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Old 01-30-2006, 12:48 PM   #1
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Reasons Behind New Champion
Cena’s title loss is being viewed as a very unique situation. The Wrestling Observer Newsletter reports that it looked like they took the title off of him in order to make people stop booing him.

Cena is the biggest draw and merchandise seller amongst women and children. The company apparently thinks that turning him heel will kill off all the money they make from those two demographics. Others think that while it may hurt those demographics, it would help in the male audience and would be viewed as one of the biggest heel turns ever.

We don’t really have any news yet on the reasoning behind WWE giving back the title to Cena. It could be because they thought their plan of taking it off him wasn’t working, that they didn’t like the results they were getting from Edge, or a number of other possibilities.

Cena has been working really hard since shooting to the top of the company, spending most of his days off doing P.R. stuff. It was previously reported that while the boos from the fans had been getting to him, he didn’t let it bother him too much and accepted that they can cheer for whoever they want.

Wrestlingexposed
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Old 01-30-2006, 12:56 PM   #2
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I feel almost bad...personally I never liked Cena as a performer or entertainer in any form. However I do realise that his current problem is not his fault but rather the fault of the WWE creative team. Damn shame WWE continues to fuck with him and my guess is that this problem will get much worse before it gets better...what with Vince LOVING him personally and thinking he is one of the few Champs he's ever had that he can send anywhere to do PR work. Personally I will never understand why on god's green earth they never did this "shove down our throats and stick with him" type approve to Jericho. He could have been a face EVERYONE loved, done fucking A+ PR Work (hell even take the title on with him on shit like Love the 80's and Best Week Ever) and Jericho has better matches. If anyone can give one GOOD reason why they never did this with Jericho, I would be happy.
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Old 01-30-2006, 01:08 PM   #3
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I'll give you one: Vince didn't "create" Jericho. He was already popular when he came in, and that's the kiss of death. Ask Booker T, RVD, Scott Steiner, or Goldberg.
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Old 01-30-2006, 05:21 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loopydate
I'll give you one: Vince didn't "create" Jericho. He was already popular when he came in, and that's the kiss of death. Ask Booker T, RVD, Scott Steiner, or Goldberg.
Goldberg Killed goldberg
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Old 02-01-2006, 03:47 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by Savior
Goldberg Killed goldberg

Agreed. As much as I liked his WCW run, he's had the wrong attitude for the world of professional wrestling. The only one in recent memory who reminds me of him and the way he did his, is ironically Brock Lesnar, but at least he's still wrestling.
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Old 02-01-2006, 03:45 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loopydate
I'll give you one: Vince didn't "create" Jericho. He was already popular when he came in, and that's the kiss of death. Ask Booker T, RVD, Scott Steiner, or Goldberg.
And that's one of the biggest things that has hurt Vince and WWE since 2001.

For as much as he, Jim Ross, and Bret Hart himself lamented the way Bret was treated in WCW, they (so far) have done nothing to prove that they were any better than WCW in that regard. Sure, they had Stone Cold -- but arguably, that character was "created" in ECW. HBK (1997 version) and The Rock were wrestlers being themselves, shedding most of the gimmicks with which Vince saddled them. You could make an argument about HHH being the same (because even though he's kept the same ring name for years, the assholia HHH spouted at his peak is a far cry from the snob who used to bow to his opponents).

I know that Vince is trying to keep another "Hogan/Savage/Diesel/Razor" situation from happening (and seems to have failed with Christian, who it seems he just gave up on)...but this is, and has been asinine. If a wrestler is good enough to get over on his own, they should roll with that. Christian is a fine example. They dropped the ball with him because they didn't use him as Cena's heel foil. Christian was really connecting with the fans, and then they bury him? What if they did that with Stone Cold?
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Old 01-30-2006, 01:28 PM   #7
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How can you honestly sy that this isn't Cena's fault? They gave him everything. Put everything there for him on a silver platter and he just couldn't handle it. Seeing Cena handle his status really makes me respect past guys like The Rock, Austin, and even Lesnar even more. Lesnar was in almost an identical situation. He had nothing, they gave him everything in such a short amount of time... BUT HE RAN WITH IT. He made it work.

They've tried everything they possibly can with this guy. They've made him win like 30 handicap matches, put the odds against him in any way they can, hype him more than any other champion ever and he STILL can't hold the weight on his shoulders. WWE needs to accept the fact that he's just not a good enough performer to pull this roll off. There isn't much more they can hand to him to make it any easier.

Christ, he's horrible.
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Old 01-30-2006, 01:45 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deadlyheaven
How can you honestly sy that this isn't Cena's fault? They gave him everything. Put everything there for him on a silver platter and he just couldn't handle it. Seeing Cena handle his status really makes me respect past guys like The Rock, Austin, and even Lesnar even more. Lesnar was in almost an identical situation. He had nothing, they gave him everything in such a short amount of time... BUT HE RAN WITH IT. He made it work.

They've tried everything they possibly can with this guy. They've made him win like 30 handicap matches, put the odds against him in any way they can, hype him more than any other champion ever and he STILL can't hold the weight on his shoulders. WWE needs to accept the fact that he's just not a good enough performer to pull this roll off. There isn't much more they can hand to him to make it any easier.

Christ, he's horrible.
LOL.

You have no idea hoe badly I want to point out wrestling is fake to you right now.

They tried everything except having him do what got him over in the first place. Cena ran with what they told him to do, and it failed, because they wanted him to change from what got him over, to a total bullshit babyface.
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Old 01-30-2006, 01:37 PM   #9
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deadlyheaven you answered your own question. They shoved him down our throats. They had him mega over, and then once they put the title on him they took away his edge and had him become ubber babyface. They had him in so many handicap matches that it became boring. His raps were written by the writers and they were boring. Having the odds stacked angainst you all the time is boring. It worked with Austin and McMahon because Austin drank beer, gave the finger, and totally acted like a heel bad ass fighting a heel in power. With Cena he was a heel bad ass until he got the title and started doing EXACTLY what Rocky Miavia (you mentioned respect for The Rock, yet he had similar thing happen and was boo'd like crazy) did which was the wide smile shinny white teeth babyface.

Trust me, John Cena's situation is TOTALLY WWE fault.
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Old 01-30-2006, 01:47 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The One
Trust me, John Cena's situation is TOTALLY WWE fault.
Cena had some leeway. Cena chose to be a team player even when it was hurting him and the business. It wasn't just WWE's fault.
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Old 02-01-2006, 04:05 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The One
deadlyheaven you answered your own question. They shoved him down our throats. They had him mega over, and then once they put the title on him they took away his edge and had him become ubber babyface. They had him in so many handicap matches that it became boring. His raps were written by the writers and they were boring. Having the odds stacked angainst you all the time is boring. It worked with Austin and McMahon because Austin drank beer, gave the finger, and totally acted like a heel bad ass fighting a heel in power. With Cena he was a heel bad ass until he got the title and started doing EXACTLY what Rocky Miavia (you mentioned respect for The Rock, yet he had similar thing happen and was boo'd like crazy) did which was the wide smile shinny white teeth babyface.

I agree here, and with what was mentioned by Kane Knight. Cena also went along with the PB&J, but then again... what's he supposed to do? Buck it and get buried or fired?

The ascension of Cena to the top face is a formula that has been used with every major babyface in the past few years that started heel. With guys like Austin it wasn't as obvious, but the stuff with Cena really looks like the way The Rock was in 2000, after he won the title at King of The Ring (remember that PPV?). A lot of people that liked The Rock, really liked him when he was heel. When he was heel, he did all kinds of mean, yet funny things that eventually got him over the crowd (see: John Cena as a heel). However, as Rock was pushed to the top babyface role, that mean streak started to diminish. By mid-to-late 2000, Rock had mostly become a comedy act who happened to hold enough charisma to keep the crowd interested. But he was very much watered down in what he said, and did (maybe he ran out of things to turn sideways and shove up someone's ass) -- much like Cena. Whether this was a conscious move by The Rock or not, the same moves are painfully becoming apparent in Cena. From a technical perspective, I'd even argue Rock's moves were less sloppily executed in the years 1998 and 1999 than they were since.

It seems Cena has less pull over his character than The Rock and others did, despite being the largest merchandise seller of the current crop. All I know is that Cena wasn't the only one who gets this treatment. In some respects, Kurt Angle gets it worse. I hate that, after they spent months making Angle the kind of heel Bret Hart was in 1997 (and really, during that era, as far as heels go, Bret was the best there was)...then they make him jump to SmackDown, and all of a sudden, shed all the things that made him edgy. No more outrageous lines, kicking out Daivari as his manager, and so forth. Seeing that people wouldn't boo him, they change his character again to get cheered. Something tells me that he's gonna end up getting booed like Cena is soon. Whatever comes of this Undertaker feud is going to be interesting as far as how Flip-flop Angle will be portrayed.

Is it me, or in retrospect, did the "Biker-taker" seem more in place with today's WWE? (I only disliked that Undertaker cut his hair and started to look more like Mean Mark Callous than the Undertaker. When he first appeared in that persona at Judgement Day 2000...Tombstoning HHH, with the trenchcoat and bandanna. That was awesome, and the way he should have stayed IMO.)
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Old 02-01-2006, 04:28 PM   #12
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I think the writers realised that Edge's contract would be up soon, so they started to shit their pants over what to do, because of bad timing with the whole MITB angle (Matt Hardy return), it didn't give him enough time to build himself up as a main event star. So Edge's short run as champ (and the manner in which that he won it) was just a quick fix out of the whole situation. Asswell, because Cena was basically running out of guys to feud with, they thought "Hey, this should eat up a few weeks of storyline." And, they may have figured that by dropping the title on Cena in less than 2 minutes like that, it would make the fans feel sorry for him and turn him into everybody's hero again. Which would mean, now here's the important part, IT BOOSTS WWE SHOP SALES!!
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Old 02-01-2006, 06:32 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Batsu
I agree here, and with what was mentioned by Kane Knight. Cena also went along with the PB&J, but then again... what's he supposed to do? Buck it and get buried or fired?
Right. They were going to bury or fire the top draw, the one they still keep on top because he's mocinv merch to women and kids at least.

There's a scary threat. I bet The Rock feared for his career.
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Old 01-30-2006, 02:47 PM   #14
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No. What I am saying is that if they had put somebdy like The Rock, Austin, or Lenar in the exact same situation (Which they have been. But I'm saying hypothetically, before they got over...) they would've found a way to make it not boring. I'll admit that the writers have something to do with it, but it isn't all their fault. Cena couldn't draw the fans in enough, and that is his fault. A good performer, a good champion will be able to draw you into what they are currenty doing at any given time. (Ex: Austin, Hart, Taker, HBK, Rock) Rock was put in many situations where they were throwing him at us. He won handicap matches against DX, he persevered through all odds but when he did it... it was entertaining. The fans were drawn in. Cena honestly just doesn't have that type of charisma, no matter what gimmick he's doing, no matter what situation he is in. The best champions are the ones that can still be entertaining in the worst types of environments.

He just doesn't have it. Quite honestly, he's terrible.
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Old 01-30-2006, 02:55 PM   #15
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I'm actually kinda glad Cena's the champ again, now Triple H can feud with him and Cena's got no chance against The Game.

Cena's gonna get promo'd out of the arena, get his ass kicked at WM, and become HHH's little bitch.
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Old 01-30-2006, 11:10 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Y3J
I'm actually kinda glad Cena's the champ again, now Triple H can feud with him and Cena's got no chance against The Game.

Cena's gonna get promo'd out of the arena, get his ass kicked at WM, and become HHH's little bitch.
AGAIN with the HHH being champ talk

There is gotta be a more credible person to win the WWE championship at WM NOT NAMED HHH!!!
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Old 01-31-2006, 09:45 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by owenbrown
AGAIN with the HHH being champ talk

There is gotta be a more credible person to win the WWE championship at WM NOT NAMED HHH!!!
Actually, Raw's pretty much fucked right now. but that's beside the point, as HHH WILL win. We are merely alluding to an inevitability.
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Old 02-01-2006, 12:10 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
Actually, Raw's pretty much fucked right now. but that's beside the point, as HHH WILL win. We are merely alluding to an inevitability.
So apparently history is gonna repeat itself at WM22 when we go back to the boredom of HHH's dominance on RAW from Sept. 2002-April 2005 that we kept getting forced fed down our throats. Apparently WWE Un-Creative has an ass-backwards mentality towards its product.
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Old 02-01-2006, 12:17 PM   #19
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Finlay should be a new champion because he loves to fight unlike that punk John Cena who is scared.

Finlay...remember the name.
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Old 02-01-2006, 03:18 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by owenbrown
So apparently history is gonna repeat itself at WM22 when we go back to the boredom of HHH's dominance on RAW from Sept. 2002-April 2005 that we kept getting forced fed down our throats. Apparently WWE Un-Creative has an ass-backwards mentality towards its product.

DUH! Hooray for the obvious!
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Old 01-30-2006, 05:10 PM   #21
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Which in all honesty will again make him popular, the idea of a face (in most terms anyway) is to garner a reaction through the fans caring about what happens to you. This constant winning Cena had going before his title loss was getting real stale and the fans didnt feel needed for him to win which is one of the keys to being a face if you are not some monster face ala Goldberg.

I actualy think nothing could do better for Cena right now that a few ass kickings, hell even Edge and HHH owning him on Raw like Edge has been a little lately would do the trick.
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Old 01-30-2006, 05:23 PM   #22
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damn what a shame, Cena was so cool in early 2003. What the fuck happened?
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Old 01-30-2006, 05:25 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by The Naitch
damn what a shame, Cena was so cool in early 2003. What the fuck happened?
Nickelodeon writers happend.
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Old 01-30-2006, 06:12 PM   #24
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This is coming from the point of view of a 18 year old...

you have to look at it like this:

Back in the Attitude Era, the Rock was kinda like this, but we were younger and of course marked out more (i'm talking about the current 16-19 year old group).

Maybe if we were this age (16-19) back in the Attitude Era we would have shit all over the Rock.
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Old 01-30-2006, 06:22 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Greater Power
This is coming from the point of view of a 18 year old...

you have to look at it like this:

Back in the Attitude Era, the Rock was kinda like this, but we were younger and of course marked out more (i'm talking about the current 16-19 year old group).

Maybe if we were this age (16-19) back in the Attitude Era we would have shit all over the Rock.
Rock had charisma, though, and got mad over. Same with Austin and to a lesser extent (in that era) Michaels and Taker.

Although I bet it was the same with the fans of the Hogan era (not going to bring internet smarkitude into this). It was a drastic change from 89-95, and what they loved as a kid had changed and didn't have that "magical" feel.

At least then they had good angles and good matches in the attitude era, though. Right now we're in the period between 93 and 96 modernly. Nothing's really happening but there's going to be that new boom sooner or later.
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Old 01-30-2006, 06:56 PM   #26
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Old 01-30-2006, 07:56 PM   #27
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Fantastic posts by Loopy, deadily heaven and the one.

All have good points by Cena does have to take some of the blame. He dosnt bother to work on his wrestling skills, forgets to sell and says the same shit all the time. He is meant to be the top guy in the company he has got to have some creative control. He isnt just the wwe's puppet.

Yeah I agree with the One if they gave Jericho the cena push back in 2001 or even before he left we would had an extremilly popular and entertaining era of wrestling
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Old 01-30-2006, 08:34 PM   #28
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Cena's wrestling skils have nothing to do with the fact that he is getting booed. The reason he is getting booed is because of how gay his character is.
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Old 01-30-2006, 08:38 PM   #29
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cena's not gay!
Queering dosn't make the world go round.
Gay/Poop jokes do, you silly billie.
He just sucks. =D
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Old 01-30-2006, 11:31 PM   #30
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I'm afraid owenbrown that Cenas reign is about to get HHH'd at Mania.I think they always planned for this to happen,why do you people think they didn't go back to the original title belt yet?Because they were always going to put it back on Cena so it would be a waste of time bringing it back just yet, it'll come back at Mania though when HHH beats Cena.For once I actually want HHH to hold back someone.
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Old 01-31-2006, 01:11 AM   #31
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So Cena lost for the exact reasons everyone suspected: to get people to stop boo'ing him.

Ah well, it's not his fault, and at least he's being a good sport about it. Shows he's a nice guy.

You can use the example of The Rock or Stone Cold, but when they got popular, they stayed popular by staying their original characters. Rock still was cocky with catchphrases. Austin was the badass. And when the writers forced them to tweak their characters, it was during heel runs (SCSA being the Vince hugger and Rock being the snob). Cena, however, has been kept a face.

So it's not really his fault, unless you use KK's technicality. But by that reasoning, someone being robbed who has a gun against his head will still technically be "at fault" for giving his money away to the thief, because he technically made the decision to live, rather than refuse to cooperate.

Cena might have had the chance to just continue with his thing, but how would he know he wouldn't have been depushed and given the Jericho treatment?
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Old 01-31-2006, 09:39 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corkscrewed
So it's not really his fault, unless you use KK's technicality. But by that reasoning, someone being robbed who has a gun against his head will still technically be "at fault" for giving his money away to the thief, because he technically made the decision to live, rather than refuse to cooperate.
It's nowhere near that, and the fact that you're trying to turn this into a comparison to Cena not being the leader a champion is expected to be just murdered your argument.

Cena wasn't raped; he had the chance to change the course of events, but didn't. Morning after regret and rape arwe not the same thing. Or to use your metaphor, Cena wasn't robbed at gunpoint, he was "robbed" in a club when he voluntarily gave his wallet, credit cards, and power of attorney to a total stranger.

You're smarter than this, Corky.
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Old 02-01-2006, 03:01 PM   #33
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I don't agree with you KK. Cena really didn't have much of a choice. If you take away the "street" persona, you get a really humble kid from Boston who wants to please everyone. So when his "betters" come to him with ideas for his character, he's going to try to make them work. Problem is...they didn't and he knows it. Rocky and Austin were all older than Cena when they got over as they did. They had the experience and the attitude to realize that they knew what got them over and they knew which ideas were bullshit and wouldn't run with them. Cena needs someone to tell him that otherwise he'll never get back to being the next face of the WWE.
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Old 02-01-2006, 03:21 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow
I don't agree with you KK. Cena really didn't have much of a choice. If you take away the "street" persona, you get a really humble kid from Boston who wants to please everyone. So when his "betters" come to him with ideas for his character, he's going to try to make them work. Problem is...they didn't and he knows it. Rocky and Austin were all older than Cena when they got over as they did. They had the experience and the attitude to realize that they knew what got them over and they knew which ideas were bullshit and wouldn't run with them. Cena needs someone to tell him that otherwise he'll never get back to being the next face of the WWE.
He chose to be humble and accomodating. The ball was in his court, and he passed on it. I'm not sure which part is supposed to absolve him of all guilt, but it ain't working.
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Old 02-01-2006, 05:10 PM   #35
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Steiner killed Steiner btw. Just for his terrible match with HHH.
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Old 02-01-2006, 08:54 PM   #36
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Those arent exactly reasons for him being made champion again.

They're reasons for him not turning heel.
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Old 02-01-2006, 09:03 PM   #37
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Those aren't credible reasons to do much of anything with Cena. Granted, I'm not exactly on the "Kill Cena and dump his petrol covered body in a ditch" bandwagon, but still, this is a pretty poor reason.
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Old 02-01-2006, 10:04 PM   #38
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I want to see michaels get the title and feud with edge w/o lita. HHH can feud with Cena or Big show.
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Old 02-01-2006, 10:19 PM   #39
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I wanna see Edge Spear Lita in the most non sexual way
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Old 02-01-2006, 10:23 PM   #40
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Wasn't the reason why they got him on RAW being so they could use him with out him being so censored as he was when on smackdown? And alas, look what's happening. They got used to the censoring on SD that they think it'll happen on RAW, too. Maybe that's another reason why they are fucking up the Cena push.
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