Think the main thing about Flocke seeing the kid was that it was that it reminded people of something bigger at play that everyone seems to have fogotten - The Eyeland IS a character. All the little weird things and coincidences are attributed to something bigger at work than simply Jacob and the MIB. The Eyeland is reminding MIB that there are rules, and whatever game/situation the series is leading too, it's got something to do with the remaining survivors as being possible candidates. I think Ben and Widmore were candidates, but like MIB stated in season 5, 'they come, they destroy, the corrupt'. Hurley, Jack, Kate, Sun, Jin, Sawyer and Locke are Jacob's A team.

Even though Locke is dead, after seeing that episode, I just got this hella crazy John Locke type feeling that in the alternate timeline, Locke is going to call Jack, get his legs fixed, and end up back on the Island with the rest of them.

Thought the 'inside' joke pretty good. Like how it illustrates the 'dark' side is currently outweighing the 'light' side.

Very good episode.

Cannot wait to find out Richard/Jacob/MIB's stories.

Hmm just had a thought though. Don't children age differently on the island?

Like, when super-grown up Walt showed up or whatever. I don't really remember the specifics of all of that

I just realized how awesome walt and michael were :(

Fuck Michael and Walt, Desmond is the best character yet to fully come back.

Holy shit, just thought of something. Since walt and michael are off the island do you think its possible he meet up with the losties and tell them what happened? As he would still know what happened.

Huh?

What? I don't get what you are saying.

Desmond is off-island in one reality, and off-island in the other. He can't tell the Losties what happened in the real reality because he cannot get back, unless he talks with Faraday's mother I guess. And in the other reality, well, it never happened.

The things they keep showing aren't happening in the same timeline as the things on the island. They are more flashsideways, than flashbacks or flashforwards.

I'd give up if you can't figure that out lol

The specifics were that real life actor walt grew the fuck up. Simple as that.

He called him that in the normal timeline too. Cause him and another loser would play some war board game on lunch break.

I like alternate Hugos confidence.

well im assuming locke's past was different

The entire reality is different, with similarities. It's not just a matter of the plane never crashing, its about the bomb going off, the Island sinking, and everything that happened after that in a butterfly effect fashion.

Never thought of the fact that Locke could have become a cripple in a different way in the alternate reality.

Well lates say no island, no jacob altering their lives....

Kate shouldnt be a thief, Sawyer wouldnt be a bitter...him, and in theory Locke should be dead after his crippling fall.

I think it is a cop out to change their lives other than the events from the plane on, and perhaps where they were touched by Jacob.

It's the bomb being detonated in the 70's that is what changed everything.

Pretty sure the bomb sunk the Island, which means from when the bomb went off, onwards; DHARMA, The Island, the people who would've come and gone, and their butterfly effect on the world - it all leads up and equals this distinct and different reality.

I don't really like it either, but hey.

Something I noticed while rewatching the last episode today.

Helen tells Locke 'with your father' when talking about the wedding or something I believe. Could this mean that his father is alive, and is not at odds with him?

Could this mean he maybe didn't lose his legs the same way?

Also, I'm not so sure Kate is locked up for the same thing. Or at least, maybe she's not as guilty of a party this time around.

Yes his father is prob alive, and yeah everything is different. It's the same with everyone, parts of their original story are now going to be similar, totally changed or twisted in some other way.

Really want to know the deal with Desmond. Either his story is totally different and maybe a lil happier, OR something different - like he still maybe 'unique' in the sense that still turning that fail-safe key, BACK in the original past, it still makes him special with regard to time travel/cause and effect/what he can remember. I got this feeling that he vanished on the plane in the first episode because he is still travelling randomly through time.

Regardless, in the new timeline if that is not true, did he STILL end up going on his boat race? what happened when he did and the storm he was in forced him to the island? or simply where it would be if it wasn't submerged?

What I mean is I think Michael and Walt are in the timeline that is off the island and will eventually meet up with one of the people who were still on the island when he left.

Well we can be pretty certain they're not going to show Walt in that timeline as the actor is a lot older than his age would be on the show.

Also what's your point? It's a different timeline, if say Michael bumped into Hurley or Locke or whoever he wouldn't know him. Same way Hurley and Locke didn't know eachother.

I think you still have me wrong. Ill try to explain this out a bit better

At the start, the plane crashed on

Sept 22nd/2004

Lets say Micheal got off the island on Dec 22/2004 (3 months to the day later)

At the start of season 6, we see the Losties plane land at LAX, this would also be Sept 22nd/2004

What I am saying is what if someone that landed, Jack, Hurley, Sawyer, Jin were to meet up with him?

They have no knowledge of what happened to Michael on the island but Michael would remember as he was actually there.

Even simpler to explain, what if Michael when he left the island, left the islands timeline and went back to the off island timeline we see at the start of season 6.

It likely wont happen, but I think it would be interesting as we almsot all but forgot about Michael and Walt (who did play a but part in the first few seasons)

Well Michael died when the freighter exploded.

But also, he wouldn't remember being on the island because in that timeline he has never been on the island, none of them have.

Michael would have no knowledge of that since it's an alternate reality stemming from 1977.

Michael was never actually there in the alternate timeline because the plane never crashed on the island to begin with

lol and you are still wrong, so I'll explain it better.

They do not exist in the same reality.

Let me lay it out for you like this..

The Losties that they show LAND in LAX are in a DIFFERENT reality. Their timeline consists of different things happening since the 70's when the nuke went off.

When Michael came back, he was in HIS and (their) old reality. The one that started the whole thing and ended up with them crashing on the island. He could not go meet up with the Losties who landed at LAX because they do not exist in his reality. In his reality, they are all on the island currently at the temple with Samurai dude. The Losties at LAX exist in a different timeline, and there is likely a Michael in their timeline as well who does not recall the events of the crash. His life has been completely different up to this point as well.

We know he is not in 'another' reality, because he went back with Walt, who we clearly saw when Locke went to visit him.

Jesus, it was just a thought. :'(

Just saying. Thought this was pretty obvious by the way they were showing things, and LOST isn't very obvious most of the time so it seemed pretty straight forward.

I forgot about Michael on the freighter to be honest.

I was just thinking what a mess it would create if he met up with the losties who landed at LAX.

I think the wiggle room for casually following the story of LOST ended somewhere in season 4

It would be no different than Locke meeting Linus in the teachers lounge, or Rose at a temp agency, or any other character in any other walk of life.

They're alternate versions of themselves living new, but similar, lives in an alternate reality stemming from the explosion

Really, Michael dying on the freighter doesn't have any significance to being in an alternate reality. He could have not died on the freighter, and he still wouldn't be able to go meet up with the Losties that landed at LAX.

It was a thought with nothing to really back it up

So back the fuck off asshole :mad:

Carrying information from one reality to another is a job for Tom Brady

Oh and btw, I loved the scene with the smoke monsters point of view.

That was very cool. I love how things worked out in the alternate reality as well.

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q...URE_II-313.jpg
Trying to figure out the plot of Lost.

Desmond as Marty McFly
Doc Brown as The Island
Jules as Jacob
Verne as Smoke Monster

Everyone else is Biff.

you guys are confusing

They will probably take the easy way out with not showing walt by saying him and michael never stepped foot on the plane to begin with because the islands existance caused events to happen where they were on it the first time and with no island in the alternate reality, who knows, walt might not even exist let alone get on the plane to begin with.

Walt killed a bunch of birds. I demand to know how he did that.

Have to wonder if the names on the cave wall have anything to do with the various lists of 815 survivors that the Others mentioned over the years.

I could swear that Locke's alarm clock made the same sound as the alarm in the Swan as well.

It did make a similar sound the the hatch alarm, all these things are put in on purpose.

The 'lists' that The Others referred to do indeed stem from the list of names Jacob put in the cave - Pickett in season 3 refers to 'Jacob's list' but for some reason I think he said 'the doc wasn't even on it', maybe an inconsistency or maybe part of a plan.

Right, the list was for all the people in the tail section that were taken.

Maybe those lists we for all the non candidates to make them into others, while they needed to let the rest of the people play out their fates. Like jacob brought them all to the Island, but was saving the people whio were caught in the crossfire so to speak

I like how everything is connecting to the Buddhist/Hindu themes of the show.

Rebirth/reincarnation, cycles of the universe/time, etc...

Seems like the candidates are the potential reincarnations of someone very important (not Jacob or Smokie, but higher up)

Interested in where Aaron is...

If Claire is on the island, where the hell is he at.

Kate gave him to Claire's mom right? Most likely there then

Jesus, I need to rewatch this.

How did Kate give him to Claires mom again?

With her hands.

Goddamn, want to punch you for that.

A lot of people tell me that on a daily basis. :$

Maybe if you werent such as ass.

Anyways, could you answer my question?

Much love.

I owe you more rep for this. Love this site.

Just more lists than one.

The list for the tailies to be taken.

The list Ben ordered Goodwin and Ethan to produce.

Pickett's reference to Jack not being on a list.

Mikhail talking to Sayid, Kate and Locke about some on them not being on the list because they are 'flawed' and 'weak'.

Jacob's list in the guitar case.

And each list, each incident that lead everything to everything was calculated by the MIB and Jacob, for example The other's list in season 2; Hurley, Jack, Kate and Sawyer. MIB would form that list and want it carried out because it allowed, eventually all the events that lead him to finding his loophole. Jacob would of formed the list because with Sawyer and Kate crushing and hauling rocks on the Hydra Island, created the runway for the Ajira flight to land, brining his 'team' back.

So good. All of it.

Just a thought...has anyone on here ever tried to use "The Numbers" for the real lottery....

I heard something that after lost aired with those numbers that they became highly used in the lottery every week.

I have played them once.

He did...with her hands :roll:




:p

DO NOT use these numbers in the lottery, you will open the box!

I didnt win.

Besides, you would have to split it a bajillion ways

I was thinking about Jacob's lists and his off-island meetings with our main cast a couple weeks back.

I though there might be something in the fact that he touched Kate and Sawyer at a very young age and Jack and Jin/Sun before they reached the island, he didn't touch Hurley or Sayid until after they had returned (to the "real world").

Were Hurley and Sayid not "first picks"? Did Jacob pick them cos others had already proven not to be "candidates"? Did he need to recruit them to help get his "first" picks back to the island.

Midly interesting that at the end of Season 2 Michael takes Jack, Kate and Sawyer to The Others (all people touched before the crash) but sent Hurley back as he was surplus to requirements. Strange bit of corolation there (with the exception of the Kwon's not being involved).

Mind you, Ben never spoke to Jacob so his list might have nothing to do with Jacob's/The Cave (unless Richard passed the list on).

You do mean Jacob didn't touch Hurley and Sayid until after they returned to the real world right?


And here is the thing I think EVERYONE could be missing, and I actually think they are and the average viewer doesn't actually realise the significance of what's going on...

EVERYTHING that has happened, from the crash, to lists, to finding things, signs, missions and effects of everything that has happened are ALL results of BOTH Jacob and the MIB's planning and manipulation. Jacob knew he was going to be 'killed', he is if not one step ahead of the game, he is in unison with the MIB, with his own game plan being executed. MIB however seems to have no idea of Jacob's exact plans, but he knows something is going on since, 'they're coming' vexed him.

I dfont pay attention to when they were touched chronoligically, but what they were like at the time.

Each time he touched someone it set them on a path to the island, or at least kep them on the path.

Sawyer -Sets him on his path of revenge that takes him to Australia

jack - keeps him going as a doctor

Sayid - Saves his life by not being hit

Hate - allows her to continue her rebllious ways

Locke - saves his life and makes him live in a chair that takes him to his walkabout

and Hurley, who he literally sends to the island

I thought of Sayid as maybe... he LET the girl get hit.. maybe Sayid would have been paying better attention otherwise. So the girl was keeping him there.. and her dying led him to do different things.

Yeah, but also other factors contribute to everything you have just mentioned. That's what I like about it - the fact that all these random and occurring chain of events have created this situation (the random/luck/cause and effect aspects of existence) and as well Jacob's/MIB's planning, coercion and will.

Like I with one example you made - Jacob does save Locke from death, and confines him to a chair, yet it was Matthew Abbonon that convinced him to go, who works for Widmore, who was exiled from the Island by Ben because Widmore was 'breaking the rules', an incident which stemmed from Ben refusing to Kill Alex as a baby, who was only there on the Island because the French team landed there, an arrival that Jacob could've allowed/planned to happen like he did with The Black Rock.

Nadia had to die, Jacob knew she would, and he knew she had to. Because if he didn't, he wouldn't of had a reason to go back to the Island, and help the O6 regroup and return.

So perhaps the rule change from Widmroe to ben was passed down by MIB who had taken over the cabin...broken ash and all.

This is why ben never truly saw jacob

Hmmmm....I dunno. I'm not saying I'm right by all means, but I just got this feeling Jacob's plan is the same as MIB's, which wouldn't make him too suspicious or aware of what he is able to do. So like, Ben never actually seeing Jacob, that was Jacob's will and wish from the beginning because he knew that if he had had contact with Ben, the events that lead them to this point wouldn't happen, and thus his eventual end game and potential 'win' would not have a chance of happening.

I have NO idea what the deal with the ash is at all. Other than the idea that it would make less sense if it were just 'ash', and that indeed, the ash Brom used in the tomb in the LA X episode and the ash used for the cabin is the ash of the dead. There must be something about the smoke monster, which is some kind of 'judging/death entity' that although is all about dead, is however hindered by the ash of the dead.

And with regard to the cabin, I had a thought a while ago that maybe we got it wrong, maybe the ash around the cabin wasn't to keep the monster out, but to keep it locked in the cabin. But then it's been free roaming since season 1. But then maybe the smoke monster is both Jacob and MIB, since although Eko said when he looked into it he saw darkness, whereas Locke said he saw a 'beautiful white light'. But again, that could've just been a ploy by the MIB as the smoke monster to lure Locke into a trap. But THEN at the same time, a plan like that wasn't part of his 'loophole' plan.

alright wheres FA i wanna post some spoilers

I don't think spoiling it for him will make any difference as he doesn't seem to actually have a clue what's going on anyway.

Anyway yeah, another solid episode but with not much overall happening I thought. These somewhat slower episodes seem to be setting everything up for a big finale though.

Although not one of the main mysteries of the show I really was hoping for a better solution to the Adam & Eve skeletons in the caves rather than their usual Hurley nod.

What's to say that's the solution?

Also, I don't get how the episode was uneventful. Some very big things happened. Much more is happening in these episodes than ever really happened before.

I honestly don't think they'll necessarily answer about the skeletons and they'll just leave us to come up with our own interpretation, using what Hurley said. Then again I could be wrong.

I'm not saying it was uneventful, actually, I don't really know what I was saying. Don't get me wrong I still loved every moment of it. I just feel as though there's still plenty to answer and we're running out of episodes in which to do so.

Yea, I know what you mean. I think there's higher expectations for answers given it being the final season.
These episodes would be huge by season 4 or 5 standards even. For instance, the lighthouse was pretty big.
Generally they're just slowly pulling the curtain back on what The Island and Jacob are all about.

We've gotten an answer on the smoke monster already, and even some semblance of one for the numbers. The numbers are actually something they probably won't fully answer. They're just a significant set of numbers that continually occur in different places on the island, and why that happens is something to be kept a mystery.
The final candidates being listed as those numbers is probably the most meaningful usage of them yet, though.

I don't think there's really a shit ton of the old lingering mysteries left to deal with. Other than "what is the island" and stuff involving Richard.
I think the big questions are the ones that are currently being raised, and that's sort of evolving every week.
The whole story of the island, and Jacob/MIB is obviously a "mystery" that will take a long time to reveal. Plus the alternate reality. We have absolutely no idea where that's going, or how it will be resolved.
I have been noticing the subtle moments of deja vu, or shaky memory that the characters experience from time to time.

I'm drawing a blank right now. What were some of the big mysteries going into this season other than the smoke monster, Richard, and Jacob/MIB?

I guess the skeletons and numbers too, though like you said the skeletons might remain ambiguous. I think the numbers definitely will, and I'm cool with that.

Yeah I pretty much agree with the majority of what you said there, I'm quite happy with some things being left to our own interpretations.

To go back to this specific episodes, the whole seeing Jacks house in the mirror thing was pretty interesting. Also I bet that Jacks son winds up being the son of somebody else we already know. Just seems a bit strange that they didn't even mention Sarah, and what with everybodys lives still intertwining I wouldn't be surprised if it's someone else we already know.

Oh and this season needs more Ben.

Wonder what, if anything, would've been revealed at 108 degrees?

So here is a good question.

It seems like every "degree" on that dial goes to a number. So Jacob could watch his candidates. ANd we know each person has a number.

Jack was 23. They were going to turn it to 108. WHo is that? WHo is coming?

beat me to it. I need to refresh

Remember, the numbers add up to 108. Jacob said someone was coming to the island. Maybe someone who will unite the last of the candidates against Smokey?

Check this out

http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Candidates

SOme guy named Wallace?

aaron maybe?.... also maybe the numbers are just the set collection of what the candidates numbers are put together.

Yea I figured that too. It's probably going to someone like Juliet

The name Littleton is crossed out. This could be Claire, though.


The name Austen is not crossed out, but that's most likey Kate.

Either way, the name in question is at 108, and it's Wallace. If it's a new character of some kind, it's probably William Atherton aka Walter Peck.

yea, I AGREE. My wife keeps complaining that they are not answering anything. Yes, they are, but like you said, a lot of the little things from back in the day may never get answered.

Like did the Polar Bear thing from season 1 or 2 ever get explained. just a random one I had in my head.


I really enjoyed the last 2 episodes of this season. It's starting to come together nicely.

oh and does anyone else have a hard time remembering stuff from past seasons. I draw so many blanks.

Like last night I could not figure out how Aaaron got seperated from Claire in the first place?

They never really answered the polar bear thing. I think we're just left to assume that they were using them for experiments on the second island (the bear cages where they stashed Sawyer and Kate).

I always wondered if Polar Bears were used to turn the wheel, due to their ability to withstand cold temperatures.

I don't think anything indicates this was going on though. Dharama build around the wheel chamber, and didn't seem to be actually using it, but rather manipulating the pocket.

I guess they were just being used for tests. Maybe they were easy to acquire illegally in the area?
Maybe they just wanted to see how well they adapted to the climate?

Most likely it was probably the writers choosing them because they'd provide the initial mystery of "a polar creature on a tropical island. that's strange."

Yeah you are correct, they were answered yonks ago. In the DHARMA videos from season 2, it explains they were experimenting with different animals and how they can adapt and live in different climates to that which they are used to. From the north and south poles in the cold, to the blistering heat of the Tunisian desert - the exit point of the frozen donkey wheel. Yes, they were caged on Hydra Island, but polar bears are like one of the most capable swimmers of the mammal species.

The newest episode was pretty good, nothing major though.

And yeah, I agree, things are getting answered all the time, but still in a LOST kind of fashion. Yes we now know about the 'candidates', but seriously, and I don't care, it was obvious from even when Locke made many of his famous 'destiny' speeches in the first season that they were all bought there for a reason, we know the reason is because they are candidates for something, that 'a war' is coming, that Jacob and MIB have great interest in these 'pieces' on their chess board. We we still don't know exactly what the battle is for - existence? good vs evil? fate vs free will? - everything most likely.

One idea I had today, was that after everything, Widmore is 'the good one'. I had this thought that if it really was the will of the island that Alex (as a baby) was to be killed, maybe it wasn't the will of the Island. What if it was the will of the MIB or Jacob? - if it was the will of the MIB, there would be a reason for it, as there would with Jacob. And if it were the will of Jacob, maybe it was so that a different chain of events concerning Ben and Widmore would've unfolded, which would ultimately change and effect the situation now, more specifically, the MIB's loophole. I dunno.

Despite the 'wallace' name. I still think it's Desmond or Widmore who are arriving to the Island. At least I hope it is.

It's hard to say, and a lot to look at. He seems to know about Jacob and MIB. In the episode 'The Life and Times of Jeremy Benthom', he told Locke a 'war was coming' and if John wasn't back on the Island, the wrong side would win.

If he was on Jacob's side, he would know Locke was a candidate for Jacob and maybe that's why he wanted to help him. OR, he knew he would be killed and/or possessed by the MIB. Even though bad things have happened, and been asked of, anything could be of the will and wish of Jacob or MIB.

I think it will be Walt. He seemed somewhat special and I think its odd he was just written out. Plus the ominous way locke told him about the fight between light and dark in like the second episode. Walt had strange things happen around him. I think it will be him.

The 'Wallace' name doesn't really mean anything anyway. It's the number that is important, and not so much in this context anymore since the mirrors were smashed by Jack. There is still a possibility that whoever is coming to the Island is NOT coming from either of their reality, dimension or planet.

Although he is not really a fave character of mine, I do love Jack's journey. How he is a man of science, through and through - yet we get these little moments of epicness and confrontation with himself and others where Matthew Fox really sells how his character is battling this thing inside of him where at first he denies the Island is even special - Season 1 finale, then the conversation with Locke at the Orchid during the Season 4 finale where Locke says, 'You know Jack, you know!' , there's this faint look of belief in his eyes. Then he begins to believe, and he comes back. And now, although he knows there is something special, he doubts that it's special enough for himself.

I don't know how you can remember all the past stuff and specific episdes. unless you read a lot through the Lost encyclopedia's or whatever. That's what I probably have to do when I have an hour to kill

Because I am a geek for the show through and through. Think only the Sopranos has come as close as LOST. But ever since I saw the first season, it's like the show was made for me, like you know how there are songs you feel personify something big inside your head or from inside. I am also interested in philosophy, existence and mystery. This is the show for me. And I have seen every episode many, many times and I just seem to remember everything.

This may have already been mentioned but I just remembered something last night. The Valterzzi (sp?) equation said there was 100% certainty that the world would end in the next 27 years.

Wasnt that equation done in 1977? which would make the date the year 2004 (when the plane crashed on the island I think was Sept 22nd/2004)

I wonder if there is any reason to think that the guy who worked that out somehow foreseen the bomb going off in 1977?

Perhaps the bomb going off in 1977, just as the island moved through time helped cause the plane to crash on the island.

This is submitted to Kano for verification as he knows everything about the show including the color underwear kate wore in the last episode.

I guess you just have to really be into it. Similar to how some wrestling fans can remember title histories and what happened in what months and years, and shit like that.

I pretty much remember everything from Lost, and I don't read about it. I've watched it all the way through twice though. I'm sure that helped.

My mates (who watch it, which are not many) can't keep up when I go into detail about all the connections through different methods, studies and aspects of mythology...like the other day me and my friend were going over how Jacob touched all of his candidates (Locke, Jack, Kate, Hurley, Sayid, Sawyer, Jin & Sun at least) and he picked up on how Jacob handed Jack an Apollo candy bar. He referred to it as the same candy bar in the Swan food supply. But they didn't think it was worth thinking about the fact that the god Apollo is more often than now dipicted with a staff and arrow, two of the other Dharma stations. And they are right really, but I love stuff like that no matter how minor.