TPWW Forums - Avengers: End Game (2019) MAJOR SPOILERS INSIDE

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- - Avengers: End Game (2019) MAJOR SPOILERS INSIDE (https://www.tpwwforums.com/showthread.php?t=135767)

Just riding right by the previous page and a half about tags. I'm using them anyway, just needed to get my wall o text printed first, since I keep getting trapped with that "back key" thing. I don't have much of a problem with tags myself. It is just an extra click to see and a tiny bit of extra typing to make.

SPOILER: show

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damian Rey 2.0 (Post 5248917)

I agree with Kalyx. I think Cap just lived out his life, and at some point jumped back into his original timeline once his life with Peggy came to an end. The Russos are better off not explaining it.

Didn't seem like any sort of logical leap to me. He spent the time with her living, and it didn't really screw anything up since his parallel was busy being frozen in the Arctic. He either spent all the time there until her end, or left when his younger self got thawed so he wouldn't screw much of anything else up in that timeline.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Damian Rey 2.0 (Post 5248917)

My biggest takeaway and surprise was how they treated Thanos. I sure as shit didn't expect him to just sit back and retire. He looked like his will to live had vanished. He completed his life mission and was now ready to just let whatever happens, happen.

Then we get 2014 Thanos. Who is a fucking monster. Infinity Wars Thanos seemed very calm, calculated and focused on one goal. Whereas 2014 Thanos was much more vicious. He mentioned it was never personal until now. You could see that with how he fought. He was aiming to kill instead of trying to get people out of his way.

The time travel was interesting, especially since they were wrestling with not only the implications, but the process itself ("You weren't moving him through time, you were moving time through him!" "Back To The Future is BULLSHIT!"). Nice nod to the "hail Hydra" that made people lose their fucking minds.

Also, the people that existed vs the people they would become in time. Current Thanos didn't simply accomplish what he set out to do, but he a) had to sacrifice Gamora to do it, and b) live with not only the consequences- which he was okay with- but apparently the "temptation" of power. Probably saw it as a monkey's paw, which is why he destroyed them. That Thanos had that weight of experience and full knowledge of what winning meant, cost, and resulted in... 2014 Thanos did not. He only saw that he won. He could get all six stones without giving anything up. He was still in a conquering mindset. In the showdown itself, he had already changed his goal to destroy everything and remake existence itself instead of his ambiguously self-righteous goal of saving the universe by indiscriminately sacrificing half.

Not just Thanos, but anyone out of time. Younger Gamora, who hasn't had her adventure to see the full extent of what a shithead her dad is and grow into her own person from that, and Older Nebula, who has grown past trying to please Thanos to become his favoite, have essentially switched places. Going forward I'm interested in how that human aspect is going to be reconciled with everyone who came back with five years just missing vs everyone who lived through it.

The only time discrepancy I had a tiny issue with was Loki and the Tesseract. If he escaped with it, that would be how he got it for later... but that escape didn't happen the first time, since there wasn't a second set of time-hopping Avengers. By solving a problem, they created another one. At best, they moved something up slightly, as he apparently did escape with it anyway and was supposed to end up with it. At worst, they created one of those divergent timelines anyhow without realizing it.

In the words of TFS Perfect Cell: "Multiverse theory's a bitch."

Also, another minor annoyance that really didn't bother anyone but me... what the hell was up with Sam's lineup at the end? It really looked like they added a CGI beard and sideburns - and did so unevenly to boot - in that last scene with the shield. If that was his real facial hair, he should fire his barber.

All in all, pretty satisfying to go from Iron Man* to this, especially if one thinks about it not as a shared universe of movies, but essentially a live-action run of a comic continuity. Asterisk because Hulk kinda counts, but not really.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frank Drebin (Post 5249762)

Loved it.

Almost ruined by a group of 3 or 4 ten year olds behind me who talked through the entire film. Right before that crowd pleasing moment for Cap, kid says "OH THIS IS THE MOST EPIC PART EVER!!!" totally taking me out of the movie. His parents shushed him once or twice but he never really shut up. Thought about casually tossing the remnants of my drink at him but didn't think assaulting a child would look good on my resume.

Hopefully I'll see it again at some point so I can enjoy those parts of the movie.

That's why you ammend your resume to say you run a boy cleaning service on the side to dress up the drink dousing. That's why I'm glad I went during the week at an early showing. Little bastards like that were at school.

A very important distinction between Post-IW Thanos and 2014-Thanos was yes, this Thanos wasn't burdened with sacrifices needed to win (Infinity War was a movie about who could and couldn't make hard choices). Thano 2014, I felt, was affected by seeing his future self broken and killed than he gave off.

At the final battle he revealed that for the first time it was personal, now that he knows that the unruly wretches on Earth would actually avenge the taken and more or less win eventually. The combination of not taking the Avengers seriously enough and seeing his own death led to a shift that we almost didn't catch.

He made peace with planning to lie.

Multiple times between these two movies it was made very clear that Thanos does not lie. He didn't raise his daughters to do so, and he honored every deal we see him do in his appearences - up to sparing Stark's life when given the Time Stone, an act of honesty that ultimately cost him his entire campaign.

So what does 2014 Thanos do? He plans on killing everything ever, an indictment on his own original motivations, and openly ignores that the new universe would be built on a lie. This regresses more into a more traditional villain, of course, and this more unhinged Thanos is presented throughout the final battle. More prone to impatience, rash decisions, and mistakes.

Under no circumstance would a calculated, "I'll do it myself" Thanos do something as risky as take on the Avengers knowing they have the Stones. Before he grew stronger as he collected them, having a head start with the Power Stone. Now he just has a fancy sword, and no actual experience telling him that Dr Strange by himself was able to hang when he had four stones. Stark made him bleed when he had four stones. Wanda held him back one handed when he had FIVE stones. And Thor nearly killed him AFTER he tried a full Infinity blast. As powerful as he was, the Avengers are dangerous when they go full throttle. Something a methodical Thanos would keep in mind, but not an impatient Thanos. Not one who abandoned reason.

What I love about his death was his deafening silence. It's essentially playing back his opening speech in IW. But what I get from it was he couldn't meet the standard he saw in his future self. It's like seeing yourself in five years with a great job and hot wife, so you just overconfidently go for that job and the girl who doesn't even know you yet... only to screw it all up. You're not the guy to be, not yet. And now not ever.

SPOILER: show

As a mod of this forum you sure like ruining threads Seanny

There is so much "gay" in this thread; y'all need to start braiding one another's hair.

For a mod of this forum you sure like ruining threads Seanny.

Edit: Please stop spamming troll posts, Vic.

The spoiler discussion at least yielded some answers.

Please stay on topic.

Kalyx with an excellent take on the two Thanos takes we got in one film.

Currently the second highest grossing film of all time. God, I really hope this tops Avatar and takes the number one position.

Hope it does. Hate Avatar.

Zoe Saldana and her agent cackles at this race.

She probably got paid less than Stephen Lang for Avatar.

I imagine the random actress from a pseudo-sequel to The Professional would get paid less than a guy who been around.

The woman with two billion dollar movies on her resume now? That's a bargaining chip Disney will have to recognize.

She had virtually no impact on their success.

Any attractive woman with moderate acting ability could have filled those roles.
They weren't important enough to pay top dollar for a big name actress so you end up with Zoe Saldana who is possibly the perfect generic standard of beauty. You can tell she's attractive but why bother looking again because oh look, a funny joke or explosion.

Zoe Saldana is 3/5 across the board, because the 3/5's never rock the boat.

It doesn’t matter how good of an actress she is. It’s all about marketability, and she’s a well liked big budget mainstay.

She has Star Trek under her belt too right? I dont know shit about actore and actresses but I know her. Shes definitely popular.

Her ensemble films are popular.
She is lucky to be along for the ride based on talent alone. She has lucked into marketability by having snuck into three major franchises because she was cheap, attractive and decent.

Nobody was buying tickets to Avatar, Star Trek or Guardians to see Zoe Saldana at work. She was boosted by 3D, an established franchise reboot and a plum spot in a film carried by Chris Pratt's name value and public interest in "comic book movies".

I don't mind her. That's precisely why she's famous.

The one movie that was a vehicle for her was Columbiana, and that was a critical and commercial failure. I like Zoe Saldana more than enough. But she's a role player.

I'm not even sure what we're arguing about.

Throwaway line towards the beginning could tease what’s in store for black panther 2. Okoye tells Widow that there was an earthquake under the ocean. This could end up being the result of Namor and Atlantis, which has had a long running feud with Wakanda in the comics.

I like that rumor. That could work.

I went and caught this on Tuesday. Avoided the thread at launch time and jumped in after I watched. It got crazy in here.

Here's my take/thoughts on Endgame. Not gonna to into too much depth.

- For as long I have been a movie lover, I've noticed then when a movie starts off with a really good song playing, it turns out to be a really good movie. Like, when The Rolling Stones' Gimme Shelter kicked off The Departed. So, when I heard Traffic's Dear Mr. Fantasy fire up, my toe was tappin', my head was bobbin', and I was singing along. I knew then I was in for a good show.

- I had a few theories about how the surviving team would reverse The Snap. Suicide mission to snag the gauntlet from Thanos, find The Book of Vishanti and perform a spell/ritual, introduce Mephisto and offer the Avengers one hell of a deal, steal the time stone itself and fuck around with time travel. Nope. Turns out Thanos turned the stones into dust and Scott Lang and the Quantum Realm is the key. Who knew?

- I agree with some of the comments about Thor. I think they took the broken, drunk, Jeff Lebowski thing a bit too far.

- Totally surprised they got almost everyone back for this. Got Robert Redford out of retirement to reprise Alexander Pierce for 30 seconds, Tilda Swinton, Frank Grillo, Hayley Atwell, etc. A couple notables M.I.A were Toby Jones, Chiwetel Ejiofor, maybe one or two that I missed. Probably since Soderbergh's Ocean's trilogy you never had that much star power jammed in one movie. Incredible.

- HA! Pre-Guardians 1 Gamora got pulled to the "present day". Now she and Star Lord gotta fall in love all over again. Should make for a good Guardians 3. I wonder if James Gunn trashed the script once he found that out. Kinda bummed out that the rest of them got a few seconds of screen time and Rocket and Nebula were pretty holding down the them representation for the whole flick.

- Hi Bree Larson. Bye Bree Larson. See ya in a couple hours. :wave: :nono: That solo movie she just had only to save a spaceship and destroy a spaceship in Endgame was a head scratcher. I wish she had more of a role in this.

- The Black Widow death threw me off. When they had to go back to Vormin I knew someone had to go. I knew the movie was in the works, but since it's going to be a prequel now makes it interesting.

- Tony Stark saves us all. And gives up his life for it. I thought it was either him or Cap. Steve Rogers putting the stones back, but staying in the past to stay with Betty, and reappearing in the present aged and handing off the Shield was a pretty great moment.

-Finally, I enjoyed the cast credits. You got everybody in there, but when you get to the main bunch, they all "sign off" with their signature. To me, they're done, sans Thor. Everyone's wrapped up. And this was a hand off to the new kids on the block. Black Panther, Doctor Strange, Guardians, Captain Marvel, they got some shoes to fill.

I thought Gamora was turned to dust with everyone else that came with Thanos?

She's the past version Gamora from 2014. So she was still aligned with Thanos at that point

Yeah, but one would assume that Tony knew she was good people, and made sure not to dust her.

The search for Gamora is almost certainly going to be the main plot of (As)Guardians of the Galaxy. Maybe an awkward love triangle between her starlord and Thor.

I really hope this beats Avatar as the highest grossing film.

Have my doubts, though.

The idea of 2-2.5 hours of Thor unknowingly schmoozing Gamora while Quill tries his damndest to re win her over sounds hysterical. Please be a subplot of the next movie.

Some dude repped me saying that Universal has the rights to Namor. Reading up on it, it doesn't seem that clear cut. Seems Marvel shares ownership with Universal. Universal would own full distribution rights for a solo Namor film, but not necessarily an appearance.

Regardless, Disney has enough money to buy the solar system, and if they want Namor, they're going to fucking get Namor.

Could just do the same deal they're doing with Sony on Spider-Man. Considering what a money magnet anything Marvel has its name is, universal would be foolish not to consider.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SixxT9 (Post 5250953)

I really hope this beats Avatar as the highest grossing film.

Have my doubts, though.

Same. I have a brief check every day but it seems to be slowing down now. Shame. :(

*Spoils movie to be a cunt*

"Damn, I wish more people would go see it."

If Endgame doesn't beat Avatar the only possible reason in my head for that is a 3hr movie isn't rewatch friendly. I saw the first Avengers 3 times in theaters over two weeks. Endgame is amazing but it's a hell of a haul.

Avatar is 162 minutes long.
It's 20 minutes shorter than Endgame.

The biggest reason I can think of would be the leak and the inevitability of spoilers.

The home entertainment numbers will be stupidly high a few months down the road.

I doubt people who want to see the film are going to be put off because of spoilers.

Like, oh I know what happens at the end now, no point in going. Fuck that of course they're gonna go.

IMO the deal with Avatar is because isn't that the film where 3D really kinda picked up and became what it is? I can say it's the only film I've ever seen in the cinema twice, once in 2D, and I enjoyed it so much I wanted to see what the 3D hype was all about so went again. (For the record I wasn't impressed. 2D is fine for me).

They probably made shit loads just off of people doing that.

If it didn't make any difference they wouldn't care about leaks or spoilers. Every preview would show the ending.