Quote:
Originally Posted by Fignuts
(Post 5588407)
If I recall correctly, destor's main point is that this kind of shit follows punk wherever he goes.
Nothing irrational about that. It's fact.
Personally, I favor WeX's outlook. They're all fucking children.
|
Correlation isn’t causation. I don’t agree with Punk’s gripes about WWE wholesale. But his issues there are different to the issues he has had in AEW. Paul Heyman has had issues everywhere he went before this WWE run. Omega and The Bucks have had issues.
Punk’s no doubt opinionated and when he was younger I don’t think he saw the bigger picture at all. But that doesn’t justify the mess AEW is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fignuts
(Post 5588409)
End of the day, the main person to blame here is tony khan. His, company, his talent, his fault things got to this point.
|
Oh I agree with this. 100%. Part of the issue with Punk’s meltdown, in my opinion, is that Punk probably lent on Tony to clean this shit up with Page, The Elite and probably a bunch of other issues too (Thunder Rosa is experiencing shit right now, for example).
The World Champion of your company goes out on live television with a live mic and tries to bury you and diminish whatever drawing power you have. Ok, what are you going to do boss? Literally nothing? Fucking great.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sepholio
(Post 5588412)
He should have cut Punk off at the presser and then took him behind the curtain and told him that a company presser is not the place to air his grievances. Follow that up with a meeting between all parties with a mediator and legal to hash out their differences and come to an understand. Then work a fucking angle off of it and print money.
But he chose to sit there with coke glazed eyes looking like "What's going on? Why is my toy talking back? I didn't pay for this. Does anyone know where I can get some more coke?"
|
Don’t disagree with this at all. Buuuut, I’ll go a step forward and say these pressers are fucking stupid in conception. Don’t fucking do them. If you’re doing them, do them in fucking kayfabe.
But hey, like most things with Punk, what he said didn’t really break the fourth wall. He’s not programmed with The Elite, but it’s within the realm of kayfabe they’re EVPs.
The things he said that really buried the company, in my opinion, were suggesting Page hadn’t done anything in the business (burying the title). And if they were EVPs of mine (and they wouldn’t be), I’d take someone publicly discrediting them professionally as disrespecting my decisions to put people in those roles.
As a “work,” it made AEW look like an incompetent mess. That doesn’t help. But AEW does a good job of that themselves too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xrodmuc316
(Post 5588413)
You don't have to be objective in order to be correct.
Punk is a no credibility having, bitter douchebag. He also never main evented Wrestlemania because he was not good enough. He looks like he smells bad, and is more fragile than the lamp from A Christmas Story.
|
Everything you said here could be said about Kenny Omega too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sepholio
(Post 5588414)
Sometimes I wonder if Tony is legit scared to stand up to the guys. He acts like it. I think he thinks if he bucks up to them that they'll just kick his ass.
|
I don’t think he’s afraid they’ll kick his ass. But there’s some issue there. It’s like he’s afraid to disappoint people, ignoring that they’re going to be disappointed when things go to shit whether or not he has the conversation beforehand. And they’ll probably be mad at him for avoiding that.
He’s terrible at managing people. People joke about them being action figures for him, but I kind of think he wishes they were like that. He doesn’t get their egos, the politics, etc. Some dudes are going to be happy sitting in the back just getting paid, some are going to want to go out there and show people what they can do.
I think the guy wants a legacy, and it to be a popular one, and this desire to please has him making too many promises he’s not going to be able to keep too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fignuts
(Post 5588415)
Tony should have hired Steve Blackman as talent relations.
One example being set would have been all it took to keep everyone in line.
|
Is he any less qualified than anyone else with an executive position in that company?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sepholio
(Post 5588418)
I mean I readily admit I don't like Punk. I have no use for him beyond his mic skills. Always thought he was overrated and his massive ego shut the door on me reconsidering a long, long time ago.
The thing here is though...I don't like any of these dudes. Punk sucks, The Elite suck (although Kenny can put on some damn good matches from time to time), and TK sucks. They all fucking suck. I don't have a dog in this fight, I don't prefer any of them over the others. I'm just calling it like I see it. I'm not going to make up stories about Jericho sleeping with Megha Parekh though and try to blame some of the fallout on that, so I feel I'm infinitely more objective about it than Noid who clearly just absolutely loathes the elite.
Trying to downplay Jerichos place in wrestling is just laughable. Dude is on the short list of people talked about when the GOAT topic comes up. He is better at every aspect of the game than any of these other clowns.
|
I don’t like Punk that much either. You don’t get to pretend to be the only one without a horse lol. And you’re way overrating Jericho. Some people bring up Jericho as a GOAT, but he’s really not up there. That’s smark bullshit.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Destor
(Post 5588422)
With this current issue: punks airing your grievances publicly burried the company. AEW comes out looking like busch league bullshit. And maybe it is. But you dont pull back the curtain and show the world.
The old adage "its better to be silent and thought a fool than to speak and remove all doubt."
People's jobs are on the line here. We're talking not just the workers being hurt here but their families too. Being the top guy, especially in a young promotion thats just as likely to fold as it is to grow, is super serious. Its everything. You hold in your hands lives. Normal human lives.
"Page said some shit he shouldn't have publicly so fuck it i will too" is only justified if you're an unapologetic willful hypocrite. Punk is the veteran and the champion. He is THE guy. The role he's demanded his entire career as a matter of owed moral virtue. Everything he's ever claimed was his rightful place is at his feet.
Instead of putting the company over by being the strongest champion you can be you jeopardize the whole thing on a petty grudge. Save that for parking lot if it needs to be handled. Instead he casually risks the lively hood of every guy on the roster, least not of all the young guys who would never make a dime without AEW.
He cant possibly be the moral actor here. There likely isnt one for the record but it cant be him if one exists. Hes the champion with twice the experience. He has to be held to a higher standard than Page or the Bucks or whomever without question.
If he cant lead by example, and with the singular focus of elevating the company for the sake of all involved, he's unfit for the position and theyre better off without him.
And yes the self serving tantrums are Punks legacy. This isnt new. Its beyond a pattern. Its pathological. AEW might be shit. It might be the worst shit to ever be released to audeinces in the history of wrestling. Maybe all thats true. Its moot. It doesnt make Punk in the right here. Those things are unrelated. The elites actions ex post facto or otherwise are unrelated.
Ispo facto Punk stirred shit unprofessionally. Had he handled this very typical wrestling drama like a professional this wouldnt be a topic and the company would at least not have what i think we all agree, even if we point fingers in opposite directions, very visible black eye.
It shouldnt be shocking that veterans that don't want to work 300 days a year as their bodies break down with age dont want punk back. He's bad for business. Not because he cant get over but because you cant trust him with the spotlight.
|
I don’t disagree with your premise here, but I think that’s why Punk is angry. I genuinely think he tried to come in and make AEW better. And there’s a self-serving element to that. Punk’s always wrapped his drama in “I’m doing this for (x) too.” He’s said his walkout in 2014 was partially because Bryan wasn’t getting the big push. There could be truth to that, but it could be a convenient way to appear altruistic too.
Page going out there and doing what he did was ridiculous. He was champion then too. That’s where TK needs to step in. He didn’t. The internet thing is to say Punk got hurt, stewed on it for months and finally came up with a response. I think it’s way more reasonable to assume he was probably amazed at the bullshit, didn’t try to deal with it publicly and asked Tony to clean it up. That didn’t happen. I don’t agree with what Punk did in front of the cameras, but I can understand the frustration he must be feeling when nothing is done when it’s kept behind the scenes. And the marks all act like what is publicly known is the only truth anyway (the dog thing, Punk not doing anything until he fired back on Page, etc.).
A lot of people assume that Punk firing off on Page and in the press conference were Punk’s first responses to this stuff. I’m sure it was brewing for a long fucking time and Tony Khan was asked to fucking do something about it before I feel like I fucking have to.
