WWE running dangerous line with Wrestlemania?
 

I have just been thinking about Wrestlemania these past few days, and I really think that WWE is running a dangerous line with potential match-ups. In most previous years there have been matches that were new and fresh, with real drawing power. I am having a hard time seeing that on this card.

Don't get me wrong, the card looks ok on paper, but for me, it could easily pass for a slightly longer normal PPV or RAW special card.

We have seen Orton vs HHH already and the whole 'not touching until the event' has made it a very ordinary repeated story. If they actually go with Edge vs Big Show for the title, it is very ordinary indeed, even if they do add Cena in.

Anyone with any knowledge will recognise that Michaels is not winning against Taker, and I think the whole streak takes away from the excitement of Taker's matches at Mania now.

The ladder match will include Kane and Mark Henry and other than throwing some lighter wrestlers about, they don't add value or make you want to see the match.

Finally, and most importantly, for me, is the Jericho match. This one has the potential to bring something different to the table. Names are flying about the net, like Piper, Hogan, Rourke, and Hogan vs Jericho has the potential to bring buys solely on the basis of it being different and special. Why then, do I get the impression that it will be Jericho vs Lawler?

No offense to Lawler, he is a legend in his own right, but he would be such a disappointment for this match. We have seen him come out of the chair to wrestle on RAW so many times...this would be a very poor finale to this story in my opinion.

All in all, nothing special is jumping off the page to me, and the card as it stands, does not impress me at all, and I fear wil not impress most casual fans.

Any thoughts? Anyone excited? Anyone not see at all where I am coming from?

Opinions please...

I will say this is one of the more lackluster Mania cards but Taker/Michaels will be worth the price of admission alone. I've been waiting for that one for years and the fact that the finish is 99.9% confirmed doesn't sway me.

Also, am I the only one who feels that they're waiting a bit too long to announced the majority of the card? It feels that in previous years the majority of the card was at least pretty much solid by the Rumble (if not by announced matches but by assumed matches) and pretty much done by No Way Out/mid-February. We hardly have half the card now with a month away.

Yeah, absolutely, good point.

I think the draft really stretches the rosters and star power, making it impossible to keep people away from each other while on the same brand (as witnessed by the current HHH no contact idea)

I think that this leads to a tendancy to very short term booking. In prior years there have been a few matchs which have had their seeds planted as much as a year prior...you get the impression that this year they are scrambling.

I doubt Lawler-Jericho will actually be at Wrestlemania. Lawler will probably just be one of Jericho's victims.

I really hope so. I think it would be a good chapter in the build-up, but more people will be disappointed than not if that turns out to be the culmination of the story.

yea, I do agree. Although honestly, I felt this about every Mania since 2006 and beyond. The Orton/HHH program has been good TV, but yea, they took the generic route with it. HBK/Taker should be the best match on the card, but not a match for the ages. It will sell all the newer fans who have not seen thier feud from 98. The Jericho storyline has also been very good TV. I hope he gets Hogan. But then again, maybe not, cause the result is obvious.

Seriously, I don't see a problem with the card. I think it's shaping up to be great in all honesty. Triple H and Orton had some great PPV matches after last year's Mania, but was abruptly cut short due to Orton's injury. I'm excited to see it continue and end at the grandest stage of them all, with this very personal storyline, one of the best I've seen in a long while.

Hopefully Edge vs Big Show will turn into a triple threat with Cena, which I think will be a fast, fun match, much like the triple threat WWE title match last year. HBK vs Taker speaks for itself, Hardy vs Hardy should be a great encounter, and then Jericho vs Hogan, if it happens, will definetely sell. The match itself might not be your cup of tea, but you can't deny the electricity it will bring to the occasion.

Seriously I don't understand why everyone is complaining so much, after all what was so incredible about last year's Mania? OK it had Flair's last match, but after that there was hardly anything incredible on paper. Batista vs Umaga in a throwaway match, just as an excuse to get Batista on the card as they had nothing else for him, and the main event being Undertaker vs Edge; doesn't exactly set the world alight (yes the match itself ended up being very good but before the show on paper it was hardly looked at as a show stealer).

I think this year's is shaping up to be the best in years. And let's face it, it's Wrestlemania. Very rarely are we dissapointed, even if it's just for the occasion of it. Most of last year was filled with entrances and pyro :lol:

Oh and if you guys are seriously that worried about MITB, read Jeritron's post in the Raw thread.

you're young. you've grown up on all the Manias on the past couple years. that's the differance really. it's all perception.

Will Adrian Adonis be there?

They might be running a dangerous line in that the two World title matches are match-ups that we've seen before, and the MITB has some interesting entrants to say the least, but I don't think it's going to be that bad.

Yeah, we all know Undertaker is going to beat Shawn Michaels, but they're two of the best Wrestlemania performers of all time, so you know that they're going to be delivering the goods as far as their match goes (at least within the limitations of Taker's knees and Michaels' back). The match-up itself is pretty fresh, since I don't think they've faced each other on PPV since Royal Rumble '98. A lot has changed since then. The only thing I'm disappointed about with this match is that they wasted so much time with the horrible JBL angle that they're really not doing the match much justice. This should be billed as a huge deal, a third "main event", a meeting between two of the most legendary wrestlers to step into a ring at WrestleMania. I guess there's still a few weeks to do that, but I would've loved a two month build up.

Hopefully they put more effort into the Hardy vs. Hardy thing than the stuff they did during Matt's first solo heel run, and it seems to be alright so far. Sure, it's pretty much following the "brother vs. brother" storylines from the past by the book, but I think the two will put on a good match. If there's anyone that can get Jeff to straighten up and really focus on a match, it's probably Matt.

I'm still thinking Jericho ends up against Austin at Mania, considering how he's supposed to appear on Raw in the week or two leading up to the show. I'm not expecting the match to be great, but at least the crowd should be hot for it. It'd be a nice break in between the MITB and HBM/Taker or one of the World title matches.

Edge/Cena/Big Show looks kinda meh for me, because it doesn't really look like a WrestleMania world title match to me -- it looks like the kind of main event you'd piece together for a mid-summer PPV no one really cares about. It doesn't really help that no one really thinks Big Show has a chance in hell of winning a world title at WrestleMania. I'd really only watch just to see how Edge can weasel his way out of this one. But spoiler: Cena wins probably applies here.

The Orton/HHH will probably headline the card, and while we've seen it like 23 times already, I get the feeling the two will cook up something original for such a landmark event. HHH is the kind of guy who wants to be regarded as The Best once he's gone (it won't happen), so I doubt he'll let Orton mail anything in. Make it No DQ, let them go 25 minutes and beat the hell out of each other, and maybe have some kind of screwjob finish (Legacy helping Orton cheat or something) to prolong the feud a bit.

On Taker/Michales, the feud has been brewing for three years now, technically. They finished off the Rumble two years ago and started it last year.

I wish there was some more build along the way (tag match here or there or something) but it's the closest we've come to long term booking in years.

Okay, that would be true if they were actually using their Rumble encounters as some sort of basis for the feud. But they're not. It's being thrown together without any real feeling or animosity behind it past "I want to be the first to beat you at WrestleMania" and "I don't want to let you beat me at WrestleMania." There's no conflict besides the match itself, so what's truly interesting about that?

Well there's still 4 weeks left to sort that out.

I agree that the storyline itself is just lazy booking, but there is recent history between the two. That's what I was getting at.

I agree with this and I'm looking at a different side now. Imagine how many peeps may just not be expecting to see as u said like a normal PPV. Their little hearts weeping.

OK, so I'd like to focus on the one point.

Does anyone actually think Taker could lose his streak? Seriously?

I could see it. It's been rumored that Taker's time is coming up and WWE could book Michaels in his last years as the true legend killer.

If this is Taker's last Mania I'd say there's a 25% chance Michaels will go over. Otherwise absolutely not.

to the casual fans, you really don't even need to do anything to sell Taker/HBK. it sells itself, so I can see why they really haven't done much. it's going to be sold as yet another respect match and I can't stand those storylines. The match will be epic though and will probably steal the show.

if they wanted to be interesting, you have HBK beat Taker and kind of turn him back into the cocky HBK who ended Flair's career last year and now ended Taker's streak. The problem is he would have to be the headline of Raw and then Orton is pushed to the side.

If I was booking the Taker loss, I would totally book the pin out of nowhere where the fans are shocked. I wouldn't set it up like Flair's loss to HBK where you saw the kick coming. I would make it look like Taker had it wrapped up and then he makes that one quick mistake that costs him.

If HBM beats Taker, look for Michaels' last run to be against a revived Legend Killer Randy Orton. Calling it now.

The streak doesn't take away from the excitement. If anything it adds to it. His matches in the past few years have been far superior to his usual matches with Mark Henry and A Train

There was talk about building up Ted Dibiase jr. in a couple years. Then have him talk about how his dad brought Undertaker into the WWE and made him who he is. Then have Dibiase jr. beat Taker at wrestlemania to end the streak. This is for when Undertaker feels that he wants to retire in a year or two they'll use this.

Matt vs Jeff hasn't gotten any mention.

HHH vs Orton and Edge vs Cena vs Big Show are no worse than the title matches of the past few years.
Taker vs Michaels and Matt vs Jeff are big matches.

I think what is causing you to feel that something is missing is the lack of a 3rd main event, which invovles either returning legends or celbrity involvement. I think you'll be getting Hogan or Austin against Jericho, with Rourke as the special enforcer, or something to that effect.

I wouldn't worry about the card. In fact, most years either have a dream match like HBM vs Taker, or a celeb/novelty event like Hogan or Austin/Rourke taking on Jericho.
You usually only get one of the two, if that.
This card seems like it will have both.

I somewhat agree, but that won't stop me from enjoying the shit out of Wrestlemania 25. I wasn't too thrilled about last years, but I loved it. The main event of Edge vs Undertaker was one of my favorite main events of all time.

JERICHO will be Facing THE ROCK!

And THAT will be a MAKE IT OR BREAK IT match!

I'm looking forward to it. I think the storylines have been done better than anything they have done in the last couple years. I'm not even bothered by a repeat of Orton/HHH. It's a new context for the match, so the match itself will be different than previous incarnations of it. I would much prefer this than nine Wrestlemanias of Hogan in the main event.

The MitB looks weird on paper, but I kind of like Henry and Kane in there. They were gonna be on the card somewhere, and this gets them both out of the way in one fell swoop. It also provides a chance for a few "less spotty spots" if you read me.

I have every confidence that Edge/Big Show or Edge/Big Show/Cena will deliver the goods. From a storyline perspective this is suddenly just as good as Orton, I'm just not sure as many people are watching it. It will be interesting to see if there is an Edge/Show double turn, or a temporary Edge/Cena alliance to overcome Show, who has been pushed pretty big lately. I would love for Show to walk out with the belt.

Hardy v. Hardy should tear it down. As should Christian v. Swagger, if that ends up happening.

Maryse v. Melina, eh. It would be great if Beth went to SD and took the Divas' title from Maryse after Michelle McCool did a little inteferring. Not that Beth would need it, but it would continue the Maryse/McCool feud, and then we get Beth v. Melina at Mania.

Jericho v. ? This match is more about the legend cameo than anything. Depending on who it is, the match could be watchable to surprising.

Taker/Michaels - Will probably be Taker's best Mania match to date. I am calling for a ref bump.

Dunno, I think it's shaping up well. I can see what you mean about how on paper some things look to be repeats or just aren't exciting. I think the guys will really turn it on. 25th anniversary of Wrestlemania. You can't hold anything back.

I agree with every word of that post.

I think who Jericho faces is important though. I will not be upset if it's Hogan. Normally I would, but given how good the storyline has been I would be fine with it.
Like everyone, I would obviously prefer Austin, but if it's between Hogan and Piper or Lawler, I'll take Hogan.
In my opinion it just has to be someone big. It's been building for quite some time, and whoever comes to the rescue of the legends has to be a huge legend, that will make the crowd mark out. If it's someone on par with the guys he's been beating up, it's somewhat anticlimactic.

I still feel there's a chance it's Rourke. Everyone has completely dismissed that.

My money would be between Hogan and Flair, though.

It's a shame Bret can't physically compete, because it'd actually be a great angle for his return.
He has said that he would entertain the idea of working in a storyline that he finds interesting and fun, as long as it didn't involve Vince, Shawn or HHH. This would be perfect.
Unfortunately, it requires a wrestling capacity and that's just not in the cards.

Hogan then. It's not going to be Flair, and I never thought I'd say this, but given the circumstances of last years events...I'd also prefer Hogan

You are all missing something.

Morrison and The Miz vs The Colons in a Tag Team Unification match. They been building is up over the past weeks, with each team successfully defending their belts.

Also, The ECW match will be good. Christian and Jack Swagger are amazing together. Hopefully Finley does not get added in. Tommy Dreamer would not take away from it, seeing his storyline going on.

This is what I suggested but I was dismissed as crazy. I highly doubt both of these teams are getting left off the card. If they weren't slated for a match, I think Carlito and Morrison would be in the MITB already.

I think that match will happen, but I hope it ends inconclusively. I don't think it will get the time they've been having on SD, so if you're gonna end it quickly, why not have an inconclusive ending and then give them more time at Backlash?

Unless something happens with physical ability to do it, Shawn Michaels will wrestle his last match against Triple H. Period.

I agree, and really, since the rosters aren't as rock-solid as they used to be, they should really combine the tag titles and let them roam shows. Fuck, these two teams ahve been all over each others' shows lately anyways.

I hope Jericho Lawler happens now that I've read this. It would be a great moment in his life.

That's legit. Add to that that there are barely even enough legitimate teams to justify one set of tag titles, and a unification match is something that really needs to happen in the near future.

The Divas title needs to go also.

The Divas title should have never existed.

He could very easily manage his nephew to face Jericho?

But seriously, that's where I'd like to see this program eventually go. Jericho is ripping into legends right now, so why not have some of their family get offended and step up to Jericho? Sim Snuka should have a massive problem with Jericho for the way he treated his father, so why not do Jericho vs. Superfly, Jr. on RAW? Jericho goes over, and then after WrestleMania, guys like Joe Hennig can come up and say "show some respect." It'd just be ways to get them working with a guy who can really help them become a lot better a lot quicker.

The PPV will actually be really good, I think. WrestleMania hasn't felt special in so many years (2006 and onwards is where it really lost some luster, as Loose Cannon said), but this year they've got some stuff going on that is actually really good.

Chris Jericho's program just feels like WrestleMania. I'm actually hoping that it is Hogan, because he is the epitome of what Jericho is ripping on. While Stone Cold Steve Austin could probably have the better match, it just doesn't make sense for him to defend what is right. That match will be awesome, solely for Jericho's promo work. Jericho will only lose once all the legends get involved, and maybe even after Mickey Rourke slugs him. I just wish Jericho would take out Jerry Lawler before the PPV, and we got JBL to fill in on color commentary for the PPV. Lawler can still make his WrestleMania appearance in this match.

Matt Hardy vs. Jeff Hardy, John Morrison & The Miz vs. The Colons and Jack Swagger vs. Christian all have "sleeper match" qualities to them. If you gave each one 15 minutes, then that's 45 minutes of solid wrestling right there. That's not taking into consideration the fun of Money in the Bank and the epicness of The Undertaker vs. Shawn Michaels.

People tend to shit on him these days, but Rey Mysterio doesn't have a spot on the card as of yet. I'm not sure what he'll be doing, but you know he'll be on it. Also, I don't care what people say, Rey Mysterio can be quite fun in the ring. Whatever filler he is working (I'm going to guess an interpromotional match against Vladimir Kozlov), I'm sure it will be passable stuff.

Just remember this: no matter how lacklustre the card shapes up to be over the next month, it will never look as bad on paper as WrestleMania 22... which went on to be a solidly entertaining show.

Orton vs HHH has been done, but the angle where Orton hit the RKO on Stephanie and subsequent HHH/Randy facial expressions really sold this match to me all over again. It is coming from a new place, with a new context, and I'm good with it as the main event (which is unusual for me to be all for a Triple H main event at Mania).

On the SmackDown side, I don't know who has been smoking what in order to believe that Big Show fits into any PPV main event in 2009, let alone the sacred WrestleMania. He has his place in the company, but realistically his days of being a super duper top guy passed unnoticed a decade ago. He will never be the new Andre. Vince needs to wake up to this fact.

Taker vs Michaels has been bubbling under for a couple of years, and I (and many others) started calling for this one a year ago, thinking it would be a no-brainer.... the story sells itself. The two most tenured, legendary figures in WWE, both major babyfaces battling in their home state... one calls himself Mr WrestleMania, can make ANYTHING happen at the big event, including ending the career of Ric Flair... but can he do what no man has ever done before? Can he beat The Undertaker at WrestleMania? Mr WrestleMania vs The Streak. Texan vs Texan in Texas. WWE legend vs WWE legend. WrestleMania icon vs WrestleMania icon. For one, the right to be permanently anointed the MVP of WrestleMania history.

Trouble is... we haven't actually seen nor heard ANY of these elements so far. Then again, it is early days. HBK only won the right to challenge Taker last week, so let's wait and watch this one play out. But if WWE doesn't touch on ANY of the above, then they are deliberately 'swerving' the fans, just like when they ignored the possibilities of focusing on the fact that Edge was also technically undefeated in the run up to last years Mania. Many thought there would be some focus on "undefeated vs undefeated" in the Edge/Taker match... WWE didn't even mention it.

The Jericho/Legends angle has been fun, and is basically just a well thought out "filler" attraction, to give Jericho something prominant to do at the big event, to make the crowd happy as the overbearing asshole heel gets his mouth shut by a popular babyface, and gives a shine to the veterans on the so-called "25th Anniversary" of the PPV. I would have liked a Legends battle royal, because the WrestleMania X-Seven one was great fun, even if the actual match itself was the shits. However, I think this match will fulfill that major "Legends" prescence for the show.

Personally, I want to see Jericho - Austin. Austin has to be in the condition to work some kind of match, because until he vetoed it at the last hour, he was announced to face Jonathan Coachman at a PPV a couple years back. I know he would be required to take more bumps against Jericho than against Coach... but then, would he? For an attraction rather than a serious, competitive match, all that needs to happen is Jericho taking a pasting from a number of veterans on the outside, Austin on the inside... the Rattlesnake wouldn't even need to take a bump. This match isn't designed to get Jericho over... he is over. Losing to a retired guy won't harm Jericho one bit, especially with lots of outside interference (Rourke too?), and will make many fans happy, and give them a WrestleMania moment. Same applies to Hogan too, except I would hope to see a more varied, see-saw match if it is Hogan on the other end of the ring (because Hogan is able to take bumps, and he shouldn't just squash Jericho when Hogan has ALWAYS been most effective as a face when selling and taking a beating).

If Lawler gets the match, it falls down the ladder of importance in the show by a few rungs, unfortunately, due to Lawler's lower standing in the eyes of fans (mainly due to sporadic and lame booking by WWE, and the fact that Lawler has never been hugely over as a face wrestler in WWE.) The time to give Lawler the WrestleMania match he always longed for was in 1994 when he was hot property after feuding with Bret Hart, but unluckily for Lawler he had to take a sabbatical from the company in the months leading up to the show for legal reasons, and only returned at the event. His second glaring missed opportunity was WrestleMania X-Seven where his program with the RTC would have almost certainly led to a WrestleMania match (probably Lawler teaming with APA, instead of Tazz, in the six man tag) had Lawler not walked out in the weeks leading up to the event.

I'm not averse to seeing Lawler get his much desired WrestleMania moment, but not here. I want Hogan or Austin, even though the match will suck, because the entertainment value of the spectacle will be worth much more, and there are plenty of other matches to offer high workrate. This one should offer fun and mark outs.

I still expect, with the economy in the shitter, for WWE to pack some more power into the card in the coming weeks. They have to KNOW they need to go above and beyond to have any hope of gaining a million buys, and even though the card is currently quite intriguing to wrestling fans, it doesn't offer much in the way of interest to the casual fans they court so openly this time of year. There's no Mayweather/Trump/Tyson/Mr T style buzz. Rourke may have been Oscar nominated, but whilst profitable, The Wrestler hasn't been a major mainstream box office attraction. Rourke's name, coupled with the film, doesn't carry enough weight to drive Mania as a PPV event, the way the above names did.

So I almost expect more celebrity involvement to be announced. Probably not in a physical capacity, but in some capacity. And I should hope for a rather big name too.

If I were WWE, I'd do all I can to secure Austin vs Jericho, and then push Cena vs Hogan. Both matches will offer spectacle, fan reaction, and WrestleMania Moments, even if the matches themselves aren't five star classics... although WWE really know how to book limited workers in dramatic matches, as Vince himself proves every time he goes out there in his vest top.

Jesus, that post was longer than Taker's streak.

*Points at Carl*

NOOOOOOOIIIIIIIIIIIDDDD POOOOOOOOOOSSSSSTTTTTTT!

*Snarl*

RE: Money In The Bank. I'd rather not see Kane, Mark Henry and in there to be honest, because this match is usually a fun spot-fest.

I do appreciate you can't just fill it with the likes of The Brian Kendrick and Jimmy Wang Yang because, historically, the man who cashes in the briefcase goes on to become a champion.. that is part of the appeal of this match. The winner has virtually secured themselves a top title run (and it would be a shame to break that unwritten rule because it makes MITB mean so much).

So, therefore, if you fill the match with nothing but a bunch of high flyers who have zero chance of winning the big belt, and then throw, for example, MVP in there with them, then it becomes obvious who will be winning. It needs the kind of star power that cannot be provided by the cruiserweight job squad, but at the same time, nobody can seriously believe Kane, Henry or will win it either.

The key is to throw as many guys in there as possible who fulfill both key objectives, ie. they seriously could win the thing and go on to take the title within a year, and also can contribute to the fast paced frenzy of the multi-man ladder match. My money is on John Morrison, if he enters, or Mysterio, if he enters.

good points Carl.

yea, I've been dying to see Cena/Hogan or Cena/Rock. I'm thinking they are going to just throw Cena in with Edge and Show though.

I would laugh if they put Cena into MITB.

Well we all knows what's gonna happen if he does...it's gonna piss the crowd off (minus kids) then Cena will win...then say "Edge! I want my title shot!" and then he's gonna make it a triple threat or screw Edge over like Edge has done Cena twice.

We also get Jeff vs Matt Hardy. How the hell can you complain about this card?