resembles the rest of his family.

Yeah I would say he’s the father figure that “should be.” But he’s definitely there, and can be there if they can all get over themselves and accept that their dumb dumb big bro can actually be counted on for fatherly support. He, of course, continually undercuts himself via boobery, but what father doesn’t?

Roman told the newspaper that his most cherished father-son moment with Logan was actually something he did with Connor.

At the end of the day, the show isn’t going to hit you in the face with these sorts of things. But I’m just taking the hints given, and this speaks further to it. Roman—especially at the beginning of the series—reminded me a lot of Connor. And I always wondered if he was particularly hard on Con (especially in those earlier seasons) because of how much of himself he saw in Connor.

Roman hates doing the things the rest of the family does. He goes along because, like connor, he's spineless. Every ounce of fortitude and machismo that he manifests is manufactured. Its inauthentic to his true self. Not to get overly Jungian but his shadow is completely hidden from himself. Its detached like its straight out of Peter Pan. He's lost track of his true self. But unlike Pan he doesnt quest to find it and reincorperate it. He believes, honestly, that he's just like the rest of them. And by extention unlike Connor.

Roman offers an interesting dichotomy.

Yeah, there's a dichotomy surrounding all the main characters. Without it, the show would just be shitty rich people being assholes without much perspective.

However, Roman is--in many ways--sweet-hearted and wants everyone to get along but says vitriolic shit.

There are points where he's lost in the muck, and he just doesn't give a fuck and is a huge asshole. That's usually when he's drunk on Logan.

Even still, I wouldn't say the worst things he says or does are any worse than the worst things Shiv or Kendall say or do, but "the act" has him firing mean-spirited zingers at a more fervent rate.

But he loves his family. He has no friends outside of it. So, yeah, he goes along and plays the games because his family is basically his identity. He gets wrapped up in trying to be "the guy" because that's what the Roy children (born of Caroline) do.

Yet, he'd clearly be much happier doing his own thing free from Logan's shadow, which was why he was so insistent that Ken and Shiv not bother with the Pierce bullshit in the first ep of the season. Sadly, like Connor, he's got no spine. So on went the Pierce acquisition.

Logan has so much power over him, too. Maybe even more than Ken and Shiv. The desperate want for (abusive) Daddy's love also makes him forget who he is.

404


I love the juxtaposition of when Logans girlfriend (whos name i never learned) enters. She's feeling real emotion. Everyone else either never did or has already moved so far beyond them they might as well have never had them. Meanwhile she is disheveled and broken. Emotional to the point of incoherence. And the family is disgusted by the sight of it. And of course they are, she reflects how inhuman they all are.

More to the point of our conversation about Ro--which Roy child came in and was super empathetic towards Keri?

Roman, and more over he told his mother how shitty was being

A genuine emotional observation by roman. Something no one else wanted to be on the same planet as

Marcia is also tremendous in that scene. Her saltiness was legendary.

Calm down mate, you’ll live longer.

Destor with the ol’ “I don’t want it to be true so it’s not true” shenanigans.
They gravitate towards family when things get tough, Connor is the only one with open arms.

You've laid out your point really poorly but if you're saying that the bunper sticker jargon that "a dad id the one who's there" is some sort of universal truth well yeah i couldnt disagree more. We choose who we emulate subconsciously. And that could absolutely be an absentee father. Sorry step dads. Being the nicest aint it.

If so, youre essentially claiming that being highly disagreeable people, disagreeable being a primary personality trait clinically btw, have less value as humans and parents. Thats fundamentally false and doesnt have a leg to stand on.

Again kindess, morality or even quality have nothing to do with it. Mimicry. The proof is in the pudding not your feelings.

At the very least we can agree it's worth the conversation lol. I like the idea that Connor is the father figure they CAN have and Logan is the one they choose. An unrequited father figure, if you will.