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Old 08-10-2006, 09:14 PM   #121
Afterlife
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First, I didn't blab about anything. I also responded to Brock's flying ability earlier up the page.

My point was not that Simon Dean was being held back, but that when you watch him in an actual match, you can see him actually trying. The man's not Nova, but he does still put on a helluva show.

I"ve also already responded to the quotes from VAC that you've posted here, so I don't feel the need to do so again.


He started a thread with a question, I answered the question, and he refused to accept it. That's his problem. If that gets me "owned", then owned, I must be.
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Old 08-10-2006, 09:19 PM   #122
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FAO TL
Quote:
Originally Posted by TL
Yes, and was the Triple H saga entertaining? No. Is JJ entertaining? No. You're basically proving my point for me. Cena's push was as boring as those examples you mentioned.
No, my point was that there will always be a guy like Cena who does not entirely deserve his push. You referred back to the attitude days, which like VAC said was an anomaly in the fact it was one of the few occasions when three to four individuals were at the top. Vince Russo put it perfectly, that there will never be a time when a fed will have guys like the Rock, Austin, Foley and Undertaker around at one time.

And coming up to late 1999, began the Helmsley-McMahon era, so that generation was hardly immune from nepotistic booking either.

Did I believe Cena deserves his spot? Probably not. I believe, that as per usual the bookers fucked up Cena. He was entertaining as hell and, like The Rock, was a heel who the fans loved to hate. You could blame them for changing his character, or you could say they tweaked his image perfectly to satisfy the headliner they needed to reach ‘that’ demographic.

But regardless of wherever you go, whatever you watch or whenever you watched it, guys like Cena are always around. So you better get used to him, and the guy after him, and the guy after him…

p.s. I intend never to quote Russo again. I apologise.
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Old 08-10-2006, 09:21 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Afterlife
He started a thread with a question, I answered the question, and he refused to accept it. That's his problem. If that gets me "owned", then owned, I must be.
Nah, you didn't get owned. It was a social experiment in the forums. The only person who didn't want to flame the n00b was Thrilla, and Kudos to him.

Some of my points were a little stretched as well otherwise I wouldn't have looked like a Cena mark's. Don't feel bad. It was great arguing with you.
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Old 08-10-2006, 09:22 PM   #124
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Cena's Gay *exits thread*
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Old 08-10-2006, 09:25 PM   #125
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Cena's Gay *exits thread*
fuck you smark!
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Old 08-10-2006, 09:26 PM   #126
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....I am so confused.
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Old 08-10-2006, 09:28 PM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chavo Classic
No, my point was that there will always be a guy like Cena who does not entirely deserve his push. You referred back to the attitude days, which like VAC said was an anomaly in the fact it was one of the few occasions when three to four individuals were at the top. Vince Russo put it perfectly, that there will never be a time when a fed will have guys like the Rock, Austin, Foley and Undertaker around at one time.

And coming up to late 1999, began the Helmsley-McMahon era, so that generation was hardly immune from nepotistic booking either.

Did I believe Cena deserves his spot? Probably not. I believe, that as per usual the bookers fucked up Cena. He was entertaining as hell and, like The Rock, was a heel who the fans loved to hate. You could blame them for changing his character, or you could say they tweaked his image perfectly to satisfy the headliner they needed to reach ‘that’ demographic.

But regardless of wherever you go, whatever you watch or whenever you watched it, guys like Cena are always around. So you better get used to him, and the guy after him, and the guy after him…

p.s. I intend never to quote Russo again. I apologise.
There maybe guys like Cena every now and then that get undeserved pushes, doesn't mean it's going to get ratings.
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Old 08-10-2006, 09:30 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by Vocal Ass Chic
fuck you smark!

CC stop using alter-egos to back you up!
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Old 08-10-2006, 10:20 PM   #129
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OMFG People who say Cena didnt deserve his push piss me off you obviously didn't pay attention to Cena's Career.

He was over like roover. He was in the midcard for a good period of time. His Mic skills are just as good as anyones in fact I would say he is in top 3 in the company. People cared and still care about him. They didn't Orton him and blow thier load early on him. It was time for him be in the main event and the world title scene.

Then when he became Champ he busted his ass for the company. The man deserved his push.

Just because you hate him doens't mean he didnt deserve the push.
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Old 08-10-2006, 10:31 PM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by legend
OMFG People who say Cena didnt deserve his push piss me off you obviously didn't pay attention to Cena's Career.

He was over like roover. He was in the midcard for a good period of time. His Mic skills are just as good as anyones in fact I would say he is in top 3 in the company. People cared and still care about him. They didn't Orton him and blow thier load early on him. It was time for him be in the main event and the world title scene.

Then when he became Champ he busted his ass for the company. The man deserved his push.

Just because you hate him doens't mean he didnt deserve the push.
They booked him wrong.
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Old 08-10-2006, 10:31 PM   #131
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Yes, I feel that one sentence can sum that up.
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Old 08-10-2006, 10:35 PM   #132
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Yeah you're right they booked him wrong.

I argee 100% on that.
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Old 08-10-2006, 10:54 PM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vocal Ass Chic
could you not be bothered to look at my profile? or are you trying to prove something by saying he's only for immature audiences?

if u like cena, u like cena. it should not be restricted to age. yeh, it'd be weird if i were 25 and i liked him, but im not
You brought up demographics, and then you argue that it shouldn't be restricted by age?

Wait, why am I arguing with someone I know to be a joke account?
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Old 08-10-2006, 10:59 PM   #134
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Afterlife

3. And I'm sure Brock was great with an SSP. But as he'd refrained from such high calibur high-fly moves up to that point, it was a definite bad idea.
Well, except brock was known for it in OVW, and had been busting it out during house shows as a warmup for Mania. It's not so much that he had refrained, he had been using it prior, he just fucked it up. Come on, Juvi's fucked top rope moves, and he does them all the time.
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:03 PM   #135
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Just out of curiosity, can somebody tell me how Cena should have been booked?
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:05 PM   #136
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Like the other negroes.
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:14 PM   #137
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It's easy to say in hindsight, but he probably shouldn't have become so whitemeat babyface. He should have had more heels, because feuding with Angle killed him. That's where I think they booked him wrong. They should have kept Kurt away from him like kept Angle on SD. They shouldn't have tried to make Angle Anti-American and this big uber-heel. If they keep Angle away I say the heat for Cena wouldn't have gotten as bad as it did.

Like I said though it's easy to say in hindsight. Also to Cena's credit the booing isn't nearly as bad anymore, and it looks like they did the right thing keeping him face.
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:21 PM   #138
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Like the other negroes.
ALL HAIL KING CENA!!!
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:24 PM   #139
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It's not hard to see, though, without hindsight . People were complaining about it almost instantly when he stopped rapping, started becoming bland babyface boy, etc.

They violated a very simple principle by fucking the way he got over, and trying to make him over instead.
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:42 PM   #140
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My question is why did fans stop booing him? There was a huge crowd backlash at the beginning of the year, but it just sort of stopped, and I can't figure out why. He's still the same old bland babyface that sucks in the ring.
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:46 PM   #141
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After the RVD match at ONS they just kinda stopped. It was the pay off. That and I think some people realized they were dicks...
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:50 PM   #142
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It's his whole fued with ECW. Cena came out of that looking like gold. Also don't forget Edge. I think Edge has been doing some great heel work, but also he isn't as respected as say Angle is.

Also another reason could be because now WWE reconginzes the boos that Cena gets and now it might be not be as fun to boo Cena. I'm not really sure about the last one, but it might be a small probablity.
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Old 08-10-2006, 11:51 PM   #143
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CYCLOPTERSAURUS
My question is why did fans stop booing him? There was a huge crowd backlash at the beginning of the year, but it just sort of stopped, and I can't figure out why. He's still the same old bland babyface that sucks in the ring.
I think people just stopped caring. There's only so long you can give shit attention...
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Old 08-11-2006, 12:02 AM   #144
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They stopped boing him because he doesnt have the title
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Old 08-11-2006, 12:05 AM   #145
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You know he's getting it back because it's still a spinner title.
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Old 08-11-2006, 12:05 AM   #146
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They booed him when he was chasing the title before.
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Old 08-11-2006, 12:06 AM   #147
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I agree with whatever fucktard said the fans just realised they were being dicks. I mean, dammit, why should people boo the guys they don't like? That is so unfair.
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Old 08-11-2006, 12:08 AM   #148
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Its wrong to dislike now days.
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Old 08-11-2006, 12:09 AM   #149
Skippord
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Maybe more children are getting tickets
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Old 08-11-2006, 03:09 AM   #150
FourFifty
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FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vocal Ass Chic
why does everyone hate Cena and his followers?
Because you touch yourself.
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Old 08-11-2006, 03:15 AM   #151
RaginRonic
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Honestly, I really don't have much of an opinion on Cena either way. Just needs to do a random moveset every match. And maybe shuffle up the moves he uses near the end a bit.

Oh, and the word nepotism? Isn't that a little bit of a big word for our favorite VAC-cum Cleaner to be using? Hmmmm...?



Oh, and a friend of mine, Bunnie, says to go take a piss on any Hunter fan out there. Hunter's a little too faggy for her
taste!

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Old 08-11-2006, 03:35 AM   #152
FourFifty
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FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
Allow me to try to say this without being judgmental.
It's part of being a wrestling fan. A lot of people will tell you that one of the greatest performers ever, Ric Flair shouldn't wrestle while other people like these goddamn sheep cheer for Mr. “Hold Everyone Down” himself Hogan. Some people will tell you that a mediocre wrestler like Mick Foley who is still a damn good interview is the greatest person in the ring. At one point in time I would have told you that the man who needs more rest stops during a match than my grandmother needs rest room breaks on a long car ride Randy Orton is the future of the industry until I actually WATCHED one of his matches! Seriously, what the fuck do people see in this asshole!?!?.
I have to deal with people who hate who I like. Ric Flair, The Highlanders I’M ROBBIE!!!!, JBL, Kane, Regal, Steve Austin, Hayabusa, Mongo, CM Punk, and the list goes on… On line, face to face, friends, family, people who I don’t know. I deal with their criticisms on a habitual basis. You just have to put up with it.

 If you’re a Cena fan, then cheer for him and be prepared for people to say you’re an idiot. I take a lot of flack for saying Bret screwed Bret and Ric Flair isn’t to blame for Foley not going anywhere in WCW. Just be a man and stop bitching about the fact that not everyone sees eye to eye with you.

And while you're at it, don't listen to emo.

Edit- I haven't read the whole thread because I'm sure most of this drek isn't worth my time so sorry if I said what someone else has already said.
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Old 08-11-2006, 03:46 AM   #153
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St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)St. Jimmy got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to FourFifty again.
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Old 08-11-2006, 03:48 AM   #154
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This thread actually hosted some pretty decent debate. Way to try and be cool, though.
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Old 08-11-2006, 03:54 AM   #155
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FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)FourFifty got the bus to Rep Town and repped it up real bad at the rep shop (100,000+)
Quote:
Originally Posted by St. Jimmy
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to FourFifty again.
Twice in one night? Wow.
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Old 08-11-2006, 08:49 AM   #156
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kane Knight
I think people just stopped caring. There's only so long you can give shit attention...

I think they realised that by booing him that was still doing Cena a favour because remember when Cena said 'aslong as I get a reaction, I don't care?' And it wasn't working so the only other option was to be silent and let the kids cheer him. Seems to have worked.
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Old 08-11-2006, 08:53 AM   #157
Skippord
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FourFifty
Allow me to try to say this without being judgmental.
It's part of being a wrestling fan. A lot of people will tell you that one of the greatest performers ever, Ric Flair shouldn't wrestle while other people like these goddamn sheep cheer for Mr. “Hold Everyone Down” himself Hogan. Some people will tell you that a mediocre wrestler like Mick Foley who is still a damn good interview is the greatest person in the ring. At one point in time I would have told you that the man who needs more rest stops during a match than my grandmother needs rest room breaks on a long car ride Randy Orton is the future of the industry until I actually WATCHED one of his matches! Seriously, what the fuck do people see in this asshole!?!?.
I have to deal with people who hate who I like. Ric Flair, The Highlanders I’M ROBBIE!!!!, JBL, Kane, Regal, Steve Austin, Hayabusa, Mongo, CM Punk, and the list goes on… On line, face to face, friends, family, people who I don’t know. I deal with their criticisms on a habitual basis. You just have to put up with it.

 If you’re a Cena fan, then cheer for him and be prepared for people to say you’re an idiot. I take a lot of flack for saying Bret screwed Bret and Ric Flair isn’t to blame for Foley not going anywhere in WCW. Just be a man and stop bitching about the fact that not everyone sees eye to eye with you.

And while you're at it, don't listen to emo.

Edit- I haven't read the whole thread because I'm sure most of this drek isn't worth my time so sorry if I said what someone else has already said.
Fourfifty may be the only person in the world to like Steve McMichael(or however the fuck you spell it)
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Old 08-11-2006, 08:58 AM   #158
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Torrie Wilson is a homo.
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Old 08-11-2006, 11:56 AM   #159
Just John
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anybody Thrilla
No, seriously. It wouldn't matter if he were the US champion or the fucking Cruiserweight champion. His moveset would be the same. I don't see why you think it would be any different. You say because he uses the same moves to win all the time? Guess what? THAT'S BEEN A TRADITION IN WRESTLING FOR A BILLION YEARS NOW. Finishing moves are not a new concept.
You are missing the point, before The Rock was 'The Rock' (Rocky Miavia) he had a pretty sturdy moveset, y'know it varied quite alot, but when he became very popular and started really selling merchandise, it became the same old same old ways of ending a match, (The Rock Bottom, Peoples Elbow etc.) this is done to create the impression that the move is strong, and will get the crowd on its feet when they see it, which is helpful in dull parts of the match.

Since Cena has been the WWE champ he has used the same moves to win matches (FU, STFU) but when he was in the leagues of the U.S title, his matches were more entertaining and more varied (Look at Cena Vs Big Show Wrestlemania XX that was a great match) also, he had a strong fanbase and was selling merch like hotcakes too.

Yes this process happens with all wrestlers who hit the big time, (Beleive it or not, when Hulk Hogan was wrestling in Japan he wasn't too bad) but like Hogan, John Cenas glory has just dragged on, his promos have been dull (Funny doesnt make them refreshing, but I guess it makes them a little better) Cena wont be able to go back to the U.S champion level no one will buy it. But a heel turn would be very refreshing. New moves, new promos, new attitude towards fans.
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Old 08-11-2006, 12:00 PM   #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anybody Thrilla
Just out of curiosity, can somebody tell me how Cena should have been booked?
He was booked fine, I just think he has been champ way too long, or at least a face champ way too long. I'd like to see the heel Cena back.
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