Which Marvel characters...
 

Peter Parker did not give himself powers. Someone else was doing the demonstration that caused the spider to get radiated and bite him.

Powers, or just the ability for supevilliany?

Cos Doc Oct has to be on that list

Yeah, but he was still a science fan. Depending on the incarnation you prefer he also created his own webbing ffs!

Dr Doom?

Was The Flash a scientist?

As far as evil geniuses go, I suppose you could include characters like Kang The Conqueror and the High Evolutionary. Even if a lot of Kang's "powers" are based off of the fact he's from the future, but he's still smart.

I don't think it's a Marvel thing. I think most heroes are smart. It's part of being heroic and skilled. How can someone take a hero seriously who's a moron? Only in comedy superhoes does that occur.

Also, there's plenty of Marvel characters who weren't scientists experimenting on themselves or in an experiment gone wrong. They do have a lot of characters with scientific backgrounds, that's true. That's a Stan Lee thing, and in a lot of ways a comic book thing.

But what about Punisher, and most of the characters in Xmen?

Another question is, aside from mutation and being from another planet, which marvel also explored back then, how else are you going to get super powers?

Gift from the gods? Build a big ass robot? Isn't there some armor that makes the owner a god? Or is that Xena?

What? Intelligence has nothing to do with heroics.

So are you either super-strong or super-smart?

Way to delete that Hulk bit. Now I feel like a dick.

Success!

It sort of does. It's an admirable and powerful quality. It's just as important as being strong and righteous. What successful superhero isn't intelligent?

The Thing and the Hulk for one. Most of the big names are smart, because back when they were created, that was the stereotypical image of a hero. Good looks, great intelligence, and often ridiculously rich. But comics have evolved greatly since then, because writers realized that while these attributes are admirable, they have nothing to do with courage, and being a hero.

There are plenty of villains who are smart, and strong, and all that stuff. What seperates the heroes from the villains is a conscience, and the will to act on it.

The Hulk is a split persona. They even made a point to have him merge his intelligence with his strength. The Hulk is brilliant when he's not on the warpath.

The Thing is part of a unit, which features scientists. Astronauts no less.

Villians are smart and strong too, absolutely. The moral line is what defines them.

Also, I think the characters that have flourished without those qualities are anti-heroes. I'm speaking clearly in classic superhero terms. Admirable qualities are a touchstone and intelligence is one of the top ones.

Jubilee is neither strong nor smart.

And hardly a hero

They increased his intelligence for a year or two just to shake things up a bit. And the hulk is not "brilliant" when he's not in a rage. He just thinks a little clearer.

And for all intents and purposes, Hulk is a seperate character. The Hulk: The End portrays this perfectly. Regardless, even ifyou don't want to look at him as seperate, he loses banner's intelligence when he transforms.

Jubilee was an immenesly popular character.

I'd say it's easier for the reverse to be true. You can be ridiculously smart and have no athletic ability (Professor X, That guy who sits in the Punisher's Van) but if you are not physically capable and you don't have your wits about you then you probably would not make it out of the War Room.

I may have oversold The Van Guy's intelligence there.

The Xmen was immensely popular. She paraded around with Professor X and Cyclops, and Beast. There are certainly heroes who aren't super intelligent. They're just not traditional archetypical superheroes, and more often than not part of a group that is led by a more conventional hero. Either that, or they're an anti-hero badass. Wolverine's a great example of that.

My point is basically that intelligence is almost required when making a straight-forward superhero that works on his own. Intelligence doesn't have to be science either. Wits.

lol the van guy in punisher

I'm just looking for an example of a solo superhero that isn't intelligent. Obviously comedic characters who are written as bumbling idiots on purpose don't qualify. I'd like to be enlightened.

Alright, wait.

Are we talking what makes a hero, or what makes a marketable comic hero.

Because from a marketing standpoint, yeah, intelligence can make a character more appealing. I have no issues if that's your arguement.

But if you're talking about being a hero in general, well then we may as well just agree to disagree. Because your view of comic heroes is based on the classical viewpoint, which is just too cliched and dated for me.

What makes a typical successful hero. What people look for in it. I didn't think you meant what makes heroics. Obviously the guy walking out of dunkin donuts that runs into a burning building to save a kid is a hero, but he might be a moron.

I also think there can be heroes that aren't the archetypical hero. I think that fits in to the anti-hero persona. Wolverine, Punisher, or Spawn. These guys are the antithesis of typical heroes, except for the fact that they have the redeeming qualities to make them heroes.
And, even though they don't have book smarts they have street smarts. They're intelligent.

So basically that's the point I'm trying to make.

I'm talking top tier comic book superheros. Most of them is super, and that includes intelligence. Even if they're not a scientist or an astrophysicist, they're awful clever.

Sub-Mariner is not top-tier enough for you?

That's Namor to you bub

Since Marvel has characters from space like Silver Surfer, mutants like the Xmen, gods like Thor, and scientists like Hulk, I'm still wondering where the fuck else one would get super powers from?

Juggernaut has a magic crystal.

Oh yea, is that from space or does that just qualify as magic/god stuff?

Spawn is from hell. What ever happened to Spawn anyways? Are his comics still going/do people read them?

I stopped reading comics years ago, aside from occasional graphic novels.

Yeah still going, although just recently they revamped eyit with a new person as spawn. They had done pretty much everything they could with the al simmons character.

I didn't say that wouldn't be awesome. It just wouldn't be serious. How about The Tick, or stuff like that?

I had read Todd MacFarlane was trying to develop a new Spawn movie. A reboot obviously.
Hopefully they can get together a good script and bring on a serious director. I always thought the character was awesome and the story has potential cinematically.
To be honest, (and I haven't seen it in a while so who knows), but I didn't think the original was all that bad.

Daredevil is not a scientist, god, mutant etc. His powers were simply an accident. No experiment. He is a smart character though.

That's a good point. I suppose he's one of those "accident" cases. Spidey and Hulk are accidents too, but in the name of science.
His is just in the name of toxic waste or something.

Good Ole Matt Murdock is an underrated character

Captain America is a subject of science. I count him as the "got his powers from science" category though.
If I wanted to stretch it, you could argue that Daredevil's are a scientific accident, but I'm not that bad.

Jubilee is now Wondra and has minor super strength from technologically advanced armor. You be wrong, Theddy.

Wonderbra may be super strong, but Jubilation Lee has the strength of a teenage girl. Also, in response to Jerry's question of "How else do you get super powers?" I said:

Even when Theddy is wrong, Theddy is right!

Spawn is the shit... that is all

Spawn is shit, yes.

you are a blastfamer

Spawn's cool. WAY overpowered (at least since I last researched him years ago), but a cool character overall.

He can do anything he can think of, but thats the beauty of it... he doesnt want to. He only does just enough because hes too interested in self loathing and stalking his widowed wife. He only shows off his stuff when provoked.

He doesnt even have to worry about using up his powers anymore either... since he killed malbolgia

I know. I used to balk in high school when guys would debate Spawn vs Superman and I thought, "Who? The demon spawn guy who hangs with street urchins? Against Superman? Get the fuck outta here!" Then I read up on his history and seen why he would give Superman a run for his money. He'd still get fucked up, but not nearly as quick as I thought.

I miss those 'Vs.' debates...

I think I posted a Batman vs Spiderman thread in casual a long time ago and it was a smash hit

the only reason spawn would lose to superman is because he could care less about the shit :p you better belive he could fuck up superman if he hurt wanda or cyan tho

Nah.