To what extent is Vince responsible for making the WWE into what it is today?

**�bermensch** · 12-06-2006, 10:56 PM

And by what it is today, I'm not refering to (supposed) slumping product at the moment (or, the last five or so years, if you will), but rather, the company that is more or less the undisputed pro-wrestling hegemon in North America. I know that this is a topic that has probably been debated z to the infinity on here, I'm still curious what people think.

The post that sparked this topic:

"ECW just gets worse and worse, they shouldn't have had a PPV until they started getting two hours and a bigger roster, but that's Vince for ya. I swear Vince's reputation has been severely damaged by this, if it wasn't damaged by the failure of the XFL, ECW has done the job, no matter how much he blames Heyman. Vince is fucking full of bullshit, also he doesn't deserve to be as succesful as he has been with WWE, he just got lucky."
-TL (http://www.tpww.net/forums/showthread.php?t=54996)

I have to respectfully disagree, for the most part. While it is true that Vince started out inheriting a company bigger than most promoters could ever hope to control, the AWA and NWA rivaled, or even surpassed the WWF in both influence and financial backing (to the best of my knowledge...if any "historians" can refute this, please do). The rise of the WWF clearly coincided with innovations introduced by Vince such as national television deals, entrance music, celeberty expose, more colorful characters and storylines with mainstrem appeal, increased emphasis on production values, more active merchendise sales, and a willingness to violate traditional territorial "boundaries." Again, to the best of my knowledge, these are all innovations that the NWA and AWA really didn't attempt.

On the flip side, I'm a little sketchy as to how the NWA was structured, but I'm pretty sure it was fairly decentralized, which may not have been very conducive to operating in a manner similar to the WWF. But the question must be asked, why not the AWA then? Even disregarding the AWA, is it not a feat to gain the mainstream popularity that the WWF had in the mid 1980s, even in a fairly uncompetitive national market?

How much credit do you attribute to Vince for building up the WWF? Why?

By the way, I think Vince is probably a total dick, and I think that if he took over a regional company now, he would run it into the ground pretty quickly. But this isn't about Vince being a dick, or Vince right now.

Also, I know it may be hard, since most people here probably learned most of their "insider" knowledge off pretty unreliable internet sources (myself included), but let's try to keep unsubstanciated claims to a minimum, or at least recognize them for what they are when grounding an argument in them.

12-06-2006, 10:56 PM	#1
�bermensch Member Posts: 325	To what extent is Vince responsible for making the WWE into what it is today? And by what it is today, I'm not refering to (supposed) slumping product at the moment (or, the last five or so years, if you will), but rather, the company that is more or less the undisputed pro-wrestling hegemon in North America. I know that this is a topic that has probably been debated z to the infinity on here, I'm still curious what people think. The post that sparked this topic: "ECW just gets worse and worse, they shouldn't have had a PPV until they started getting two hours and a bigger roster, but that's Vince for ya. I swear Vince's reputation has been severely damaged by this, if it wasn't damaged by the failure of the XFL, ECW has done the job, no matter how much he blames Heyman. Vince is fucking full of bullshit, also he doesn't deserve to be as succesful as he has been with WWE, he just got lucky." -TL (http://www.tpww.net/forums/showthread.php?t=54996) I have to respectfully disagree, for the most part. While it is true that Vince started out inheriting a company bigger than most promoters could ever hope to control, the AWA and NWA rivaled, or even surpassed the WWF in both influence and financial backing (to the best of my knowledge...if any "historians" can refute this, please do). The rise of the WWF clearly coincided with innovations introduced by Vince such as national television deals, entrance music, celeberty expose, more colorful characters and storylines with mainstrem appeal, increased emphasis on production values, more active merchendise sales, and a willingness to violate traditional territorial "boundaries." Again, to the best of my knowledge, these are all innovations that the NWA and AWA really didn't attempt. On the flip side, I'm a little sketchy as to how the NWA was structured, but I'm pretty sure it was fairly decentralized, which may not have been very conducive to operating in a manner similar to the WWF. But the question must be asked, why not the AWA then? Even disregarding the AWA, is it not a feat to gain the mainstream popularity that the WWF had in the mid 1980s, even in a fairly uncompetitive national market? How much credit do you attribute to Vince for building up the WWF? Why? By the way, I think Vince is probably a total dick, and I think that if he took over a regional company now, he would run it into the ground pretty quickly. But this isn't about Vince being a dick, or Vince right now. Also, I know it may be hard, since most people here probably learned most of their "insider" knowledge off pretty unreliable internet sources (myself included), but let's try to keep unsubstanciated claims to a minimum, or at least recognize them for what they are when grounding an argument in them.