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Old 09-05-2011, 11:22 PM   #321
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Originally Posted by Cool King View Post
I don't know.

I get the feeling that it's leading to a run for Ziggler as a face, leaving Vickie with Swagger.
It makes sense to go this direction. But the way it's being booked, Ziggler is portraying the heel which is definitely weird. He's the one costing matches, acting selfish, abusive, etc.

Of the two, Swagger's been made to have the more "faceish" tendencies.

I mean, I guess it's nice he's in an angle, but it doesn't make a ton of sense thus far. At least Riley is out of it.
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:25 PM   #322
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But Christian didn't pin Orton and Barrett didn't win the championship in this match!!!
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:26 PM   #323
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Look, I'm not normally a Cena hater and I really don't even know what th IWC is but really? He goes from being set up for a finisher to spinging out an AA.

Then he gets put in an ankle lock for over a minute, yet Swagger taps out in about ten seconds.

And for good measure, the same Cena who was in an 8 man tag hits an AA on the champion.

I'll give you it furthers the Swagger/Ziggler storyline. But it was just another example of the WWE writers almost having fun forcing a "Super Cena" down our throats, which is a shame, cuz Cena has been at his best playing more of a tweener with the Nexus and Punk angles.
Okay but where do you see the idea of THREE people getting buried in 45 seconds?
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:32 PM   #324
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Just a little education for some of you...

Burial (or Bury) refers to the worked lowering (relegation) of a popular wrestler's status in the eyes of the fans. It is the act of a promoter or booker causing a wrestler to lose popularity by forcing him to lose in squash matches, continuously, and/or participate in unentertaining or degrading storylines.

Do any of that apply to what you saw tonight?
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:34 PM   #325
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Originally Posted by jkman61494 View Post
Look, I'm not normally a Cena hater and I really don't even know what th IWC is but really? He goes from being set up for a finisher to spinging out an AA.

Then he gets put in an ankle lock for over a minute, yet Swagger taps out in about ten seconds.

And for good measure, the same Cena who was in an 8 man tag hits an AA on the champion.

I'll give you it furthers the Swagger/Ziggler storyline. But it was just another example of the WWE writers almost having fun forcing a "Super Cena" down our throats, which is a shame, cuz Cena has been at his best playing more of a tweener with the Nexus and Punk angles.
There was nothing new that happened at the end of this Raw. Doing just your finisher on the champion isn't a burial. There was no sign of "Super Cena" here.
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:50 PM   #326
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I quite enjoyed the main event tonight. Hot crowd.

They may as well just take down my podium and laptop though.
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:51 PM   #327
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Why don't you just fucking chime in? Or have they disabled your access?
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:57 PM   #328
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Watching on DVR Right now, and Michael Cole is awesome right after that AWESOME ZACK RYDER JUNKET.... 'this guy is a complete idiot'
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Old 09-05-2011, 11:58 PM   #329
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Why don't you just fucking chime in? Or have they disabled your access?

Maybe they forgot to recharge the battery for the laptop considering how long they used it on the same charge.
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:02 AM   #330
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Triple H took the banhammer to Lock Jaw
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:14 AM   #331
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Why don't you just fucking chime in? Or have they disabled your access?
I do, but they just don't bother to even check the inbox anymore. Tech Guy also ignores my texts to activate the lights and sound.
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:19 AM   #332
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:21 AM   #333
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Ah, so not true, and uncool bro
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:22 AM   #334
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:24 AM   #335
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There was nothing new that happened at the end of this Raw. Doing just your finisher on the champion isn't a burial. There was no sign of "Super Cena" here.
Actually we just lost power here.

No sign of "Super Cena"? He overcomes 2 on 1 odds, beats both of them within 2 minutes of each other, and has enough juice left to hit a finisher on the WWE Champion. That's not "Super Cena"? Please.

The reason I say burying is this. Ziggler looks like a total jobber, you further diminish the fear of Swagger's finisher, and the WWE Champion is made to look weak.

It's the latter two I think it damages more. Both of them have image problems with a lof of fans and people on here.

Swagger is booked to be upper midcard yet his results are almost total jobber. Having him tap out mere seconds after his submission hold was on so long just further cemented his standing as a jobbing wuss.

Also, a lot of people think ADR isn't ready to be champion yet. It's an opinion echoed by many people. I still don't know how being fresh and trying to attack Cena, only to then be hit by his finisher and run away helps with that Champion credibility.

I love Del Rio and think he has a lot of talent, but if they book him wrong he could be the Christian version (was booked HORRIBLY as a champ) of Raw rather than an emerging true Main Eventer.

So in the case of Swagger (who desperately needs to look strong) and Del Rio (who needs to look like a serious champion) both got buried.
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:39 AM   #336
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It's too good to be true...
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:48 AM   #337
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The nitpicking by jkman61494 is outrageous.
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:54 AM   #338
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:59 AM   #339
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Kind of wish the person who invented demotivational was raped with an AIDS infected rail spike.
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Old 09-06-2011, 01:01 AM   #340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkman61494 View Post
Actually we just lost power here.

No sign of "Super Cena"? He overcomes 2 on 1 odds, beats both of them within 2 minutes of each other, and has enough juice left to hit a finisher on the WWE Champion. That's not "Super Cena"? Please.

The reason I say burying is this. Ziggler looks like a total jobber, you further diminish the fear of Swagger's finisher, and the WWE Champion is made to look weak.

It's the latter two I think it damages more. Both of them have image problems with a lof of fans and people on here.

Swagger is booked to be upper midcard yet his results are almost total jobber. Having him tap out mere seconds after his submission hold was on so long just further cemented his standing as a jobbing wuss.

Also, a lot of people think ADR isn't ready to be champion yet. It's an opinion echoed by many people. I still don't know how being fresh and trying to attack Cena, only to then be hit by his finisher and run away helps with that Champion credibility.

I love Del Rio and think he has a lot of talent, but if they book him wrong he could be the Christian version (was booked HORRIBLY as a champ) of Raw rather than an emerging true Main Eventer.

So in the case of Swagger (who desperately needs to look strong) and Del Rio (who needs to look like a serious champion) both got buried.

You are thinking far too much about this.
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Old 09-06-2011, 04:50 AM   #341
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Awesome Raw again. Loved the 'Super Shredder' reference and the 'Cerebral ASSassin' line. Some pretty great matches thrown in too. Looking forward to Night of Champions.
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Old 09-06-2011, 05:14 AM   #342
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Not sure I'm on board with this "Supershow" thing just yet but that was a good Raw.

Kinda hoping Nash gets involve again further down the line (NoC maybe?) otherwise his part in this could go down as a decent sized ball drop.
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Old 09-06-2011, 05:59 AM   #343
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Considering Triple H/CM Punk has been made No DQ, I'd have thought it's pretty obvious SOMETHING has to go down.
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Old 09-06-2011, 07:50 AM   #344
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Is Russo back?
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Old 09-06-2011, 08:45 AM   #345
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkman61494 View Post
Actually we just lost power here.

No sign of "Super Cena"? He overcomes 2 on 1 odds, beats both of them within 2 minutes of each other, and has enough juice left to hit a finisher on the WWE Champion. That's not "Super Cena"? Please.
No, it's not "Super Cena".

Swagger and Ziggler were involved in the match from when the bell rang, whereas Cena didn't get involved in the match until that last ten minutes or so.

So Cena was the healthy man in the match and Swagger and Ziggler were weaker from being involved in the match from the beginning.

A healthy man beats a weak man. It's not rocket science.
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Old 09-06-2011, 09:04 AM   #346
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YEAH!! BUT ADR WAS HEALTHIER THAN CENA!!!11!! CAN YOU SAY BURIAL!?!>!
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Old 09-06-2011, 09:05 AM   #347
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(Of course, we are disregarding that Del Rio has OWNED Cena on more than one occasion - dare I say every time they've had a physical altercation)
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Old 09-06-2011, 10:35 AM   #348
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Originally Posted by jkman61494 View Post
Actually we just lost power here.

No sign of "Super Cena"? He overcomes 2 on 1 odds, beats both of them within 2 minutes of each other, and has enough juice left to hit a finisher on the WWE Champion. That's not "Super Cena"? Please.

The reason I say burying is this. Ziggler looks like a total jobber, you further diminish the fear of Swagger's finisher, and the WWE Champion is made to look weak.

It's the latter two I think it damages more. Both of them have image problems with a lof of fans and people on here.

Swagger is booked to be upper midcard yet his results are almost total jobber. Having him tap out mere seconds after his submission hold was on so long just further cemented his standing as a jobbing wuss.

Also, a lot of people think ADR isn't ready to be champion yet. It's an opinion echoed by many people. I still don't know how being fresh and trying to attack Cena, only to then be hit by his finisher and run away helps with that Champion credibility.

I love Del Rio and think he has a lot of talent, but if they book him wrong he could be the Christian version (was booked HORRIBLY as a champ) of Raw rather than an emerging true Main Eventer.

So in the case of Swagger (who desperately needs to look strong) and Del Rio (who needs to look like a serious champion) both got buried.

Seriously? Off the top of my head, I don't remember seeing 'Super Cena' since the whole Nexus deal.

All that happened on Raw, was the number one contender came off looking strong, after the champion getting the upper hand last time. Big deal.

And I'm not denying that there was ever a 'Super Cena', but it's kind of annoying when people assume just because he doesn't lose all the time, it means he's being Super Cena.

Remember like 10 years ago when Austin used to kick the shit out of the whole Corporation? Yeah....'Super Austin' at his worst....

To quote Kevin Nash...."Get a clue".
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Old 09-06-2011, 10:36 AM   #349
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I'm not even a Cena fan, by the way. But he certainly is more enjoyable this side of WM.


Solid Raw, again.
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Old 09-06-2011, 10:52 AM   #350
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Jack Swagger actually came off looking pretty strong in that main event. He actually had TWO people tap out to him. When was the last time that has happened?
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Old 09-06-2011, 10:57 AM   #351
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Exactly. When you beat two people with your finisher in one match, only to get it reversed by the face of the company, you aren't getting buried...
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Old 09-06-2011, 11:28 AM   #352
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BUT, BUT...that actually makes total sense.
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Old 09-06-2011, 11:28 AM   #353
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The only recent "Super Cena" moment I can think of was the comeback at Over The Limit against The Miz.
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Old 09-06-2011, 11:29 AM   #354
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That was a pretty bad one to be fair.
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Old 09-06-2011, 11:43 AM   #355
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"i had a manifestation" "doesnt that happen after puberty?" that rtruth/miz segmant was gold
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Old 09-06-2011, 11:51 AM   #356
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This was a great RAW and I really look forward to next week as I will be there in person and I'm curious as to what Reks and Hawkins are gonna up to wonder if there gonna end up being members of the New nWo lol no joke it could happen WWE.com had an article about it recently.
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:03 PM   #357
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkman61494 View Post
Actually we just lost power here.

No sign of "Super Cena"? He overcomes 2 on 1 odds, beats both of them within 2 minutes of each other, and has enough juice left to hit a finisher on the WWE Champion. That's not "Super Cena"? Please.

The reason I say burying is this. Ziggler looks like a total jobber, you further diminish the fear of Swagger's finisher, and the WWE Champion is made to look weak.

It's the latter two I think it damages more. Both of them have image problems with a lof of fans and people on here.

Swagger is booked to be upper midcard yet his results are almost total jobber. Having him tap out mere seconds after his submission hold was on so long just further cemented his standing as a jobbing wuss.

Also, a lot of people think ADR isn't ready to be champion yet. It's an opinion echoed by many people. I still don't know how being fresh and trying to attack Cena, only to then be hit by his finisher and run away helps with that Champion credibility.

I love Del Rio and think he has a lot of talent, but if they book him wrong he could be the Christian version (was booked HORRIBLY as a champ) of Raw rather than an emerging true Main Eventer.

So in the case of Swagger (who desperately needs to look strong) and Del Rio (who needs to look like a serious champion) both got buried.
You are like one step below starting your own WWE Sabremetrics.

You are way too far down the rabbit hole.

There is no way anything could have happened there that you wouldnt have had a problem with.

I would love to see you book that match and not "bury someone"
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:09 PM   #358
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Honestly surprised to see so many people calling this a "great" or" awesome" RAW. The Nash reveal was completely shit and lazy booking. I have little interest in Punk vs Hunter because it's so rushed. Hunter wasn't even really established as the COO and he's already giving it all up.

Also, Del Rio was bitched out when he shouldn't have been. Cena should not have gotten the upper hand after being in a two on one match (essentially). It made Del Rio look like a joke. I don't see him as a worthy champion and tonight didn't change my mind.

The Ryder thing was okay, and I did like Punk vs. Truth and the main event. But overall, this was a pretty bad RAW. Compared to a month and a half ago, this is complete and utter shit.

WWE dropped the ball on Punk, and they're going right back to the same old shit. On RAW at least, as I've been legit enjoying SD quite a bit.

But Punk will be on Swagger's level come the Rumble. He's on his was down, and I don't doubt it's a way to show him and the fans that he doesn't belong at the top.
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:13 PM   #359
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xero View Post
Honestly surprised to see so many people calling this a "great" or" awesome" RAW. The Nash reveal was completely shit and lazy booking. I have little interest in Punk vs Hunter because it's so rushed. Hunter wasn't even really established as the COO and he's already giving it all up.
SWEEEEEEEEEERVE
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Old 09-06-2011, 12:15 PM   #360
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Im hoping for a major swerve, no way does NOC go down with simply HHH losing and going back to being a wrestler.
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