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Originally Posted by Instant Classic
Joe does't use submission, unless you count his choke hold, which is a CHOKE. Occiasionally he's use an arm bar, or his gay STF he uses, thats about it, and that is few and far between. Also, because I know Joe isn't the next wrestling superstar, does not make me an idiot. Joe doesn't have the charisma, mic skills, star power, or the look. Not to mention he's a shitty wrestler. Yes, Somoa Joe doesn't wrestle, and really can't. You give shit to guys all the time for not being techinically sound, well guess what? Soma Joe sure as hell isn't. I'm tired of you fucking marks, thinking just becuase they use no physcology, and work stiff, makes them a good wrestler, I wish it were that easy, but it's not. There is no art or skill in winding up and cracking someone with a solid forearm shot, or a stiff kick. But anyways, Joe will never be a superstar, he will never be a world champion, unless you count RoH. Fact is, Joe is your average run of the mill, Mid carder. Also, how fucking stupid is his fucking name, the more I think about it, the more retarded one has to be to choose such a fucking rediculous name.
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In TNA, I have seen Joe hit a powerbomb and try and get the pin. When he quite can't get the three, he uses the opponent's momentum kicking out against them, and locks in a Boston crab. Right there, in that move, there is more psychology than in an entire WWE match. OK, that might be stretching it, but if you can't see the strategy and purpose there, you are indeed a moron, there is no other way around it.
When the opponent reaches for the ropes, Joe reaches back and rolls the Boston crab into an STF, and suddenly edits the point of pressure a little bit. The back is still not getting a breather, you know, because there a 280lbs man putting his weight on it. I believe an STF from Joe, because the guy is usually so much bigger than his opponents. Of course he is going to try and use his weight to keep them grounded.
Right there, in just three moves, Samoa Joe has written a small wrestling novel. I accept that you are not going to be swayed, because you don't like Joe. That's fine. I don't like John Cena, but at least I admit the guy can wrestle when he needs to (proven in his OVW and early SmackDown! days).
Also, the guy has the perfect "everyman" image. Of course, not every guy is an athletic Samoan, but he doesn't have the sculptured body of a steroid user. He goes out there as he is, which is very relatable. He then shows off some surprisingly athleticism for a guy his size, and it would perhaps come off as more enjoyable than a guy looking like he can flip around pulling off the same moves.
What does star power have to do with someone becoming a star? Usually you reach stardom before you use a guy's level of stardom against him.
You're a good poster, IC. I just don't get where you pull this "he can't wrestle shit," when he has had matches that have been labeled modern classics. Your opinion may differ, but fuck, there's a fine line between having an unpopular opinion and just being ignorant. I could say Christian Bale is a shitty actor until the cows come home. Doesn't make it so, unfortunately.
Really, you and the other three "Soma Joe" guys on here are the only people I have ever tried to see make a case agaisnt Samoa Joe's ring skills, and you are yet to produce one convincing point other than "he's shit."